View Full Version : MTW-Redux Beta Released!
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/universal/RXB1007_Header_01.jpg (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=190721)
This is a BETA-version of new Redux (Medieval Total War-Redux 3rd Edition) as such not everything is carved in stone yet, however most things seem to be settled at this point. Anyhow, it requires the original MTW game in order to run - as in the V 1.1 version or with the compatibility-module it can also run on VI/V 2.01 versions - the game and experience is the same. To install Redux you first set up a clean install of MTW somewhere and then properly patch it up to either V1.1 or VI/V2.01 ? once that is done you THEN copy/paste over Redux on top of MTW, standard package first and VI-module last? If done this way, Redux should work just fine.
The primary campaign in this version of Redux is "RX-classic", a scenario which offers a campaign spanning from 700-1260 AD, in total 560 turns. 11 out of 18 factions are playable in it along with unruly rebels and pirates as well. The overall goal is total supremacy over Europe, North Africa and the Middle East, either by achieving 60% or a 100% domination of all provinces. The means for achieving this goal are troops, ships and agents, and yet more of the same. Development and a functional economy are key-factors for survival on the road to glory - without it you will surely perish. Anyhow, please report in bugs, typos and anomalies if you encounter any.
Mod Name: Medieval Total War - Redux
Mod Version: Open Beta 1007
Language: English (Multi edition compatibility, European editions)
Terms of Use: Restricted material. Personal Use Only...
Size: Zipped 273MB/Uncompressed 395MB
Compatibility: All major versions. Medieval Total War v1.1 or VI/v2.01 using the VI-upgrade module, see below...
Operating System: 2000/XP/W7*/W10*/W11* (* with Steam)
Hardware: see "Redux_ReadMe1007.txt"-file, virtually everything else is try and find out, essentially.
Description: see above...
Credits: see "Redux_ReadMe1007.txt"-file, credits section?
Download Links:
Download primary:
Offline
Download reserve:
http://www.moddb.com/games/medieval-total-war/downloads/mtw-redux-beta1007zip
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https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/RXVI_banner_blue_small.jpg
This is the VI-upgrade BETA module, as such it makes Redux compatible with the Steam/Gold/VI/V2.01 versions of MTW. At this point it does not bring any ?extra features? to the game-experience which is thus nearly identical to the standard version of Redux. This is still a beta so it is possible it may contain some minor errors here and there. Anyhow, please report in any bugs, typos and other errors if you encounter any. All MTW-Steam users must also use this upgrade (no exceptions). Finally, the VI-upgrade is as of now included in the standard Redux package directly (as a separate folder named "Redux - VI-UPGRADE"). It is no longer available as a separate download.
Module Name: Redux VI-upgrade
Module Version: Open Beta 1007
Language: English (Multi edition compatibility, European editions)
Terms of Use: P.U.O, Personal Use Only, thus it is restricted material.
Size: Zipped 0 MB/Uncompressed 0 MB
Install: VI-upgrade must be installed after the standard package.
Operating System: 2000/XP/W7*/W10*/W11* (* with Steam)
Compatibility: Medieval Total War V2.01 only. (Steam-, patched Eras- and Gold-editions included).
Credits: see "Redux_ReadMe1007.txt"-file, credits section.
Download Links:
Download primary:
The VI-upgrade is included as a separate folder in the RXB1007-package...
Download reserve:
The VI-upgrade is included as a separate folder in the RXB1007-package...
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Some demo-screens of new Redux...
Demo01
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/universal/RX_Outnow01.jpg
Demo02
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_Demo00.jpg
Demo03
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_Demo01.jpg
Demo04
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_Demo02.jpg
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Apart from this regular TWC Redux-thread there is an entire sub-forum over at this place (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=263) dedicated for Redux and discussions about it. Any interest, discussion and questions can be posted right here or in that external sub-forum (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=263) ? at your discretion. The direction of topics is limited to the framework of Redux but beyond that it is up to you guys where the focus ends up. The intensity and traffic-levels here is also up to you people ? not me (the more posts and traffic, the more probable it is that I will be around here regularly). After all, this thread is for you guys! Well that's about it.
- A
Well, it seems like I don’t have the proper privileges in order to do what I initially intended here. The plan was to put up some screenshots right here of redux for you all to see so you could get clearer hint on what it is. But that won’t happen, since I clearly don’t have privileges to do that. Well there is always plan B. It might not be as much fun as plan A, but it works at least and you can get some hints about redux anyway.
Now some more info on Redux 1.0 then; I did these screenshot-montages for my upload over at “filefront” but I think they will work around here just as well. I guess that the best way to do this is to open links in new and separate windows.
EDIT: Well, I have the privileges to do it now so I fixed it....
PIC1:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_2ndEd_montage01.jpg
First off, pic1 shows which factions there are in redux, which factions you can play and how the starting positions looks like (by default at least). As redux offers a somewhat more colourful experience than the original map, you can basically see via the colours if region is arid/lush/temperate and so on. Sahara is put back in the game and few land bridges have been removed, all clearly indicated on the map and the campaign timeframe is AD 700-1260, 560 turns in total, so you could play it slow, real slow if that’s your style.
PIC2:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_2ndEd_montage02.jpg
Pic2 shows some reduxed stuff in the strategic mode in SPC (single player campaign). Princesses, Bishops and Emissaries have all the colours of their faction. What the picture don’t show are that spies and inquisitors have been changed as well. The Grand Inquisitor, Priest, Alim and Cardinal has been removed and I have put in the Druid for the pagan factions (Norse and Lithuanians). That’s the white-bearded brownish old-timer that is doing some “druid_awaiting.Buf”-stuff.
There are several other changes here; plenty of new buildings (quite a few actually and I wont list them here, maybe some other time) and of course all catholic portraits has been changed. I never really liked the CA style on the portraits so changed ‘em all, it sure took its time but I did it eventually. There are also some changes in castleflags and shields (HRE, Russia etc.), on the pic some such stuff is shown for the Lombards.
PIC3:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_2ndEd_montage03.jpg
Pic3 shows some examples of reduxed tactical mode. Various troops from the HRE and Portugal battle things out. I wanted a more colourful experience in tactical mode than the original game offered, so among other things, I changed some shields and in this case we have examples of Portugal and HRE. However, the game does not seem to like that, so my original plan of making some further changes for almost all other factions was abandoned. I only did what I had to, for new or altered factions; Lombards, Portugal, HRE etc. I have also given the Royal “reduxed” Knights some colour in tactical, which really makes them easy to spot and stand apart from other knights (you have such an example in the left corner).
PIC4:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_2ndEd_montage04.jpg
Pic4 shows various examples of units in the game. There are some 200+ tactical units in redux and not all are available to the player, at least by conventional means (just like Viking Invasion actually). There are a few units here and there that truly are unique and that are only available by playing some special faction. To name a few here; “Spanish champion” (Spain), feudal longbowmen (England) or Byzantine palaceguards (Byzantium). Redux also introduces some high quality mini and solo units like “Ghazi Warlords”/”Feudal Champions”/”Norse Berserkers” or “Nubian Slayer”/”Champion”/”Polish Hero” and of course the grand daddy of them all; Grand Champion. Given the right support units like these can really make a difference in battle, especially if they got plenty of valour to spare. Anyways, I always felt that the original had too little variation regarding tactical units, and that was especially true for spearless infantry. Redux changes all of that and you get the chance to make some serious choices instead.
By the way, if there are some questions, if any, this thread would probably be a great place to post ‘em to.
Well that’s that, and that’s it.
- Cheers
Wow! I looked at those pics and it took my breath away.
I noticed it's only available to MTW without VI, since I've got gold edition, there's not a way to install it on my PC. :confused:
But still, those pics are quite something, I look forward to more works by you. :thumbsup:
Hi Axalon
After all that work you might like to know that it works! I dug out my old disks, installed and I am really impressed. Feels like MTW but also very fresh. I'm still digging of course at this point, but having a very interesting time as the Byz. It's not trying to be historically accurate, as you say, but at the same time in a certain way - ie how you run your faction - it is. The armies of different cultures feel very different; there's a big difference between unit types; no ahistorical tendency towards spear phalanxes that sweep the field in the age of heavy cavalry; always plenty to build. I like it!:yes:
Very cool, Axalon. :2thumbsup: If you've not already done so, I recommend you PM TosaInu to see if he'll host this here (like he did for Tyberius XL Mod add-on).
Hi there guys, glad to hear you like it.
Raz: This stuff about gold-edition not being compatible with v1.1 was news to me. I did not know that. I lost track of such things after I got my own MTW-VI copy, back in the day when no gold-editions or Era-packs and such where around. This really is some bad news, so much for making redux usable to all happy owners of MTW, including all of you gold-edition people.
-----
EDIT: That statement was done at a time when redux was uncompatible with VI. These days it is indeed compatible, so there are no such problems any more....
Western: your news is good news and much appreciated. You can probably toy around with redux for quite some time if you like. I know I have. Just curious, are you one of those people that have a newer GFX-card that wont work with MTW? If so, what kind of card is it?
Martok: I kind of get the impression that you like camels; there actually are two or so camel buildings in redux, that is, if you have not found that out already for yourself. Anyways, PM TosaInu? Yeah, I might just do that, if no one else beats me to it. It would be my pleasure to have redux hosted around here.
- Cheers
Hi mate
It looks brilliant, good work mate.
I cant play MTW at the moment becose the 8000 driver problem, i am waithing for a update so the people with 8000 Ge force grafic card cane play MTW again:2thumbsup:
But if the update commes i will play this mod :yes::yes:
Axalon
In answer to your question, I'm playing on an old computer. I've never had video card problems because mine is still MTW vintage.
Tony Furze
08-10-2008, 05:28
"I'm playing on an old computer."
Me, too. I was very interested to see this, Axalon. So I still have the MTW 1.0, plus the patch, I bought and I decided to give it a go.
I've done a test run as the Moors. The feel , with the fewer factions, is something like Shogun. So far all the additions/changes i like. However, after overrunning the rebels in Sahara, I tried to "Enslave " them and the game froze. I had to get out with Ctrl + Alt + Delete.
Second attempt : the Moors again. I fulfilled the first turn, building things and recruiting. When I press End Turn the music goes on a kind of loop, and the game freezes. This time I can't get out with Ctrl + Alt + Del. I have to switch off the computer.
Maybe it doesn't like my graphics card. MTW plain Vanilla plays well...best game to play , in fact.
I'll try a re install when I get time.
Tyberius
08-11-2008, 01:44
Amazing work, looks great!, gives great freshness and another concept to MTW. I've always thaught, that we should all unite to make a great mod, each one of us doing what we do best. Why to have dozens of mods based on the same period of history?.
By the way, I really loved your Info pics, and your review icons are great, May I use some of them for my own purposes?
Cheers.
Tony, I am on it. I will get back here with my findings soon.
Tyberius, hold on.
- out
Hi again guys,
Tony: I have no short answer for this “Moorish bug”, so I give you the solution for it first and then I have some further remarks afterwards. This solution aint pretty, but it works 8 out 10 times or so. It is imperative that you follow these instructions exactly in order get things going in the game:
Solution for “Moorish Bug” in redux:
1. Start up a new Redux SPC as Moors. (Whatever difficulty)
2. Go to Morocco, move your “Moorish Warriors”-unit to Algeria.
3. Go to Tunisia, move all existing units (including ruler) to Cyrenacia.
4. Go to Egypt, move one “Moorish Infantry” unit to Cyrenacia.
5. No more moves, with any unit. Don’t move anything else.
6. Build stuff and commission troops or change taxes at your own discretion.
7. End turn... Let the game do its stuff and wait for the first news of rebellion within the empire (let those rebels and peasants have their fun). AD 701 arrives and you can play the game as much as you want from now on. Make save of AD 701 just to be safe.
- If the game for some reason still freezes, “alt-ctrl-del” and shut down MTW. Do step 1-7 all over again.
This “Moorish opening” is of course not what or you or anyone else wants but it works. However, once you make to AD 701 you should be able to play redux anyway you like (and you have some 559 turns to correct the disasters of the Moorish opening).
The Moors have bugged on me before and it extremely unfortunate that the Redux 1.0 Moorish campaign start is somehow still configured in such way that game-program may freeze on the very first turn. I thought I solved this problem long time ago, your findings clearly shows that I was all wrong here. Now, I suspect that this bug might be connected to multiple rebellions events in a single turn and this sometimes makes the game-program to freak out and not load related audio-files properly (the rebel screams). Hence the game freezes. That’s a least what I think, based on previous experience. This is almost certainly not a redux exclusive bug and it has happened to me in similar forms many times, even in the original game. See “known bugs” in the “redux read me” (entry no:6), that’s the ones we are talking about here. What is really bad in this case, is the fact that you don’t got any such old saves to rely on and thus you are stuck with the weird manoeuvres of the “Moorish opening” to be able play game properly. MTW is a fairly stable game but not much more than that.
There might be other ways to halter this “Moorish Bug” other than doing a “Moorish opening”. If you are up to it, experiment some and try to keep your Moorish subjects as happy as possible and target some provinces high taxes and you might be able start your campaign in another way. Ironically, it is very much in line with the Moorish campaign description, you will have to leave some provinces in order to save others. Otherwise do the 7 steps listed above and take it from there. Hopefully your troubles end here and can you start playing the game instead.
(As far I can tell, your redux-install is probably in good health and you’re GFX-card dont seem to have a problem with redux either),
Tyberius: sorry for being a bit minimalistic on ya earlier on. Glad to hear you like my stuff. Regarding the “lending part” then, sure man, just give me the proper credits for my work and I will have no problem lending some to you. What are your plans or is it some sort of secret?
Axel: happy that you like redux man, but why the big wait (for your drives)? If your PC are up and running, why dont take chance and install redux now? Hell, it might even work, you never know until you tried. As I said earlier, I have a GFX-card, and it aint that old, that actually runs redux but wont go anywhere near original MTW-campaigns! Try it. If it don’t work, then by all means wait or try some other drives. ...It might...it might...
REDUX BUG-HUNT DECLARED:
----------------------------
With Tonys discovery the box of big bad bugs has been opened for sure and it is only fitting that a proper bug-hunt is declared. So, if you stumble upon something suspicious, weird and bug like in redux and it is not already charted in redux “known bugs”, then posting it here would probably be good idea. All help here will be much appreciated, since my bug-slayer-skills will only go so far. I will see what I can do to counter or fix it, and if I can’t then perhaps someone else can step in. After all, there are some really serious MTW-specialists and such around here at the .Org... The best!
- Cheers
Tyberius
08-12-2008, 16:33
Tyberius: sorry for being a bit minimalistic on ya earlier on. Glad to hear you like my stuff. Regarding the “lending part” then, sure man, just give me the proper credits for my work and I will have no problem lending some to you. What are your plans or is it some sort of secret?
Never mind, See, I'm a good designer myself, and I have done plenty of info pics and unit icons, panel etc. But yours must be the best info Pics I have ever seen. the question is that several of your info pics fit perfectly on some of my Tyberius Modded units, that have been using duplicate info pics from the original game, and some of yours looked even "properer" than the original MTW ones! and that is the use I want to give them, giving you the appropiate credits.
but, that's not all, your work was so inspiring, that I had to demonstrate myself that I could do something like it, and i think I got pretty close:
XL Armoured Almughavars
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/3600/armouredalmughavarsfb0.jpg
TM Breton Militia
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/6224/bretonmilitiaay9.jpg
TM Milicia Concejil
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/9361/miliciaconcejiltq6.jpg
TM Skutatoi
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/3589/skutatosfr0.jpg
TM Mounted Squires
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/5237/mountedsquiresyx0.jpg
XL Arsenalotti
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/2227/arsenalottiha1.jpg
And I've made this three almost from zero..
Korean Spearmen
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/75/koreanspearmenrk8.jpg
Korean Skirmishers
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/4213/koreanskirmishersdv2.jpg
Korean Guardsmen
https://img179.imageshack.us/img179/7394/koreanguardsmencf9.jpg
If you find some of my work useful too I will gladly put it at your disposal.
cheers.
Hi there Tyberius, again thanks for the praise.
I have been entertaining my self by looking at your little exhibition here. To me it’s all a question about shape and light. You basically got the shapes right, but you are often having some slight problems with the light. As a spectator you can sense that some parts are external rather than a piece along with others in the pics. This is a problem I have had and battled with many times and I know all about it myself. It can at times be really hard to make things blend “correctly” and create the impression or illusion for the spectator that all the stuff belongs together. I would say that generally this is your weakest aspect in these pics.
All in all I think you got some real fine work going here, but many of them could be strengthened by some slight and further adjustments in light. This is especially true for your Korean boys who are otherwise really good shape wise. My altered Frankish spearman/your Breton militia is really devious, I get the feeling I did him myself! At the same time I am fully aware that the shield is not mine, but sure feels like I always have put it there. You got a really god angle and light on that one. Your shields on the Almughavar and Skutatoi are excellent pieces of work, the kind I am looking/aiming for when I do a pic myself (although some tiny problems with the light again, especially with the squared one, otherwise first class shields). The Concejil shield must have been a real fuzzer for you, but you have nailed it in the end (nice blend). The Skutatoi is spot on, that is plainly put a kick-ass pic! Regarding the “mounted squires” guy, I would suggest that you move him rightwards about 1-2 cm and do something in line with what I did for reduxes “feudal cavalry” and shield from the “russian knights”. It’s your call, but that’s what I would have done. The Arsenalotti, its my head is not? I can’t remember if it is or not… Ha! How about flipping his head horizontally? Wouldn’t that be good?
I realize I sound like a whining know-it-all but as a fellow pic-artist I guess you would be more interested in this kind of input than many others. A simple “great/bad” isn’t that useful here, at least the way I see it. Personally, I usually go/aim for the “great masterpiece” each and every time, even if the common sense of a brick-wall alone clearly tells you that this is not going to happen. Still I try and try. So I guess I am not that smart after all. He he! Regardless Tyberius, as far as I am concerned you have a GO on using some redux-stuff for your mod. I would be my pleasure to help you out by lending some redux material to the Tyberius mod.
(I’ll keep your offer in mind for sure, but for the moment I probably got what I need for redux, but if that change and you have something that works, I’ll be looking for you and your stuff)
- Cheers
Tony Furze
08-13-2008, 13:46
Thanks, Axalon, for finding the solution and putting in so much hard work!
Your mod is one of the most interesting I've come across as a player - the portrait work reminds me of the vividness of the Knights of Honor game. As a rampant strategy /roleplayer it looks very promising. I'm a fan of muslim armies so the Moors were the natural choice.
Hi mate,
Ok ill give it a go, also got my old PC running again :yes: so i cane play it soon
Hello,
I found out a bug on my own (or rather it's an old mistake by me) concerning Islamic castles in tactical mode. I will post a Fix for it within 24hrs.
Tony: it’s good and appreciated news!
Axel: that’s the spirit!
- Cheers
seireikhaan
08-14-2008, 18:19
Hi Axalon, this is some nice looking work you've got here.
A couple of queries, I guess:
First of all, do the Mongols still appear around 1230? You said it ends about 1260, and I was just thinking what a nightmare it would be if someone was going for the 100% victory and was juuuuuust finally getting to Khazar at 1231. :laugh4:
Also, I don't suppose that there's any way some of the other factions can be made playable? I'd love to give the Lombards a go.
Baron von Manteuffel
08-14-2008, 21:43
I know to make the other factions playable, go to the startpos file and find: SetActiveFaction::, and change minor to major. What issues may arise insofaras stability and/or balancing only the creator knows. :lam:
Hi all, as promised here is the” REDUX-ISLAMIC CASTLE FIX” for you guys. What it does and such is all in the attached “ReadMe”. Download, install and continue your reduxed games. Get it here:
Link 1:
Removed
Link 2:
Removed
Makaikhaan: I’ll get back here soon, hold on! (the Baron is on the right track)
- Cheers
Galagros
08-15-2008, 03:55
How do you use the bonus files?
Hello again,
GALAGROS: I’m assuming here that you mean the bonus portraits. To apply one of the redux bonus portraits in the game you apply and follow the steps of “GUIDE 1A”-on altering game portraits in MTW-Redux:
1. Determine what kind of unit it is that you want to change portrait on. Let’s say it is a general and he got the white number-tag “16” in the right upper corner.
2. You locate the bonus-portrait you want to put in “general 16’s” place in the game. Let’s say it’s the one located in “Redux Bonus Material\Bonus Portraits\Hero “–folder with the filename of “Hero20”/ “Hero20.tga”.
3. You make copy of “Hero20.tga” and put this copy on, let’s say, you’re desktop.
4. Now you locate your reduxed MTW-install folder, either named “Redux - Total War” or “Medieval – Total War” and from there you go to “………-TotalWar\campmap\Portraits\Catholic\General”, when you found your way to that place, you locate the file which is named: “general16.tga”. Copy that file-name.
5 Get back to your desktop and the “Hero20.tga”-file you earlier put there. Now, replace or change that filename with the one you copied at step 4. The “Hero20.tga” should thus now be named; “general16.tga” if you have followed the instructions and steps correctly.
6. Now open up the “………-TotalWar\campmap\Portraits\Catholic\General”-folder again, make a copy of your renamed file placed on your desktop and paste it into the generals-folder and let it replace the existing file with the same name.
7. Start up redux a locate the general you wanted to change portrait on, he now has the portrait of “Hero20” taken from the Hero-folder in the “bonus portraits”-folder which in turn is placed in the Redux Bonus Material-folder.
Now, if you for some reason would want to reset one or all portraits the game-portraits to redux default again, you simply use copies of the files located in the Back-Up Files-folder. As in the same way you did on step 1-7. Also located in “Bonus portraits”. There are back-ups on both “kings” and “generals” there.
This concludes “GUIDE 1A”…
Lastly, if you do mean the stuff in the “Review Unit Markers”-folder, these are auxiliary markers for tactical units in the game. They are made ready for you or anybody else that would like to use them in redux. As in, adding some new and custom units of your own into the game. They are there for that very purpose, since many considers it hard to make such markers that also works the way they are suppose to. Now, if you want to use these in the game there are plenty of guides for these things right here at the -.Org. Read those guides and then you’ll know when and where to use em’. Otherwise forget all about it.
(The wallpapers are pretty much self-explanatory, don’t you think?)
-----
MAKAIKHAAN: Glad you like it man. Some answers for your questions then, first question; nope they don’t, but even if that is technically true, something could appear (cause this might very well be hard coded stuff). It all depends on one thing; are the Lithuanians eliminated or not. If not, nothing happens. If they are, you’ll get this message:
“The Lithuanians have allied themselves to a new and powerful force in the east; it is known as The Golden Horde. It is rumored that the horde dominates all land to legendary Cathay; with such an ally the Lithuanians have found a renewed strength."
And then you get a serious assembly of cavalry to deal with (probably in Khazar). That’s what happens.
Second question; the good baron is quite right, “C:\Program\Total War\Redux - Total War\campmap\startpos” and then the appropriate entry, change “minor” to “major”, in this case the Sicilians. However, this is beyond the default framework of redux and such you will get no intro text – If you can manage to live without that, it will probably, in the case, work just fine. But, I would not recommend these kind changes for all other existing minor-factions. The factions that I would advice you and everybody else stay away from in SPC are the following; Portugal, Lithuanians, Norse, Russians, Papists and Saracens for various reasons.
This leaves you with the following functional minors; Aragon, Burgundy, Hungarians and Lombardy which should in a strict technical sense work just fine. Playing as Lombards in SPC will probably be similar to that of playing as Italy, maybe slightly harder. The Lombards tech-tree is the same as the “Italians”. It's a diverse and rich tech-tree so you should have a decent shot of doing just fine in redux-SPC with the Lombards. Go to “custom battles” and Redux-MP, there you can find out which units are available to Lombardy. Redux is all about customizing your personal game man, so you have my full blessings in the matter, if you should ever need em'. And you don’t. Hehe!
-----
GOOD NEWS: Redux 1.0 - “Viking Invasion compatible pack” on its way!
After Raz gave me wake-up-call about the fact that newer editions of MTW are not compatible with version 1.1, I have been, let’s say… …“Vexed”, about that. My “Plan A”, was in short, making redux available to all MTW-players, hence I did the 1.1 version. Because I do know the feeling of being unable to play a seemingly cool mod because you don’t have access to VI (or whatever game), so this is no news to me. Now, there is always plan B (any of this sound familiar?), and that is of course to make redux compatible with MTW version .2.01 so everybody can play redux if they wanted to.
I can now reveal that “Plan B” is already in the making and I have converted some 95% of redux to version 2.01 and this “compatible pack” should be ready very, very soon. However, I have so far not had the time to properly double-check everything and therefore I am seriously considering releasing a beta-version of it first. There are two potential advantages with such a move; 1) you “v.2.01”-people get to play redux faster and 2) stupid snags, bugs, bad-grammar, lost words and such could be countered faster and BEFORE releasing a more proper and formal version of it. Any happy helper/player that finds valid bugs or some bad grammar/lost words and such I would be delighted to pay for your "prey" with a credit in the final release. So, are there any happy “bughunters” around here?
Finally, let me also point out that this does not in anyway mean that all you v.1.1 guys will be left behind. As I said earlier, the plan is that all MTW-players shall be able to play redux if they want to.
Well, that’s about it…
- Cheers
Axalon
Excellent news about the 2.01 version. I, for one, will be very happy to do some bug-hunting.
Great! Much appreciated Western! I’ll probably release the ReduxVI compatibility beta within 24 hrs. (You better go and oil up those ol’ catapults!)
- Cheers
24 hours? That's great news. I'll be waiting patiently 'til then. :2thumbsup:
Well, the beta is out (available over at the “debug thread”) and I hope it works. Could anyone verify this?
Axalon
Yes, the beta works. Sadly I now have to go to work, but I will aim to do some bug-hunting tonight.
Thanks Western, much appreciated. - Happy hunting…
TONY: If you’re still around, I never got the proper chance to ask you this earlier but I am still curious; what do you find interesting with redux? Also, why do you find these things interesting? I would be interested to hear your views regarding those things since I think it might be interesting stuff to get some info on. If you don’t want to answer me on this, just tell me so and I’ll accept that, but I am curious here.
(If anybody else wants share their views regarding these things, feel free to do so, I will probably be just as curious on that.)
- Cheers
Hi Axalon
I've played as the Byz and the Moors on the beta. Very stable - no bugs spotted yet.
I like what you've done with the rebels. They are more aggressive than I've seen on other Mods, and they don't run into massive debt, which has traditionally been their problem. The building ban is a clever idea. Is that what is making them more active and worthwhile foes?
I also like the use of some high building costs (eg church, shipyard). Is that to soak up excess money as the game proceeds? I'll share a simple idea for the same purpose which I've used but not seen in other Mods. I give certain building upgrades negative cathedral income (operating costs). So if you upgrade your court or armourer, for example, you get the benefits, but you also get part of your royal income consumed by running this new, bigger court/better armoury. It helps to combat the situation where you are actually struggling to spend all your income as the game goes on - and it's kind of realistic. Got to be careful with it though, because I read somewhere (Cegorach I think) that too many income producing buildings in a province can cause a crash
Hi there Western. (This took a bit longer than I originally planned…)
First of all, good to know that the beta appears to be stable and that the bugs so far have eluded you. I would say it is very likely that MTW 2.01 version is more stable than the 1.1 version of the game and this also has its effect on how redux is running (as in less crashes and freezes). Now, I got both short and long versions for your remarks and questions and they are as follows:
Short versions:
--------------
1. The rebels: …probably a combination of reduxed things…
2. High Costs; …it’s better and more proper that way…
3. Excess Money: …more unlikely to happen in redux…
4. Shared Idea: …an interesting idea and I agree with you…
Long versions:
-------------
1. THE REBELS: in truth, I have no certain answers for you why they appear to do their job better in redux and it is probably a combination of reduxed things.
Firstly, I have given the rebels some (5-10 or so) special units that are only available to them (usually categorized as “raider”-troops, ex. “raider” -infantry, -cavalry, etc.). All these special rebel troops usually are fairly easy and cheap to recruit which by itself makes it very possible for the AI to actually use them. I have also given the AI all the possible incitements I could think of to encourage the AI to use/recruit those special rebel units, and it appears to be working. I have also changed the settings/stats so that they should be able to build smaller and “rebel only” pirate fleets if they have the proper installations in place. This actually happens now and again, thus disrupting the sea routs of trade and transportation making the rebels even more troublesome to have around.
Secondly, rebels should not build installations (buildings), they raid and plunder (building stuff are the regular factions job)! The build embargo has essentially been integrated for that very reason and I have instructed the AI that starting embargos are especially good thing to do for the rebel faction, and if your findings are correct then it seems to be working. I have also reasoned that sooner or later the rebels get their hands on a province which does have a castle in it, and that in turn will ensure that the rebels will have the possibility to raise some of those special rebel troops.
Thirdly, I have reduxed all the rebel settings for provinces in the game, basically increased all settings by at least one step in the “startpos” entries. The direct effect being that there are greater risks of rebellions in redux. There are a few exceptions here, CONSTANTINOPLE being one among of those few. Redux also introduces, relocates or discards various rebel-hotspots in the game compared with the original MTW, the worst unruly rebel hotspots in redux are among others; CORDOBA, SAHARA, KHAZAR, FRIESLAND, SCOTLAND, LIVONIA, VOLGA-BULGARIA and NORMANDY etc. It’s all in the “startpos” entries. At the same time there are more buildings in redux that makes people happy and all the various values/stats for that have also been reduxed so all that rebel activity is basically balanced out by that. Building (and finishing) an 80 or 100%+ farmland makes the people happy in redux for instance, small taverns don’t give as much happiness boost as a great tavern etc. All the exact values are obviously in the “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”-file (a Gnome editor is recommended here of course).
A fourth note is that the rebels usually don’t go to war with everybody and thus seem be inclined to attack the weaker spots of their current and active enemies for starters, which actually happens now and again. Thus potentially forcing the player and all other factions to have garrison near a rebel strongpoint in the region I guess. If the rebels get a promising opportunity to take a rich province they might very well take it. They are at war for god sake! Well, you get the idea… I suspect that the rebel AI might be similar to the “Pope AI” in that regard.
Lastly a more speculative note on the rebel behaviour in redux; their unusual vigor could perhaps be explained in how the redux-SPC is constructed and set up. There are plenty of rebel controlled provinces when the campaign starts. In fact it’s the lion’s share of the entire “stratmap” right? Most other major MTW-mods tend to fill these “vacant" territories with new factions of different kinds and the original game has obviously also less rebel held territories than redux does. It might be just this simple; the game program is instructed to “take back” lost provinces for the behalf of the rebels, since it was "rebel"-territory when the game started and it is merely trying to achieve this with the available means. This is of course speculation, but it might very well be just like that, personally I get that impression. (Other than these five aspects, I have not a clue…)
2. HIGH COSTS: The high costs in redux is basically altered to what I thought was proper yet functional for the installation/building in question. Many times the final value was compared with the cost of a single unit of “royal knights”, and then I applied a little reason to it. To me taverns and inns should be cheap and easy to build since it merely is some large plain houses. Churches, palaces and such on the other hand, should be at least fairly expensive since anything else would have been ridiculous.
Basically it is combination of reason and what also is functional in the game. Building a castle is not cheap, it has never been and it is not even supposed be it either. If you want a castle, then prepare to part with some of those precious florins of yours… You get idea. It’s as easy as that. All costs are of course listed in “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”-file.
3. EXCESS MONEY: This is indeed problematic issue. The problem can also be divided into several parts, but in the end, it all comes down to the “flow of florins” in the game.
Part I
As you probably are well aware of, the trade system has been changed and even more so when running redux upon v 2.01 of MTW. I have essentially cut the trade income by 50% with a few exceptions along with the obvious fact that I have redistributed, introduced or and removed some trade goods from the game (in cases this actually resulted in a seemingly more historically accurate distribution of goods and resources than in the original).
This of course has its impact on the game, for all factions even the rebels, making it harder to get those “monster loads” of florins in the royal coffers. Thus redux offer harsher economical conditions, but at the same time prices are also higher, making it even harder. The cutting of trade income will definitely have an effect on the game, exactly how big remains to seen but there should be less florins flying around and as a result possibly smaller armies of the map, or at least fewer expensive and big formations within that army (ex. royal cavalry or infantry). That’s one part.
Part II
Another part of the problem is; “what should I get for running my economy responsively”. My answer to that is; “a good or at least better economy." I’m also an advocator of these ideas; "If I do handle my economy responsively and I do it long enough, I should be able to save some of my florins... If I also manage to save florins for a long period, I should also end up with plenty of florins in my coffers." And now the great separating question; "If I manage that, should I be punished for it?” My position here is; “…no, you should not!” which clashes with the opposing tradition of; "Yes you should!". In redux the “…no, you should not!”-design that has been applied. There are of course other games where the “yes, you should!”-tradition are applied. I wont name them here, but still, they are out there and quite popular some of them as well. This aspect is basically a pure design matter and the design for redux aims above all to moderate the “flow of florins”. The basic idea is to halter the player from getting ridiculously rich in an instant or that “you” should be punished for handling the economy responsively. If you manage to get rich by saving your florins, so be it. You earned it.
Then again, saving florins are also supposed to be hard, since you are always tempted to invest your florins in some useful building so you can start recruiting some of those “cool knights” or “keep the people happy” and so on. At least, "you" probably feel the need to keep up in the arms race with the neighbouring factions and thus spend your florins on commissioning some new and powerful troops to secure your borders.
Part III
This in turn is linked to another part of the problem; where your faction is located in the “stratmap”. For example; Normandy is with out doubt a richer province than Cyprus is (at least according to the default redux design). Hence, if your position is Normandy your chances of getting a successful economy going are greater than doing so on Cyprus. Thus you get the incitement to conquer Normandy since you want to riches of that province. In that way rich provinces creates attention and interest of other factions that want their riches for themselves and thus the threat of potential invasions are born. Which in turn cost florins to halter and so it goes on and on.
In these regards, there is, and it’s supposed to be, differences between the factions. Poland is economically harder to play than France because there are not the same potential riches in the vicinity that is available around France for instance. But on the other hand, the threat of invasion should be greater to France and thus she must spend florins on defending those rich provinces (Aquitaine, Anjou etc.) since they appear to be more attractive to conquer than let’s say; Silesia and Volhynia... To rule Europe you need florins, and there are of course limits and inequalities on where those florins are located.
Conclusion
Now if you manage to get rich, even with the obstacles that are incorporated in redux, my position is: you earned it and should rightfully enjoy the advantages that those riches bring. It’s not my intention to create some sort of symmetry between expenses and incomes. My aim is just to keep a more balanced flow of florins thru out the game (and I personally see no harm in saving some of them either). So with all this in mind, the “excess money” situation is probably more unlikely to happen in redux, but if it happens, it is supposed to be the result of how you played the game and not because the game suffers from a potentially incomplete or poor design. This have been my intensions for redux at least.
4. SHARED IDEA: it’s a very interesting and good idea and I do buy your arguments for it all the way. But I am sure that you agree with me that florins are complex stuff (as partly discussed in the “Excess money” section), and the issued instability warning on top of it all, do make me very cautious here. So, for now I will put it in my “box of great ideas on stasis” for better and safer times. Still, it is very interesting idea.
Happy hunting on ya!
- Cheers
Western, when can you do some more hunting in redux next time?
(Poland seems to be working just fine by the way)
- Cheers
Regarding higher costs and excess money: How does that affect the AI? My impression is that the AI isn´t particularly adept at managing it´s coffers (surprisingly, one could argue that this is historically accurate, Edward III of England was said to have imbursed his crown because he so desperately needed money, and Charles VII of France said of himself that he was the poorest man in his kingdom); so I´m a bit afraid that the AI will never be able to collect the means to upgrade its provinces or to use decent troops.
Axalon
Tried the Italians tonight. Everything seems good. The rebels in the papal states are Apulians when they should be something more northern like marchese or anconans- but that is probably straight from vanilla.
I note that wars are slow to come in redux. Factions build strong armies before they finally attack. But I like that - who goes to war without a bit of planning first??
Hi there Western,
This is good stuff you are reporting here, the Apulian stuff is probably vanilla as you say. Slow wars? Hm, it’s just as well, why go to war unprepared... Right? What are you playing the next time? It would good to know, so I don’t play the same factions as you.
I will have a go at the English next I think - and see if the vikings come after me.
Western:Thanks for that info, I sure appreciate it. Good hunting!
Ciaran: I also got some answers here for you, hello by the way. I will start from the top and work my way down here…
“Regarding higher costs and excess money: How does that affect the AI? My impression is that the AI isn´t particularly adept at managing it´s coffers… …; so I´m a bit afraid that the AI will never be able to collect the means to upgrade its provinces or to use decent troops.”
Well, in theory, the way you stated this, it sure makes a lot of sense. In reduxed practice however, it's a very different story...
“How does that affect the AI?”
Technically it doesn’t, as far as I can tell at least. However, the higher prices do have an effect on how easy it is for the AI to actually realize various things. Once the AI has its priorities stated, it follows those regardless of the cost. As far as building installations/buildings goes at any rate. If no florins are available, it simply waits.
“…the AI will never be able to collect the means to upgrade its provinces or to use decent troops.”
My experience with redux is that the AI (for various reasons) actually delivers more varied troops and thus armies than in the original. In these armies the AI have a tendency to also include some high quality troops such as “champion”, “feudal champions”, “Byzantine palaceguard” or ”royal guard” to name a few examples (all dependent on which faction it is of course). The fact that redux has more or less an entirely different set of “new” troops is of course a factor, but I find it very unlikely that this is the only reason for the AIs “interesting” behavior. The AI seems to prefer a mix between all arms (archer/infantry/cavalry etc.) if possible, regardless if it’s cheap or expensive troops, within the boundaries of what is currently available (this of course dependent on region, existing buildings and relevant tech-trees).
Since the tech-trees of redux is very different from those existing in the original, the circumstances that follows are also very different. Because of that you will end up with armies that are different. All of this seems to create an end-result that is more diverse, which usually means that it is harder to face such a foe on the battlefield, regardless of the fact that prices are higher. I realize this may sound strange but this is what really happens in redux, in spite of the harsher economical frameworks applied.
“…the AI will never be able to collect the means to upgrade its provinces…”
Yes, it’s harder for each and every faction to get a broad and solid “high-end” war production going. Fewer castles are built, meaning fewer places to recruit troops in, meaning fewer troops running around on the “stratmap” and smaller support expenses. Fewer troops means also that the importance of quality, when available, increases. And it seems that the redux-AI corresponds fairly well to those circumstances.
The importance of well developed provinces are vital in redux, because they usually are harder to come by. The flaw here might be that the AI does not fully recognize the need to protect these key-provinces properly in some cases, which of course is very stupid. The AI is a shameless coward, and will only fight if it “feels” sure of success. It does not fully understand that some provinces are more important than others, at least when it comes to defending them. On the offensive however, the AI is a bit wiser and usually will invade the richest (which usually means the most developed) province that are within its reach on the “stratmap”.
However, as a redux-SPC goes on, more and more provinces do get developed and the effects of the AI’s cowardice are less and less devastating for every faction that has managed to develop other key provinces. Since the redux-AI at least, likes to build stuff even if it is expensive. Hence provinces do get developed, but in another way and not in all over the map (simultaneously). A few posts up, Western confirms that even the rebels (notoriously bad regarding economy-stuff in the original) in redux manages to get by, in spite of the harsher economical framework. And it’s not because of the build embargos (although they do help), because I checked that.
Many territories in redux usually have plenty of buildings in place, but that does not necessarily mean that the AI also automatically places some defending castles there (even if resources for it are available). Thus making it more attractive for some one else to invade and continue to develop the area upon the costly investments already made by the enemy! This is a very common scenario. Since florins usually are in limited supply, the redux-AI seems to be quite a farmer, desperate to get some more florins for other more grand buildings perhaps?
To sum things up then;
I could be wrong here (by all means correct me), but to me it seems that you based your fears upon the assumption that facts retrieved from the original game would somehow be valid or the same for redux. But redux is quite different actually and therefore most of those facts become invalid and incorrect. With the result that your fears don’t add up correctly to the actual and ruling circumstances found in redux. Because of that, I suggest that you get rid of those fears, since they won’t do you any justice here.
If you not already tried out redux, feel free to do so, and find out all about it for yourself.
- Cheers
(BTW, I don’t want any rep as some sort of “monster poster”, but I trying to get you guys some good answers on redux here, and that tends to get big).
Why, thanks for your encompassing answer.
If you not already tried out redux, feel free to do so, and find out all about it for yourself.
I´ll do that, when I manage to get MTW to install properly again, since you definitely have piqued my interest.
Hi mate
If i use the Redux 1.0 and the beta fix do i still have to put the Islamic castle fix in as wel?
And dose it it matter where i download this wonderfull mod ? i see a lot of download links are they all the same mod? :2thumbsup:
Hi guys,
Ciaran: when you come around to it, I hope you’ll have much fun with redux.
Axel: All you need is MTW-REDUX 1.0 and the VI/2.01-BETA (available at the VI/2.01 debug thread). The Islamic castle bug and the “Moorish opening” problems get fixed when applying the VI-beta (which by the way seems to be very stable and have worked just fine so far). The ISLAMIC CASTLE FIX is only relevant those people who are running redux upon a 1.1 version of MTW.
The reason for the multiple links is an old habit of mine; “always provide an extra separate backup link, for all important material, if one link should ever turn out to be bad.” That’s why there are two links to almost all redux stuff, just use ”link1” (which is filefront, no: 2 is the Atomic gamer upload) on everything if you feel uncertain here. Enjoy!
- Cheers
(Bughunt-update; Spain seems to be working just fine)
ok mate thx
but one more question, I only need Medieval total war not with the Viking invasion? and do i patch Medieval up?
after i install it ill play the game and let you know any bugs
Ok, axel here is what you do:
1. Install MTW
2. Patch and upgrade original MTW as far as humanly possible (all patches and expansions)
3. Determine what kind of version of MTW you are running. Either it is V1.1 or V2.01. (Start up “over patched” MTW and see what version it is in the upper left corner of the game menu).
4. Now, you install MTW-Redux 1.0 according to the instructions that came with it, see the “How to install”-file.
5. Install all the relevant extra files (Betas or fixes) for redux depending on which version of MTW you are running:
*If you got V.1.1: You should download the ISLAMIC CASTLE FIX, and install it after you have installed MTW-Redux 1.0. Follow the instructions that came with it..
*If you got V2.01 (Viking Invasion/gold edition etc.): You should download the VI/2.01-BETA, and install it after you have installed MTW-Redux 1.0. Follow the instructions that came with it..
6. When all extra stuff are installed, start up and play redux…
That’s it!
Baron von Manteuffel
08-23-2008, 05:13
@Axalon - First, nice mod. It's unique and I'm having a lot of fun with it. I've tried 2 different campaigns. One with France and the other with England, and both campaigns played flawlessly. With England, one of the starting units in Mercia is the English Foresters. Unfortunately they are not recruitable and therefor not upgradable. I guess you don't need them anyway with the availability of the Longbows. Why are the Knights Templar the only Knights Order you can recruit? I checked the CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT, and they are recruitable with the { ORDER_PALACE } building. I know they're used in Crusades but why can France and England recruit the mounted Knights Templar, but not Templar Cavalry or Templar Foot Knights? The Italians cannot recruit the Hospitallers, nor can the Germans recruit the Teutonic Knights, etc.. I would prefer to recruit them all, but that's just my opinion. I like a lot of different recruitable units. I'm tempted to make Hungary playable after the bug hunting, just to give the Dragon Knights a try. Dragon Knights are recruitable too, but Hungary is a Minor Faction at this time. Anyway these aren't bugs, they're just observations. Keep up the excellent work, and I'll look forward to any future updates you may add. Thanx :2thumbsup:
Hi guys,
Ciaran: when you come around to it, I hope you’ll have much fun with redux.
Axel: All you need is MTW-REDUX 1.0 and the VI/2.01-BETA (available at the VI/2.01 debug thread). The Islamic castle bug and the “Moorish opening” problems get fixed when applying the VI-beta (which by the way seems to be very stable and have worked just fine so far). The ISLAMIC CASTLE FIX is only relevant those people who are running redux upon a 1.1 version of MTW.
The reason for the multiple links is an old habit of mine; “always provide an extra separate backup link, for all important material, if one link should ever turn out to be bad.” That’s why there are two links to almost all redux stuff, just use ”link1” (which is filefront, no: 2 is the Atomic gamer upload) on everything if you feel uncertain here. Enjoy!
- Cheers
(Bughunt-update; Spain seems to be working just fine)
Now there´s a philosophy I can easily subscribe to. I usually download anything that looks like I might need or want sometime later, because with the internet, you never know how long any given content will be available.
By the way, which version would you suggest (when I install I´ll get MTW 1.1 before I install VI, and, after all, I can have multiple installations of MTW on my harddrive).
Hi guys,
BARON VON MANTEUFFEL: First, thanks for the praise man. Now, you just got our first valid “kill”, even if you seem to be unaware of it yourself! The “English Foresters” in VI/2.01-Beta are supposed to recruitable. This nasty bug snatches away over 30 tactical units from the redux-SPC and really damages the overall designs for it, making you guys and all factions unable to recruit all these troops even if “you” have all the right requirements to do it! Your good Intel, made me suspicious and I finally became aware of it and I’ve killed this sneaky bastard for you. Congrats and good work man!
(Regarding the order-stuff, it is an older mistake made by me. I looked things over and decided to unlock most of them for the VI-Beta. However, due to some balance-issues I have slightly increased support costs for all the order knights. If you want foot-knights, just dismount the regular ones.)
CIARAN: I would actually recommend you to go with the VI/2.01-Beta, in spite of what I just said to von Manteuffel. Because it appears to be far more stable than the 1.1 version, which seems to have a higher risk of potential freezes and crashes. And you want to play the game! Right? With the new tac-fix installed you and everybody else, can now play some real redux, instead of some starved and puny version on V2.01!
WESTERN: do you have any additional info on England?
I have already posted the fix for the bug: “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_TAC_FIX.zip” over at the “debug-area”. All further info is available there.
- Cheers
Thank you, Axalon.
As I said, I´ll get round to it once I can be bothered to install MTW and VI anew. Right now my only copy is overwritten with XL and the Tyberius 2.0. I´ll see whether I can convince my computer to install MTW and VI again - the last time I tried that, it gave me cheek when I tried installing VI after sucessfully installing MTW and, being the genius I am, I failed to keep a clean copy of MTW :dizzy2: I suppose I asked for it. :whip:
Axalon
England played fine for me. I didn't spot what the Baron spotted. But playing again as the Byz I had a rebellion in Leser Armenia made up entirely of ballistas (about 30 of the things). This is a bug I've seen before, perhaps even in vanilla. Not sure what the fix is short of denying the rebels all siege weapons.
Hi guys,
Ciaran: Im not the guy who’s trying to tell you how to run things on your PC or anything, but you could always do this;
1. Copy your MTW-XL-Tyberius install to somewhere, uninstall the regular copy (it’s probably the reason for all the fuzz), install MTW again, and make a copy of that. Install VI on one of the copies. And then install Redux and VI/2.01-beta + Tac-fix or the ordinary version on one of the regular MTW copies (however, a bit unstable and you need the “Islamic castle fix” there).
2. Copy your XL-Tyberius MTW and install redux over that (with VI-Beta +Tac-Fix). It should probably work just fine but you will have alot of junk within that install.
Western: Regarding the horde of ballista’s; it’s an old bug from original MTW, had it myself, usually with mangonels. Solution; remove all entries in column: 11 for all siege weapons in the “CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT” using a GnomeEditor. That will do the trick, I might just do that myself for redux sometime. Thanks anyways.
von Manteuffel: Any other info on the HRE?
Has anyone else found some useful or interesting Intel on redux? If you have, feel free to share it with the rest of us.
- Cheers
Baron von Manteuffel
08-25-2008, 20:13
Hi, I have not found anything else yet with the Germans. I did fight a battle in Franconia against the Norse. They attacked with a large army of Norse Bodyguard units. It seems that the AI prefers to recruit nothing but the Bodyguard units for the Norse (about 90%). While they are very powerful against other infantry, I was easily able to get Imperial Knights in their rear and flank. My infantry battleline though mauled, held long enough for my Imperial knight counterattack. The Norse King fled, and their whole army desintegrated. The point is though they are very powerful, they are not balanced. ~:) After looking at the Norse some more, I believe the Bodyguard indulgence is just caused by a lot of heirs and after a King dies, ex-heirs.
Hi again von Manteuffel,
This post is based on your unedited post, but I think it might be interesting anyhow so I post it as it was, even though you clearly got new info on the matter. Regarding the heirs and such, you are probably right.
---
I do appreciate your sincerity in the matter. However, I don’t recognize the scenario you’re painting here, even thou it is interesting. And because of that I will stand my ground on this one until it can be further verified that this scenario is indeed a regular occurrence in redux.
Now, what you are describing sounds to me like one of the text-book examples on how to deal with those lethal Vikings (especially those Norse Bodyguards which are among the meanest of them all). You applied cavalry to infantry (in the flanks and in the rear?) and if there was no spears around I think you got a pretty accurate conclusion of that particular battle (given the fact that you were also facing Vikings without any spears). Add to that; you also got a healthy taste of what kind of loses you’ll have if you deploy infantry against the Norse. Infantry is their specialty, but on the other hand they have scarce options in other arms, making them vulnerable to “high-tech” factions like the HRE for instance. The HRE and “Italy” has plenty of various specialist to draw from (with the right installations in place of course) which makes them quite formidable to face if a few of these units are present in an army and you got all the “wrong” troops. Trying to improve “your” tan in front of some Frankish formation of crossbowmen will, and should, end in utter doom for the poor dumb bastard that tries it! I am pretty sure that you agree with here.
In my experience the Norse usually throws in a few spear and cavalry units and some archers as well if they got it available in their armies. Thus usually having more balanced armies than the one you describe. For some reason the AI, thou a coward, thought it had good chances of defeating you in this case and went to the attack accordingly (Franconia being prosperous province and all). You had the right and enough tactical resources available in Franconia to defend it, and triumphed because of that (probably along with some able generalship involved as well).
What I suspect happened in this particular case, thou I can only speculate because I have to scarce info here, is that your scenario happened fairly early in your campaign and the reason for the Norse “stubborn” recruitment of Norse Bodyguards could be linked to the fact that they may not have had the time yet to develop enough buildings to commission cavalry or archers and such. Because they usually build such troops if they can, to a far greater extent than they build Norse Bodyguards. All this based on the experience I have had with the Norse so far.
However, if your claims turn out to be correct and accurate for longer periods in the redux-SPC, I will do something about it, rest assured about that. Now, I have few ideas on how to counter this problem, if it really is a problem. But, until I get it verified that it really is I will leave things as they are for now. None the less, carry on and keep the good stuff coming! And do hold on to that candor!
(As stated earlier you clearly got new info here so my comments are a bit dated above.)
- Cheers
Axalon
Is there a reason why tradeships and trade galleys have identical stats but different costs? A number of factions have access to both - why ever build the more expensive?:inquisitive:
Glad to hear from you, Western! Now, your questions are both interesting and valid I think (you finding these things a bit odd it’s not that surprising to me, I would probably react in the same way).
First question; the reason for the ”trade galley” being a bit more expensive than the “tradeship” are based on the assumption that the slaves/prisoners required to operate it properly cost some as well. That kind of reasoning goes for all the galleys in redux. Hence it is a bit more costly to buy/build galleys (it is basically applied to support costs as well, hence tradegalleys are more expensive in every sense).
Second question; why on earth would I ever want to build something that I can get cheaper and still get the exact same quality anyways? Well, the short answer to that is; no you don’t, pure and simple. But the AI for some reason thinks its fun to do so, why? The most likely explanation for that is probably linked with the AI-build values in CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT and personally I think it adds little colour to the game. As in, all the ships on the stratmap are not the same kind everywhere, kind of thing. Now, before any hasty conclusions are made here, we need also to have a closer look on the answers to the next question.
Third question; why are the stats identical? The reason for that can be traced back to a flaw in the original MTW. I my experience, half of the boat stats are almost 100% cosmetic and have, with the exceptions of range and speed, no traceable effect in the game at all (for each shiptype at least, strength is similar to the “men”-value of tac-units. As in a value of “60” results in 60 men in that unit by default). Before I realized all that I did have an intricate system planned for all the ships in redux. However, when I finally found out, beyond any doubt, that the attack and defence values did not have any noticeable effect the game, what so ever, I decided to give them some “reasonable” standard values to camouflage the flaw in MTW (and redux along with it). This is hard coded stuff and I can’t do anything about it, if I could I would.
