View Full Version : Feedback wanted!
Greetings people!
This thread is for your feedback.
Want me to incorporate your personal ideas into
the next release? Well, I can not promise I'll do,
but I can promise I'll carefully consider every opinion.
Moreover, you are free to decide on what faction,
that is Japanese (Akagi/Zensen), Chinese (Zhuanshi/Yuwan),
Mongolian(Karazai), Korean(Choson),Indian(Krishnapur),
Demons(Yomi),Blue Lotus Sect(Monks),will be presented
next on the updates page.
Go ahead!
P.S.: Anyone willing and able to help with some very specific tasks?
Old Nick
05-16-2008, 17:37
I've only one suggestion and I don't know how hard it would be to implement:
In the mod End of Days 2, the cannons from BL have extra sounds and it's a vast improvement over the original catapult sounds, so those would be nice.
Anyone willing and able to help with some very specific tasks?
What would they be ?
btw.
I would like to see either Yomi,Krishnapur or
Monks next, but I like all BL-Factions so it does not really matter.
Anyway, great work so far, keep it up.:2thumbsup:
Ok. I never changed sounds so far (except for the music), but if others can do it, I can do it, too.
The specific tasks I would like to have done... I'll tell you tomorrow!
The Japanese will be finished tomorrow. Since the Yomi are extra-complicated, I guess I'll do the Krishnapuri next.
Well, I actually added my own Asian-style music to my version. I will send it to you later if you want, along with some info, just to see if it fits or not.
Also, right now it seems like a lot has improved. The mod is starting to look alot nicer. As a modder, I am totally baffled as to how you managed to achieve a single soldier unit. Could you explain that quickly for me? I'm just dying to know. :D
Hi Ticu,
thanks for your mail, I wrote back.
Drunk-Monk
05-18-2008, 13:28
I've never played Blue Lotus before but it looks very intresting, I have some suggestion for this mod though, do you think that you could include the seconday hp feature which allows you to have balanced auto resolve. Also could you eventaully modfolder this mod as it would mean that more people would try it. Also I reccomed you make a post in the TWcenter once you have finshed the patch, so more people can hear about your great work.
Regards, Drunk-Monk
The secondary HP system might be a good Idea to balance HA's in autocalc. This will also help making the elephant units not to strong in autocalc.
2HP's fail during battles though. Try having heavy cavalry charge an infantry unit with 2HP and the cavalry will be annihilated, while try again with the same units but remove the second HP and the cavalry will kill heaps more on the initial charge and thus turn the battle in the cav's favour.
Wat I'm trying to say: 2 HP = Diluted charge power. :thumbsdown:
Unless, I'm wrong, I think they mean the secondary hp system, which isn't used on the battlemap, but only has an affect on the autocalc.
Yes. See here.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=88860&page=3
Old Nick
05-26-2008, 10:44
Nice updates !:belly:
What about the specific tasks ?Done them yourselves already ?
Ah. Specific tasks that have to be done in chronological order:
Current:
*Integrate the rest of the units (models, stats, 2D art, animations): my task
*Integrate the new music: Ticu's + my task, done!
*Fix the missing/non-functional custom battlemaps: Ticus task. Done!
*Fix the sounds for the Krishnapuri and Zhuanshi heavy cannons: done!
Near future (has to be done later due to internal dependencies):
*Integrate the new building roster
*Custom battle unit balancing: hiring as many people as possible!
Farther future:
*New rebel pools for each province
*New mercenary pools for each province
*Stratmap armies and cities re-distrubution (number, strength, buildings etc.)
*Stratmap balancing
*Scripting:Tentative. I am not too happy about how scripts work.
So. Krishnapuri are finished.
What to do next?
Orders, please ^.^/
Edit: Next is the Karazai Khanate.
kitagata
05-31-2008, 03:47
I'm glad you included the old 'shiva' unit into the Krishnapur army. I've been messing around with the old beta for a while, and it feels far more appropriate for that unit not to be a Yomi. You might include the Vanara as well, perhaps as a buildable unit requiring a certain level of the Krishnapuri temple. It's another unit that seemed strange as a mercenary.
The fishmen are demonic enough that they could be recruited by the Yomi. It could be a change of pace for the Yomi, if when they finally get to territories with ports they could start recruiting the fishmen.
You could update some of the animations. The Battles of Asia mod has two Katana skeletons/animations which you might seek to use, they look great modded into the Akagi and Zensen. Also the two handed spear and two handed cavalry lancer skeletons that are floating around in various mods are also good.
Lastly, if you can figure it out, adding some appropriate sounds to the firelances and thunderbombers. I've managed to add rocket sounds to the firelances, but couldn't get impact sounds to work. Dunno if there's an issue with the old programming or just my modding novice-ness, but if you can do it, it'd be cool.
Keep up the good work, I look forward to seeing more of your fixes and improvements.
The Krishnapur are looking great, though there might be a few issue's that I will PM you about. I honestly think that the Shivas should remain with the Yomi. They are demons after all, and it would probably be better to keep all cultural demons on one side and the somewhat more realistic units on the other - the way it was in the first place.
Also Kitagata, I did not know about the 2-weapon animations. We should check those out. Another animation set I think would be interesting is the 2-handed sword. It would look alot better on the mighty swordsmen and the no-dachi Samurai. As far as I know, the Ashigaru used 2-handed spears, so that is definately something to look into.
Thank you so much for the info.
Greetings Ticu,
I hope you don't mind If I make the reply to your PM public; it may inspire discussion. And give people an impression of what we are working on.
First of all: yes, your maps are right what I needed. And the panorama pictures prove a certain love for details that surely fits my taste! I just finished integrating them into the newest patch; as always, all you have to do is copy-past the data folder. You will realize I played around a little with the names; for example, to evade repetitiveness, one of "Flatlands" and "Grassy Flatlands" was changed into "Anvil of the Gods". Those two maps are nearly identical anyway.
Next to answer your questions:
Yes, the animations of the 1-man (woman) units are not finished. For now, I was happy to manage 1-man units at all ^^/. The killing three men with one swing will stay, and the launching will, too. The point is that those units are really, really special. Their appearance will (possibly) be scripted, so they are really unique (non-recruitable). If one swing would kill just one enemy, they would need half an hour to finish off a unit of ashigaru spearmen no matter how high their stats are. And you are right, unit radius and the like will have to be adjusted.
If you have a 2-handed animation that does not look like holding an axe, I will happily include it for the Akagi Duelists. The dagger animation is just a little better than the original 2-handed one. Please try to dig it up, it will certainly look even better. The Zensen get the Kamikaze instead of the mighty swordsmen. Both units are similar in fighting power, but the Kamikaze are a little faster and harder to control (and a bit better armoured, and... no need for details here!). At a certain point I realized that more units doesn't make a game any better. It just makes it more complicated to manage, and lo! BLTW is about fun, not about manymany. Basically, both the Kamikaze and the Akagi Duelists are the unique top-class units of their respective factions. (Apart from the Heroes).
Of course the Krishnapur Scouts and the Dalit Scouts are clones. The Krishnapur Scouts will not appear in the final game. I just left them in for now to have a reference unit for comparison. Basically all yellow-background units will ultimately disappear (the patch I just sent you already did that for the Krishnapuri).
No, your comments are not boring me. They are very, very helpful (see the animation stuff above - I had no idea those exist!). Ultimately, I have no intention to succumb to all the wishes and critique people confront me with; some are simply incompatible (see the two posts above), and I invested by far too much time in this to hand over the final stake in decision-making. However, there is things where I have to admit the work of others is simply superior to my own - your splash screen is one example.
There will be some few totally new units - the dragon warriors of the monk are one example. Their .cas and animations file are finished, but give me some time; integrating a simple unit is done in about 20 minutes. The holy Gor-haw modifications (skin, .cas, description, riders) took me about 6 hours. Yes, the model is not the original one, haha! (Though I fear few will notice).
Plan for the future...
1. New Duelist animations
2. I never expected new custom battles could be done that fast. Ah.There is another special task I could use some help with. When you use the rebel faction in custom battles, you will realize they have white flags and a roman interface. I guess it has something to do with a faulty culture tag somewhere, but until now I was unable to find out where...
@Kitagata: Vanara will be in, first as rebels, and perhaps (much later) as part of another faction not in the original game. If you could provide me with the firelance rocked sounds or those animation, please go ahead! I'll happily make use of them. The whole culture of the Krishnapuri will be centered around the jealous and fierce Goddess Kali (no matter what final fantasy makes you believe - Shiva is a man, after all? ^^/). Why not have her display some of her wrath on the battlefield?
Drunk-Monk
05-31-2008, 18:03
Could you use the mod-switch feature this would be very useful and attract more people to play the mod.
Well done on reviving this intriguing mod.
I guess this is possible for the final product, yes. I just read it up, and it doesn't seem awfully complicated to implement.
I suppose we could continue the conversation in here.
Alright first of all, I would suggest keeping all attack attributes of the 1-soldier units, except for the launching attribute. That way, they stay just as powerful as before, and they appear more martial artsy (for lack of a better term) than superhuman.
Another similar thing could be done for the jiang sheng and hong shue fei. YOu may have heard of the attack speed attribute. To make them appear mroe skilled than macho, perhaps we could simply lower the attack speed all the way down, so that they attack every second rather than waiting a while after each attack. I've tried doing that before. It looks pretty good in game.
I will try to dig upsome of the animations I have. I believe I have a 2-handed sword and 2-handed spear set. I will play around with those. Try acquiring the 2-sword animation set that kitagata was talking about.
And about the rebel ui. That was kept that way because the players were never meant to play as the rebels. I don't see why we would need to change it.
Cheers! And great job on the Krishnapur faction!
kitagata
06-01-2008, 04:03
I'd be happy to send along some animations and rocket/cannon/gun sound effects. How should I do it? I'm new to the forums, is there a way I can pass them along here? Or could I get someone's email?
Thank you so much, Kitagata.
I would recommend storing all the sounds onto a zip file and uploading them either on filefront.
http://www.filefront.com/
Zshare
http://www.zshare.net/
or some other file host.
Post your link when you've done that.
Thanks again!
kitagata
06-01-2008, 05:32
Just uploaded to filefront. Hope it works!
http://files.filefront.com/BL+animations+and+soundszip/;10442198;/fileinfo.html
Hey, I don't suppose you guys would release the custom music you put together for forum listening would you? I'd like to see what direction you're taking the asian/demon ambiance.
Well, I suppose it wouldnt hurt. It's only music after all. :P
http://files.filefront.com/blmusicnewzip/;10455357;/fileinfo.html
A lot of the previous music was kept, though a few new pieces were added. It's some of the best asian freeware stuff online as far as I know.
The animations you sent were totally amazing! I am sure we will have use for most of them. I believe many Asian troop types used 2-handed spears. The katana animations will go well with the Samurai, and perhaps some of the other units. I'm not sure if the horizontal bow animation could work nicely for some units. I don't think the musket animations will be used, but perhaps they would work for the fire lances.
The sounds you sent seem to be of a much better quality than the cannon animation currently included in BL, and I'm sure we could use it.
Zenith Darksea
06-03-2008, 14:53
Now I am not a person who enjoys fantasy games. I usually stick rigidly to historical (or pseudo-historical, as in the case of RTW) settings, not for one moment considering fantasy.
However, the first time I played Blue Lotus I was absolutely captivated by it. It was just so original, so much fun to play, so interesting. I thought that it was an incredible shame when the original team gave up working on it. Having seen what you are doing for it, Rinsui, I am both impressed and very happy indeed. It looks like you are bringing new depth to the mod and making it stable and reliable to play!
Forgive me if this has already been proposed, and especially if it is unfeasible, but I wonder if you would consider introducing a Zone of Recruitment system? That is a feature of mods like RTR that I quite like, since not only is it a bit odd for a Japanese faction to capture a city in India and be able immediately to turn out samurai, but it would also add a great deal of variety if the player was able to train the basic units of the other factions (except perhaps for the demons). I understand of course that this may be too much work, or not what you had in mind for Blue Lotus.
Not at all. This system IS implemented already ^^/
kitagata
06-04-2008, 07:51
If anyone else has been goofing around with the more recent beta, here's a couple files with new anims to style things up a little bit. Just add the anim names into descr_model_battle.
http://files.filefront.com/Added+in+Anims+BLTWzip/;10487049;/fileinfo.html
Now those duelists LOOK like they got skills...
Excellent. I just integrated them into the new patch already (release Sunday, 08.06.2008)
Thanks again for the help,
Hmm Kitagata!
The new Katana animation and the new Monted Standardbearer animations were promptly used. The two-handed spear animation was also used for the Yari spearmen, but not the Ashigaru, since it is too slow (movement speed). The "Katana" animation and the new "Swordsman" animation seem to be the same thing (at least I could not tell the difference); likewise, I can not tell any difference between the new foot_archer animations and the old archer animations...? Hmm. The rest is just wonderful, and I guess we will need the musket animation after all, haha ^^/
By the way, you seem to be proficient at editing sounds. May I get back to you once the new firelances are implemented?
And... it's faction selection time again. What faction should I do next? You got time to decide until this evening. Hurry up, guys ;)
Ok. Since no specific orders have arrived yet, I think I'll expand the Rebel factions for a while.
Come on guys, this is your chance to decide on what poor me has to work on ^^/
kitagata
06-06-2008, 01:19
Do the Chinese!
kitagata
06-06-2008, 01:31
Oh, also the difference between the sword and katana animations are slight, but if you give the katana animation to an officer, while the footmen he leads use the sword anim, you can see a difference. Sword is a more rigidly held vertical, while katana has the sword tilted back. Just a matter of preference. Same with the new bow anim, it's just tilted slightly more vertically.
