Interesting Mod

[OmarPacha]

Just had a look at this post in the hosted mods for MTW2

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=96186

It seems that the promoter is clearly going for the map of Hyborian continent of
Vincent N. Darlage based on the essay of Dale Rippke.
It will be truly interesting to consider a mod for Viking Invasion that
could move from the same map. What about ?
~:cool:

[Martok]

Interesting. I'd never realized Hyboria was loosely based on and/or inspired by real-world geography. At least that's what I'm assuming, given that you can clearly see the western & southern coasts of Africa plus India, in addition to familiar place names (Iranistan, Pictish Wilderness, Corinthia, Kush, etc.).


How many factions would/could there be? (Again, I'm not familiar with the peoples and nations from this series.)

[OmarPacha]

Hi, Martok.
Well, looking at the map there would be about 40-45 named regions;

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/OmarPacha/vd_hyborian_age_800x600.jpg

that's why I was thinking of a mod for Viking Invasion.
Surely, any VI modification could foresee more regions not described in that map.
Unfortunately, I know so little of tales and books of hyborian age and so can only follow
all that is said in the thread started for MTW2 (that's not short).
However, if I should decide to start the mod beginning from the creation of a new map, what is the right way to look for support ?

Thanks

[Axalon]

Hello there OmarPacha,

I am as happy about Conan stuff as any other guy (read the comics as a teen), and if you want see this idea thru I would happily and favourably consider it to lend some redux material to you if you would ask me about that. Redux got plenty of rev-pics that probably could be useful for a project such as this one. Also I got some strat-agents that might do the trick here.

Anyways, I won’t help you (I got my hands full with redux) but if you could show me some prototype material and further ideas and work, I will favourably consider, any request to lend material for this project. That is the best I can do for you, sorry….

I also recommend you to have a look at the bif-plates of Ancient Total War and Hellas Total War as well. Try to contact their creators and see if you can’t loan some of them. I guess that would be advantageous for a project such as this one. Best of luck!


- Cheers

[OmarPacha]

Thank You Axalon, I'll soon go and see about that mods.
I've already started with the map and my main concern now is for battle maps architecture
that I don't want to leave to the aspect of Viking Invasion, but I'm no good to make new models
and never used map editor, so any help should come that direction will be greatly appreciated.
Hope to show You all something next week.

Cheers

[OmarPacha]

That's what I call a good start,

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/OmarPacha/HyborianContinent.jpg
:yes:
now comes the uneasy work.

I'll try to approach the number of regions we've got in HTW (68), let's say
65. It won't be simple, because the NE of the map is a huge area but short of
descriptions.
About factions:
I guess there are basic factions such as Cimmerians, Aquilonians, Khitai Empire and maybe Stygians
but can't say nothing about their power or wealth so, any information on which could be the most attractive regions will be considered.

[Axalon]

That's what I call a good start,

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/OmarPacha/HyborianContinent.jpg
:yes:
now comes the uneasy work.

I'll try to approach the number of regions we've got in HTW (68), let's say
65. It won't be simple, because the NE of the map is a huge area but short of
descriptions.
About factions:
I guess there are basic factions such as Cimmerians, Aquilonians, Khitai Empire and maybe Stygians
but can't say nothing about their power or wealth so, any information on which could be the most attractive regions will be considered.

Hello again OmarPacha,

Nemedia, Ophir, Corinthia, Asgard and Turan… Perhaps? I also found a little something I thought might be intresting for you…


L= large state, M= medium, S= small, or this is how I understand it.

All this stuff below is written by a dude called “Grimfinger”:

KINGDOMS OF THE HYBORIAN AGE
AQUILONIA (L) -- Symbol of might in the Hyborian Age, Aquilonia with her legendary armies of Bossonian archers, Gunderland pikemen and Poitanian knights, wields indisputably the supreme military power of the Western world. More than any other Kingdom, however, Aquilonia lies surrounded by grim and unrelenting enemies. A long series of defensive wars for survival must inevitably be fought (and won) ere Aquilonia may seek empire beyond her borders.