What I’m trying to say here is that you could have the value of “87” on defence and “24” on attack and it still would not matter in the game (if you or anybody else considers it worthwhile to prove me wrong, by all means do so. I would actually consider that a major breakthrough for the game and do something about it, that’s for sure). “Your supership” would most likely just get sunk anyways, sooner or later (and probably by a ship with the values of 2 or 4 or something). I tried stuff like that when still thought it there was any point in doing so, desperately trying to make the ships different from each other. As it is, the sad truth is that it does not matter, the only reason for buying a “royal warship” is that it cooler then the plain ”warship” and so on (not counting range differences here). Speed-values have a small impact on the game, but “Range” actually is the only value that really has a direct effect in redux and original MTW. Because of all this there really is no point in giving the various ships different values since they actually won’t matter much anyway. But for forget all that when your plying, because it would not be as much fun otherwise, would it?
The bottom line: when it comes to naval-power, the only thing that seems to count is quantity and “stars” basically all else have no or little effect in either redux or the original (sad but true, but it seems to be hard coded all of it).
Are there any other questions? (That offer is open to all by the way)
INTEL-REQUEST:
I am curious Western; how long have you progressed in turns with the Byz so far? How many provinces do you got? How does a typical “Western”-Byz army look like? What are you favourite units? Why? Which units do you especially hate to face etc. Why? Give me some redux-Intel here! That goes for you too von Manteuffel! That offer is also open to all by the way. Come on guys; don’t keep me in the dark here im curious! Hehe!
BUGHUNT: I you found something that you are anyway uncertain of, whether it “qualifies” or not, as a bug do post it here and I will see to it that it gets the proper treatment. If it is a valid bug (or error) I will “move it” to the “debug area” and announce the “kill”/credit confirmation. (However, if you do feel certain on your bug/error; proceed directly to the “debug area”. Oh yes, the debug thread is for MTW-VI/V.2.01 only. Any MTW-V1.1 errors and bugs; right here is the best place to post 'em.)
- Cheers
Hi Wes, all that stuff is well worth discussing further and I will gladly do so, but I would like to request that we put it on hold for a short while. I really need your Intel on the Byzantine tac-unit situation (especially) and such stuff (and I know that you played the Byz so you should have an opinion by now). It would sharpen my perspective so to speak, is this ok for you?
If it is; just type “got it” below here, and you can post your Intel later (but I would prefer sooner hehe! ). Cause I would like to handle all the stuff by you and the baron at full capacity. If its not type ; “no can do”…. (Have some mercy on me man, Hehe!)
Cheers Man
Over at the “debug area” Baron von Manteuffel wrote this:
“The Polish infantry could use a heavier spear unit to hold a battleline. Right now the best they have is a Basic Spearmen. Kind of strange they have Royal Knights but not Royal Spearmen, Royal Infantry, or Royal Guard. No Knights of Dobrzyn help either for poor Poland. Hungary is almost the same; they don't have any of the heavier Royal units, though they do have the Order of the Dragon.”
There are plenty of things here to comment on, I will start with the polish stuff and get back to the Byzantine things later (which is cut out for the moment). When I get some additional info from Western on the Byz I will return to your notes on that, because I want more info and a broader perspective on this before I give you my reply…. Ok, off to Poland then:
Redux & the Polish faction:
Now, what you are reacting to here is the fact that I regard the Poles as semi-external to the war-traditions that dominates western Europe by design, roughly speaking; knights, crossbows, Frankish- feudal- and royal- formations and smaller more specialized infantry units and such. On the other side we have what I categorize as “eastern”-war-traditions; horse archers, lighter cavalry, massed (often unspecialized) infantry, various types archer formations etc. (right or wrong, it does not matter much really, that’s the way I see it). I my mind and in my design Poland is caught in between of east and west, just as stated in the campaign intro-text: “the place where east meets west”.
The royal and feudal knights are an expression of that (western influence), just as the lack of most other feudal and royal units (Eastern influence). I must draw the line somewhere (because Poland can not have all tactical units, that would simply destroy designs for redux) and I have chosen to do it with the assumption that nobility is more inclined and receptive to be influenced by western traditions than the lower classes. Hence you got the knights and hence you got more “eastern”-oriented infantry.
In my effort to reflect that (my) view in redux I have obviously treated the poor Poles (and Hungary even more) differently than most other Catholic factions. Poland is more reliant on “eastern” and Slavic troops. The primary strengths of Poland the way I see it; is cavalry- and archer-formations. Infantry, although not that bad, is none the less a weaker area of her available tactical arsenal. Poland got light and basic spearmen, light and regular halberdiers (who are slightly better than the spear formations I think). There is also the solid Slavic Knight- and Infantry-formations who should be able to protect Poland fairly successful. Poland also got her two unique troops, don’t forget them.
It has never been my intension that the “tactical unit-profile” of Poland should be similar or resemble to the factions of western Catholic factions (as in Burgundy and France). It is very intentional that Poland greatly differs from all the other Catholic factions and that she relies much more on “Eastern” and Slavic-units. There is a designed and deliberate “cultural” difference applied here. We should not also forget that the opposition in the polish region is different then what is found in Frankish and Southern Europe (or at it least it should be, because I designed redux that way). And that is also reflected in the troops available to Poland.
Now, having said all this, there is another factor which you actually do have influenced me in. And I have actually considered this even before I got your post; this is the difficulty rating for Poland. Your input have further encouraged me to raising it to “Expert” instead of the current “Hard” level. The harsher economical framework in redux certainly does not make things easier for Poland. Making florins a steady concern for Poland and certainly more difficult to play. What are your views on this, now when you have more insight on my intensions for Poland? Would it not better reflect the challenges of a Polish campaign? At any rate, If this is done, it will be realized first with the release of the “formal” VI-upgrade pack. To me it seems that this would be in line with much of your presented critique regarding Poland, or what do you say good baron?
On a related note; I am also (and even more) considering to lower the difficulty rating on France to “Normal” since they usually do have florins to spare thus making things easier for them. The rich provinces in that area really show in the game, even if the crown is under “AI-management”.
Finally, regarding the Knights of Dobrzyn; I have put them in my “great ideas on stasis” box, because the idea is not bad, and I will of course credit you if I use it in the future.
- Cheers
Baron von Manteuffel
08-29-2008, 20:57
Hi, yes I agree with the expert difficulty rating. Florins are very hard to come by for the Poles and they are surrounded by very powerful enemies. I tried to hold coastal province Prussia for the development of shipping and trade, but while I was slowly building the Norsemen invaded. Timing is everything and unfortunately I didn't have enough units for the task. I've found with Redux the importance of having a large police army for a recently occupied province. Oh, I know historically the Polish and Hungarians (Szekely Cavalry) relied heavily on mounted archers, I just thought they could use a Slavic Armoured Spearmen or something like that. I've read the Templars where active in both countries as well. I'm sure I will enjoy what ever you come up with and I don't mean to sound to critical. As far as faction unique units, the French were famous for their heavy cavalry and Knights. How about giving them the Compagnies d’Ordonnance or some other heavy cavalry unit? The Portuguese: Knights of Aviz, The Aragonese: Knights of Calatrava, The Byzantines: Skutatoi, Kontaratoi, Menavlatoi - just some ideas. :idea2:
Axalon
OK, here's my feedback on the Byzantines.
My longest campaign was 70 years on expert, at the end of which I had the Balkans, Asia Minor and Italy and had wiped out the Hungarians and Italians. I had some truly epic battles against both those factions - big, tough, lots of variety in the troops but with the Italians in particular having a definitely different feel about their mainly infantry armies. Reminded me a bit of the feel of MedMod, the first great MTW Mod, where there was a real effort to give each faction a distinctive character.
I liked
- the look of all the troops. There's a weight and substance to the icons in review and a good match with the troops as they actually appear
- the balance. No troop type seemed too overwhelming. I was worried at first that archers were overpowered but that seemed to wear off. Factions didn't seem to spam all the same type of troops, or too low a level, and nor did rebels.
- the fact that ships were fairly few on the ground. Too many ships, with instantaneous movement, and any feel that you have to work to get from a to b, or that the world has any scale, goes out of the window. Those active rebels did a small sea invasion on me, which was novel. Otherwise it was land movement until I went into italy via the toe. The commonest ships were rebel ships
- regionalisation of troops, so that my troop options expanded with my empire
- good mix of mercs: very appropriate for the Byz
- stable balance of power. I killed 2 factions, rebels killed the Pope and someone else did in the Burgundians, but otherwise everyone was left at the end and all save Lithuanians were reasonably formidable powers.
- absence of bridge battles, which in my opinion are unrealistic, silly and too hard for the AI
- rebelliousness - not so high as to be silly, but it took time to stabilise new provinces, and depleting garrisons too far caught me a couple of times (since I don't check as a matter of realism)
- no uber generals. You seem to have somehow corrected the hard coded habit of the Byz spawning multi-star heirs. No idea how this has been achieved??
I would suggest
- money is still a bit too plentiful. That's what kills my interest, when I am struggling to spend my income each year once my empire has grown
- raise requirements (and upkeep) for Byz infantry and put in a militia unit between them and peasants.
- regionalise even more. I don't like being able to raise cataphracts and Byz lancers in Hungary and Wallachia. I should be having to recruit local auxiliaries or bring troops up from my home provinces.
- not sure why cataphract numbers are so small and lancer numbers so big.
- Byz lancers are probably my favourite unit. I like saracen mercs too and I'd like to see a buildable Byz unit that is basically a copy - heavy horse archers (actually the rear ranks of the line cavalry) are a Byz thing. Let's relegate the guys in shirts to being mercs and have some buildable mailed horse archers.
- I could do with less starting variety of light cavalry. I've got peasant cavalry, light cavalry, horse archers and scouts. Byz werent known for light cavalry. I would cut down to one or two and give Byz an incentive to go looking for some regionals instead.
I didn't see anything that would qualify as a bug - this is a real quality piece of work.
Hope that is the kind of thing you were looking for.
Hi again guys,
many thanks to the both of you, for the praise, additional comments and Intel. Now as promised earlier I will now give some further comments on the Byzantines. Over at the debug area Baron von Manteuffel wrote:
“The Byzantines, or Eastern Roman Empire, to me look to weak in their infantry units. They have the usual nice assortment of missile units and great looking cavalry but where's the infantry? The Palace Guard (Are they the Varangian Guard?) can only be recruited in Constantinople which really hurts, and then they have Light Spearmen, Byzantine and Armenian infantry. As you can probably tell I favor the spear units especially early in a campaign. The reason being that they're a fairly cheap unit to recruit, usually a large unit, and a defensive unit you need to hold what little you have at the start of a campaign. After I establish a trade network and can afford to do so, I will recruit elite units and have more of a balanced army.”
And below are my remarks and additional commentary.
Redux & the Byzantine faction:
If I understand you correctly you have “objections” against the fact that the Byzantines have a limited infantry arsenal available, and as you might already suspect this not a coincidence. I have designed it that way because I was interested in forcing the Byzantines to recruit auxiliary infantry formations as the game progresses. I had yet again to draw the line somewhere and it ended up the way it did. The Byzantines has a small core of solid and reliable formations of tac-units and the main problem, the way I see it, should be recruit- and support-costs, thus forcing the player to more actively have to restructure existing skeleton tactical resources and merge them to new operating formations (thus creating veteran formations).
The requirements for commissioning new Byzantine infantry formations are fairly easy, and this is intentional (this is of course linked to the tech-tree) because the main problem is designed to be the costs involved instead. I want the Byzantine armies to have a core of massive and unique formations and I want a Byzantine battle to be distinct and characterized by this core of massive infantry and cavalry formations looking mighty and disheartening to the enemy. It should have an “imperial” feel to it, so to speak. A Byzantine army of 6 full infantry and 2 cavalry formations should really have an “army” feel to it in a way that Catholic factions would have a hard time to compete with (still possible although, with the royal formations of course).
Since the Byzantines or any other faction (HRE is close however), can’t have it all in tactical resources the lines have to be drawn somewhere. I have designed it so that the Byzantines have three core units to build there armies upon: Byzantine- infantry, cavalry and lancers. Everything else is, to me at least, basically additional and auxiliary troops, regardless of what it may be (including the light spearmen. He he!).
Regarding the Byzantine palace guard then; no it’s not the Varangian guard it’s rather reduxes substitute for ‘em. They are indented to function as elite/veteran auxiliary units to support the regular infantry. These guys are good and can usually deal effectively with most things they encounter in battle. The reason for them being only available in Constantinople is based on the assumption that there the imperial palace is located; if that gets overrun, then the option of recruiting these guys won’t be available any more.
The “real” Varangian guard is supposed to be Norse mercenaries, and if my design works correctly, they should be available as mercenaries in Constantinople. Those boys could really be good “crack-troops” if properly supported.
Additional comments: (including Westerns Byzantine-Intel now)
Having reviewed the material Western posted in it is clear to me that I agree with much of it. It is also clear that the both of you are pretty keen on introducing new units to redux, and that’s fine and ok. But to put it frankly for you guys, I’m more interested in making the already existing units in redux work properly before even considering any such things myself. The door is wide open for the both of you to add and tinker with that as much as you like, privately or publicly. Now, von Manteuffel; it sounds to me that you should consider to do an “order expansion” for redux yourself since you clearly know more about that than I do anyway. And Western as far I can tell you have already two copies of redux one “vanilla” and “Western deluxe” and you are already doing some major alterations and custom stuff with redux as well. Great! Redux is supposed to be a platform for customizing your own personal game. But I would appreciate if you guys could help me out in securing a good “formal” VI-upgrade for redux first, if its ok for you guys? Since it is blatantly clear to me, no matter how much experience I have on redux and MTW, It is always a good thing to have some extra pair of eyes.
Basically what I am trying to say is that, I need your help, eyes and opinions to secure a good and sharp perspective on redux, which all leads to improving my chances to ensure a good quality on the VI-upgrade and the redux version itself. I might not always agree with your opinions, but I always appreciate your input because it helps me to keep my own perspectives on redux sharp. And there is also an ever standing possibility that I might miss something and your eyes and Intel is then the last line of defence I got in preventing such stuff to happen.
Now, having said all that I do agree with you western that some additional regionalizing could be a good thing for the Byzantines (sorry Manteuffel hehe!) and I will look in to it. It should not be too hard since it is really just 3-4 tac-units were talking about here anyways. If none of you guys have some “super ironclad” arguments for the restrictions of the Byzantine Infantry I already decided that they shall remain unchanged. That leaves the cataphracts, lancers and cavalry formations which are all currently unrestricted. That is all about to change somehow, the question is how? Now the cavalry is fairly hard to get due to the tech-tree the same is almost true for the lancers. Even if they currently are unrestricted it is not that easy to recruit them everywhere, the province must be developed as well. The cataphracts then? These are probably easier to get hold of then the other two, thus applying some restrictions are even more interesting here. Your views on this matter would be much appreciated, if nothing else to keep my perspective sharp at least. Frankly, I have not decided yet as I write this. This is one thing you guys could really influence me in.
Concerning the size of cataphracts then, the main three reasons for having them as they currently are; are cost, balance and the notion that they should be rare and few in numbers. Technically I could double their size to 20 and the over all effects would probably be rather smallish on redux-SPC. However, in doing so the cost for such a formation would be 500 florins which usually are very much when playing in solo battles or redux-MP. How about it guys? What are your views on that? Would that be a good thing? Would it serve the Byzantine faction? Don’t forget that there is a support costs involved here and that all Heirs will have these formations.
To the issue of support costs then, westerns Intel regarding the Byzantines clearly shows that my design has failed so far and that this needs some further adjustments. Currently it is cavalry 100fl./lancers 75fl./infantry 50fl. obviously it needs to be higher to some extent. I will look in to it. Concerning the light cavalry stuff for the Byzantines, they are all auxiliary troops as far as I am concerned. To me it is “the big three” that counts along with the Byzantine archers and cataphracts. Regarding the haltering of “super generals” Western, I have no idea what I did (if I did, I can’t remember, I have been working on redux for a long time). It’s probably just luck I guess hehe!
Some other unrelated remarks:
Now, if I remember everything correctly we have together played thru all the 8 factions and there have not been any obvious bugs on any of them so far, which of course is a great thing. But this also means that we probably can concentrate more on other things and that we also are one step closer to the formal release.
One thing is certain, and this is partly because of your input guys, I have decided to put in 12 additional slots in the CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT thus making more room for you guys to put in what ever troops you want when the formal upgrade pack is finally released. Thus there will be 24 instead of the current 12 available slots (I do know that there is a max limit of 256, but I prefer units that actually make a difference and not just adding quantity to the game). As far as I can tell there is no need to expand the CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT so far and frankly I am bit concerned about making it to big anyways. Because I get the feeling that the game-program is not that happy about any such prospect (however I have no solid facts here). VI’s capacities for tinkering are at any rate far more greater than there ever was in V.1.1 which means that it is probably just as well to add some extra vacant slots for tac-units.
Another thing I have been considering is campaign start capital. Currently it corresponds to the original MTW but I am more and more convinced that this deserves some adjustments as well. In my book, an expert level on campaign is supposed to be expert and not the default setting for any meaningful play. Thus I am inclined to do some alterations for redux. How does this sound?
Alternative 1
--------------
Easy........8000fl.
Normal.....4000
Hard........2000
Expert.....1000
- Quite a challenge for the first 20-25 turns on expert I guess, as it should be. Imagine playing Poland or Spain now, Hell I’m interested!
or....
Alternative 2
--------------
Easy........5000fl.
Normal.....4000
Hard........3000
Expert......2000
- Still quite difficult for the first 20-25 turns I guess, expert is supposed to mean expert at least as far as I’m concerned.
Well guys what do you think?
Western I will get to your posted material as soon as we get the above sorted. For now I will start investigating your potential bug.
The OPTIONAL MISSION/experiment “1A” :
Oh yes! I got an optional mission for you guys: fire up the ol’ GnomeEditor and open up “CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT” and go to row:41-43/column:36 and set the ” ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD” to 10000. Do a least 5 battles against the English with whatever faction you want. The English must have at least 2 Longbowmen formations and the battle should be in open terrain. Then report back to me with your findings. Good luck!
- Cheers guys
Axalon
Couple of quick points in response, since I am on line.
Very happy to keep trying things out on "redux pure". Just keep telling me what would help, and I will get around to it.
I understand all your logic round the Byz - except the low build requirements for their infantry. It meant I could keep instantly spamming them out any time I took a province, however unByzantine its character.
Now I have a hangup about realism, and here it seems to me realism and gameplay go together. Shouldn't I have to socialise the province a bit, and put in a bit of infastructure, before they will line up to wear my uniform? I reckon the Byz never got any decent infantry out of Italy even though they ruled in the south for hundreds of years.
My point about adding a weak militia (which doesn't have to be a new unit - the Catholics have one already that could be cloned) is that you have nicely simulated the feel of a Byzantine field army. But those guys didn't garrison cities - and sometimes, even in the field, they had to be bulked out with quickly raised levies who could just hold a spear and stand in place.
My field regiments should be precious rather than spam, so my suggestion is to make them quite a bit more expensive and give me townsmen to do the spam jobs (but so poor that they are not good for much).
I offer this as a suggestion for the greater good of Redux (and because I like a bit of debate). Ultimately you have made it possible for us all make our own adjustments, so we don't have to fall out!:laugh4:
Regarding cataphracts, I would double size and restrict where they can be built. Historically their breeding grounds were Anatolia and Rum and they went extinct after the Turks took these, the last remnants having to be consolidated in one super regiment, a bit like Napoleon's cavalry officers on the retreat from Moscow.
I'm still seeing my "bug" by the way - rebel monoculture followed, eventually, by diversity. It's not a major problem, because it's possible to tweak what the monoculture will be, but it's certainly curious.
Baron von Manteuffel
08-31-2008, 01:36
Hi, I think I understand your intent now with the Byzantines and that's cool. I'm up for the experiment 1A. I'll try that this evening. Don't know if it is by design or not but there are two factions that start with the default 2000 florins. One is the Burgundians and the other, I'm not sure. Maybe the Lithuanians? ~:)
**** Manteuffel! You are absolutely right!
I had forgotten to fill in the “coffers” of both Lithuania and Burgundy in the “startpos”! I my book that at least an error! There you go again Manteuffel, you are good hunter no doubt about that! EDIT: I had also overlooked Russia.
On a different note, I’m really interested in your coming results from experiment “1a”. If it works the way I hope it will, then ….!!!.... That would be drop-dead cool!
Once again, good luck!
Cheers man.
Err, the download link on the first page for the RAR-ed version isn't working. The one linking to filefront.
Just thought I'd share that with you.
Thanks Raz, I’m on it….
EDIT: All the links are operational again.
Baron von Manteuffel
08-31-2008, 16:38
Okay, I played around with the engagement threshold increasing the value from 1500 to 10000, as you requested. I used the Agincourt battlefield and made sure it was a fine day. Tested the French with 3 Frankish Spearmen, 2 Regular Infantry, 2 Frankish Crossbowmen, and 1 Royal Knight unit against the English with 3 English Spearmen, 2 Regular Infantry, 1 Longbowmen, 1 Feudal Longbowmen, and 1 English Foresters unit. I tested this same scenario 8 times and the results were: I believe the missle fire was more deadly, but I wouldn't go as far to say 'beyond a shadow of a doubt'. At first I tried so hard to find a discernable difference that I increased the value to 100000 with the idea of making it obvious, but I couldn't see a difference. I don't know if the game can recognize a value that high anyway so I went the down to 1000. Again, no discernable difference. What was obvious was that the English always chose the Longbowmen unit as their General unit. I made the French attack them with a simple frontal assault every time without flanking maneuvers or anything fancy. 50% of the time the English met them head on with their infantry up front and bowmen in the rear, and 50% of the time their infantry went way over to their right and paraded around while I went for their general unit. Wierd??? Reguarding the engagement threshold, I thought the value indicated when one infantry unit engages with another in hand to hand combat, the collision mass of the men at the point or threshold of the engagement. Not really sure how that would affect a missle unit, but it did appear the missle fire was more accurate and deadly at the value of 10000. Hope this helps. :happybirthday3: to me :birthday2:
Axalon
I'd echo the Baron's comments. I expected something dramatic and didn't see it. Playing with a classic French line-up, a couple of times I manoeuvred my cavalry so I didn't get shredded, got in among the bows and beat them. More often, if I played it straight and just marched straight into the arrows, I'd get decimated before contact - but that seems normal.
hi
About lak of time on work i stil did nt play this mod but, will do soon mate :embarassed:
I (and all my little ”rev-pics”) wish you a happy birthday good baron! Congrats! :) ....I don't know how to do those **** smileys. He he!
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Hi Axel, there you are!
I was wundering were you might have wanderered off too! Anyways, welcome back here and I hope you will have lots of fun with redux when you get the chance to play it!
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THE OPTIONAL MISSION DEBRIEF:
Now, what I was interested in finding out in this experiment was: if the 10000 value somehow would make an impact on how the English longbow units behaved. My hope was that they would fire away much sooner than the usual standard range. Both of your reports does not clearly indicate that this is the case so I would think that this experiment is, if not a failiure, at least disappointing so far. If it had worked it would have changed the entire game completely. Ahh well, you win some, you lose some. At any rate, thanks guys for reporting in and doing this thing for me. If you guys got any other stuff or replies on stated questions etc., you know by now were to post ‘em. I’m off to continue my investigation with Wes strange anomaly.
Cheers guys!
Baron von Manteuffel
08-31-2008, 23:39
I (and all my little ”rev-pics”) wish you a happy birthday good baron! Congrats! :) ....I don't know how to do those **** smileys. He he!
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Hi Axel, there you are!
I was wundering were you might have wanderered off too! Anyways, welcome back here and I hope you will have lots of fun with redux when you get the chance to play it!
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THE OPTIONAL MISSION DEBRIEF:
Now, what I was interested in finding out in this experiment was: if the 10000 value somehow would make an impact on how the English longbow units behaved. My hope was that they would fire away much sooner than the usual standard range. Both of your reports does not clearly indicate that this is the case so I would think that this experiment is, if not a failiure, at least disappointing so far. If it had worked it would have changed the entire game completely. Ahh well, you win some, you lose some. At any rate, thanks guys for reporting in and doing this thing for me. If you guys got any other stuff or replies on stated questions etc., you know by now were to post ‘em. I’m off to continue my investigation with Wes strange anomaly.
Cheers guys!
Well, now I know what you were looking for and yes, it is dissappointing. :wall:
Ok, I've only just recently been able to download and install Redux (as well as the patches for the VI version). Anyway, I only had time to mess about in the campaign, from what little I saw I found it to be terrific. The campaign map and the completely new unit rosters are quite interesting. :2thumbsup:
One thing though, I thought I'd take the time to look through all the units, I typed in badgerbunny, and out popped: The Wrath of God, Death for Hire, Mr Warhammer, Mystic Knight and a few others who's names escape me. I found their description hilarious! I won't be using them of course, but I can see I'll be enjoying Redux for a while to come. :grin:
Haha, a beautiful maiden dancing naked around a sacred stone at midnight. Classic. :wink2:
...Guilty as charged, Raz! :smile: (Thanks for the praise by the way)
I simply could not resist the temptation of putting in some fun and stupid stuff in redux. I was actually wondering when this might come up. I always knew that it would happen sooner or later and it turned out to be you who first posted it in. As for "the magic units", here is the “highly classified” truth of behind them:
Mr Warhammer: is a reference to a really old cover for the Warhammer RPG.
Mystic Knight: is a reference to the old Amiga game “Moonstone” and so is the naked maidens as well (however, (sadly) they were not completely naked in that game of course).
Death for Hire: is a redux original and is basically reduxes own superman gone bad, whose sole mission is to destroy all game balance what so ever.
The Wrath of God: is a monster formation of royal knights which should have no equal in the game and these guys are having a morale bonus of +99, so they won’t break easily. It’s basically a Monty Python kind of thing (the Holy Grail, if you or anybody else remembers that film)
I can’t remember if I put in more obviously stupid and silly troops in there, but I don’t think so. All of these “spaced out” units have of course ridiculous stats and should not be regarded seriously in any way. They are there because I always felt that most real games always have some fun and stupid stuff hidden within them. In MTW however there never was (if there are, I've missed it), so I decided to remedy that once and for all in redux (the cheaters must have their fun as well). Publicly, I will of course deny all of this; “wrath of what???!! Really….”
- Cheers
Baron von Manteuffel
09-05-2008, 03:28
Has anyone successfully recruited a Norse Mercenary unit in their Byzantine campaign? I believe they're supposed to randomly appear in Constantinople, but I never see them. :shrug:
Hi good baron, (The “clone-bug” has had my attention for a few days now)
Regarding the Norse Mercenary unit then; well I got them at least (Byzantines, turn 729). Technically they are available in Constantinople; I know that you can read a GnomeEditor just as well as I can. Have you played the Byzantines for a longer period (or have you captured Constantinople) and the Norse mercenaries have still not showed up? The safest way to attract them to Constantinople is to build a lot of high-end Taverns, Brothels and Merchant Buildings along with an Inn of course (since all of these helps to attract mercenaries in redux).
The buildings that have an opposite impact on mercenaries are Admiralty, Chancellery, Marshals-, Captains-, Champions-, Constables-, Order- and Royal Palace and also the military academy has a particularly big negative impact. Castle-size can also have an impact on mercenaries. All the exact stats are in the “CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT”. Perhaps you just have too much of those negative-impact buildings in Constantinople? (Perhaps I might need to do some further adjustments on those values for the coming “official” upgrade-pack).
I repeat von Manteuffels question: has anyone else had any luck on hiring them?
- Cheers
Moving on then….
Now, “for the greater good of redux” (which has a nice and deliciously dubious ring to it) I never had the proper chance to respond to Westerns comments on the Byzantines in post: 59 and the various issues regarding them so I do that now....
Byzantium Alterations : (last chance to influence me guys)
These are the plans I made for the Byzantines so far. This is in many ways influenced by the input and Intel posted in from both of you Western and von Manteuffel, regarding the Byzantines. Which have turned out to be a bit semi-problematic faction to deal with…. - Wes and Baron now is the time to speak up, before I carve this in stone. The changes then:
Campaign Difficulty level: upgrade to “Hard” (currently “Normal”)
---------------------------------------------------------------
Byzantine Infantry: (all regions)
New unit: 1050fl. (Including the faction discount bonus. Same tech requirements)
Support/turn: 100
Other: +1 Morale
The Byzantines must have some good unit available regardless wherever they might be. Otherwise they would be too unbalanced compared to other factions. If the Byzantines can pay, they can have ‘em! Having a few of these running around should really make an impact on the coffers (it is at least supposed to do so).
---
Byzantine Lancers: (all regions)
New unit: 1350fl. (Including the faction discount bonus.)
Support/turn:150
Other: +1 Morale
Recruiting these guys is hard enough as is. Regionizing them will unbalance the Byzantines compared to Catholic/other factions.
---
Byzantine Cavalry: (regionized to: Greece, Bulgaria, Constantinople, Nicaea, Trebizond, Anatolia, and Rum, Georgia)
New unit: 1800fl. (Including the faction discount bonus)
Support/turn: 200
Other: -
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Byzantine Cataphracts: (regionized to: Greece, Bulgaria, Constantinople, Nicaea, Trebizond, Anatolia, and Rum, Georgia)
New unit: 260fl. (Including the faction discount bonus. 10 men)
Support/turn: 25
Other: +1 Attack
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“New” Light Militia: (all regions)
New unit: 100fl. (40men)
Support/turn: 5
Other: -
I hope this little addition will end up being a good thing. Wes I would be particularly interested in Intel regarding these guys if you find anything worth while to report in (that goes for you as well Baron)…. And, yes these guys really are worthless soldiers.
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Optional Mission/Experiment: 2A”
Manteuffel and Western, since I already know that you guys have the know-how to do this without any problems this optional mission is especially for you guys (its nothing fancy but I don’t want to write any guides for it). Download and install the files below and put them where they belong in your redux. Don’t forget to backup your regular CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT-file! Play as Byzantines on expert (with the experimental files, campaign experiment 2a) for 20-25 turns, do it at least twice (I guess you could do it all in 1-2hrs). Report back here with your findings and impressions of such circumstances. Please play it to 100% of your abilities! Fast responses are preferred, as usual, and good luck!
I will remove the link and “destroy” the files within 48hrs since this is not supposed to be a standing gig possibly even sooner if both of you guys have successfully reported in before that. EDIT: I have removed the experimental stuff now....
(Anybody else is of course welcome to participate in this little mission/experiment as well but, I will not offer any support what so ever for it, none at all. So, if you are in any way uncertain of how to do this, don’t do it! For your own sake….)
Link to “Experiment 2A-files”:
That link self-destructed about 15 seconds ago…. :mickey:
Cheers guys
Baron von Manteuffel
09-07-2008, 07:20
Hi, I'm a slow builder and so I played for 48 turns. Usually I play on the normal level, but on the expert level I really didn't notice a huge difference except for the starting florins. The militia unit would be a nice cheap unit if you needed it, I guess, but I never recruited any. I go for quality over quantity. I dissagree with the Campaign Difficulty level: "hard" as I found it fairly "Normal". I had a lot of mercenaries I could recruit if I had wanted to in Constantinople, unfortunately never a Norse Mercenary :shrug:. Anyway, overall it is a fun campaign. My opinion of mods in general is that "fun should always outweigh realism". I believe you've already stated that this mod was something you put together the way you like it, and that you weren't really striving for realism. I feel you should stay on that path. An occaisional unit update :eyebrows: or whatever you see fit would be cool. Thank you for sharing this mod with the public. :2thumbsup:
OK Axalon. Because I'm an early riser, here's my feedback from 2 games as the Byz on expert using the experimental files (1 for 30 turns, the second for 25).
First, everything stable as always.
Changes slow down expansion, but not dramatically. First time I went by land and had all of Asia Minor, the Balkans (less Croatia) and Moldavia by the end, with a healthy income surplus rolling in. Second time I started with the islands and by the end had Crete, Rhodes, Cyprus, Asia Minor and Bulg.
What the changes do is drive me towards a much greater reliance on mercs and peasants (as garrisons). The first is good. Don't like the second though - peasants are an ahistorical MTW invented unit. I'd prefer that they were not available to recruit and I had to rely on militia garrisons. But that may be too big a change for others.
As the game played on - and I started to come up against factions and I had more money, I would have been using my core Byz troops more to give some backbone to my armies - but always very aware of the cost (with upkeep more significant than purchase price).
So I think the changes are good - but militia are a bit irrelevant as long as I can spam out 100 peasants at need.
By the way, I was on constant lookout for Mercs and - to answer an earlier question - the Norse mercs never showed in Const.
Ok guys, (again thanks for the praise Manteuffel, it always feels good to be appreciated for what you do)
Many thanks for the fast replies; it makes things easier for me to work faster. Now neither of your “reports” indicated that you had any significant problems playing with these settings. Hence I am inclined to rule to Manteuffels favour, as in the “Normal” campaign difficulty level stays. Wes, you said yourself that you had florins to spare in spite of these settings and that have convinced me that a change to “Hard” campaign difficulty is not justified.
Western your point regarding the peasants is duly noted and the peasant availability goes out the window (just like the Moors, cause they don’t have any peasants available either. In that way I can force the AI to build some more serious units instead). I will lock them out for the Byzantines (I never liked the peasants anyway, he he!). The Cataphracts stay on 10 men since with these newer settings the Byzantines must have some option of raising “tac”-units that don’t cost a small fortune. Basically it’s a balance thing and it’s more or less about to be carved in stone already. It’s good to know that you finally started to be more sensitive to support costs while playing as the Byzantines, because this was the basic plan from day 1. Compared to other factions Byzantine support costs are now in a league of their own, but since I wanted a different feeling and experience while playing as the Byzantines I am willing to accept that. I have always felt that in almost all other cases that support cost is not, and should not be, the big issue. Initial training and equipment are supposed to be that.
Anyways, I think that redux is finally getting close with the Byzantines regarding my different take on them. Playing different factions should preferably offer a different experiences, not just in the obvious way of another strategically different starting positions and the various special units (which is great), but I prefer it also on a deeper level as well and especially if different cultures are involved. If that don’t happen I personally feel that the reasons to have another faction available for the player are limited.
Regarding the Norse mercenaries:
-------------------------------
Now, back to our dear little mead drinking Norse mercenaries again; it appears to me that I need to recalibrate the “mercenary magnetism”-values to sort things out properly. I will do so, if not sooner, at least to the release of the “official” VI-upgrade. It should not be half-impossible to recruit these guys otherwise the whole god **** point is lost by having them available in Constantinople. So, I will look this over again.
MISSION DEBRIEFING: case “2a”
-------------------------------
It seems that “experiment 2a” fared better than the last one. Due to your fast responses I can get things done faster and for that I am grateful to you guys. Again that also includes your willingness to help me out and keep my perspectives strait and sharp, which is always a good thing. Again, many thanks for your (fast) help and useful Intel!
- Cheers
-----------
(BTW: Wes, you graciously put your earlier stuff on hold for me. Now, if there still is anything of that stuff you still want me to comment on (in case of I might have forgotten something) please give me a reminder me by posting them in again. /cheers)
Over at the debug area Baron von Manteuffel wrote this:
“Hi, As far as the Lombards [go], I thought that may have been an oversight. I gave them the building. :shame: Apparently they're just for custom battles??? The Hospitallers weren't founded untill the First Crusade in 1099, but if the Venetians have access to them in 700 AD, you may as well give them to the Lombards as a prelude to the Genoese having them. :smile: Favorite faction, all :laugh4:. No, probably England for the Longbows, and it's an easy home base to defend. I like France for all the heavy royal units and Templars. I've tried all except: the Saracens, Russians, Portuguese, Papacy, and Lithuanians..."
Ok ok, I will unlock the building (order palace) for the Lombard’s since your argument is as good as any. It will be done with the release of the “official” upgrade-pack. By the way I have recently discovered that the Russian faction seems to run without any problems in the VI-version of redux so I am seriously considering to make them available as a playable faction as special feature for those who are running redux on VI/2.01. (making them playable was my original plan from day1). Redux on MTW V.1.1 already has some unique features so it is only fair that the VI/2.01 will get some as well.
GOOD NEWS!
I have set a formal deadline for the release of the official redux VI-upgrade 1.0. It’s October 1st, possibly even sooner but it is my goal to have it out no later then that. When it is released, all bugs and errors so far will have been fixed with it (as far as it is possible, the clone-bug is the special exception since it is most likely hardcoded and thus I can’t do anything about it). Which means that all fixes for VI/2.01 will become obsolete and I will probably remove them from filefront after the release of VI-upgrade 1.0.
While looking into the future, after the VI-release I will probably put together the first patch for redux. Mainly making the MTW V.1.1 version of redux to catch up with most of the changes already done or on their way for the VI/2.01-version and incorporate the various fixes already charted for that version. Thus even stuff out between the versions for V1.1. and VI/2.01. After all it is supposed to be the same game/mod (almost at least). Maybe I will put in some additional “quick battles” and maybe some other things as well, we’ll see. I guess that this will happen a few weeks after the release of VI-upgrade 1.0.
- Cheers
Hi Axalon
Wow, what an amazing effort you have gone to! The images look great.
I've been trying to get the Moor campaign to work, but with no success, even using the moorish opening, reducing all taxes, etc. Maybe I just have to keep trying. Since you hinted the problem might be to do with too many rebellions at once, why not just reduce the number of their starting provinces?
I just have a few suggestions to make also - take them or leave them, no worries, and I do know you've gone for fun over realism. But having looked at the troop types available with badgerbunny... all the Islamic troops look completely generic. Would I be wrong in thinking that most of your effort has gone into the European (esp Norse) aspects? I think you've missed some great potential for rich and interesting troop choices by going with a plain "Moorish/Saracen x", "Desert x", etc.
For example: you could have had a range of Berber soldiers (light cavalry, javelins, etc); saqaliba regiments (the armies made up of imported slavic slaves); various arab infantry and cavalry units. Then you could have made it really, really interesting with Murabitin elites - a range of javelin infantry, camels, and shock infantry - famous for charging into battle with their faces veiled and with terrifying drum beats. They used flags and drums to transmit orders in battle as well, making them far more disciplined than the other military forces in Spain. They would be regionized to the desert provinces. That would be much more interesting than the silly "ghazi" idea of the MTW creators.
Anyway, just a few thoughts. I look forward to the updated version and the Moors bugs being fixed up. Congratulations on your great effort!
Zasz1234
09-15-2008, 21:24
Axalon,
Kudos! This mod is fantastic and singularly responsible for putting MTW back on my pc. I love the feel of it. The units act like the their names imply and I really feel like a king raising troops. This is especially true for my French campaign. It is hard, but I am loving the fight. Great job and keep up the good work!
Zasz
Hello there Zasz and Qurtubi,
Welcome to the redux corner of MTW and I’m glad to hear that you guys like the redux stuff and I do appreciate that both of you considered it worthwhile to post it in (it got me smiling guys).
Zasz:"The units act like the their names imply and I really feel like a king raising troops." :grin: Yep Zasz, thats basically the plan here, and you feeling like a king is a plus! He he! Do stick around here and post in additional questions and comments if you have any. Happy fighting!
Qurtubi: you have trouble with your Moorish campaign, let’s see if we can’t get things going here! I take it that you have redux running on a MTW v1.1 because the Moorish problems are none existent on the VI-beta (as far as I know). The Moors seem to be a reappearing problem in v.1.1 and that is really bad, and of course it is not supposed to be anything like that. The “Moorish opening” should work out for you and it is really strange that it seems not to (maybe close variants will work, some extra unit here and there). Give it a few more tries and if it still don’t work for after a total of ten tries then my guess is that it wont work at all for you (if so, that would really be strange because it is supposed to work and I have even had it verified that it does work).
However, there is no reason to give up even if that should be the case, I still can offer you one other foolproof solution to get things going. As usual it isn’t pretty, but it works and that’s what we are interested in, right? Download the saved game below and you should be able to take it from there. I have just done a variant of the “Moorish opening” in it and I have not built or commissioned any troops in it, except of 1 slave Militia unit in Granada, basically it’s blank but it starts at turn 701. It’s set on expert level. If you want still want to try and do an opening of your own you could always copy the moves I have done in this save, that should also do the trick.
Download “Moorish Save”:
Removed
Additional comments for Qurtubi:
----------------------------------
I also got some additinal comments here on your ideas and it ended up being a lot of text. I hope you have the stamina go thru it all (sorry, but I am trying to give you some good answers here). But first of all; let me say that it is always interesting to hear other people’s ideas and views on redux, and yours is no exception....
Now, as I already said to Baron von Manteuffel, for the time being I’m not that interested in putting in some new additional troops in redux (of any kind, short of snarling dragons and sexy amazons, becuse that would be really fun) and all your pointers here are fine and ok. To me it sounds like you should do the “Islamic troop expansion” for redux since you clearly know more about that stuff then I do anyhow so why don’t you? I am all for it and this is my little counter-suggestion to your suggestion he he! My guess is that there is always someone out there that shares your particular interest in Islamic troops and also plays redux. You got 12 available and vacant slots for tactical units just waiting to be filled with whatever content you so fit, so that sounds to me like a good place to start (if you don’t know how to, there are plenty of guides on the subject right here at here at the .Org). Use the design of redux!
I have already paved the way and made room for you and everybody else to make it easier to put in your/their favourite special units in there! Because I know that even if I had managed to put all those units that you particularly like there would always be someone else with other preferences and thus wanted me to put in some other special units instead. And redux (and original MTW as well for that matter) can only hold so much troops, and as always, the lines have to be drawn somewhere. It is because of all that I have intentionally designed redux to be more flexible and fairly adaptable in order to better comply with each personal preference (as in, among other things, having 12 vacant unit slots available for you and everybody else). Because that is the only solution that makes everybody happy and I have recognized that fact in my design.
“...why not just reduce the number of their starting provinces?“
This is just an excellent idea and I will probably just do that in the future on the v.1.1 version of redux. I have been so busy working on VI-things that I so far have not had the time to think about these things. With your little idea here I might not have to think much about it either (at least on that matter, which would be real nice!). I guess that MALTA is the most likely and first target for such a move. It is a simple, yet very good idea, and it has gone straight to the “to do” list!
“Would I be wrong in thinking that most of your effort has gone into the European (esp Norse) aspects?“
Well, a little bit of both I guess; half-right or half-wrong, pic one.... He he! There is some substance in your assumption however, because most work has been directed towards the Catholic factions in redux. Personally I don’t find this to be that surprising either. After all, most factions in redux are Catholic (14 out of 18 to be exact) so focusing on them seemed to be the natural move for me (the circumstances are similar in the original as you well know).
Regarding the Norse interest then; as far as tech-tree goes, yes I have given the Norse and Lithuanians some special interest because I deemed the “pagan”-culture to be badly neglected in the original games (both in VI and MTW). I always wanted the pagan culture to be far more than it ever was (and can be with the existing elements) in the original game and with the redux design I dare to say that I have changed all that. To me, paganism is an enormous concept that is far too diverse and interesting to be so blatantly ignored the way it was in the original games. Actually it’s too big of a concept to be healthy for it self, but all that is another story for another place. In redux I have tried to restrict it to the Norse and Lithuanian mythology and all research I did has been limited to that basically. This of course is just puny parts of the concept of paganism but the lines have to be drawn somewhere.
Since I am a Norseman myself, Vikings is close to home and I thought that they deserved a better treatment then they have had before in MTW. As far as Norse units go; no I can’t say that I given the Norse a special attention or treatment. They have the similar design guidelines as any other faction. The only thing I have done on them was to emphasize their characteristics for which they are world-famous for. No fear of death, berserkers, excellent fighters and seafarers and that sort of thing. I have reflected some of these “Norse” traits in the redux design because I think it would be cool and at the same time offer some diversity to the game. In a practical and technical sense this means that they have a semi-ridiculous moral bonuses and have access to first class, but numerically limited, infantry formations and at the same time their cavalry is cut down to measly 4 units and so on. As with all factions in redux, I have tried to create different profiles on each faction that at the same time felt right for me. And this is especially true if different cultures are involved. The culture in the Apennine peninsula is different than the one found in Frankish Western Europe or the Iberian Peninsula and so on. Even if all are essentially Catholic areas (again, yes there are exceptions). And this is to some extent reflected in the redux design, as in different troops and tech-trees, being many times regionized or restricted to special factions etc.
“I think you've missed some great potential for rich and interesting troop choices by going with a plain "Moorish/Saracen x", "Desert x", etc. “
Yeah, you might be right. However, if you look closely this don’t differ much from any other of the factions. Most factions are built up upon such symbolic categorizations and standards. The Islamic factions, to my mind, are not in anyway that different from other factions as far as name construction goes; Slavic Warriors, Slavic Bowmen and Slavic Knights? Or how about Frankish Spearmen, Frankish Infantry and Frankish Knights? To me it sounds like they follow the similar guidelines as Moorish Raiders, Moorish Warriors or Moorish Bodyguards? Or is it just me?
Yes, it might sound generic to someone that has particular knowledge or interest of let’s say Spanish Conquistadors and the “Reconquista” or anything else, but it works and it does comply with the fact that the room for units in MTW are limited. In order to create a workable and meaningful tactical profile for each faction in the game (because I personally value that higher than sheer quantity of available troops) I simply can’t just focus on one particular culture and related factions. This is one of the “hard” practical reasons for this reality.
Other practical reasons are the raw and time-consuming GFX-work involved for each unit, which for me at least must have a satisfactory standard compared with other material in the game; it must blend in and go together. After that there is the pure unit-design part of stats and how the unit functions and works compared to other troops and of course the dreary practical coding of the unit in question etc. 1 unit, no problem, 10 units, problems dead ahead basically, 100 units just your average nightmare. I have done some 200+ of these (and discarded plenty of them for various reasons), so I do have some experience of what I am talking about here. Maybe I’m just lazy, but after a while (umm let’s say 40 unit rev-pics/40 unit icons/40 info-bifs speaking from a strictly GFX view here) the fun of doing them have kind of disappeared (at least for me)....
There are other more “softer” reasons as well, by using symbolic names the game avoids to get entangled in special terms like “Khataphraktoi” or anything like that (which by the way is just begging to be spelled wrong). All these symbolic classifications work and are easy to understand, and they can cover much ground since they are above all symbolical and are intended to function on an associational level.
Another advantageous thing with symbolical names is that it does not require an encyclopaedia close by to understand what the hell the troops are all about, thus avoiding all problems of let’s say; “Szezkelly” (I spelled that wrong didn’t I, there you go!), because that problem is eliminated altogether with easy understandable and symbolical names (and the encyclopaedia can peacefully continue to collect dust instead).
“...you could have had a range of Berber soldiers (light cavalry, javelins, etc); saqaliba regiments (the armies made up of imported slavic slaves); various arab infantry and cavalry units. Then you could have made it really, really interesting with Murabitin elites - a range of javelin infantry, camels, and shock infantry - famous for charging into battle with their faces veiled and with terrifying drum beats. They used flags and drums to transmit orders in battle as well, making them far more disciplined than the other military forces in Spain. They would be regionized to the desert provinces. That would be much more interesting than the silly "ghazi" idea of the MTW creators.”
Now, if I read you correctly it seems to me that most of those troops that you are talking about are already more or less (or could be regarded as) covered within the ruling and strict possibilities of MTW. As in the available bif-plates, stat-system, limited framework of the program, audio and graphical capabilities and so on. And with the already existing units within redux.
“Berber soldiers”
These are more or less covered with the various desert formations (not the right names of course, but in function and style)
“Saqaliba regiments”
I get the feeling that this is more or less covered by “Slave Militias”.
“...various arab infantry and cavalry units.”
Yes I could, but again there is no room for that stuff and it is essentially covered by Saracen and Moorish formations. The Islamic factions already have more troops allocated to them than there ever was in any original game, the Moors alone have 10 more units than found in the original (at least in redux MP). The lines have to be drawn somewhere and they happened to end up the way they did.
“Murabitin elites”
Well redux got the Moorish “Black Guard”; perhaps those could fill that void for you? They are pretty “elitish” and to me it sounds that they do essentially fulfil that roll you are talking about. Again not the exact and right name perhaps....
Now, I am no specialist on these things and it might sound stupid to you, but you are stuck with silly, ignorant me here, and that’s just the way it is.... He he! My point being twofold:
Firstly, everything usually has more than one single name, and depending on whom you are talking too, each name is more correct and understandable or accurate than the other. Let me give you simple example here: It is called “Skane” by those of us who live here! Not “Scania”! Skane is a more correct term for those who might live there and perhaps to other people from Scandinavia but for almost everybody else it is basically “Marsian” and they don’t have clue what it means or signifies. With “Scania” however chances for recognition improves drastically. If you have ever looked at a MTW-XL map you might perhaps know were that region roughly is, but if you don’t my guess is that you don’t have a clue were that is, and if you do, I would say that you are an exception. This of course applies to all things and the various “spaced out”/”specialist” troop names in MTW are no exception. I’ve tried to keep it simple so at least I can play the game and skip the encyclopaedia part. If I don’t use the exact specialist term so be it. I can live with that. :mickey:
Secondly, there is another thing that I personally consider to be paramount. This is the fact that most troops have a meaning and actually plays a part in the over all unit grid of redux. Basically every unit has some purpose and function and they are balanced with all other units and profiles in the redux grid to a satisfactory degree. And this is especially true for playable factions in redux. I know this, since I have thoroughly tested it with friends of mine, doing some redux MP together. We have battled things out a few hundred times so this is fairly certain (apart from my own personal tests which probably are a few thousands). Now, the Moorish troop’s works and they are different and they do have a different style, compared with troops from other cultures and that’s way I want it to be. Because I have the notion that playing different factions should offer different experiences if possible, beyond the obvious geo-strategical differences and available unit arsenals. The troop’s themselves should feel different, the way and how they fight should be different. If all that happens I am happy, because that’s just the way I want it....
Redux & The Moorish Profile:
The Moors as any other faction have limits and strengths. To me, cavalry and quantity are strong points for the Moors. Specialized infantry is one the weaker aspects. This together begins to draw a “profile” on that faction. Add to that a special tech-tree and the profile gets more explicit, then you have the aspect geography and regions and the profile evolves even further. This is the case for every faction in redux, to a more or less explicit degree depending on these parameters and others as well. Wealth is another aspect for instance. And were that wealth is found, as in which region you can find riches to commission expensive troops surely have an impact in the game. Regional development is another and the list can probably be expanded further.
The existing troops in redux works together in creating a diversity in the game yet they still balances each other out fairly well. Considering all the parameters involved here. To me there is no or little meaning of putting in new troops for the sake of it, because if those troops don’t have any real and valid function in the game, why are they there? There are of course a few exceptions, but there always are. My point being; any fool can fill the troop rooster to the max with let’s say “peasant Xs” and call them “Heavy Whateverings”. That’s not the trick, it is to give them purpose and diversity between them and thus strengthening the game and the experience of it as a whole, that’s the trick. That is at least the way I see it. Maybe you agree with me on this? It has definitely been my goal for redux at any rate.
I hope all of that sorted stuff out for you (or at least reveals for you how I see these things). Now, my external Intel on the Moors is a bit scarce and perhaps I could unlock some of the existent Islamic units for the Moors as I have done for the Catholic factions earlier (this seems like very good idea actually). How about that Q?
Anyways, I hope you get redux going (preferably by doing a version of the “Moorish opening”) and I would appreciate if you reported back here with some Intel on how things work out for you regarding starting up the game (and feel free to post in additional questions and comments as well, you too Zasz!).
- Cheers
------------
Baron and Wes, the “redux agency” is currently looking for Intel on the Moors, concerning troop availability in perticular, if you guys are interested. Basically its up your ally baron since this cheifly concerns stuff in the "CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT"-file. Note! This is not supposed to be a bug-mission it is a matter of design and opinions and I would like your input to keep things safe from possible misstakes. As usual, fast responses are preferred since I need to keep my perspectives straight, and I do like to work fast on these things, as usual.... No surprises here! He he! /cheers!