Do the Chinese!
Rinsui, could you please reply to my response your the response to my long pm? It's back on the first page. :P
@Ticu
Ha. Interesting. Your post seems to have slipped through my net of attention, sorry!
We can talk about the launching attribute, agreed. Perhaps I am too inspired by
modern chinese films (Hero, The Banquet and all those mass-produced clones China
punches out at the moment to satisfy growing demand and to distract people). The
Hero units will have to be overhauled anyway - as you said, radius and the like is not
really perfect. However, I wanted to do this along with the first round of general
balancing (4 factions and the custom battlemaps are finished... time for some first
Multiplayer Beta tests?). Perhaps this weekend? Or somewhere around tuesday...
The attack speed attribute in the EDU you mean, I guess. Second number from the
back in the pri and sec attack lines? Yes, I know that. The Hong Shue Fei (red poppy
version) will become the Yuwan heroine (Lit Sin Seen), btw.:yes:
My problem with the rebel UI and the white rebel flags is, that they will show up
in multiplayer, too - interestingly, the rebels in the campaign game have correct flags.
I was able to change the UI for all factions - except for the Rebels. And those will
be usable in multiplayer, too. I guess I'll find a way to solve this sooner or later, yes.
But Kitagata cries "Do me the Chinese! Do me the Chinese!" all over ^^/:sweatdrop:
By the way, Kitagata: if I implement the units which need new sounds first (Firelances,
Chinese gun, Hwa'cha...), can I count on your skills at integrating the new sound files
as before for the Gor-haw trumpet? If so, I'll start with those...
kitagata
06-07-2008, 05:31
Sure.
I can't promise everything, because units are a good deal different than the engines and I haven't found a decent tutorial on the subject, but I've pretty much figured out how it works. The problem again though, is that there are some bugs in the firelance projectile files. Thunderbombs and vanara peaches too. They won't accept sound effects for the impact and kill animations. I don't know how that works and I don't have the software to change the actual CAS files. Unless that gets figured out, I can only add sounds to the firing animation. Plus I tried listening to the old firelances, and strangely they have a group firing sound of bows, plus an individual firing sound of javelins or slings, so I don't really even know how or where the 'flaming_fireworks' description from descr_export_unit and it's animation files are linking to in sounds. Strange.
But, I'll give it a shot, and since that'd be unpacking the SFX file, if anyone has some fun sounds for dragons, shi shi, and the like, I could try putting that in too.
Maybe the mod inquiry board can help...
Ok. I'll try to finish all the units which need new sounds by Sunday.
Well, at least those I think that will. New sounds for the Shishi, Dragons and
Wang Liang are a nice idea, but will mean a lot of work. It will suffice if you
can finish the Roaring Thunderdragon (Chinese Cannon) and perhaps the Sunogung,
the Singijeon and the Hwa'cha (all three Choson) for now. I'll do my best.
Greetings,
That would be great!
Rinsui, was there a task you wanted me to do? Perhaps you did give me one, but I might have missed it.
Yes, sure. But I´m not at home right now...
I`ll PM you later.
Just an idea but you might want to call the mongol stormriders mangudai. And make them alike.
Try "The Gimp". Extremely powerful at an extremely good price - it costs nothing.
That's what I am using, and I think my skins are not that bad.
Be sure to download the windows version:
http://www.gimp.org/downloads/
@Moros: Mangudai, it will be.
Just wondering, when will the Campaign come back in working condition? This was the absolute most attractive feature of Blue Lotus to me, and having a bunch of dummies fighting over a map isn't as much fun as you'd think it would be.
Also, my main menu's seem to lag horribly, the cursor is going at about .5 FPS and its a real struggle to get anywhere, but once I start the campaign or a custom battle its instantly lag free, any idea why it does this?
Love the new animations and units though, keep up the good work!
I have no idea when the next releasable version will be out. Rinsui would know more about that. Perhaps one way to fix the menu speed would be to go to the preferences file and disable the background fmv.
Anyway, Kitagata, those are awesome loading screens! They are much more diverse than the old ones. I hope Rinsui uses them in the mod.
kitagata
06-09-2008, 11:43
Rinsui, thanks for the tip about GIMP, man. I'm overwhelmed with the options abilities of the thing!
Re-did the loading screens to a much better overall quality. Stuck 'em here for viewing if you want.
http://files.filefront.com/Loading+screens+final+cansrar/;10561399;/fileinfo.html
(anyone know how to erase previous posts? I'd like to get rid of the previous post with the crappier loading image link.)
Also included is a Tibetan chant sound that might be useful for a unit that has druid/chant skill. There are a few more cannon sounds as well. Again, yours were fine, but I just felt like they didn't quite have the sound quality of some of the others floating around SE databases.
Finally, the Dalit scouts are standing in their horses in the latest beta out. Small thing, didn't know if it had been noticed yet or not.
Post erased.
I'll have a look at the new loading screens asap.
Sorry for the delay, but the implementation of a new siege unit (hwacha) is more problematic than I expected - I can't get it to fire the firelance rockets. Thanks for the hint concerning the dalit scouts. This should be easy to correct.
Basically all monk type units will ave the ability to chant. If you can put in their sounds, go ahead!
Please give me another day or two, because I just started with a job. I have to sort this stupid hwacha problem out, then I'll immediately do the rest... or wait. I'll do it the other way round. Next patch this Wednesday (GMT).
I have no idea when the next releasable version will be out. Rinsui would know more about that. Perhaps one way to fix the menu speed would be to go to the preferences file and disable the background fmv.
Thanks Ticu, disabling the FMV fixed my menu, no more lag!
And for the campaign, I was more just wondering if the campaign had been scratched for now in lue of multiplayer work, or if we'll see it coming back very soon, not so much an actual release date. If you guys don't plan to implement the campaign anytime soon, can you repost a link to the old Blue Lotus version?
Ok! I just took a look at the new loading screens. You are definitely right - having just Japanese ones feels "unfair" somehow. Most of those you provided are pretty good - but we will have to find a way to make them all appear as a "harmonic unity", if you get my point. For example, mixing black-and white sumi-e (screen 3) with modern-day impressionism (screen ) will (personal opinion here!) look interesting at first, but may disturb the whole atmosphere in the long run, perhaps. Screen 15 is very, very beautiful indeed. But alas, it is hard to deny it was taken from some present-day computer game, and is far from authenticity. As many of those screens are very interesting indeed, if you allow, I'll try to work some GIMP magic on them to "hammer them into unity". I'll include them into the wednesday release, and if you disagree, we will discuss this in public here.
Greetings,
and many thanks for the hard work,
Rinsui
@TigerVX the campaign map will be done once all units are overhauled. Interestingly, the Title Screen slowdown does not appear for me - everything is absolutely fluent. However, I know well what you are talking about, since I experienced the same with my old computer. The origin of this bug are unknown at this date; for now, Ticu has the best solution.
kitagata
06-10-2008, 15:41
Was messing around with the sound files and decided to give the Chinese factions' leopards actual leopard sounds.
Here's the result.
http://files.filefront.com/New+Leopard+Soundszip/;10578631;/fileinfo.html
Now they don't bark!
Sorry for the large file, but the entire voice3.dat had to be changed and included to keep it simple for installation and testing; otherwise I'd have had to include info on xidx usage, which I didn't want to get into.
The leopards were relatively simple to do, so if you like the results, I'll give a shot at the shishi, dragons, etc.
No problem with the loading screens. #15 is kinda hokey, I was just running out of image ideas. I'll make a new one, but I'd argue to keep the two screens with the modern samurai images.
I'm happy to take them out if you want, but it is a little tricky to find continent-spanning art on war and demons that meld perfectly:)
kitagata
06-11-2008, 02:08
Important notice on the new leopard sounds.
Was testing them some more, and was occasionally getting random CTDs in battle (but usually occuring at initial contact) until I figured out the following:
On each of the wav files, open up properties, and at the bottom if it says that the computer may block them since they're from a different computer, click allow and apply.
Then go into the the three txt files (unit_ambiant, anim, idle) and remove these six sounds under each one's 'dog' category:
cat_idle4
cat_attack4
cat_snarl1
cat_snarl2
cat_snarl4
cat_snarl_attack1
These sounds aren't coded to rtw's liking apparently (strictly WAV, Channels/mono, Audio format PCM) and while it will play them, it will also choose to crash during battle, especially during initial contact.
Once gone the leopards work fine and growl and snap appropriately.
You can easily decode them to the correct ADPCM format with a free audio program called Audacity. That's what I used for encoding some remastered sounds from the Latin Voice mod.
And... I'm still waiting for that assignment. :stupido2:
kitagata
06-12-2008, 16:52
Sounds for the new Korean artillery and fixed impact sounds for the Chinese, Indian, and Demon artillery.
http://files.filefront.com/Integrated+sounds+for+artyzip/;10608165;/fileinfo.html
Also you may want to shorten the 'mindist' for the Hwacha. The crew stop firing and draw swords way too early it seems.
Also the shots from the Chinese and Indian cannons are beautiful, but they don't hit with enough impact. It can strike the center of a unit and only send two or three soldiers flying. I think you should adjust the radius of effect a little.
buasudah
06-12-2008, 22:01
Hello !
Played a bit of this new BL, like it lots, cant wait campaign units!
Maybe you should reconsider the number of the big units like wang liang and dragons
cause of how they look when close together
Also, can someone please tell me where the text for changing unit speeds is, i need to slow
it down so i can continue testing it happily
Keep up the great work..
Damn, you people are fast!
@ Ticu:
Vey well.
Originally I wanted to keep this to a much later date.
But we are making progress faster than expected, so...
As Kitagata will be mightily busy with the new unit sounds in the near future,
I have two possible tasks for you. Choose.
1.) Implementing the building tree, without the units. I already sent you the intended techtree as an excel, I guess. Most of it should be self-explanatory. For now, I only need the "raw" techtree, including bonuses, pictures, costs, buildtimes. (Units will not! be implemented yet). Pictures you can use are plenty in the respective folders of the original game. If you need something else, let me know, or, if your skills are high enough, make fitting new ones.
2.) Beta unit stats for the finished factions (Akagi, Zensen, Karazai, Krishnapur). You are free to edit everything for those in the EDU, but not outside, as this would conflict with my work. In fact, your editing the EDU already is, but if you do it correctly, I will be able to implement your changes without much trouble.
Both tasks come with a number of additional restrictions and annotations; I will PM you the exact details after your decision, at some of it requires lengthly explanations of the overall concept for each of the factions. That is: if you are willing to do it.
To tell you the truth, I am very reluctant to allocate this part of the work at all. But alas, it will speed us up, and people are waiting ^^/
@Kitagata:
Your gun sounds will be in the next weekly patch (presumably this Sunday). The impact and radius and status of the ranged attack units are just tentative, of course. For now I was just happy the guns actually a) shoot their projectiles from the muzzle (which was not the case before) b) use the correct sort of ammunition (did you realize the captive catapults now actually launch severed heads, haha? Perhaps I overdid it there?) c) have adequate skinnings and models for both undamaged and destroyed state (again, this is new). As much of the range and impact radius can not be adjusted by Ticu in the EDU, I will do it until Sunday. Agreed.
The chinese standard sprite used is just a placeholder, of course. The actual sprites used later are generated automatically, and I'd like to do that in one big set, not piecemeal with each update. Using the placeholder for all units allowed me to cut the size of the base Version by about 100MB, as I was able to delete the other sprite-sets.
To feed your sound-hunger, I will work on the Vanara, snow monkeys, leopard handlers, beast riders and shishi next. The dragon... perhaps, as it needs a big major overhaul (perhaps even a redo), similar to the Gor-Haw before. This may take some time, so I cannot promise I'll be finished with the dragon on Sunday. BTW, I thought about changing the "Copper Dragon" into an "Undead Dragon" with new skinnings, bits of raw flesh shining through, just a bit rotten and bloody... Somehow "Copper Dragon" sounds too clean for the Yomi, eh? After all, it will be the mount of their ancestral unit, which is to be "Enma Dai-ou, the King of Hell". Opinions?
The Kanji (which actually will show you the unit's name - if you can read it) were not considered to be a placeholder, but it is easy to give the faction mon to at least the Akagi and Zensen faction. Let me think about this for a moment.
Lastly the Tengu Camel archers. It is funny to note someone had exactly the same feeling about this. Yes, "historically" Tengu are more Swordsmasters or!: fan-wielding stormbringers. It is a simple fact that the yomi lack other missile units. This is intentional, of course; but I guess even they should get 2 different ones (the Skullthrowers are no real missile units). Kappa Archers and XXX, where XXX reads Tengu Camel Archers for now (slow missile cavalry - not really good, but at least something mounted and ranged). Given a bit of time, I hink I could at least change their weapon to a fan, and their projectiles to small whirlwinds... this would be "historically" (haha) accurate, but I am not sure about how good it will look in the end. Hmm. Difficult.
Well, back to the drawing-board ^^/
@Kitagata, addon:
The impact radius of the heavy guns has been adjusted to that of the heavy onagers' fire projectile. Note, though, that those big guns are not intended as anti-personnel weapons; each will have a maximum of 8 shots per battle, which are very inaccurate against troops on top of that. This has a number of reasons.
1. In vanilla RTW, it is very easy to out-bombard the ai. Take a few catapults, know what you are doing, and you can shoot the AI to pieces without being touched. While this feels very satisfying the first time you find out, it is nothing but an exploit; and becomes stupid after a while, as there is no challenge included. For this reason, Siege Gunnery will be SIEGE equipment in BLTW. Few shots, powerful. This includes Siege- and Captive Catapults, Thunderdragons, Gor-haw trumpets. Some factions (about half of them, indeed) will not get those heavy wall-crackers at all. Walls bear no meaning if it is so easy to tear them down as in original RTW.
