Natives

[The Blind Samurai]

well besides the European factions and native american factions what natives shall i be fighting on places like Arabia and Jerusalem like how would CA make those factions unique ?

[Sir Beane]

You won't be fighting 'natives ' in Arabia or Jerusalem if by natives you mean tribes.

The locals in this time period are The Ottoman Empire and the Saffavid Persian Empire. Both are very powerful factions.

The Ottoman Empire in paticular is massive, powerful and just as advanced socially and technologically as any European faction, and they are playable as well.

In North Africa you have The Empire of Fez and Morroco to the south of Spain, and East of them you have The Barbary States. Both factions are vassals/client kingdoms of the Ottoman Empire however.

In India you have The Mughal Empire, a powerful and old Empire which was extremely rich. In South India you have Mysore and then the Maratha. The Mughal Empire or the Maratha may be playable (one or the other is.)

Since two of the factions I mentioned will be one of the twelve playable they should be very unique. Basically they will have: unique units, unique buildings, a uniqe architectural style, unique clothing styles, unique voice acting (commands given on the battlefield in native languages) and possibly even a unique UI on the battle and campaign maps.

The Middle-Eastern 'native' factions though will not fight any differently to a Western faction. They did not historically either. They'll be using lines of infantry armed with muskets just like everyone else. Maybe a few camels thrown in for variety.

You won't be seeing natives in any other part of the world, since Asia, Africa and South America are not featured.

Hope that helped. :2thumbsup:

[lenin96]

I suspect they will be generic because I also suspect they won't be playable, but there could be a non-native Arabian faction though.

[Sir Beane]

I suspect they will be generic because I also suspect they won't be playable, but there could be a non-native Arabian faction though.

Two of them definitely ARE playable. The Ottoman Empire and either the Maratha or The Mughal.

Also there were no factions in the Middle East that were not native to the area. Since there were ony two factions in the Middle East, the Ottoman and the Safavid.

Check this map out, it illustrates what I mean. http://www.euratlas.com/history_europe/europe_map_1700.html

[Fisherking]

@ lenin96



Well natives without their own faction would cover most of the German States and a few of the other minor European States.

I know this is not what you had in mind but they will likely be generic in nature.

Unfortunately Sub-Saharan Africa is not mapped so that most of what you are calling native factions will be the Amerindians and Indians proper, though the latter are part of larger factions.

[Megas Methuselah]

Won't each area have its own rebel faction, though? IIRC, I don't think there's going to be a standard, large slave faction... :thinking:

[Sir Beane]

Won't each area have its own rebel faction, though? IIRC, I don't think there's going to be a standard, large slave faction... :thinking:

You are correct. CA have stated there will be region specific rebel factions, with no overall 'Rebel' or 'Slave' faction.

Which is quite impressive really, I wonder how unique each rebel faction will be?

[Noncommunist]

Two of them definitely ARE playable. The Ottoman Empire and either the Maratha or The Mughal.

Also there were no factions in the Middle East that were not native to the area. Since there were ony two factions in the Middle East, the Ottoman and the Safavid.

Check this map out, it illustrates what I mean. http://www.euratlas.com/history_europe/europe_map_1700.html

I suppose in central Arabia, there would be some nomadic tribes. Of course, I don't think there would be much of a reason to even bother attacking that area as petroleum wasn't needed a lot.

[Megas Methuselah]

I don't think there would be much of a reason to even bother attacking that area as petroleum wasn't needed a lot.

:laugh4: I suppose I'll flee to Arabia as a Native American faction when the Iroquois come knocking on my door. It'll only ever be good as a hiding place, methinks!

[Noncommunist]

:laugh4: I suppose I'll flee to Arabia as a Native American faction when the Iroquois come knocking on my door. It'll only ever be good as a hiding place, methinks!

Like Paul and Jessica in Dune? Maybe meet some desert tribes, become a religious figure and then sweep the rest of world in a glorious jihad?

[The Blind Samurai]

You won't be fighting 'natives ' in Arabia or Jerusalem if by natives you mean tribes.

The locals in this time period are The Ottoman Empire and the Saffavid Persian Empire. Both are very powerful factions.

The Ottoman Empire in paticular is massive, powerful and just as advanced socially and technologically as any European faction, and they are playable as well.

