The Campaign System

[Rahwana]

Cute Wolf allready set some "simulated campaign system", and as soon as I arrive at Bandung, I'll finish that job of scripting, now, we just wait for the map to be finished (and we should count the Wolf's research report also need to be taken care of)

[jirisys]

There's something Called "Shift Key" which when pressed, makes a Capital letter, they look good on Thread titles

~Jirisys (oh c'mon)

[Cute Wolf]

Aye2, I'm actually got the map, culture, and UI on modfolder version now, but for some reason, it crashes when I quit the game :wall: I'll repair that first...

Oh yeah, and I also got another crash when try to change the "Zoroastrian" pip into Islam one...

[plutoboyz]

Aye2, I'm actually got the map, culture, and UI on modfolder version now, but for some reason, it crashes when I quit the game :wall: I'll repair that first...

crash when quit? that silly...


...
Oh yeah, and I also got another crash when try to change the "Zoroastrian" pip into Islam one...

looks like they refused to be converted.:laugh4:

[Cute Wolf]

not silly, cultural error or something (allready ask wlesmana via facebook for help...)

[Cute Wolf]

thanks to wlesmana's guide ^^ now, the CTD problem is done...

[Cute Wolf]

just updating the map, and last saturday, I made some long test campaigns to look for AI expansion, notice: the regions are delibrately toned so the AI will envolve into "island pushing contests", because almost every factions start as "arche" (15++ regions), that was actually quite BIG for RTW standards, and AI did tend to spam units, so prepare for a lot of BLOODY battle

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/cfffe11a7f.jpg

also update the UI to use Batik, instead of "sea" theme (as wlesmana suggested), allready made logos, and you can see the mountains and forests are allready added... Black spots are the Pirate colonies...

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/7702aaf0a2.jpg

even the banners are allready made.... heheheh... all we need is just someone who can made the banner .tga.dds symbols (I don't know how to change the symbols in banner section....)
:wall:

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/9e7400b9d1.jpg

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/c43d3865df.jpg

NOTE : Skullheadhq's face are captain portaits for VOC, another factions also have their own captain portaits :grin:

[Nyz]

Melaka totally wiped out from Peninsular Malaysia in 9 years...

[Cute Wolf]

nah, that was because the portuguese starts out with Comitatenses, and malaka only have hillmen at their expense, the unit lists should be updated with "real" units.... so melaka don't got swamped too early....

and Malaysian peninsulla is the only areas left, could you give me some help in locating the settlements in 1511? I have some rough map, but it left the eastern side still blank

BTW, update pics... how about the mountains?

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/b6c826534a.jpg

[Cute Wolf]

and I have made the "hate-ring" in australia, so factions controlling some certain important cities will hate each other more (by adding territory border), clue : the central ring is Sunda Kelapa
http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/3b0d00f381.jpg

[Nyz]

Hmm I try to merge your posts, but you already delete it. Well, I just restore it... I already post the settlement and province of Peninsular Malaysia map in map thread, can you see it? Hmm, do you asked me about the mountains location in Peninsular Malaysia only, or you asked my opinion about mountains?

ADD: Do European factions also used batik as UI?

POST MERGED: So Pajajaran will be hated by everyone? :laugh4:

ADD: How many provinces are remain? You have used a few to make false sea.... (I think around 30)

[Cute Wolf]

no, just everybody that controls these cities will got hated by several other owners of important cities (the central city is Sunda Kelapa, the most important trade ports in Indonesia...), the 4 cities flank that is Majapahit, Melaka, Kutaraja, and Demak, the last circle is Pakuan, Tanjungpinang (the most important mining region), Palembang, and Jambi

[Rahwana]

Err.... CW, you put a wrong banner screenshot :wink:
notice that you still used that damn "cute wolf" banner on VOC forces.... :furious3:

[Cute Wolf]

are you mean THIS?
http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/82e3f976d8.jpg

[plutoboyz]

POST MERGED: So Pajajaran will be hated by everyone? :laugh4:..

during that time, Pajajaran is at war with everyone. even it alliance with VOC just started at 1512.

@wolf; I can make banner. btw, will Majapahit got red&white Banner and Pajajaran use Black&white? or same as other?

[Cute Wolf]

just like everyone, the floating banners (which was destined to be turned off for most players), will be simply copypasta from their faction logos...

but that red and white, and white and black historical banners will be carried with the banner carrier officers... like in real life will do...

[plutoboyz]

just like everyone, the floating banners (which was destined to be turned off for most players), will be simply copypasta from their faction logos...

but that red and white, and white and black historical banners will be carried with the banner carrier officers... like in real life will do...

actually IRL, its carried by officer and army as well. its Panji-panji.

[Cute Wolf]

yeah, one officers per unit... the panji won't be as unrealistically big as the floating banners don't you?

[plutoboyz]

yeah, one officers per unit... the panji won't be as unrealistically big as the floating banners don't you?

well...
http://www.imagine-rainbow.ch/englisch/umbulumbul/bilder/Strand_prozession_gross.jpg

[Cute Wolf]

but at least they are still proportional, and don't float like that one right?

[plutoboyz]

BTW, update pics... how about the mountains?

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/b6c826534a.jpg

Kawali placed on north east galunggung.

and more forest.

and banten better replaced with Pandeglang, but the province name still banten.

and hanum better replaced with Saunggalah(Kuningan), between Kawali and Cherbon(Cirebon) or replaced with Pulasari (southern banten, that black territory)

Add: how about baroque UI for european, Songket UI for Melayu.

also, that parangrusak batik a little bit too dark. how about this (http://netsains.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/ganggengan.jpg)?
this one also good for UI
http://batharablade.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/gunungan1.jpg


and how about using archaic writting system for lokal region name in minimap? for more realistic map. since we can't make geographically accurate map, thanks to landmass ratio CTD.

Example: Jawadwipa written in cacarakan, Parahyangan in Kaganga, Melaka in Jawi.

[Cute Wolf]

I'm affraid, I can't add more forest before completing malaysian peninsulla, or we will made the map CTD again....

look at this lastest compact preview about what've I done last 2 days ^^
https://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/af335/Oalahsonson/portaits.jpg

[plutoboyz]

...
look at this lastest compact preview about what've I done last 2 days ^^
https://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/af335/Oalahsonson/portaits.jpg

I think, no need to modify the mask. you'll still able to see clearly with that.

[Rahwana]

the elephant bodyguard's face is silly...

[Rahwana]

just completing several test-run campaign (with several autoresolve and auto_win though), in the campaign map, with standard BI units, as CW allready give me that, here's my impression about the upcoming campaign difficulty:

1) Aceh : HARD
- While Melaka usually overrun by Portuguese Horde relatively soon, their posessions in Riau actually give me some headache, even when they start out as ally, melayu kingdoms did historically at war with aceh soon, and as you can expect, attack me pretty soon and I was forced to move south, rather than repelling portuguese from Malaysia. After Portuguese got entire malaysia, they also sent their troops overseas to invade my land too, while religion is not yet a big part (we didn't made the trait system yet, just use defalut BI), that north Sumateran province (that CW made so Sriwijaya is their faction creator, not aceh or melaka, because of the Paganism there) often gave me big headache since they tend to rebel, and have a lot of hindu buddhist provinces there, occupying riau and west sumatera is easier because of Islam, and Sriwijaya outgrow the Palembang, and put the later to early death (well, sword heerbann vs keels is not a good idea u know), pajajaran gulp entire Java and put Demak and Majapahit to flight (they are still horde faction, thanks to wolf's laziness).

2) Melaka : INSANE
- having a horde in front of your very2 door is really annoying, especially if that horde had chosen axemen and horde chosen warriors, and you must use only hillmen and berber axemen to hold yourself (bah, hope the new units won't doing that stupid things). Anyway, even when Portuguese are repelled from their initial settlements, actually their numbers increase, and I decide to let them occupy johor to give me some peace. in Riau fronts, Aceh, Sriwijaya and Palembang ganged up and attack my possesions, and can't expand much (but partially because of that crappy "berber" units that can't hold clibnarii spams the acehnese produce, and fight against sword heerbann and hearth troops is tad difficult. yeah, long story short, melaka's position is very dangerous one, and thanks to CW's weird ring of hatred, everybody hate everybody more now... and well, once again, Pajajaran gulp entire Java.

3) Pajajaran : TOO EASY
- heck, I think I'd got the hardest historical campaign, but actually, Pajajaran's postion in this darn map is the best one, your immediate enemies are interlocked with each other (demak vs majapahit, and in sumatera sriwijaya vs palembang), it was really quick and boring blitz against those romano british legionaries too, occupying java was a piece of crap, and I own north sumatera (!!!) rather very2 quickly, only aceh grows big, and that's all, too easy campaign...

4) Demak : INSANE
- pressed on two fronts, having only slaves and virgins to hold your line (WHERE ARE THE BOSOPHORAN INFANTRY WOLF?), and well, I resort to mounted archery tactics, but that was still hard to hold out the hun 66 cavalry army, and pajajaran's vandal raider spam. In sumatera, Aceh grows into really big empire, and even kick portuguese out of Malaysia (and melaka remnants too), to this point, I was simply sandwiched and barely hold Central Java... really - really insane postion....

that's all I should report... (made Pajajaran's Postion more perilous!!!)

[plutoboyz]

...that's all I should report... (made Pajajaran's Postion more perilous!!!)

if you want harder campaign, forward several years when they only hold Pakuan and Pandeglang. with Banten and cirebon army spamming arround you.



3) Pajajaran : TOO EASY
- heck, I think I'd got the hardest historical campaign, but actually, Pajajaran's postion in this darn map is the best one, your immediate enemies are interlocked with each other (demak vs majapahit, and in sumatera sriwijaya vs palembang), it was really quick and boring blitz against those romano british legionaries too, occupying java was a piece of crap, and I own north sumatera (!!!) rather very2 quickly, only aceh grows big, and that's all, too easy campaign...

historically, Pajajaran have 100.000 balamati standing. you can't have hard campaign.

[Rahwana]

I also wonder about my own unit stating system that was worked by Wolf on pajajaran, namely pajajaran got so many 2 HP units... that could made campaign ridiculously easy for them.... maybe I'd knock wolf's room door and made several new stating works, or should I wait for him to finished up some models?

[Cute Wolf]

you should used my lastest data, with in game actual units, yes, vandals are quite easy because steppe swordsmen of them got warcry, and steppe nobles. And pajajaran maybe don't have HA at all, you just test the map, right?

[plutoboyz]

pajajaran should be at war with everyone. at least it would slow it. and don't forgot that pajajaran have really poor navy. poorest.

[Cute Wolf]

so should I remove the landbridge between jawa and sumatera?

[plutoboyz]

if it could slow them, then be it.

[Cute Wolf]

yeah, and port only buildable in sunda kelapa and two banten cities, right?

[plutoboyz]

yupz.

[Cute Wolf]

well, so the AI aceh expansion should be as aggresive as they historically do, right?

[plutoboyz]

well, so the AI aceh expansion should be as aggresive as they historically do, right?

so... AI behaviour can be modded? I thought it was hardcoded.

well, its good to have aceh AI more agresive and demak AI too. make Pajajaran AI more defensive if you could. since it was historical

[Cute Wolf]

that was hardcoded, but AI expansion behaviour could be directed via campaign map modification (hence I tell sonic to test my campaign map), perhaps adding some barriers between cirebon and Jawa tengah, but get a sparse forests to other side in visible town of cilacap and tegal, will made pajajaran unlikely to invade jateng unless their LOS matched, but the demak or majapahit AI still invade jabar...

EDIT : another reason to eschew geographically accurate campaign map was to create historically accurate expannsion behaviour, that's why

[Rahwana]

just come upon this map ides wolf, should we spawn "defender script" on cilacap, tegal, magelang, and mataram? or gave them to the pirate factions with big garrison script?

the southwest sumateran and uper lampung should also have them

[plutoboyz]

I notice cirebon under Pajajaran. make them rebel instead.

[Rahwana]

no, look at the year :grin: that wasn't CW's starting year, they are under "pirate and rebel" faction at the start I think...

[G. Septimus]

uchh, and PIrates and Rebels really suck

[plutoboyz]

wolf, how about give all Pajajaran FM +2 command point when defending -4 command point when attacking. I think its historical and will make their campaign a bit difficult.

I'm more on giving "recommended difficulty settings"


CW : sori, nga sengaja neken tombol edit bro...