2. For use against troops, you have the Siege Crossbows. Personally, I was always very disappointed when one type of unit became "superseded" and "outdated" by another one (for example: Siege Crossbows by Catapults). Now they will be designed to complement each other. This will be one of the main general conceptual changes I have in mind, btw. In RTW, at a certain point in time, you would produce masses of Praetorian Guards and steamroll-crush the enemy (which tended to produce a mix of historically accurate - but alas, comparatively weak - rabble and elite units).
Please tell me your opinion on this point: Don't you somehow feel sorry for all the other units you suddenly stop using, because something "better" is available? What I have in mind is to make high-level units not simply "better", but "different, complementary, expanding your possibilities, not simply powering you up". Get my point? Elite units have to be Elite. There never were medieval armies composed entirely of heavy cavalry and footknights, for example. For a simple reason: Both units were extraordinarily (extraordinarily!) expensive to maintain. And this will be the main change I will introduce into BLTW. Elite Units will cost immensely more and take immensely longer to produce than normal ones. And suddenly the poor peasant recruit will become appreciated again. Not because he is OMGXXXzorgggzROXXAZ!. No. Because he is diligent and cheap.
While forcing a player to adjust to your preferences is never optimal, I guess this approach might be justified in this special case. Opinions?
@Ticu, addon: ^^:
If you choose to do the EDU beta-stats, this will *roughly* translate into:
Production time../..Initial Cost../..Maintenance Cost:
Peasantry:....1....0....X (high, since nobody works your fields!)
Infantry (LV1+2):....1....X....1/3X
Infantry (LV3+4):....2....2X....2/3X
Infantry (LV5):....4....4X....4/3X
Cavalry (LV2):....1....1,5X....1/2X (Note: There are no cavalry units available at LV 1)
Cavalry (LV3+4):....2....3X....X
Cavalry (LV5):....4....6X....2X
Mercenaries: at least double or triple both costs. After all, mercenaries always were expensive, as they were hired only in times of imminent war => actual service on the
battlefield was guaranteed, and fatalities high. Take the normal rules of availability and demand, and you can imagine they have to be expensive; if otherwise, no nation would have used standing armies at all. Concept: They may save your throat in times of dire need, but don't rely on them too much 'cause they'll rather sooner than later drain your purse. Comments?
I guess that's enough of leaking out some of the "big picture". I guess we should save some of the surprise for the actual release.
Drunk-Monk
06-14-2008, 08:47
You have some excellent ideas there, keep it up.
It appears the new Korean Gun unit is made up of horrible mutated demons D=
https://img383.imageshack.us/img383/3628/sciencenf3.jpg
...and have been corrected. Sometimes strange things happen upon exporting form 3DS Max...
See the updates section, just paste the new file.
You are fast to notice, haha!...
kitagata
06-15-2008, 13:13
Hey, does anyone know how to create new anim events for descr_sounds_unit_anims? I mean I can write a new one in, but where are the files that these correspond too? I'm trying to make sounds for thunderbombers, dragonfire, and singijeon. Are there evt files somewhere like for the ballista, onager, etc?
(Link and comments self-deleted for being obsolete)
Hmm. Actually I don't know too much about sound editing either. You are well ahead of me in that matter ^^/. I guess there IS a solution somewhere o the net, but I don't know where. Most tutorials I used come from either where you posted your question on that matter or here
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=22
Perhaps you are lucky and can dig somethin up from there?
kitagata
06-16-2008, 18:34
Semi-breakthrough on some previously non-functioning sounds for dragonfire troops.
In a day or so I'll post a zip with sounds and accompanying necessary txts for shishi, snow monkeys, dragonfire troops, singijeon, siege catapults with working impact sounds, and the thunderbombers (if I can replicate the success with dragonfire).
I'm basing it all off the beta with the three updates, so please don't post another update for few days. Plus this all requires heavy modification of many of the descr_sound_ files, and may take a little while for you to combine with what your currently working on.
Thanks to Moros for leading me to Audacity. It's a great program.
Rinsui the Krishnapur and Yomi officers (at least) have problems with their beard textures. They have a black border instead of being transparent. Same with the Tomoe Gozen, whose veil is no longer translucent. In terms of balancing I know it's premature, but the singijeon are incredibly powerful for such a high rate of fire. They slice right through everything. Should they really punch through multiple bodies?
Also, in order to make a unique sound for the shishi that doesn't make the horses gain wierd sounds, I'm having to make them 'class camel'. I thought this was a good solution because from what you were saying it sounded like you might be junking the tengu camel riders, and the Chinese have so many archer units I was hoping you'd put bactrian camel archers on the backburner.
If this interferes with your work let me know so I can figure something else out for them.
Again, if anyone knows how the events work in descr_sounds_unit_anims, please let me know. I looked in descr_skeleton and the animations go into CAS files which contain evt files I think; and those files relate to the events like ANIM_ARCHER_FIRE in descr_sounds_unit_anims (I think). But I don't know how to access those evt.s, or if that's even what I should be doing!
Ok. No worries about the Singijeon. In the final release, there will be just one of them, not three at once; but it is intended to be the most powerful anti-personnel weapon indeed (which is historrically accurate, btw). I just wanted to check the flying projectiles three at once, because I am slow to push the pause button at the right moment. Thanks for the info concerning the beard textures. This will be corrected in the next patch.
Arrgh, arrgh. Go ahead with the shishi camels. In fact, I also did that, because I thought they might scare off horses like this. Camels will definitely be in the final release as mercenary units... after all the Gobi desert is right around the corner! But I don't mind if you make them sound a bit lionish, haha! Just don't make the sount too discernible. Something grunty will do.
I guess I misunderstand you on the .evt files, but isn't it easy to open the .evt files with notepad?
Personally, I doubt a .cas file contains an .evt file in some way, but I may be mistaken on that. I am sorry I cannot be too much of a help on that matter!
Thanks for your great work,
kitagata
06-17-2008, 14:05
Put up a big file with sounds for shishi, snow monkeys, singijeon, dragonfire, thunderbombers, and other things, plus their accompanying txt files.
Many files had to be changed, so please check out the readme, Rinsui.
http://files.filefront.com/SnowMShishibombsgunszip/;10678028;/fileinfo.html
I like your new description of the Snow Monkeys.
Where will the former ghost mercenaries be in the new rendition? Are you considering putting them with the Yomi at all? They could use the archer unit, and it would seem 'better' than the tengu on camels.
Alright, I've been a bit busy for a while, but I'll try and tackle the buildings for now. :D
And Kitagata, you're awesome. Blue Lotus desparately needed new sounds, and you seem to be filling in the gap quite well.
Well, I finally updated BL all the way, and when I played it, I found a very changed game - for the better. I though't I'd address a few issues and concerns before working on the buildings, if that's alright. I know my ranting is probably growing tiresome, but I'm a neat freak, so I can't help it sometimes. Please note that what I am posting is only a suggestion. I'm not going to beg or anything. =P
However, I'll give one last attempt at stating my case about the hero units. I know they are "really special", but take one final look at this and tell me what you think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSxqr1sggbY
(The only difference is the launching ability.)
That's basically all I can say about that, though it would also be good to note that I was able to kill half of an entire army using only one hero unit. I doubt that any of the stats will be changed, but it would be nice if we could make it so that the heroes do well in combat, but not to the point where they sort of throw away the necessity to use tactics to win (just a thought). ~;)
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Perhaps they weren't implemented yet, but when trying out the Japanese, none of the katana wielding units seemed to have the katana animations (I didn't try *all* the units out, but enough so that it was noticeable). I thought it was an issue with the way I installed the patches, but I later noticed that the Green leaves had the two-handed sword animation. I'm sure you meant to add the new animations in, but I thought I'd point it out just in case. If that is how you meant to have them, then ignore this. :P
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While I'm on the topic of the Japanese, I might as well mention that some of the Zensen units seemed to be the same color as the akagi units. I don't know if this was done on purpose, but I find the blue armor slightly more fitting. It might also be better if they had a different symbol on the flag attached to their back.
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I noticed you changed the music around some more, which is awesome. However, I noticed that some of the songs didn't seem to fit the situation they played in. I noticed some peaceful flute music, as well as intense combat music during the the marches. Having a different mood often works well, as in the case of having that bell like music during the combat scenes, but the previously mentioned situations should be tweaked a bit in my opinion.
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Lastly, the units seem to have an extremely large amount of defense compared to attack. It's great that the battles now last longer, but the truth is, they last a bit too long. I pitted some Akagi duelists against another similar unit, and the fight lasted *really long* - a bit too long in my opinion. If tuning it down slightly isn't an option, I had the idea of lowering the wait time between attacks for every unit. That way the defense is kept, and fights between two soldiers don't take 2 minutes. ;)
Having the soldiers perform rapid attacks would also further help maintain the illusion of an intense battle.
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That's all I have to say for now.
Ok, here we go. Second round ;)
You won, the launching attribute will be cancelled in the next official patch (this sunday). Stop begging already, haha! The stats of the hero units are far from being final anyway - I just gave them the high numbers to make them last long enough to check for modeling and skinning errors and the like. Btw, this goes for ALL units up to now. None of the stats are final; the high defense ratings the stats are based on were introduced as a try-out by Moros, originally.
The problem with the Katana and two-handed spear animations is unit movement speed. As the animations are directly tied to movement speed, I could well give the Yari Ashigaru the two handed animation alright - by making them move just as slow as a heavy unit clad in full body plate armour. I decided to go with the a little less beautiful, but technically a little better option. The Katana animation may work with the No-Dachi, the normal Samurai and some other units though. I'll look into this.
The Akagi/Zensens colours were mentioned by Kitagata already. It is just a matter of the little time I have to do things. I guess I'll have to re-introduce different colours for both factions, then. It's just a matter of working time.
The music... I am not sure about which pieces don't fit, but I will try to keep my ears open for inconsistencies.
@Kitagata
You'll get the Handlers next. Anything else that needs new sounds?
kitagata
06-18-2008, 12:46
Hmm, beast riders, and yomi general's unit maybe; they could use the shishi sounds.
I'd like to give the Wang Liang and Hanya a few new growls and howls and add new Asiatic chants to any chanting monk units.
These are all low priorities though, and can be done at whatever your pace work is. So I guess for the time being, the leopards are the last in dire need of sounds.
Beyond that I probably can't help too much else unless there are sound issues or needs.
Do you want a new background song for the credits instead of the one from M2TW? I have a raw sound file that could easily be turned into a fitting dark and Asian down-tempo piece for the credits.
Also if you want to put new sounds in to replace the 'clicks' and 'button pushing' I have a bunch of mastered Asian instrument wav sounds lying around.
On the subject of animations, I know people make slow, semi-fast, fast versions of skeletions. Maybe that could be looked into.
the length of the battles is mostly due to a low lethality used bu most units. Try doubling or trippling them.
So don't lower attack speed, and defense yet.
Hm. Changing the colours for Akagi and Zensen will be more time-consuming than I originally thought, as the original BLTW does not provide INFO pics in different colours. I'll do it right away, though.
The movement speeds of the animations could always be changed, of course. If you want I can try modifying them.
Edit: Also, another minor issue I thought I'd point out is that the veil of the Tomoe Gozen isn't semitransparent as it was in the previous version.
Note that a lot of animation packs who have the basic animations also have different speed anim's. Alin's one for example might have usefull ones.
@Ticu
Definitely yes. Finalization of unit movement speed is of much higher priority than the building roster for now. As Kita knows how to integrate new animations, please talk to him directly - I guess he can help on that matter. As far as I can tell, we still can use, ordered according to priority high->low:
1.) An additional slow-firing crossbow-type animation. Movement speed is ok as it is, but the reload times are too fast (for the Singijeon). Perhaps you can simply double the animation cycles for the reload animation? (making them reload twice before firing)
2.) An additional "semi-fast movement speed" 2-handed spear animation for the Ashigaru - otherwise the 1-handed one will have to do.
3.) thats all for now. Give it a shot, and if it takes too much effort, tell me. It is not a "must have", just a "would be good to have".
The veil of Miss Gozen is directly linked to the indian officer's beards (haha). You will know what I mean if you read Kita's post a few posts up. This will be corrected in the next release (Sunday). Strangely the GIMP seems to sometimes lose transparency information - just sometimes I say, because it did a great job for the Kamikaze (their flag has holes).
I've worked with animations before and know how to implement new ones, so I will do that now.
Also, I have photoshop, and am pretty proficient with it. So if you need help with something that can't be doen in GIMP, I could work with it. I will fix the veil of "Miss Gozen" for now. :P
kitagata
06-22-2008, 16:58
I noticed that the Yomi banners that surround the town center in their settlements have some skinning problems. The bottom of the banners contains other imagery. Also, is it intentional that stonewall sieges no longer allow ladders?
Both are errors I guess. I'll look into it right away. The new patch I just uploaded also contains the new colours vor Akagi and Zensen, and the new sounds you provided for all units except the Snow Monkeys. Since I didn't fully understand what you did for them, I was weary to integrate the changes to the export_descr_unit.txt and the export_descr_sounds_soldier_voice as yet \ savety first, you know... As you hijacked the romal Light_1 set for the Monkeys, what will happen if another faction (e.g. the Egyptians/Yomi) recruit Snowmonkey Infantry? Will those use the monkey sounds or the normal egyptian Light_1 set then?