In North Africa you have The Empire of Fez and Morroco to the south of Spain, and East of them you have The Barbary States. Both factions are vassals/client kingdoms of the Ottoman Empire however.

In India you have The Mughal Empire, a powerful and old Empire which was extremely rich. In South India you have Mysore and then the Maratha. The Mughal Empire or the Maratha may be playable (one or the other is.)

Since two of the factions I mentioned will be one of the twelve playable they should be very unique. Basically they will have: unique units, unique buildings, a uniqe architectural style, unique clothing styles, unique voice acting (commands given on the battlefield in native languages) and possibly even a unique UI on the battle and campaign maps.

The Middle-Eastern 'native' factions though will not fight any differently to a Western faction. They did not historically either. They'll be using lines of infantry armed with muskets just like everyone else. Maybe a few camels thrown in for variety.

You won't be seeing natives in any other part of the world, since Asia, Africa and South America are not featured.

Hope that helped. :2thumbsup:

it did alot its a shame i cant use Bedouin Camel Riders but what iam thankful for CA doing is inculding the Sioux and Apache i cant wait to retake back the land that was taken from us

[lenin96]

When I said native factions before I meant tribal factions as well like in America which was misleading, what about a native faction in Central Asia, the Russian Empire hadn't taken it by the starting date, so maybe they could add Kazakhs in and create Kazakhstan.:yes:

[The Blind Samurai]

i would not mind that

[Sir Beane]

There is a possiblity that the small tribes will still be represented as mercenary units for the Ottoman, so you might still be able to use Bedouin camelry and other tribal units.

As for a smaller native faction in the Middle East it is a possibility, if you look near the Russia border on the 4th map in this (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=110990) thread you will see two small blobs of colour near the black sea.

We don't know who exactly those factions are (one may be Georgia) so they could be something interesting. :2thumbsup:

[The Blind Samurai]

i cant wait to conquer the known world with my armies of camels and elephants as the Mughals

[ConnMon]

lol. I'd like to ship thousands of camel riding warriors across the atlantic and suprise everybody. That would spice up history class a bit. September 8th, 1760, the Grand Ottoman Invasion of North America begins, turning the French and Indian War into a whole 'nother beast.

I wouldn't mind that. :yes:

[Fisherking]

You may want to consider landing in Mexico or California rather than on the eastern seaboard though.

Use those bonuses while you can before you get up into the woods…

[Sir Beane]

Camels and elephants would have led to some very interesting skirmishes between the colonists and the Native Americans. :laugh4:

I wonder how easy it will be for factions such as the Mughal or the Ottoman Empire to build specialist beast units like camels and elephants? If they can grab a colony in North America and then start churning out camelry it will be utterly rediculous.

Ideally I hope that elephants and camels can only be recruited in regions in which they live wild/have a very long history of being bred.

Camels should not be trainable in America, unless CA intend to include North America's extinct species of camel the camelops (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camelops). It only died out 10,000 years ago, there could still be a few knocking around somewhere. :laugh4:

[Fisherking]

Camels and elephants would have led to some very interesting skirmishes between the colonists and the Native Americans. :laugh4:

I wonder how easy it will be for factions such as the Mughal or the Ottoman Empire to build specialist beast units like camels and elephants? If they can grab a colony in North America and then start churning out camelry it will be utterly rediculous.

Ideally I hope that elephants and camels can only be recruited in regions in which they live wild/have a very long history of being bred.

Camels should not be trainable in America, unless CA intend to include North America's extinct species of camel the camelops (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camelops). It only died out 10,000 years ago, there could still be a few knocking around somewhere. :laugh4:

After the time frame of the game but the US Army imported camels for use in the Desert Southwest in the 1800s. Some got free and bred. They were eventually wiped out though.

Australia is a different story. I think the British Army did the same there, and they are still around.

But yes, camels and elephants once lived in North America. Some species of Camelidae
still live in South America and the horse originated there in North America, though it had to be reintroduced. Maybe the new ones weren’t as tasty as the old ones…

[pevergreen]

Australia have camels in zoos? We simply hop into the pouch of a kangaroo to get around.

[Megas Methuselah]

But you live in Martok's Camel Stables. :laugh4:

[Sir Beane]

Apparently Martok keeps the odd kangaroo as well. A man often craves something exotic after a hard day of work.