AMAZONIA (S) -- The female warriors of Gamburu are unmatched in the Southern world. Their fleet footed warriors are rightly feared for their ferocity and for their prowess with both the Javelin and their bronze bladed shortswords. A dream of empire calls them to seek dominion over the vast interior grasslands and the endless, forgotten jungles beyond.

ARGOS (M) -- The major sea power of the Hyborian Age, proud Argos sweeps the western sea from Vanaheim to the Black Kingdoms. Wealthy beyond its size. Argos seldom lacks for funds either to war or to weave far reaching webs of intrigue as the situation dictates. Natural enemy of Zingara and secret supporters of the Barachan pirates, the Argosseans may very possibly prove the ultimate rulers of the Hyborian Age.

ASGARD (M) -- Blonde reavers of the icy north, the mailed warriors of the Aesir are held in check only by their equally ferocious kin the Vanir to the west, the grim Cimmerians southward, and by arcane Hyperborea to the east. Loosely organized, the clans await their forging to a cause, or a great captain of men, to spur them over the ice towards bright and bloody conquest!

BORDER KINGDOM (S) -- On the fringes of the great Salt Marsh within the Border Kingdom, a new power is quickly developing. Strengthened by a surprising volume of trade (which travels northward to avoid high Nemedian Tariffs) and by a harsh but brilliant leadership composed mostly of exiled Aquilonian and Nemedian families, the young border Kingdom lies poised on the brink of empire ... IF only the fledgling Kingdom can stave off the early territorial appetites of its larger neighbors.

BRYTHUNIA (M) -- The land of plains and horse, the Brythunians have become a culture of hunters and farmers, ranging their wide, flat lands ahorse and unfettered. The Brythunian army carries forward this heritage with a large contingent of disciplined cavalry regiments. Split and scattered into small, widely dispersed fiefdoms, Brythunia awaits only a powerful leader to weld it together and send its riders thundering out of the plains and onto the road of empire.

CIMMERIA (M) -- Grim. Moody. Grey skied. The land of Crom amid hills and mountains. A warrior race, the Cimmerians are descendants of ancient Atlantis and only slowly coming again into the ways of civilization after contact with the Hyborian Kingdoms. In battle the Cimmerians are unmatched in the darkly wooded hills of their homeland and few are the invading Aquilonian, Pictish, or Northeim warriors who return from that grey land! A legacy of hatred runs strong amongst Cimmerians for their long time enemies, the Picts.

CORINTHIA (M) -- Secure behind high mountain passes lie the city states of Corinthia. Notable for their highly disciplined battle phalanxes and fearsome weaponry (halberd and pike), the Corinthians swiftly move towards unity as a Kingdom. A great general is all that Corinthia needs to lead their heavily armoured pikemen down upon a surprised Hyborian world.

DARFAR (S) -- The sharply filed teeth of the Darfar savages haunt the dreams of even the boldest warriors who have faced them in screaming battle. Actually composed of a various mix of tribes, the Ghanatan and the northern Tibu tribes foremost amongst them. Darfar gains its name from the scattered cannibalistic grassland tribes which most often provide the drive and leadership for empire.

HYPERBOREA (L) -- Cold and heartless, Hyperborea is ruled by grim, gaunt, albino nobles and by the sorcerously powerful witch- women. Safe within their high stone keeps on the snowy Hyperborean plain, the Hyperboreans wield power far beyond their meager resources and small army. Fortress of arcane power in the north, Hyperborea is a spiteful foe to Aquilonia and quite possibly the most dangerous Kingdom of the Hyborian Age.

HYRKANIA (M) -- Savage horse tribes of the interior steppes, uncivilized in all by the arts of war at which they excel, the Hyrkanians move upon a shifting sea of unrest as turbulent as the fiery ponies upon which they ride. The Hyrkanian tribes war constantly amongst them- selves but when united under a great chief they destroy armies as swiftly as their horse-archers can race across the endless flatlands which encompass them. Trained from childhood in horse and bow, the Hyrkanian cavalry has been called with good reason the finest horse- archers in the world.