Axalon,
I'm just in awe at how helpful you've been to everybody! I feel a little embarrassed now.
I had tried the Moorish opening perhaps six or seven times before posting; naturally enough, it worked the very next time after making my post! The campaign is progressing nicely. The only thing that I found a little strange was owning Egypt, so far east of my centre of operations - I was going to pull my troops out of there, until I saw how much money it was bringing in, hehehe. The battles feel quite different to the original - somehow they seem more lethal and desparate. Very gripping. There's quite a gap between the weak troops and the real soldiers, especially in morale - i like that!
I will do my best to keep you posted on how things go and any bugs than turn up : )
As for the troop types... I totally understand, and yes, if there's things I would like to see, the natural thing would be for me too do them myself : ) At present the only mod experience I have is tinkering with startpos, but everyone has to start somewhere right.
Thanks again for your trouble.
William the Silent
09-17-2008, 09:51
A week ago I noticed the exsistance of this mod thanks to TW.org mentioning it. I'm always looking for some new challenge so I was exited.
I tried to install it on MTW 1.1, but that didn't work somehow. But after installing VI 2.01 all my problems were gone.
I started with the French on hard: and it was hard.
But I loved it.
Great all these new units, hero's and sexy princesses. Great idea.
Awesome. Original MTW should have looked like this.
But I have some questions/remarks:
I unlocked the other factions, but I'm wondering when the Turks or other factions come in that do not start out.
Also is there going to be a change in the kind of units/buildings through the years, because of progress in weaponry.
The pikeman are showing up as mercenaries, but they were not (re)introduced in medieval warfare untill 1200's I believe (am I trying to be too historical).
Are they going to give you your own little home for the mod. I mean, your info's are kind of spread out all over the Guild. Hard to find. You deserve it I think.
Hello there Qurtubi and William the silent,
And while I’m at it, a special welcome to you William to the redux corner of MTW. Now, I will start with Qurtubi here and after that I will get back to you William (because it’s easier for me that way).
Qurtubi: First, I appreciate that you posted in the stuff regarding how you got the game goin. Now, “I'm just in awe at how helpful you've been to everybody!” Well I do try, and it’s nice to know that at least somebody appreciates it. :bow:
“…naturally enough, it worked the very next time after making my post!” Typical, aint it!? Ah well Q, it is small price to pay to get your game goin and, I for one, am more than willing to accept it the way it turned out. He he!
“…I found a little strange was owning Egypt, so far east of my centre of operations…” Yes, that is hardly very historical, but this is a pure design matter, because the Moors need second chance if their front fell in Iberia or even worse in Marocco. Especially if the Moors are run by the AI. That’s why they got Egypt, to assure them a second chance and a still functional economy. Since I don’t want the Moors to be "over and out" just because they happen to lose Marocco to a crusade or something. After a while, the Christian pressure in Iberia can be intense if not Portugal, Spain and Aragon are destroyed and conqurered. In my experience, the Moors usually have a two-front war after a while, One front in Iberia and the other in the middle east with the Saracens, possibly the Byzantines as well.
“The battles feel quite different to the original - somehow they seem more lethal and desparate. Very gripping. There's quite a gap between the weak troops and the real soldiers, especially in morale - i like that!” Yes, this is my intensions at work here and I’m glad you like these traits.
“I will do my best to keep you posted on how things go and any bugs than turn up : )”
Please do, I for one would appreciate it.
“At present the only mod experience I have is tinkering with startpos, but everyone has to start somewhere right.” Well, that’s how I finally started out back in 2003, so my guess is that you get to the troops and the GnomeEditor and maybe beyond that as well all in due time. :mickey:
William: “A week ago I noticed the existence of this mod thanks to TW.org mentioning it.” Yes, Martok’s kind support for redux has really done wonders for it. That week there were more people downloading redux (and perhaps even playing?) than there ever has been before. I am very happy about that fact.
“I tried to install it on MTW 1.1, but that didn't work somehow. But after installing VI 2.01 all my problems were gone.” Well first of all, this is strange…. Perhaps you could post in some additional info on this so I can get a clearer picture of what has happened here? My experience tells me that this should not have happened (with the exception of the Moors, minus a “Moorish opening”). Did you try to start up a campaign with any of the non-official factions? Or was something else irregular you did? I can only guess here because I got not enough info to give any valid answers on how this might have happened. At any rate, the VI/V.2.01 is far more stable for redux at least and because of that I would recommend most people to use that version if possible. V.1.1 usually works fine but is more unstable (not just for redux but for the original game as well, sad but true).
“I started with the French on hard: and it was hard. But I loved it.” He he! Hard is supposed to be hard! At any rate, it won’t get any easier because I will lower the starting income drastically in the near future for both versions of redux. So, it will get even harder! And as far as the French goes, their overall difficulty level is most likely about to be downgraded to “Normal” (that is, if no one else can thoroughly convince me that this is a really bad idea).
“…hero's and sexy princesses. Great idea. Awesome.” Actually you are the first one who have finally and openly mentioned this and all I can say is that I worked my brains out on those girls. Oh boy, did I work on those! Eventually I was finally happy with the results and what else can I say than; hey I am guy! This is the way I like my princesses, and I can’t be the only one now can I?!? Their (princesses) function in the game so ridiculously limited that I thought that something had to be done (so “how about making them look good at least” I thought). At the very least, it’s very “DC/Marvel-ish” and that works just fine for me. I never really liked the CA girls (nor the men either) basically too little “Marvel-factor” and too much “comedy”-factor on those. Actually, I personally feel that “the redux girls” got some different personalities going on as well when I look at them. Some of them seem to be just proud and beautiful others have just ended up being lecherous vixens. He he! Maybe it’s just me, I don’t know. Anyways, I am glad you like it, I do too…. BTW I usually get a good laugh when I look at the various portraits of bishops, inquisitors and druids, many of them do look really dubious and questionable to me. He he! I do like that!
“I unlocked the other factions, but I'm wondering when the Turks or other factions come in that do not start out.” Feel free to do this; it’s your personal game man. If you feel the need to do it, do it! But you must also realize that my practical support for these things is very limited compared with the “official” stuff. The reason why I left out certain factions in redux varies from stability issues, hardcoded errors and balancing-issues (as in accessible units and other stuff). Now, I am afraid I will have to disappoint you with the Turks, because they won’t ever show up in redux. They have been converted to the Portuguese and this is related to the fact that redux was originally built on plain MTW and not VI (since I never really have had a burning urge to put in some extra additional factions in the game especially with plain MTW, the faction-colours are just awful). And personally I never thought the Turks were worth keeping in my design so I removed them altogether. You and everybody else will have to make due with the Portuguese instead. Sorry, but I got another disappointment for you regarding the “coming in” factions in the middle of the campaign and the like. Personally such stuff never impressed me much so I did redux without all that. The starting factions in redux is the ones you have to worry about, what you see is what get, and usually that is more than enough compared with the original game. You might get reappearances and such things can and probably will happen during your campaign at some point.
“Also is there going to be a change in the kind of units/buildings through the years, because of progress in weaponry.” Yet another disappointment for you here, I have thrown out the era-progression altogether in redux because I never really liked it that much anyhow. Personally I feel that it did not make the game anymore interesting and all potential and related bugs have been killed by doing this. Redux is an ever standing “gunpowder free” romantic anachronism and thus there is no era-progression at all. Cause I simply don’t like it myself.
“The pikeman are showing up as mercenaries, but they were not (re)introduced in medieval warfare untill 1200's I believe (am I trying to be too historical).” To put it plainly for you; yes you are… (You could always change this of course, hell you could even throw back in the era-progression to get your particular historical feeling back if that’s what you want. There are guides on these things, use those for such moves if you want to do this. I however are just happy about how things are, after all I designed it that way).
“Are they going to give you your own little home for the mod. I mean, your info's are kind of spread out all over the Guild. Hard to find. You deserve it I think.” Well, this is basically all up to the Org-administrators. I would be delighted to have all the redux stuff at a more permanent place here at the .Org, no doubt about that. However, I have not yet sent a formal enquiry for these things to administrators (TosaInu is probably the appropriate man regarding things I guess) since I at a minimum want to have at least released the formal VI-upgrade before I do any such thing personally. I don’t really know these routines that well here at the Org. I have only been active here a few weeks myself so I basically know nothing about this. Maybe it is supposed to be me that send such a request, maybe don’t have to be me. Maybe it is like the administrators offers "you" such an oppertunity. I honestly don’t know and have no clue here on how these things usually is done. If you personally feel the urge to sort these things up now, now. I guess you could always send a PM to TosaInu and ask for info about it and decide what to do from there. As far as I can tell, I can only send a formal enquiry about it. But that does not in anyway guarantee that it will happen anyhow, since this is a decision entirely made by the .Org-administrators alone. It’s basically out of my hands. All I can do is ask for it, nothing more. And so far redux stuff has only really spread to the MTW-Mainhall area, which I personally have no problems with (rather opposite actually). And the VI/V.2.01 debug area is just next door and that fact keeps at least me sane, so that suits me just fine as well.
Hopefully all this have sorted things out for you. Do stick around!
--------
Baron & Wes: if I don’t get any Intel on the Moors from you guys by noonish tomorrow I take it that you guys got better and more important things to do. I realize that you can’t always help me out and I won’t hold any of it against you guys in any way. It simply would be wrong and indecent of me to do so. I got another request or rather an enquiry for you guys as well. It’s extremely secret so you will have to open up the spoiler here.... :grin:
One other thing and this is important, I also want you guys to know that you are free to help out other less experienced redux-players on this thread. Feel absolutly free to do this. I actually would encourage and welcome it. And you two are the most experienced redux-players that I know of, so I can’t really think of anybody else better suited to do it (however, one does not have to be experienced to help out, everybody can quote me on that!). Share your insight and know-how. I would appreciate it much and probably others as well, and let us not forget that the answers to various questions will get here to this very thread faster, which undoubtedly is good thing. And if you are uncertain about something, just openly say so, and I will know on what I should concentrate on when I do post in. - And if you guys just happened to be wrong about something, that’s not the end of the world. We are all wrong at some point and we get it sorted out eventually.
Basically what I am trying to say here is that does not have to me who answers each and every question on this thread; you guys could probably in many cases just do it fine as well. I utterly certain that you could for example answer at least a few of the questions found above here in the previous posts. Now, von Manteuffel I know that you have tried this before on this very thread and I give you a golden “carte blanche” to that again (and again! etc. This is explicit invitation to do so is also handed to you Western since I certain that you as well could do it). Both of you are legal redux-“bugmeisters” with one solid and confirmed kill each, so this should not be that hard for you guys. All this of course all voluntary and it indisputably is all up to you, but I for one would certainly appreciate it.
That’s that, and that’s it I guess.
- Cheers
William the Silent
09-18-2008, 00:40
About that problem that I had with MTW 1.1:
What happenend is that after hitting "Start Campaign" the bar would come on that shows you the game is loading, but after that I was send back to option screen.
I don't know what went wrong (I tried twice). Maybe I made mistake with installing, but after I uninstalled everything and installed up to VI 2.01, I had no problems.
Thank for your indepth reply.
I'll continue with my Viking campaign now. It's cool to be a viking, but not easy. I needed about a 100 turns (I guess I'll see them as weeks, since there is no era progression) to establisch 6 regions. So after 400 I'll have 24 :laugh4:.
Btw. not many princesses with these norsman. Do they throw girls away after they are born?:inquisitive:
Hi Will,
Did you install anything after the MTW-Redux 1.0 full package, any fixes or something like that? It sounds to me like the installation went wrong somehow, because you are the first that I know of who have had this problem so far. At any rate, this my guess based upon the limited info I got here.
I try to give you guy’s thorough answers.
Well, you rascal! :grin: Playing as the Norse is officially unsupported! …Is it any fun!? It’s quite different isn’t it?
Regarding turns/years; you can of course allocate whatever term you feel appropriate. Personally I see it as “turns”. I actually stopped caring about any of that, from MTW an onwards. To me there is only one game that ever had a time/turn system that I could take seriously and regard as acceptable. That is Shogun total war, with its 4 turns on each year model. All else is nonsense the way I see it, but that’s just me. Enjoy your raiding with the Vikings.
Ah yes, I almost forgot the pagan girls…. Well it’s a matter of me being lazy. The game only needs 24 of them to function correctly so I did what I had to (as I said before, you are not supposed to play the Norse…He he…). And usually most people are not that interested in the little pagan girls so that’s why (you being the exception of course).
Cheers man!
Baron von Manteuffel
09-18-2008, 07:53
Hi, just so you know, I lurk in the Total War forums daily and I have read all you've posted. ~:) I have 7 different Medieval/Rome TW mods installed that I play so they all stay somewhat fresh, if that makes any sense.
I know you were asking for Moors intel, but I'm not sure I can give you accurate information. What I mean is, I play on the normal setting and from what I've seen, you use the expert setting. I have little experience on the expert setting, and don't have the patience to deal with the rebellions. :no:
Anyway, playing the Moors on the normal setting, of course I found it easy. In the year 827, I have a yearly income of 12,468 florins, full balanced stacks on every province which are all golden armour, at least 1 ship in every sea, almost every building built in every province, and I've easily taken Sicily, Sahara, and Malta after it rebelled. I've had practically no altercations while I was building this solid juggernaut.
Portugal tried to sink some of my Dhows, but couldn't. So did the Saracens, and they managed to get 1 or 2. I then began to mass produce Bagalas and both factions quickly sued for peace. So I resumed building the empire, but never forgot their treachery.
In the year 827, I decided it was time to test this elite horde of an army against some Catholic knights so I attacked Portugal. :laugh4: They had about a full stack and so did I, and the result was... The Portuguese have decided they cannot win the battle and have retreated. :inquisitive: You have captured bla bla number of troops including the King...:inquisitive:...The King of Portugal has been killed in battle. He has no heirs and his forces no longer pose any real threat...:inquisitive:...:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:
William the Silent
09-18-2008, 10:31
Hi Will,
Did you install anything after the MTW-Redux 1.0 full package, any fixes or something like that? It sounds to me like the installation went wrong somehow, because you are the first that I know of who have had this problem so far. At any rate, this my guess based upon the limited info I got here.
Cheers man!
No fixes. Ax I would not worry about it as long as no one else has the problem. I'm happy with my VI 2.01.
Anyway, playing the Moors on the normal setting, of course I found it easy. In the year 827, I have a yearly income of 12,468 florins, full balanced stacks on every province which are all golden armour, at least 1 ship in every sea, almost every building built in every province, and I've easily taken Sicily, Sahara, and Malta after it rebelled. I've had practically no altercations while I was building this solid juggernaut.
Mister Man Devil I recommend you play the French for instance on hard. See if you laugh as loud. You'll be ~:mecry:. Suffering is fun for me :wall:: I gained 4 provinces in 100 turns and only make 1000 fl/turn ................................................................................... ~:mecry:
These Moors are way too powerfull. Can you imagine: I'm playing Norse right now and I have to fight stacks and stacks of Moor Navy.
Axalon
I have people staying at the moment, so not much computer time to help out I'm afraid. Sorry - back in the fray in a few days! I have one thought from past games as the Moors though (aside from agreeing that they might start with less provinces). Javelin cavalry was one of the things they were most famous for, and provides an interesting bit of tactical variety. This is one thing original MTW always lacked - jinetes looked too western. I wonder why you haven't gone for a moorish javelin cavalry unit?
Achilleslastand
09-20-2008, 22:14
Hello everyone.......I cant wait to try this wonderful looking mod out.
Only problem is i extracted the files over program files/total war/medieval total war.........and still all im getting is MTW1.1 vanilla........ive tried this many times even followed the install instructions to no avail...................can anyone offer any advice or tips?
Thank you...
William the Silent
09-20-2008, 22:48
To me it seems that your MTW 1.1 files have not been replaced with the mod files if you just get MTW 1.1.
Unzip the mod files somewhere else.
Then change the name to "medieval - Total War", if it is named "Redux - Total War", otherwise leave it the same.
Then drop it (or copy it) in the "Total War" file in "Program Files" (if you have installed MTW 1.1 in the automatic way).
This "should" do the job.
Are you shure you upgraded to 1.1 (check in the options menu after opening the game what version it tells you it is).
Hope this will help. Otherwise Ax will have to do the work.
Achilleslastand
09-21-2008, 06:11
To me it seems that your MTW 1.1 files have not been replaced with the mod files if you just get MTW 1.1.
Unzip the mod files somewhere else.
Then change the name to "medieval - Total War", if it is named "Redux - Total War", otherwise leave it the same.
Then drop it (or copy it) in the "Total War" file in "Program Files" (if you have installed MTW 1.1 in the automatic way).
This "should" do the job.
Are you shure you upgraded to 1.1 (check in the options menu after opening the game what version it tells you it is).
Hope this will help. Otherwise Ax will have to do the work.
Hmm tried this with same results.......maybe im missing a step or something...
William the Silent
09-21-2008, 09:27
Hmm tried this with same results.......maybe im missing a step or something...
Let's see if the Redux files were copied in your MTW 1.1.
Go to "campmap/startpos" and see if the files "ReduxSP", "ReduxSPC", etc are in there.
If not then you didn't install right. If yes then wait for Axalon to give an answer.
It's very frustrating :wall:. I've had stuff like that happening.
I actually had problems with using MTW 1.1, but I upgraded up to VI 2.01 and my problems were gone.
It's a fun game. I'm gonna go play :knight:.
Hi Axalon,
Firstly, I'd like to thank and congratulate you on your work.
MTW Redux is without a doubt the best mod I have played on. I love what you've done with the units and buildings, especially the champions and unit sizes.
Please keep up the great work.
One small bug I found - when completing the construction of an abbey, the finished construction message does not have a picture.
Cheers
Kris
Hello everyone, and a special rare double welcome to the Org *and* the redux corner of “MTW-land” to Orph. My welcome also goes to AchillesLastStand as well. Also my thanks go to William for stepping in and holding the fort here. Keeping this place covered, which is undoubtedly a good thing!
Achilles: first of all, welcome to the redux corner. Now let’s see if we can’t get your game up and running for you. In order for redux to run, it must be allowed to overwrite the original MTW files in the selected/intended installation. If it’s not allowed to do that, it simply won’t run and the effect of that would be the exact scenario that you are describing in your posts.
Now in order to make things happen you must do the:
"Install guide 1A, backup & problem edition":
---------------------------------------------------
1. Have MTW V.1.1 installed....
2. Determine exactly where this MTW V.1.1 installation is placed on your harddrive(s). As in X:/????/?????/Medieval – Total War or something similar like that (since you seem to use that variant). You must find out the exact path of where your MTW is placed on your computer. Once you do that all of this gets real easy.
3. Open the folder which contains the “Medieval – Total War”-folder in it. Keep it open, perhaps make the window smaller, but keep it open none the less. Let’s call this window the “MTW-Window” from now on.
4. Decompress the redux files again or download the redux package again (just to be on the safe side here. That is, if you have not saved your redux-Rar/Zip somewhere). Within the folder you will get after you decompressed redux, there is another folder named “Redux – Total War”. Now make a copy of this “Redux – Total War” to let’s say; your desktop. Change the name of this copy, which is now placed on your desktop, to “Medieval – Total War”. Copy it.
[b]5. Go back to the “MTW-Window” and paste, and let it replace and overwrite all the necessery files until it’s done.
6. Start up MTW and play redux....
*However, you should also download and install the “Islamic castle fix” as well (using the exact same method again and the exact right install path as well) to have an optimal game going.
**If the utter disaster scenario strikes:
If the game still don’t work, even if you have followed above instructions 1-6 exactly. My only advice to you is to uninstall MTW, then reinstall it again. Patch it up. Download another copy of redux and do step 1-6 again. This should in theory work and secure a funtional game on your PC. If it don't, well then my knowhow on PC's and windows have met it's match.
---------------------------------------------------
7. “Optional Task”, report back here to the redux thread and let us all know the good news that game is now up and running (It should be, at least). I would sure appreciate it to have this verified by you and probably others as well. While you’re at it perhaps you could share with which faction you intend to/have started to play and at which difficulty level. But at the very least, please verify that the problem is solved so we can move on to other stuff.
Orph: many thanks for the praise, I can’t get any higher grades than that, now can I?!? :laugh4: And thanks for the info regarding the abbey. I will look into it some more and if all you say here adds up I will put your name in the credits in the VI-upgrade pack for this. But as far as I can tell for the time being, all the files are in there. This certainly seems strange. Regardless, do stick around and feel free to post in questions and comments if you want share any of those with the rest of us. Again, welcome!
Baron: Now, didn’t I say earlier that the AI was a coward? He he! You just proved that the AI is too cowardly for its own good! :laugh4:
Although, many thanks for the Intel and no it did not matter much that you played on “Normal”, as you know it essentially only make an impact on the AI behaviour and starting cash for the faction in question. and you played long enough to at least cancel the effects of the starting cash at any rate.
What I was looking for was recruitment issues and the tactical profile on the Moors. And your little story confirms that there are no problems in that area, which is good!
At any rate, I have decided anyhow that I will unlock the ghazi- warriors, archers and cavalry units for the Moors. Much in the same way the Catholics get crusade units with an order palace. In this case however it is of course with a ribat instead, and an increased building cost for it to balance things out. Other than that, I also unlocked the desert warriors for them, making those available with a “Blacksmith” in place. I guess that makes you and perhaps others as well happy (how about that Qurtubi?) since that ultimatly means that there will be more units available.
“I have 7 different Medieval/Rome TW mods installed that I play so they all stay somewhat fresh, if that makes any sense.” No, it doesn’t. Whatever makes you happy man! :laugh4:
Western: We’ll hold the fort for you while you are away, beyond the safe borders of “MTW-land”.... He he!
As usual, you do have a point, this time with the tactical diversity argument regarding the “Moorish Jinets”; you almost beat me with my own perspective! However, this is also a matter of available bif-plates, and there is none that satisfactory supports such a thing (as far as I can tell at least). And the arduous process of making one for this is simply not worth it (even If I did know how to), considering what you get in the other end. I’m pretty sure you agree with me on that. Besides making new room for “default-units” is more or less impossible by now, I have found that out the hard way. There simply is no more room; otherwise stability goes out the window. And neither you nor I want that to happen, since I know that you are an avid supporter for stability (this of course is a good thing).
To be perfectly honest with you, I never though much about it since I personally was never that impressed with spear throwers or the jinets from the original game. I though those to be all but useless ”swordfood” essentially never did see them make a true impact in battle.
Will: “These Moors are way too powerfull. Can you imagine: I'm playing Norse right now and I have to fight stacks and stacks of Moor Navy.” No they aint, they just got more florins and castles than you do, that’s all...
Thanks again for you helping out here on the thread man.
Cheers guys!
William the Silent
09-21-2008, 17:26
Mr Axalon.
I started playing the spanish and I noticed that there were no units in Navarra. I just could walk in there and it was mine. He he!
Axalon
I'm not surprised by what you say re jinetes. I had noticed that javelin cavalry are rarer than hen's teeth in all Mods, and I presumed there was a reason. It's a shame but there we are. If we can't have javelins, then having Moors and Arabs much as they are is the best thing. From a realism point of view I'd hate to see these guys dominated by horse archers - that's not how they fought.
In my offshoot of redux I'm having a lot of fun trying to beat the Moors. My Spanish are going down heroically time after time, but each campaign is different and always a challenge. I love the unit balance you've achieved - good units prove their worth, but none of the main units is absurdly jedi or completely useless. So I may have fiddled around with the playing field, but I'm playing the teams much as you set them up, and the battles are some of the best I've had in several years now of playing. I'm glad to see from the forums that increasing numbers of people seem to be giving this Mod a whirl (of those of us that are left now the crowds have moved on to MTW2) :2thumbsup:
Achilleslastand
09-22-2008, 08:08
Hello everyone, and a special rare double welcome to the Org *and* the redux corner of “MTW-land” to Orph. My welcome also goes to AchillesLastStand as well. Also my thanks go to William for stepping in and holding the fort here. Keeping this place covered, which is undoubtedly a good thing!
Achilles: first of all, welcome to the redux corner. Now let’s see if we can’t get your game up and running for you. In order for redux to run, it must be allowed to overwrite the original MTW files in the selected/intended installation. If it’s not allowed to do that, it simply won’t run and the effect of that would be the exact scenario that you are describing in your posts.
Now in order to make things happen you must do the:
"Install guide 1A, backup & problem edition":
---------------------------------------------------
1. Have MTW V.1.1 installed....
2. Determine exactly where this MTW V.1.1 installation is placed on your harddrive(s). As in X:/????/?????/Medieval – Total War or something similar like that (since you seem to use that variant). You must find out the exact path of where your MTW is placed on your computer. Once you do that all of this gets real easy.
3. Open the folder which contains the “Medieval – Total War”-folder in it. Keep it open, perhaps make the window smaller, but keep it open none the less. Let’s call this window the “MTW-Window” from now on.
4. Decompress the redux files again or download the redux package again (just to be on the safe side here. That is, if you have not saved your redux-Rar/Zip somewhere). Within the folder you will get after you decompressed redux, there is another folder named “Redux – Total War”. Now make a copy of this “Redux – Total War” to let’s say; your desktop. Change the name of this copy, which is now placed on your desktop, to “Medieval – Total War”. Copy it.
[b]5. Go back to the “MTW-Window” and paste, and let it replace and overwrite all the necessery files until it’s done.
6. Start up MTW and play redux....
*However, you should also download and install the “Islamic castle fix” as well (using the exact same method again and the exact right install path as well) to have an optimal game going.
**If the utter disaster scenario strikes:
If the game still don’t work, even if you have followed above instructions 1-6 exactly. My only advice to you is to uninstall MTW, then reinstall it again. Patch it up. Download another copy of redux and do step 1-6 again. This should in theory work and secure a funtional game on your PC. If it don't, well then my knowhow on PC's and windows have met it's match.
---------------------------------------------------
7. “Optional Task”, report back here to the redux thread and let us all know the good news that game is now up and running (It should be, at least). I would sure appreciate it to have this verified by you and probably others as well. While you’re at it perhaps you could share with which faction you intend to/have started to play and at which difficulty level. But at the very least, please verify that the problem is solved so we can move on to other stuff.
Orph: many thanks for the praise, I can’t get any higher grades than that, now can I?!? :laugh4: And thanks for the info regarding the abbey. I will look into it some more and if all you say here adds up I will put your name in the credits in the VI-upgrade pack for this. But as far as I can tell for the time being, all the files are in there. This certainly seems strange. Regardless, do stick around and feel free to post in questions and comments if you want share any of those with the rest of us. Again, welcome!
Baron: Now, didn’t I say earlier that the AI was a coward? He he! You just proved that the AI is too cowardly for its own good! :laugh4:
Although, many thanks for the Intel and no it did not matter much that you played on “Normal”, as you know it essentially only make an impact on the AI behaviour and starting cash for the faction in question. and you played long enough to at least cancel the effects of the starting cash at any rate.
What I was looking for was recruitment issues and the tactical profile on the Moors. And your little story confirms that there are no problems in that area, which is good!
At any rate, I have decided anyhow that I will unlock the ghazi- warriors, archers and cavalry units for the Moors. Much in the same way the Catholics get crusade units with an order palace. In this case however it is of course with a ribat instead, and an increased building cost for it to balance things out. Other than that, I also unlocked the desert warriors for them, making those available with a “Blacksmith” in place. I guess that makes you and perhaps others as well happy (how about that Qurtubi?) since that ultimatly means that there will be more units available.
“I have 7 different Medieval/Rome TW mods installed that I play so they all stay somewhat fresh, if that makes any sense.” No, it doesn’t. Whatever makes you happy man! :laugh4:
Western: We’ll hold the fort for you while you are away, beyond the safe borders of “MTW-land”.... He he!
As usual, you do have a point, this time with the tactical diversity argument regarding the “Moorish Jinets”; you almost beat me with my own perspective! However, this is also a matter of available bif-plates, and there is none that satisfactory supports such a thing (as far as I can tell at least). And the arduous process of making one for this is simply not worth it (even If I did know how to), considering what you get in the other end. I’m pretty sure you agree with me on that. Besides making new room for “default-units” is more or less impossible by now, I have found that out the hard way. There simply is no more room; otherwise stability goes out the window. And neither you nor I want that to happen, since I know that you are an avid supporter for stability (this of course is a good thing).
To be perfectly honest with you, I never though much about it since I personally was never that impressed with spear throwers or the jinets from the original game. I though those to be all but useless ”swordfood” essentially never did see them make a true impact in battle.
Will: “These Moors are way too powerfull. Can you imagine: I'm playing Norse right now and I have to fight stacks and stacks of Moor Navy.” No they aint, they just got more florins and castles than you do, that’s all...
Thanks again for you helping out here on the thread man.
Cheers guys!
Ok ive tried everything you suggested Axalon step by step.....I even did a fresh install of MTW1.1 and a fresh d/l of redux again........Still all im getting is MTW vanilla........strange thing tho....when i open up the Medieval Total War files....as i go throught the files....there it sits all together in its own renamed file....i dont consider myself PC illiterate by any means......but this is like my 5th or 6th try and i am perplexed.........any ideas?
Ok ive tried everything you suggested Axalon step by step.....I even did a fresh install of MTW1.1 and a fresh d/l of redux again........Still all im getting is MTW vanilla........strange thing tho....when i open up the Medieval Total War files....as i go throught the files....there it sits all together in its own renamed file....i dont consider myself PC illiterate by any means......but this is like my 5th or 6th try and i am perplexed.........any ideas?
Hello Achilles, (I will respond to you other guys as well but I really want to sort this thing out first, I will get back to you guys.)
Now, I REALLY don’t want to be rude, but what you are seemingly claiming is simply not possible, even in theory (or have I maybe misunderstood what you are trying say here). The only sane explanation I can think of is that you must have 2 or more MTW’s installed (or that you still install redux in a wrong way). If you use a short-cut to start the game, get rid of it! Because it might be set to start another installation of MTW. And don’t start off the CD either.
If the redux files really are in the right place, it will work. And believe me; you will know the difference when you start up the right installation and if it is properly installed. Now, start the right game by activating the “Medieval_TW.exe” in that very folder where the redux files is supposedly to be. If you don’t get a radically changed game by then, the files are simply not there or are not correctly installed.
An easy and certain way to check that out is to open up the intended “Medieval – Total War”-folder (as in the very folder you are trying to replace with redux), then go and open the “Quickstart”-folder. In there, search for any files which contains “redux” in their filenames. If there are, the redux files are installed. If not, redux is not installed.
“…as i go throught the files....there it sits all together in its own renamed file...”
Please be more detailed in this. Please be overly explicit. Where are these files you are talking about? Post in that path.
And another thing I want to be surer of, you do have admin rights? Right? And you do use the very same user-profile as you have when you installed MTW? Right? As I said earlier, I’m just making sure here. This is just so I can rule out any such possibilities.
------------
EDIT: Please also post in the exact and entire installation path for your intended MTW-install (as in the one you are trying to replace with redux).
EDIT2: If I remember everything correctly you can run MTW directly from the CD. When this happens you can only do so at really unsexy resolutions like 800x600 or something. Can you make the game go to a 1280x1024 res? If not you might be running MTW from your CD. Is that what has happened here? Frankly I am guessing here because I have too little info to go on. You must give me more info to enable me to give you some further pointers. Because without that, I can only do so much, and blind guessing is not that useful or productive here anyways.
*How many MTWs do you have installed?
*Are you really sure you have really replaced the right folder?
*What are your exact install path?
Respond at your convenience (personally I prefer fast, I always do). If I get no answer of any kind within 24hrs I will assume that it have all worked out for you. I would prefer and appreciate a verification from you.
- Cheers
Achilleslastand
09-22-2008, 20:35
Hello Achilles, (I will respond to you other guys as well but I really want to sort this thing out first, I will get back to you guys.)
Now, I REALLY don’t want to be rude, but what you are seemingly claiming is simply not possible, even in theory (or have I maybe misunderstood what you are trying say here). The only sane explanation I can think of is that you must have 2 or more MTW’s installed (or that you still install redux in a wrong way). If you use a short-cut to start the game, get rid of it! Because it might be set to start another installation of MTW. And don’t start off the CD either.
If the redux files really are in the right place, it will work. And believe me; you will know the difference when you start up the right installation and if it is properly installed. Now, start the right game by activating the “Medieval_TW.exe” in that very folder where the redux files is supposedly to be. If you don’t get a radically changed game by then, the files are simply not there or are not correctly installed.
An easy and certain way to check that out is to open up the intended “Medieval – Total War”-folder (as in the very folder you are trying to replace with redux), then go and open the “Quickstart”-folder. In there, search for any files which contains “redux” in their filenames. If there are, the redux files are installed. If not, redux is not installed.
“…as i go throught the files....there it sits all together in its own renamed file...”
Please be more detailed in this. Please be overly explicit. Where are these files you are talking about? Post in that path.
And another thing I want to be surer of, you do have admin rights? Right? And you do use the very same user-profile as you have when you installed MTW? Right? As I said earlier, I’m just making sure here. This is just so I can rule out any such possibilities.
------------
EDIT: Please also post in the exact and entire installation path for your intended MTW-install (as in the one you are trying to replace with redux).
EDIT2: If I remember everything correctly you can run MTW directly from the CD. When this happens you can only do so at really unsexy resolutions like 800x600 or something. Can you make the game go to a 1280x1024 res? If not you might be running MTW from your CD. Is that what has happened here? Frankly I am guessing here because I have too little info to go on. You must give me more info to enable me to give you some further pointers. Because without that, I can only do so much, and blind guessing is not that useful or productive here anyways.
*How many MTWs do you have installed?
*Are you really sure you have really replaced the right folder?
*What are your exact install path?
Respond at your convenience (personally I prefer fast, I always do). If I get no answer of any kind within 24hrs I will assume that it have all worked out for you. I would prefer and appreciate a verification from you.
- Cheers
Thank you for the quick reply Axalon....i will give you as much info as i can....
I only have 1 MTW installed....MTW 1.1 i usually play from disk and usually play at 1280x1024 althought i have played as high as 1440x980 i believe,,,
The install path is.....Local Disk C/Program Files/Total War/Medieval Total War
I have checked the quickstart folder and there is no redux to be found.
And what i meant to say about the files......i renamed redux medieval total war then installed it over the medieval total war folder......then when i opened MTW folder for example you can see all the files,battle,campmap,quickstart,logfiles,sounds,etc...then i also see the redux file that i renamed MTW and it is all together in 1 folder.
And yes i have full admin rights to everything on pc
I just d/l redux from filefront{the other d/l were from atomic gamer.....i will try everything again and not start the game from the CD.....i will keep you updated and thank you for all of your help.
Baron von Manteuffel
09-22-2008, 21:20
@Achilleslastand - Right click on the redux file that you renamed Medieval - Total War, copy it, then paste it in your Local Disk C/Program Files/Total War. Let it overwrite and it should work. ~:)
Cheers Baron! Mystery solved!!!
That means that we all can move on and business returns to normal around here. Ooohh, that means that I will respond to Western and William as well… I will do so soon. Tomorrow or something like that.:mickey:
And we will be waiting for your reply and the good news, Achilles!
- Cheers
----------
Hey Baron, you got the "100 post" for redux!!! :laugh4:
Achilleslastand
09-22-2008, 21:59
I just tried that Baron with same results......if someone can tell me how to take a screenshot and post it i will glady do so...
Hold on! I will write a guide for you.... ETA 30min
Hello again Achilles, here is what you do.
The Achilles special guide:
---------------------------------------------
1. Decompress the redux material. (Again… That way it is certain you got all the files)
2. Within that folder you get from doing that decompression you should have two folders:
“Redux – Total War”
“Redux Bonus Material”
3. Copy the “Redux – Total War” to you desktop. And once you done that. Copy the name of this folder. Yes, “Redux – Total War”.
4. Go to Program Files… Open it. Don’t know what you got on your PC, but somewhere in there, among the various folders you should be able to find a folder named “Total War”. (This is utterly based on your posted information).
5. Locate that folder…
6. Open this folder named: “Total War”.
Now if everything is correct you should only find one single folder in there. This folder is called “Medieval - Total War” or “Medieval Total War” again this is based upon the info you posted in. The dash is really important actually.
Regardless, right click on this single folder, and check “change name”, yes as in change the name of that folder. Once the letters of that folder are marked/activated/darkened, press “Ctrl+V” on the keyboard or “paste” with the mouse. Whatever works best for you. Regardless, the result of doing this should end up in “Redux – Total War”. This is exactly the same name that the copied folder on the desk top has. And it must be!
7. Now copy the “Redux – Total War”-folder on the desktop and let it replace and overwrite the other “Redux – Total War”-folder, the one found in “Total War” (the one you changed name on). Let it overwrite and do all its stuff. Wait until it’s done.
8 Open up the newly replaced “Redux – Total War”, which is placed in the “Total War”-folder as in:
“C:/Program Files/Total War/Redux – Total War”
Go to “Quickstart” check for redux files… If any are there, the installation is successful. If you can't find any files that contains redux in them, the your installation have failed yet again. But this is the way you do it. So do it again step 1-7, exactly according to the above instructions.
Report back here with the results…
- Cheers
----------
(To take a screenshot, press ”print Scrn” then open up Paint/photoshop or some other similar program. Open a new file. Press “Ctrl+V” or paste” to get the screenshot in there. Mind the the size of the file if you have to do this.)
mortalflesh
09-23-2008, 01:50
Hi,
I've installed this mod and when I go to start it, I get a message saying
"Column_building_faction_association (this is the title of the pop up box.)
Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8
NOVGOROD"
I haven't seen anyone else post this complaint so I assume it's unique to me.
I have 6 other Mods installed on my machine and all work fine, so I got a handle on how to install mods.
I have a fresh install of M:VI 2.01 and that works fine before the install.
This is the only mod I've had issues with so not sure what to do with it. Any assistance would be appreciated. I'm really looking forward to playing this, so hopefully someone has a solution for me. Thanks guys!
Hi there Mortal flesh,
Welcome to the Org and especially to the redux corner. This problem of yours is very fixable and yes it seems to be, if not unique, very rare at least. I have never had this one myself. And I have installed redux on VI/V.2.01 plenty of times as you might imagine (as in using the “official” files). Do you have any special edition of MTW that I should know about?
Have you checked the “Quickstart”-folder for redux stuff? I’m just making sure that it is properly installed here.
I take it that you have not tried to tinker with anything yet. Right?
Do you know how to handle a GnomeEditor? Because if you do, change all the “Novgorod”’s in column 20 to lets say… “FN_EGYPTIAN”, that should do the trick. Just make sure it is the right crusader_build_ prod13! Otherwise, you will have to wait a bit.
But I am interested in which edition of MTW you got, including the VI expansion if this is the case, is it a plain old VI? Or is it something else? Any gold edition or something like that. Era-edition?
To be really safe here post in your entire install path, better safe than sorry man. :smile:
If you get going with the GnomeEditor, please report back here with the news on how things work out for you.
Otherwise just post in the stuff I requested and I will take it from there.
- Cheers
----------
Well Achilles? How are things going for you?!?
Achilleslastand
09-23-2008, 08:37
Hello Axalon.......I tried everything in your letter......and followed your instructions exactly.
I tried 3 or 4 times and each time when i copy it...it just creates its own file in the TW file......it dosnt overwrite anything....just creates it own file within all of the MTW files....this is very strange as ive never had any problems like this before at all....i changed both names to Redux TW....with same results,even tried MTW as name with same results as well......i made sure there were exact spaces in name and between the - symbol.....I will keep at it because now im obsessed with making this thing work........And Axalon and everyone i thank you for all of your help it was/is greatly appreciated.
Hi,
I've installed this mod and when I go to start it, I get a message saying
"Column_building_faction_association (this is the title of the pop up box.)
Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8
NOVGOROD"
I haven't seen anyone else post this complaint so I assume it's unique to me.
I have 6 other Mods installed on my machine and all work fine, so I got a handle on how to install mods.
I have a fresh install of M:VI 2.01 and that works fine before the install.
This is the only mod I've had issues with so not sure what to do with it. Any assistance would be appreciated. I'm really looking forward to playing this, so hopefully someone has a solution for me. Thanks guys!
Hi MF,
I had this exact issue when I attempted to install over MTW-VI after I used the XL Mod uninstall application. Once I did a complete fresh install of MTW, the issue was fixed. This may help??
William the Silent
09-23-2008, 09:16
Hello Axalon.......I tried everything in your letter......and followed your instructions exactly.
I tried 3 or 4 times and each time when i copy it...it just creates its own file in the TW file......it dosnt overwrite anything....just creates it own file within all of the MTW files....this is very strange as ive never had any problems like this before at all....i changed both names to Redux TW....with same results,even tried MTW as name with same results as well......i made sure there were exact spaces in name and between the - symbol.....I will keep at it because now im obsessed with making this thing work........And Axalon and everyone i thank you for all of your help it was/is greatly appreciated.
We have to find a way to make you play Redux.
If dropping the whole "Redux Total War" enchilada doesn't do the job, I would unzip the mod file (somewhere).
1. "Select all" the files from inside the "redux Total War" file (see top "Redux - Total War" window in picture).
2. Then do "copy"
3. Then go to your MTW installation.
4. Go inside "Medieval Total War" file (see bottom "Medieval - Total War" window in picture).
5. Do "paste" and:
6. Boom!
7. There you go (hopefully).
My 7 step solution to enduring happiness :laugh4:.
https://img150.imageshack.us/img150/5025/helpvs6.th.jpg (https://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=helpvs6.jpg)
Hello Everyone,
Not bad Will, not bad at all…. :laugh4: We all know that it’s possible to get redux in there for Achilles. It’s now just a matter of time. By the way:
”I started playing the spanish and I noticed that there were no units in Navarra. I just could walk in there and it was mine. He he!”
Yes this is true, and it is designed that way. But it’s probably the only walkover you’ll get with the Spaniards for a long time. My guess is that the Moors, Aragon, Portugal and France see to that. He he he….. (Oh, it seems that there some troubles with your pic, maybe you should check that out?)
Orph: “I had this exact issue when I attempted to install over MTW-VI after I used the XL Mod uninstall application. Once I did a complete fresh install of MTW, the issue was fixed. This may help??”
This certainly was some interesting news to me at least, and I hope that this might sort things out for Mortalflesh as well. On another note, I have looked things thru with the abbey and you just got yourself a credit in the coming VI-upgrade. Congrats man!
Achilles: This is turning out to be quite a thing. Hang in there, because this is very solvable, you can be sure of that. Most of us now know were the trouble is located, and you will get it right sooner or later. :smile:
(Just a couple of friendly suggestions and ideas for you. How about letting a friend/brother/sister/neighbour have try at it, maybe that will sort this things out. Do you know anyone who can come over to your place and help you out with this? I’m just really interested in making it work for you that’s all. Good luck! And we are still waiting here for the good news!)
- Cheers
-----------
I will comment Wes post:96 in a separate post.
William the Silent
09-23-2008, 18:44
My game keeps crashing after this 1 hour long battle that I won. I just don't know how to post a file here on this forum, otherwise I would have posted a copy of my quicksave. It crashes after all the sea battles after finishing the battle.
I would continue my game with quick resolve normally, but I'll loose that battle then ~:mecry:.
One other thing: I believe that after I finished an abbey (playing spanish), the message that told me that my beautiful abbey was ready, didn't show a picture.
I'm not 100% sure of that, because I clicked through all these messages fast, but I noticed twice that no picture showed up during my quick click.
Achilleslastand
09-23-2008, 19:23
We have to find a way to make you play Redux.
If dropping the whole "Redux Total War" enchilada doesn't do the job, I would unzip the mod file (somewhere).
1. "Select all" the files from inside the "redux Total War" file (see top "Redux - Total War" window in picture).
2. Then do "copy"
3. Then go to your MTW installation.
4. Go inside "Medieval Total War" file (see bottom "Medieval - Total War" window in picture).
5. Do "paste" and:
6. Boom!
7. There you go (hopefully).
My 7 step solution to enduring happiness :laugh4:.
https://img150.imageshack.us/img150/5025/helpvs6.th.jpg (https://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=helpvs6.jpg)
William,your solution worked like a charm,when i get home from work i will start a english/hard campaign.......Thanks for the great mod that has breathed new life into MTW.....and thank you axalon,baron and william the silent for helping me to get this up and running....thanks again
mortalflesh
09-23-2008, 23:41
Hi Axalon,
Thanks for the reply. Initially, I installed the M:TW Gold edition which I used to run all mods mods from. When I got this error, I dusted off my original copies of M:TW and M:VI expansion pack. I was surprised it installed as it's old and scratched but voila, there it went. Anyway, I digress. I got the exact same error on the original installs.
After 3 tries, I manual copied over the seperate files from the Mod over into the original install folders to make sure it went it. The Redux files are in that folder you mentioned, I double checked that.
I took your suggestion and renamed Novgorod to EN Egyptian in the editor and then I got the next country, Italy, to pop up with the same error. I changed that name and then boom...got the same error with another country. Uggh. It's almost as if I don't have a file somewhere but it seems that all the files are there.
Sorry to ramble on but I really want to try this mod, if you have any thoughts or suggestions, I'd greatly appreciate them.
Baron von Manteuffel
09-24-2008, 02:51
Hi Axalon,
Thanks for the reply. Initially, I installed the M:TW Gold edition which I used to run all mods mods from. When I got this error, I dusted off my original copies of M:TW and M:VI expansion pack. I was surprised it installed as it's old and scratched but voila, there it went. Anyway, I digress. I got the exact same error on the original installs.
After 3 tries, I manual copied over the seperate files from the Mod over into the original install folders to make sure it went it. The Redux files are in that folder you mentioned, I double checked that.
I took your suggestion and renamed Novgorod to EN Egyptian in the editor and then I got the next country, Italy, to pop up with the same error. I changed that name and then boom...got the same error with another country. Uggh. It's almost as if I don't have a file somewhere but it seems that all the files are there.
Sorry to ramble on but I really want to try this mod, if you have any thoughts or suggestions, I'd greatly appreciate them.
@mortalflesh - It looks like you may have copied the mod folders into the vanilla folders instead of overwriting them. If you copy all the mod folders and simply paste them in the Medieval - Total War folder, you will get a message like "Battle folder already exist do you wish to overwrite? campmap folder already exist do you wish to overwrite? etc. etc."? Select "yes to all" then BOOM! you're done. ~:)
Hello everyone,
Achilles: At last the good news!!! Yay! A long overdue welcome to the world of redux! Hope you have some real fun with it! You have suffered more than enough I think, time to have some fun instead. And do stick around here now when you finally got things going!! :mickey:
Manteuffel: What would I do without you?!? Thanks for holding the fort here... :mickey:
That’s the good news…
The Bad News:
--------------
Oh, and let’s do this with a smile guys, because tomorrow could be worse….
William: It sounds to me like a corrupted save-file. Sorry, but there you have it. It’s not much I can do about it. For what it’s worth, this is not in anyway unique for redux. It happens now and then in the original game as well. You should have a “mastersave” at least every five years/turns to have some sort of damage control (and save at the very beginning of the turn, before you do anything!). It sounds to me that you are now forced to go back at least 2 turns and start over again. Sorry but there you have it.
Concerning the abbey, sorry again. Orph beat you to it, since he identified the problem and reported it in before you did. Better luck next time (you’ll get another chance sooner or later I guess). Sorry for all this, but that’s just how things are…. :bow:
Mortalflesh: More bad news…. This is what you do:
--------------------------------------------------
1. Download the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_UPGRADE_PACK (BETA A)”
2. Download the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_TAC_FIX”
3. Make a fresh install of MTW + VI + 2.01 patch
4. Decompress MTW Redux 1.0
5. Install MTW Redux 1.0 (Either by using my “Achilles guide” or Williams “happy 7”, Manteuffels “Boom model” or the instructions that comes with redux. The “how to install” guide. Take your pick)
6. Decompress the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_UPGRADE_PACK (BETA A)”
7. Install the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_UPGRADE_PACK (BETA A)”
Using the exact same method as before.
8. Decompress the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_TAC_FIX”
9. Install the “MTW-REDUX 1.0 VI_TAC_FIX”
Yes the very same method…
10. Start up the game… Using the “Medieval_TW.exe” found in the install. Step in to the world of redux…
11. Promise me (yes me, Axalon), that you check things out more thoroughly the next time. As in, current info and such. And always read the instructions! He he he!
Happy fighting! :knight:
Download all the files here:
--------------------------------
http://hosted.filefront.com/Urwon
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I know now why I never encountered this problem myself…
Just so you know, I do expect a reply for this Mortalflesh! :laugh4:
- Cheers
-------------
Now, can everything go back to normal around here?!? :mickey:
Some 10 posts up, (before all the turmoil of the installation problems) Western wrote among other things this:
“In my offshoot of redux I'm having a lot of fun trying to beat the Moors. My Spanish are going down heroically time after time, but each campaign is different and always a challenge. I love the unit balance you've achieved - good units prove their worth, but none of the main units is absurdly jedi or completely useless. So I may have fiddled around with the playing field, but I'm playing the teams much as you set them up, and the battles are some of the best I've had in several years now of playing. I'm glad to see from the forums that increasing numbers of people seem to be giving this Mod a whirl (of those of us that are left now the crowds have moved on to MTW2) “
Wow Western, this is really some serious and sky-high grades you are giving me here. It means a lot to me and it sure makes me smile. Not only because you being one of the very first who ever played redux after I released it to the public. But I also realise that this is based upon some amount of experience (quite rare so far) with the special reduxed circumstances which together creates the overall game that is redux (unit-, tech-tree-, tactical profile-design and among lots of other things). Apart from all that, it also shows that redux evidently can be flexible enough to entertain people of other convictions and preferences than my own. Since I know that we are in fact followers of different “schools”; fun/cool (me) vs. realism (you), anachronism (me) vs. history (you). Thanks man. :bow:
“My Spanish are going down heroically time after time, but each campaign is different and always a challenge.”
This sounds really cool, grand Armageddon’s or Ragnarok’s. As in like “how long can you hold out and survive?” kind of thing. If nothing else this indicates that redux can actually “bite back at you” and that it is not a “one way show” in this game. As in, it’s just a matter of time before the player wins (Personally I always kind of get that feeling in the original MTW). Then again playing Spain/Castile is not supposed to be easy and you know my beliefs regarding that; expert should really mean expert and nothing else (and I can’t really believe that you have changed the strategical circumstances for Spain that much in the “Western Deluxe-version of redux. It would simply be unhistorical. Dunno if you tinkered with the income? Is it changed?). Your story here further confirms that this is actually so, which of course make me happy. After all, this was my intensions with redux and Spain, and the design seems to work, which is great!
I love the unit balance you've achieved - good units prove their worth, but none of the main units is absurdly jedi or completely useless.
Well this is something that I have tried to achieve by working a lot with unit-design, balance and tactical diversity, and the same time keeping an eye on tactical functions for each unit and the redux unit grid as a whole. I also thought that the standardized unit sizes could be torn apart to create some more interesting diversity (as you know this is not the only thing I have destroyed from the original game, the MTW projectile system is out the window for instance). The format of 20/40/60/100 formations is quite ok, but 1/5/10/20/40/60/80/100 is more diverse and interesting to me. Also it does allow you to expand the available tools of tactical diversity and unit-design in MTW. In the original there was too much conformity to my taste, almost all infantry units was 60/100 and cavalry was 20/40. I never really understood why it had to be like that. I wanted the diversity you get in redux so I designed it that way, as simple as that.
The tactical diversity and unit design in the original game felt to me underdeveloped and even neglected at times. There are 5000 different spear units and too few regular infantry units, for instance. All the cavalry had too standardized movement-values; there simply is too little diversity there and because of that you don’t have any real reasons to go beyond your favourite set of units. Since you don’t have any such reasons you get the result of more or less ignoring a lot of available units in the original, I don’t like that trait. I simply wanted to change all that, and it seems that I have actually managed just to do that in redux, at least according to the experiences that you seem to have with it. This is of course great, and I can’t say that I am complaining about the news you bring me here! It really feels great when your intensions and designs appear to actually work out!
“…the battles are some of the best I've had in several years now of playing”
Music to my ears man, music to my ears… (One should never underestimate the importance of thorough unit-design, balancing and tactical diversity, and the individual functionality of each unit-type in regards to the overall unit-grid. I dare promise you this; if all the above aspects where neglected you would still not get a better experience of the game even if you had 1000 different units put in the game. This might not be the most common and popular way of seeing these things but it sure is the way I see it.)