[Nyz]

uchh, and PIrates and Rebels really suck

Well, that "suck pirates" were the one that controlled the Strait of Malacca, both Malaysia and Sumatera coastline and small islands scattered between that....

[G. Septimus]

Well, that "suck pirates" were the one that controlled the Strait of Malacca, both Malaysia and Sumatera coastline and small islands scattered between that....

you know, wut's so hard of taking an island without any defenders? The Pirates did that. now, back to topic

[Rahwana]

you know, wut's so hard of taking an island without any defenders? The Pirates did that. now, back to topic

they are actually lawless islands which the sultanates are barely able to overlooke them, it was natural they become pirate lairs

[Cute Wolf]

wolf, how about give all Pajajaran FM +2 command point when defending -4 command point when attacking. I think its historical and will make their campaign a bit difficult.

I'm more on giving "recommended difficulty settings"

every faction should got recommended difficulty:

- Portugal, Majapahit, Sriwijaya, Aceh : VH campaign, M Battle (you can try H if you want to roleplay)
- Melaka, Palembang, Bintara : H campaign, M battle (so they are not squished too early, try VH if you dare)
- Pajajaran : VH campaign, H battle (so the WTF MELEE and 2HP BASIC UNITS you got is partially negated, remember that pajajaran first tier troop (wado), is actually 120 men strong and as strong individually as acehnese heavy infantry in melee, the various pajajaran unique melee unit such as Pemarang also got 2 HP, even when they are actually low tier one, and they are the one who got 2 HP cavalry that wasn't chariot or elephants and your bodyguard is 2HP too, in M battle you could just run away to enemy battle line, going in melee as quickly as possible, and then.... you win.... (assuming your economy isn't suck, pajajaran will got lowest trade bonus). the AI pajajaran won't get the ai bonus on traits, so they wil be slower too (I know, sonic just confirmed that we can't forbid pajajaran have that much 2HP units, they are just legendarily strong in melee - but their missile combat...... sucks)

[Rahwana]

forgot your lastest suggestions wolf, all we need is adjust the pirate and independent cities faction unit stacks that was sandwiched betewwn pajajaran and his neighbours. having Hard battle will made Pajajaran army easily lose to Blambangan Majapahit (which also posess 2 HP basic units, and Bayangkara are supposed to be sightly weaker than Pajajaran crack elite, made them hard difficulty will just reverse this logical ratio...

perhaps when human controlling pajajaran, the script will leave them in debt, rather than gave them money...

[Cute Wolf]

allready implemented, and now I need some time to work up with the starting locations of several factions (that means tedious works in descr_strat again :wall:)

and the Script are your job Sonic, that's true, we'll Rob Pajajaran all his money and damage most of their buildings (so they will be initially STUNTED), but gave them several more garrison unit, unless the human Player is Pajajaran Himself (they got some money, as well as non damaged buildings, but then, their initial army only comprised of few numbers of unit consists of mere skleton garrison, so they must raise troops in long time first, and risk the possibility of caught in Javanese invasion unprepared), or the human player is either Bintara or Majapahit (so they will get the nightmare of full strength Pajajaran Invasion! Hahahahahaha)

[Nyz]

no, just everybody that controls these cities will got hated by several other owners of important cities (the central city is Sunda Kelapa, the most important trade ports in Indonesia...), the 4 cities flank that is Majapahit, Melaka, Kutaraja, and Demak, the last circle is Pakuan, Tanjungpinang (the most important mining region), Palembang, and Jambi

AFAIK, Kutaraja was the name given by Holland when they subjugated that city... Earlier Royal Letter of Aceh's Sultans called that city Aceh, or Banda Aceh (literally, Bandar Aceh / Aceh City in Aceh Language) as we know today...

[plutoboyz]

yes, it was Bandar Aceh Darussalam changed to Kutaraja in 1524.

[Cute Wolf]

??? So that was Banda Aceh? (now renaming the map again), ... well I allready finished the EDB, so Plutoboyz, can we meet again? (DVD yg tempo hari gw pinjemin sekalian gw ambil)

[Rahwana]

??? So that was Banda Aceh? (now renaming the map again), ... well I allready finished the EDB, so Plutoboyz, can we meet again? (DVD yg tempo hari gw pinjemin sekalian gw ambil)

no, kutaraja wasn't the name given by Holland, Kutaraja origins in much older lore that origins when second pangeran of Pasai was ousted from palace, and found a new city there, so it was named Kura para Raja, and later shortened as Kutaraja

[plutoboyz]

no, kutaraja wasn't the name given by Holland, Kutaraja origins in much older lore that origins when second pangeran of Pasai was ousted from palace, and found a new city there, so it was named Kura para Raja, and later shortened as Kutaraja

but during NUTW time, it was Bandar Aceh Darussalam.

[Cute Wolf]

umm, but soon changed in 1524 then? back to Kutaraja again? Hmm......
How about searating em as 2 cities? :idea2: .... (damn, I was soo confused and uncreative today :wall:)

[plutoboyz]

umm, but soon changed in 1524 then? back to Kutaraja again? Hmm......
How about searating em as 2 cities? :idea2: .... (damn, I was soo confused and uncreative today :wall:)

bad idea wolfy, better give the slots to for another city rather than separating one city into two.

[Cute Wolf]

but I think this time, I'll kept that still as Kutaraja, because historical manuscripts told the city's original name, and more common name was Kutaraja....??? well, I'll ask that in Kaskus history forum then...

[plutoboyz]

...well, I'll ask that in Kaskus history forum then...

beware, I smell conspiracy theory...

[Cute Wolf]

beware, I smell conspiracy theory...

yeah, emang disana pada demen conspiracy theory semua :laugh4:
--- ntar gw tanyain siapa yah jadinya?

[Nyz]

and how about using archaic writting system for lokal region name in minimap? for more realistic map. since we can't make geographically accurate map, thanks to landmass ratio CTD.

Example: Jawadwipa written in cacarakan, Parahyangan in Kaganga, Melaka in Jawi.

How it can be done? Are the names written on the land? And embedded in the minimap using photoshop?

[plutoboyz]

How it can be done? Are the names written on the land? And embedded in the minimap using photoshop?
see the radar map
https://a.imageshack.us/img827/7949/cassep.jpg
now open your EB file, EB\Data\world\maps\campaign\imperial_campaign\RADAR_MAP1.TGA. compare it... same right? That what we will modify.
replace latin text with something like this:
https://img5.imageshack.us/img5/3740/asdafo.png

[Nyz]

replace latin text with something like this:
https://img5.imageshack.us/img5/3740/asdafo.png

Hmm, it is not Mim Lam Alif Kaf Alif, it's Mim Lam Alif Kaf Alif (without last Alif):

https://a.imageshack.us/img716/8057/melaka.png

[Rahwana]

it was with alif

[plutoboyz]

it was with alif

he was right. coppied from wiki "ملاك"

[Rahwana]

no, without alif, the pronounciation won't be right

[Cute Wolf]

what the heck you guys arguing about?

[plutoboyz]

what the heck you guys arguing about?

its about Jawi writing...

anyway can you read carakan?

[Nyz]

no, without alif, the pronounciation won't be right

Yes, without last Alif. Many Jawi words are spelled like that. They just omitted the vowels. Mim lam alif kaf = Melaka, while Mim Lam Alif Qaf = Melak

Examples: Nun Alif mim = nama, ba alif cha = baca, Mim ra ya kaf = Mereka, Kaf ra alif nun = kerana

I don't know why, but I think they were spelled base on the former spelling of Pallavi script.

Example: Ba ha ga ya alif (literally: Bhagia; Pronouncation: Bahagia), Ba ha ya (literally: Bhaya; Pronouncation: Bahaya)

And loanwords from Arab retained it Arabic spelling.



anyway can you read carakan?

Nope

[Cute Wolf]

I feel bad forgot to update this and only visiting TWC mostly.... :cry:

so here's the building system!
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=165105&stc=1&d=1306750091

[Reza]

you shall change the religion symbol
maybe this will help
Islam:Crescent
Christian:Cross
Hindu-Buddha:i don't know

[Reza]

the eurpean barrack like the one in the M2TW.are you copying it?

[Reza]

Where you get the cannon model and animation.if you look for good gunpowder animation just copy the animation from Citadel total war,they have very good gunpowder animation