IRANISTAN (M) -- The golden land south of the Ilbars mountains is widely, albeit sparsely inhabited. Ancient and rich, Iranistan uses the Kossaks and the Ilbars hillmen as border defenses to turn back the swift horse-archers of their long standing foes in Turan and Hyrkania. When forced to do battle the well trained Iranistani army is as good as any in the world of Hyboria.

JUMA'S KlNGDOM (S) -- The warriors of Kulalo receive archer training in the Turanian fashion and thus stand out as the finest archers in any of the Black Kingdoms. Juma's Kingdom is relatively unbeleaguered in early years and can look to the north and south coastlines for easy expansion. The black corsairs of the Southern Isles have become natural enemies over many a skirmish and raid. Under skillful control, Juma's Kingdom can quickly emerge as a major power in the southern world.

KAMBULJA (M) -- Ruled by the god-king of the scarlet circle, deep in jungle girdled Angkhor crouches the hungry Kingdom of Kambulja. The Kambuljans are forever locked in war with neighbouring Khitai whose great wizards, the god-kings also contest on an arcane level. The Kambuljan host fields huge mammoths trained and relied upon to smash the formations of the Khitai in battle.

KESHAN (M) -- A Kingdom of barbaric splendor, the Keshans are well led by nobles and religious leaders who claim descent from the great people of Alkmeenon. Keshan also has a well drilled army patterned after the Stygian military organization. While Stygian troops often raid into northern Keshan, Punt is Keshan's long standing and hereditary enemy. Keshan lies poised in the midst of a power vacuum and, if well controlled, may emerge as a major power of the Hyborian Age.

KHAURAN (M) -- Rich in fertile meadowlands and at the center of trade in the Hyborian world, Khauran is a Kingdom of abundant wealth. Khauran is well ruled by nobles of Kothic descent and lacks not for wizards and powers arcane. The Khauranian nobles disdain the use of horse but hire mercenary cavalry troops as needed. Khauran begins the epoch in strong alliance with both Koth and Khoraja.

KHITAI (L) -- The ancient empire, stronghold of the world's greatest wizards and masters of the eastern world, Khitai has a powerful army and a sound leadership based in Paikang, Shu-Chen and Ruo-Chen. Khitai is forever at war with Kambulja to the south whose god-kings vie with them for supremacy in the arcane mysteries of the scarlet circle.

KHORAJA (S) -- Blessed with excellent leadership, a highly diverse and well trained army, a fertile land, and a location central to the rich southern and eastern trade routes, Khoraja is powerful beyond its tiny size. Wizards and priests capable of calling upon unearthly aid are not unknown in Khoraja. Situated over the fractured eastern Shemish Kingdoms, Khoraja stands at the gates of empire IF through wisdom and cunning Shem, Stygia, and Turan can be held at bay. As the epoch begins, Koth and Khauran stand firmly allied with Khoraja.

KOSALA (M) -- The Kosalans are an ancient race, decadent but not grown soft. They are devoted to the worship of the god Yajur and their armies are an arm of their religious organization. The Kosalans are aided by ancient magics and a fanatical if untrained populace ever willing to fight and die in battle. Kosala from of old is tied with Vendhya through intermarriage and treaty and can expect no invasions from that quarter.

KOTH (L) -- Pride of the Hyborian south, Koth is known for its armour making skill and adventurous people. The Kothic army is powerful and balanced enough to fight against any army of the Hyborian Age. Both Khauran and Khoraja have formed cultural and economic ties which bind Koth into firm alliance with them during the early years of the epoch.

KUSAN (S) -- The westernmost Khitan Kingdom, culturally advanced Kusan relies upon her excellent ambassadors and diplomats (easily the most adept politicians of the age) at least as much as upon her armies. Considered the most challenging position to rule, Kusan must expand its tiny size in the dwindling vacuum between great Khitai in the east and the Hyrkanian hordes to the west.

KUSH (M) -- The semi-civilized Black Kingdom of most common knowledge among people of the Hyborian nations is Kush. Proud Kush is seldom raided, the Stygians usually preferring to take their slaves from weaker Darfar or Keshan. Kush in Conan's time is a Kingdom teetering on the road to empire ... or ruin. Good Kings must be fostered lest poor leadership allow the Kingdom to fall into unrest and rebellion.

NEMEDIA (L) -- Nemedia, the central pillar of Hyborian culture and civilization stands ever in defiance to their habitual foes, mighty Aquilonia. The gleaming Nemedian knights are rightly proud for their army which is as diverse as it is deadly. Nemedia may well extend an empire without limit ... IF they can stop the hosts of Aquilonia.

OPHIR (M) -- A Kingdom of great beauty with gilded knights and high towered cities, Ophir is protected by natural boundaries of mountain and river on all sides but to the south which the Ophirians have well fortified. The Ophirian army is provided for with all that wealth can purchase including the finest training, weapons, and arms as well as being additionally strengthened by mercenary archers from Shem. Unassuming Ophir is powerful enough to begin the red road to empire but small enough to avoid threatening the larger Kingdoms.

PICTLAND (M) -- Savage, warlike brutish, persistently resistant to civilizing influences, the Picts inhabit the Primal forest of the Pictish Wilderness. Constantly warring amongst themselves, the Picts must find a leader strong enough to unite the tribes and hurl their vast hordes upon the path of empire.

PUNT (S) -- The barbaric splendor of the Kingdom which is Punt is based upon the bright yellow gold washed down off the central hills. Hereditary enemies of Keshan, Punt must also mistrust the growing power of Zembabwei. If these two foes can be kept at bay, and if a trade route can be established to the gold hungry markets of the Hyborian world, then Punt may well emerge as supreme among the Black Kingdoms.

SHEM (M) -- The city states of Shem lie between the ambitions of Koth and the malignant arcane power of Stygia. The western Shemish states form a loose knit nation with Asgalun as their tiller head. The eastern Shemish states stand in alliance with each other and also with western Shem creating a friendly eastern border. The Shemish Asshuri and the famous Shemish archers make Shem's armies very strong. Through mercenary service in over a dozen Kingdoms of the western world the Shemish generals have learned well the art of war.

STYGIA (L) -- Slumbering in her desert retreats, protected behind the mighty and brooding Styx river, lies Stygia. The Stygian army is never without the backing of wizards well versed in black battle magics, most often of the priesthood of Set. The ancient culture of Stygia is in decline, revolving in malignance about itself but it is also the source of a great and evil sorcerous knowledge which may yet gain mastery over the western world.

TOMBALKU (S) -- The vibrant clashing Tombalku culture provides a springboard of energy for expansionist desires. Unless controlled, the white-black conflict in Tombalku may rip the small but powerful Kingdom in two. However, if united and working together, the Tombalku riders, Black spearmen, and White lancers may roll back their bordering nations in a surging red tide!

TURAN (L) -- Gleaming mailed and silken clad riders, masters of the Vilayet Sea, Turan revels in sweeping the barely contested wastelands to the west and south. Turan, however, must bear the plague of a thousand frustrations arising from the seemingly indomitable and ever resurgent Kossaks, Zuagirs, and Vilayet pirates. Perpetually battling raiders and quelling revolts from a hundred pinpricking sources, the rulers of Turan must pass their reign in unceasing watchfulness. Turan is a natural enemy to Iranistan and Vendhya but at the beginning of the epoch stands in loose alliance with Hyrkania.

UTTARA KURU (M) -- Dismissed as a myth in most regions of the world, Uttara Kuru is a land of ancient magics, misty mountains, dense coastal forest, and the strange, haunting architecture of Uttara Kuru City. The people of this Kingdom are fanatically loyal in defense of their homeland. Ancient enemy of great Vendhya, the people of Uttara Kuru must seek empire to the north and east.

VANAHEIM (M) -- The red haired Vanir are isolated in the northwest and their mailed swordsmen perforce must vent their warlike natures on their Asgardian kin to the east, the savage Picts to the south, or less often upon grim Cimmeria to the southeast. Many a hero of the Hyborian Age was of the Vanir and warriors of Vanaheim are known to be utterly fearless in combat.