“I'm glad to see from the forums that increasing numbers of people seem to be giving this Mod a whirl (of those of us that are left now the crowds have moved on to MTW2)“
Me too man, me too, much has happened here in the last 6-7 weeks. However, I still appreciate your very first post man. Because with it you showed others (the world actually) that redux actually is playable and that “you” actually could have some fun with it. I don’t know if you realize how important that is. If not, go and have a visit over at the TWC, and then you will know exactly what I mean by that (it’s a very different story than we got here so far). Also, Martoks kind support for redux has done wonders for it right here at the Org. Hope to “read you here” soon. :mickey:
Cheers man!
Achilleslastand
09-24-2008, 07:55
Didnt get a chance to get very far in my english/hard campaign..........I usually play at 1280x1024......but my monitors native resolution is 1680x1050 but the highest i can crank MTW is 1440x900.......is there any way to fix this or make it where i can play at 1680x1050?
William the Silent
09-24-2008, 09:45
Hello everyone,
-------------
Now, can everything go back to normal around here?!? :mickey:
I guess Redux TW is kind of the Disney version of MTW https://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7132/rolleye0012yz7.gif (https://imageshack.us)
I've been enjoying my spanish campaign so far. I got by the crash by going back and abandoning my plan to take out the Italians (with their 2 x 7 full stacks of unit opposing me) by taking out their heirless king in another area. I had to fight two battles against 7 stacks :sweatdrop: after my attempt. That took about 1 1/2 hour each. And then you find out the game can't continue ~:mecry:.
I'll use battletime limit next time.
Ok I'm over it.
I had some little remarks/questions:
I noticed that their is no recruiting of foreign units possible through anything other then the inn. Ever thought about that, or is there a reason you abandoned that in Redux. Would be cool to recruit some scottish clansman since I own their land now.
Also in VI the Vikings can leave an area (over seas) without having to have a harbor (since longboats don't need harbor). This was an advantage for raiding an area. Maybe something to use in Redux if you ever are going to make Norse playable https://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7132/rolleye0012yz7.gif (https://imageshack.us).
Great work axalon. you'll get busy writing replies if the Redux family grows.
Back to fight these evil italians.
https://img510.imageshack.us/img510/7581/doofywaveed4.gif (https://imageshack.us)
Those Moors really are a danger in redux.
My first campaign with the English was going great - I had the British Isles, Ireland, Norway, Sweden, Normandy and Flanders, and then they turned up - smashing through the Spanish and French, and landed 5 full stacks on Normandy!
I held out for a little while, but soon lost due to lack of funds to keep up my armies, and got rolled all the way back to Scotland, where my king and the tattered remains of heavy infantry went down in flames!
Next campaign - Spanish, and first priority was to smash the Moors. I drove them from the Iberian penninsula, held Morrocco against the hordes, but then crusaded to Egypt and Palestine - choking off their money-making provinces. This seemed to cut them down, and I was able to mop up Afroca quite quickly.
I really like how redux rewards a well run economy. The changes to trade and agricultural returns are great.
My current campaign ( I tend to finish up once the tide has turned in my favour - the spanish campaign saw my empire stretch from Portugal to Kazar, and from Tunisia to Norway, with only the Russians left in their top corner of the map), is with the French, and this one is definitely a fun challenge.
I currently hold the french homelands, as well as Navarre, and a line of fortified provinces from Friesland to Burgundy. Just now building up a strikeforce of royal infantry, frankish knights and feudal bowmen to take back Iberia for the true faith :).
I can't say enough good things about this mod! Waiting pateintly for the update.... Thanks Axalon.
mortalflesh
09-24-2008, 12:34
Axalon:
Thanks for the link for the patch for Redux, it worked great!! The mod looks awesome and I look forward to playing it. Unfortunately I gotta run to work. Thanks again for the patch and the mod. Good work.
Hi again everyone and many thanks for the praise and good news,
William: “I guess Redux TW is kind of the Disney version of MTW” You don’t like this guy :mickey: ??? What’s there not to like?!? :laugh4:
Seriously, I went to doctor redux practice today and he declared your game sick and unfit for further duty, William. He described the symptoms like this: “Would be cool to recruit some scottish clansman since I own their land now.” Since you can’t, you’re game is not feeling well and simply needs its medicine to be up and running properly again (perhaps now, all of you understand the value of posting in stuff regarding your campaigns now and then). Download and install the “VI-TAC-FIX.zip.” Sorry, but “it’s the doctor’s orders…” He he!
- The current state of your game, is simply not redux. (at least not the way it was designed and supposed to be). Because of the “Manteuffelian bug” you’re missing out on roughly 40 tactical units in the entire game. Perhaps you should do something about it? It’s the TAC-fix you need to fix it and its available over at the filefront upload (use the link a few posts up or go to the debug area).
And another thing, I personally can only sympathise with the annoying fact of the corrupt save, and yes it’s typical that it had to happen just where it did. But you must also realize that this has not anything to do with me or redux. It is flaw that has its origins in the original game and it happens “shows its ugly head” in redux as well (because redux runs ontop of it). If you are vexed about it, I can surely understand the reasons for why, but please direct your disappointment where it actually belongs, CA. Not redux.
At any rate, if you honestly can say that you did not have fun during those prolonged battles with the Italians, I can only offer my sympathies. But my guess is that you did have fun. Besides big and real battles usually take time and should take time, at least the way I see it. Now, this “battleclock-thingie” is a stupid stuff if you ask me. No battle is ever settled to the tic-tac of an eggclock! Don’t bother with that, and get back to the scene of the crime, and make it right this time! Last time was just a rehersal! (Oh, and all this should happen AFTER you installed the “TAC-fix”. BTW I will have a look at the longboats as well.) And now folks! By popular demand here he is! Mickey!!! :mickey:
Achilles: If you can’t run MTW in 1280x1024, at least run it at 1280x960. It usually works just as well. And if those specs of yours are right, you probably can’t go any higher…
Orph: Again thanks for praise here. Now, everybody seems to whine about the Moors these days. All I can say is this. When I play (some other faction), I usually have problems keeping them (the Moors) alive, or is that just me?!?
Mortalflesh: Finally we got the good news from you as well! This means that the portal to the little world of redux is wide open and I sure hope that you do stick around here now when we actually got the game going for you. :smile:
Cheers guys!
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Due to recent events, do check out if "you" really got all the fixes that are available for your version of redux. The "infoV2" download should suffice (post1).
William the Silent
09-24-2008, 20:38
Thanks for your replies Axalon.
I actually tried to download the "VI-TAC-FIX.zip.", but I end up with the message:
"we were unable to locate the file to download".
:balloon2:
Ok Will, try again…… I know that filefront works because I have tested it myself. This is the file you need:
“MTW-REDUX_1.0_VI_TAC_FIX.zip”
Filefront (faster):
--------------------
Removed
Atomic Gamer:
--------------------
Removed
- Cheers
William the Silent
09-25-2008, 01:33
Ok Will, try again…… I know that filefront works because I have tested it myself. This is the file you need:
“MTW-REDUX_1.0_VI_TAC_FIX.zip”
Filefront (faster):
--------------------
http://files.filefront.com/MTW+REDUX+10+VI+TAC+FIXzip/;11589049;/fileinfo.html
Atomic Gamer:
--------------------
http://www.atomicgamer.com/file.php?id=71617
- Cheers
Only the "Atomic" works for me, but I'm happy with the result in my campaign. Now I can defeat the evil Italians with some more flavor.:laugh4:
https://img359.imageshack.us/img359/2015/toothpi9.gif (https://imageshack.us)
Since things have settled down here a bit, I would like to give Orph some proper replies and comments to his remarks in post:119. Because I think it deserves it and I never really had the chance to properly reply and comment on it before (time shortage), and I want remedy all that right now. After all, Orph bothered to think things thru, write it down, and post it in and I think I owe him to return the favour. This kind of behaviour is good for all of us and should be encouraged at all times! However, please also remember that "you" are writing for all of us, so keep things intresting and relevant.
At any rate, I am sorry for cutting you short Orph and you deserved a better treatment than you got. I might not always have the time to give you guys some thorough answers and comments, but if possible, I will try to do it when I can, even if it ends up late and over-due. Here is my penance, this time.…
Now, back in post: 119, Orph wrote this:
“Those Moors really are a danger in redux.
My first campaign with the English was going great - I had the British Isles, Ireland, Norway, Sweden, Normandy and Flanders, and then they turned up - smashing through the Spanish and French, and landed 5 full stacks on Normandy!
I held out for a little while, but soon lost due to lack of funds to keep up my armies, and got rolled all the way back to Scotland, where my king and the tattered remains of heavy infantry went down in flames!
Next campaign - Spanish, and first priority was to smash the Moors. I drove them from the Iberian penninsula, held Morrocco against the hordes, but then crusaded to Egypt and Palestine - choking off their money-making provinces. This seemed to cut them down, and I was able to mop up Afroca quite quickly.
I really like how redux rewards a well run economy. The changes to trade and agricultural returns are great.
My current campaign ( I tend to finish up once the tide has turned in my favour - the spanish campaign saw my empire stretch from Portugal to Kazar, and from Tunisia to Norway, with only the Russians left in their top corner of the map), is with the French, and this one is definitely a fun challenge.
I currently hold the french homelands, as well as Navarre, and a line of fortified provinces from Friesland to Burgundy. Just now building up a strikeforce of royal infantry, frankish knights and feudal bowmen to take back Iberia for the true faith :).
I can't say enough good things about this mod! Waiting pateintly for the update.... Thanks Axalon.”
Well the Moors and every other faction have this capacity in redux I believe. It seems to me to be a question of which faction will it be the next time. As I indicated earlier, it’s very rare that the Moors grow strong, when the crown is under my management, but they can, and obviously they did, when you played your campaign. Personally I have seen similar behaviour from the Russia, Byzantium, France and Italy for instance. As in growing strong and becoming increasingly expansive.
“I held out for a little while, but soon lost due to lack of funds to keep up my armies, and got rolled all the way back to Scotland, where my king and the tattered remains of heavy infantry went down in flames!”
Again, your Intel (along with Westerns for instance) seems to indicate that redux is ready and able to “bite back” at the player, which of course is a trait that I always wanted in this game. I always wanted to have god fight and challenge for anybody who plays redux (and I feel that the original is a bit disappointing in that area). Perhaps those intensions finally got thru to the AI, at least to some extent. Hehe! At any rate, it sounds really cool to have an increasingly desperate situation. Fighting each battle as it where you’re last, retreating, scrape together the little formations you got and perhaps rebuild a new bigger veteran formation. In some cases it is actually better to several small skeleton units instead. Regardless, even if you loose, you can still have lots of fun! And I am certain that Heavy Infantry dudes (personal favourites of mine) went down in style! They usually do! Hehe!
“Next campaign - Spanish, and first priority was to smash the Moors. I drove them from the Iberian penninsula, held Morrocco against the hordes, but then crusaded to Egypt and Palestine - choking off their money-making provinces. This seemed to cut them down, and I was able to mop up Afroca quite quickly.”
Now, since you obviously learned to have a healthy respect for the Moors, and you should have, your actions as described does not come as a big surprise! Besides, playing as Spain, I believe that you are forced to deal with the Moors sooner or later. And, the longer you wait to actually do that, the more formidable the Moors get. As stated in the campaign intro, you can’t match them in an arms race, they got more castles and at least as much florins as you do as Spain. I would say than the most important battle you have with the Moors is probably over Cordoba and Morocco. Once they have fallen, the strength of the Moors are too scattered and they usually don’t have florins and men to secure all their bordering provinces to full strength, thus giving you multiple alternatives of attack and the overall initiative (at least the way the AI usually behaves). But at the same time you will probably have to withstand a very possible counterattack or two.
The importances of economical aspects of redux do have a far greater impact on the game than what can be found in the original and your story here is testimony to that circumstance. As you might have guessed, this is consciously designed to be like that, because that’s the way I like it. As simple as that. The reasons for your successful mop up seems to be fairly obvious, they have less and less florins available and less and less castles to recruit those precious new troops in as well. The conclusion is accurate and correct to the given circumstances I think.
“I really like how redux rewards a well run economy. The changes to trade and agricultural returns are great.”
I have always felt that you should collect the well earned advantages of a well kept economy (I have discussed these things earlier on this thread, see post 31. If you not read that already that is, you might otherwise find it interesting). Redux is not in any way an exception in that regard. However, in the VI/2.01 version the importance of economy is more obvious and true than in V1.1 (structural and hardcoded reasons) since it has basically reduced all trade income to 50% or there about. Because of that, the importance of economy really is greater and thus making redux a bit harder than it is in the V1.1 version. As far as agricultural stuff goes, I always felt the original 4 steps was to little so I changed it to 6 steps instead (not to little not too much, I did a similar thing with the horse breeders). Frankly, I think that alteration makes the whole game better and more interesting. Anyways, I’m glad you like it, I do too…
“(I tend to finish up once the tide has turned in my favour - the spanish campaign saw my empire stretch from Portugal to Kazar, and from Tunisia to Norway, with only the Russians left in their top corner of the map)”
Not all does (finish up). May dare to ask at what difficulty setting this happened?
“I currently hold the french homelands, as well as Navarre, and a line of fortified provinces from Friesland to Burgundy. Just now building up a strikeforce of royal infantry, frankish knights and feudal bowmen to take back Iberia for the true faith :).”
Infantry (sword), now that is key. If I were forced to choose only one of the 3 major arms available in redux, it would have been infantry (preferably the heavy kind). Without enough solid infantry you probably will find many battles very hard to do. A few formations of well equipped, upgraded and trained infantry can under the command of an able general do devastating damage to a vastly superior force, especially if there are some woods around. Like the Frankish Knights Ehh? Anyways, good luck and be careful of the Russians and the devious Italians!
That’s is more like it; this is how I should have answered you the first time around Orph.
I have slapped myself in the head again so I don’t forget that next time….
:bow:
- Cheers
cambovenzi
09-26-2008, 06:49
i had a problem with installation.
i overwrote the files like it said in #2, and clicked medieval, and it was the exact same.
no mod.
Hi again cambovenzi and welcome to the redux area,
Let’s sort this thing out for you shall we? Post in your (exact) install path and also specify how many MTW’s you got installed on your PC. Also specify what redux material you have downloaded so far. Also post what version of MTW you got (I know that it is V.1.1, but do it anyway, so we got all the info in one place, for others to see).
After you have posted this stuff in, why don’t you have a look at post: 90, 94, 100, 104, 109, 112, 114, while you wait for an answer. Have look at these posts and chances are that you can solve it on your own that way. If you do, please post in that fact. At any rate, these posts have plenty of useful info for you and you current problem.
Once I get hold of the above specified info I or someone else around here will take it from there.
(“…i overwrote the files like it said in #2” of what?)
- Cheers
----------
Oh just so you know, we usually “hi” around here… :smile:
Hi Axalon,
Thanks for the indepth response!
I think I may have been too hasty in over-estimating the Moorish impact. My current French game has taken a completely different turn (one which I gave a slight push to accomplish).
So, standard scenario to begin with, I have all of France - having wiped out Burgundy and Aragon, and had a common border with the Moors in Cordoba - the Spanish and Portugese were still present, but only holding 2 and 1 provinces respectively.
I watched with trepidation as I shored up Valencia with 3 full stack royal infantry/frankish infantry (I love these guys) and assorted cav and archer regiments. The Moors had 6 full stack armies, predominatly Moorish infantry, but some nice special units mixed in as well.
I had one assassin, and the game gave me a 25% chance of killing the Moorish leader - which incidently was one of the highest percentages I've ever got on a leader, so I sent him in.
And, surprisingly he was successful. The Moors immediately break out in civil war - but with 4 of the armies joining the rebels. This happened in Granda as well, and after two more turns, the Moors were no more thanks to the rebels and the Saracens who had stormed across Africa and took Morroco.
So, it does indeed seem that any of the factions can dominate - which is great. I only out forward my earlier findings based on 2 and a half play throughs, which was an insufficient sample size.
I have to agree regarding infantry - RTW was my first TW game, so I am used to relying on the legion strengths, so am approaching MTW in the same way. Always have a core of sword/axe infantry, 2 spear regiments for the wings, and then archers and cav as auxiliary.
I hate asking stupid questions, but I want to make sure I do this right: What exactly do I need to install in order to play Redux with MTW/VI 2.01? Is it a single download, or do I have to install something else first?
alphington
09-27-2008, 04:44
This is a great mod, thanks to Axalon for all his work it's excellent.
All has gone well for my v1.1 plus Redux but I just hit a slight problem. Playing the English I have commanded attacks and battled successfully in Northumbria, Brittany and a couple of others but on invading Scotland and choosing to command the attack personally (I always go for this option) the battle would not load and I got a message "Hard-Sprites failed to load" - the only way out was the escape key and back to the game but with my invading army now back in base as if they never entered Scotland. Not wishing to miss out on a fight with the Highlanders I ended up doing a new install of the game and reduxing it again and then putting in the save game - same result! i tried invading about 4 other countries/provinces and in each case all worked normally in order to give me a battle to command. So up to now it's only Scotland that has this problem.
so i guess either there is some problem in my save game that replicated the issue in the newly installed reduxed version or perhaps some glitch in the mod?
cambovenzi
09-27-2008, 05:47
Hi again cambovenzi and welcome to the redux area,
Let’s sort this thing out for you shall we? Post in your (exact) install path and also specify how many MTW’s you got installed on your PC. Also specify what redux material you have downloaded so far. Also post what version of MTW you got (I know that it is V.1.1, but do it anyway, so we got all the info in one place, for others to see).
After you have posted this stuff in, why don’t you have a look at post: 90, 94, 100, 104, 109, 112, 114, while you wait for an answer. Have look at these posts and chances are that you can solve it on your own that way. If you do, please post in that fact. At any rate, these posts have plenty of useful info for you and you current problem.
Once I get hold of the above specified info I or someone else around here will take it from there.
(“…i overwrote the files like it said in #2” of what?)
- Cheers
----------
Oh just so you know, we usually “hi” around here… :smile:
alright ill give it a shot.
only 1 MTW on the computer.
C:\Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War
v 1.1
and i downloaded the .rar version on the first page.
there was 2 ways it gave me how to install it.
#2 seemed easier so i did that.
it instructed me to rename and replace/overwrite the medieval - total war file as redux - total war.
i did so, and it overwrote it.
and it said that was all i needed to do.
but when i went into the game, it was the same as before:dizzy2:
ill go check out those post #'s you gave me a little more in depth now.
and get back to you.
Hello everyone and special welcome to Alphington, both to the Org. and to the redux corner, also many thanks for the praise as well (Orph, maybe I could get back to your stuff later?). Martok please excuse me for a short moment….
Cambovenzi: I would personally recommend the “happy 7”-install model of William the Silent (post:109) since that seems to be the simplest way to install (Will I’m gone credit you for that!). What you need to have an optimal redux going is listed below. And you need to install the fix after you installed redux. Start with that and see how things go. And yes, please do report back here with your progress. Good luck!
Alphington: this problem you are describing seems strange and with the limited amount of info I got, my only conclusion can be that it is a corrupted save in this case. Because I can’t replicate what you are describing, hence we can almost certainly rule out the possibility that it has anything to do with redux.
My guess is therefore that it is a corrupted save you got and that has also nothing to do with redux. MTW V.1.1 simply is not as stable as the VI/2.01. And corrupted saves have their origins from flaws in the CA coding of the gameprogram running MTW, as sad and simple as that (thus I would advice you to do regular “Mastersaves”, at the very beginning of the turn, before you do anything). I have run redux on V.1.1 easily more than 1000 times, and believe me this is not related to redux in any way. Because if it was, I would have discovered it long time ago. Now, I can only offer my sympathies for you, but that’s how things have turned out for you, sorry.
Feel free to post in the exact specifications of which units that where involved in the battle for Scotland. Yours and the rebels, and I will when time allows, double-check if all those troops functions properly and as supposed to. Then we will have a final and certain answer regarding this. Hope this cleared things up for you and again I’m glad you like redux! :mickey:
Martok: Sorry for that…. Its quite alright man, we all must do the “stupid questions routine” now and then whether we like it or not. At least I have proved that on more than one occasion. :smile:
Now for the sake of clarity for others than yourself, I’ll also include some stuff regarding the V.1.1 as well in a separate section below. Here are the exact specifications of what you need and it must be installed in that order: (in spoiler)
Redux on VI/2.01 you exactly need:
------------------------------------
MTW-VI + Patch 2.01 + MTW Redux 1.0 + VI BETA a + VI TAC FIX = Current optimal version of redux
However, this will change with the soon to be released formal VI-upgrade 1.0. Then it will be like this:
MTW-VI + Patch 2.01 + MTW Redux 1.0 + VI upgrade 1.0 = New optimal version of redux.
All installed in that sequential order….
Now, after the releases of the formal VI-upgrade 1.0 and you already got a redux install, it will be like this:
MTW-VI + Patch 2.01 + MTW Redux 1.0 + VI BETA a + VI TAC FIX + VI upgrade 1.0 = New optimal version of redux on VI/2.01.
As in, you simply download the VI-upgrade 1.0 and then install it on top of all the rest….
------------------------------------
AND FOR THE OTHER VERSION
------------------------------------
Redux on V.1.1 you exactly need:
------------------------------------
MTW + Patch 1.1 + MTW Redux 1.0 + Islamic castle fix = Current optimal version of redux on V.1.1
However, this will change with the soon to be released “Superfix for V.1.1”. Then it will be like this:
MTW + Patch 1.1 + MTW Redux 1.0 + Superfix = New optimal version of redux on V.1.1
All installed in that sequential order….
Now, after the releases of the Superfix for V.1.1 and you already got a redux install, it will be like this:
MTW + Patch 1.1 + MTW Redux 1.0 + Islamic castle fix + Superfix = New optimal version of redux on V.1.1
As in, you simply download the Superfix and then install it on top of all the rest….
------------------------------------
Now, the VI-upgrade 1.0 and the Superfix will be released separately I guess, as in when I finish them basically. The end result when both are released is that both redux versions VI/2.01 and V1.1 will for the first time have some proper conformity. As in you could play a V.1.1 version and essentially discuss your experiences with a person who plays on a VI/2.01 version of redux….
All the stuff that you need to make redux happen are uploaded over here:
Filefront:
--------
http://hosted.filefront.com/Urwon
Atomic gamer:
-------------
http://www.atomicgamer.com/directory.php?id=13253
------------------------------------
Hope all of that sorted things out for you Martok (and everybody else).
- Cheers
----------
I’m off to the countryside today to be peasant-like so I won’t be able to help you guys personally until sunday evening or there about. Hopefully some of the other cheerful guys here at the redux corner will help you out until then. :mickey:
alphington
09-27-2008, 14:46
Thanks for your reply Axalon - I will just deal with the save game issue and 'battle on' :) after your response I'm convinced this is nothing to do with redux - i'll just start up again and do master saves regularly.
cambovenzi
09-28-2008, 12:08
yeah, thanks for reply.
i did what you said from post 109
and its working beautifully.
pretty cool and different so far.
William the Silent
09-29-2008, 02:50
I think that what is going wrong with installations is that the Mod is unzipped towards the "Medieval Total War" file (this puts the complete file inside the "Medieval Total War" file, which is wrong).
It has to be towards the "Total War" file in "Program Files" (if you're talking about the automatic installation path of MTW).
Baron von Manteuffel
09-29-2008, 21:41
I think that what is going wrong with installations is that the Mod is unzipped towards the "Medieval Total War" file (this puts the complete file inside the "Medieval Total War" file, which is wrong).
It has to be towards the "Total War" file in "Program Files" (if you're talking about the automatic installation path of MTW).
Yes but don't forget the .rar file when unzipped is Redux - Total War, so unless they're fully aware of that little tidbit, it still won't be an automatic installation path. :no: Instead of assuming that a mod installs to the main directory,:lam: a good safe practice for any mod installation might be to create a new folder on your desktop and unzip the .rar in that folder. :idea2: Then you can view the entire contents of the mod and notice things like the folders name before you try to overwrite anything. This has saved me a lot of headaches with mods in the past. My :2cents:.
Hello everyone and I’m glad that each problem has been sorted!
Alphington: Yes, do the “Master Saves” because my guess is that you won’t be sorry for it, especially when MTW fusses with you again (and it will). Otherwise enjoy redux and feel free to post in any questions and other stuff, and do stick around here at the redux area! :smile:
Cambovenzi: Excellent news! I’m glad all your installation problems have been sorted for you. Now, didn’t I say that we could solve them? He he! Do enjoy redux and I hope to "read you" here more. :smile:
Orph: I won’t give you some big answers this time but here is a shorted version. The story of the assassin is an illuminating example that everything doesn’t have to be settled at the battlefield. And yes, (almost) all factions (Portugal seems to me to be the usual exception to the rule, personally I have only seen such tendencies once from Portugal) have the chance to grow strong and expansionistic. Thus making redux an ever changing game with a strong replayability factor which is a thing that I always valued in the original, but perhaps that factor is even stronger in redux.
Now your example of Valencia clearly indicates the importance of infantry. I you would have attacked without a strong core of infantry you might have very well lost that battle because the Moorish Infantry would have grinded down your cavalry and what else that were around after that. And don’t underestimate their archers either because those guys can do some serious damage if you allow them to operate unhindered. Anyways one of the big overall advantages of infantry is that they can fight in any terrain, at any condition (short of desert, because that area really is punishing for all heavy/medium formations. The Islamic factions will never be as strong as they are there.). Cavalry and archers need open spaces, and archers are dependant on good weather as well. Now, I am fairly certain that we all can agree that such circumstances is not present at all times, thus making such troops usually forced to fight at various kinds of disadvantages.
William: Thanks for guarding the fort man…
“I think that what is going wrong with installations is that the Mod is unzipped towards the "Medieval Total War" file (this puts the complete file inside the "Medieval Total War" file, which is wrong). It has to be towards the "Total War" file in "Program Files" (if you're talking about the automatic installation path of MTW).”
Yes, all the install-problems up till now have had one thing in common. As in the mix-up of the “Total War”-folder and the “Medieval/Redux – Total War”- folder (which is found within the Total War”-folder). At any rate, these problems seem to be rather small and limited since we have had only a few people that have posted in these problems (I hope this holds true!). Roughly 5 out of 300 or so (current statistics), as about 1,6% of the known downloads (even if I do have a hard time believing that there are some 300 active redux players out there). Anyways, as long as the troubles are limited to this we should now have little problems in sorting them out if and when they do occur.
Baron von M: Amen to that…
----------------------------------------------------
GOOD NEWS!
The Release of the “Redux VI-upgrade 1.0” is just around the corner and is scheduled to be released within roughly 48 hours (This is needed to play redux if you got a V.2.01 of MTW). On top of that the release of the “Superfix V.1.1” will also be released in close proximity as well. The Superfix V.1.1 is an update for all players running redux on MTW V.1.1 and it makes the current version “catch up” as much as possible with the changes and alterations made on redux during the development of VI-upgrade 1.0. Thus creating some sort of conformity between the VI-2.01 version and the V.1.1 version (for the first time since the VI-Beta was released.). This will mean that two players of different versions will be able to have similar experiences of redux and thus can have a discussion of redux if they wanted to (even if they play different versions of it).
Details on what both the VI-upgrade 1.0 and the Superfix V.1.1 will do:
* Killing all known bugs and errors that have been charted in redux so far.
* Slight AI-adjustments.
* Minor fine-tuning of a few units.
* Corrections regarding various availability issues for various factions (unlocking units etc.)
* Rebellion values adjusted and fine-tuned.
* GFX-corrections and a few additions.
* Some audio corrections for campmap and frontend.
* Secret new tactical units… But be adviced they are not many! However, they are recruitable.
* New reworked “Mercenary Magnetism”-model, as in making it easier to recruit various mercenaries in well developed areas.
* Slight adjustments and alterations in the troubled Moorish Campaign in ReduxSPC. Making it more stable (Malta has been removed, this is a V.1.1 issue).
* ReduxSPC difficulty levels and campaign settings altered and starting cash changed.
VI-upgrade 1.0 exclusive:
* The Russian faction is unlocked for the player (functions very well).
* Harsher economical framework applied (thus making it a harder game than the V.1.1 version).
* All factions unlocked for reduxMP and additional commentary and info regarding reduxMP (it's is due to structural differences to V.1.1).
Both will be available in zip/rar compressions and at different locations (if some link would go bad) and they are to be downloaded separately (as in, you don’t have to download the superfix to get the VI-upgrade for your MTW V.2.01. You just download what you need, nothing else. And of course it is the other way around for V.1.1 users). As soon as I release one of them and all stuff are in place I will set up the links for it. :mickey:
- Cheers
cambovenzi
09-30-2008, 10:21
yep.
thanks again.
i almost forgot what i was going to say.
I was wondering if there was a way to fix my new faction leader basically magically teleporting away once the king dies.
i had him and my king down fighting a war, and he was a 6 star general of a big army.
my king dies of illness or something, and my new king gets bounced back to the capitol, far away from the battle.
so i lose 2 generals.
yep.
thanks again.
i almost forgot what i was going to say.
I was wondering if there was a way to fix my new faction leader basically magically teleporting away once the king dies.
i had him and my king down fighting a war, and he was a 6 star general of a big army.
my king dies of illness or something, and my new king gets bounced back to the capitol, far away from the battle.
so i lose 2 generals.
I believe that's hard-coded and can't be changed. When your faction leader dies and the crown prince ascends to the throne, he automatically appears in your most developed province (since theoretically that should be your "capital").
That's why if you own Constantinople, your newly-crown faction leader will often appear there -- it starts out with a Citadel and often has a large number of high-level buildings.
cambovenzi
10-02-2008, 17:07
I believe that's hard-coded and can't be changed. When your faction leader dies and the crown prince ascends to the throne, he automatically appears in your most developed province (since theoretically that should be your "capital").
That's why if you own Constantinople, your newly-crown faction leader will often appear there -- it starts out with a Citadel and often has a large number of high-level buildings.
ah.
that makes sense i guess. he would have to return to the capital to be crowned i suppose.
i was afraid it might be hardcoded:furious3:
still not helping me any if im fighting the egyptians and all of a sudden both my only (6+ star) generals are gone.
one back to spain...:dizzy2: and one dead.:skull:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/screens/RX_2ndEd_VImodule01.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106497)
Ok, I have released the “official” MTW-redux VI-upgrade 1.0. Click on the pic to get to the download area (or click
on my signature, it will also have the same effect). Hope you guys have lots of fun with redux while using this module.
Finally, could someone please verify that it actually works?!? :bow:
Enjoy!
Hi Axalon
I can confirm this works - and it's quick to get and install. I was playing as the Russians about 5 mins after spotting this while browsing with a cup of tea! I'm not expecting a huge amount of changes, but curious to see what's new.
Hi Wes!
That's good news! You know, you’re a rock you know that? He he! I have been running up and down cleaning this thread (as in removing all the now obsolete VI-links). I appreciate that you verified the VI-upgrade functionality for me (just like old times eh?! He he!). By the way, I credited you in the “ReadMe”-file. As for the changes there are some here and there, but it’s more fun if you find them out on your own. Again, many thanks for helping me out in the development of this module. Oh, and enjoy the module!
Cheers man! :mickey:
Gah. I thought I'd followed the installation instructions in the Readme (for both Redux and the VI Upgrade) correctly, but apparently not. Nothing happens when I click on the game's icon, nor when I try running it directly from the CD/DVD drive. I tried to uninstall (and then do a reinstall), but I'm now getting an error message that reads "Could not open INSTALL.LOG file". :wall:
Any ideas?
@ Martok
Have you tried starting the game using the .exe in the Redux folder? For some weird reason it did not work for me either when I tried to run it from the original MTW/VI desktop shortcut. I would guess you do not have a Medieval - Total War folder any more (probably renamed to Redux or whatever) that is what the shortcut is looking for.
If that works, just create a shortcut to that .exe and your problem will be solved.
Hmm. Couldn't find the .exe file, which only further confirms my suspicions that I did in fact screw up the install somehow.
Fortunately, I think I have finally managed to uninstall the game, so I'm going to try a fresh install and see if that helps. :sweatdrop:
Hello guys,
Martok: Ok, let’s solve this for you shall we? I would be very surprised if this is not a screwed up install issue. This is essentially post:127 and bits of 132 all over again but what the hell, it is for a good cause.
“Post in your (exact) install path and also specify how many MTW’s you got installed on your PC. Also specify exactly what redux material you have downloaded so far. Also post what version of MTW you got…" (I know that it is VI, but do it anyway, so we got all the info in one place, for all others to see).
”After you have posted this stuff in, why don’t you have a look at post: 90, 94, 100, 104, 109, 112, 114, while you wait for an answer. Have look at these posts and chances are that you can solve it on your own that way. If you do, please post in that fact. At any rate, these posts have plenty of useful info for you and you current problem.”
The only safe way to do initial start-ups with redux is the “Medieval_TW.exe” found in the game folder (as in were reduxed Medieval/Redux – Total War is installed). There are plenty of things that could potentially go wrong otherwise. Once the install is correct and redux is running the way it should, you can manufacture new shortcuts for the desktop or whatever, but stick to this initially because it’s safer that way. Oh, and the way to check if you got the install right go to the “Quickstart”-folder (in the gamefolder) and open to look for any filenames that contains “redux” in any way, if there are, the install is correct. If not, the install have failed again.
Bits of post:132. “I would personally recommend the “happy 7”-install model of William the Silent (post:109) since that seems to be the simplest way to install…” (Will, you got a credit for that in VI-upgrade!). “What you need to have an optimal redux going…” you already got as far as I can tell (MTW-Redux + VI-upgrade 1.0). While I’m doing recommendations, it would probably be advantageous for you to have a clean and fully patched reference-copy of MTW-VI for safekeeping. This will above all save you time from doing traditional installs, as in you simply copy the ref-copy to the place you want your clean RAW-copy of MTW-VI to overwrite with redux or any other mod-version for that matter. Report back here with your progress. Good luck! :bow:
(If this is an install-matter, we will solve it. Of that I am pretty sure, but I must have the requested stuff to help you further here.)
Joh: quite an entrance! Hehe! Holding the fort the very first thing you did here! My thanks and welcome to you, Joh! I hope that everything is working out satisfactory for you and I am looking forward to your comments regarding redux and I really hope that you like some of it. At any rate, the TWC redux-thread could really use a few posts that show all the people there, that redux is indeed playable and it could actually be fun while doing just that. Because it really hard to maintain that thread otherwise. I really hope to "read you" here (or there!) some more from now on. Oh, which solution did you end up with by the way? Did the drivers work?!?
(Any other redux player are of course invited to also pay the TWC thread (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=190721/vb) a visit, “you” are even more invited to show the “TWC people” there that redux is indeed playable and fun. At any rate, it’s very different there so far, compared to our cosy redux corner here at the Org.)
Ok, I’m off to the salt mines again to finish up the “Superfix V.1.1” for all you guys that are running redux on a MTW V.1.1.
- Cheers
---------
I guess that general reference-guide as in "the fools install guide!" where all the various ways of successful installs of redux could be presented is probably a good idea. Anyone interested in compiling all relevant posts and doing an easy to use overall guide that we all could use as a reference?!? With pics and red pointers and the full manual-ish package? Because I get the feeling that I am not the best person to write it. Anyone interested? :smile:
Zasz1234
10-04-2008, 19:41
Hi Axalon, thanks again for the mod, but it is giving me some trouble.
It runs fine for quite some time, maybe 100 turns or so then it will crash and give me this message when I move into the tactical battle mode:
fclose(0008A2860) - "Invalid Argument"(22)
C:\Med_Patch\Crusaders_TW\errmess.cpp(288)
Sorry if this has been repeated elswhere.
EDIT: oh yeah, and I'm playing version 1.1
Hi there Zasz,
Let me first repeat what I said to Alphington back in post 132:
…this problem you are describing seems strange and with the limited amount of info I got, my only conclusion can be that it is a corrupted save in this case. I have played redux way beyond 100 turns myself and can’t remember anything like this at all" …hence we can almost certainly rule out the possibility that it has anything to do with redux.
"…it is a corrupted save you got and that has also nothing to do with redux. MTW V.1.1 simply is not as stable as the VI/2.01. And corrupted saves have their origins from flaws in the CA coding of the gameprogram running MTW, as sad and simple as that (thus I would advice you to do regular “Mastersaves”, at the very beginning of the turn, before you do anything). I have run redux on V.1.1 easily more than 1000 times, and believe me this is not related to redux in any way. Because if it was, I would have discovered it long time ago. Now, I can only offer my sympathies for you, but that’s how things have turned out for you, sorry.
Having repeated this I can only think of two possible answers for you. 1. you have tinkered with the “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt”-file and it has become corrupted (that happens). 2. A corrupt save as mentioned and discussed above. Sorry but there you have it.
Because if it was connected to redux I would have discovered it long time ago. As I said I have played way beyond 100 turns running redux on MTW V.1.1. However, in order to do that I did save a horde of games and a small legion of mastersaves. It’s the flaws in the gameprogram that forces you to do that if you don’t want do 10-20 turns all over again… My suggestion to you is to not trust those autosaves, they aren’t that trustworthy in my book, its way better to do mastersaves (however that do demand more work on your part). I’m afraid that your only option is to go back to another save and take it from there. For what’s its worth, you are not the only one who had this fate (not even in redux). It is a bitter lesson about these mastersaves and you just found out the hard way. For that I am sorry, but you can be sure of one this, it will happen again for you. Mastersaves is the only known way around it, sorry. :bow:
THE FOOLS INSTALL GUIDE!
----------------------------
From one thing to another, this is for all you guys who have (or will have) trouble installing redux I have done a little something to seriously combat those issues from now on, and hopefully this will be the end of it. I guess that only time will tell if that’s true, but that is what I am hoping for here. Now, here is my penance for not being clear enough regarding these things (hopefully I am now), so without further a due and fresh out from the redux lab, here is “the fools install guide”. Enjoy! :laugh4:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/universal/RX_FoolsInstall.gif
Is this clear enough for everyone?!? :smile:
- Cheers
-----------
BTW, the redux “Superfix V.1.1” will be released within 24hrs.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/SupFix_banner.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106497)
Ok, I have released the “Superfix V.1.1”. Click on the pic to get to the download and info area (or click on my signature, it will also have the same effect). Hope you guys running redux upon v.1.1 have lots of fun with while using this!
However, due to the eternal wisdom of the filefront management I was recently forced to do a new upload of the full MTW-redux.rar package. Because of that I have the past few days been building a new and fully updated version of the standard redux package, the MTW-Redux 1.0b. The superfix is all included in this new edition and there are some other new stuff included there as well, including the new “fools install guide”. Thus there will only be one single download from now on (knock on wood!), as long as you play upon MTW v.1.1. The VI-players still have to download the VI-upgrade module to make redux compatible with that.
In other words, the superfix is only really useful to those of you who have a copy of the initial and first edition of redux, and at the same time only have access to MTW v.1.1. The Superfix is essentially for you guys who are not that interested in downloading the full new version of MTW-redux 1.0b (then again perhaps there are some that do want to have all the files in one single package, then by all means download the new version. After all this is all up to you guys.).
At any rate, I have now uploaded and put up the new stuff. I have also put up a new threadheader pic for the redux area (again one of the girls from the princess department has graciously agreed to be the new poster-girl for redux. He he!). Perhaps the redux corner will be fully operational from now on or at least for a while (or perhaps some other link will go down, we’ll see I guess). Anyways, the new links are in place and the redux area is now wide open for business again.
(Due to recent developments, I will soon start removing obsolete links and deleting the obsolete fixes and files. Maybe I’ll keep an old “1.0” for ref-purpouses. We’ll see)
- Cheers
---------
well, this is my 100th post it seems....
Joh: quite an entrance! Hehe! Holding the fort the very first thing you did here! My thanks and welcome to you, Joh!
Well, you know, sometimes you just have to give something back :yes:.
Anyhow, just for your info, I spent a fortune in dark chocolate (not flowers) and was then allowed by headquarters to use my good old computer (related to http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3715296#post3715296). Of course, I could not wait until the release of VI upgrade, so I have comments on both the pre and post "patch" releases. And yes, as you could have guessed, I am using the VI2.01 version.
First of all, installation worked flawlessly, so no complains there. Stability is just a charm, no problem whatsoever. I read somewhere about the "clone" bug, but I do not think I have suffered from it (anyway since I do not really know what that is this is just a guess).
Pre VI-Upgrade campaign
Playing with Italy on hard (I know I am a sissy, but I had not played MTW for more than 4-5 years). I found it rather easy, as money rolls in through Venice (4.5k a turn now). I must have played something like 50 turns/years (??? sorry but I do not even know whether that is the same). Managed to take all the Italian peninsula and Sicily, nowadays Croatia and Bosnia-Herzegovina, South France, Crete, Rhodes and Malta islands (Cyprus was captured by the Saracens) and Milan. Campaign bullets, aka my thoughts (most likely some are hardcoded issues):
Italy gets too much money (don't know after VI upgrade)
AI cannot handle see trade, my ships are the only ones there (after getting rid of some nasty pirates) creating a trade network covering most of the map. Maybe sea trade needs to be reworked or tunned down for the player?
Italy is the richest, strongest and most developed country in the game.
Islands did not have any garrison (just disembark and the province is yours)
High-tech Italian units are inexpensive and easy to get (maybe related to first point?)
No wars apart from my own have broken out, but there are some MAJOR standing armies out there
What's up with all those alliances between everybody?
Abbey picture which has been mentioned and fixed
Post VI-upgrade campaign
Playing with the Russians on hard (yeah, read above comment). So far, played ~75 turns/years. Ok, I did NOT find this one easy. Money is very difficult to come by, cheap troops are not that good and there are some "scripted events" that did not make it easy at all. The initial development is not that good and it is difficult to find funds to improve your provinces, which means you will see the "not enough funds" quite often.
Regarding stage, I own the north-east part of the map, from Lithuania and Kiev to Khazar (Lithuania was thereby eliminated by Russian might). Only recently I managed to start some sea-trade network that is giving me some money. Novgorod is my best province now (2k per turn), followed by Livonia (spelling???) and Finland (which is a crappy province, so you can imagine the rest of the empire). My thoughts:
Civil Wars. Don't think they were there in vanilla MTW/VI. They are THE BEST feature I have found in Redux so far, mostly for the role playing kind of players. They can be devastating for your empire though. After two plots against my King/Prince, I just found out I have to kill any low-loyalty heir in my kingdom. Since then, I have been doing a lot of suicide missions :smash:.
Again, AI cannot handle see trade, my ships are the only ones there (this time, I was not even bothered by pirates, just a single ship) creating a trade network covering most of the map. Maybe sea trade needs to be reworked or tunned down for the player?
High-tech Russian units. They might be good, but they are so damned expensive (purchase and upkeep) I cannot even think about buying them. Maybe tune down a bit? I do not know what is going to happen when I have to fight some large Catholic power, whose units are supposed to be better.
Again, too many alliances between nations. Everybody is allied to everybody (ok, almost since I lost some allies when I attacked Lithuania)
Now, here is a good surprise. AI HAS BEEN QUITE ACTIVE. Portugal was destroyed by the Moors, Hungary by Poland (???), Poland was displaced from the Baltic by the Norse/Danes, England has finally conquered the whole island, and the Byzantines look really threatening on my southern borders.
The Moors are the richest, the French the strongest and the HRE is the most advanced.
I keep on discovering assassins from the Moors, sometimes several a turn.
All-and-all, a very interesting campaign.
Well, definitely no game breaking bugs, or even annoying bugs, just minor misspells here and there (specifically verbal tenses but that was to be expected from a Scandinavian :laugh4:. Sorry had to mention it, living in DK and sharing office with a Norwegian, so they laugh about my English pronunciation and I do it about their English grammar).
Ok, that was all for now. Sorry for the long post and personal comments, but since this seems to be a very specific thread I would not imagine anybody getting too upset about that :laugh4:.
Cheers everybody,
Joh
Hi there Joh,
I don’t care about posts being big, just as long as they are interesting, which I think your post is. I can only whish that we got more of these here at the redux corner (and I do appreciate that you bothered to write and post in your remarks and thoughts. I want more of that around here. And especially at the TWC thread, oh boy could it use some of that!). Not only is it more fun and interesting for me to read, but far more importantly it provides valuable perspectives to all redux players! “Are the Italians to easy”? “Is the HRE is impossible to play?”, “how do I survive with Spain?”, “French cavalry rocks!”, that sort of thing. I would actually like to have a more debate-ish climate here at the redux area, because I am not that enthusiastic on the prospect that almost everything is dependant on me to make things happen and going around here. As in we limit ourselves to various problems with the game-program itself and install issues and all that stuff (which of course should be sorted out!). And, as much as I like to help out and answer various in-game questions of different kinds, I feel that it is also too dependant on me, and I don’t want that. I want a vivid thread with several debates going regarding reduxed who knows what, without me taking part in it all, if you understand what I mean.
Now some general comments on your post then; as you already said many things here are hardcoded issues, trade being one of the most obvious. In the VI-version of redux trade is roughly cut about 50% to at least contain that problem somewhat. I actually don’t dare to cut it anymore, at least not for now. The firm alliance politics all over Europe are also one these things that I cant do much about. It’s just like the original; everybody wants to be allies with everybody, regardless of religion and such stuff. Oh, I call it turns as well… The only years I have ever played was in Shogun-TW.
I also got some more "detailed remarks" for you hidden in the spoiler below, because it's all "so secret" you know. :mickey:
“…getting rid of some nasty pirates…”
This is a redux feature. Also one the ways I have tried to combat the “trade-situation” with. Besides, if there are sea areas in the game, should there not be some pirates in there now and then?!? The frequency of these pirates are connected to available rebel ports and the development of that area.
“Italy is the richest, strongest and most developed country in the game. ”
Well, they are in that particular campaign obviously. However, I doubt if that is true all the time. Redux has a nice habit of being ever changing from one game to the next, this is my experience at least (and that conclusion seems to be shared by others as well). Although, Venice is an economical strong point in the redux design and without it the Italians will find all things much more difficult. Essentially it is the “Constantinople” for the Italians or what Paris is for the French. A worthy contender is of course Milan (however that is in Lombard possession by default Redux-SPC design). Some provinces are more important than others in a strict economical and strategical sense, Venice (along with Milan) is without doubt one of the more important ones in that region. It’s all in the campaign “startpos-file” (ReduxSPC-file).
“Islands did not have any garrison”
It’s consciously designed that way. Taking an island is one thing, hold on to it tends to be quite another (besides this is not true for all islands, some have rebel garrisons. Ireland, Sicily and Sardinia are examples of that). He he!
“No wars apart from my own have broken out, but there are some MAJOR standing armies out there”
Again this tends to vary from game to game. However, the AI usually is a coward and the massive armies you see is probably a symptom of that. It’s more or less an arms race. As in, “oh my neighbour has more troops than me, commission more men!”. And, after a while all the bordering provinces are so well defended that the AI does not “dare” to attack if there is none inviting and “coward-safe” possibility for it. My guess is that this is what you are experiencing in this case. Again this can very well change in the next game.
“Civil Wars. Don't think they were there in vanilla MTW/VI. They are THE BEST feature I have found in Redux so far, mostly for the role playing kind of players. They can be devastating for your empire though. After two plots against my King/Prince, I just found out I have to kill any low-loyalty heir in my kingdom.”
Well, all I can say is that all my extensive tinkering with the game files have now and then created some nice side-effect results. My guess is that this is one of these. Because I have worked with redux for so long that not even I can remember all the things I have done with it! Besides, redux is so different from the original game that the game-program seems to be a bit “lost” compared to the original MTW’s standard patterns of behaviour. This makes the AI a bit more unpredictable and thus we get a more interesting and fun game on our hands, a trait that I personally like very much.
“High-tech Russian units. They might be good, but they are so damned expensive (purchase and upkeep) I cannot even think about buying them. Maybe tune down a bit? I do not know what is going to happen when I have to fight some large Catholic power, whose units are supposed to be better.”
Who said anything that this was going to be easy? He he! Maybe my difficulty rating might be off, but the eastern part of the “strat-map” is not nearly as rich as areas around France (Aquitaine, Ile de France, Anjou etc.) and Italian region (Venice, Milan, Genoa and Naples) etc. And that reality does make an impact in the game. If France can secure its riches it has every opportunity to get strong and powerful (as can essentially all factions in redux actually). But France must first secure supremacy over those riches, and that is not always easy. Redux is designed that way. Venice is great to be master of, but that view is also shared with the AI, thus you will sooner or later have to defend it to keep it under “your management”. By the way, you have now first hand discovered the “cultural differences” that are a factor in redux. Playing one faction in redux will not present that many similar circumstances as in playing another faction. This is far more true and explicit than it ever was in the original MTW. Culture and/or “tactical profile” along with relevant tech-trees and other stuff come to play in redux (including florins). This is all part of the redux design. Actually the Russian “top-notch” units are not more expensive than others units, it based on the very same unit-cost-formula. It’s just that you don’t have Venice anymore… He he!
“Now, here is a good surprise. AI HAS BEEN QUITE ACTIVE. Portugal was destroyed by the Moors, Hungary by Poland (???), Poland was displaced from the Baltic by the Norse/Danes, England has finally conquered the whole island, and the Byzantines look really threatening on my southern borders.”
“The Moors are the richest, the French the strongest and the HRE is the most advanced.”
I believe I have already covered most of this earlier, but, your own remarks here serves excellently as an examples of the diversity and seemingly ever changing face and circumstances found in redux. One campaign tends to be quite different from another. And I like and want this kind diversity and unpredictability. The original MTW usually have a set of patterns it follows and that is not as much fun to play. I do prefer the reduxed way instead.
“All-and-all, a very interesting campaign.”
Great! Let’s hope that you get to play plenty more of those! ….How, shall I phrase this diplomatically? …It’s not a mere chance that I did develop redux.
“…just minor misspells here and there.”
Well… I certainly tried to kill them all but there is always some stuff that gets thru isn’t it? Feel free to PM me the various errors of this kind you have found out and I will probably fix it later on, and I will credit you for it.
Ok, that a wrap for this time Joh! Again, thanks for sharing and posting in your remarks and experiences with redux with the rest of us!
Cheers!
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Martok, I would love to help you out if you are still having problems but, I must have some more and additional Intel to be able to do that. If things have worked out for you, splendid, but please post in that fact so I can consider the matter solved and closed (to me it is the only acceptable option).
THE FOOLS INSTALL GUIDE!
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From one thing to another, this is for all you guys who have (or will have) trouble installing redux I have done a little something to seriously combat those issues from now on, and hopefully this will be the end of it. I guess that only time will tell if that’s true, but that is what I am hoping for here. Now, here is my penance for not being clear enough regarding these things (hopefully I am now), so without further a due and fresh out from the redux lab, here is “the fools install guide”. Enjoy! :laugh4:
http://static3.filefront.com/images/personal/u/Urwon/148509/helrchlmtd.jpg
Is this clear enough for everyone?!? :smile:
- Cheers
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BTW, the redux “Superfix V.1.1” will be released within 24hrs.
Okay. Obviously, I'm still doing something incorrectly here. :wall:
I tried installation method #1 (the red version), but then the game simply refused to start. And yes, I did make sure that both files were the same name (I named them both Redux -- Total War).
After reinstalling the game from scratch again, I then tried installation method #2 (the blue version). The game starts up just fine....but it's just the regular Viking Invasion (2.01 version). There's no indication of any kind that the Redux Mod has been installed. :dizzy2:
@Martok
I will just focus on the red model (the one I used). I am talking by heart, but I think I will get it right. On a side note, adding unmatched memory to your existing RAM can make unrar process unstable/unreliable. So, if you have recently partially upgraded your RAM, go back to your original configuration.
Anyway, here is the list.
Install MTW
Patch to 1.1 I believe
Instal VI (optional, but you will get improved stability)
Patch to 2.01 (of course, only if VI has been installed)
Select your Medieval - Total War folder, copy and paste it without leaving directory/folder. There should appear a "Copy of Medieval - Total War" now. This way, you have a fresh copy and do not need to reinstall everytime you mess up. Additionally, you can have multiple mods (Remember to copy your copy before modifying it though).
Now, rename your original Medieval - Total War, to Redux - Total War. So now you can see a Redux - Total War and a Copy of Medieval - Total War.
Unpack Redux where ever you want. You will get a Redux - Total War folder.
Select the unpacked Redux - Total War folder and copy it. Two options: Ctrl+C, or mouse right click and Copy.
Go to your folder where you can see both Redux - Total War and Copy of Medieval - Total War. Paste the folder you copied in the previous step (unpacked Redux - Total War). Again, two options: Ctrl+V or mouse right click and then paste. It should tell you that there is already a folder called Redux - Total War and that pasting could damage it. Say yes, or overwrite or what ever the message is. If it does not tell you anything, you are doing something wrong.
***EDIT*** Do the above for both Redux 1.0 and Redux VI upgrade (OK, my memory failed me. What's up?, I am just an old man)
You are done. Now let's start the game. Go to your Redux - Total War folder and double click on the .exe file you have there. Do NOT tell me you do not have an .exe file, it is there.
Does Redux start fine? Yes: HURRA!!!!; No: you are SCREWED.
Now, I am assuming it did start but you do not want to have to look for the .exe file all the time. Well, go to your desktop, mouse right click, select new and then shortcut. Browse until you get to the .exe file in your Redux - Total War folder. Name it Redux, or whatever you want. Now you can start the Redux from the desktop, or you should be able to.
Last step for real pickies (aka nerds like myself). I do not like having the same launch icon for normal/vanilla Medieval - Total War and Redux - Total War. No problem. Download this EXCELLENT and FREE image managing program (Irfanview, from http://www.irfanview.com/), install it, and start it. Now go to the first post of the thread, right click of the first image and select copy. Go to Irfanview, Edit and then paste. The picture should be on the canvas now. Left click and hold making a box around the beautiful Medieval - Total War - Redux letters there. Select Edit and then Crop selection. Almost there. Select File - Save as. Now, as "Save in" you browse to reach your Redux - Total War folder (make sure Redux - Total War is part of the path in the "Save in" line, that is, you are saving this image inside the folder). For the "File name" field, I do not care, but something like ReduxIcon. IMPORTANT now, for "Save as type" select ICO - Windows Icon. Make sure this new file is inside Redux - Total War folder.
Finally, go to your desktop and mouse right click on your Redux shortcut, Properties, Change Icon..., Browse... until you find your new ReduxIcon. DONE, now you have a beautiful icon for your nicely working Redux - Total War.
Well, if this does not work for you, I am willing to send you a CD with my installation so you can copy it directly.
Good luck,
Joh
Hello guys,
Joh! …Again! Thanks man… I was unaware of your post when I wrote my reply for Martok here, so maybe we will overlap each other a bit, but frankly don’t care about that, because to me it is far more important to just help him out. I’m almost certain that you feel the same way. So, I will post my reply as it was and let’s hope that our combined effort will create some synergy on this one.
Martok: …Hang in there…. We will solve this, rest assured. It is probably just a matter of time now. Here are my pointers and stuff for you:
Okay. Obviously, I'm still doing something incorrectly here. :wall:
I tried installation method #1 (the red version), but then the game simply refused to start. And yes, I did make sure that both files were the same name (I named them both Redux -- Total War).
After reinstalling the game from scratch again, I then tried installation method #2 (the blue version). The game starts up just fine....but it's just the regular Viking Invasion (2.01 version). There's no indication of any kind that the Redux Mod has been installed. :dizzy2:
Based on the limited info you have provided me with I can only draw the following conclusions:
Red-model only possible error-scenario:
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You have not reduxed your game enough. As in you have only installed the files from MTW-Redux 1.0b and NOT the VI-upgrade 1.0 afterwards. This is a must in order for the game files to work properly. Remember, v.2.01 and v.1.1 are structurally very different and thus will not work with each other. Hence the game will not start, because if you put the folder in a wrong place you would have got a start up with plain VI.
You should have gotten this error message then:
------------------------------------------------------
“COLUMN_building_faction_association
Unknown faction specified: column 20, row 8
NOVGOROD”
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If you had one of these you are doing things right, but you just are not doing it enough. So what you need to do here from that point on is to also install the VI-upgrade in very same manner as well… After you installed the files from MTW-redux 1.0b (because the VI-upgrade files must overwrite all the v.1.1 files from MTW-redux 1.0b). Then it will work.
Blue-model only possible error-scenario:
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You have not pasted the redux files in the right place and thus they have not been allowed to overwrite and replace existing original VI-files. They must be allowed to do so in order to function at all. If you paste the files in a wrong place you can only get plain VI. Hence you have pasted it somewhere else (and, if you pasted correctly but only pasted files from ”MTW-Redux 1.0b” you should have gotten the very same error message mentioned above. Once you get that message you are on the right track! Believe it or not! Once you have that message then also paste in the files from the VI-upgrade in the exactly same manner and then it will work.
If black disaster strikes: :vulcan:
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Now, if it for some reason still don’t work out for you I simply must have this info:
1. Your exact intended install path, as in where you want to install redux. What is it?
"X:/?/?/?/Medieval – Total War" ....or.... "X:/?/?/?/Redux – Total War"
2. The exact actual install path for the redux files, as in where the redux files have actually ended up after you have tried to install them. Where is it?
"X:/?/?/?/Medieval – Total War" ...or something like… "X:/?/?/?/Medieval – Total War/?" ...or perhaps…. "X:/?/?/?/Total War/?" I must exactly know where you have put the files.
It is critical that I get this info from you now. You must also promise me that you only start from the .EXE from this point on (so I can for sure rule out all such potential problems).
As a general rule; if you do an install (red/blue) and you don’t get any varning-message that you are about replace and overwrite any existing files – you are putting the files in the wrong place for sure. Also, as long as you put the redux files in the wrong place there is no functional need to reinstall VI again (you could perhaps clean things up (removing misplaced folders and files) after the install is successful; this is of course is all up to you).
Regardless, post in the good news or the info I simply must have to do anything from this point on. Good luck!
- Cheers
bozewolf
10-08-2008, 00:20
As a long time player looking for something fresh I thought your mod was definitely interesting. It looks like it changes the game a bit more instead of just making it bigger.
I have MW:VI 2.0 so here's what I did.
Installed VI 2.01 patch
Installed Redux 1.0
Installed Redux VI upgrade.
Now I'm going to see if it works. :sweatdrop:
bozewolf
10-08-2008, 00:49
Installed like a charm. :) Had a quick look at the custom battle screen and very impressed with the fun looking unit rosters. WIll be checking this game out in depth over the few days. Even the Viking campaigns can still be played normally. :)
Great work! :jumping:
Hi there Bozewolf,
A special double welcome to you, both to the Org and the redux corner of MTW! You can hang up your sword and shield over there, and we got plenty of princesses here that serve us mead, meat and wine… Oh and don’t mind the knight who are talking to the horses in the stables, it’s just sir Will the not so silent. A brave and friendly chap, but he isn’t that silent. Oh he just got his virtue upgraded to “Eloquent” so that’s why I guess (sorry Will for being stupid at you! But I just had to get it in there! :laugh4: By the way, have not seen you here for a while). Most of the knights however are out with their armies conquering Europe and doing some healthy pillaging as well. Anyways, I bid you welcome to castle Redux (did you know that this castle was designed by the very same man that did castle Anthrax, yes it’s true!)… :laugh4:
Now, I won’t do the same mistakes as many others seem to do, assuming “you” to be “mr Greenhorn” just because you went “active” now. The Org is really a great and friendly place, but I sometimes get the feeling that too many people here, too often presume that you know nothing or little about “total war-games” just because you gone “active” now (of course there are cases when this is true as well. However, if “you” do know nothing, just say so, and we’ll treat you accordingly, that’s the way I like it here). I won’t have any such prejudice and nonsense in this place, because I know the feeling and I was in your very boots about two months ago. So I’ll at least try to avoid all that, if possible.
“It looks like it changes the game a bit more instead of just making it bigger.”
Amen to that. Quantity might be a quality but it does not mean I have to prefer or like it, now does it?!? I do hope that we see and read a lot more of you here at “castle Redux” and feel free to post in any questions or other stuff if you can’t find the answers and such in the already existing posts in this thread. Finally, I hope that you have lots of fun with redux, I know I have.
- Cheers
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Joh, that icon-tip you posted in earlier. Really interesting stuff man! Maybe I’ll do some of that later./cheers
bozewolf
10-08-2008, 20:06
:2cents:
Started a campaign with the English yesterday.
Things I like so far (that aren't obvious, since everyone likes new units and buildings Im not gonna get into that):
The economic revisal. I know some of us will miss the ridiculous revenue previous trade could generate, but this is more stable and a tad more realistic.
The unit cost/upkeep principle. Very well concieved, I must say. Apart from some inbalances with certain types (which I'm sure exist), this idea works much better when comparing light troops with professional troops and elite troops. The overall costs represent a good picture of the financial work needed to achieve military might. Although I get the feeling the overall upkeep could've been a wee bit higher (nitty-picking here).
Ships: Faster to build and from trade ship onwards the vessels can travel ground so much more quickly than in the original game, where it would take you a highly unlikely 16 or so years to sail from England to Egypt. This also enables you to set up proper trading routes much more quickly, somewhat off-setting the trade reduction.
The map:
It's like looking at my atlas. Kewl.
The effort taken to give the rebels in each rebel starting province names that correspond with their location. A very nice touch that really adds to the atmosphere of the game.
The increased range missile units have (and seemingly slightly increased hitting power?). Suddenly they're actually dangerous and can "keel you" instead of merely forcing the AI to close contact. Building a missile heavy army now seems like a viable option to me (I never built high-on-missile armies in the original game, apart from when facing the Horde, who are dirt-easy to beat with a good combo). Especially longbowmen have insane range now. Maybe you actually went a bit overboard on the range :laugh4:(by a little), not sure.
The high-on-rebel starting positions. Makes the game a bit more slower to start. IMO a good development.
The upgrade buildings for subterfuge agents. God, that saves a lot of time.
The differences in building costs and duration. They make the game a bit more difficult but finally make a lof ot sense! It is ludicrous that it used to take people 4 years to build a whorehouse. Now it seems a lot more logical. Big buildings take more time, posh buildings dig into your coffers.
AI finally seems to build troops capable of actually breaking a few skulls up close. I'm actually kinda worried about the huge, well-trained French force lurking south of my borders.
AI also seems to be more willing to engage in diplomacy and interfaction marriages. Don't know how their attitudes will change once your empire gets really big (as they did in the OG game), but for now I like.
Things I'm not too sure about:
The extremes in unit size. I've obviously just started the game so I don't know how the ultimate overall balance is, but I've seen some factions being able to train huge blocks of troops (pure quantity in one unit). Although these units are very expensive indeed, the prospect of having to face blocks of 100-a piece well trained Muslim cavalry isn't a pleasant one. Catholic nations' Royal Knight bodyguards only come in packages of 10? They have a tendency to expire rapidly with those small numbers.
The chronological incorrectness: Ah well, just don't read the year too literally :). It's more like an unfixed period somewhere in the Middle-Ages. I do like historical correctness and I like the principle of the OG game where some units weren't available up to a certain date or technological innovation, but the mod offers enough on other areas that I'm not that bothered by it.
AI factions slightly hesitant to go to war with each other? I've only played 30 odd or so years so far, but I haven't seen a "conflict of opinion" yet. Not that I mind a less agressive AI, though, on the contrary, I hated medieval's original semi-suicidal strategy AI.
Things I don't like:
The helmeted knight portrait that seems to be ubiquitous. The princesses are finally hot (w00t) but all look alike as well. This is a minor detail of course and I'm sure can be changed easily if I really wanted to.
Some poor English in some of the unit descriptions, from simply typo's to crooked English. This doesn't affect the game obviously, and typo's are inescapeable, but still it looks terrible (keep in mind I'm a genuine spelling Nazi :smash::book:).
Also, some units (Kerns, Gallowglasses for example) have a "thing" that causes the unit name to appear weirdly on the description sheet, in brackets with a lot of question marks and something about not being to find the plural or whatever. The actual descriptive text isn't there. LoL. Purely cosmetic, though and only happens with a few troop types.
Bugs:
None so far! *knock on wood*
All in all, I'm thoroughly enjoying it. Will hook-up my buddy so we can play a succession game with it. Anything good, bad, out of order or disastrous with the mod, I will post it up here in the future! If there's anything you want us/me to check, let us know!
Hi again Bozewolf,
It is in many ways an interesting post you have sent in here. There is some praise and some critique I guess along with some other things. At any rate, thanks for bothering to write it down and sending it in to this thread.
First of all, you seem to have overlooked the redux readme-file, in that you would have gotten answers for several of things you are having thoughts on in your post. Also it probably would be advantageous for you to know is that redux was not initially intended to be released to the public at all, it is a thing that has happened after it was essentially done. Hence redux (by default) is above all the game I want (as far as the hardcoded parameters allowed me to) and I have thus not been at all interested in doing a game that appeal to all others when I did the design for it.
If there are some people that like it and play redux, fantastic! But it has never been my intention to do something that appeals to all, because it would only end up as a crappy game. Hopefully people like it, if not, well that’s a shame I guess. The best game-designer for you is; “you”... He he! This is my firm belief. Now when I actually did release redux to the public, my intentions was to have it function as a platform for “you” to create your own personal game upon (it’s probably unique in that regard as far as MTW goes). And you can read all about it in the reduxes “ReadMe”-file (I do recommend you to read it).
Redux is very, very different from the original, because I have designed it out of my own set of ideas, not the paradigm or template set by CA (another thing that is, if not unique, at least very rare in MTW). I am not that interested in making another take on MTW, it has been done and for me personally it simply does not generate any interest. To me, the original is too limited in too many ways and to put it frankly; I did redux because I was not content with the original and some of the features it had. What I loved was the battlefield simulation and the strategical overview and advancing to or defending territories, and ultra above all:
You are responsible for what resources you have, where you position these resources
and what you put on the field, not some half-witted and crappy game designer!
Oh boy have I played many of those games. What I have done in redux is to give you more options and more diverse and unpredictable problems to deal with. And that in a manner that is different from the template created by CA. The redux “projectile-system” alone is proof of that, so is the abolishment of the era-progression among other things. And redux campaigns have a trait and tendency to be ever changing, one campaign is not like the next (even if it is the same faction, it changes). It is unpredictable and I like it that. It is the reduxed way.
I also have some further detailed comments for you in the spoiler. I start from the top of your post and work my way down....
“The economic revisal. I know some of us will miss the ridiculous revenue previous trade could generate, but this is more stable and a tad more realistic.”
Perhaps… To me it creates a more challenging and interesting game and that what’s important to me. Hopefully that is somewhat true for you and everybody else as well.
“Although I get the feeling the overall upkeep could've been a wee bit higher…”
Well according to the concepts of my design, upkeep should be only a minor cost for tactical units, it is commissioning new troops, training and equipment that should be the big spending area. But if you feel that way, increase it then… It’s is ok! If you believe that your personal game gets better by doing that, do it!
“This also enables you to set up proper trading routes much more quickly, somewhat off-setting the trade reduction.”
You forget the potential threat of pirates, if the rebels get their hands on developed ports you will probably have to fight some for sea-supremacy.
“The increased range missile units have (and seemingly slightly increased hitting power?). Suddenly they're actually dangerous and can "keel you" instead of merely forcing the AI to close contact. Building a missile heavy army now seems like a viable option to me…”
Well, this is the way I like it, as simple as that. Actually the whole CA projectile system has been thrown out, it simply was not good enough for redux. There is no point in having archers and stuff if they can’t make an impact in battle, is there?!? As far as I can tell, arrows can be very dangerous and useful in battle, so there is little to debate in that regard. Why should redux be an exception to this? I know that it is in MTW, but that’s CAs problem not mine! Hehe!
Especially longbowmen have insane range now. Maybe you actually went a bit overboard on the range (by a little), not sure.
Frankly, I have always been annoyed by the fact that in the original MTW the unit description for longbowmen states that they could fire bursts up to 300m… Enough BS, now they can! And that description is accurate for the first time ever! Hehe! Well, what the point of having longbows, if they are not allowed to be longbows? The crappy MTW standard of 100-120m or so is ridiculous… Besides, it creates a cool tactical diversity in the game.
“The differences in building costs and duration. They make the game a bit more difficult but finally make a lof ot sense! It is ludicrous that it used to take people 4 years to build a whorehouse. Now it seems a lot more logical. Big buildings take more time, posh buildings dig into your coffers.”
Agreed… Of course there are some cost-adjustments to correspond to the circumstances of the game, but yes it is the basic plan here.
“AI finally seems to build troops capable of actually breaking a few skulls up close. I'm actually kinda worried about the huge, well-trained French force lurking south of my borders.
This is redux… Expect it… I won’t have it any other way. Besides, if other factions can’t or are not allowed to be dangerous for you, why even bother to have them in the game?!? Or even to play the game for that matter? You must have the risk of actually loosing the war & the game otherwise it isn’t that much of a game I think. In redux you can loose, and especially if you are not accustomed to the reduxed circumstances (everything is different). We have had some testified examples of that in this thread (I can’t remember which posts though).
“AI also seems to be more willing to engage in diplomacy and interfaction marriages. Don't know how their attitudes will change once your empire gets really big (as they did in the OG game), but for now I like.”
Hardcoded…
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Now before I continue, there are some things I simply can’t agree upon and you will have to live with that, I will also have to live with the fact that you got some opinions I simply can not understand, even if I try. But, above all, don’t take things the wrong way on some things when I present my own remarks to your stuff here, because it would be a **** shame if you did. And it is certainly not what I am looking for at all. Ok?
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“The extremes in unit size. I've obviously just started the game so I don't know how the ultimate overall balance is, but I've seen some factions being able to train huge blocks of troops (pure quantity in one unit). Although these units are very expensive indeed, the prospect of having to face blocks of 100-a piece well trained Muslim cavalry isn't a pleasant one. Catholic nations' Royal Knight bodyguards only come in packages of 10? They have a tendency to expire rapidly with those small numbers.”
Well this is your opinion (which of course you are entitled to), mine is that you are too stuck thinking in the framework set by CA. This is redux, different set of perspectives, rules and ways of designing things. Many people seem to have a hard time realizing that, as in it does not have to be similar to what CA did in the original. Believe me it works just fine, I have played thousands of battles it’s not a problem. Royal Knights just need some support, that’s all.
“The chronological incorrectness: Ah well, just don't read the year too literally :). It's more like an unfixed period somewhere in the Middle-Ages. I do like historical correctness and I like the principle of the OG game where some units weren't available up to a certain date or technological innovation, but the mod offers enough on other areas that I'm not that bothered by it.”
See redux-“ReadMe” for answers… the “Historical accuracy”-part, it should do the trick for you.
AI factions slightly hesitant to go to war with each other? I've only played 30 odd or so years so far, but I haven't seen a "conflict of opinion" yet. Not that I mind a less agressive AI, though, on the contrary, I hated medieval's original semi-suicidal strategy AI.
Don’t judge redux based on one single campaign, it’s ever changing from one to the other. Sometimes the AI is doing what you are describing here, at other times it doesn’t. With redux you never know until you are facing the matter of fact. It is unpredictable, it’s the reduxed way. I have also made other comments on this in other posts as well I believe.
“The helmeted knight portrait that seems to be ubiquitous.”
See redux-“ReadMe” for answers… Customization-part.
“…the princesses are finally hot…”
This is redux… I won’t have it any other way.
“…[princesses] but all look alike as well.”
I simply cannot agree with you here. I just can’t. My eyes tell me a very diffrent story. You are of course entitled to your opinion, but I simply can’t understand it. Have you actually looked closely??! I can’t even begin to understand how you have come to this conclusion. Are we even talking the same game here?!? The best I can do for you here is that some of these girls have similarities, I am willing to recognise that, but beyond that, well... I just can't do any better for you.
“[princesses and generals] This is a minor detail of course and I'm sure can be changed easily if I really wanted to.
Im confused. Not quite sure how to interpret or understand this… Perhaps it’s best to leave it at that. But for the record, making 100 new and presentable princesses is anything but easy; I talk out of experience here and so far no other designer have done this for MTW, apart from me. So I’ll guess you’ll have to take my word for it.
“Some poor English in some of the unit descriptions, from simply typo's to crooked English. This doesn't affect the game obviously, and typo's are inescapeable, but still it looks terrible (keep in mind I'm a genuine spelling Nazi).”
Well, if you really like to do something about it, you’re hired! Nazi away and send it in! As simple as that. Because I do prefer it to be correct and I have surely tried to kill ‘em all (i'm just not skilled enough to erase them all, evidently). Actually I tried to have other players to keep their eyes open and obviously it did not work, now did it? By all means PM me with your findings and corrections and I will most likely fix it later on, and I will credit you for it.
“Also, some units (Kerns, Gallowglasses for example) have a "thing" that causes the unit name to appear weirdly on the description sheet, in brackets with a lot of question marks and something about not being to find the plural or whatever. The actual descriptive text isn't there. LoL. Purely cosmetic, though and only happens with a few troop types.”
This is a first, and really strange at that… Gallowglasses don’t even exist in redux, Bozewolf…. I should know, since it was I who made it. Are we really discussing redux here?
As for the kerns, that does exist in redux, I can’t replicate your scenario. Could you post in an exact list of the units that you claim you are having problems with? But above all is this really redux you are referring too? I can’t even find a single unit that fit the scenario that you are claiming here, not even close actually.
Perhaps you are referring to the Viking campaign… Well, I just don’t care about that, because it is not part of redux in any way. My suggestion is that you delete it completely and that goes for all non-redux “quick battles” as well. If you want the Brittish Isles-map, do a redux mod, if you want some “historical accuracy”, do a redux mod…. It’s all possible and those possibilities are also included in the designs for redux (as I said, that trait is probably unique for redux and modded-MTW). Use that built in design! Also, you would not be the first that does these things for your personal game. Redux is a platform, use it! All the guides for these things are available here at the Org!
”All in all, I'm thoroughly enjoying it. Will hook-up my buddy so we can play a succession game with it. Anything good, bad, out of order or disastrous with the mod, I will post it up here in the future! If there's anything you want us/me to check, let us know!”
This is great news and I am glad that you are having much fun with redux! :mickey:
Ok, that’s all I got for you this time. There certainly are some questions I would like to have some clarity on myself (the kern/gallowglasses for instance), so it would be great if you could provide me with some answers and Intel here.
- Cheers
Hello again,
Let’s try something different shall we? Believe it or not, I got a question of my own for all you guys that runs an updated versions of redux (VI-upgraders/superfixers/redux 1.0b’s) regarding sound. As in “frontend” and in “battle mode”. Which sound-set do you guys prefer?
Original or redux?
In “Front end”? Why? What makes you like the one above the other? Please specify and explain if possible the reasons for your choice…
In “Battle mode”? Why? What makes you like the one from the other? Please specify and explain if possible the reasons for your choice…
I’m curious here (and I do realize that most of you guys probably not are any full-fledged sound experts, its ok. None the less, your opinions are interesting here). It’s no big deal if you might prefer the original before reduxes, I won’t have any problems with that. But what is interesting to me is why. It is this that I am essentially interested in …
So far I have not received a single comment regarding sound in redux, so I am really interested and I would appreciate if you guys could post in some of your opinions are regarding that. Feel free to have additional comments beyond the stipulated areas of “Frontend” and “Battle mode”. If you also want to comment on the campaign SFX, by all means do so….
- Cheers
bozewolf
10-09-2008, 23:11
Hey Ax!
Keep in mind that 80% of my post was under the header "Things I like" :)
Also, I've only been playing one campaign game for slightly over 40 years yet. I think I mentioned that (let me check, yes I did :yes: ) as well. So I have no clue on the overall game balance. Those were merely first impressions.
Indeed I did not read the readme. Consider it a character flaw ("Pigheaded: Does not care for manuals or instructions. -2 Acumen). I will. The comment on princesses and others is maybe easier discussed directly (f'in drunk right now, eh), check yer PM's.
Baron von Manteuffel
10-10-2008, 04:11
Hey Axalon, Muslim factions can't get a princess? Is that by design? :egypt:
Hey Axalon, Muslim factions can't get a princess? Is that by design? :egypt:
I believe that's hard-coded. My memory could be in error, but I do seem to recall other modders having made comments to that effect.
FOR THE OPEN RECORD:
-----------------------------------
There are no description-display-errors among reduxes units at all. Just thought I’ll clear that up for everybody. It was a mistake made, and it did not concern redux whatsoever. This concludes that issue and that’s the end of it.
-----------------------------------
Hi guys,
Martok: Thanks for stepping in… I appreciate it. And yes, it is hardcoded, as for the effects… (See below).
Baron: Good to see you here again! Now let’s see, this connected to hardcoded errors/limitations of plain MTW V.1.1, (don’t know about VI, but my guess is that there are the same circumstances ruling there as well). Muslim factions can’t generate princesses the way Christians can and do. Because of all that, I have left that possibility out for the muslims, the only way they are ever gone get some delicious maidens is to do it the old-school traditional way; buy them…. There are four slots available for strat-agents as you probably well know. You’ll have to edit them in there since they will have to cost you some (and that don’t go to well with the other girls). There are also some name-related problems to consider if you care what these little dark beauties are called (especially in V.1.1 that is basically hopless). Moorish princess “Cecilia” don’t strike me as quite right, so you’ll have to create an appropriate name-pool as well, just so you are aware of that. Are you sure you want to do all that? At any rate, creating that name-pool will be at the expense of another existing one in VI, just so you know. Along with the standard stuff of assigning buildings, description, rev- and infopics and all that (not forgetting the buf/bifs-files for the strat map).
So, the short answer for you is, yes it is by (forced by hardcode) design….
Bozwolf: Our fluff is sorted, and I’ll expect you to be all sobered up when you march your army out of here to do an honest commanders days work and have some proper pillaging and fighting done. Otherwise I will slam an “often drunk” vice at you so fast that you won’t have the time to say: “earl gray?”. Also, if you don’t have at least has advanced to the “merciless”-vice when you return here I will be very, very disappointed… Soup and bread for a week at least! :laugh4:
- Cheers
bozewolf
10-10-2008, 16:17
Well, I'm afraid it'll be water and bread for me since I'm a wreck today after a night's hard binging, teehee.
I've checked the readme file now. Good to see the portraits (the helmeted general for example) can be easily customized/swapped with others (that's what I meant when I referred to this in my original post).
As far as the historical accuracy thing goes, I fully agree with you! Personally I do like historical accuracy but with the way Redux works there are so many more advantages to the system that I'm not al all bothered by the date in the lower right corner. So yeah, good job on that.:2thumbsup:
Overall what I enjoy most is the way Redux tends to make the actual game a bit more realistic. Ships moving at a faster rate, better economic balance, realistic costs for running professional armies, more logical buildtime/buildcost ratio for structures, missile troops being far more dangerous at range. Etc. Basically your mod changed and tweaked a lot of game mechanics (instead of just making the game "more of the same") that I always thought needed tweaking in the original.
It's more challenging, too. You really have to work quite hard to protect your kingdom. I like smaller kingdoms much better these days. Large empires tend to get a bit boring and annoying.
Hi, Axalon. I wanted to let you know that I downloaded your mod and after a few tries finally figured out the installation with help from instructions I saw in this thread. This is by my count my 9th working mod for MTWVI 2.01 so I have been through this before. I told myself I wasn't going to play the campaign yet because I still have - months after starting them - savegames for the Early Period scenario for MTWVI and for Hellenic Total War(Persian Wars scenario) - that I want to get back to but never do, as well as a couple of other MTWVI mod campaigns that are on my ever-lengthening games to play list.
Nevertheless, after editing the money values in the startpos file and using Gnome Editor as I like to do with anything involving MTWVI on the relevant unit_prod and build_prod files. I started play as my medieval favorites the Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation. I spent the first 25 years just agreeing to a whole bunch of alliances proposed by others(I figured doing so would help buy me the time I needed to get my war machine cranked up and ready to go)and building up my infrastructure to give me the super units I created in Gnome(my favorite of all medieval units is the Teutonic Knights). I also built up my army to prepare for the expansion I knew had to come.
At about the time that 25 game years had passed I decided I was ready to take the fight beyond my own borders and I started going after all the rebel areas that I could reach. Once I accomplished what I could with that I started warfare in earnest by attacking Hungary which didn't last long in the face of assaults by my superior units. With Hungary out of the picture I turned my attention westward since France was one of the very few other nations that didn't bother to offer me an alliance. I widened my offensive in that case to include Burgundy since that faction had territory that I wanted(it had taken over rebel Switzerland). I had to slow the pace of my attacks due to MTW's painfully slow pace of production at one unit and one building maximum per turn. For Rome Total War ands its mods I can produce units in bunches and have a complete army built in 2 or 3 turns(and that is 20 units as opposed to the more limiting 16 units found in MTW and its mods). Anyway, at this point in the game I have gotten up to the Advance Turn phase in the year 750. Burgundy is out and France is reduced to only the rebel province of Toulouse. I still have to siege assault the castles in Brittany and Aquitaine to complete my takeovers of those areas. It seems a bit ridiculous to me to see how easy it is for my troops to smash open the castle gates and take out the garrison. The AI does a bad job of protecting its castles IMO. Well, while war in the west was going on I didn't like the apparent threat posed by Poland so I launched a preemptive offensive there and took Poland(province)and Volhynia on the first go-around. Shortly after that I completed the elimination of Poland as a viable power and turned north to invade Denmark. My first attack ended in the only battlefield defeat I have suffered so far after(and before)so many smashing victories. That army suffered the loss of its commander and things went south, so to speak, not long after that. It turned out that the surviving remnants really weren't worth saving. That will teach me to rely on an army that has so many mercenary units in it. Not too much later I raised another army with mostly Teutonic Knights in the ranks and attacked again against the Danish army that didn't win a cheap victory the first time around; that triumph cost the Danes more than 400 men. This time I had my revenge as the Knights smashed their way to another lopsided win; shortly afterward I successfully attacked Roskilde Castle and so sent the remnants of the Danish Viking kingdom reeling back into Sweden which I plan to attack soon. At present I am currently at war with Italy(I assume this means Venice)and have taken Austria and Tyrolia both of which I consider to be provinces belonging to the empire(as they indeed now do). The Pope has broken off his alliance with me in support of his neighbor but that has only earned him my ill will and likely revenge in the future. This is even more the case as he has been implicated in at least one successful assassination plot of several that have claimed the lives of 4 of my generals. It doesn't matter, though, as I learned from playing Shogun Total War that if your troops are good enough it really doesn't matter who leads them. I am very confident going into battle whenever I have a good proportion of Teutonic Knight or other similar heavy cavalry under my command. These units have beaten odds as much as 6 to 1 against me and won gloriously to the point where I expect it no matter what the opposition. They also have been the leaders in a couple of river crossing battles where they smashed their way across the bridge enabling the other units in my army to follow across unhindered.
This is pretty much where things stand at the moment. The Moors and Saracens have also been implicated in several assassination plots against my generals so I have scores to settle with them as well even though they are for the moment too far away to think about too seriously. The day of reckoning will come for both of them, I believe. I still have an alliance with the Saracens but I don't care. They must pay for their crimes and so they shall as long as I have something to say about it. Also, I don't like the English possession of Normandy and I see war coming out of that situation. It's just a matter of when I get around to it. The AI doesn't seem too bright(granted, I am playing on the Easy setting)when it comes to recognizing a mutual threat to many nations such as the one I pose and forming a grand coalition to deal with it. Whenever I embark on another war I get reassurances of friendship, etc., from virtually all of my numerous allies unless someone among them(such as the Pope with my Italian war)decides my activities are coming a little too close to home and wants me to cease and desist and tells me so in whatever words they choose to use. I plan on ignoring the Pope just as I would any other power that I deem worthy of being invaded, overrun and conquered. I can hardly wait to capture Rome and unleash my troops to wreak havoc upon the city before I decide that I've had enough and start to rebuild the place to suit my own purposes. You wanted more feedback, Axalon, and you sure got it here. I hope you(and others)enjoy this longwinded post. I know from reading this thread that you for one don't mind a little excess length and so I gave you more grist for your Redux mill. Thanks for doing this mod. You modders, as I keep saying, are in a league well above mine.
One other thing that I previously forgot - I saw your advice about saving the game so I save the game every 5 years. It's not that much bother, especially once you get into the habit of doing it on a regular basis.
Hi Noon23,
First of all, thanks for your post. It’s a big one, but that’s ok. Just try to avoid any compact formatting because that will make it harder to read, and we don’t want any of that. Right? Also I hope that you are having lots of fun with redux in your on special-edition way (have altered stuff and all that).
Now, we have slight problem with your post and because of that I’ll stay away from commenting on the contents and claims within it. Instead I will concentrate on the issues and problems as such that are creating these problems that we are having with this particular post.
Ok, you have decided to alter redux and that is fine and ok. Now, in order for the rest of us to be able to understand the resulting circumstances of all these changes we must have these very changes properly presented to us. Cause without any such account we simply have no honest chance to fully understand or validate the things stated and claimed in your post. We simply can not get any perspective on it. Now, my guess is that this is not what you intended, but that’s the way things are. Until all that changes the rest of us can at best only speculate about the contents and statements in your post, because we don’t have the information we need to fully understand its content and statements. You have, but we don’t. In order to fully understand what you are trying to say, we must have access to that information and as things are for now we don’t. As sad and simple as that.
Now, I am sorry for not being able to give you more positive response than this but that is solely dependent on the current design of your post. I’ll guess that this was bound to happen sooner or later. Although I did not expect it. And this time, it just happened to be you, so this is not in any way connected to you personally what so ever.
You obviously did not realize all this and I certainly did not make these things clear to everybody until now (because I did not see it coming, I was too busy answering posts! Hehe!). Now, there is no reason for why we can’t remedy this little problem. What needs to be done here is you giving the rest of us a solid presentation on what changes you exactly made and then we are up to speed and can for the first time read your text the way you intended it to be read.
The idea of posting in a campaign-story is great and personally I hope that we’ll have more of these since they serve as excellent providers of perspectives and information for all other players to consider and think upon. But in order to have that effect the circumstances for that campaign must be either presented properly (which remains to be done in your post) or have already established and familiar circumstances (default redux). Besides campaign-stories also can serve as foundations for further and interesting debates on various aspects regarding them. Now there is a prospect I can live with!
So, lets fix things up and then we have another go at it. :mickey:
(Here are some pointers on what I mean:
Exactly what changes are made? How does they work as a solo entity, and with all the other content in the game? To what end are they made? How did you reason when did these changes? How did you monitor the resulting effects of these changes? Are you pleased with your changes? Etc. Etc.
As for battles: How many men do you got? How many does the foe have? And what kind of troops are we talking about? At what troop-size-setting are running your campaign? Is it default or anything else? Losses? What were they? Both sides mind you, for the sake of clarity. Otherwise all battle accounts will just become an unknown blur.)
- Cheers
Here are some replies to Bozwolfs post:166,
I've checked the readme file now. Good to see the portraits (the helmeted general for example) can be easily customized/swapped with others (that's what I meant when I referred to this in my original post).
Now you can get DC/Marvel-styled heroes where you want them! Or anything else you deem suitable. That was part of the design all the way. Personally I never really liked the portraits of CA, too much…. Well, I just don’t like ‘em, perhaps its best to leave it at that. I wanted DC/Marvel inspired style instead! Storm as princess, oh there is sweet a thought….
As far as the historical accuracy thing goes, I fully agree with you! Personally I do like historical accuracy but with the way Redux works there are so many more advantages to the system that I'm not al all bothered by the date in the lower right corner. So yeah, good job on that.
Well that is a happy surprise, great great! This calls for a bow! :bow: I only wish there where more people that came to that conclusion. History stuff and games don’t work that well together. Never did. As a setting and inspiration, ok, fine and excellent but beyond that, naah!
Overall what I enjoy most is the way Redux tends to make the actual game a bit more realistic. Ships moving at a faster rate, better economic balance, realistic costs for running professional armies, more logical buildtime/buildcost ratio for structures, missile troops being far more dangerous at range. Etc. Basically your mod changed and tweaked a lot of game mechanics (instead of just making the game "more of the same") that I always thought needed tweaking in the original.
Seriously, this is news with a babefactor… Thanks man!
It's more challenging, too. You really have to work quite hard to protect your kingdom. I like smaller kingdoms much better these days. Large empires tend to get a bit boring and annoying.
Yeah, I’m all for that myself. Besides, if you got a big empire there are fewer enemies to fight and kill which is not as much fun. And on a more serious note, the bigger empire you got the more vices “your people” (generals) get. Don’t know the exact numbers for it thou but as long as you stay under 10 provinces you are safe from that penalty. Because of all that I usually prefer 7-9-ish highly developed provinces myself but I’ll intervene and police things all over my trade routes. If the Pope has been acting stupidly I’ll go over there with a decent commander and few formations of Heavy Infantry (one of my personal favourites) and sort things out with his holiness, making him retire to think things over for a while so to speak!
But usually I tend to safeguard Spain for Christianity and have an ever standing training school at Sahara to spice things up. Playing as England that dubious honour usually falls upon Scottland. At any rate I do prefer the smaller kingdom-modell myself and the “worldpolicing” it’s just a hobby of mine. It’s a dirty job but someone got to do it. Essentially I am an equalizer most of the time, slowly building up my valour:5 veteran-formations. Yes that’s right valour 5, the only way to go. They won’t break and they don’t care whatever opposition or odds they are facing. They just fight on and doing it with style. That means that I can focus on tactics. Hehe!
- Cheers
---------
What is it with all you people? Is there no one who likes sound here?!? :laugh4:
"Exactly what changes are made? How does they work as a solo entity, and with all the other content in the game? To what end are they made? How did you reason when did these changes? How did you monitor the resulting effects of these changes? Are you pleased with your changes?
As for battles: How many men do you got? How many does the foe have? And what kind of troops are we talking about? At what troop-size-setting are running your campaign? Is it default or anything else? Losses? What were they? Both sides mind you, for the sake of clarity."
Axelon, I 'm sorry that you didn't get a lot of my last post. Now I will try to answer some of your questions.
My first change was in the startpos file where I gave the HRE as much money as MTW would allow and left every other faction with ZERO to start(nasty, I know). From there I went into Gnome Editor and opened up the unit_build file. Once inside I sought out and found 7 units unique to my medieval favorites the HRE(thank you Axelon - I couldn't find any such units to edit in the MTWVI Early campaign scenario making that scen a tougher proposition - ). I boosted as many of the properties of those units as far as I felt safe in doing(wanting to make changes without wrecking the game). I would have liked to have done more but it just seemed too risky, but if there is more I can safely do along these lines I would like to know about it even though it is too late for my current game. Well, I made these 7 units faster, gave them better morale, gave them a slight shield bonus increase, gave them better armor protection, made them disciplined and formed, removed any fear they had against any possible enemy units, gave them attack and defense bonuses against cavalry, eliminated unit costs for both creation and maintenance, etc., etc., etc. Really, I don't recall everything I did.
At any rate, once I finished with the units file I switched to the buildings file and cut the waiting time to the minimum of 1 turn for any building that looked like it might have some military connection no matter how slight(for those structures that had more than a one turn construction period).
The changes took effect in the game with no problem. The only thing was that I had to wait until I had the right buildings constructed to enable me to start building my special elite units. As it is now after 50 years I still only have three areas - Franconia, Bohemia and Brandenburg - where I can build Teutonic Knights cavalry. I hope that will start to change soon. That is the unit that I plan to have leading the charge for the HRE to run the map to total victory. That is the whole point - I want my personal favorite from the Middle Ages the HRE to conquer everything before it and I don't care if I have to provide a good measure of "divine intervention".
To move on, I am fairly pleased with the changes I made but I would have liked to have done more. If it would be possible I would like to make unkillable units(immortals in the literal sense)but maybe that is too much to hope for.
As for battles, I tend not to have armies that are too big because their unit slots are largely filled by the smaller but very lethal heavy cavalry units. Some of the enemy armies have been bigger than expected(a couple thousand or more)but that has as much to do with little or no scouting as anything else. At this point I think the quality of armies on all sides is a mixed bag. Upgrading to my designated killer units has been a painfully slow process while I wait for the right buildings to become available in captured areas like Saxony, Pomerania and Prussia, among others, but I have been seeing that pattern changing in recent turns so maybe it won't be much longer before those areas will start producing the desired units.
My troop size setting has been Default. I have been tempted to increase it but I wonder if I should take the risk and if so the next question becomes how much larger can I make that setting before the game rebels and I have problems just starting Redux(which, BTW, reminds me of reflux, but never mind)?
Battle losses have for the most part been running heavily in my favor even when I face enemy forces that have substantial numerical advantages. Many enemy losses have come when units tried to run away but were caught and cut down. Many more enemy losses have come when my elite killers started the battle by plowing headlong into the enemy masses seeking the opposing commander and often killing him early thus sending the other army on its downward spiral leading to defeat and disaster. My losses by comparison have been more affordable with a couple battles against smaller enemy forces resulting in no losses at all for my troops. In short, things are looking good but they could always be better. Whenever I resume play I'm going to work on that situation.
I'll give this a rest for now. You'll probably take me to task again but I'll survive. And so it goes...
bozewolf
10-12-2008, 04:37
Hey Ax,
so far I've found that the unit cost/upkeep changes make making a really big army takes more time and also makes you more careful with them. And, i dont know if you intended this, so far the AI seems to be more careful as well, no longer go on suicide wars.
little campaign update, thought you may like that: I've unified the British isles now. Letting Scotland rebel to use as a training school (Scotland makes a whopping 90 florins. I'm quite sure I can afford to lose that, hah). With my ships' connections Ive managed to seize Crete. Very pleased with that since it seems to be quite wealthy and a very very strong base for eventual crusades or expeditions against Eastern factions. Now in my 40th year. My royal line seems to be quite weak so Im going to "level" the crown prince in Scotland now with a decent force.
bozewolf
10-12-2008, 06:19
And just to clarify: I think it taking more time to build seriously big armies is a good thing! It also makes you more careful since you can't replenish a force that big so easily unless you have serious coffers to dig in to.
I've seized Malta as well, since it was unprotected. Not very rich but quite eager to rebel. A good second training ground maybe, heh. I've also managed to occupy Sardinia, which should guarantee quite a lot more income.
I'm excited about these new acquisitions as they may allow me to establish a Mediterranean beginning. :smash:
Hello again guys, Bozewolf this is essentially for you…
First of all, yes I am well aware of the effects reduxed unit-costs and it’s just the way I like it (you seem to do so as well, great!). It is one of the many big design-decisions I made for redux beyond the template established and created by CA. This is one of the many ways redux stands apart from other versions. Moving on, the fact that reduxed AI seems to prefer more solid preparations for war is nothing that I have any objections to at all. It makes the game better and more durable. I can’t remember what I did to create that type of AI-behaviour – been working on redux too long (it might even be a pleasant side-effect to some other aspect that I tinkered with in redux).
Now, I think it is really great that you keep the rest of us posted on your campaign, at the very least it shows possible and potential paths and strategies with the reduxed English faction. Allowing Scotland to “rebel out” is the way I do things, maybe you like it that way as well, we’ll see I guess. At any rate, it usually is a good thing too keep troops training and warmed up during peacetime that way, or at least I think so. If nothing else it will get you some battles even if you have and organized and fully functional kingdom that no current wars to fight. And when war comes you’ll have battle-experienced formations that will with out doubt be better than most of the foe’s formations since the AI don’t do that type of training. Thus the AI is more likely to have inexperienced greenhorn troops. That way you can battle enemy formations that on paper are better and superior to yours still can loose against your veteran troops. Don’t forget that moral is a key factor and 1 valour point means +2 in moral. Thus valour: 4 will in effect mean +8 to moral and that factor will have a very distinguishable effect in battle, regardless the commander. Also don’t be afraid of ticking of the “tidy up units”-option and do some restructuring manually on your troops. You’ll probably end up with better troops in the end by doing that. A tad much on the detailed side of unit-management here so lets move on.
It seems that you are quite an island-jumper. Well there are of course advantages and some disadvantages as well with that. As for the advantages, you’ll not need to worry much in regards to troublesome borders and neighbours as long as you keep you coasts clean from all enemy naval activity in the area. That’s the good part apart from any obvious “geo-political” rewards you might get by controlling that area of course. As for the disadvantages with islands, the cost involved with securing islands and the maintenance of that is usually far more costly than any regular land area. You also a fully dependant on functional and undisrupted sea lanes, that requires fleets, fleets cost florins and above all maintenance of fleets are expensive (or at least I think so). In a strict economical sense it is not always winning prospect to take and hold an island considering the actual cost in doing so (MALTA or RHODES for instance). Also, if the garrison becomes cut of they can’t be expecting any reinforcements thus every deployment on such potentially isolated areas will become more important than elsewhere. As in you will be extra responsible for what you put there once all hell breaks loose in that area, either by rebellion or invasion. That’s the bad side of things with islands (the exception to some of these circumstances being SARDINIA and CORSICA).
As for the Easter factions, expect different styles of troops and tactics. They tend be very different from Catholic tactical profiles, heavy dependency on archers is common for the Byzantines along with their different and unique style of troops. With the Saracens you should expect cavalry and probably some camel formations along with various types of Islamic infantry as well. The battles will most likely be a bit different to those you are used to in Western Europe.
In regards to royal heirs, I always give them a hard drilling in harsher sides of life just to ensure that they always have some decent dread and command-values. As for acumen, well that is really important, so if need be I’ll send an assassin to get the trait of “very nervous” and thus a +1 acumen on the poor sob. He he! Be careful with that thou! At any rate, combat experience pays off; heirs are no exception to that rule in any way.
Well that’s all I got for you this time and perhaps you already know some of the tips and pointers I presented for you, but it is hard for me to know where exactly to set the bar here. At any rate, do keep the rest of us posted on your progress with the English (just keep track of the turns. BTW, what difficulty level was it again? Just so we have the full overview here)!
Redux player X (yes you!):
Is there anybody else of you guys that have remarks, suggestions, views and/or opinions on Bozewolf’s campaign and its progress or his choices made so far??? Any of you regular redux posters perhaps? Any of you guys interested in posting in a few lines in that regard? Feel free to post it in so we can get a more debate-ish thing going in this thread, I for one would welcome it. And we all would probably get some further and deeper insight in the world of redux that way (including yours truly). Remember, this thread does not in any way have to include me in every aspect of it to get things going…
- Cheers
-----------
Noone23 I’ll get back to you shortly in a separate post with comments and pointers for you…
William the Silent
10-14-2008, 23:03
Well, at the moment I'm not so happy the way things are going.
I'm playing the english at hard.
I established myself first by building a good economy (for troop build-up and all other progress) and and securing Normandy against any invasion.
Put a spy in every province for stability. Build up superior see-power around the Isles. Then take ALL of the Isles. If I would leave Scotland independent, it could be taken by some overwhelming force from somewhere. And I would be faced with some big problem in my backyard Bozewolf .
Scotland can be stabalised with 240 troops, a church and a spy and taking a peek at their stability every turn on "High Tax", with the sea secured.
I make alliances with everybody. Look for wives for my sons.
Now about my struggles:
I was in peace with everybody. I believe the World was in total peace with everybody at that time. Only rebels had to fear war. The perfect world.
So I took Flanders/Friesland (my place of birth) and I didn't offend anybody.
But all of a sudden France invades my terratory. I kick them out and show them who is the boss.
But what happens: the whole world condems me for being the agressor and I loose all my friends except the Lombards.
That's all fine with me, because noone can challenge me at that point, in battle, because I have nuclear weapons.
But what I come to find out is that no one, I mean no one, wants to marry my sons, not even the Lombards. So after my king dies I'm left with a sonless new king. I survive that, but not the second time. Not even a moslim wants to give their daughters to my sons.
So in the year 828 my king dies with a son of 10 years old at an age of 53. I try to revive him by reloading my saves and give him some more years, but no, the judgement of Redux is final. 53 Years. And for the first time in my life I see the looser screen https://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7132/rolleye0012yz7.gif (https://imageshack.us).
128 Turns of dedication, glory, noble deeds, patience, love, sweat and tears for nothing. Shall I start all over? I'm broken ~:mecry:.
Give me a reason to start over Axalon?~:mecry:
Baron von Manteuffel
10-15-2008, 04:12
@William the Silent - A reason to start over? For King & Country! :laugh4: No seriously, I've had that happen too, and I hate it. It sucks, but you know you're going to start again. If you can only get your King to survive 6 more years, I think it's 16 years old for the heir to mature.
About heirs, I've got a question. Hypothetically, your King has 2 sons and he suddenly dies. The eldest becomes the new King and his brother is still a Prince. Now the New King has a son, and he turns 16 and now he's an heir. If the New King dies, the 16 year old son is crowned King?
Is it always the son of the King that becomes the new King? What about the 30 or 40 something year old brother, he is just a general now and no longer a Prince? Was it always that way historically?
The Royal bloodline is confusing and there must have been a lot of power struggles. The War of the Roses comes to mind but I'm not sure. I need to read more :book:.
The point of all this babble is I've had Kings die and when the new King is crowned, all the other Princes become generals. I've never fully understood that, but I believe it's someting along these lines. :inquisitive:
Hi guys,
Will: welcome back! How I missed your whining! :laugh4: Its feels good to have you back here from your latest adventures beyond the safe borders of MTW-land. You Know, you are this threads own workhorse doing the dirty job of reliving my workload and keeping the thread going and for that I do thank you! I wish only more people followed your example.
About your troubles, no worries man we’ll get it sorted. Now the way I see it you got three possible options:
Option 1. You go back to your current saves and try to make your king live long enough to allow his son to mature (age 16). Do a token battle, move him around and stuff like that. That usually makes them live a little bit longer. It should work for you.
Option 2. You set up your redux to go to “debug mode” using the “-ian” command line in the shortcut to redux. Its more thoroughly described in the frogladys guide and its available here at the Org. It’s an excellent guide, but it wont do much good for redux I’m afraid (all the stuff is for standard MTW).
Anyway, once you got your “debug mode” set up, load up a game some 20 years prior to AD 828 (it was that turn was it not?). So here we are back in AD 808, now the first thing you should do is an “.unfreeze.”-cheat (that get you a new royal-male-heir next turn) type it in like that, don’t forget the dots. After that you should whenever you need to marry your princes select an ally that you want close relations to, lets say France for instance. Once they get princess you simply switch over to france by pressing/typing “7” that should switch over the controle for you to france. Now as france, send her over to England marry your English prince, give her that mission. Once that is done, switch back to England and continue playing.
Since AI is incapable of sending the girls to marry already established allies you wont get any such suggestions at all once you allied with a faction. Because of that I would advice you to be more selective to whom you sign alliance treaties with. Don’t have too many allies, that will only **** things for you so don’t bother with that. And the Pope? Well, you do what you want, but personally I don’t care much about him… Just try to avoid to be excommunicated, you will eventually be that of course and when it happens, either kill him or kill your king it’s the easiest way to deal with it. Alternatively, you could always destroy the papists if you like that instead.
Now back to the weddings, it is an annoying thing that is hardcoded and such I cant do anything about it. Because of that I usually play at “debug-mode” myself and send the princesses to me from 1-2 trusted allies. It saves me a lot of time and work, and I can concentrate on far more interesting things instead. I am well aware that this is not by the rule-book but it makes the game a lot smoother. Besides, why the hell should I bother with a game-feature that has not been properly worked thru in the first place? No, I don’t bother with that personally, but that’s just me.
Option 3. You start all over again… You will of course do that eventually (in that regard the good baron is quite right), but this time? Well that’s just plain unnecessary. So don’t bother with that for now. Wait with that for a new campaign instead….
Now I got some questions of my own for you:
“...because I have nuclear weapons.”
What?!? Care to elaborate?
“Not even a moslim wants to give their daughters to my sons.”
Have you tinkered with the game? Islamic factions don’t have daughters/princesses by default. Care to elaborate?
-------------
von Manteuffel: You are also a dependable soul here at the redux corner. Let’s see if I can’t get you some answers for you here…
“About heirs, I've got a question. Hypothetically, your King has 2 sons and he suddenly dies. The eldest becomes the new King and his brother is still a Prince. Now the New King has a son, and he turns 16 and now he's an heir. If the New King dies, the 16 year old son is crowned King?”
Yes
”Is it always the son of the King that becomes the new King? What about the 30 or 40 something year old brother, he is just a general now and no longer a Prince? Was it always that way historically?”
Historically, no… As for the games, in plain MTW v.1.1 he becomes a general of royal blood (one who technically can instigate a civil war and that way become king, he will then have his age reset to 20-30 something). In standard VI he becomes just a plain general (I never liked that in the VI-version). All is hardcoded… (Expect the history part of course).
“The Royal bloodline is confusing and there must have been a lot of power struggles. The War of the Roses comes to mind but I'm not sure. I need to read more”
Why not? :mickey:
“The point of all this babble is I've had Kings die and when the new King is crowned, all the other Princes become generals. I've never fully understood that, but I believe it's someting along these lines.”
Well my dear baron, there is a lot of things I don’t understand about the designs of MTW… Again, it might just be me.
- Cheers
Hello again, this is in regards to post: 167, 168 and 170. Basically, this is for you Noone23…
Now, Iv’e got about 5 tons of criticisms that I could poor all over your two posts, but I won’t do that. You have obviously and freely made your mind up in regards to what you like and what you essentially want and that’s your privilege. I simply have or at least should have no right to question that. And what you do and play at home is one thing. Discussing a public game based upon circumstances that is not essentially valid for that game that’s quite another.
Because I and everybody else do have the right to measure the substance and validity of your publicly stated claims now that we finally got some chances of understanding the circumstances in which these claims are founded upon. Furthermore, I certainly have a right to defend my own work in the public debate. This is also true when claims are presented in a way that it could be perceived to “be associated to” or “be representative” of my work, redux. Even if it just “appears” that way, I still have the full rights to defend my work and question all those claims and statements if I want to. After all, they are addressed to the public redux, my version, not your version, and thus I have every right to defend the “image” or “appearance” of my work in the public eye, even if the presented claims are not founded upon it.
Now, your initial post made some pretty bold statements considering the actual circumstances that these statements were founded upon. It is of course you privilege to continue to do so but my friendly advice to you is to keep a tight titanium lid on all that from now on, because you will end up a much happier man that way. If you want to discuss redux and the various aspects there of, be my guest, by all means you are welcome to do so. BUT you must base your assumptions and opinions upon known and established circumstances, not the ones you tinkered your way to at home. Otherwise there is a mammoth-sized risk that your statements will be subject for merciless scrutiny, and frankly, the initial claims in your first post will not survive that, that’s a promise from me to you. I alone can probably kill most of them 10 times over, imagine what others would and could do. My guess is that this is not a prospect you want, so it’s better to avoid all that by simply stay “redux default”. That way most of the heat will be directed to me and you can probably live with that.
Anyway, I think you are right, it is best to give this whole holy roman super-superior Reich thingie a rest (at least here). Your version has too much discrepancy and is too different with default redux, and as such it is little meaning in discuss that here on a thread that is earmarked for the public version of redux. I see no point in it actually. So, from now on we stay strictly redux default, that way all of us can immediately recognise the circumstances ruling in of the game, and above all we all can talk about the same game.
Ill leave you some pointers to accelerate your debatable win with the HRE thou:
There are public guides on how these rascals/cheats work, use those.
.worksundays.
.badgerbunny.
.kidsmode.
.viagra.
unkillable units/immortals: set defence to 99, set armour to:99 in “crusaders-unit-build11”-file, that is as close as you ever gonna get. In effect, this will make them immortal. If want them to be medieval superman, set melee to 99 (same file).
This of course will wreck and disrupt the designs even more in the game, but that has probably little importance since it could be argued (quite convincingly) that it is virtually already destroyed as a functional and thus meaningful game. But as I said, that is your privilege to do that at home.
unit setting: redux should handle max with no problems
That should speed things up for you. Matter closed. Next time… Redux default ok?
- Cheers
bozewolf
10-16-2008, 08:11
Well Ive been playing a bit more and longbowmen are so immensely powerful, lol. Load up on these bad boys and you can literally mow down entire armies from an incredible range. Normal archers seem paltry in comparison. For now I don't mind having these ballistic missiles around while I'm still exploring the mod, but lol, maybe I should learn how to change some values later on.
I'm in turn 57 now (playing it slow) and finally the Italians got into a good scrap with the Pope and the Lombards. The Saracens and their Moorish brethren also seem to have a slight difference of opinion.
I'm consolidating my kingdom now, using Scotland mercilessly as killing grounds for new recruits. Raw 4-valour longbowmen are not to be sniffed at, not even by the frighteningly large French presence in, well, France. Though the French never tried to ally themselves with me and turned down the few attempts that I made as well. Somehow I feel secured to know at least I will avoid "teh backstab". Forces are building up and the situation feels rather tense. Although there are no provocations from any side yet.
Malta is pretty worthless economy-wise so I'm (ab)using that as a second rebel-party to get some experienced troops and a general out of it.
My coffers aren't deep but I'm making a steady income surplus of about 2500 florins, so I'm spending most of my cash once I get my hands on it, investing readily in fresh upgrades and better troops.
The royal line isn't the strongest as of now. I hope that will change since the following King will likely be quite young and that gives me plenty of time to invest in him.
Overall having lots of fun :) And enjoying the new units and buildings.
Regarding difficulty, I can't remember actually, hehe. Either Hard or Normal. I think Normal since thats what I use to explore and do whatever the F I want, I'm certainly not 100% sure however.
Hi Boz,
First of All, thanks for keeping all of us posted on your campaign (also congrats to your promotion to regular member, it makes things easier doesn’t it?).
As for the longbows, we have been up that road before you and I. Now, you do what you like, but as I said before, it is little point including longbows in the game if they are not allowed to be longbows. I have set the range to 300 m based on the info available info in wikipedia (which states the values for relevant English longbow-models to 250-328m as to range, so don’t take my word for it). Thus any value set under 250m will effectively make it something else and ridiculous. I am well aware of the power of the longbow in the game. I have fought for this before (not with you) and it seems that I am doing it again.
Now, it is no mere chance that England is set to “Easy” campaign difficulty. Apart from the obvious strategic advantages available to England, there is also the formidable and unique power of the longbow-formations. That combined makes it a lot easier to play England than any other faction, in spite of the many efforts of mine to try to contain and moderate that power by requirements, heavy costs and training times. But it also opens up for a possible specific and unique tactical style for England in the game that to some extent reflects the many claims of traditional history (Agincourt etc.).
The reduxed longbow formations are far more expensive than regular archers and should be because of their power. I am basically stuck between the prospects of either excluding them on one hand and or ridicule them on the other. I have chosen to include them and not to ridicule them. Their “fantastic” range does create problems in regards to game balancing, no doubt about that, but it also do reflect the longbow for what it is, a fantastic weapon beyond the ordinary bow (there actually are historical accounts that claims that men have even fired above 500m, but that was not longbows it was with the Mongol composite-bow. See Wiki.). What you are describing are exactly what the longbow is all about, mowing down the enemy at a great distance. Redux reflects that, where as other versions have constantly backed away from that rather uncomfortable design-decision of letting the longbows actually be longbows. It is not fair, it was not fair back in the day either. The longbows fame is founded upon that very reality. Thus here is a blatant example of me being inspired by a “historical” circumstance and letting that be reflected in the game.
The over all ranges of bows in redux are as follows: 100m/150m/170m/300m (the longbows). Looking upon those numbers it is blatantly clear that the longbow will rock the balance, but that’s just the very thing, it did rock the balance and it became famous for that very reason. So, yes they are powerful, yes they are not fair, yes this is the way it is and its not by chance this is still around in redux.
Also, for the sake of preventing any misunderstandings, I have not lost my temper here in any way in regards to your concerns about the longbow. You are simply conveying an opinion and now I am merely pointing out my reasons as for why the longbow has the range it has. Nothing else. Thus making sure that you (and everybody else) understand the reasons for the longbow and can that way easier see why I have allowed such circumstances to remain in redux. It is not an overlook, it is conscious and I hope that this is clear once and for all now.
As I said earlier, you do whatever you feel is necessary to sort this out, if that means a lowering of the longbows range, so be it. But for me, the range-value stays, for the very reasons stated above. As for my personal use of longbows, it is limited, it happens now and then, but I tend to rely upon other troops instead because of the outstanding traits of the longbow (it kind of ruins much of the fun if you got more then two formations, although I have used a few formations to teach the AI a few lessons on occasion). I have never relied upon or battled with heavy concentrations of longbows in my armies, it would not be much fun in that I think.
England is great faction to explore the many secrets of redux with, but it is certainly not the most challenging faction available. England is easy, and it should be categorized as easy, in large part because of the possibilities that this very special weapon offers. This is how I see it at least. And when I do play England I am very careful with the usage of longbows. If you use and depend much on the longbow, well, then it could be argued that you’re very English in your tactics, so to speak….
Now as for your campaign, well things change don’t they? The different wars and all that.
“…the frighteningly large French presence in, well, France. Though the French never tried to ally themselves with me and turned down the few attempts that I made as well. Somehow I feel secured to know at least I will avoid "teh backstab". Forces are building up and the situation feels rather tense. Although there are no provocations from any side yet.”
This is very redux, you get a war on your hands soon enough I'd guess. If it is with the French then their attack will probably come at either NORMANDY, FLANDERS or AQUITAINE, that’s my guess. But you never know until it happens, only some spies perhaps and the good 'ol AI might knows that...
“Malta is pretty worthless economy-wise so I'm (ab)using that as a second rebel-party to get some experienced troops and a general out of it.”
Yeah as I said earlier, conquering a new province will not necessarily mean additional profit for the coffers (a trait I rather I like actually). MALTA is a good example of that.
“My coffers aren't deep but I'm making a steady income surplus of about 2500 florins, so I'm spending most of my cash once I get my hands on it, investing readily in fresh upgrades and better troops.”
Again very redux, I done this plenty of times myself. What the hell else can you do with a tight purse?!? Hehe! Build upon the stuff you already got, that’s my suggestion.
“The royal line isn't the strongest as of now. I hope that will change since the following King will likely be quite young and that gives me plenty of time to invest in him.”
It pays off to have good kings, and the best way to get that, is to let the heir fight a lot. Scotland or Malta, pick your choice (Scotland is probably safer, also don’t be afraid of upgrading some armour stuff there, thus making the opposition harder. I usually do that, 1-2 upgrades so at least the rebels think they got a chance… He he!
“Overall having lots of fun :) And enjoying the new units and buildings.”
Excellent news man. :mickey:
Well that’s all I got for you this time, do keep the rest of us posted with your progress with your campaign. Is there anybody else with comments and suggestions here for Bozwolf?
Cheers man!
William the Silent
10-16-2008, 23:24
I actually gave up my attempt to revive England. It's not worth it.
I'm playing russians now (Exp).
The start-off seems to be far more difficult then England, because of finances. Which I like.
I don't think it should be easy. The game has to challenge skill.
Plenty of princes this time and Byzantium gladly gives its daughters to my sons.
I noticed before that rebel armies seem to grow sometimes (I might be wrong). That is a good thing, because it makes it so more difficult to expend. But I didn't see that around the russian terratory.
It's easy to march in there with overwhelming army and take it without resistance.
I think, since the AI is not agressive, that you could make the rebel terratories stronger in force, or in rebellion like Friesland (which reflects the real nature of the Fries through history, like me :viking:).
But you're doing a much better job in your mod then the original, which I think is too easy. It's not easy to expand without solid economy and good units.
Tyberias XL mod is beautiful, but is too easy.
The most difficult/realistic MTW mod I ever played was the MedMod. It took me about two era's to establish and survive untill I was finally in a position to expand, thanks to the unslaught between the other factions. The downside: hardly any variety in units and it's not fun to just survive for so long.
Since your game has so many turns, maybe it is an idea to slow down the progress by lenghtening the buildtime of buildings. That way we can enjoy a longer time with your less superior units in battle.
I'm kindoff sad that I have to throw them to the side so soon, to be able to match the heavies from the enemy. You have a real richness in unit choise.
Just some idea's. But maybe you have thought these things over already for years and have no desire to change it.
One more note: I noticed that Byz recruits mostly skirmish units. That makes them weak I think.
Longbows indeed great advantage. First thing you do is kill enemy general with two longbow units. After that peace of cake with the rest. Maybe they should be made small like foresters.
bozewolf
10-17-2008, 00:30
Regarding the longbows not being fair in real life:
that is absolutely, 100%, undisputably true, hehe. I'm only just getting used to a game not nerfing a certain characteristic for the sake of perfect balance.
The tips as implemented work well and, what is more important, don't cause any bugs.
Really, though, Ax, there's no need to take umbrage because I decided I wanted to make some changes to Redux. The fact is that I wouldn't have started playing your mod any other way. I changed a single copy that I took the time and trouble to download and install and left it at that; I did not encourage anyone else to do the same since everyone else who has posted here has shown a clear preference for playing Redux(sounds like reflux)straight up.
I don't know why, but I feel as though I continue to have to remind fellow players that these are, after all, GAMES, and not exercises in religious or moral discipline. MTW(in all its numerous forms, including Redux)is what it is and that's pretty much it. As such, the idea here is to have FUN, and that takes different forms for different players.
It seems to bother you quite a bit that someone would actually think to make changes to your mod. Surely you must have at some time imagined that someone would do exactly that. In this case it happened to be me but I doubt I'm alone; I think the likelihood is that others have done something similar but haven't come here and posted about it.
Really, you should be glad I was interested enough to DL and install the thing, especially considering I had to go around the block a few times before I finally got it to work. Not only that, but I didn't have to bother you for help with the install.
As far as people verbally attacking me here, I don't care. It's all just talk when you come right down to it.
Meanwhile, you should just be glad that I am enjoying your mod, even if it wasn't quite the same thing that you originally created. There are worse things in the world than your ideas and creative vision differing from someone else's.
I have my own visions for any number of games and mods and the more I can do to realize those ambitions in any given game or mod the more likely it is to get playing time instead of merely sitting in storage stacked with other unplayed titles.
You should remember that there are games that come with editors and the like and that these tools make it possible for the user to make the kinds of changes that I chose to make and more. You personally have mentioned Gnome Editor(I would be lost without it for use with MTW and its various versions). Clearly I am not the only person to make use of this tool; it certainly wasn't created for my exclusive use alone.
That's enough out of me for one post - this one - . I hope that I have made my point well enough.
When the abbey I build in any given area gets completed and the popup message informing me of this appears there is no corresponding pic with it. I was wondering if you forgot to add the pic or was it some technical problem that caused this situation. Of course, it has no effect on the play of the game as said abbey(maybe Dear Abbey at this rate)still gets built regardless.
Hi Guys,
Will: Well, you do what you want of course but you could have saved your English campaign by doing the various manoeuvres’ I suggested to you in post: 176. To me the English faction is a very viable faction to play just as long as you go light on the longbows. You will probably find things a lot harder with the Russians. Income and florins might be a likely problematic factor you. It is also possible that will find the various Catholic specialized formations quite formidable, we’ll see I’ll guess. Playing as Russians will probably be harder for you since you now moved to expert level as well.
As for the rebel armies, yes your observations are quite correct. Rebel armies do have a tendency to get bigger. This is all dependent on whether or not there is a castle in the province or not. As for the most eastern part of the map there few of those around so they wont get bigger until a castle is built, perhaps then they will start growing there as well.
As for the great marching in and taking control thingy, yes you could do that, but maintaining that control will probably be more problematic for you, that’s my guess anyway. I have designed it that way and it’s not an overlook. I got more stuff as well for you in the spoiler... :mickey:
“I think, since the AI is not agressive, that you could make the rebel terratories stronger in force, or in rebellion like Friesland...”
Well, I think that this is open for debate. I am not that willing to so fast categorize the AI as non-Aggressive. The redux-AI can definitely be aggressive at times but it also has a tendency to prepare its various factions to war in a whole other way than the regular AI. That takes time and you seem not to be quite accustomed to that yet. It is unlikely that it will throw itself into war without substantial reserves of troops first. Thus it is harder to defeat when war do come. You should know that by now.
”But you're doing a much better job in your mod then the original, which I think is too easy. It's not easy to expand without solid economy and good units.”
Why thank you Will. Yes the original is too easy and yes it should not be easy to expand without some solid troops and a developed and functional economy. I wouldn’t have it any other way... There is too much “blitzing” around and I don’t care much for that. I like the reduxed and harder circumstances a lot more personally. It’s more of a game and less sport to it.
”Tyberias XL mod is beautiful, but is too easy.”
Even if that might be true, I would appreciate if you (and everybody else) could please refrain from doing such remarks here in the future. I have too much respect for the work and effort made by VikingHorde and Tyberius to willingly allow such comments to thrive here at the redux corner. I might not always share other designer’s views on various design-issues but does not mean I don’t respect them or that I am not willing to defend their work if necessary. I know what kind of effort and work they have (free of charge) poured into their versions first hand so, I don’t reflect lightly upon that. I have great respect for both, however I don’t share their views on how the best way to MTW-bliss is achieved, that’s all.
As for the hardest version of MTW, I think that is a subject for wide open debate. There are many factors to consider in such a discussion to be sure. Also, hard does not necessarily mean good or interesting (as you seem to indicate yourself), and if I’m forced to choose between them it will be good and interesting above hard. At any rate, I personally feel that redux is probably among the most challenging versions released to date (right or wrong, I must anyhow come clean in that I have not tried out all other versions available, just so that this is clear to everybody). It is very likely that redux is far more lethal than other versions and that is a special characteristic for redux for sure, along with plenty of other things that are special and probably unique with it so far.
”Since your game has so many turns, maybe it is an idea to slow down the progress by lenghtening the buildtime of buildings. That way we can enjoy a longer time with your less superior units in battle.”
I have worked with redux in various forms for 4 years so I am quite content with how things are (suffice to say, I have tested and considered this more than once). If you feel the need or have an urge to change it for your personal game, do so, but I want it the way it is. The tech-trees have been a subject that I have probably worked a lot more with than many others so there are no things there I am uncertain of so far. If you want less superior units, just commission more of them and the problem is solved. Besides it is highly unlikely that you will have the cash to “build” all the troops you want all the time and thus you’ll be forced to consider cheaper alternatives at times. That circumstance is by conscious design.
”I'm kindoff sad that I have to throw them to the side so soon, to be able to match the heavies from the enemy. You have a real richness in unit choise.”
Well this part of the redux arms-race, that’s how things are and that is what you get with an improved and recalibrated AI, at least when I have done it. As for the richness of troops, well this is a pure design-matter; I have designed it that way because I want it like that. I want to have choice and options, where as the original offers little. So I changed it. You know, you still have a choice to use such “inferior” troops if that is what you like, but as you said, it will be problematic when you face the AI. That’s redux...
”Just some idea's. But maybe you have thought these things over already for years and have no desire to change it.”
As I said I worked with redux in various forms since 2004, the available public version found its essential form in 2007. Default redux works, and as much as I am always interested in various ideas, I have in most cases thought things thru more than once and what you are playing now is the end result of my conclusion that such form and design is the best possible for that so far. Changes are only made if they prove to be more in line with my overall intensions for redux. There have been a few such examples after the first release but they are fairly rare (the aspects of some Byzantine units are such examples for instance, Western and Baron von Manteuffel helped me with that, again thanks guys). These changes are not to be taken lightly since they simply must be better in every regard to be justified, also they must function with the other already existing material in the game as well. That craves either extensive experience of the game, its designs and mechanics or some solid testing - preferably both. As simple as that, otherwise “you” would end up with a pretty crappy game fairly soon.
Now, by all means feel free to present any ideas and I will welcome that, but don’t expect me to jump at them the first thing I do, because that would simply be hoping for too much. Besides what might seem great for you might seem to be crap for me and vice versa of course. It is not by any way certain that we share views on all different issues. Also, I have said it before and I’ll say it again, do a redux-mod and release it as an optional expansion or something, it would be great. I am still waiting for the barons Order-expansion mod for instance! Hehe! There are among other things 12 vacant unit-slots available for you guys, use them! If you want heroes, put them in! - I have made that blank for that very reason, so you guys could do that on your own (VI-version only thou).
”One more note: I noticed that Byz recruits mostly skirmish units. That makes them weak I think.”
Keep a close eye on that for me, if this turns out to be more than a temporary thing it is well worth investigating further, because that is not the overall plan here. However, I do suspect it to be just a temporary thing.
Boz: No problems man... Hopefully you now know where I stand in regards to the longbow and the reasons as for why. It is radical and problematic decision no doubt, but I personally think it is well worth it since it creates a tactical diversity and reflect the longbow for what it is. It also creates an option to fight in that special “English way” if one wants to do that, and I do like the fact that the player has the option and liberty to choose whether or not he/she wants to use that way or not. Instead of simply removing that choice from the player as most designers would probably do and certainly all other versions of MTW have done so far (or perhaps applying a lame ridiculed version of it). No, I want that choice to be made by the player, not by the designer.
Noone23: Now, lets set the record straight shall we? Because the way it is now, it is way too off track and distorted for my taste. The rest is in the spoiler...
First of all, you asked for pointers to help you in your persuit for the HRE superreich thing, I provided you with answers and such. Still here you are questioning my know how by implying that there could be a bug-risk to the pointers I gave you. And yet you have at the same time used the very stuff I have provided you with? If you suspected there was a bug-risk to the stuff, why on earth do you apply them then? You can’t have it both ways you know...
Secondly, I did not (and still don’t) resent the fact that you chose to do alterations on redux (I might have personal opinions on WHAT you appear to have done, but that is not the same thing). I have time and time again suggested to people to do their own adjustments, additions or full mods if they wanted or felt an urge to do that. That won’t become any less true just because you choose to blatantly ignore that fact (I have done it in this thread several times, which by the way you claimed to have done some reading on, and it is also in plain black and white in the redux read me-file as well).
What I do not care much for was the fact that you claimed to steamroll all over the game (Europe) with your “so many smashing victories” and “to another lopsided win” and all that highflying bunch of crap. This is what I had problems with, nothing else. I still am very sceptical and doubtful to the substance and the validity in all these claims, and it is my right to be so regardless if you like it or not. To me it certainly came across like an attempt of trying to be "oh so" impressive and that the game could not offer "mighty you" any resistance at all (thus actually indirectly implying that I have done a poor job with the redux).
What you were blatantly vague on however was the fact that you had so heavily altered the game into something that seems to have no sporting chance what so ever of offering you anything short of a futile sequence of one-sided slaughter to your favour and all this was/is all by your very own design. A fact, I still think, you were way too vague about in that initial post. You have still not come all clean with all that, exactly what you have actually done. And yes, the more you have revealed about you “alterations” the more your initial “lopsided wins” has become more and more questionable in their nature considering the circumstances.
The steamroller was made by your design, the superior troops was made by you design, starting cash and all other stuff you have done to further extinguish any possible way for the AI to offer any sort of meaningful resistance thus throwing out any balance and all functional design out the window. On top of the fact that you do play on easy level as if your “heavy alterations” was not enough for you. Obviously you want to have the combat bonuses and the AI penalties as well. And, after that you still have the stomach to implicitly question the AIs and games capabilities to offer you a challenge. It does not add up, not even by a long shot, and all this on a public forum concerning a game that I have designed as well, not you. A place where you can’t expect people to read things thru closely thus there is a very possible risk that it could be mistakenly interpreted to be representative of the public version of redux. All this because you consciously or unconsciously (it does not matter really) did not bother to be clear enough about that fact, particularly on what you have actually have done to your home-edition of redux. Hell, I still don’t know what you have actually done with your favourite units because that is still not revealed.
Yeah, you did not think of all that I have gathered that much but let me tell you, I did... That’s what I have problems with, nothing else. Besides I have even gone so far as to help you out to further this personal goal of yours in making the HRE invincible (regardless of my personal feelings) and yet here you are suggesting in your post that I have resented the possibility that people might change redux. Again you can not have it both ways. Chose one and stick with it...
Thirdly, I have already stated (in my very first post directed towards you, post: 168) that I had hopes that you were having fun with redux in your own special way the exact words were: “I hope that you are having lots of fun with redux in your on [own] special-edition way...” I have had no reasons to change that statement so far. In spite of that fact, here you are, suggesting in your post that I am unable to be happy about you having fun with what used to be redux, in spite of the fact that I explicitly stated that I have nor should have any rights to question the various decisions you do at home with your game. Still here you are, suggesting otherwise in your post. You really are piece of work do you know that. For the third and final time, you can not have it both ways, you choose and then you stick with that choice...
As for the abbey, I always welcome and appreciate any spotting of all possible errors in redux (it serves us all so it is basically a good thing). In this particular case, that error was discovered about a month ago by Orph (see post: 93) and both the Superfix and VI-Upgrade 1.0 has been released after that discovery so I suggest that you do update your game before you try to report in possible errors (it helps and you don’t have to look bad in the process).
FOR THE RECORD; a game is just a game generally speaking, no questions and problems there. However, in a conventional meaning that means that you also must have a prospect to have more than one possible outcome otherwise it ceases to be a game and becomes a sequence of some sort. This is one of the very defining aspects of a game (I should know since I have actually bothered to study these things and have written papers on that subject as part of my formal education). We obviously don’t have the same views on that and because of this it is problematic/hard for me personally to regard your home-version as a functional game; to me it appears more to be a sequence instead, as far as I can tell at any rate. Redux is probably “just” another game for you (no surprises there), but to me it “just” happens to be the end result of some 4 years of unpaid toil and hard work as well. So it probably will not be “just” a game to me. I thought I’d make that clear for you as well before you start going further down that road...
Now, I have been more than kind to you Noone23, but even my patience and good will has limits. I offer you a second chance to get out of all this clean (no grudges attached) by dropping all this nonsense and inconsequence of your post and limit your further contributions to things regarding and relevant to default redux from now on. Then I will forget all about this crap and start all over with you. Because I won’t offer that chance to you a third time, is that clear? What happens next is now entirely in your hands.
Start over, or shall I start doing some ignoring on my own? It's your call....
- Cheers
----------
Joh, perhaps you might have some suggestions to William here since you have played (still plays?) the Russians if I remember everthing correctly?
Is there something that might be worth mentioning here?
William the Silent
10-19-2008, 10:26
Axalon, thanks for your great replies allways. You're a dedicated man.
I'm sorry that I didn't try all of your suggestions about reviving these english. I apreciate your concern/time for it. My problem was I only had that last save (I keep more saves now). I moved and tweeked to get my king older, but after 10 times of reloading I had enough. And I do not have time to change things inside the game, or learn about it.
How can you make screenshots actually in MTW? It doesn't work the same as in RTW.
You're game is fine as it is. I just try to give my input to maybe make it better. I have no problem with it if you don't use my idea's. Totally fine. I understand you thought everything through already.
I will not comment on the other Mods. I agree with what you say about that. I think they all have something great and unique.
I tried to make a screenshot of these Byzantines with their too many skirmishers, but as I said I didn't know how, in this game: "Print screen" doesn't work.
I wrote down what an average stack looks like for both Byzantines and Lithaunians up till turn 900.
Byzantines actually lost a lot of units, because they are getting clobbered by the Saracens. I guess skirmishers are the first casualties, since they have declined in the Byzantines. Lithaunians didn't loose many units yet in battle.
Lithaunians stack: 4 Bodyguard units, 1 spear unit, 1 sword unit, 1 archer unit, 4-5 skirmish units, 2-3 ballista units.
Byzantine stack: 4 Bodyguard units, 1-2 spear units, 1 sword unit, 2-3 archer units, 4-5 skirmish units, 1 ballista unit.
Btw. the russians are doing good. Have established armies with spearman (valour 2) and anything else armour 3, 5 star generals, superior sea power north and Black Sea. Plenty of heirs.
Saracenes are dominating again. I made them my friend (untill I see weakness) and then :smash:
https://img359.imageshack.us/img359/2015/toothpi9.gif (https://imageshack.us)
Kaidonni
10-19-2008, 10:55
Long time no post on these forums...
William the Silent>In MTW, you have to use F2 for screenshots. They are then stored as .tga files in their own folder, which should be located in the main folder where the .exe is. It'd be the folder named TGAs.
I'm considering trying my hand at this mod. I've been having a break from MTW, but the urge to play is growing on me. I wonder...are there any plans for factions like Sicily being included at any point in the future?
Hi guys,
Will: Ok, I have checked out the skirmishers myself. The current AI-settings do what it is supposed to, as it is not only building skirmishers. However, it is just barely acceptable. I also think that there are too many skirmishers (and archers) around for the Byzantines. And, as I look upon the values it sure looks like I have missed it and current numbers seem completely unacceptable. This means Will that you have earned yourself another credit and I’ll be forced to do something to remedy the current situation. I will have to recalibrate sections of the AI-matrix again and especially focusing on Byzantium, “crap-troops” in general or low-end units so the opposition will be a bit wiser (I’ll also remove the discount on English longbows, why on earth is that still around?). Thanks for that discovery Will, I appreciate it.
So, I guess just me and the good ‘ol “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt”-file again (just like old times). A bit more serious, it might very well be that I will release a fix for this, we’ll see, no ETA however… In the mean time feel free to keep the rest of us posted on Russia and what happens there under your rule.… Oh yes before I forget, the printscreen works but you’ll have to push it 2-3 times, and then it works.
Kaidonni: I bid you welcome and thanks for helping out here. I actually have forgotten about the “F2” button but here you reminding me again, thanks.
Now, I am afraid I’ll have to disappoint you concerning the Sicilians. Since Redux was originally built for MTW-v1.1 and the Lombard’s have replaced the Sicilians there is no prospect of such a development in any “official” redux expansions by me. That would simply tear the two redux-versions (VI/v2.01 and v.1.1) apart even more and I don’t want that at all. I am trying to keep them together as much as possible, so that won’t happen, sorry.
However that does not in any way exclude the possibility that someone else could do a mod-expansion with the Sicilians in the VI-version (getting the colours right and all), perhaps you are that someone? Technically it’s very possible and all GFX is already done in the original and you could easily copy the Italian reduxed tech-tree and tactical profile and before you know it you got your sicilians in redux. That’s the best I can do for you at the moment, sorry.
I hope that won’t scare you off from giving redux a spinn, I would actually be suprised if you were sorry for trying it out. My guess is that most people judge redux based upon one campaign, even if campaigns usually is very diffrent one from the other (even with the same faction). Well, well your’e the boss, so it’s all your call...
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/universal/RX_greentrees00.jpg
REDUXED TREES ANYONE?
-------------------------
Here is a little something I did a few days ago, it sure makes the battlesfields a little more colourful, and that never hurts! Now, this was/is actually indented for later release but for those of you who are avid readers, updaters and downloader’s here at the redux corner this is a special early sneak-peak of this stuff for you. It will be kind of an optional fix until it will be included in a bigger release. We had too much people not realizing that they should have updated their games long time ago. He he! It should pay off to stay alert I think! I’ll have to pack and upload it first and then I will set up a link for you guys soon.
- Cheers
Baron von Manteuffel
10-20-2008, 01:18
Hey Axalon, are all the Redux faction difficulty levels determined while playing on the expert setting? Just wondering. I started a campaign with the English using the Expert setting and tried to stimulate a cash flow. Then I was offered the alliances and excepted all including France.
While pre-occupied with the cash flow thing, the French attacked and took Normandy. They then destroyed my little fleet and it was just a few turns later, began to attack the rest of Great Britain. I just couldn't recover and bailed out.
I then tried the Hard setting and though I had more florins and did a little better, eventually history repeated itself. Again, the back-stabbing French. I gave up once more. :shame: Started another campaign on the Normal setting but gave that up too because, after all the struggles on the Expert and Hard settings Normal was no longer enough of a challenge. :no:
Went back to the Expert setting with a plan this time. Every English campaign seem to present one major problem, the French. This time I built some English Spearmen, and Regular Infantry, and took the battle to them with an attack on Ile De France. Beat them there and let the French King have Anjou. That is the best plan of action I've found for the English. You have to stop, or at least slow, the aggressive French.
I believe I'm hooked now on the challenge of the Expert setting. You really need to monitor all your generals loyalty levels though to avoid a Civil War.
In reguards to units I like the Royal Guard and Heavy Infantry. I wanted to ask you what your idea was with the English, Spanish, and Frankish Knights? I thought they would be more of an elite unit because of the building requirements, but after looking at the CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT, they closely resemble the Fuedal Knights. In fact they look weaker. Their charge value is 5 while the Fuedal Knight is 12. I know sword and lance but maybe give them armour piercing? Other than the cheaper cost for the English (etc) knights, I see no reason to build them. :no:
By the way, I like what you did with Longbows and agree with you that they are now accurately portrayed. Yes! :yes:
William the Silent
10-20-2008, 02:00
Hm, I had different experience with the english. Maybe because of different tactics.
I played on Hard. I noticed that opponents (France) do not attack if you have equal force strenght.
So in the beginning I moved my strongest units to Normandy. France never attacked me.
England was weak, but rebels normally do not attack.
I surrounded the Isles with ships to prevent it from being invaded. Then I started building a force to take all of the Isles. English economy is good.
For a long time nobody, but me, built fleets.
After I had taken Flanders (flemish spearman are great) and Friesland with forces built in England, I noticed that at the moment I left one of these provinces weak, the french would attack.
I must say it's a "chess game" to defeat the french, or any other faction. I try to weaken them by bribing one stack before I attack :laugh4:.
One of my tactics is setting up a trap. I leave one provence weak knowing they will attack. Once they attack I close in behind that invading army next turn, while attacking the invading army with held back force from the Isles. Sometimes the invading army chooses to retreat and is lost totally, because their way back is blocked. So double victory. You hope their king is in there then :laugh4:
That's the way you can defeat Moors in Spain. Let them invade you and block their way back home, by taking all seas with your fleets, behind them :laugh4:.
I know how to establish myself and beat off any attack, but defeating factions is very hard.
I guess Axalon did a great job.
I need some help installing this mod.
I followed the exact steps in the installation guide, but it didn't work.
Here is what I did, please tell me what I did wrong:
1. Downloaded the mod & related files.
2. Reinstalled the original Medieval Total War.
3. Unzipped the mod, renamed Redux Total War to Medieval - Total War and copied it over to replace the original game.
4. Created a short cut then ran the mod.
5. It didn't work, kept telling me to put in the correct disc.
6. Help!!!
Baron von Manteuffel
10-20-2008, 07:20
I need some help installing this mod.
I followed the exact steps in the installation guide, but it didn't work.
Here is what I did, please tell me what I did wrong:
1. Downloaded the mod & related files.
2. Reinstalled the original Medieval Total War
3. Unzipped the mod, renamed Redux Total War to Medieval - Total War and copied it over to replace the original game.
4. Created a short cut then ran the mod.
5. It didn't work, kept telling me to put in the correct disc.
6. Help!!!
Which game version did you install? If you installed (original) Medieval Total War Version 1.1 then you need Redux 1.0b and that's all. If you also installed Redux VI-Upgrade 1.0 and use the Medieval Total War Version 1.1 disc, you'll get that error message. :inquisitive:
Kaidonni
10-20-2008, 10:46
Hey Axalon, thanks for the reply. I might consider adding the Sicilians in the VI version at some point, and don't worry about it, no problem that you don't want to add them in. Besides, I've got to try me the English first. Especially with Normandy. :D
EDIT: Ah, I didn't notice the Lombards on the pics on the first page. For some reason, I assumed the Italians were the Lombards, but I can see a small faction between Italy and Burgundy. Nice! I'm VERY tempted to try them first, I absolutely love one province factions (no joke - I was sad when, in XL 3.0 and Tyberius' mods, Sicily also had Naples, but on the flipside happy that England had been downsized).
Which game version did you install? If you installed (original) Medieval Total War Version 1.1 then you need Redux 1.0b and that's all. If you also installed Redux VI-Upgrade 1.0 and use the Medieval Total War Version 1.1 disc, you'll get that error message. :inquisitive:
Ok, I think I know what the problem is. I think I have the Gold Edition game and not the original 1.1. Therefore, I need to also install the Redux VI-upgrade 1.0. I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks.
Hello everyone,
He he! And who said the redux-AI could not be aggressive!?? Yet again we have an obvious example of the contrary! No, the AI behaviour is wide open for debate! The redux-AI can be both aggressive and defensive, and I think that this is great because that means that you never know for sure what it will actually do and that is unpredictability for you guys! :laugh4:
Baron: As usual, my thanks for holding the fort. You know the drill by now and you got the info straight and that’s the way should be. That way we can all help each other a lot faster! I sure appreciate it as you know and I only wish that more people would follow your example here.
Now, you are having problems with the English? Well, as I said time and time again. campaigns differ from each other, even if it is with the same faction. If nothing else you have now discovered first hand that redux can strike back at you, which is a nice trait I think. It makes the game more fun, interesting and challenging. As you all too well know, I always play on expert regardless any other variable, and I have played England a lot my self and I have never had such problems you had, so my guess is that this is something to do with the unpredictability of redux and maybe some of your strategies.
What is clear is that the French AI will definitely consider attacking Normandy, and that’s quite understandable since it is a rich province with some development as well. It is a tempting target basically, and the AI is more interested in those than any others. If you do not defend such a target properly, it will be invaded. It’s just a matter of time. Now, how about building some troops (light cavalry and some other stuff, also move in 100 men from Wessex (your Feudal Infantry + English spearmen) for instance that should work just fine and some further buildings as well? Yeah, it will take time but that’s a part of the game. The start is usually one of the most critical phases in a game; redux is probably not an exception.
As for the English (etc.) knights your observations are quite correct, they do resemble the feudal knights very much (that was/is the plan), but they do offer a cost-flexibility to you as your realm becomes more developed and that’s the major point with them. However, since they got swords instead of lances their charge values are adjusted to that fact, hence a lot less charge-bonus. They are available at half the cost of a full formation of feudal knights (which is expensive), but come with the penalty that they only got swords. Essentially they are half-formations of feudal knights (but with swords).
As for favourite troops, yeah “Heavy Infantry” and “Royal Guards” are mine as well. “Royal Guards” are really tough formations, not big but tough. A typical Axalon army will have a core of Heavy Infantry and some royal and feudal knight-formations (which is also favourites of mine). Almost all my generals are always royal knights if I play the English, leading at the front of the army… It’s just my style, I am well aware of the risks and that others have a very different style of commanding their troops. “Looking thru the binoculars” at a safe distance, so to speak. It’s not for me…
As for the difficulty setting, it is based on several things but should be regarded as valid for normal setting above all.
Finally, it seems that William have devised a plan to beat the AI by exploiting weaknesses in the hardcoded behaviour. Most games have these kinds of weaknesses and there is little I can do to counter it. Then again, it is just a question of time before stuff like that happens.
Hugalu: Welcome to the redux corner, I hope you will have a good stay here. Feel free to post in campaign-reports, detailed battle reports or any other redux related stuff that you deem interesting to the rest of us and by all means any questions as well. We’ll be waiting here for the good news (you getting redux up and running)! Good luck!
Kaidonni: knock yourself out with the Lombards! However, you should be aware that the Lombard’s are not included in the default redux settings (minor power), meaning you won’t get any intro-text and if you play a glorious achievements campaign, you can’t check the scores because the Lombard’s don’t have any shield for that (if I remember it correctly), so the game will crash. Other than that it should work just fine playing the Lombard’s. Also, you will have to fix the “startpos” campaign-file manually. Overall the Lombard’s circumstances are very similar to the Italians (maybe slightly harder, having just one province and all that). Happy fighting!
Will: You sneaky….. He he! I have done a few of those myself over the years, but with a very different agenda. Mine was to force the AI to fight me, yours seem to be an intricate manoeuvre of defence instead. He he! Anyway, it’s good stuff. The redux corner is the right place to share strategy and tactics, so you’re right on. As for having a hard time breaking the opposition, this is redux! It’s supposed to be like that! He he! Have fun… :laugh4:
- Cheers
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/universal/RX_greentrees00.jpg
Alright guys, here is the "GreenTrees"-fix. This optional fix will change the trees in battle-mode
so they will be a bit more colourful, as simple as that! You can download it here:
Download MTW-Redux GreenTrees_Fix.zip:
Removed
- Enjoy
William the Silent
10-21-2008, 03:54
Axalon I tried your new "tree" fix. Something must have gone wrong:
https://img56.imageshack.us/img56/9571/t2ok1.png (https://imageshack.us)
https://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7132/rolleye0012yz7.gif (https://imageshack.us)
Hi there,
I know, I know, long time no see. It has been a very hectic time lately, with a lot of tight deadlines at work and tons of family appointments and obligations, which all combined has left me with no possibility of extending my Russian empire. In any case, I have kept myself well updated with the contents of this thread. I am happy to see (even though surely not as much as Axalon) the increasing number of active members in the “Redux corner”.
Anyway, yesterday I told myself, enough is enough, and after putting wife and kid to bed, I grabbed a nice bottle of wine, switched on my old computer (only one usable for MTW) and settled myself for a nice Redux late-night show.
Read at your own discretion:
To get a context picture, I should say that the Russian horde had already control over the Steppes, form Lithuania and Kiev to Khazar (spelling???). In any case, I play in hard (yes, I am a sissy) and I am a very cautious player, setting technical/infrastructural development over military might.
In my last session, I continued deploying my naval trade network at the maximum pace I could afford, cutting down in infrastructure expense and above all, troops production. In any case, after a few peaceful years, secured by my network of alliances, my fleet extended from Novgorod to the Black See, giving me a huge trade revenue … or at least compared to the meagre income I had at the beginning of the campaign (at this point Novgorod gave around 2.2k per turn).
The AI is building nice size armies when it can afford it. My Byzantine neighbours had 2-3 stacks per province around my borders, but the French are still the main military might of the known world. My Polish border on the other hand, is basically demilitarised, a long stretch of no-mans land. Soon enough as I feared (and somehow hoped for, as I tend not to start wars to easily overwhelm the AI) the Byzantines make their move. My only complain is that it was a very bold one: they try to sink my mighty fleet with their pathetic two vessel fleet. The result, two naval victories and no Byzantine fleet no more. And now comes my shameful sneaky move: taking advantage of my naval superiority I land a huge army at Byzantium itself where the Byzantine king is taking a little rest from the front lines. As every single time in MTW, the AI surrenders the province not to get the king stacked in a sieged castle. Byzantium (and its wooping 4.5k a turn) is mine.
As for AI behaviour, next turn the AI reacts pretty well sending large multiple-stacks armies to all our border provinces, Byzantium, Kiev and Khazar. Unfortunately (for the AI of course) I crush every single one of these attacks taking so many prisoners my war ships are about to sink.
And there we are now, after playing 3 major battles until 3:00 am, I decided it was time to quit. All-and-all, a very enjoyable late-night Redux show. Well, the morning was not that good with the kid waking up at 6:00 am and demanding constant attention, but well, I suppose that is the price you have to pay for waging war.
Some of my feelings/comments about the campaign:
Early in the campaign, I thought “Slavic bowmen” rocked as they could decimate half a rebel army in a bridge battle when attacking. They have superb range and pretty good damage. They delivered a good 200 kills per unit. Of course, the rebel were not really armoured, which did not helped them much. So, why do I need crossbows for? The have shorter range and enormously long reloading times. They are obsolete, why keep them?
A little further into the campaign I realised how premature my first impression was. Now I realise crossbowmen are death incarnate on the battlefield. On defence, they are consistently delivering 200 kills per unit … with more than half the ammunition left.
Now that I can afford it, large cavalry units are über devastating .. at least against the Byzantines, but I would imagine 133 horsemen charging anything could be quite a sight.
Does it pay of to build very high end units despite their much lower men count? Royal Spearmen (or something like that) come in a 53 men package, is that enough to be effective against either a cavalry charge or an average-stat 100 men sword unit? I have to confess I have not seen them fight yet.
On the tactical side:
It is true the Byzantines field a huge amount of missile units, so they are easily beatable with a horde of horsemen … which is the Russian approach. When you field 4-5 133 horsemen units plus your generals, mostly of royal blood, the Byzantines are dead meat. Anyway, I think you already changed that.
I am actually looking forward to finishing off the Byzantines so I can have a go at the Saracens, mainly because their armies are mostly Saracen Spearmen and Camel Warriors, so I do not think the cavalry approach would work very well here. I can still remember the massacre the Camel Warriors made of my Christian Knights on the original game.
After the Byzantines attacked me, all my allies abandoned me, and do not consider my marriage proposal anymore. I suppose they are getting a little bit scared of my power, which is good. Maybe we can see a firm alliance opposing my Russian mighty warriors.
Sorry, I know I already mentioned it, but I would do it again anyway. Is there any way to set a higher priority for ship construction for the AI? Now only England (1), Italy (2) and Spain (1) have boats on the water. No boats, no trade. No trade, no money. No money, no war machine.
On the bug/fixable/suggestion side:
I might be wrong, but I have not been able to find my Khazar governor anywhere. Maybe the title is lost? Maybe my eye sight is crap?
What does the “ruin ….” Building really do? I suppose it is happiness, but it is not stated on the card description. It just says something about bridging together the real and spiritual worlds (ok, that was kind of a personal description).
Russian hero does not have picture, but a number of question marks (maybe intended?). I am actually looking forward to building one of these, but since the description says keep protected from arrows and the Byzantines have mainly missile units, I do not know whether I will get to see him fight at all.
Ok, this one is going to be annoying, I know. I am a spoiled brat, I know. The thing is, I am one of those who followed Frogbeastegg’s bible and get a little bit lost when I do not know the stats of my units. Is there an easy way to create a chart like that? Please, remember I am a full blown ignorant.
And that would be all. I know, it was long.
I finally got the game to work. The game sure is on par with the original Medieval Total War, and it does have a lot of new, never seen before units. The game is also much harder since the costs to construct buildings went sky high. The battles seem a bit weird, where the units look like a swarm of ants. The game also has a few bugs where when loading a battle up it will say unable to find some files, then exit out of the battle. The game starts out slow since you don't have much money to build at the beginning, but once you built some income generating buildings, then you will be ok with money. Overall, the game needs some improvements but it is good for the first try.
I only recently stumbled onto this mod. It's become very addicting.
[...] The battles seem a bit weird, where the units look like a swarm of ants. The game also has a few bugs where when loading a battle up it will say unable to find some files, then exit out of the battle [...]
Hi Hugalu,
Regarding the look of the units, do they actually look weird? It might have something to do with your graphics card or drivers. Mine look fine ... ok, they look as weird as the original game when you compare them to the newer Total War releases.
Regarding missing files when loading up the battles, you might want to check your installation. I do not think anybody has complain about that, and definitely not on the campaign game. For me, this is the most stable TW series mode I have ever played, and I have played a few total conversions. Admittedly, I have not played that much (100 turns in each of my two campaigns) but not a single crash, works flawlessly for me.
The cavalry units look fine, just the infantry units that look weird. The game overall is fast and all, but it does lack the varieties of factions and events that other mods have. I like it the way it is, but if it can be expanded a little bit more it will be better.
The cavalry units look fine, just the infantry units that look weird. The game overall is fast and all, but it does lack the varieties of factions and events that other mods have. I like it the way it is, but if it can be expanded a little bit more it will be better.
Ok, now I just HAVE to have a look at my infantry with a more critical eye. I will let you know tomorrow as tonight I will continue my struggle against Byzantium ... hopefully not until as late as yesterday :laugh4:.
Hi guys and a special welcome to Rick, (this is a big one)
Joh: its nice have you back here and posting, and as always my thanks for holding the fort here. You’re post interesting and it deserves some further comments and reflection I think and don’t mind it being big, just as long it is interesting which it is (in my book at least. Besides it is nicely formatted which certainly helps “you” to forget the size). However, I will get back to it later, because I want to give it my full attention, and with the blatant oddities described by Hugalu, I am unable to do that for the moment. Sorry… I WILL get back to it!
Rick: I bid you welcome to the redux corner, your post were short, but sweet! Feel free to lengthen it a bit next time, and I do hope we get at least another post from you! Have fun with redux! Oh, what are you playing and at what diff-setting? :mickey:
Will: :laugh4: you rascal! Hehe! I had it coming I’d guess, since I have done some crappy jokes on you as well lately. Hehe! I have already devised a fix for that “error”; you turn the monitor upside down! Then they will work as supposed to! :laugh4:
A little bit more serious thou, way what do think of it? The trees I mean? I personally feel that the battlefield has become a bit more colourful and the trees actually resemble trees now instead of dark shadows of trees.
NOTE: For all you other guys, it’s just a prank from Will directed to me, nothing else!
The GreenTrees-fix works just fine! I repeat, it works just fine!
Hugalu: Your recent posts have certainly caught my attention and that is for numerous of reasons. First of all, are you sure that you actually have redux up and running? Is the “frontend” blue and with different music and sounds? Because what you are describing certainly makes me wonder if that is really the case. It certainly does not sound to be a redux in “perfect health” so to speak. Anyway this entire post has major "Hugalu-theme" all over it. More in spoilers....
Regarding claimed bugs...
The bugs you are claiming to have, what exactly are they? Because you claiming the existence of them is not going to help anybody if you do not describe and report them in properly. I’m sorry, but that’s the hard reality. As for the moment we only got your word for it, we don’t even have a description how they look like or where they are located. With just your word and claim, we can’t really do anything for you (or anybody else for the matter). You’ll have to do better than that if I and others are supposed to fix it, just so you know, I do take bugs very seriously, probably all the regular guys here can confirm that. Are you really sure it is a bug you have stumbled upon? Maybe it is just a misunderstanding from your part or it could be a corrupt save at an early stage of the game? If that is the case it is really unfortunate, but that is actually not reduxes fault because that is related to a flaw in the code of the original game.
I don’t know much here and thus I can only do some wild speculation (and that is not very productive), since you have so far given me almost nothing to go on here. Are you sure you have patched up your game to v.2.01? Or is it just 2.00? Check in the upper left corner of “frontend”, the version is displayed there. Basically you MUST provide more info if you want something to be done about it.
Ants, bugs and weird battles...
“The battles seem a bit weird, where the units look like a swarm of ants. The game also has a few bugs where when loading a battle up it will say unable to find some files, then exit out of the battle.”
This really got me wondering, the units look like ants?!? What the…. As in compared with what? The original game? Another later total war game? What?!? Is there a major (even a minor) difference with the troops compared to the original (excluding shields and such)? That is the only really interesting question really. I sure would appreciate a straight up answer on that. I might sound pushy but you are too vague here for my personal preference, could you please be a more specific and explicit? As for the battle-bugs they are so far unheard of, frankly I have run redux thousands of times and I simply can’t spot or remember any of what you are describing here, I’m sorry, but it does not exist in fully functional version of redux. Are you really sure you have patched up your game 2.00 to 2.01 and is that the install made on a fresh copy of v.2.01 (it was gold edition right)?
Hold on!!! It actually sounds like a corrupted save come to think upon it. As I said earlier, that is something solely related to the original game and not redux, my guess is that this might very well be the case.
To find that out Hugalu, here is what you do:
* start up a custom battle, same factions and at least similar troop’s composition.
* start up another campaign (temporarily) same faction and do a fight or two. You don’t even have to win here.
If neither of these show any similar errors as you have experienced earlier, you got a corrupted save on your hands. If that is the case open up the MTW-redux 1.0b ReadMe.txt the “known bugs” section and read the info available there. Other than that there is little you can do than to go back to an earlier save or start a new campaign, sorry but this is not my fault it is a flaw in the CAs original game. The only thing that might be fortunate here is the fact that you have become aware of this at an early stage and can take counter-measures to that from now on. We have had reports from a few people that have lost their campaigns after more than 100 turns in and they was forced to start over because they did not keep backup-saves. The whole thing is really sad chapter in MTW actually and that have also cast its unfortunate shadow over redux as well (after all redux uses and runs the same game program).
“… just the infantry units that look weird. The game overall is fast and all,…
Ok, more of the oddities… How does the infantry look weird and the especially interesting aspect is; do they look weird in any way compared to the original game? If so, how?!? If it is compared with another later official TW-game it is matter way beyond my control. Then it is a matter for CA, not me and redux.
Regarding design-matters...
“The game is also much harder since the costs to construct buildings went sky high.” …“The game starts out slow since you don't have much money to build at the beginning, but once you built some income generating buildings, then you will be ok with money.
Now this is a lot easier for me to grasp and comment on. This stuff is all related to design matters and as such we enter the domain of ideas, opinions, preferences and functionality. I have designed it that way because I thought it was better that way, I like it like that and I think it creates a more interesting game as well, that is my opinion and preference and my ideas are influenced by those. As for the functionality, it works and that is beyond any doubt. Do you like and prefer it? That’s an entirely different thing… Hopefully you find these traits in the game attractive as well, I really can’t say much more than that. Only you can determine that.
Improvements and first tries...
“Overall, the game needs some improvements but it is good for the first try.
Again you are too vague to enable me to produce meaningful answers or even a comments to that statement. What improvements are you talking about? Are they even technically possible to do these changes whatever they might be? There are always the possibilities for further improvements, redux is along with everything else (and I mean everything) is no exception. A more interesting question is; is it possible to do it? If we can, should we? Will it actually end up being better? And as for the last of these questions it is a matter of opinion, preference, speculation and perhaps experience to a certain degree as long as it remains undone and untested.
As for the first try, the redux-version you are playing, its basic design was set in 2007, after I had redesigned redux two or three times before… First major try was perhaps in late 2004 or early 2005. So, it’s not the first try, just thought I’ll clear that up for you. I aint that good, and neither are any of the few other MTW-designers/modders that are out there and at the same time have managed to actually release any major and functional MTW-version of their own (no exceptions, it would be very unlikely at any rate).
Factions & variety...
…but it does lack the varieties of factions and events that other mods have. I like it the way it is, but if it can be expanded a little bit more it will be better.
Ok, back to the dominion of opinions and preferences again… First of all, let me stress the fact that you are allowed to have whatever opinion you like, that is your privilege. By the very same concept I am fully entitled to mine. Now, my opinion (and preference) is that quality is (far) more interesting than quantity; diversity is (far) more interesting than conformity.
As for the sheer quantity aspect of factions is a thing I have discussed before (not explicitly in this thread thou) and by all means I can do it again. But, before I do so let me first present the actual and ruling practical framework for redux.
The ruling practical framework of redux
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Now redux was built upon MTW v.1.1 that gives a maximum of 20 presentable factions in a pure practical sense, because any more than that will result in simply horrendous faction colour combinations. I was not willing to accept that so, max 20 it is… Apart from that, there are the hardcoded limits and anomalies of v.1.1, meaning that we can not get 20 fully functional and operational factions. The Papist is good example of that, so is the Russians (considering the actual time-frame for redux) and bunch of others. We are also stuck with the default colour schemes that are present in MTW v.1.1, we can’t change them, no matter what, because it is hardcoded. We are also stuck with the hardcoding of faction cultures, meaning that even if you can change this on the surface it will still operate along the lines of the hardcoded behaviours and circumstances. I know, because I have done it for redux.
Also there is there overriding agenda of mine that redux should be available for all major versions of MTW, meaning v.1.1 and VI/v.2.01. Apart from redux there is only one other version of MTW that have trait to my knowledge. Now, I want to keep it compatible to both major versions of MTW and at the same time have some sort of conformity between the two versions, as in effect two players of the different versions can still have a basic discussion of redux as a game, in spite of the fact that they are playing two different versions. Most MTW-versions just ignores that and goes directly and only to VI/v.2.01. But that’s not for me. I want redux to be available and playable for all owners of a MTW-copy. That just the way I want it (and that by the way do mean a lot more work as well). Now, that means undoubtedly that MTW v.1.1 will set the bar for what I can do for both versions, thus the absolute max of acceptable factions present in the game is 20. However, since 2 of these factions have almost the exact same colour-scheme it becomes 19 possible candidates, so the max is actually 19. That is the actual and ruling practical framework for redux.
Why does redux have only 18 factions?
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Now, redux only got 18 factions (that is less than 19) so why is that? With the proper background now set, let the discussion begin then… First of all, the answers you will get on this subject vary greatly depending on who you are asking, now since I get the feeling that you indirectly asking me, here is my answer: Hehe, here we go…
Ok, so why have I only 18 factions? This is directly connected to my preferences and beliefs. I believe in the concept of “quality”, and the more factions I have, the greater risk it is that this “quality” will be endangered and more easily transform into something that could be regarded as “quantity”. I am well aware that other designers have very different views on this and that is reflected in their designs, which clearly shows in their released MTW-versions who are blatantly different from redux. It seems that it is a common opinion that more troops and more factions will secure a good game. I simply do not believe that, I just don’t. As I said elsewhere:
“ I think that the key to bliss [in MTW] is elsewhere; as in tech-trees or calibration of AI and diverse unit design for instance. Which probably are areas that might not have been quite that interesting for him as they are to me, thus underlining the differences between us (except perhaps the AI if I remember everything correctly since he was fairly interested in that)” (oh, don’t bother with who “he” is. It is irrelevant)
And…
“It is how the units are balanced and designed that matters to me, all else is secondary or cosmetics.”
And…
“1. Quantity of various troops does not in any way guarantee or secures neither a good game nor a good experience of it.
2. The risk of several troops to overlapping each other in capabilities, essential functions and purposes in the game increases for each new troop you put in there. Personally I’m not that excited about such prospects.
3. The risk of troops being poorly balanced (overpowered or underpowered) increases for each new tactical unit included in the game. This of course is always a risk, but it undoubtedly it gets bigger with more troops involved.”
And…
“… I have many times made the mistake of doing a new unit just to realize that it was not warranted (this of course after a lot of various work was already done, GFX-wise or whatever). Pouring in [totally from scrath] new troops is easier said than done, and more importantly will any of these new troops be warranted in regards to already existing units in the overall unit-grid? My experience is that after a while it becomes more and more “no” and less and less “yes”.
And (post:55)…
“It has never been my intension that the “tactical unit-profile” of Poland should be similar or resemble to the factions of western Catholic factions (as in Burgundy and France). It is very intentional that Poland greatly differs from all the other Catholic factions and that she relies much more on “Eastern” and Slavic-units. There is a designed and deliberate “cultural” difference applied here. We should not also forget that the opposition in the polish region is different then what is found in Frankish and Southern Europe (or at it least it should be, because I designed redux that way). And that is also reflected in the troops available to Poland.
And (post:80)…
The Moors as any other faction have limits and strengths. To me, cavalry and quantity are strong points for the Moors. Specialized infantry is one the weaker aspects. This together begins to draw a “profile” on that faction. Add to that a special tech-tree and the profile gets more explicit, then you have the aspect geography and regions and the profile evolves even further. This is the case for every faction in redux, to a more or less explicit degree depending on these parameters and others as well. Wealth is another aspect for instance. And were that wealth is found, as in which region you can find riches to commission expensive troops surely have an impact in the game. Regional development is another and the list can probably be expanded further.
The existing troops in redux works together in creating a diversity in the game yet they still balances each other out fairly well. Considering all the parameters involved here. To me there is no or little meaning of putting in new troops for the sake of it, because if those troops don’t have any real and valid function in the game, why are they there? There are of course a few exceptions, but there always are. My point being; any fool can fill the troop rooster to the max with let’s say “peasant Xs” and call them “Heavy Whateverings”. That’s not the trick, it is to give them purpose and diversity between them and thus strengthening the game and the experience of it as a whole, that’s the trick. That is at least the way I see it. Maybe you agree with me on this? It has definitely been my goal for redux at any rate.
And (post:116)…
Well this is something that I have tried to achieve by working a lot with unit-design, balance and tactical diversity, and the same time keeping an eye on tactical functions for each unit and the redux unit grid as a whole. I also thought that the standardized unit sizes could be torn apart to create some more interesting diversity (as you know this is not the only thing I have destroyed from the original game, the MTW projectile system is out the window for instance). The format of 20/40/60/100 formations is quite ok, but 1/5/10/20/40/60/80/100 is more diverse and interesting to me. Also it does allow you to expand the available tools of tactical diversity and unit-design in MTW. In the original there was too much conformity to my taste, almost all infantry units was 60/100 and cavalry was 20/40. I never really understood why it had to be like that. I wanted the diversity you get in redux so I designed it that way, as simple as that.
I might have done some further comments on this elsewhere but my point should be quite clear by now. Why the heavy focus on troops then?
Because it is the troops that to a significant degree creates and makes up the factions character (tech-trees and buildings are also other major factors). And, because the tactical diversity is limited by hardcoding the amount of meaningful units becomes limited. If they are limited, the amount of possible factions you can create with these troops are limited as well. This is at any rate my opinion.
Another excellent example of what I mean can be found in Shogun Total War. That game has fewer factions and less available unit-types than any other total war game and I dare say even modded versions of any Total War-game as well. Yet still it is in my mind one of the very best and most successful Total War games ever created (including different mods). That game proves my point and shows that it is very possible to achieve it - you don’t need quantity as long as you stick with, or successfully go for, quality in overall design. This is why I have only a limited amount of factions (and troops) in redux. My intension has been to have quality with the 18 existing factions I got (including troops, tech-trees, AI and basically the lot of it), that was/is my goal.
I firmly believe that redux won’t get better by adding several new factions (or troops) to it, it will probably get worse instead! This is why I have only 18 factions in redux.
However that does not mean...
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Now having said all that, let me also point out that this does not in any way exclude the possibility that someone else, other than me, (that is not bound by the notion of keep both redux versions similar) could add an extra faction or two in the VI/v2.01-version of redux and thus creating an expansion for that. It would be fun and I welcome that! Besides redux will probably handle that quite well. It would be great if such a version was released! But, adding lets say five new factions?!? I seriously doubt that such an addition will help the game much. I would actually be rather worried for such a prospect, suspecting it to be five fateful and unfortunate steps towards quantity and personally I would think it to be a very regrettable development for redux (or any version for that matter).
So… There you have it... This is my answer for you and this is where I stand in this matter. It is not in any way a mere chance that I designed redux the way I did. As said earlier, there are plenty of people that don’t agree with me on the quantity vs. quality thing, including most other designers/modders. Perhaps you as well?
The events then…
All “historical events” are hardcoded. Personally I am not a big fan of those anyhow, it is too hap-hazard for my taste and since the default timeframe for redux is 700-1260 you will have to play for about 400 turns before the hardcoded events starts to kick in… I prefer it that way, since that means that these events won’t bother me for the major part of the game. However, it is very possible to change the timeframe, and if you feel the need to do that by all means do it. You will have various hardcoded events between 1089-1453 or there about. It’s your choice for your personal game man (and it probably won’t make that big impact on redux. Also there are simple guides for how it’s done)…
Ok, Hugalu that’s all I got for you this time. I would appreciate some answers myself, so please post some back here. :bow:
Cheers guys!
Yes, the game is Redux with a blue screen when loading up. Come on ;), I have about 6 mods total as of now, and I am not a kid that can't tell which game is which. :) I played as the Russians, expert mode. The game was tough at the beginning because I didn't have much money at the beginning, and the Lithuanian (light brown/yellow color) expanded so fast and so much. The weird thing about the error when it's loading the battle is sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. But the good thing is it doesn't shut the game down. It just exits the battle as if it never happens. The other thing is the AI is not as aggressive as other games. I meant they have 5-6 stacks of armies and still didn't dare to attack me, unless I attack them first.
Hi Hugalu, (don’t take offence about the load-screen, there have been such related problems before)
* What about the ant-thing? What about that? I really like some answers on that….
* You have yet to report in the results of the corrupted-save-check I offered you. That way, it will become clear if it is a corrupted save or not. It sure would explain things...
* Is your version really 2.01? (I am just making sure here, that’s all.)
Your bug is actually unheard of… As I said I have run redux thousands of times and never anything like what you are describing. Besides, redux has been public for over two months and a problem such as this one you are describing *would* have been discovered. Especially since we were actually bug-hunting for over a month, so I am sorry, but I find it very hard to believe that it is a bug. My guess is that your install is not in perfect order, and for some reason, it may lack a unit-icon or something like that (god knows why, and that is very unlikely since that would have been discovered as well). It’s either that or a corrupted save (I believe it is a corrupted save).
As for the AI, don’t be so fast in judging it based on one single campaign. It changes much from campaign to campaign. There is a lot of external Intel on this very thread, apart from my own experiences with it, that paints a very diffrent picture. The AI behaviour is a subject wide open for debate. It’s unpredictable; it can both defensive and offensive. However, it does have a tendency to prepare itself before it goes to war (maybe you are unaccustomed to that, I don’t know). And, in a general sense it still is the coward of the original game, since that is all hardcoded.
Anyway, I hope you are having an intresting and fun game in spite of all the strange problems. :mickey:
- Cheers
Ok, this horde of verdanas is for you Joh, as in some replies and remarks for post: 197
“The AI is building nice size armies when it can afford it. My Byzantine neighbours had 2-3 stacks per province around my borders, but the French are still the main military might of the known world.”
Well France has a good potential of being a force to be reckoned with, due to the riches of the French region. France is without a doubt one of the richest factions in the game or at least it has that potential. All depending on how things look at the stratmap of course.
"…the Byzantines make their move. My only complain is that it was a very bold one: they try to sink my mighty fleet with their pathetic two vessel fleet."
Well as you might have guessed, the AI behaviour in these regards is for all I know hardcoded so I can't do anything about it, even if I wanted to. As for the naval aspect of MTW (and redux, this is after all hardcoded) is very debatable area, which no doubt leaves much to wish for.
”As every single time in MTW, the AI surrenders the province not to get the king stacked in a sieged castle. Byzantium (and its wooping 4.5k a turn) is mine."
Not perhaps every time, but way too much. I believe I have discussed this before somewhere in this thread. As for Constantinople, that is one of the richest provinces in redux (and MTW), because of that it is a popular target. It is very likely that you will have to defend it someday if you do not secure your borders close by.
“As for AI behaviour, next turn the AI reacts pretty well sending large multiple-stacks armies to all our border provinces, Byzantium, Kiev and Khazar. Unfortunately (for the AI of course) I crush every single one of these attacks taking so many prisoners my war ships are about to sink."
Hehe! Way to go! :laugh4:
"And there we are now, after playing 3 major battles until 3:00 am, I decided it was time to quit. All-and-all, a very enjoyable late-night Redux show. Well, the morning was not that good with the kid waking up at 6:00 am and demanding constant attention, but well, I suppose that is the price you have to pay for waging war."
Yep, there is price for everything I guess… :laugh4:
Feelings/comments about the campaign:
"A little further into the campaign I realised how premature my first impression was. Now I realise crossbowmen are death incarnate on the battlefield. On defence, they are consistently delivering 200 kills per unit … with more than half the ammunition left."
Well in single effect, crossbows are more lethal. The downside is of course reloading time and shorter range, and that are their real big weaknesses (short from the fact that they aint any “Conans” in battle of course). As every other unit, they have their place, purpose and weaknesses… However, it is an fairly even race between (real) archers and crossbowmen. Usually archers tend to be a tad better to defend themselves however (in general terms at least).
"Now that I can afford it, large cavalry units are über devastating .. at least against the Byzantines, but I would imagine 133 horsemen charging anything could be quite a sight."
You play at maximum settings? Troop-size that is? It sounds that way anyhow. Massed cavalry can be great! Sure looks nice doesn’t it? However, facing the “wrong” kind of enemy can be utter disaster as well, so always keep an eye out for what kind of forces you might be facing in battle and do adjust your armies accordingly. Otherwise you will probably loose or have horrendous losses at least. You know all that of course but I am just giving you a friendly reminder here (because this is especially true for redux).
”Does it pay of to build very high end units despite their much lower men count? Royal Spearmen (or something like that) come in a 53 men package…"
You must be referring to the “Palace Guards”, those guys are good! Probably among the best infantry you will ever get as the Russians! Don’t let that size fool you! Do a few battles with them and you will soon find out their mettle! As an over all rule the fewer they are, by default that is, the more dangerous they usually are. I thought that this piece of info might be interesting and useful for you… Hehe! Heroes and champions are good, but they are solo-units and that are the downside with them!
On the tactical side:
“…the Byzantines are dead meat. Anyway, I think you already changed that.”
Yeah, I will look over that when I get the time, because as is, doesn’t cut it my book (thanks again Will for that discovery). It functions now, but it is barely acceptable. So, yes I will probably change that for something better. No ETA for that thou…
"…Saracens, mainly because their armies are mostly Saracen Spearmen and Camel Warriors,…"
Yeah I have noticed myself that the AI is pretty found that line up. Well, the infantry is not that bad so it can probably offer you a decent fight or two. My geuss is that you will have more difficulties with these guys (at least the way the redux-AI is currently configured). As for the camels, well they are camels and with some decent infantry they will become history very fast. I the Saracens manage to put up some of that excellent cavalry, then you should be more careful. Oh and don’t forget, if the Saracens got archer around, take ‘em out or you will probably have some serious damage in your ranks…
"Sorry, I know I already mentioned it, but I would do it again anyway. Is there any way to set a higher priority for ship construction for the AI? Now only England (1), Italy (2) and Spain (1) have boats on the water. No boats, no trade. No trade, no money. No money, no war machine."
Yeah, this is something that got me wonedering… I must say that your Intel here surprises me and I usually don’t have these kinds of problems myself. Italy, Lombardy and Byzantium usually are avid naval-powers when I play. France, Vikings/Norse and the Saracens usually build some smaller fleets as well. There usually are plenty of ships floating around when I play, so I don’t think that it is the AI-settings that are causing problems here for you. I suspect it rather to be something else, god knows what thou (I have to little info here to come up with any substantial suggestion as for why. My wild guess is lack of developed ports).
Your overall assumption in regards to trade is correct but even that is the case, the AI simply refuses to do anything rational when it comes to trade so even if there was lots of ships around the AI would not get as much florins as you do. This is hardcoded behaviour.
On the bug/fixable/suggestion side:
"I might be wrong, but I have not been able to find my Khazar governor anywhere. Maybe the title is lost? Maybe my eye sight is crap?"
Your eyes are crap! Sorry… :laugh4:
"What does the “ruin ….” Building really do? I suppose it is happiness, but it is not stated on the card description. It just says something about bridging together the real and spiritual worlds (ok, that was kind of a personal description)."
It is a “holy” stone or rune stone if you like. Compose a better description and forward it to me and I will consider it. That description was based on the “writing tradition” I found for similar things in VI. Essentially it is more of the same. It generates a small happiness bonus (+5%) and some faith propagation +2% I belive. It’s all in the “crusader_build_prod13.txt”.
"Russian hero does not have picture, but a number of question marks (maybe intended?)."
1 question mark if everything is correct… Never found the time and inspiration to do that one. Maybe that will change in a formal patch. We’ll see I guess…
"Ok, this one is going to be annoying, I know. I am a spoiled brat, I know. The thing is, I am one of those who followed Frogbeastegg’s bible and get a little bit lost when I do not know the stats of my units. Is there an easy way to create a chart like that? Please, remember I am a full blown ignorant."
Well, with spoiled brats I usually have only one solution, get to work with it! You have all my blessings to use the redux pics and the template is already set by the froglady. Now, its time for you (and perhaps other as well) to do the grand redux-delux guide for units, since froggies guide wont do you any good for redux. Get going! Still a brat? Hehe! I actually would like such a guide…
Now, I think you (and perhaps others) doing a Redux unit-guide is an excellent idea! What you’ll need is to download a GnomeEditor, once you got one of those you can open up the “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt” find out all about each and every unit in redux. Froglady have set the standard and it up to you the either follow that template or do something better. Actually, to get things into a more manageable size, why don’t you do a faction at a time (as in all available units for that faction). Either you do it in word or in some fancier program like InDesign, Illustrator or perhaps even photoshop. That is the least of your problems, the problem is the dreary work of writing it all down somewhere else than in the “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt”. That way you limit the project-size and your chances for completion is a lot bigger, as in you got a serious chance of actually see it thru to the end. Maybe you should even start a separate thread and see if there were any other people interested in such a project, and if there is perhaps you could recruit them for your cause. Your call of course.
If such a project happens and it does generate a result it got to be in Pdf, it is the best and most manageable and common file format for stuff like that. Finally, the only thing I can promise you is that I won’t do it; I got my hands full with other redux-stuff. Overall, I think the idea is brilliant and well worth doing and certainly worth investigating closer as in if there is any “demand” for it and stuff like that. It would be real cool if it happens.
Oki, Joh that was all I got for you this time, happy fighting! :mickey:
- Cheers
@ everybody
Being the brat that I am, I like to know the stats of my units before sending them to combat, so I know what they are good for and against. Axalon, very wisely and cunningly, suggested ME doing some type of document about that. I could be willing to do that, depending on time availability.
First and foremost, I am a full blown ignorant when it comes to modding (or moding???) so I will need some help. According to Axalon, I should use some type of GnomeEditor to mesh with things. Problem is, I CANNOT FIND IT. And yes, I have been surfing a bit, both in the Guild and Google, but have not found anything that looks usable for my purpose.
So please, could anyone post a GnomeEditor download link or upload it to this thread?
@ William the Silent
Axalon I tried your new "tree" fix. Something must have gone wrong:
https://img56.imageshack.us/img56/9571/t2ok1.png
Do not ever do that again. Don't you realise I believe everything I read? You are a sick evil young man! :smash:
@ Hugalu
My infantry definitely looks normal ... that is, MTW normal, and not a single crash yet.
Yes, the game becomes much easier as you progress in the campaign, mainly because you develop your economy and are able to afford many more things. The speed at which you progress is affected by several factors, in my case it was mainly decided by two rebellions of my heirs, which costed me tons of time since I lost a quarter of my provinces each time.
However, I would expect that as your progress gets closer to the end date and you have expanded sufficiently, your trade network yields less revenue and financial situation becomes more tight, together with more unrest/rebellion levels. In any case, that is also applicable to the standard MTW.
@ Axalon and whoever might be interested
Ok, here we go. As, unlike many other threads, this ones does not allow short posts, here goes another long one :beam:. Sorry it is a little bit messy :sweatdrop:. Some general comments/answers/feelings based on my 125 years into Russian campaign, hard settings.
Comments/Corrections:
When I say that one faction is very powerful, but the game says that the major power is another one, I mean it in a good way. That means that factions are building up.
Byzantium is a gold mine. At full speed it is now producing 6.5k florins a turn and is by far my best province, with Novgorod delivering a steady 2.5-3k florins a turn. But as you mentioned, it is a nice price and the French have launch a crusade against it. In any case, Pope died and I retired my ships for a turn so there is no common border, and we are trading once again.
Corsica and Ireland are still rebel, but both have a 4-stack powerful rebel army, which I really do not know how on earth they can afford. They have not launched any ship yet though. In any case, my navy is moving in to eventually deal with their evil intentions and trade disruption.
WTF???? Maybe my Khazar governor is preparing a plot against me? Will check again, but the bastard is nowhere to be found. Tonight I will check under every stone, every tree, every leave if needed until I find the sucker!!!! Nobody messes with the Russian Royal Prince!!!!
Hero, one, few, many questions marks? Are you that peaky? Ok, ok, I stand corrected :oops:. Palace Guards? Royal Spearmen? What is the difference? Don't you see I am referring to them? Ok, ok, I stand corrected again. Must admit my short term memory is bad, but my long term is even worse ... if possible.
Regarding the rune, I was not complaining about the description, that is fine. It was just that I could not see the effects it brought. At some point, I though that it could spread pagan culture as some of my provinces have up to 10% pagan culture even though I have maximised religious building. Maybe is a side effect of your "rebellion/revolt" tweaking? Eventually I destroyed some of them and the orthodox culture seem to increased a bit (maybe due to other factors then???)
Explanations/Answers:
I am not sure of my setting, but definitely not huge because many people have complain about path finding issues. It could be either default or large, not really sure.
Ok, the lack of ships could be due to the difficulty settings, which in my case is hard, not expert. Will have to try with expert and see what happens :beam:.
Regarding the Saracens, they have started building more versatile armies, with foot archers. The Moors are also doing a good job with both spears, cavalry, camels and archers. On a side note, I should say that the picture/card for the Moorish generals is possibly my favourite. I have not check the rest much, but now I will have to look into the Germans and English (my new targets???)
Suggestions:
Regarding the player edge when it comes to trading, could there be some scripting giving the AI factions money to compensate for this disadvantage. Initially it should be a little amount, as the player is not really getting much from trade, then peaking in the mid-game and finally decreasing in the last stage of the game? Again, I do not know whether that is possible.
Norse armies: Sweden became rebel and I seized it, which eventually meant war with the Norse. Now, they are no more and Scandinavia and Hamburg are now spelled in Cyrillic characters. In any case, if the Byzantine build missile heavy armies, the Norse build heavy infantry heavy armies. I had to fight stacks with 8+ bodygaurds on them. By the way, do not engage them with your infantry, do not charge at them with your cavalry, just nuke them with arrows. So, all-and-all, they become an easy prey. BTW, my respect for Slavic Bowmen is back again :2thumbsup:.
I could have a go at the stats document, but as I said above, I need to figure out, first where to get and then, how to use that Gnome thingy you talked about. Starting with each faction seems the way to go. And yes, you got it right, the first one will be the Russians :yes: ... or maybe not?
Hi Joh, let me help you out here…
GnomeEditor available here:
http://www.atomicgamer.com/file.php?id=68503
There you go, the stuff is pretty self-explanatory. New row = new unit, new column = new aspect/category.
Just make sure you open up the right file! It is located in the redux installation as in ”Redux/Medieval - Total War”-folder. The file, you want to open up with the gnomeeditor is: “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt” (make a back up just to be safe). If it starts up with heathen –Xs in the first rows, then you got the right file. Have fun… :mickey:
I’ll comment your stuff later on or edit them in here…
EDIT: Some remarks as well then...
---------------------------------------------------
Rune/holy stone… Well this little thing functions like this, depending on who builds it and especially what religion that faction has, will ultimately set what kind of “Faith Propogation” the stone will emit. If it is a pagan faction that builds it, it will emit paganism, EVEN if the province is under, let’s say Catholic faction. That way, a province, with such a stone, built under such circumstances will never become 100% pure Catholic until that stone is destroyed. This hardcoded and now you know… Hehe!
About your unit-setting… Your setting got to be large, maximum would probably be 150 or 160 units to a default 100 man unit. I always play default so my knowledge is rusty here (personally I prefer that setting above all the others).
Regarding ships… Maybe it varies from campaign to campaign. I don’t know, I have never had any problem with the lack of ships, if anything it is the opposite, too many ships floating around. Very strange. My guess is still the lack of possible and suitable ports.
Regarding the Saracens… Well once they got diverse armies you are probably in for much tougher fights, consider your easy wins with the Byzantines as a warm up, especially when you come to the desert. Fighting in the desert will undoubtedly be the most disadvantageous terrain you will ever fight in, just so you know. It will be very interesting to see what kind of reaction you have when you face an army - the way it is supposed to be. As for the Germans and English, both will most likely to prove themselves a lot tougher than the crippled Byzantines (I got to fix that!). Especially the HRE since they should have many specialized units available by now.
The trade problem… What you are suggesting in your latest post is not possible in an acceptable way. Meaning those changes could too easily be abused and certain factions would be totally off limits or the whole game would go to hell. Technically it could be possible to create a special and unique building that generated enormous amount of florins but I seriously doubt if that would help the game. And, it would be almost impossible to ensure that this X-building would not fall into the hands of the player at some point. Basically, it is not possible in an acceptable way as long as MTW remains hardcoded… I have already done what I deemed viable in the VI-version and that is more radical and drastic than have ever been done before in any other version for MTW (as far as I can tell at least).
Regarding Norse armies… This is covered by post: 49 & 50…
- Cheers
---------
If I missed anything, give me a friendly reminder and I will see what I can do for you. :bow:
No wonder I didn't see the message I posted yesterday. I really appreciate all the time/effort put into this mod. I just want to point out it does have a few areas that need improvement, as in all the mods are.
Hi guys and a special welcome to Rick, (this is a big one)
Rick: I bid you welcome to the redux corner, your post were short, but sweet! Feel free to lengthen it a bit next time, and I do hope we get at least another post from you! Have fun with redux! Oh, what are you playing and at what diff-setting? :mickey:
Cheers guys!
I wimped out and I'm playing it the Normal level. I'll try and play it at a more difficult level the next time.
The game itself seems quite stable. When I play Pike and Musket I frequently have CTDs, but not with Redux or NTW.
Rick
Hello everyone,
Rick: Do I dare to ask what faction you are playing......? Don’t mind being wimpy, just as long as you are not trying to hide that fact. Then, it's alright in my book!
Joh: I have edited in my comments in post:208. I am looking forward to some remarks regarding you battle things out with the Saracens!
Hugalu: Look… I think it is great that you like redux and I am very happy that you are playing and enjoying it, so far so good. Excellent, fine and ok!
However, if you got ideas on improvements that could be made on redux, OTHER than more factions and troops (all that is already answered in post:203), what is keeping you from stating what those are? You have so far been very bent on pointing out that redux needs improvements and in every regard I have answered those remarks (rather extensively) once you have actually specified to some extent what you had in mind. What more can you ask for?!?
If it happens to be that I don’t share your ideas and views it would have been blatantly clear by now, since my own views on the various matters are all accounted for in plain black and white in previous post (post:203). If you got other ideas, by all means specify what they are and if I got the time, perhaps I will answer some of them. Hell, they might even be great! But, keep maintaining that redux need improvements and then not bother to specify what you mean is just downright annoying and borderlining to rude.
So, from now on, PLEASE keep all that stuff elsewhere, as in far away from this thread! If you want change your personal copy of redux, by all means do it, what is stopping you? Nothing! If you want changes to be made in the public version of redux state exactly what those improvements could be or don’t bother to bring it up! Now, can I be more explicit than this?
As for the “Ant-thing”, I have two times explicitly asked for an explanation of what you meant by that and the reasons as for why, giving you the benefit of a doubt. Two times you have failed to make account for the reasons for why you did that statement. Since you obviously is unable to support that statement with anything other than just your statement, you force me to treat it for what it appearantly is, a load of bull…
As for the errors you are having, I have also in this matter been very specific and explicit in my requests to you, since I have so far bothered to be concerned for these strange errors of yours. I have offered you a test to determine if your alleged errors might connected to corrupted saves or not, thus narrowing down the possible causes for these errors. Thus actively trying to find the exact causes for it and thus getting closer to potential solutions for that. Yet, you have now twice failed to report in the results of that test, and let me tell you. Don’t bother to do it because I don’t care anymore, just like you… It might very well be a bunch of crap as well, if I understand your displayed behaviour correctly.
Other than that you and I are just honky-dory….
- Cheers
William the Silent
10-23-2008, 21:47
[B]@ William the Silent
Do not ever do that again. Don't you realise I believe everything I read? You are a sick evil young man! :smash:
Sorry Joh, I was just going to tell you about the "Christmas special" Axalon is working on, where all the pine trees have Christmas ornaments.
(kidding).
@Axalon
I finally fought a battle with your new trees around (Russia is mostly pine tree) and I think it looks great.
You have turned the dark atmosphere (that was intended by the makers) of MTW definitely into a lighter one. I noticed you even dressed the princesses very "light" (thin). You p......
I as a veteran MTW player can say that you really improved the game. And all the changes you made show great dedication, skill in picture editing and taste. Your icons fit perfectly together in style. I wished some of the other mods had some of your artwork in it. You and Tyberias would make a great team. You also definitly made it more challenging.
The only thing I would change, if it was me, is the "kings with helmets". I like to see kings with some of the creepy faces you made :laugh4:.
Oh, we know that the Lithaunians and Byzantines have to many skirmish/archer units, but what about the russians. Don't forget to check out what they are building under the rule of the AI?
Also Norse built lot of the 20 man Huscarls (maybe they are ex-princes). When are they going to be playable? I looove raiding.
No pressure.
Hi Joh, let me help you out here…
GnomeEditor available here:
http://www.atomicgamer.com/file.php?id=68503
Thanks, already on the case.
I had a look at the editor. It seems simple enough. In parallel, I have started collecting the unit cards, but now I have to figure out how I want to present everything, the easy way or the nice way.
I will probably go for the easy way :embarassed:.
Baron von Manteuffel
10-24-2008, 19:53
Hello :dizzy2:, if you MTW veterans really want a challenge, then try the Spanish on the expert setting. I would be very interested to hear if anybody can come up with a winning strategy. Axalon, you must have played this before, so what is your method of handling the relentless hordes of the Moors? :help:
Just when it appears things are going well in Leon, Castile, and Navarre, the Moors attack. I must say it's fun to play this Reconquista and you've done a great job of creating the huge Moor armies. I just battled them in castile and had a fairly large army (about 1800) with Royal Infantry, Royal Spearmen, w/silver armour, etc,etc, but it still wasn't enough.
The Moors attacked with 4 full stacks (about 7000) and simply outlasted me. My troops fought well but the battle losses were: Spanish 1500 - Moors 4500, resulting in the loss of Castile and all hope for this campaign. :surrender: However, I will try again. :yes:
I would say this is the hardest campaign I've tried. Again, on the Expert setting. I have noticed when playing other factions that the Spanish get vanquished pretty early. Any opinions, or observations anybody? I challenge you all to try the Spanish on the Expert setting. :knight: Good luck!
William the Silent
10-24-2008, 21:59
Spanish was the first faction I tried in Redux. Played on hard I believe. For sure not Expert.
I survived (maybe with luck), because I kicked the Moors off the Peninsula and blocked it of with naval power. I didn't finish my campaign, but I had established myself and progressed north against France with Aragon as my ally.
Portugal has to be in your hands otherwise they will come back there.
Aragon has to be strong or give you time to built economy and unbeatable army.
I believe once you have kicked the Moors of the Peninsula their economic power is weak for a time untill they start going east.
I kicked them out of Peninsula with trap. I built strong enough fleet (3/4 ships each) to block of peninsula, while allied with them and built army. I took Portugal. Then waited for good oppertunity, when they were at war with Aragon.
Took all their weak provinces in peninsula and destroyed all their fleets around it. So no reinforcements for them (this can also cause rebellion in their terratories). To stabelise taken lands you have to use spies. They got beaten up pretty well by me and Aragon in their last (eastside) province on peninsula.
I opened up the sea for them towards that province to bring in their reinforcements. They did and then I closed it up behind them again and dealt slowly, but surely, with the rest.
Their sultan was in that stack and after a few attacks from them (defense is easier then offense and offense takes more cusualties), I moved in a big stack (using mercenaries) to attack them and they chose to retreat (which was not possible) so they lost their sultan and army there.
It might not work always. It's a chessgame :juggle2:. You have to become allies first otherwise they attack you to death right away when you're weak. They start of with best economy I believe.
I guess Axalon wanted to simulated the moslim threat of that time.
It'll make you sweat. But it's fun.
Baron von Manteuffel
10-24-2008, 23:20
Thanks for the info William the Silent on the Reconquista. I'm going to try again and implement some of your ideas. One important thing I didn't do was ally with the Moors. They were annihilating Portugal and at war with the Saracens, and others, so when they offered an alliance I turned it down. I didn't want to cancel my alliance with the Saracens who were peaceful at the time.
In reguards to Portugal, I set them as an active faction to see what they were like. Again, on the expert setting and the results were a quick and absolute annihilation at the hands of the Muslim hordes. :sweatdrop: I know they are not an active faction in the mod but I wanted to try them. There's probably some good reasons why, but the Portuguese start extremely weak with a very short life expectancy. :laugh4: Green and orange= The Turks (just kidding). :laugh4:
William the Silent
10-25-2008, 00:36
Also, if I have to fight defensive battle, I move my force as far as possible away to the edge of the map. If possible as high as possible. This will make the enemy have to march far, which makes them (very) tired at the time they have to fight me. It also gives me fast reinforcement.
If you have spearman with good defense, keep them in hold postion mode and let them not attack unless that's their strenght. They will only stay fresh in defensive mode.
Let the archers concentrate on the enemy general. With 2/3 archer units you'll make'm flee or die.
With units with good valour you can hold out forever against big stacks.
If enemy flees kill as many as possible with your cavalry (power-units first), but keep archers and infantry in the same place untill all the enemy reinforcements seem to be used up.
Let'm march, climb, crawl as much as possible.
I mostly deploy:
7/8 spear (frontline), 2/3 archers (2nd line), 3/4 sword (3rd Line), my general, rest cavalry.
Against Moors and Saracens you need time to be able to built good army.
They will offer alliance, because then they'll have more units to attack somebody else. That's why they do it. That's also when they'll become vulnerable at your border.
You sometimes cannot win with only military power, you have to dig the most ugly characteristics out of the dungeon of your soul (like betrayel) to defeat an enemy, who, you know, is going to inhallate you one day.
Axalon the inventor of all this would say: "hehe".
I tried to play the Norse one time, but they have no princesses and diplomats, so you're doomed to die off as a royal family.
Hi Axalon,
Seems like you don't take criticisms well, even constructive ones. Here are some pros and cons that I see in your game:
Pros:
1. Fast running, stable game.
2. Improved graphics and new units.
3. Much harder game since the costs for key buildings went sky high, makes game more interesting.
Cons:
1. Lacking factions, mentioned before: other mods have a lot more factions to choose from.
2. Lacking special events that happened in history at certain times.
3. Lacking special heros that make the game more interesting, ie. provide much needed talented generals.
4. The ant thing: the graphics become blurry and all seems like a big mass, and it seems to happen only to infantry units. This could be the problem with my graphic card.
5. Battle loading error. Again, this could be due to missing or corrupted file during installation.
***One suggestion: I was proposing a new mod call Far East Total War, which as the title implies, is about the countries in the Far East. The time frame could be divided into 3 time periods: Early, High, and Late and factions include many of the countries in the East and Far East Asia. Too bad I am not a programmer. However, if you have the time to do this mod, then I can provide some help with doing research on people, units, countries, banners, shields...etc on the factions.
William the Silent
10-25-2008, 09:04
@Hugalu
Maybe you can send picture about blurry units.
I didn't notice any negative change in picture quality by the hands of Axalon, compared with the original. Maybe his colors are brighter?
western2
10-25-2008, 09:45
Hi Axalon
Your Mod has certainly kicked this area of the forum back into life. I'm still enjoying playing by the way. I've warped away to my "more historical" version, but it is still obviously Redux (including cool new trees!)
The issue I wanted to raise is mercs. We had a bit of discussion earlier on about Norse mercs not showing up very often in Constantinople. I've searched the old threads and it seems to me noone has ever got to the bottom of how the merc pool really works. It's one of those puzzles where you can partially control it, but not completely.
As far as I can see, factions specified in the unit.prod for mercs make no difference. Period does, but region only partially. Any observations? I note that you have been successful in getting your merc units to show up the most often, but have you actually managed to limit any, or make more frequent, by area? Did you achieve observable results with the Norse mercs - and if so, how?
I think there is more potential in mercs if I could control appearance better.
I'm playing the French at the moment. I tried playing the English on the "Hard" difficulty setting - got my butt kicked after the 25th move. I guess that made me gun shy, so went over to the French.
The battles are probably the most in outcome; the units being brittle and desolving into panic when they're not handled right. I like that. Also, what's with the Norseman? I cannot win a battle against them, even with a 2 to 1 advantage and tons of Feudal Knights and mercenary pikeman. I guess I'll have to keep building up those items that gain my troops the most valor.
Is there a unit that players get in the future that basically defeats all comers? Just curious.
seireikhaan
10-25-2008, 16:17
Congratulations on getting your own subforum, Axalon! :applause:
:laugh3:…!!!... And again …!!!... And another one …!!!... :medievalcheers:
...We got our on Sub-forum here at the .Org! This is drop-dead cool! Things might be a bit out of order now with the relocation and everything! But not to worry! We will sort it out together I hope. The primary task now is to fill this forum with a lot of interesting reduxed content, information, debates and discussions, stuff like that. And that is all up to you guys! I have a few ideas myself on what could be interesting and I will also try to fill this forum with meaningful content (with one or two exceptions I hope, myself and William will probably see to that), now that we got our very own forum and castle for redux!!! Castle Redux!
My thanks to the people that helped and made it possible for this to happen; Martok (again the benevolent camel-ridden redux supporter strikes!) and Caravel whom I suspect also played a major part in making this a reality, he surely deserves a mammoth-thanks as well. About 20 hats off to both you guys! Also one should not forget that we all are just humble vassals and guardians of this new castle in the Org-kingdom and it will only happen with the silent approval of “grand chancellor” Tosa, so my hat is off to you as well, where ever you may be...
Now, my composure is completely gone for the moment so bare with me!!! Hahaaa!!! “Blisshigh” My thanks to all you redux supporters and players, you guys made all this possible, not I! And a very special thanks to you regular posters, my super thanks guys! MTW-Redux would have probably died without you! I’m sorry, but I won’t do any of you guys much good for the moment - I am too exited, but I will return here! That’s a promise! :laugh3:
CHEERS!
Congrats, Axalon; it's well-deserved! Given Redux' popularity, it definitely warranted its own place here at the Org. :medievalcheers:
And yes, Caravel and Tosa deserve most of the credit. All I did was simply pass on the former's recommendation on to the latter. ~:)
2. Lacking special events that happened in history at certain times.
These are hardcoded and so cannot be added.
William the Silent
10-26-2008, 21:22
Nice little castle they gave you here on the outskirts of the MTW Kingdom.
Congratulations Axalon. You deserve it.
@ Axalon
This weekend, I have been working on "our" little project. The first results can be seen here. Just have a look and send some comments when you have time.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=AZNJV4NR
As expected, it is taking much more time than I thought it would, but I am slowly progressing. In any case, I have some questions that I would like to ask you. However, this week I have to travel and probably won't be able to work on it, so I will postpone them until later.
Happy gaming.
Baron von Manteuffel
10-26-2008, 23:14
@Joh - I looked at your project and you're doing a fine job. Take your time and finish when you can. ~:)
@Axalon - Congratulations!!! :applause:
William the Silent
10-27-2008, 00:38
Here some screenies from battle as reaction to Hugalu's complaint about quality (on highest settings).
I believe they shrunk when I changed them to jpeg. Hopefully that didn't damage the quality.
But I believe that's the quality you normally get from MTW.
https://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5517/00000002rj5.th.jpg (https://img253.imageshack.us/my.php?image=00000002rj5.jpg)
https://img258.imageshack.us/img258/471/0000000rs0.th.jpg (https://img258.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0000000rs0.jpg)
https://img253.imageshack.us/img253/1296/00000003xl0.th.jpg (https://img253.imageshack.us/my.php?image=00000003xl0.jpg)
The invasion of my ants.
You see these 2 "newly skinned" trees in the middle Axalon? :laugh4:.
Hello everybody,
First of all, this is a really big post, but there are so many posts that crave answers and replies so that’s why I guess. This time we have as diverse subjects as “redux-princess-fashion” all the way to “the survival of Spain” so there is plenty of stuff for different tastes and interests in this post... :laugh4:
I would also like to point out that this is above all OUR redux forum, not mine! I alone won’t and can’t make things happen, it is we together that must do it, there simply is no other way! Also, there are plenty of posts to reply here so forgive me if I manage to miss out on anyone or something. It is not intentional if that happens, just so that is clear to everyone. Finally, my thanks for all the congrats, even if I still consider this to be collective effort above all… :bow:
Makaikaan & Martok: Thanks guys. I’m really happy about all this. I’m particularly happy about the sturdy gates…
Caravel: Always working… Anyway, good to see you here man, feel free to join us whenever you like! This castle is always open to you!
Rick: Playing the French eh? Well it’s as good a faction as any, plus you usually get lots of florins with those guys and that really helps. Well in an overall perspective redux is not supposed to be too easy, that job has already been taken by the original, so to speak. Redux is a bit harder (quite a bit actually for several reasons). As I said in the game intro text, old strategies and tactics don’t work too well with redux. The most obvious reson is that redux got another combat paradigm/system than the original. By comparison it is way more explicit and extreme. Something that many people seems to have found out the hard way. (more in spoiler)
The overall plan is to offer a game where expert and decent players can enjoy the game alike, at different settings of course. I would also stress the fact that “Hard” in the original should at least be considered to be “Normal” perhaps even “Easy” (or there about) in redux. It is a harder and more challenging game and thus could be regarded by some to be more interesting and I personally like and prefer that, so that’s why.
As for the Norsemen, oh yes you can win against them, it’s just that you have not yet discovered how, that’s all. If I remember everything correctly; Joh had an entry or two about that in one of his posts so check ‘em out! Then you got at least some pointers on how to do it.
As for your final remark I’m not sure I entirely understand what you mean? Is there a special unit that can defeat all others? In theory that is all units, the more likely candidates however are fewer. There is no single unit that could easily rule the battlefield alone, it’s all part of the redux design and overall unit-matrix. Some units are better than others but there is always ways to counter them, no matter what unit it is.
Feel free to share some more on your French campaign and perhaps specify a bit more what mean by “all comers” (then I might be more able to give some straighter answers perhaps). You might get some further pointers or suggestions as well that way, either by me or some of the other guys.
William: Thanks for holding the fort, errr I mean castle (not really used to it yet), as usual! Anyway great work man (perhaps I should do a badge/signature or something for you and the other few faithful guardians of the fort, signifying honorable service for the greater good of redux or something). Because it sure makes the redux-area better place that way. Also, thumbs up for providing some answers and pointers for the good baron, just as he has helped you and other guys before. It’s just better that way; it’s as simple as that. I’m sure you (and the baron) agree with me on this. (more in spoiler)
Now, as for the changes you suggested they will probably not happen, sorry. Firstly; making 85 or so kings is a tremendous job and I simply don’t deem it worth the effort in regards to the actual usage of those in the game. You will have to make do with exchanging the king portraits just like the generals. Maybe I do a few new ones when I finally release a regular patch for redux or something. 2. As long as the hardcoded problems and limits remains in MTW, the Norse will not become an official playable faction (the reasons are stated in redux “ReadMe”–file). I would to make ‘em playable but as long as that is hardcoded I will not do it. I’ll also keep an eye on the Russians as well when I come around to it.
As for me and Tyberius working together, it might happen to some extent. We’ll see I guess. He has already have included some of my stuff in his version of XL and I have already made it clear to him that if he wants to do gig in redux the door is open and we could discuss in detail exactly what it would and could be. He is a good artist, especially when he put his heart in it and I would be glad to have some of that work included the redux project. I have much respect for the man.
As for the ant-thing, its just some fluff so don’t bother with that anymore, it has nothing to do with redux, its beyond any doubt now. If there really are some anomalies, it is because of settings on the GFX-card, nothing else. That is the most plausible explanation for it. We all know too well that there is nothing wrong with reduxes Bif-plates, nor the numbers for ‘em. Anomalies have happened to me in several games (including M2TW) and are usually connected to the fact that the card is in the lower end of requirements. BTW, could you please edit in some spoilers to your screens, because they are too big as they are now I think. Anyway, with max settings troops do get somewhat more “blurry”, but that is part of MTW so that goes for Redux as well.
Finally, my thanks for the praise man; it always feels good to be appreciated for what you do.
Oh yes, before I forget… I know that you are interested in the girls at the “princess-department” but really? Asking about “redux-princess-fashion”? Is that not taking your personal interest a bit too far Will?!? Ok, you’re the boss…
Now, all the girls at the princess-department are honest, hard working and above all honorable little maidens (most of them anyhow) and all of them got some fine “royal-assets” as well, no doubts there (that sure makes them more persuasive in the delicate negotiations of marriages and matters of state). But the way they dress is all hardcoded in redux. It’s all connected to the AI’s “princess-wardrobe”-files. I have tried many times to improve all the girls behavior and dress-code but it is just hardcoded all of it, and sometimes, well ok, many times they just simply *forget* to slip in to “something less comfortable” if you know what I mean…
Anyway, it is hard to find proper princesses these days and most of reduxes girls had a previous career as sinful nuns at castle Anthrax so it’s essentially hopeless to get them to understand the fact that this is an innocent and “proper” game with a supposed “TEEN”-rating and they are expected to dress “less comfortable” here. I have already received some reprimands about this from the rating-board but the girls just won’t listen to reason and continue to dress light! Now what am I supposed to do?!? I got the rating-board on one side and the horde of beautiful little maidens with a hardcoded urge to dress “light” on the other. I’m really on a tough spot here…
NOTE: The Norse have and do generate princesses, but no emissaries or spies are available to them.
Western: Seeing you as a “junior member” is not an every day experience. Your question is good and interesting, no doubt, but I will have to get back to you on that because I am swamped with posts here so it will have to wait (I’ll need to think straight for that). Oh by the way, if you got any remarks of your own for the baron and his “Spanish dilemma”, feel free to post ‘em in. I will get back to you and the mercs, rest assured.
Hugalu: I’ll start with your self commissioned pros/cons-list…
No comments on your so called “pros”-list, it’s just redundant. The over all perspectives you present there strike me as limited however. (more in spoiler)
As for your listed “cons”; 1-2 are old and worn out and also have been answered in full already, post: 203 (still).
3. The “heroes” are intentionally left blank so you guys can put in whatever heroes you like (there are guides available for that) - Conan, Cortez or Batman, I actually don’t care to be honest here. To me heroes are not that interesting and essentially a free ride. Personally I build most of my heroes from scratch if they are not of royal blood of course (old-school like). If you want good generals, you earn them in my book, not by opening up “your” latest package of cornflakes…
4. It is a hardware-issue, if anything. The most likely explanation is the settings you have applied to your GFX-card. Stuff like that happens with certain cards. It have happened to me in many games (M2TW for instance), especially if the card is in the lower end of the game requirements. Thus we can now finally and utterly rule out any flaw of the relevant redux files of your copy. It is your GFX-card settings nothing else that causes alleged anomies, if any. Perhaps you should have included this info in your very first post? That way you would have saved me and others a lot of trouble. Besides you would have found out all this sooner as well… Thus we can now safely erase this entry in your “cons” list.
5. It is a corrupted save, as I suggested before, you have prolonged this issue long enough for me to figure that out on my own (in spite of your repeated failures to report in any test-results). You will continue to have these problems as long as you use that save and any save after that. Just so you know, and it has nothing to do with redux and all to do with flaws in the code of the original game-program (corrupted saves are common in all versions, including the original game). So, don’t bother to bring this up anymore. The problem is identified and the way to handle it is found in the redux ReadMe-file, “knows bugs” section. Thus we can now safely erase this entry in your “cons” list.
As for me not being able to receive constructive criticisms, all NEW stuff you have brought to “the table” have now been answered in full. Unless you bring any new arguments and information this IS the utter end of it. Because you have so far failed to do any such thing with your already 3 times presented faction-opinions, thus any further discussions about them have already ceased to be constructive long time ago (if it ever was constructive). The only one, who has failed to realize that, is you. And let me tell you, I am feed up with it, and I will not tolerate it any longer. Is that clear?
As for you suggestion, I have little choice but to turn down your offer, I simply don’t have the time for it. Sorry, but there you are…
Baron: Having problems with the Spaniards now eh? That hardly strikes me as a surprise. If you had problems with England on “Hard” this is to be expected. The scenario with Spain is way tougher and more unforgiving. Playing Spain set on “Expert” is probably as tough and hard as it ever going to get with default redux settings (with the possible exception of Poland perhaps). I don’t want to create any drama here, but to put it frankly, that is “advanced expert” level, this is not for everybody, that is intended for skilled veterans. Guys who are accustomed to fighting against the odds and facing multiple (what might be considered as) formidable foes, possibly at the same time (if disaster strikes). That is not something that everybody is cut out for. Maybe you are one of these guys, I don’t know, but that is not for the fainthearted that is for sure. Again, I am not trying to create any drama here! I'm just trying to say how things are, straight up. :mickey: (more in spoiler)
As I said earlier, the originals difficulty ratings don’t correspond well to redux, and you should consider these as at least one step below the redux rating. Original “Hard” means “Normal” in redux, original “Normal” is “Easy” in redux and so on… Redux “Expert”, well it is a lot harder than the original ever was…
Now, of course I do have (several) solutions on how to survive with Spain, but as you obviously are bent on moving up to the “advanced level” now, are you really sure that you actually want me to tell you what these might be? After all, if you want to operate on that level you should not need to ask for any help in these matters, short of tech-trees and tactical profiles. But considering your experience with redux and your skills as a “gnome-reader” you should know all what you’ll ever need for that by now.
It’s not that I am unwilling to help you here, but if you really are ready for this you should not need my help… If you get my drift here. This is advanced level, the guys that belong there don’t need my help once they got to know the troops, the enemy, the feel of reduxed battle and all the traits that are unique for redux. You have had enough redux time under your belt to know the characteristics and traits of redux by now.
Western “tried and died” each and every time with Spain if I remember everything correctly and he is one the very first redux-players after it was released to the public (see post:96 and my comments on that in post:116). He is one of those very few that have actually managed to play redux even longer than you have (and that is a very short list). Before I reveal any of this stuff I would like another confirmation from you again that this is what you really want (after all it will spoil the challenge somewhat).
Until then I’ll leave you with some general guidelines and remarks to consider…
“THE SPANISH DICTA” 1A:
-----------------------------
First of all, go for quality, it’s probably the only thing that are going to save Spain because you will not beat the Moors in an arms race, thus the only alternative left is quality. So, go for quality.
Secondly, the fate of Spain lies in Cordoba, if anywhere. This is the key to the entire region! Who ever controls Cordoba have the possibility to dominate and threaten the entire peninsula. It is here all important battles should be fought.
Thirdly, you need florins and time to build up Spain to full capacity; it is this that should be your primary task. Secure that time and wealth.
Be well aware of the capacities and composition of enemy armies, and make sure that whatever army you have that might have to face these armies is ready for it. As in have the right allocated tactical resources (troops & arms) to that army and thus it can actually and successfully counter the threat in question.
Be sure of what you build and the reasons as for why you are building it. Plan ahead when you build stuff, you don’t have the margins of mistakes in the start… Both in troops and in buildings. You must plan ahead! What do I need in 5 turns?
Always try to anticipate major enemy troop-movements (armies) near your borders and deploy your troops accordingly.
Always try to minimize your borders and maximize the enemy borders, if possible. Thus forcing the enemy to disperse his forces into several provinces, while you have to defend only one province (or something like that).
If possible operate with buffer-zones, that way you can afford to loose a battle a still com back and fight another day…
Once you have enough secured you borders enough, consider to build a navy (when you have enough florins for such expenses) to disrupt enemy logistical lines.
Never be afraid to fight, even if the odds seem grim…
Regardless, Williams pointers and suggestions are good and they sure do offer some other and possible ways of solving the problems in a completely different way then I would have done. Personally I would never ally with the Moors, it’s simply not my style. If that means I’ll have to fight them, so be it. But I won’t be sitting in a corner when it happens that is for sure, so that is another difference as well (effective, granted. Is it worthy of a Spanish commander? No…). I have fought these guys many, many times, so I’ll do it all over again! As long as you’re not doing any critical fights in the desert, Spain have all you’ll ever need to break the Moors! That’s a promise! Oh, and by all means keep the rest of us posted on how things are going for you!
Joh: I have had a look at what you have done, the initial results do look promising. Do save the text files and all the stuff if you someday want to “sex things” up a bit. The way it is now, functional and Spartan and it is good for printing as well, which is a great plan I think. Keep it up, we sure got something worth while here! Hopefully some of the others want jump on this project, by doing some limited help, cutting out pics or something, we’ll see I guess. I still think this is an excellent idea and I hope that we’ll get one of these for each and every playable faction.
A friendly suggestion thou, you should consider to open up an account at filefront. Less intricate interface and less redundant blip-blop and no waiting time to download. It’s free and it probably is a lot simpler than the place you are currently using. You could also get the link easy that way as in fetching it and incorporate it for some future thread and stuff like that. Think upon it and let me know what you decide to do in that regard (I honestly had a little problem understanding the interface at first glance, and that is not it is supposed to be. Then again, I aint that smart).
Ok guys, finally we reached the end of this monster post. Hopefully it will be a bit shorter next time! I will return here shortly with other stuff as well… :bow:
- Cheers
----------
This got to be one of the biggest posts we ever had here... "Dont do this at home"... :laugh4:
@ Rick
In any case, if the Byzantine build missile heavy armies, the Norse build heavy-infantry heavy armies. I had to fight stacks with 8+ bodyguards on them. By the way, do not engage them with your infantry, do not charge at them with your cavalry, just nuke them with arrows. So, all-and-all, they become an easy prey. BTW, my respect for Slavic Bowmen is back again.
[edited] [...] In any case, try to fight some bridge battles ON THE ATTACK, then they will be rather passive and you will definitely have missile superiority as the Norse do not build as many archers as they should.
If you do not have the chance of a bridge battle, go for the mobile crossbow cavalry and try to shoot from the back. I remember my Italians guys decimating whole units despite their low numbers.
Hope this helps.
Joh
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/RX_BatRep_banner.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=109072)
Ok, I spent the last few days expanding the new MTW-redux forum and so far I have already set up the following threads:
Redux: Battle Reports & Discussion (regular)
Redux: debug area… (practical)
Redux: Install Emergency! (practical)
Redux: corrupted saves & symptoms (practical)
I guess the titles for these new threads are pretty self-explanatory. It’s mostly threads on the practical side so far, the
reasons for that are threefold:
It seems to be stupid to set up a thread if nobody is interested in it or have no practical uses.
It is way better to have bug issues and install problems separately so that, when such stuff happens (and it will), it does not disrupt all other activities here. It has been so in the past and I for one don’t want that to happen again so that’s why. Hence all those issues have now special and ear-marked threads for such purposes.
It is way better to have all such info gathered in one place, then scattered over a fairly massive thread such as this one.
All practical (“boring” :laugh4:) threads have been marked with special signs and marked with “Redux: xxxxx xxxxxx” for instant recognition. So “you” could easily and instantly trace them back to Castle Redux (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=263) (alias the MTW-Redux forum) from “The Guild”-overview. After all, there are other “castles” around here as well. I’m hoping here that you few regular guys will be kind enough to redirect all newcomers and visitors that attempts to discuss “Install & buggy”-stuff to it’s proper locations (threads) of the castle from now on. So much for the practical side of things in this new castle....
Onwards to more fun stuff then, I have so far dared to set up one new thread that I believe could be real interesting and fun to have, this is of course the “Redux: Battle Reports & Discussion”-thread/"tower". The plan is to there focus on tactical-aspects in redux and various discussions about it, primarily based on publicly available battle reports, so we all know and have access to the circumstances and situations of what we are discussing (if it are custom/solo battles, possibly even recreate them!). My guess is that everybody (including yours truly) could discover plenty of interesting and valuable things that could perhaps be utilized in various campaigns and battles later on. In other words, stuff that “you” could use when you are playing your private campaign and that sort of thing. However, in order for that to become a reality we must all do our share in this, because I can’t make that happen on my own, so if anybody interested in that must also work for it a bit. Ok? I have made a battle report-template for everybody to use, just to make things easier for you guys. Just fill in the entries and post it in and were in business! :smile:
Even more fun stuff heading our way… Now, since this is a new castle, we must fill it with content and that is beyond any doubt a collective task. So, here is what I thought we could do. I have a few ideas on what other threads we could have here and now I would like to know what you guys think these ideas and hear all about your ideas. So, I thought we could have an open debate on what sort of other threads we should have here? Apart from the already existing ones. I’ll start things off with my ideas…
"Speakers corner" – Thread solely dedicated for: discussing and presenting various ideas for the public version of redux, all for the greater good of redux! Sort of, open and public debate area, for all such related stuff without creating any trouble or disturbance for all other activities in the castle. So we all can sleep tight and undisturbed! Here everybody could express their opinions and argue their ideas on reduxed god knows what or what might/should be. After all, there have been a few such posts here and there in this thread so far, so there is a “market” for it anyhow…. For all I know people usually don’t share views on everything so it could be fun to have area were all could debate freely while presenting what could be great ideas, or perhaps not so good ideas….
"Mods & special versions" - Thread dedicated for: for all alternative and special versions of redux, giving the people that have or want to mod redux a special place to hang out and discuss/debate all about their versions of redux with out any risks of mix ups with the public/default version. Giving them a place to be and operate without the risk of creating confusion and causing me a lot of trouble in the process, including the people that want do strictly VI-based alterations or have put in some “custom units” and all such stuff. I believe that there are at least some people that might be interested in such a thing.
"Download Area" - Thread dedicated for gathering all official redux-stuff and links in one single and separate place. Is this anything that might be good? What do you guys think about that?!?
"Other"…. Insert your average excellent suggestion/idea for what we could have!
It’s not at all that I’m trying to implicitly prevent you guys to start new redux threads on your own. Far from it! By all means please do! It is actually rather like this; we have a new castle and we have to start somewhere, so why don’t we start off with something that “got a market” and demand so to speak. If you all know what I mean…
Ok, the floor is open, now is the time to speak up! ...Looking forward to hear all your ideas and input on this stuff.
:medievalcheers:
Thanks for the advice.
I got tired of the French when Italy and Spain ganged up on me because I failed to establish ships to prevent sea movement. The game would have ended in a couple more turns.
Then, I tried Spain on Hard. Not a good choice, but a learning experience non-the-less. I'm currently playing the Bizantines on Normal (to salve my ego a bit before I go back to getting my butt kicked on Hard).
One question: Were the Norsemen really that relentless? I picture them as raiders going in, killing everthing in site, destroying the infastructure and then leaving, not holding onto territory. However, I could be mistaken. I welcome further input.
With regards to the comment about the missels agains the Norsemen heavies, would you also recommend picking up few mercenary Trebuchets to knock them about? Also, how about Naphtha throwers?
Rick
William the Silent
10-29-2008, 23:59
I was the one that complained about the king protraits.
So I looked in what I could do myself, with the portraits you give in the game.
85 Kings is a lot, I totally agree. Not even talking about moslim factions :dizzy2:.
I can edit the tga files by copying them into jpg, but I cannot transfer them back into tga.
I have Paint Shop Pro on my bookshelf.
I would need men with beards and different skin/hair colour. Also turban and that kind of stuff that I can fit in the standard portraits. All has to be same style.
And I'll have to see if it's possible with my time.
Here some quick editing I did. Using the helmeted kings crown and the one from your portrait and put it on some of your characters:
https://img373.imageshack.us/img373/8213/king00lu9.jpg (https://img373.imageshack.us/my.php?image=king00lu9.jpg)https://img373.imageshack.us/img373/117/king01lw8.jpg (https://img373.imageshack.us/my.php?image=king01lw8.jpg)https://img373.imageshack.us/img373/3227/mickeypz5.jpg (https://img373.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mickeypz5.jpg)
I could use that crown on the different characters you already created and change them into (european looking) kings.
I myself do not have enough skills to create portraits. Just skills to edit with what is already created. But I might be able to use some of the turbans and helmets from MTW tga's and fit them into Redux.
Maybe it's all going to be ugly and you don't want it. hehe! I would NOT be hurt.
Here one of your faces put in MTW moslim portrait. Just needs change into Redux background
https://img411.imageshack.us/img411/2899/general00po3.jpg (https://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=general00po3.jpg)https://img529.imageshack.us/img529/9488/general01zx7.jpghttps://img362.imageshack.us/img362/1845/general01ly2.jpg (https://img362.imageshack.us/my.php?image=general01ly2.jpg)
I just throw that out there. Maybe you have suggestions.
:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: .....Hi guys! Oh boy, did I laugh when I saw father mouse! The holy order of mouse ears... What can I tell you – it’s a Lithuanian pagan thing, turned down by CA in the M2TW expansion for being a bit much on the exotic side...
Did you know that “father mouse” was offered a part in Star Wars Episode II as Yodas brother in law?!?
This is all your fault Will! I’m trying to get serious here! Oh how futile it seems! :laugh4:
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Get serious...
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Get serious...
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Rick: Don’t feel bad about the fact that the redux have capacity to finish you off! This isn’t the original game you know! You should rejoice instead! Since you actually found a game that you enjoy, and at the same time it can give you some solid opposition and were you actually have to fight for your way to glory! Thus you have game, a real game, with a very real chance of losing! This is one of the key elements of every game. Something that challenges you! A game that demands and require your full attention, and still it might finish you off! That is way more fun and interesting! Rejoice instead! As for your ego, let it have some vacation for a while, it will do wonders for it!
The difficulty ratings of redux are devious and you should not trust them to correspond well to the originals. At least consider the reduxed ratings to be one step above the original ratings. That way you probably will get something that in circumstances are at least somewhat more familiar to you (although it still is two very different games and redux offers a lot more problems and aspects for you). Its way tougher, so don’t blame yourself if you don’t get as impressive results in redux as in the original. Besides “reduxed battle” is a lot harder and dangerous for several reasons. So it’s ok to loose! If you couldn’t loose what’s the point in it? Where is the joy and satisfaction of a win? If don’t have to work and fight for it? No Rick, cheer up! Prestige is way overrated anyhow! Play on the level that suites you!
Now, as for the Norsemen. On the game side; since we are dealing with the hardcoded parameters of MTW it is simply not possible to make the Norse faction behave that way you suggested. You have to rewrite and expand the game-program for something like that to happen, so rest assured it won’t. The Norse faction acts like all the other factions in basic functions. As simple as that.
As far as “history” goes, I’m no expert and I only got my measly 3-4 years of studies on the subject at Lund University, so keep that in mind, but at the top of my head: The Vikings did some holding on and settling here and there. They took and stayed in; Iceland, the brittish Isles all over essentially, various places around the Baltic, Novgorod and other places in modern Russia, “Vinland” or perhaps more familiar as parts of modern Canada some 500 (roughly) years before that Italian dude came around, Normandy/France as well (the name is allegedly derived from Norseman or so they say. The Frankish king gave it to them actually in exchange for peace) and probably a few other places that I forgot to mention here. So, they did some take and hold as well... Thus I wouldn’t go so far as saying that they didn’t hold on to any of their conquests! At any rate, “history” plays a very nominal role in redux anyway so no need to worry much about that anyhow. :mickey: (Hmm, strangely familiar...)
Regarding the Norse and missiles then, the trebuchets and Naphtha throwers would certainly be an experimental and unorthodox approach to deal with the Norse scourge. I would actually like to see that... My guess is that it would not be as effective as you might have hoped for, but maybe it could offer you some good a decent fun! Infantry are if anything, a Norse speciality so its just stupid to take you chances with the Norse in that regard, try massed and concentrated fire instead. How about some 4-5 Slavic bowmen for instance? That should do the trick I’ll guess. Perhaps a good cavalry charge is a viable option as well. Post back here and tell the rest of us how things work out!
-----------------------------------------------------
Western: I promised you that I would get back to you about the mercs so here we go... (See post:220)
First of all, there are some simple facts that deserve some attention while on the subject of mercenaries:
REDUX:
---------------
29 possible merc-units out of 196 units (excluding siege and custom units stuff)
ORIGINAL:
---------------
68 possible merc-units out of 102 units (excluding siege and disregarding era)
I think the numbers speaks for themselves. I also think that we can safely assume that regardless of any era there never are diffrent 102 units in play in the original as it is in redux with its potential 196 (although that takes some developing of course). By comparison there are fewer possible candidates for mercenaries in redux. This is probably one of the reasons that reduxes “true” merc-units show up more often in the roster. Another is that I have many times limited the availability in many ways for most other units that are not “pure merc-units” in contrast to the typical merc-units that have none or few of these restrictions. Fewer constraints mean greater chances of appearing in the roster, obviously.
After reading your post a few times I think you are on the right track in most regards but you have missed one important piece and that is the “Culture”- constraint/filter that also works very well on mercs and thus you can control it better. I have that in redux and that might very well be the thing that makes things work better. I dont know if these traits and designs are unique for redux or not. You probably know that better than me since you probably have played more of the other versions than I ever have.
Anyway, you only have a few certain tools to work with in this and those are:
Merc-ticking-filter
Regionalizing-filter
Culture-filter
Era-filter
Buildings-filter
There is also the uncertain factor of changing the values in the AI-matrix... *MAYBE*, this has some actual effect as of frequency and such, but that remains to be properly verified, and as far as I know, that has not happened yet. Another factor is the mercenary-magnetism values of various buildings found in the “crusader_build_prod13.txt”. The higher total positive sum you got the more mercenaries gathers to that place, pretty selfexplanatory right? But as for the Norse Mercenaries it seems that you must have fairly high “magnetism value in order for them to appear at all in Constantinople so here is an aspect that might be a factor as well, if we see it in a strict perspective of frequency and the actual appearence of a certain unit. You said it yourself, there are a lot of uncertainties here...
Now, there are only two ways of making mercs appear in the game (this is hardcoded so it’s valid for any version).
1. The unit must be marked/ticked as a merc-unit in “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt”-file.
2. The unit is disbanded by a faction during an ongoing campaign, and then it can also become a mercenary unit, even if it is not marked/ticked as one in “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt”. Units like that usually hold the title of “captain”.
As you surely must realize by now, you can’t influence the “second way” no matter what you do. You are completly at the mercy of the game-program, hardcoding and AI on that alternative. The first “way” you can influence to some extent however by using the tools I listed above.
As for the actual occurance of mercenaries in the rooster that remains as a bit of an enigma to me and whatever it is that exactly determines which unit should actually turn up there if there a several possible candidates is not known to me. It could be the linked to intensity of the merc-magnetism value and/or the development of region in question, but that is just speculation on my part. There simply is no clear information about that (not that I know about anyway).
At any rate, the merc situation in redux is designed towards the end of having mostly explicit and typical mercenary units available as mercenaries. Maybe this is what you are looking for I dont know, but that’s how things are in redux anyway.
Ok, that’s a wrap this time. BTW, I would appreciate if you (and others!) could give me some input and opinions on the thread situation. And as usual, I would prefer as soon as possible if you are able to help me out with that? For details see post:232.
-----------------------------------------------------
William: I put you last this time to have any hope what so ever of being serious so that’s why! First of all, do you have Photoshop available (or something similar)? That should handle the tga-format just fine... Currently all reduxed portraits are saved as 24-bit tga’s.
“I would need men with beards and different skin/hair colour. Also turban and that kind of stuff that I can fit in the standard portraits. All has to be same style.”
Well, most of it is already there, you just need to process it and after that, fit things together. Not always as easy as it may seem. You’ll discover that I’ll guess. Anyway you have most stuff you need in the already existing redux-files. Also, limit and set your plan straight and stick to it, finish one plan THEN go for the next. That’s I my suggestion to you.
”I could use that crown on the different characters you already created and change them into (european looking) kings.”
In the “hero-kings” folder there should be at least 1 blond, 1 black, 1 brown and 1 white haired king. Use those as crowns. It will probably work better than the solution that you got now, That’s my guess anyhow. This depends on how you cut and process things out of course.
“Here one of your faces put in MTW moslim portrait. Just needs change into Redux background.”
The basic idea is good (I actually never thought about that), just make sure that you make the helmet smaller (not much, just a bit) so the proportions have some order. Yes fix the background, also change the colour the clothes to accomplish some variation of the portraits (that way). Yep I think you are on the right direction. Also consider to do this Muslim fellow as a template. I am too swamped with other stuff so you’ll have to make it on your own or recruit some external help. At any rate, doing portraits is a big job, really big! Just so you know, do a few test-runs in Photoshop just to refine some ideas and get the routine up. Overall I think it is great that you are interested enough to actually start doing stuff on your own, just like Joh!
- Cheers
------------
I would appreciate some input and ideas on the thread situation. See post:232 for details.
William the Silent
10-31-2008, 02:36
Axalon
I didn't find any "Hero King" folder.
Can you give the path?
Hi Will,
Here you go…
“MTW-Redux 1.0b\Redux Bonus Material\Bonus Portraits\Hero King”
And if you can’t find it, decompress the files again and then they should be there.
Otherwise download redux again (it will take approx. 20 min).
- Cheers
William the Silent
10-31-2008, 22:37
Funny, I never saw these files, because I only used the Redux installation files and I guess deleted the rest.
That meant you have created kings (not 85) except for moslim factions.
I'll give it a try to create moslim kings. Give them some colour and Redux-Halo.
First I'll have to wrestle with Paint Shop Pro to establish some skills in that. To move hair, heads, etc and to create helmets, turbans, etc.
I never really used that program.
I'll show you my stuff once I get something done, to see if it's Redux quality. Like that nubian princess. hehe!
Did you know that Richard the Lionheart, when he was working out peace deals with Salidin, was seriously negotiating a marriage between moslim and christian royalty to establish that peace?
So maybe that possibility should be open. Only on rare accasions in Redux. Once in the whole game.
Some sort of price/accomplishment with extra bonus for the one who can establish that marrige, untill she dies.
I'm just dreaming.
Now I have to go back on my roof to wrestle with tar and shingles. I'm fixing my roof. And it's 90 Fahrenheit.
- Be well!
Hi Guys,
It’s been silent here for a few days and I thought I would change all that with some general info and recap. As of November 1st I set up another redux thread over at the TotalWar.com (I finally managed to get over there. The crappiest forum-engine I ever saw). So far it has received a cautious reception and we’ll see I’ll guess how things will turn out eventually. As usual PR and exposure is the primary problem, so no surprises there...
A month after I released redux to the public (8th Aug) here at the .Org (I thought I owed that to this place to give it a month "exclusive"), I set up another redux thread over at the TWC. That thread has been a bit problematic and currently it is in a state of coma. Last post was in Oct 11 and that was by yours truly and that was the announcement of the superfix V.1.1. Since then there have been completely silent and no posts at all (although it have had regular visits, but no posts). I have no clue why this is and I don’t like it at all. More about that below...
As for the future, I have one or two things that are still planned for later releases. I will do a proper patch for redux, that is a certainty without any doubt. I will Include various stuff in that; AI-fixes, green trees, weapon fixes to some degree hopefully, a limited number of new and additional portraits for generals (and kings perhaps) and maybe other things as well (BTW any other suggestions? No new troops thou, there is no room for it!). It will be official patch and it might very well herald the end of the beginning for redux. After that I have realized all the goals I set up for the public version of redux.
HELP ME SAVE THE TWC THREAD! (Yes, I am serious)
--------------------------------
As I said above, things are not going nearly as well over at the TWC as here and the TWC-threads current state strike me nothing short of a “coma” (oh boy, have I tried to change that!). Now my hands are tied (I had be forced to do a double-post there with the Superfix release) and I can don’t anything without receiving a warning over there (and they do seem to take double posting very seriously over at the TWC, imagine what they do with a triple-post?!?) so I simply must rely on somebody else to break the ice and deadlock that currently is a fact over there. I’m sure all of you can see the obvious advantages of having another thread going, for ALL of us not just me. I am getting increasingly desperate here and that’s why I do this unorthodox appeal to you guys! The potential value of that thread is too good to just let it die...
So far most people over there have essentially being capable of only two things; 1. “Oh it really looks great” (I appreciate that, but If that’s true, what makes it so hard to actually try it out then? What’s so freaking hard about that?!?) and 2. “How is it compared with XL?” (I care as much about XL as Viking Horde cares for redux, fill in the blanks at your discretion, and more importantly it’s like comparing oranges and apples for god sake!). It’s really sad actually, not only for me but for all other designers as well since none of us deserves such a treatment, remember we have done this free of charge! People should rejoice instead, since they now actually got more ALTERNATIVES!
It really annoys the hell out of me that too many people don’t seem to be able to figure that out for themselves. Now I REALLY NEED some HELP here so I would appreciate that someone could help me for a change and do a post over there so that thread could snap out of it’s current coma. If you worry about standing out from the crowd, hell just do what everybody else has done; post a “oh I like those pics” post, that should suffice as a start at least for saving that thread. I would of course personally prefer something completely different as in: “I played redux and I wondered about X” or “I played redux and this is what I like about it” or “I played redux and this and that trait I have not found in any other version” (after all, I have not tried all versions) or “I was wondering when new redux material is going to be released?”. Stuff like that because it is a lot more interesting and it provides a solid platform to work upon, hell it might even spark a debate! Besides there have not been any such post (for reasons unknown), the only exception is a nice guy who had a hardware failure (Nvidia 8000 card) and could not play redux properly even if he clearly wanted too.
So please, could someone be kind enough to help me save the TWC-Thread! (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=190721/vb)
Will: Sounds cold! BTW, would you like me to do a Islamic template general for a the future Patch? I’m just asking here, I have no such plans myself for the moment. Would you have me do otherwise? Because i could bring myself to do one at least....
Baron: I take it from your silence that you wanted to face the Spanish problems without any further aid from me. In other words, dealing with it in a way worthy of a Spanish commander? :laugh4: How did you fare with the Spaniards then? Anything insights you want to share some of your experiences with others (and me)? It probably would be interesting stuff for people who might want to try Spain for themselves (regardless of difficulty level). Did you have any use of the guidelines of “The Spanish dicta”?
Rick: What happened next with the Byzantines? Anything worthwhile mentioning for others? I personally would actually be interested in your experiences with the Byzantines!
Wes: Did you have any use of my remarks on the mercs?!?
Joh: How are things going for you? Have you managed to produce any other troop-paper? Also I got question for you. Are it based solely on the campaign starting positions or what?!? I just thought that would interesting to have such stuff more explicitly stated. I’m a bit unsure of that myself actually, so if nothing else could shed some light on that for me at least?
Finally, I now fully understand that none of you "old-guard/fort-defenders" guys are that interested in creating any more and other specialized threads here (the deafening silence about it is obvious enough) and I will give it a total rest starting as of right now. I will not bother you guys with that anymore. It will hopefully happen by itself when there is any interest for it. :bow:
Ok guys, now I have “sabbed out” all my issues for you. Anybody make post and make me in a better mood... :mickey: (This little guy sure tries).
- Cheers
----------
A friendly reminder to all MTW-redux “1.0” holders; check if your game is fully updated! Besides I put in a new redux-girl at the download area...
cambovenzi
11-04-2008, 09:12
i started playing this mod again, w/ the superfix.
alot of fun so far.
i know this has been brought up before, but the longbowmen wreak complete havoc on everything.
i know you like that, and dont want to minimize it too much.
but atleast could you make the enemy troops try to move out of the way once in awhile?
they just stand there and get ripped to shreds in a few volleys.
maybe its just the difficulty setting(i picked normal this time), but im pretty sure it happened on hard or expert too last time i played.
i also have a suggestion for troop types.
you said you didnt have room for any more.
well how about trimming down on the ones you have, to make room for new ones?
for example there is hobilars, AND light horsemen. do you really need both?
i do like how there is increments of different troop types. (light, regular, etc)
but you probably dont need them that similar.
Joh: How are things going for you? Have you managed to produce any other troop-paper? Also I got question for you. Are it based solely on the campaign starting positions or what?!? I just thought that would interesting to have such stuff more explicitly stated. I’m a bit unsure of that myself actually, so if nothing else could shed some light on that for me at least?
Hi Axalon,
Been quiet for a while. As I said, last week was really busy, and it does not seem to be relaxing for the next month or so. This closing part of the year is usually the busiest at work, so it keeps me pretty much entertained.
The good news is I have finished with all the "core" troops for all the playing factions (9 as far as I remember), and that soon I will start with the non-playable. I have added some "minor "modifications to the initial template. To check the current status follow the link. FEEDBACK is encouraged and definitely most welcome.
http://www.megaupload.com/dk/?d=GX46SLJO
However, I have a few problems:
I have taken the unit card picture from the custom battle screens, which covers most of the (what I call core) troops available to each faction. However, there are region specific troops that can be build (in theory) by any faction, such as English Foresters, Clansmen, Kerns, Armenian Infantry ... What do I have to modify to make these troops available in the custom battle screen?
In connection with the previous one, I do not seem to understand all the coding in the file. Some troops are supposed to be ALL_FACTIONS, but some factions cannot actually produce them. For example Russians do not produce either Light, Regular or Feudal Infantry. What (and where) am I missing? Where can I find those modifiers?
I will consider opening another account for the real deal, but for now Megaupload is the easiest for me, as I do not have to fill any form. I know it is maybe not the best, but will check other possibilities at some point.
I was thinking that for the "aesthetic" properties of the file, I could use some of your excellent signature posts, but without the "Click here" thingy :laugh4:. Could you post some of those somewhere so I can use them?
At some point you mentioned something about saving the text files. I am afraid I am using a text "editor" that is not the most widespread ever, and compatibility will definitely be an issue. It takes a long time to set a template, but after that, it is mostly copy&paste, which makes it very simple for me.
Have you reserved Novgorod for some special reason?
Regarding your concern about Redux, I realise you have put a lot of effort on "your" mod, but you have to realise that nowadays MTW and everything related to it is old news. As we have all seen, games have mostly improved in the graphical quality, but not that much as a gaming experience if you know what I mean. On top of that, people on this sites have game oriented computers, which in many cases means that they can actually not play Redux for hardware reasons.
Besides there have not been any such post (for reasons unknown), the only exception is a nice guy who had a hardware failure (Nvidia 8000 card) and could not play redux properly even if he clearly wanted too.
By the way, thanks if you were actually referring to me :laugh4:. In any case, thanks on behalf of the guy for the gentle comment.
And to conclude, I do not know your age, but some people (including me) have been around for a while and we are getting pretty old, with new responsibilities and less and less time. That also mean that we have to manage our time the best way we can, which sometimes means dropping some gaming hours. Unfortunately, we all have our preferences and maybe "old crappy games" :embarassed: like Medieval are the first casualties for many people. I am actually impressed that this thread has survived for so long and has been so active. Maybe because Redux is really good? :clown:
Ok, I will leave it here and try to do some work,
Joh
William the Silent
11-04-2008, 10:34
Dear Ax,
I posted on the other forum. I'll try creating moslim dude this week. If I'm not succesfull, or it's taking too long to make one, because of Paint Shop Pro, Ill leave it up to you. If you really want to :laugh4:.
I think it's hard to keep people interested in anything. There is so much new stuff out every day. People get bored with that after a while and will start looking for the old stuff again. Then they will end up with your mod.
I used to play Chivalry Total War for a long time (2 years I believe). Even did game testing. But all at once I had no desire to play anymore. I wanted something easier to manage, with a hard challenge. That was Redux (I like historic tho, but ok).
The fun in a game is stepping in a new world and explore. For some other people maybe the challenge to beat the system.
I think in the first place you have to find your joy in creating in this mod and not let that depend on the amount of people that react. You made a great mod.
You'll see with other mods, people come and go. Sometimes many sometimes few. It's all very unpredictable.
I'll try to squeeze out some hot sultan for you. Otherwise an AAR about how to beat the Moors in Spain or something like that.
Just keep doing what you were doing.
Hi Axalon
I see a couple of guys got to the TWC forum before me, so I'll post here today instead.
Thx for the comments re mercs. It's useful to know the limits of knowledge on this, and that it isn't just me. My goal was to make crusader mercs that would only appear in crusade provinces (Holy Land, Baltic, Spain). I think that is unachievable, but I have now got them appearing mainly there, which I'm happy about.
I'm enjoying the battles in Redux, as well as the campaign. How many of the maps are yours, I'm wondering? A lot I don't seem to recognise.
William the Silent
11-05-2008, 04:47
Here my first result with sultans hat. That was not too difficult. Need different kind of beard actually. Beard was put on quick to make 'm look like sultan, so don't look at that. Armour will have to go too.
Still practicing layers in PSP.
https://img47.imageshack.us/img47/3680/t1hz8.png (https://img47.imageshack.us/my.php?image=t1hz8.png)
cambovenzi
11-05-2008, 08:10
i found a couple glitches or something.
not sure if anyone has brought it up.
1.i was playing as the spanish, and on the first move(i think it was), i moved troops from castile to leon, and the next turn it had them as if i just moved them there.(you know how when you click the unit, it tells you where it started at? it was still at castile if as if i hadnt moved them)
not sure if that is the game, or your mod. but it hasnt happened to me before.
2. a bigger, and funnier glitch thats happened before. i attack portugal. they have a stack and a half or so of pretty good troops, but they decide to abandon the province, w/ that being their only province.(not even retreat, they abandon it)
so they lose their only province and refuse the ransom, effectively losing their entire faction for nothing and no reason.
not really a big deal. just thought id let you know in case there is anything you can do.
especially the 2nd one is a little cheesy.
Hi all, I’m in a better mood this time, thanks guys...
Cambovenzi: Great that you are having fun man, it’s kind of the point here! :laugh4:
Longbows
-----------------
Ok, I'll start with the popular subject for many players these days, the longbow. Now, as we have been thru all this before you should know my position on that matter by now (for those of you who might have missed out on that check post:179). It is not a question of whether I like it or not that is the thing here. It is a question of allowing the longbow to be a longbow that is the issue here.
As I said before, it is a problematic and difficult decision to make and so far I am the only one who have allowed that weapon to be what it is, a very very powerful weapon. What everybody seems to fail to understand is that all other versions, including the original, have ridiculed it to something else. Now, you and plenty of others might have become accustomed to those circumstances but let me tell you, it ain't the longbow as it should be or rather it does not reflect the longbow very well. And the whole freaking point of including the longbow in the game in the first place is because of its very special characteristics. Otherwise I see no real reasons for including it.
Also, what many people don't seem to understand is the fact that the usage of this weapon is entirely optional in redux (I have leave it to you as player to decide if you want to use it or not). If you and everybody else feels that it is too powerful, well then, don't use it! What I personally have a hard time understanding is the fact that people like "you" are using it and then complains about its overwhelming power. It simply does not add up to me.
No one has to tell me about the power of the longbow, because I have actually been in the receiving end of things while playing against other human players who have used 'em against me. It is slaughter and you desperately seek for ways to protect yourself! Now, as long as you go light on the longbows it wont make such an impact on the pure game-aspect of things. Rest assured about that, besides the true power of the longbow only comes into play in redux while under the control of a human commander. I know this because I have actually checked that out.
Troop behavior
-----------------
As for the behavior of troops on the field, it is very hardcoded and that is something neither I nor anybody else can do anything about even if we wanted to. Its nothing wrong with your basic idea of having the troops under fire to look for some protection, its just that it is impossible to realize, that's all...
New Troops
-----------------
Over to yet another popular subject then, new troops. I have actually already done that (replaced units) in order to introduce the two new units that came with the 2nd edition/VI-uprade/Superfix. So I have been there before and I might go there again but it will have to be some really fantastic troops were talkin about then! The only thing I will guarantee here is an assured spot in the troop-roster are for snarling dragons and sexy amazons! Everything else, well their chances are pretty slim of me putting them in “officially”.
Having said that, you (and everybody else) still got 12 vacant slots alocated to players just like yourself to put in whatever troops you deem appropriate. Whats keepeing you from using those? I mean, if you got some ideas on additional troops, put them in! Hell you could even release them to the public: “the Cambo redux troop expansion-mod”. What’s keeping you from doing that? Hell I'll even help you set up a thread allocated for such very purposes so all people could download it and stuff like that. What more can you ask possibly for?!?
Glitches
-----------------
First glitch, I am unable to replicate what you are describing so far and that means that it does not have its origins from redux as far as I can tell. Besides, if that actually were the case it would have been discovered long time ago. Could you upload a save of it so I could have look at it myself?
Second glitch, is totally related to hardcoded behavior of the original and thus I cant do anything about it, believe me I would if I could. As for the discovery of stupid Portuguese behavior, that honor goes to Baron von Manteuffel who was the first one who reported that stuff in. But yes it is pretty sad that you could kill the Portuguese faction without even a single drop of blood.
At any rate man, do keep your eyes open and let me and everybody else know if you find anything else that might be odd (if you do, try the debug area). Finally, do I dare ask what you’re playing now?
Western: No worries about the TWC you'll have plenty of chances doing some posting there for the greater good of redux yet! In the mean time, first of all I’m glad you found my merc-info useful for you (I had to think straight for that, hence the delay on it). Would you be interested in compiling all the info you gathered so far on the subject and post it in? I know I’m interested in it, I have a hard time believing that it would be just you and me?!? I think that would be a great idea actually, are you up for it? Since you cant be the only fiddler around, now can you?!?
Actually I think its possible to get the merc boys restricted to those areas if one just set the filters right and straight. That's what my gut tells me anyhow....
Glad to hear about the battles man, yes I'm pretty happy with the balance myself (muuuuuch testing). As for the maps, their all stock. Don’t know why rarer ones show up for you thou.
Joh: Ok I have check your stuff out and you sure got routines for it now. I actually dare to hope that you might even do all 18 factions! I got some various ideas and suggestions for you over at the TWC.
As for your various problems:
The easiest way of getting all the troops to appear in the solo battle section is (not that easy) to install v.1.1 again and the apply basic redux upon that. Once all that have been arranged you open up THAT “crusaders_unit_prod11.txt” and remove all region-requisits – that should do the trick. After that you em all in solo but you must keep an eye on column 54 and the “culture filter”, because that have some bearing here as well. There other way to make all this happen for sure but the one I suggested above is probably the easiest one.
Column 54 and the “culture filter”, corresponds to your second problem.
Do you want both or what did you more precisely have in mind? Also covered over at TWC… What! You don’t like my “click me”, it’s quite popular with the ladies you know, considered to be the finest “click me” in town!
I just though it might be interesting for potential future “sex ups” that’s all…
Yes, they have the same colors as the Russians do. It’s a redux version conformity thing, trying to keep the two versions fairly the same. That’s why.
“Regarding your concern about Redux, I realise you have put a lot of effort on "your" mod, but you have to realise that nowadays MTW and everything related to it is old news. As we have all seen, games have mostly improved in the graphical quality, but not that much as a gaming experience if you know what I mean. On top of that, people on this sites have game oriented computers, which in many cases means that they can actually not play Redux for hardware reasons.”
Well it seems that you might have misunderstood me a bit here. Yes you are very right about the monstrous amount of effort and work I put into it. BUT I am all too well aware of the fact that the game is some 6 years old. Oh boy do I wish I had this version and knowledge some 5-6 years ago. What a gigantic difference it would have been compared with the ruling circumstances of present days (in every sense)… Tell me about it!
As for the longevity of this thread, well I certainly do what I can to make things going here, so does William, you and a few others if I may say so myself. It is guys like “you” that have made this thread to what it is, no doubt about that. I know all about the stuff about work and all that (it sucks, but you got to have money). If you got a wife and even a kid it certainly won’t make things better for poor ‘ol MTW either, so no surprises there. Anyway, hope that you can squeeze in a few lines for us here and there, if for nothing else; just to cheer up the rest of us from time to time?
Finally, I was referring to another guy, but you do hold the debatable title of “author of most treasured post” at the TWC, if that counts?!?
William: Again I sure do appreciate your efforts the last few days; I wish everybody would do half of what you do. Oh boy it would be different around here. For starters; myself and the all girls from princess-department could go to Bahamas and have some decent and well earned vacation from all this. :laugh4:
At any rate, I think that you have many very solid points in your post:242. Much of it sucks, but it is very accurate I think. TWC is a good example of that, still it has its obvious advantages so that’s why I’m trying too save that thread regardless of that fact.
Ah well, I’m tired now so I’ll quite right here. Before I go you should know that I think it is great that you’re trying to make some additional portraits for the Muslims (more on that over at the TWC), and if that don’t work out for you, be sure to do a “Battle Report”. I’ll promise you that I for one will read it with great interest and then “discuss it to the stone-age” afterwards. That would be some decent and good fun for the both of us I think (maybe for others as well)! :laugh4:
Ok, guys that’s a wrap. Thanks for the response guys…
- Cheers
NEW TOWER BUILT!
---------------------------
We got a new area here at castle Redux and it concerns the vexed and popular subject of: the survival and triumph of Spain ( https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=109475/vb). It is supervised by William the Silent, highguardian of the new Spanish tower (but isn’t he dutch or german? Shhh! Order!!!) who have assumed command of that area. Undoubtedly it will be very intresting (I wonder how long it takes untill he turns to questionable diplomacy and shady spies?). Well worth a visit! Check it out! :thumbsup:
Other tidings here at the "Castle"
----------------------------------
Over at the “Battle Reports & Discussion” area these questions came up:
Could you please explain this build embargo thing to me – how and why to use it?
I’ve noticed that master spearmaker does not give its +2 valor bonus to Royal Spear.
The build embargo does exactly what the title implies; it stops all building activities while active and it will do so for 48 turns unless you cancel it of course. The usage for you might be limited, but for the AI however, it is excellent stuff.
As for the master spearmaker it is quite correct it does not give that bonus and that is connected to the designs of the tech-trees. This is intentional, if you want valor with these guys you’ll have to fight for it…
We actually got a small debate going at the Battle Reports & Discussion (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=2056706#post2056706/vb) area, also worth a visit (concerning Spain for the moment, what else!), so check that out as well…
Ok, folks that’s all the news for now. :bow:
- Cheers
Hi Axalon,
Thanks for your instructions. Of course, I did not follow them but they gave me inspiration to test some ideas and get the work done. Yes, I have finished core troop for all factions, plus I have checked the regional troops recruitable for the factions depending on their religion. I am missing troops that only appear as rebel, but those are only 6 and I am not sure how/whether to do it.
You could start off with a big sized reference/stat-map (at least 4x current size for a unit or something, its hard to be overly obvious here) were you actually write in exactly what everything stands for, as in “Attack” were that is and “Defence” were that is located on your matrix/grid. My suggestion is that you have this on “Page2”.
You would probably be better off with a few initial definitions and explanations as well. Explain and define what you mean by “core units”. Explain what you mean with the asterisks. Again it is hard to be overly obvious here. Generally speaking do some definitions and explanations it wont hurt none. Explain the model of selection you have applied.
First of all, I think Redux will most likely be played by experienced MTW player that have a very good prior knowledge about the game. In any case, there is actually some explanation at the end of the document, but as I was doing it on the fly, the explanation was not always updated when I changed the basic form. I still think that that should be at the end, but will probably try to build a table of contents or something like that so you know where to find it. As for explanations, I am a minimalistic person, so it suits my taste. I will think about it though.
Perhaps some minor chart over stuff like “dicipline”, things that is fairly limited with in its variables (how about uppgrades in armor and weaponry or perhaps some stats on bows and crossbows?!?). Stuff like that and that is at the same time usefull or intresting to know about. How about such stuff all gathered in place, after all redux are very special when it comes to projectiles....
Regarding missiles, I have stated their reach and whether they are armour piercing or not. I feel that adding to much detail will crowd the file … and I am a minimalistic. I can give you that accuracy could be interesting, but the final result depends more heavily on from where the projectile is shot, so I do not see it as a key element. Regarding the upgrades in armour and weaponry, my idea is that it “just” adds 1 extra point to deffence or attack but I am not sure myself.
I found some “passive” crossbows in the italians page, maybe there are some more of that stuff around. Have another check on that perhaps?
I am afraid I did not get that. I actually used Access to surf the file since I can use search tools or order it, which makes it much easier. Maybe there is something close to that entrance in the original file? I know about your “secret” units, Mr Star and Mr Warhammer. Is it related to that? On the topic, Novgorod units appear through the file, but it is not defined as a faction in the ReduxSPC-VI_Rebel.TXT file. What was the intention? It has some unique and reserved units as well, but I do not know what you intended.
You simply got have some cool cover for it or something. I could upload it here for PR, PR, PR! Hell I could perhaps do some cool and sexy title text or something, but you must determine what it should say if you want any of that to happen.
Ok, here is what I like. Background of your first last picture in this thread without the “VI-Upgrade1.0 ….”; Background of PIC1, specifically Redux Campaign; Background of PIC2 without “Reduxed strategical mode”; Background of PIC4 without “Redux troops & such”; And finally, your picture signature without “2nd edition …” or “Click here”.
On another level, I have also messed a bit with the factions and made all of them playable (I am using VI). I have not really tested them, but why shouldn’t any of them be playable (apart from the Papacy of course)?
Joh
Hi there Joh,
Don’t bother with the rebels in if you don’t want to. Personally however, I think that your guide would
be more complete with them included. Here is a list of which units that are “strictly” rebel:
• HeathenWarlords
• RaiderInfantry
• RaiderSpearmen
• RaiderCavalry
• RaiderWarlords (I think these are actually locked down)
• RaiderHorseArchers
• KhanateHorseArchers (hardly ever get used)
Rebel naval-units:
• PirateShip (Naval)
• PirateGalley (Naval)
All other units are to be considered either “secret” or locked down for various reasons.
As for other stuff related to your guide; “…a table of contents” and explanations are always good. It better to have too many instead of too few. That’s my view anyway. I also think that you should definitely have some specs on missiles. I would include accuracy with an asterisk with your comment on circumstantial dependence for that value. As for upgrades; swords provides +1-4 bonus to attack, shields provides +1-4 bonus to armor which is not, and does not work, the same as defense. Don’t bother with the “secret units” they are not supposed to be “official” anyhow. The Novgorod situation is entirely linked to structural stuff of the basic game program, and that’s my way to keep it silent and cooperative. Novgorod was/is never intended to be used in any official stuff. Regarding “passive” crossbows, what I meant was that you spelled Pavise crossbows wrong that’s all.
Finally do have an ETA on the full package? As in a complete guide? If this is soon perhaps we could sync it with the patch. That way all minor changes would included in it. Just a thought, let me know what you think about that.
“On another level, I have also messed a bit with the factions and made all of them playable (I am using VI). I have not really tested them, but why shouldn’t any of them be playable (apart from the Papacy of course)?”
Have we not been here before? Have look at the known bug-section in “ReadMe 1.0b” and find out why, particularly PORTUGAL, NORSE and LITHUANIAN factions (all these are big no-no, because of structural issues and limitations with the original program. You simply cannot play them in an acceptable fashion, at least in my opinion). All the others should work ok in the VI/V2.01 version.
First of all there are some design aspects to it; I use these factions to among other things balance stuff out for the default playable factions. Hence they were not supposed to be played (but it is very possible to play them of course). Also I did not bother to write some intros for ‘em (thus saved time and avoided additional work) and I was hesitant in regards to if they were any fun to play. So I cancelled them. Hungary is probably the hardest of them all (a fairly weak tactical profile by comparison with most other factions). At any rate, LOMBARDY, BURGUNDY, ARAGON and HUNGARY should all work just fine, regardless of what version of redux you use. If there ever going to be additional factions to play in redux “officially” it will be all or some of these four (I don’t think I’ll ever use the Swiss slot, if I do perhaps it will some future expansion or for some silly redux-mod. I just don’t know. Any of this will first be considered after redux is completed, fully operational and patched without any of the current flaws and weak areas). Novgorod will at any rate, never be included in any official stuff (my advice to you is to stay clear of Novgorod so the game-program won’t fuss with you).
As for the requested pics, I sorted most of them out and included a few other things as well that might be useful for this project. I’ll pack ‘em all together in one resource-pack. I’ll PM you the link for the package when I uploaded the stuff, since I don’t want these files swimming around the net beyond any control (bad experiences with such stuff that’s why). I have of course grated you permission to use these pics for this particular project, but I have not given any other person the right to use ‘em so that’s why I do it like this. Once you got a solid cover set for the guide (or perhaps even fooled me to do it), you or I can post it here for PR-purposes. I’ll PM you shortly….
ON A GENERAL NOTE
------------------------
Due to the recent discovery of the “Spanish bug” I strongly suggest that all of you stay away from playing Spain until further notice, because it is obvious that the scenario is not functioning as supposed to. All other default factions should still work fairly well so play those instead with little or no worries. Just stay clear of Spain while waiting for the “Spanish problem” to get resolved, because it sure as hell does not work properly the way it is supposed to. The reason for all this is the fact that I am forced to make numerous changes in order to bypass all the hardcoded flaws of CA. Oh boy, do I want to shoot them for this!
So, there will be changes and redesigns to ensure that the experience with a Spanish campaign actually complies with I had planned for the spanish campaign (at least on a decent level). As for CA, I'll say this much, if those clowns had done their job on the AI properly in the first place, NONE of this would have happened. So, this is all courtesy of CA, do-not-forget-that-stinking-fact...
Now, I will try to clean up this whole mess to the best of my abilities, but in order to do that I am forced to alter things and get the game to act more responsibly and don’t do the crap it has pulled on you guys so far. I WILL make sure that the Spanish campaign will properly earn its “Expert"-rating, rest assured about that....
In the mean time, it would be good and appreciated if someone could guard the castle?
- Cheers
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/SpanishFix_banner.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106497)
The Spanish Fix is now finally released! Thus the “Spanish problems” should be solved once and for all (and one should be able to play Spain on acceptable terms now). It has been a lot of demanding work involved with this and it is with a bit of relief I finally make it available to the public (thus I can finally concentrate on completely other things). This “superfix” will not only counter the many issues and hardcoded problems with the Spanish campaign but also make several changes and improvements for the entire game.
Release Notes on the Spanish fix:
-------------------------------------
Personally I would prefer to make things even harder for Spain but since the main problems here are hardcoded so there is little more I could do now short of completely wreck the entire game balance in favour of the Moors. At any rate, the Spanish campaign (set on expert) is now harder than it has ever been before, all the hardcoded crap are harder to trigger which means that the Spaniards will now have to do some proper fighting – as supposed to – if they plan to advance anywhere. Portugal has ceased to be the “self-destructing” sitting duck it was before and the Portuguese will most likely put up a fight now! Aragon will probably not go down without out fight either. As for the Moors from a Spanish perspective, they have now become a more worthy foe as I intended them to be from day 1. Spain might be able to initially snatch a few provinces out of the Moorish empire, but I would be very surprised if they manage to do anything else beyond that (short of cheating of course). As for the march to Cairo, in theory it is still possible to do it, but again I would be fairly amazed if anyone manages to do that in less than 30 turns with the circumstances that follows with this fix – and survive as a kingdom in the process! But, it will probably take longer than that....
Now (and I do mean this), I do hope you guys enjoy this stuff so all the work with this will have been warranted somehow. As for additional info on the Spanish fix see the included “ReadMe”.
Other notes on the Spanish Fix:
-------------------------------------
Not only Spain has got a proper rummage with this fix but a lot of other things as well. The entirety mercenary system has been changed from essentially scratch. The AI matrix has been COMPLETELY replaced and recalibrated with the new “RX1000 AI-System ®” (bye bye CA-system and this time permanently) for it in order to better comply with my plans and designs. The rebel’s situation has been reworked (again) and they should now be a bit more active than before, hopefully at sea as well. A few alterations in the tactical matrix have been done as well. Here are some of the changes listed below.
Raider cavalry unit size changed to 60 men (default settings)
Light Militia unit size changed to 60 men (default settings)
Spanish Horsemen unit size changed to 60 men (default settings)
Camel raiders unit size changed to 60 men (default settings)
Peasants unit size changed to 80 men (default settings)
Desert Spearmen unit size changed to 60 men (default settings)
Pikemen few value-adjustments
Heavy Pikemen few value-adjustments
English Longbows finally comes at a decent price!
Italian Infantry finally comes at a decent price!
Various small adjustments here and there over the unit matrix
Introducing a new unit, the Mercenary Eliteguard!
The skirmisher weaknesses that plagued the some of the AI-armies before has been utterly destroyed and thus will not play any active part in redux anymore. The AI will not build peasant or skirmishers anymore. Thus armies will generally be stronger and properly balanced to do more serious battle. The archer situation of Byzantium seems to be hardcoded because the game conveniently ignores the standing instructions of the AI-matrix and keeps having a lot of archer formations no matter what the numbers says. It appears to be especially true for the VI-version.
The Moors will now regularly train cavalry (and a few camel) formations in their armies and thus better correspond to the profile I assigned to them. The Saracens are still the mother of all camel-formations it seems, along with a continued strong presence of able infantry as well in their armies. The English have started being the naval power they are supposed to be and France has also been turned in to play a more active part at sea also. The HRE will now have some internal strength within the empire and will not collapse as easily it seems. Lithuania seems to finally have accepted its assigned role of being wild and aggressive. The Norse now do some serious ventures over sea and plays a more active part as a naval power – as supposed to! The Hungarian seems to have a way better survival rate with the Spanish fix, which of course is good as well. The Russian wave over Europe seems to be less frequent and the overall Russian power is contained better now. The Poles have still a very dark destiny awaiting them, but at least now they actually try to prepare themselves better for the great Armageddon of Poland. The Lombard’s and Italian league seems to finally “understand” that peaceful coexistence is at least an option from time to time....
The Spanish fix also includes the little known “GreenTrees fix” for tactical mode. Some minor improvements in unit GFX and Normandy and Tunisia are as of now trading regions. Finally, the Spanish fix will only operate at full capacity on default unit size settings. The higher unit size settings you apply the more inefficient it will become. Ok that was the basics here; further details are to be found in the included “ReadMe”. :thumbsup:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/SpanishFix_A_small.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106497)
Ok there are two versions of the Spanish fix released. This blue banner indicates that this is the regular version which is only compatible with MTW-Redux 1.0b (standard redux). When you are over at the download area look for this blue sign if it is MTW V.1.1 your’e are running at home. Then this is the Spanish Fix (A) you should download and use for your game.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/images/redux/images/banners/SpanishFix_B_small.jpg (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106497)
This grey banner indicates that this is the VI-version of the Spanish Fix (B) for redux. This means that it won’t work with anything else than a fully VI-upgraded game. When you are over at the download area look for this grey sign if it is MTW V.2.01 your’e are running at home. Then this is the Spanish Fix (B) you should download and use for your game.
Ok, that’s it. Enjoy!
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