Another thing is the Leopard Handlers. As you noticed, I did not implement the changes to their voices as yet, as some of them seem to cause CTDs (according to your tests). However, those kitties are in dire need of new growls, I think. could you look into that, perhaps? I'll do them right now, but just in case you want to continue immediately, they will be named "BLTW_leopard_handlers" internally.
Thanks again,
continuing work after a long weekend,
kitagata
06-24-2008, 01:22
The Snow Monkeys should only use the Roman light_1. Units don't change their voice category if you make them recruitable for other factions, and mercenaries in vanilla RTW didn't either, so I think the monkeys are fine. It seems units have a primary "affiliation" to one culture, but I don't know where that's determined in the _.txts.
I'll try them with different factions to see what happens when I get a chance.
In fact, if you can switch the Son Goku from a Barbarian unit to a Roman unit (but only recruitable to the Chinese through export_descr_buildings) then he could just borrow the Snow Monkeys' voice set from Roman light_1.
Then I wouldn't have to take the Barbarian light_1 voice just for Son Goku.
The leopard sounds have been fixed so they are all the right format. I don't get CTDs anymore with them. When I get a chance I'll put them on filefront.
Lastly, I've never liked the overly-stereotyped eyes of the Mongol units. The eyes of other Asian units are fine, but the Mongols are all sleeping/blind/or squinting!
So I've tried GIMPing in some eyes on the old BL Kharazai units. If you wouldn't mind looking, maybe if you like them you could cut and paste the faces to the new Kharazai units.
I'll include them with the leopard sounds in a while.
EDIT:
Here's the fixed Leopard sounds and the sample Mongol textures:
http://files.filefront.com/LeopardAndMongolszip/;10780614;/fileinfo.html
Keep up the good work.
Ok. The Stonewalls no more allowing ladders is "intentional by accident", I think. The problem is that the outline of those walls is slightly slanted for the Chinese and Japanese Factions, and thus the ladders and Men would disapper inside while climbing them (as the original obstacle data was not changed - it is a different file from the visible .ITEM file you see in battle). The removal of the ladders altogether seems to have been the best solution the original BLTW developers could come up with - I guess they realized the problems the new models would cause after they were finished, and were too lazy to redo the complete wall sets afterwards. In theory I think I could correct this; no, actually I am quite sure I could. But alas, i also think this is a rather low priority problem. It would take me several hours to do, after all. Remind me once I am finished with everything else.
The wrong skinning of the Yomi banners is not due to a wrong skinning, but due to the Yomi using a slightly differently composed texture for all their banners. No problem to correct this, but I am not sure what side-effects this may have. I'll give it a shot.
Edit: Ok. The side-effects are controllable. This will be corrected in the next patch.
kitagata
06-27-2008, 05:19
Tested the newer sounds for the Leopards, and they definitely don't cause problems anymore.
If you haven't gotten them, they are linked in my last post.
Messed around with Son Goku, and he can't borrow the snow monkeys' sounds. You're right, by making him recruitable for the Chinese, he takes their voice. I can give him sounds, but I'll have to take one of the Eastern/Parthian voice classes. Same for the Incarnation of Kali.
I'm going to test the snow monkeys to make sure that when they are mercenaries, they keep their monkey voice in any army. Again I think I remember that it is true in normal Rome Total War, so it should be fine.
Also, what are the sounds that the beast riders use? Did you make them camels? They don't use horse sounds.
Lastly, While the model is pretty cool, do the demons need the headless horse cavalry? It seemed like their strength was infantry, with just a few cavalry and archery units. Also, it doesn't seem quite as 'Asian mythology' as the other demons.
I can get used to the unit, though, but maybe you could at least limit it to the custom battle or something. No offense, the unit looks good, but I dunno...
What's coming up in the next release???
@Kitagata
The next release will be on July 1st. This will be a new "base" version (~1.3GB), that will supersede the current base version+patches.
It looks like we can't have distinctive sounds for all those special units we are about to field, then. Well, please do not hack more of the original unit sounds; for Kali, Dragons and some of the more stupid-looking Yomi Units etc. it would suffice to have an "undistinguishable grunt" of some sort - one for all of them. So you are free to "conquer" one of the voice types - Light_1, Medium_1, Heavy_1, General_1, Female_1 - for each of the cultures; and I guess you will have to do that for mercenary units anyway. Unlike yourself, I am not sure the snow monkeys will keep their voices in an "egyptian" army. Rather I am convinced they will not, just like Son Goku doesn't. Hmm. This is a problem we didn't think of...
Yep, I fear I was right. I just tried the snow monkeys within a Yomi (egyptian) and Rebel (roman) army. The roman ones had your beautiful screechings, but the Yomi ones were just plain soldiers. Damn. I really liked those monkey sounds. But I guess you understand we cannot afford to sacrifice one whole voice cathegory for every faction just for a single unit. My test was with custom battles, so I am not 120% sure this will affect stratmap mercenaries as well. But then again, do all mercenaries really use roman voices? Until this problem is sorted out, the monkey sounds are on hold and will not be included in the next release.
Beast riders are "camels" too, yes. Horse sounds would be a little strange for them, eh?
The headless horses mainly fill a gap in the Yomi roster. The problem is: there are generally four levels of cavalry: 1 is light, 2 is medium, 3 is heavy. The Yomi had medium (beast riders) and heavy (shishi). Undoubtable, Shishi "look" pretty heavy, and not just "medium". They have a certain weakness to ensure a Yomi player doesn't get overly cavalry-enthusiastic (they may run amok), but a giant lion just isn't "medium". The next decision was to make the beast riders either medium or heavy, and to fill the third slot with something appropriate. I first thought about using the Tengu Camel Archers for this, but I need them to have at least a second missile unit for the Yomi.. If you take the time to read through the unit descriptions, you will note the Yomi have serious problems with live horses.. Now ok, it is possible to... grr. Yes, I could make up a new Yomi archery unit, alright - to fill the ensuing gap in the missile department. But I don't want it to be "better" than the Kappa archers, just different. Hmmhmm. Let me think about this. Hmm.
Btw, I agree the Yomi cavalry, and especially their archery shouldn't - relative to the other units they field - be the best. On a sidenote, however: in MP battles with unlimited amounts of money, the Yomi will be nearly unbeatable. The BLTW campaign game should give even the most experienced players a real challenge when facing a Yomi army - and I think just giving them a money boost (which is very easy to implement), I want them to be really stronger than the other factions. But... now I have to go back to unit-implementing. Tedious bug-slaying has slowed me down a lot during the last days. It's time to move on.
Edit: Upon several trials, the new leopard sounds worked like a charm. I also included the new mongolian eyes into the new textures that are currently used for all units but generals and officers - this gives a bit of variation to the faces. Very good idea indeed.
Does the run amok work on normal cavalry though?
Also I just donwloaded the new base build and the updates. I'll start looking for a fix for the white banner.
Well, another option would be to simply make the screeching sounds play when you select the units. You can customize that for any individual unit without replacing anything.
By the way, I've been out of the house for around a week, so I wasn't able to work very much on the animations. I have created a new, faster, 2 handed animation set, as well as included one I found that has the units holding their spears with 2 hands even when standing idly or marching (the old set didn't do this). I will finish up and try to upload the file soon. ;)
EDIT: Here (http://files.filefront.com/Datazip/;10826787;/fileinfo.html) it is
I didn't include a slower crossbow animation because I think it's possible to simply edit one of the stats in the EDU file in order to modify the rate of attacks. I know this works with melee units, and I'm pretty sure it would do the same with the Singijeon.
Ha, yes. I would be glad if it did work. But I upped the attack delay for the Singijeon to 200 (20 secs), and they still attack as fast as before; so if you can make a crossbow animation that has about a 10 sec delay, I would be very grateful. And provided it is easy to do, another 20 sec delay one would be good, too... for now, I'll try out your 2h animations. Thank you!
@Moros
Yes, even normal cavalry runs amok pretty well ^^/. Those white banners are a mystery to me. Try playing at the Rebels in custom battles, and you will notice they use the default RTW roman interface, too. I guess if you can find out where they get that default interface from, the banners problem could be solved too... Strangely, the slaves in custom battles do not seem to use the banners specified in descr_banners.txt!
@Kitagata
Ticu's suggestion concerning the Monkey sounds sounds reasonable to me, as it is better than nothing...?
I'll see what I can do. It may be that the animations may only be tweaked using a script if it affects movement speed. I may need to edit the animation and tween it a bit in max.
Alright, I guess a decision's going to have to be made about the crossbow animation. For some strange reason, all crossbow animations appear to be non-editable in the sense that if they are reexported, the bones start to behave erratically in game. The only one I was able to re-edit was the hold animation, but that presented some problems. It seems as if the hold animations of missile units have their length multiplied by a changing value for each indiviual soldier in a unit, causing each of them to fire at slightly different times. Due to the fact that I greatly increased the count of the hold animation frames, the firing variation times became much longer as a result. This caused the soldiers to shoot and reload out of unison (by 5-10 seconds approximately). Also, because the firing wasn't grouped in the same time interval, several soldiers would shoot long after the group firing sound effect had played. It seems like I won't be able to change the speed between firing volleys... unless I can figure something out.
One possibility is to take the bow stringing animation and modify taht instead. Although it would most likely affect the smothness of the transitioning between the ready and holding animations, it would also allow me to get the desired transition time between volleys. I suppose the good news is that I've found out how to make soldiers fire at closer times.
Tell me what you think.
The general approach I take with this game is functionality > cosmetics. So if you can give me longer reload times by including animation cycles that don't look as 100% good as the original ones, their "functional superiority" will be given preference. Sometimes the .CAS exporter is (randomly) erratic btw, so it might help to simply try lengthening the old crossbob animations again. I had a similar problem with the Singijeon, which suddenly mixed up their bones upon export (there is a picture on page 2 of this thread).
I guess you are experienced enough with the animations already, so allow me to compile a comrehensive (complete) list of what I think we will still need. Unless I forget something again, that is. ^^/
After this, we should be able to close the animations chapter:
1. A semi_fast 2-handed spearman (Yari Ashigaru, "old style", that is, just 1-handed while idle and moving)
2. A normal speed crossbow animation with about 25 seconds inter-volley time (Singijeon)
3. A normal speed crossbow animation with about 15 seconds inter-volley time (Dragonfire Troopers)
4. A slow-moving crossbow animation with the minimum possible inter-volley time (is 3 seconds possible? - for the Chu-ko-nu)
BTW, it would be great if you could name the animations set according to movement speed. In RTW, there are 4 movement speeds for both infantry and cavalry: fs_slow_xxx, fs_xxx, fs_semi_fast_xxx, fs_fast_xxx (horses are a bit different, but we don't need those).
To tell you the truth, I have little clue about animations above using them. Consequently, I cannot judge the workload you'll have to manage. If it is too much, tell me. Otherwise, just take your time. As for me, i'll try to punch out about 3 units a day - the most difficult ones (except the Dragon) are finished already anyway.
Thank you again,
Hi there I just wanted to thank you for your hard work on this excellent mod and carrying on a great game. Thanks, again.
Alright Rinsui, I'll use the archer animation instead I guess (since I've tried modifying the default xbow animations around 7 times)
I believe I could create those desired speeds, though it might take me some time.
Also, should we be holding our modding discussions in the feedback thread, or would it be better if we sort of... transfered the convo somewhere else and left the feedback thread for the feedback. :P
I don't really mind, but it is just a suggestion.
Yes. I just opened up a new thread. Please read on there.
kitagata
07-04-2008, 07:54
Hey, just a small error I've found lately.
The Barac Guardsmen don't have a description appear with their pic and stats during battle, and their description is actually on another unit. I think it's the peasants or militia unit.
Also the thunderbombers make the archer fire sound when they throw their bombs. The javelin sound would make more sense. I think this can be fixed in export_desr_unit.
Next, I was going to give some chanting sounds to the warrior monks, but when I click the chant button, nothing happens. It may still have the effect on the surrounding men, but they don't perform the chant animation or make sounds. I haven't looked into why, but maybe there's a mistake in the texts or maybe chanting isn't compatible with the two handed animation.
Lastly, again about the snow monkeys, since there are five voice categories in a culture, is there really a problem in taking up one of the Egyptian ones so that they sound right? The mercenary snow monkey unit will make the monkey sounds for any faction that hires it, but the ones recruited by the Yomi won't unless I take a voice category.
I'm working on making a bunch of generic grunts for the Yomi soldiers (Medium1), a voice for the geisha and hags (Female1), a wang liang and hanya voice (Heavy1). So I figure that leaves General1 open for any additional need and Light1 open for the monkeys. Same for the Chinese with Son Goku. I don't imagine there will be need for that many different voice categories, so taking one just for that unit ought to be alright.
Lastly lastly, I noticed some of the music in the game is from an old game called Rise of the Middle Kingdom. I used to have it, and still have the sound files. If you want I could give you the rest of the music. I browsed through it and it is all very suitable.
PS I give in. I'll ask, why are the Chinese Elite Cavalry now Hooker Cavalry?
Thanks for the hints. Punching out 3 units a day takes about 3 hours, you know - there is *much* more to do than just writing descriptions and changing names. Actually many units have small skinning or animation mistakes, so I sometimes simply don't have the time to check the details.
Barac Guardsmen descr: corrected
Thunderbombers sound: not corrected; I know what you mean: there is an archery sound before they actually throw their bombs. Well, I guess you know better about that than me...?
Chanting sounds: Yes, I also noticed that. This might turn out to become a problem. If everything fails, we can skip the chanting and simply have them inspire nearby troops without chanting (like a legionary eagle). Less beauty, same effect. Ticu is working on new animations already. Perhaps we could stress his good will even more, haha!
Snow monkey sounds: I am not sure they will actually use their new sounds when "mercenaried" by other cultures. This will have to be tested first once the campaign is up again. A little more patience please. BTW, the Yomi will no more be able to "normally" recruit the Snow Monkey Infantry.
Ah, haha. Yes, the "Hooker Cavalry" ^^. I did hesitate for a long time about the name - after all, there are some kids playing this game, too. You'll understand once you read the unit description, and consider the general "character" of the Yuwan (this Sunday).
I don't mind about still more new music, but I consider it somewhat low priority. The pieces I used are samples of Jeff Alexander's works that are provided for free on his homepage - so there is no legal issues.
saulot333
07-05-2008, 20:37
Hi, I tried this mod when it came out time ago and I found it great. I helped a bit Moros and the others in stabilising the campaign and rebalance battles and campaign. Today I installed your version and I found it really great, even in this early stages. I think that this team have done a great work and I want to thank you all for it. I was also wondering: could I volounteer to help? I'm no good in the graphic department, but I can help you in the stat testing and balancement, tech tree, building coding and text editing in general.
kitagata
07-07-2008, 19:08
Hey, I was browsing the latest changes and noticed the Shadow Warriors don't have bomb sounds, and they make the archer fire sounds. So I went ahead and fixed it as well as added some 'ook ook' sounds for Son Goku. Check the file linked below.
http://files.filefront.com/sound+fixeszip/;10963350;/fileinfo.html
Also included two common use Indian tracks I was given and cut a little. Might be good for Krishnapur.
Has anyone considered adding a small horde unit based on gaki or the impish demons? You see it in lots of Asian myths and art, and I think it would be very fitting of the character of the Yomi.
It probably wouldn't take much more than copying and rescale-ing a skeleton and then modding the bakemono or hanya model a bit. Or maybe just use the kappa skeleton.
Here's what I mean: (tab open the links, as they don't like letting you go back.)
http://bp3.blogger.com/_uEwOmLfNbOk/R03olPxUojI/AAAAAAAAAsk/ZBVsolteY2I/s1600-h/gaki1.jpg
http://bp1.blogger.com/_xQwP8MNj0EA/R0kcL-1r-gI/AAAAAAAADfQ/l829ZkGvzbQ/s1600-h/AN00231216_001_l.jpg
http://bp1.blogger.com/_xQwP8MNj0EA/R0kbQ-1r-XI/AAAAAAAADeI/EzeYOCBK0QY/s1600-h/AN00201900_001_l.jpg
To Saulot333, I'm just a party crasher on this mod so my words aren't worth anything, but I hope they accept your help. I remember the good fixes you had for the first beta.
Jesus! These pictures sure are beautiful. As for me, I don't mind having something small at all. The Bakemono would be quite befitting on a small scale as well, I guess - and it would add some sort of funny cuteness (image a horde of child-sized small devils bashing away at the knees of ever-severe, honourable and proud Akagi Duelists... admitted, it is a matter of taste, but I like the idea. I'll give it a shot with the Son Goku skeleton. We can always change back if it looks too stupid).
Btw, the Dragon-Warriors of the monks in the last release somehow managed to elude my censorship. They are not finished, just a sketch. Lets see whether I can give them revolving claws.
...-and thanks for the new Shadow Warrior sounds, as always.
P.S.: My wife will leave for a trip back to Japan for about a month beginning next monday - which might slow me down until then. You know, family>a>b>c...>x>y>BL (or at least I have to pretend to be of that opinion, haha!). The good news is: I will also be able to elude censorship for a month beginning next monday.
@Saulot: Your help is most appreciated. Please send me a PM, and we'll talk about details.
kitagata
07-11-2008, 09:52
That's funny, my wife is leaving Japan for the States next week. Anyway, here's a gaki texture and skeleton. Give it a look and see if it's worth using.
http://files.filefront.com/gaki+skeltextzip/;11014546;/fileinfo.html
Old Nick
07-16-2008, 10:35
I've been away for a while and wow,I can't believe how much progress you made.This is amazing,guys.
Going to download and take alook at everything asap.
I've one further suggestion but I don't know if that might not have been brought up already:Teppo/Muskets
Would there be away to implement them, especially since there already are so many different projectiles ?I think they'd make a great addition to the mod and would be especially great to make the distinction between the progressive Zensen and conservative Akagi even clearer.
I would offer to try and make the models (using Hoggy's as base of course) but I haven't modded RTW for years and all I ever did where some small changes on models and skins (if there is anything like that I can help you with I would do so gladly btw).
Cheers
ON
The new Singijeon more or less is a very primitive "Teppo" for the Choson. In the fictional timframe of BLTW, gunpowder is something really new that was only recently invented by the Zhuanshi. From there, it spread to India (in its heavy guns), Yuwan (in its thunderbombers). The sneaky Yuwan in turn sold the secret of gunpowder to the Karazai (Mongols) in exchange for an alliance against their common archenemy - the beforementioned Zhuanshi. How the Choson fit into that transition is explained in the unit descriptions ^^.
Old Nick
07-16-2008, 14:41
Just tried out the Singijeon wow,perfect,I really loved the sounds,they were actually better than NTW2's - and even better than the Singijeon (because they were a pleasant surprise): the Hwacha ,really awesome.
I had some troubles though,at first the game would ctd,shortly after the first screen, show_err said nothing, worked with -nm though, so it seems there's a trouble with the intro/background vids.
The game also hung itself when I tested the indian guns, the Zhuanshi guns worked fine though (used EAX3).I like the cannon sounds, but they could be a tad louder and longer.
As for the Teppo, maybe they would make sense as an AOR unit in the territories of the Choson and/or Zhuanshi ?They could use the same projectiles as the Singijeon, the UI could be a problem though,well they're not that important anyway.
This mod is getting better and better, thank you very much !:bow:
Cheers,
ON
P.S.
Another Idea would be jungles,I know EB has them and the Crusades mod has them too, I saw a guide to implement them somewhere as well, too bad I'm so inept in any things code-related.If you need me for small modelling/texturing I'd be glad to help though.
kitagata
07-21-2008, 04:38
Dragon Warriors are pretty smooth. The game runs them, but on shutdown it gives a warning that they have different max ranges listed in different places, 18 or 30.
Also, I think you need to change any originally barbarian and roman culture units to a voice type other than light_1, except Son Goku and the Snow Monkeys. At the moment practically the entire Chinese army is making monkey howls.
Lastly, the chanting/praying animation and sounds work on all the monk units except the Sohei on foot and horseback. It doesn't seem to be skeleton or animation set based, as the Sadhu fanatics use the two handed set but can chant.
Again, the Dragon Warrors are a great idea, very cool.
EDIT: Realized that the reason the Shishi still use the horse sounds for charging and death from descr_sounds_units_anims is because the shishi's skeleton in descr_model_battle (fs_beast I think) points it at the horse 'event ANIM_...' entry.
I am unable to edit the skeleton, but if anyone knows how to change the skeleton so that it points at the CAMEL 'event ANIM' sounds in units_anims then everything would be fixed.
Noted, both errors (dragon warriors range and chinese monkeys) will be corrected later today. Also scheduled is the first Gaki tryout.
Like the new dragons. Though I'd keep the old ones too if I were you. Make them two different units. The black ones being like the royal elephants, while the green ones like the medium indian elephants? That'd be awesome.
Nope, sorry. Dragons are too special to be something "medium" in my opinion. One dragon for the whole game. No worries, though. It's about 8m tall. ;)
~:(
I didn't mean medium unit, I meant a medium dragon. Powerfull but the towered ones wouldn't be as powerfull as the black dragons. Them black being well overpowered really.
Ah, yes... I understand what you mean. The stats are not finished, btw. In fact, they aren't even started. So don't wonder when your 10-man Ashigaru batallion wipes out a Samurai army. To clarify that alos: the "Black Dragon" is an ancestral unit, btw (Enma Dai-ou, the King of Hell), hence: not recruitable. Think of it as the "final boss" in this game.
kitagata
08-19-2008, 00:58
Hey, things are looking really good!
I just wanted to point out that beards on some units, including the yomi officer, still have black borders instead of invisible alpha channels.
Also, you said that you finished all the units; will there be no full sized Bakemono? I didn't mean to replace them by suggesting the Gaki. The original Bakemono model is such a great model, I think it would be great as a medium or heavy weight Yomi unit, or as a mercenary.
Hm. The beard's borders is a very strange and elusive bug I don't know the origin of. It may have something to do with they way I export .tga int .dss, or it may have something to do with the models themselves. Strangely, the black border sometimes disappears once you close in on the unit. Strange, strange. I'll look into this once again then.
Your Gaki pushed out the Bakemono, that's right. The Yomi already have by far the largest unit roster of all factions, so there is little need for doubles.
Will the normal dragons still be recruitable though?
As you insist on a definite answer: not in the version I am planning to release. I'll leave the .cas and .tga.dds files in though, so it should be a matter of minutes for an experienced modder like you to re-include them. Personally I hold the conviction that, even in a mythology game, dragons are waaaay to special to appear on the battlefield in dozens. But, again, this is a decision I am unable to defend with rational arguments; it is a matter of pure personal preference, and I am sure many will disagree. Some people think it's cool Gandalf slew the Balrog, some people think that's bullshit. In fact I secretly hope some modders will mod this mod after I'm finished modding...
kitagata
08-19-2008, 23:18
It's cool that you're ok with other modding. I've been redo-ing some of the units, roads and bridges, and the wooden walls to my own liking, and I was hoping it wouldn't be rude to post them at some point.
Any chance of a Yuwan thunderbomber model instead of using the Karazai one?
...ok. This should be doable. Btw, the Yuwan will be allied to the Karazai at the beginning, against their common archenemy, the Zhuanshi. The Thunderbombers are a co-production of the two nations, with the Yuwan providing the gunpowder secrets and the Karazai providing... well... the madmen throwing them. But I guess I can give them separate models each. Agreed. Don't expect too much, though. I'm pretty *done with* units, hahaha!
Btw: what did you do to roads, bridges and walls? This sounds interesting...
@Moros. To be upright: another reason why I am very reluctant to include the "normal" dragons is because their original model, if you look closely, definitely lacks quality of all the other BLTW ones. I admit I may be a little lunatic in that regard, but I invested a whopping 9 full hours to distill the Black one out of the Green ones. Please look at the last entry in the "Rinsuis updates" thread which shows the two versions in direct comparison. The Green dragon had unaligned textures, a stupily open jaw, a straight swifer-tail, a broken hip and neck, matchstick legs and did definitely not move like a reptile but rather like Mr. Crabs from Spongebob Squarepants. In consequence this means I'd have to use a downscaled Black Dragon model for the Green ones, too... but where is the coolness in: "Oh, yet another dragon. This times he's a little bigger. And not green. Whoa. What's on TV?". And as I said: I am too tired (mentally) to sacrifice another 9 hours of summertime to come up with something completely new. Please understand this decision.
@Moros. To be upright: another reason why I am very reluctant to include the "normal" dragons is because their original model, if you look closely, definitely lacks quality of all the other BLTW ones. I admit I may be a little lunatic in that regard, but I invested a whopping 9 full hours to distill the Black one out of the Green ones. Please look at the last entry in the "Rinsuis updates" thread which shows the two versions in direct comparison. The Green dragon had unaligned textures, a stupily open jaw, a straight swifer-tail, a broken hip and neck, matchstick legs and did definitely not move like a reptile but rather like Mr. Crabs from Spongebob Squarepants. In consequence this means I'd have to use a downscaled Black Dragon model for the Green ones, too... but where is the coolness in: "Oh, yet another dragon. This times he's a little bigger. And not green. Whoa. What's on TV?". And as I said: I am too tired (mentally) to sacrifice another 9 hours of summertime to come up with something completely new. Please understand this decision.
No problems at all Rinsui. I just was wondering. I'm glad you're doing the already incredible amount of work you're doing. Respect mate.
kitagata
08-21-2008, 16:55
I took the Chinese stone wall skin and cut it to fit and shadow properly on the bridge and road. Problem is that the textures streach on the road differently than on the bridge, so the two don't line up quite right. Plus the road appears in the Japanese settlements, and the Chinese wall color looks all wrong next too the Japanese buildings. I'm going to try a new texture.
Just a small error I noticed, units entering and exiting the gatehouses on the large wooden wall float. They walk up an invisible staircase. Also the Singijeon's in-battle description doesn't have it's picture, just the generic peasant.
edit: went back and looked at vanilla rtw and bi and the tiles for the roads and bridges don't blend well in the first place! I didn't remember that.
Wow. I visited this forum when it was still under hoggy, and I really enjoyed Blue Lotus despite its random CTDS and stuff. I'm so glad its revived now, with expansions on the Korean and Mongol factions. But the Filefront server doesn't seem to work, and I can't test out this brilliant work. Is there a way someone can upload these files to Rapidshare or something?
Thanks, and Great Job! :beam:
Once I'm finished with the beta stats, I'll re-upload a new base version. That should take care of the matter ^^.
kitagata
08-30-2008, 02:54
That nice new King Enma is just calling out for a voice. Here are some sounds for him, and fixes so the Kappa Elephants make elephant sounds.
http://files.filefront.com/Enma+KappaElezip/;11644535;/fileinfo.html
Hope it works.
!
Great. I am also happy to announce I found a way to decrease the fire rates of the heavy Ashigaru Crossbowmen and the Singijeon. I'll contact you later, Kitagata.
kitagata
09-04-2008, 22:25
Things are kinda slow on the board, so I thought I'd post a couple images of the bridge that I've been messing with.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_S1WR3n6aRyw/SMBR2-2_t2I/AAAAAAAAAnY/TEzZ30y-iI0/s1600/bridge1.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_S1WR3n6aRyw/SMBR25sMzZI/AAAAAAAAAng/hXwgx1aAHCU/s1600/bridge2.jpg
If I can, for myself I'm going to try to switch the settlement streets for the Chinese and Japanese factions. It seems more appropriate for finely paved streets to go to the Chinese and dirt or cobblestone streets to go to the Japanese.
Does anyone have any info on how to do this, or feelings on changing the streets?
I admit things must look quite slow at the moment, but the last week I've been very busy (an verage of 3h/d) with playtesting the new unit stats. It is actually quite difficult to come up with a good and somehow realistic formula. This is an (not further explained) template I'm using.
Level-up points per level: about 12 worth points, Militia only 8
1. type
dictionary
category
class
voice_type
soldier
officer
Morale Base 0
AT Base 2
DEF Base 2
Formation
-Archer 1, 2, 2, 4, 3
-Swordsman 1.3, 2, 2.6, 4, 4
-Spearman 1, 1, 2, 2, 4
-Cavalry 1.5, 4, 3, 8, 3
Speed
Weight
Kill counter
2. Armour:
Simple Helmet: +1
Heavy Helmet: +2
Simple Shins: +1
Heavy Shins: +2
Leather Koshi: +1
Metal koshi: +2
Nude 0
Light Cloth 1
Multi-Layer Cloth 2
Leather BP 2
Metal BP 3
HQ Armour +1
Iron Wall Ultra Heavy Full Fused Armour Set: 16
Shield:
None 0
Small Buckler 1
Large Buckler 2
Small Round Shield 3
Large Round Shield 4
Tower Shield 5
Pavise 6
Heat: Base 2+Armour:2, Armour Malus halved if mounted and horse unarmoured
Speed: See what the unit looks like.
3. Extra Weapons:
Kill Value = Range/100*Attack Power
AP average 3
Ammo Value = Ammo/28
Examples:
27 Armour 9 units dead with 9
7 dead with 1
12 dead with 4,6
16 dead with 4,8
15 dead with 5,6
so it's *very* roughly kill rate * 3
4. AT Boni (2,3,4...)
RAT Boni (4,5,...)
Range Boni (4)
Ammo Boni (?)
5. DEF Boni (2,3,4...)
6. Mental Boni
7. Abilities, Formations
8. 2-handed heavy weapon bonus AT*4/3 (down) DEF*3/4 (down)
AP bonus Axe,Mace,Poleaxe
DEF*3/4 Axe, Mace, Poleaxe
Charge Bonus Lance Cav: 1, DEF*2/3
(AT,DEF)*(1-(Armour+Shield)*2.5%) (down)
9. Charge Boni
1/2 all (up)
2/3 heavy 2-handed,cavalry (up)
1 Lance cavalry
10. Spear Boni
Spear 4
Naginata 2
Pike 6
11. Scrub: All except Elephant*2/3, Chariot*1/3 exact, negative down
Sand: Cariot*2/3
Wood: Cav*2/3, Chariot*1/3
Snow: Camel,Elephant*2/3, 25% (Nude), 50% (Light Cloth), 75% (Multi-layer Cloth)
12. Worth
13. Cost
Training: 12 P per level (AT,DF first increase costs 2, then 3,4,... per step counter reset)
Note this template is combined with a "worth" table that assigns a set value for every stat increase, ability and th like.
...so...
stay tuned. One thing I *drastically* changed was the effectiveness of archers. It is a all-too-well known tactic of human players to "outrange" the AI, which is not intelligent, but rather an exploit. Likewise, I considered it fairly unrealistic that a bunch of lowly Ashigaru Bowmen could decimate a contingent of from-head-to-toe-steel-plated Naginata Samurai by half before they could do anything about it. If armour was that ineffective, there would be no armour in the first place. Personal opinion here.
kitagata
09-07-2008, 20:23
There's a building boundary problem with Japanese settlements. At least with the "minor city" level, The "Large Residence" now blocks some of the roads, making movement impossible.
Just played the new base version today. Two words. Absolutely brilliant. However, I did note a problem that, while it did not hinder gameplay, still got on my nerves.
There seems to be a sprite problem with most units on the battle map; when I zoom out to command my armies, they all carry Akagi banners. The only units that don't seem to have this problem are the monks. Wierd.
Um, all the units on the campaign map seem to be dummies. Look like terra cotta warriors. Lol.
Also I felt that the Choson units were a bit bland compared to the other factions, and I was wondering if it was possible creating a sort of Phalanx unit with the Jangchang spears by giving them shields and the phalanx technique avaliable to the greek spearmen in Rome TW. Just a suggestion. Anyways, great job guys and thanks for the great mod! :2thumbsup:
Actually, the "Banners" they carry is the sprite of a chinese standard. Just a placeholder, as sprites will be implemented last. You know, there is always tiny tweaks and changes to be made until the very last minute, and generating sprites is an automatic process -> no need to waste time at this stage.
The stats of the Choson are not implemented yet, but I can say that much: they will have the very best ranged attack units (and a secret special Ship) of all nations. The dummies are, well... dummies. Campaign is next on the list.
kitagata
09-10-2008, 19:08
Hey, got some fun stuff today!
I put together sounds for the shambling undead in the Yomi army.
Here's the link to the sound and text files. Also included are fixes so the Krishnapur elephant units actually make sounds, AND fixes so only Son Goku and the Snow Monkies howl.
http://files.filefront.com/Undead+and+Elephantsrar/;11752432;/fileinfo.html
I think the zombie sounds add tremendously to the feel of playing the Yomi. Really liking it.
Hope you feel the same.
Kitagata,
there's no need to comment your work. It's excellent as usual. However, the thing that impresses me most is the way you present it. Every zip you send contains a very well-structurated and informative readme. This saves me hours of time. Thank you.
So. This had to be noted once.
As I was playing the game, I could help but notice how the Choson General had the same model as the Chinese General.
Because all the other factions have original Generals, maybe the Koreans deserve a unique model too?
Anyways, here are some images I that depict the role of a Korean general well, just in case anyone takes my suggestion to consideration.
http://cafefiles.naver.net/data16/2005/12/28/213/qjarmsaa_1.jpg
https://img187.imageshack.us/my.php?image=yisunshinjp7.jpg
Btw, BL rocks.
DaCrAzYmOfO
09-18-2008, 03:34
Great update on the mod!!! a lil more play testing and the stats will be just right me thinks :D
One question though, are the single unit regiments only available in small unit sizes? cause I can only get a single unit with small unit sizes ..... >.>
Alexander IV Aegus
09-18-2008, 16:34
Any chance of this being mod foldered? The screenies look great but i dont want it messing with vanilla files.
@MOFO
Yes, normal unit size only. Theoretically, there is a workaround for large unit sizes if you use it as a general's bodyguard, but this workaround lead to results worse than what we have now. Also, it would mean the Hero units could not be used in custom battles - and I guess that's not really what you guys want.
@Alexander
Nope. It will definitely crush all your beloved vanilla files.
kitagata
09-27-2008, 20:41
Hey Rinsui, noticed a couple of small things that are easy to change, and really help.
In Japanese settlements, there is a large Roman barracks. I don't know how to take it out, BUT...
in "Data\models_building\TEXTURES" there is "ROOFTILES_LARGE_GOLDISH.TGA" file.
Make a copy of "GREEK_ROOF_TILES.TGA" and rename it to "ROOFTILES_LARGE_GOLDISH.TGA".
Now the Roman barracks will use the Japanese roof tiles.
ALSO, you can get rid of the Roman statues in Japanese and Monk settlements.
Open descr_settlement_plan.txt and go down until you see things like this:
group colosseum_group
{
greek_elite_cavalry_stables, 0, 0, 0, 0
boxed_tree_A, -114, -52, 0, 0
boxed_tree_A, 116, -62, 0, 0
boxed_tree_A, -84, 88, 0, 0
boxed_tree_A, -114, 58, 0, 0
boxed_tree_B, -84, -84, 0, 0
boxed_tree_B, 69, -88, 0, 0
boxed_tree_B, 116, 56, 0, 0
boxed_tree_B, -114, 86, 0, 0
boxed_tree_C, -90, 76, 0, 0
boxed_tree_C, -120, -84, 0, 0
boxed_tree_C, 80, -84, 0, 0
boxed_tree_C, 120, 36, 0, 0
boxed_tree_E, -104, 72, 0, 0
boxed_tree_E, 76, 82, 0, 0
boxed_tree_E, 96, -78, 0, 0
boxed_tree_E, -74, -88, 0, 0
boxed_tree_F, -104, -74, 0, 0
boxed_tree_F, 106, 76, 0, 0
greek_colonnaded_portico, 115, -82, 0, 0
roman_statue, -120, -40, -67.5, 0
roman_statue, -120, 40, -112.5, 0
roman_statue, -60, 90, -164.25, 0
roman_statue, 60, 90, 164.25, 0
roman_statue, 120, 80, 126, 0
roman_statue, 120, -40, 85.5, 0
roman_statue, -60, -90, -11.25, 0
}
Now put a semi colon before "roman_statue" or replace it with something else (boxed_tree_F, etc...)
Now the Akagi and Zensen settlements look much better.
DaCrAzYmOfO
09-29-2008, 04:01
Any chance of this being mod foldered? The screenies look great but i dont want it messing with vanilla files.
just make a copy of the rome total war folder, rename the original blue lotus, install, then play.
Then if you wanna go back to vanilla just launch the game from the folder of the copy.
:egypt:
kitagata
09-30-2008, 19:24
Hey, I downloaded and tried the Three Kingdoms mod, and there are a lot of elements that could be borrowed. Their Chinese buildings would be great for improving the BL Chinese culture factions' cities. I don't have 3d editing software, otherwise I would add it.
Just the building texture skins alone are great, and I have used them to add variety to the buildings.
There are good music files as well.
Also, it seems the mod is no longer being officially worked on, so it's alright to borrow from it. Plus I noticed they took the Yomi banner image and Chinese shield texture and used it themselves.
...which means we are well able to do it the other way round, I guess. Could you give me a link to their download page?
kitagata
10-07-2008, 01:00
Here you go:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=66550
Thanks Kitagata, and thanks for the advice on the texture. It's right those tiny things that cost so much time to find out. About the descr_settlement_plan.txt however: In my file the roman_statue entries are already ;ed out, but those pesky statues appear in-battle nonetheless. I wonder why...?
kitagata
10-07-2008, 21:55
Did you check that the statues had ";" in all of both the Roman AND Greek tile layouts?
kitagata
10-11-2008, 07:06
I've been play testing the Japanese factions, and I think you did a really good job. Those Kamikaze are worth the high point cost!
The Crossbow units are incredibly slow though. Could someone maybe change their animation set so that the run faster?
Also, your mercenary units are really good, but the Hilltribe mercs are a little... basic.
I thought the Standard Bearer might be a good unique unit.
Here is an example, the CAS needs to be fixed so it doesn't have the 'ghost' lines from the standard.
http://files.filefront.com/NEW+BLTW+hilltriberar/;12032770;/fileinfo.html
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3045/2930247941_56142fde27_o.jpg
Just an idea.
Keep up the good work. Look forward to the next update!
Ah yes, Kita. I did make sure the ";" are there to no avail. I'll post an update tomorrow with the file in, so please be so kind to check what I did wrong (does it 100% work for you, btw?). As I said before only the Akagi and Zensen stats are finished for now, but I guess it's time to shed some light on the strange calculations (sometimes they look like abyssmal incantations to me) I used to arrive at what we have. Be prepared. Here it is.
*****************************************************************************************
*****************************************************************************************
General rules:
1. All further modifications are added or substracted form these basic stats:
- Attack skill 2
- Attack speed 25
- Kill chance 1
- Defense Skill 2
- Health 1
- Morale 0
- Heat 2
2. For "normal" units, apply the following soldier numbers and formation spacings based on you unit type:
- 60 Infantry Peasants and Militia 1, 1, 2, 2, 4
- 48 Archers 1, 2, 2, 4, 3 (this includes peasant and militia archery)
- 48 Swordsmen 1.3, 2, 2.6, 4, 4
- 48 Spearmen 1, 1, 2, 2, 3
- 33 Cavalry 1.5, 4, 3, 8, 3 (this includes missile cavalry)
- Special arbitrary rules apply to Chariots, Elephants, Heroes and Dragons
This will ensure all units have roughly the same width spacing to make some nasty exploits more difficult.
Note that exceptions exist for "special" units, which are sometimes smaller (e.g.: Bodyguard units,
Level 5 units, Heroes) or even larger in number (e.g.: the Karazai Nomads) than usual or have
special spacings for their special formations.
3. Next take a good look at the units model, and decide on the appropriateness of the following number:
- type
- category
- class
- voice_type
- officer
- Speed (controlled by the skeleton in descr_model_battle.txt used for a given model!)
- Weight
- their ability to hide (generally infantry units without glinting armour have hide_increased_forest, infantry units
with glinting armour and cavalry units without have hide_forest. Cavalry units with glinting armour normally
cannot hide.)
4. Next is the armour value. Each piece of equipment is asociated with a specific bonus.
Take a good look at the unit model and use common sense in unclear cases.
- Light Helmet (e.g. Turbans, Leather Caps etc.): +1
- Heavy Helmet (e.g. Full Cover Steel Helmets, Kabuto etc.): +2
- Special Neck Guard: +1
- Light Cloth (e.g.: full body single-layer or half-body padded cloth): +1
- Padded Cloth: +2
- Leather Breastplate: +2
- Metal Breastplate: +3
- Simple Shins (Arm-, Shoulder and Leg Guards): +1
- Heavy Shins: +2
- Leather Koshi (The piece of armour used to guard your hip and upper legs): +1
- Metal koshi: +2
- High Quality Equipment: +1
- Special Armour set used by the Iron Wall Unit: 16
- Heavy Horse Armour: +3
- Arbitrary special rules apply to Elephants, Dragons and Heroes
5. Next are the shield values. Use common sense again.
- Up to 25cm diameter shield or lefthand weapon: +1
- 25-40cm diameter shield: +2
- 40-60cm diameter shield: +3
- 60-85cm diameter shield: +4
- above 85cm diameter shield: +5
6. Next are heat stat modifications due to heavy armour.
- For infantry units and cavalry units with heavily armoured horses (e.g. the Khanate Heavy Cavalry)
simply half of the sum of armour and shield values to the base value. Round up.
- For cavalry units with unarmoured horses add one fourth of armour and shield values to the base value.
Round up.
- For camel units reduce the final value by 2
- Arbitrary special rules apply to Elephants, Dragons and Heroes
7. Next is the really fun but complicated part: Level-based bonus points. Each normal unit is available for campaign
map recruitment at a specific city size level. As a general rule it will get more Level-boni the later it is available.
The exact amount of level points available to a unit is calculated by multiplicating the unit's level (0-6) with
the culture specific amount of level bonus points available to a culture. Example: The Zensen units get 12
bonus points a level. This means a unit available for recruitment at "large city" level will get... exactly. 12*5=60
level bonus points (of course there are countless exceptions to this simple rule).
With these level points you are allowed to buy unit stat increases like higher morale or attack skill increases
etc. Each increase has its specific price, and some are even dynamic: whereas the first attack or defense value
increases at a given level cost only 2 points, each subsequent increase at a given level will cost one cumulative
point more.
Example: A LV 2 unit (recruitable at "large town" level) gets 12 points per level, totalling 24. With these 24
points I decide to first buy 3 attack vale increases. Since it is a LV 2 unit, this means I will have to pay at least
7 level bonus points for this. Why 7? Because I have to pay 2 points for the increase at LV 1, then 2 points
for the increase at LV 2, and then I have to pay 2+1 points for another increase at either LV 1 or LV 2. If I
wanted to increase attack skill by 5 points and defense skill by 2 points, I'd have to pay 2+2+3+3+4 points
for attack, and another 2+2 points for defense increases, totalling 18 points. May sound complicated, but will
ensure right the degree of "restricted variation" good balancing needs.
The complete price listing for stat increases or abilities is as follows.
The stats not listed (e.g. charge boni) are not (normally) changeable.
Available melee status increase price listing:
- Attack skill: 2 (special: level-bound cumulative increase as stated above)
- Defense skill: 2 (special: level-bound cumulative increase as stated above)
- Morale: 1
Available skill price listing:
- Command: 6
- Mental stat Impetuous: 1
- Mental stat normal: 2
- Mental stat Disciplined: 4
- frighten_foot: 5
- frighten_mounted: 3
- Wedge Formation: 3
- Circle-and-shoot Formation: 3
- Testudo (Turtle) Formation: 3
- warcry: 4
- druid: 3
- screeching_women: 3
- hardy: 3
- very_hardy: 6
- Fiery Ammo: 3
Note on archery status changes:
- Units with normal bow/crossbow attacks should get archery level boni beginning at Level 2 as befitting
for their faction, but have their melee boni decreased by two levels on the average.
- Units with throwing spears get archery level boni as befitting for their faction, but are limited to 4 volleys
and have their melee boni decreased by one level on the average
- Range and Range attack skill may be increased at will as long as the total value of the formula
(Range in Meters/100)*Range attack skill*4
stays below the alotted archery level bonus total
- The Range attack skill value in the formula has to be increased by 3 if the attack is armour piercing
- The whole formula has to be divided by 1.4 if the complicated crossbow animation is used (as it is much slower)
- The whole formula has to be divided by 1.4 for normal accuracy, by 1.4 for low accuracy and by 1.4 for horrible
accuracy. Accuracy levels are tied to different projectiles whose stats can be found in the file
descr_projectiles_new.txt.
8. Innate and special skills
Some exceptionally powerful skills should be limited to very special units in their use. These include:
- Mental stat berserker
- Double Health
- The phalanx (Iron Wall) formation
- The ability to sap (which is given freely to LV 0 peasant infantry)
- The ability to hide in long grass
- The ability to hide everywhere
- The bad habit to run amok
- Increases or decreases to the attack speed
In the rare cases those skills are used make sure to reasonably compensate for their power (e.g. by halving
unit size etc.)
9. Next is special weapon attributes, and final attack skill and defense skill modifications
- Heavy two-handed weapons have their attack skill value multiplied by 4/3 (round up), and their defense skill
value multiplied by 3/4 (round down)
- Axes, Maces and Poleaxes get an armour piercing attribute, but have their defense skill value multiplied
by 3/4 (round down yet again)
- infantry units with spears get the
- Cavalry units equipped with lances now immediately get a charge bonus equal to their current attack skill value
but multiply their defense skill rating by 2/3 if they do not also have a second weapon (round down yet again).
- All units then multiply their attack and defense skill ratings by (1-(Armour+Shield value)*2.5%) (round down).
10. Charge boni
All units then get charge boni based on their current attack skill values. The size of this bonus is:
- 1/2 the size of the attack skill value (round up) for normal infantry units
- 2/3 the size of the attack skill value (round up) for infantry units with heavy 2-handed weapons and
cavalry units without lances
- Special rules apply to cavalry units with lances (see 9. above). Be aware that for them the ordering of
calculations if different. This is important.
11. Terrain boni
Each terrain effects different types of units in a differeny way. To reflect this, terrain boni (technically most
are mali btw., as they give negative modifiers) are calculated in the following way.
First calculate the sum of attack skill, armour value, defense skill and shield value. Multiply this sum
by the terrain and unit type specific multiplier as given below and round up. What you get is the terrain bonus
that unit has for this type of terrain.
Unit type specific multipliers are:
Scrub: Elephants: 0, Chariots: 1/3, All others : 1/6
Sand: Chariots: 1/6, All others: 0
Wood: Cavalry: 1/6, Chariots: 1/3
Snow: Camels and Elephants: 1/6, 1/2 for nude units, 1/4 for light cloth units
1/8 for Multi-layer Cloth units, 0 for all other units
Example: An Infantry unit has attack skill 5, armour 3, defense skill 4 and no shield. It's terrain bonus
in scrub would be (5+3+4)*1/6 = 2.
12. Worth
Each parameter has a certain worth value. The total worth of a single soldier is calculated by adding up
all the worth parameters of the stats and abilities he has. The worth of the whole unit is calculated by
multiplying this value with the number of men in one unit. The worth of each stat and ability is:
Attack skill: 2
Charge Bonus: 1
Armour Piercing Melee Weapon: 6
Armour: 4
Defense skill: 2
Shield value: 3
Morale: 1
Movement speed slow: -6
Movement speed semi-fast: 6
Movement speed fast: 12
Ranged attack (Range in Meters/100)*Range attack skill: 4
- armour piercing increases the Ranged attack skill value by 3
- long reload time for crossbows divides the whole formula by 1.4
- the whole formula is divided by 1.4 for normal accuracy, by 1.4 for low accuracy
and by 1.4 for horrible accuracy
- the whole formula is halved for spearthrowers due to the low ammo
Impetuous: 1
Normal: 2
Disciplined: 4
Berserker: doubles worth
Heat: -1
hide_forest: 3
hide_improved_forest: 6
hide_long_grass: 9
hide_anywhere: 12
can_sap: 6
frighten_foot: 5
frighten_mounted: 3
can_run_amok: -12
cantabrian_circle: 3
command: 6
warcry: 4
druid: 3
screeching_women: 3
hardy: 3
very_hardy: 6
Fiery Ammo: 3
Testuo formation: 3
Wedge formation: 3
Phalanx formation: unit worth multiplied by 1.5
Attack Delay 0: worth multiplied by 1.5
Health: worth multiplied by the appropriate value
Number of soldiers: worth multiplied by the appropriate value
Sum of all terrain boni: 1/4
13. Cost
- Recruitment cost: Simply divide the worth by 100, round up, and square that value.
- Support cost: Recruitment cost*1/3
- Build time: 1 turn for LV 0,1, and 2 units, 2 turns for LV 3 and 4 units, 3 turns for LV 5 units
14. Unit type-specific special rules:
- Militia Units have their support cost halved (to 1/6 of their recruitment price), but get only 2/3 of the Level 1
boni to melee or archery stats, although they are (technically) Level 3 units.
- LV 0 units cost only half their normal price to recruit, but their support cost is a fixed 300/60 per infantry
man and a fixed 450/60 per cavalry man.
Faction Specials:
;Akagi units:
;+Infantry in step 1 and 3 get at 12 level-point extra bonus
;+Level boni are 12 for all unit types and levels, archery and melee
;Akagi campmap:
;+relatively rich, large and cultured, diplomacy specialists
;+relatively secure starting position
;-weak militay force in the beginning
;-All Samurai units are one step slower to recruit
;Zensen units:
;+Infantry in step 1 and 3 get at 12 level-point extra bonus
;+Level boni are 12 for all unit types and levels, archery and melee
;Zensen campmap:
;-relatively poor in the beginning
;+secure starting position
;+large standing army in the beginning
;-All Samurai units are one step slower to recruit
;Karazai:
;units:
;+Terrain mali lowered by 1/3 (and even boni available, round up)
;+Even riders with glinting armour can hide
;+All horses one step faster
;+Level boni are 14 for both archery and melee throughout for cavalry units
;-Level boni are 12 for archery and 10 for melee for all infantry units and levels
;campmap
;+Vassal-type units are one step faster to recruit
;-no heavy walls
;-no militia units
;-limited agricultural options
;-short tech tree
;+units cost only 2/3 their normal price to recruit and maintain
;-no siege equipment
*****************************************************************************************
*****************************************************************************************
Scared?
Of course there are some things I simply have to do *by intuition*. Which is subjective. I try to have "objective intuitions" though, if you get what I mean, hahahaha! I do not have the time to incorporate the new buildings (in theory I know how to do it; actually all the palace complexes for Jap/Chin factions bear the arranged by Rinsui tag). I both agree the Hilltribe guys are generic and those women are beautiful to watch, but these women are such a special sight I'd like to reserve them for the standard task (which is an unintended pun). Plus I hate making new unit cards. But as time goes by I might change my mind.
For now, I fear it's back to the stat implementation board. Do you agree with the faction specifics for Akagi, Zensen and the Karazai, btw?
kitagata
10-14-2008, 19:11
Very complicated system, but the results seem good so far. The Kharazai will really need that recruit/upkeep discount if they can't build stone walls and have a simpler building tree, and are located in the middle of the map. They will be challenging.
Here is a link to a mod team that is essentially doing Blue Lotus, but with Mediterrainian mythology. Looks pretty good. (And maybe they would be willing to lend their model of a gorgon to BL. Maybe make it a tengu...)
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=767
Can you fix the link to filefront?
I cant seem to download from the Rapidshare links, and filefront used to work for the file.
So I cant play the wonderful mod now.
A new version will be back up tomorrow (02.11.) evening, GMT. Promised.
Thank you so very much good sir, I am excited.
Of course Fallout 3 has been on my agenda lately, lol.
kitagata
11-05-2008, 22:37
Stuff's been quiet lately, so I thought I'd upload some pictures.
I've been re-skinning and doing a little remodeling on some units, just to my own taste.
In particular, I think the Choson and Kharazai lack diversity in their units. (Due to them being a minor faction in the old edition.)
So here are a few Choson units I've changed to try to remove the Yuwan/Zhuanshi elements left from making these new units.
Feedback would be appreciated, and if anyone wants them, just ask.
Okubo Militia
https://img511.imageshack.us/img511/7671/okubo2dp0.th.jpg (https://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=okubo2dp0.jpg)https://img511.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
Yedo Swordsmen
https://img511.imageshack.us/img511/8519/yedo2bn5.th.jpg (https://img511.imageshack.us/my.php?image=yedo2bn5.jpg)https://img511.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
Borderland Scouts
https://img145.imageshack.us/img145/4628/borderland2yj4.th.jpg (https://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=borderland2yj4.jpg)https://img145.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
The new update didnt work so well...lawl.
@Masonop: why?
@ Kitagata: I/we want them. Please give me a download link, your changes are appreciated.
I got these huge icons over every province, and the bar for the map/stats/info/ and everything else dissapeared off the screen so I could only see a blip of it.
I think though, I will re-download it and try again sometime.
kitagata
11-13-2008, 21:40
Rinsui: Here are the Choson models I've been messing with. I think they give the Choson their own feel, and make them a little more interesting. Not sure about the Sunogung, it may need some work.
http://files.filefront.com/Modded+Chosonzip/;12342607;/fileinfo.html
I'm working on a unique Choson general, since I figured out how to make the Choson/Spain faction use the Carthaginian general, not the Celtic one.
https://img89.imageshack.us/img89/6517/chosongenqk5.th.jpg (https://img89.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosongenqk5.jpg)https://img89.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
This is an image of the issue I have, and this is in game.
https://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=whathaxr2.png
I get big ole green icons and I cant even see what I am doing because the entire bar at the bottom is gone.
I wonder why it is like this.
0-0
@Masonop
Whoa. I have no clue what you did to achieve that. Though I must admit I like the refreshing green.
No, serious: I am sorry Masonop, but this is the first time I see such a screenshot. And I just tested my own freshly reinstalled version which works perfectly well. I'll upload a new base version this sunday, so I propose you completely (completely means: manually delete all remaining RTW folders after you uninstalled) uninstall that junk and reinstall the new version.
I'll do that and see how it goes.
Thankies good sir.
^_^
Well I got it to work, finally found out what was wrong.
But now all the units for everyone in the game are "sexy dummies"?
Is that a joke? Lol.
kitagata
11-20-2008, 02:49
Hey Rinsui, scaled down the campaign map watchtowers. Before they were too big, so I made them around the same height/width as the vanilla RTW towers.
http://files.filefront.com/watchtowerszip/;12404363;/fileinfo.html
Also I've been messing a little more with the units. Let me know if you want any of these as well.
I made a slightly distinct Choson banner, by changing the kamidana's roof and banners and adding bells.
https://img155.imageshack.us/img155/8261/chosonstan2uv8.th.jpg (https://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosonstan2uv8.jpg)
Gaur Hunters, done as more wild, fur-wearing animal hunters.
https://img388.imageshack.us/img388/538/gaur2fh5.th.jpg (https://img388.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gaur2fh5.jpg)
Karazai Officer with better armor and less fat.
https://img388.imageshack.us/img388/5216/karazaiofficer2qz6.th.jpg (https://img388.imageshack.us/my.php?image=karazaiofficer2qz6.jpg)
I made the Iron Wall look a little more striking with some gold trim.
https://img155.imageshack.us/img155/1566/iron2df9.th.jpg (https://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iron2df9.jpg)
Terracotta spearmen with glowing eyes and older style Chinese pikes.
https://img388.imageshack.us/img388/2766/terracotta2qm8.th.jpg (https://img388.imageshack.us/my.php?image=terracotta2qm8.jpg)
Militia looking less colorful and more... militia-like.
https://img155.imageshack.us/img155/5372/militia2ws7.th.jpg (https://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=militia2ws7.jpg)
@kitagata
I'm in for the Gaur hunters, the Terracotta guys and... hell, zip + post them all.
BTW, a new yuwan officer for you.
https://img210.imageshack.us/img210/6883/rometw2008112302415540qp5.th.jpg (https://img210.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rometw2008112302415540qp5.jpg)https://img210.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)
kitagata
02-20-2009, 02:03
The crew working on Ran no Jidai are doing a great job. Any chance someone could talk with them and see if they'd be willing to share their walls? I know they were allowed the BL buildings.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=43172&page=19
https://img520.imageshack.us/img520/4224/walls2mr7zj5.jpg (https://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=walls2mr7zj5.jpg)
https://img520.imageshack.us/img520/walls2mr7zj5.jpg/1/w1600.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img520/walls2mr7zj5.jpg/1/)
Good idea.
Mod Leader = Kagemusha
Builder of the RNJ walls = Prometheus(who used to be its mod leader but stepped down a few years ago)
Good Luck ;)
kitagata
03-02-2009, 22:39
Your latest updates are great, Rinsui. The changes in animation speed really improve some of the units. One problem though, is that the Singijeon's firing sounds now have a huge delay.
Just a few things I noticed in the latest beta:
Mugongchui Rebels, Shinzoku Bodyguard, Arjuna Chariot, and Working Elephant lack a picture when you look at their "statistics and info" window;
the Choson have two Shaolin Monk units, one of which uses the Monk Faction officer;
Kali has no description;
the Hwarang have an incredibly long range; (This may be intentional, I'm not sure)
a few units in the Krishnapur use the zombie sounds;
the Monk Novices use monkey sounds;
several of the new archer/gunpowder units have sound problems again.
I'll try looking into some of these, as they are all minor stuff compared to what you're working on.
Also, does anyone know which txt file determines the walls for different cultures and different city levels? I'd like to mess with the Chinese culture factions' walls.
Lastly, I sent a request to Ran no Jidai for the right to use their walls and they agreed. I'm just waiting to find out how they'd like to transfer them. (I suppose I should have asked whether they'd let us use them now or AFTER they've released their own beta.)
As always, your keen eye is much of a help. The issues with the unit pictures you mentioned will be corrected in the next patch this sunday. Also, I changed the reload animations for thunderbombers and Ashigaru Crossbowmen yet again. They should work properly now. The choson second Shaolin is a miss, of course. It belongs to the Monks. Kali's description must be missing due to a typo. The Hwarang range is intended to be about 170-200m, which is intentional. They are the top archery unit in the game, and the top class Choson unit. The sound problems you mentioned I also realized, but lo: The master of sounds of this mod is Kitagata, not me. Talk to him ^.^/
The walls for different cultures are in... what do you mean? The wall models (.ITEM files), or the .txt defining wall ownership, or the .txt definig a walls stats?
kitagata
03-03-2009, 20:17
Sorry, I was looking for the txt file that defines wall ownership. I want to try replacing the chinese wooden palisade.
:help:Yesterday I was download the "Base Version as of 2009/02/27"
Why there all armies consist of only one type of unit - BLTW_dummies ?
kitagata
03-05-2009, 11:34
Bonten, please check this link:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=109764
Thanks, Kita. Btw, Dromikaites will rectify this situation until next week sunday (or so) - perhaps he's already contacted you. He'll implement the tentative building roster in the edb to get a running beta campaign map (which of course will need a lot of polishing later).
Btw, the file you were looking for (defining wall ownership) is most likely:
For campaign map models:
- data/descr_cultures.txt
- data/descr_sm_settlements.txt
and for the buildings and stats used in battle:
- data/descr_building_battle/dbb_walls_greek.txt (for example) for the stats. In this file, please ready my annotations. They are about 2 years old, but still describe what I originally did to the walls. Be very careful when you edit things here.
- these files (dbb_walls_greek.txt for example) are referenced to towards the end in data/descr_building_battle.txt, and (perhaps) data/descr_items.txt, btw.
- data/descr_walls.txt
...I hope I didn't miss anything.
kitagata
03-10-2009, 20:28
Hmm, does changing buildings require re-PAK-ing?
I tried replacing the wooden_short_gateway.item and wooden_tall_gateway.item in data/ITEMS but nothing changed.
So I checked descr_walls txt and these are the two walls used for the palisade and wooden wall (non-scaleable).
What did you do to give the Yomi their newer stone walls, Rinsui?
Aaaah, yes! There was some re-packing-stuff with the ITEMs I did a loong time ago, definitely. Uiuiui. I'll try to dig it up again, but this will take some days. This, I did quite some tie ago, so I forgot. Sorry.
kitagata
03-20-2009, 22:14
Not a problem.
I was thinking we could use the short wooden walls and tall wooden walls from the Sanguo mod for the Chinese based cultures.
From what I read on TWCenter, the mod is pretty much dead, plus they used the yomi banner and a shield texture from BL.
Then we can use the Japanese wooden walls from Ran no Jidai for the Japanese factions, since those guys were nice enough to say we could use them.
...sorry, my memory has grown dim on this issue. But as far as I remember, wall ownership and models used was
defined in one of these files, as noted above:
For campaign map models:
- data/descr_cultures.txt
- data/descr_sm_settlements.txt
and for the buildings and stats used in battle:
- data/descr_building_battle/dbb_walls_greek.txt (for example) for the stats. In this file, please ready my annotations. They are about 2 years old, but still describe what I originally did to the walls. Be very careful when you edit things here.
- these files (dbb_walls_greek.txt for example) are referenced to towards the end in data/descr_building_battle.txt, and (perhaps) data/descr_items.txt, btw.
- data/descr_walls.txt
And I also remember that some factions use other walls than you would expect them to in vanilla rome; foe example, the greek factions originally use the roman walls on city leven 4 and 5 (or so). Now the greek_huge_city_wall_gate.item file or something in fact does exist, but it is "broken" in a sense that it does not fully function. So what I did was to define new wall ownerships where appropriate. now the funny thing is, this was about the only step I didn't do and document in a way other people could easily understand afterwards. For example, I gave ownership of some of the greek walls to the egyptians and vice versa, to be able to come up with new textures for each faction... it is stupidly confusing now even for me, but I remember this was the most effective way of doing things back then. Forgive.
To give the Yomi their new walls I used... damn, what did I do... I think I used the chinese walls and gave them a new texture in both 3DS Max and... where was it... yes! In descr_building_battle.txt. Due to a bug with the export function for ITEM files in 3DS Max I actually had to give the egyptian (Yomi) faction the new texture several times with different names... take a look at my documentations in that .txt file and you should be able to guess what I did in this case.
I am sorry. You discovered my weak spot; wall stuff was the thing I did *not* take the time to do in an orderly fashion...
kitagata
04-30-2009, 23:03
Hey, things have been pretty quiet on the board lately. I haven't been doing much myself as I was waiting for the latest beta's release.
Sorry to the folk who aren't able to get the BL mod currently. Dunno if Rinsui is taking a break or what.
I'd upload my own copy, but it has personal modifications on it that might be buggy.
If anyone is a pro on integrating walls, I'd really like your help. Having some problems getting faction-specific wooden walls to work.
The Holy Pilgrim
05-04-2009, 20:56
I'd be happy to put a link with a clean verion of it if anybody wants it.
The Holy Pilgrim
05-04-2009, 20:59
Sorry for the double post but check the "New Link?" thread and click on the link in the second post by me. It will take you to the download. Hehe, I guess it's good that I save all of my downloads for future use.
Rinsui!
Love the work so far, been looking at the threads. I was wondering, have the stats been completed yet to make the campaign playable? im really lookin forward to using the Chosun to conquer asia!:2thumbsup:
as we say in Oz, goodonyamate!
Yes, sorry, Kita is right as always. I have been lazy during those last weeks (month?), but I never stopped modding on. If I don't post a new version this sunday, I'll officially step down as this mod's leader.
P.S.: I have no intention to let that happen ;).
The Holy Pilgrim
05-27-2009, 20:42
Can't wait for the new version Rinsui!
Old Nick
05-31-2009, 15:06
Thanks alot for the new version !
You're welcome. This last time took ages, I have to admit. I had really very heavy problems with balancing the units, and that was wa slowed me down to 10% of my nomal speed. The new version includes an excel document called "BLTW_unitstats.xls" which may give you an impression of the formula I used for calculating a unit's recruitment, upkeep and upgrade costs. More interesting may be the lines "Melee total" and "Archery total" which should give you a pretty good impression of how strong the unit really is in melee and ranged combat. The attack and defense values you normally see in-game actually tell you *hit about that, for a projectile might have an attack value of 53, but an accuracy factor of .5, which means it will never hit (=in total: very bad). Another one might have an attack value of mere 8 but pinpoint accuracy and a blast radius of 4, which means it is an absolute killer.
For now, all human factions should be perfect, and if you pitch a unit wit a Melee Total (in the Excel file) of 40 agains a unit with a melee total of 50, the latter should win pretty consistently. And that's where you guys come in. Please try a few custom battles, and tell me whether the units "feel" like what you think they should.
@Kitagata: It's been a long time, and I fixed all the problems you mentioned in your last major post (unit pictures and descriptions). However, I have never done sounds as of yet (or at least I can't remember), so I am not able to fix the Singijeon sounds and the zombie stuff. If you could look into this matter... well, I don't really have to offer anything in return. Just the new version which is already around the corner ^.-
P.S.: Check out hiding with the "Kaonashi" unit.
When will we get delicious campaign D=!?
Once Rinsui loses his job, is expelled from his university and decides to divorce his wife, leaving behind his 2 children.
No, seriously. Sometime this Summer a rough beta should be ready.
The Holy Pilgrim
06-01-2009, 18:09
I know this might upset the gameplay quite a bit but I though all Samurai would rather die than run from the enemies. Wouldn't they have locked_morale in-game?
Sorry, pilgrim. Gameplay > Cliche. Btw, if you look through export_descr_units.txt or the BLTW_unitstats.xls, you will notice samurai units already have above-average Morale. Still, they are human and intelligent enough to understand when it's better to turn and run to fight another time. Just a hint: Zombie units are an altogether different story...
kitagata
06-01-2009, 21:14
That's great about the newest release. I'd happily work on the sounds, but I haven't had steady internet in about a month! The joy of changing jobs and moving...
I should be able to work on it in a few weeks.
Additionally, some time back I got the OK from Ran no Jidai to use their bridges/walls. Plus, since the mod seems to be dead and Wundai is going to release the current work, I think we should try to integrate their bridges and walls.
The problem is, while it seems pretty straitforward, I can't get the game to recognize faction specific wooden walls! I know it can be done, but I don't know what the game is bypassing and using PAKed info from.
I think I know all the txt s and files to change, but still nothing changes in the game.
If anyone out there knows about this stuff, please share your wisdom. I'd love to also get the now defunct Sanguo TW's Chinese walls into the game as well.
The Holy Pilgrim
06-02-2009, 00:51
Sorry, pilgrim. Gameplay > Cliche. Btw, if you look through export_descr_units.txt or the BLTW_unitstats.xls, you will notice samurai units already have above-average Morale. Still, they are human and intelligent enough to understand when it's better to turn and run to fight another time. Just a hint: Zombie units are an altogether different story...
I completely agree, I just saying that seeing samurai run from "lesser foes" is kind of strange.:yes:
Once Rinsui loses his job, is expelled from his university and decides to divorce his wife, leaving behind his 2 children.
No, seriously. Sometime this Summer a rough beta should be ready.
Hey thats not too far off, looking forward to it!
Beren Erchamion
06-02-2009, 20:51
Thank you very much for your hard work, Rinsui. This is a great mod.
Hey thats not too far off, looking forward to it!
...and the winning award in the category "unintended humor" goes to... TigerVX for the most funny and ambiguous encouragement ever :sweatdrop:
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