We shouldn't judge him. :shame:

:clown:

[The Blind Samurai]

well its going to be excitng i also hope to launch raids on unsuspecting colonies as the Sioux with my guns and horsemen

[Familyguy1]

So can you travel from India and go east to North America?
I might start out as India, take over the subcontinent and china and then act as a trading power.

Actually here is how I might start out,

Ottoman Empire as military, or the British.

India as an Economic Empire/ Sea trading etc.

[Sir Beane]

So can you travel from India and go east to North America?
I might start out as India, take over the subcontinent and china and then act as a trading power.

Actually here is how I might start out,

Ottoman Empire as military, or the British.

India as an Economic Empire/ Sea trading etc.

I'm not sure about sailing east, CA haven't mentioned it. You'll be disappointed if you want to take China, it isn't in the game. As far as we know everything North of India is inaccesible.

[The Blind Samurai]

maybe in a expansion pack i would really like to play as japan invading manchuria

[Polemists]

and I would really like to play....


A DEMO

[Fisherking]

I'm not sure about sailing east, CA haven't mentioned it. You'll be disappointed if you want to take China, it isn't in the game. As far as we know everything North of India is inaccesible.


While sailing East to get to the west has not been officially addressed CA might not want the controversy of unmaking the round shape of the Earth…:smash:

Spain had an important Treasure Route there, with the Manila to Acapulco Galleons. :book:

:painting:
There should be Pacific ports in the Americas. You have a cost line from Peru to British Columbia. If these don’t have ports or transition boxes for ships, I think that they will catch a little flack for it.:smg:


What do you think?...:stupido2:

:laugh4:

[Polemists]

There should be Pacific ports in the Americas. You have a cost line from Peru to British Columbia. If these don’t have ports or transition boxes for ships, I think that they will catch a little flack for it.

Sadly I think South America is out.

The only regions of Americas i've seen in the maps thus far is north america. I assume New France and 13 colonies will both be there, and maybe some southern territories controlled by Spain given the time frame.

So far, our best guess on trasition zones, is that your just in a zone since you can't conquer them or establish cities in them apparently.

So for instance Canary Islands is a transition zone I think, and it just is.

Only areas we know are in is Europe, India, Carribean and Noth America, beyond that it's guess work.

You know until we have

a

DEMO:stupido:

[Fisherking]

Sadly I think South America is out.

The only regions of Americas i've seen in the maps thus far is north america. I assume New France and 13 colonies will both be there, and maybe some southern territories controlled by Spain given the time frame.

So far, our best guess on trasition zones, is that your just in a zone since you can't conquer them or establish cities in them apparently.

So for instance Canary Islands is a transition zone I think, and it just is.

Only areas we know are in is Europe, India, Carribean and Noth America, beyond that it's guess work.

You know until we have

a

DEMO:stupido:


Some things we know about the game and some are just guesses. If there is a map though, it gets harder to make provinces unreachable…especially if you give it to some playable faction or other.



Go here: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=110990&page=3 bottom of the page.

As you can see it is the Americas and some of the provinces.


The city of Panama with all its wealth was on the Pacific side. To raid it you had to march through swamps filled with mosquitoes, crocodiles, and poisonous snakes, or sail to the Pacific side. The alter of the Cathedral was made of solid gold…but white washed to disguise it. Morgan missed it…will you?

[Sir Beane]

Some things we know about the game and some are just guesses. If there is a map though, it gets harder to make provinces unreachable…especially if you give it to some playable faction or other.



Go here: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=110990&page=3 bottom of the page.

As you can see it is the Americas and some of the provinces.


The city of Panama with all its wealth was on the Pacific side. To raid it you had to march through swamps filled with mosquitoes, crocodiles, and poisonous snakes, or sail to the Pacific side. The alter of the Cathedral was made of solid gold…but white washed to disguise it. Morgan missed it…will you?

If I'm raiding a city I won't miss anything. I'll be instructing my men to take anything that isn't nailed down. And if it is nailed down to prise out the nails, then take it, then take the nails to! :laugh4:

[Polemists]

yes...it is a great time to pillage the natives of various lands for all they are worth


I assume the same old exerterminate, enslave, occupy is back when you capture a native town. Though I could be wrong.


The only way to truly KNOW

is in

a

DEMO

[Sir Beane]

yes...it is a great time to pillage the natives of various lands for all they are worth


I assume the same old exerterminate, enslave, occupy is back when you capture a native town. Though I could be wrong.