VENDHYA (L) -- Vendhya is an ancient and proud Kingdom, ruled by the Kashatriyan warrior caste and has wizards adept with their own peculiar range of magics. Vendhya is pent up in the north by the savage and virtually unconquerable Ghulistan tribesmen. To the west lies Kosala, made unassailable by the well forged intermarriages between the two Kingdoms. To the east broods Uttara Kuru whose silver tongued diplomats and arrogant wizards have long held the weight of Vendhya at bay. As the huge Vendhyan host continues to swell in size, like a bubble it must burst forth into empire and the day of Vendhyan glory.

ZAMORA (M) -- Zamora is a land of spider haunted towers and master thieves. The Zamoran army is adequate (Conan called them poltroons), but it is their spies and long lived wizards upon which Zamora relies. What King not departed from his sanity will risk the intrigues of Zamora or worse yet her assassins? Zamora may indeed follow a shadowy path to world mastery with the aid of spells long forgotten and knives which strike swiftly in the dark!

ZEMBABWEI (M) -- A growing power in the southlands, vital Zembabwei is well led and armed. The Zembabwei command great flying reptiles found only in Zembabwei heartland. These soaring winged mounts strike terror into the hearts of all who behold them. The Zembabwei age of power has just dawned in the days of Conan.

ZINGARA (M) -- The most powerful sea raiders next to their Argossean rivals, the Zingarans are active supporters of the Zingaran buccaneers (pirates by any other name). Zingara is a proud and rich land, though often torn by civil strife and bitter feuds between powerful members of its nobility. A strong succession of kings and carefully calculated expansion could easily see Zingara as master of the western world -- land and sea.

While I’m trying to do some modest helping here, let me offer you a friendly piece of advice; don’t do the mistake of having too many factions in this, its better to have a limited amount of factions that are good, interesting and preferably diverse (I would probably suggest about 10-12 proper factions or something like that, as in similar to Shogun). Quality above quantity, diversity above conformity, it does pay off. It’s of course all up to you but that’s my experience and it is my suggestion to you. :bow:


- Cheers

[OmarPacha]

Thank You Axalon and thanks to Grimfinger who wrote all those informations;
I must find the time to read something about Hyborian Age and its characters,
in the meanwhile your reply will be very useful.

The work on map shown above♠ is going on, all seems to progress the right way
and it has been successfully loaded.


https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/OmarPacha/Campaignselection.jpg

Beginning from the border infos, the modding of the campaign starting
position file would need some time (names and region-faction specific
files are in a provisional version, waiting for decision on how many
new factions will populate the mod; I won't add heroes now, so if there's
somebody who wants to take care of this aspect, he's welcome).

Map has 70 land regions and 20 sea regions. Villayet Sea is not navigable.
I'd like a lot to get over 70 but the absolute lack of any information on
some areas of the continent made the matter quite difficult, for the same
reason, 3-4 regions come from fantasy tales; They are freely inspired by
novels of Norwell W. Page and Karl Edward Wagner.

The land regions, approximately
from west to east:

Zingara
Pictish Wilderness
Argos
Kush
Vanaheim
Aquilonia
Cimmeria
Stygia
Shem
Koth
Darfar
Asgard
Juma's Kingdom
Ophir
Amazonia
Black Kingdoms
Southern Isles
Nemedia
Khoraja
Njal's Land
Corinthia
Zamora
Keshan
Brythunia
Zimbabwei
Punt
Red Waste
Khauran
Steppes
Zariba
Hyperborea
Drujistan
Red Isle
Thuran
Ilbars Region
Zuagir Desert
Iranistan
Venjipur
Ghulistan
Wahuan Desert
Zarfhaana
Hyrkania
Kosala
Wigurs
Vendhya
Pathenia
Ghanara
Kusan
Meru
Pathenian Hills
Kuigar Tundra
Uttara Kuru
Suntai
Talakmas Region
Kara Korum
Kambuja
Southern Kingdoms
Khin Mountains
Altai
Kambujan Marches
Lower Khitai
Khitain Plains
Upper Khitai
Swamp of the dead
Chosan
Lemuria
Ashertir
Ice Marks
Ujun-Rapan
Carsultyal


About the number of factions, it can be said that I'd like to
better understand, before the exact number, which tribe or kingdom
of the Hyborian Age could stand as an independent faction according to
military power, wealth or width of settlements.

I'll report updates when available,
Cheers