The only way to truly KNOW

is in

a

DEMO


CA might be being careful about 'enslave' given the connotations with the slave trade that they are already trying hard to avoid.

I intend to peacefully occupy as many settlements as possible. My Empire shall be one of peace and tolerance. :2thumbsup: (For the five minutes it takes for mass rebellion. Then it will be swift and brutal crushing)

[Polemists]

Don't worry Beanie your brutal crushing of the locals will be nothing compared to what will occur to your empire if there is no DEMO tommorrow :laugh4:


I think they do have to be careful but it's also kind of hard to go, "Oh right, historic game, 18th century had no slaves, none at all."

Of course we'll find out the truth...

when we have

a demo........

[The Blind Samurai]

Well my empire will be that of czarist russia where only the strong rule and the weak die and i aslo hope to conquer the riches of north america and allie myself with sioux and fight everyone else and crush them and their heathen relgions where only I The Blind Samurai Rule over all manners of peoples ranging from the french to the indains and it as that time the world shall know peace

[Fisherking]

I want to see the most numerous and powerful tribes in southern North America, playable or not!

At least two or three of the so called 5 Civilized tribes should be there, French or no French!:inquisitive:

The Choctaw, Creek, and Cherokee should really have lands in this game. Leaving them out is hard to justify. The Chickasaw were a small but influential tribe ( they fought so much they couldn’t keep any large numbers) but their position could be combined with the Choctaw. The Seminole didn’t really exist as a tribe at the time, they were mostly Creek refugees mixed with other tribes and runaway slaves in Florida in the 19th century.

If CA thinks the Indians were hostile in the 18th century, just wait and see how hostile it gets if they leave them out!!!:smash:

[Sir Beane]

A native faction would be extremely interesting to play as. It could be a fun mimi-campaign trying to drive the European settlers out of North America, and then keep them out. :2thumbsup:

I wonder just how far up the tech tree it's possible to go as the Native American tribes? If they can get large sailing ships it will be both historically innacurate and wonderful. :laugh4:

[Fisherking]

A native faction would be extremely interesting to play as. It could be a fun mimi-campaign trying to drive the European settlers out of North America, and then keep them out. :2thumbsup:

I wonder just how far up the tech tree it's possible to go as the Native American tribes? If they can get large sailing ships it will be both historically innacurate and wonderful. :laugh4:

Privateers! Capture!

Hay they built 60 foot canoes that is enough to surprise a ship at anchor. And do I remember something about capturing ships in port with a town under blockade?

[Jason X]

I wonder how easy it will be for factions such as the Mughal or the Ottoman Empire to build specialist beast units like camels and elephants? If they can grab a colony in North America and then start churning out camelry it will be utterly rediculous.

Ideally I hope that elephants and camels can only be recruited in regions in which they live wild/have a very long history of being bred.

this line of argument is fallacious. why is it any different to the availability of horses to factions in america? after all - horses were introduced by european colonists...

[Sir Beane]

this line of argument is fallacious. why is it any different to the availability of horses to factions in america? after all - horses were introduced by european colonists...

Mostly because horses are much more widely available than either camels or elephants. Not to mention much easier to train and breed. Plus the fact that horses had been around in the Americas since Christopher Columbus introduced them in 1493. Thats 200 years of breeding, enough for feral populations such as Mustang to spring up. Horses in America may well have been a problem if the game was set two centuries earlier, but in 1700 they were pretty much everywhere. Camels and elephants were not, however.

[Jason X]

elephants take a long time to breed, so you might have a point there, but the historical australian example of camels (wild camel population from zero to a million in about 50 years) shows that there's no reason to restrict them.

[Sir Beane]

elephants take a long time to breed, so you might have a point there, but the historical australian example of camels (wild camel population from zero to a million in about 50 years) shows that there's no reason to restrict them.

If the game supports dynamic resources then camels could become available after ten or so years of Ottoman occupation, to simulate breeding colonies developing. :2thumbsup:

[The Blind Samurai]

i cant wait till the demo comes out hopefully they will have one native faction in the game

[Megas Methuselah]

It will probably just be an historic battle between England and France or something. :shrug:

[Sir Beane]

It will probably just be an historic battle between England and France or something. :shrug:

You are almost certainly right about this. CA can't give all the interesting stuff away in the demo. :tongue: