Virtues of Bush

[Cebei]

I posted this into the entrance hall to get the ideas of the newcomers too.

As it is well apparent that Bush really failed in foreign policy, I want to think that he at least succeeded in domestic policy. American users: What do you think of Bush's domestic policy. To what extent did he achieve his election promises?

[Pindar]

I'm not sure I understand the criteria whereby you are concluding a failed in foreign policy, particularly given his present term hasn't come to its end.

[Cebei]

So you believe he will succeed at the end of his term.

Anyway it is not the question, come on he must have done something right

[Pindar]

I mean: I don't see the standard whereby success or failure is measured. Without such standards (whether the discussion is concerned with domestic or international matters) the bulk of responses will be simply the reascertion of one's like or dislike of the administration. For example: one could say Bush is a failure because he pulled out of the Kyoto Treaty. Another may say Bush is a success becasue he pulled out of the Kyoto Treaty.

Looking more specifically at the domestic sceen: one could point out that when Bush came into office the U.S. was in a recession (negative GDP growth). According to the most recent quarterly figures the GDP is now over 4.5% and expected to clear 5% next quarter when the tax cut impacts the ecomony. Another example might be the stock market which was severly hit by the recession is now over 9800 and expected to go over 10,000 before the end of the year.

At the same time, the budget deficit is over 400 billion and expected to possibily go over 600 billion. Further, unemployment is still at the relatively high figure of 6.1%.

Then of course there is the unfortunate reality that the exectutive doesn't have that great an ability to impact the economy regardless of the tendancy to laud or condemn whoever happens to be in the chair at the time.

So, how is one to judge?

[Portuguese Rebel]

This is possibly going to be a short thread...

[bighairyman]

well at least Bush is friendly and have swift justice http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
and some people might even call him a unhinged Loon http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Aurelian]

This is strange. Will no one sing the praises of George Bush's domestic policies? It's been two days. Surely someone can come up with something positive to say.

Hint: It won't be me. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Gregoshi]

It is the weekend. Wait 'til everyone gets back to work so they can get paid for posting here. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[squippy]

Foreign policy can be said to hjave failed as Bush has dmeonstrated the US to be a rogue state going against the UN, alienating friends and allies, and getting mired in a colonial adventure in classic Imperial style.

I think his domestic policy could be said to have failed on the budget deficit alone.

[Eastside Character]

Bush is an expansionist, so he should be:
- skilled attacker
- killer instinct http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif
and maybe also - natural leader (after his dad and all that governorship thing I think) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[The_Emperor]

Bush's V&V's?

For the Economy, Secret Kleptocracy http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

For his big business connections, Moral Flexibility

Given his faith, Religious Compulsions

And lets not forget for his WMD intellignce, and dealings with the names of CIA agents... Informant Network

And of course he couldn't stay as president without his Faithfull Servants http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

However for his efforts to attack Iraq he gets Skilled Attacker. And for his failiure in the aftermath, Bad Defender.

Did I miss any? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Kraxis]

You know such a general would only become the governor of a province that didn't make much money and I wanted kept down. Heh...

But the Informants should perhaps be changed to Informants Network? He DID do a good job on convincing quite a few people that there were WMDs in Iraq.

[The_Emperor]

Quote[/b] (Kraxis @ Oct. 06 2003,22:58)]You know such a general would only become the governor of a province that didn't make much money and I wanted kept down. Heh...

But the Informants should perhaps be changed to Informants Network? He DID do a good job on convincing quite a few people that there were WMDs in Iraq.
personally I'd use him for Assassin/Inquisitor training, but then I do have a vengeful streak dealing with my corrupt governors.

Informant Network does sound better... doesn't it. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Parmenio]

For his extended adolescence : Hedonist.

[ichi]

Quote[/b] (The_Emperor @ Oct. 06 2003,13:37)]Bush's V&V's?

For the Economy, Secret Kleptocracy http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

For his big business connections, Moral Flexibility

Given his faith, Religious Compulsions

And lets not forget for his WMD intellignce, and dealings with the names of CIA agents... Informant Network

And of course he couldn't stay as president without his Faithfull Servants http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

However for his efforts to attack Iraq he gets Skilled Attacker. And for his failiure in the aftermath, Bad Defender.

Did I miss any? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Great start, but yes you did miss a few

Secret Paranoia

Strong Security

Authoritarian

Secret Tyrant

Poor Steward

Family Favorites

Fervent

Irritable

and Secret Bad Temper

Bush has yet to display his best attribute, which I think will be

1 Term President

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[LestaT]

Hear Hear http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[mandt]

Ya know, I can't think of a thing that he's done that's had a demonstrably positive impact on this country.

Here are some high points:

-Economy still dragging; tax cut proposals ineffective, but more importantly appear to pander to the rich. In other words, even if the President has no direct affect on the economy, he can still pretend he understands the plight of the American middle class. He doesn't.
-Iraq becoming more ugly every day; no resolution in sight. It doesn't matter what the reality is over there, the fact that one or two American soldiers are getting killed each day is having a serious effect on the American public.
-Bin Laden still at large
-Saddam still at large
-No WMDs
-Admission of no connection between al Qaeda and Saddam. This after the carefully constructed speeches designed to suggest a connection.
-Request for 87 billion for Iraqi reconstruction
-burgeoning deficit
-Connections to Enron, Haliburton
-North Korea
-Failure of the Mid-East roadmap, and the subsequent inaffectiveness of his adminstration to come to grips with the problem.
-White House leak outing CIA agent. This is a Federal crime.
-Managed to piss-off just about every other country in the world.

I think he handled the post-9/11 as well as could be expected, especially considering his, or anyone else's lack of experience with an event of such magnitude.

But on the whole, he's been about the worst president I've seen. And I've seen a couple of doosies.

BTW, if anyone is really interested in what Americans think of Bush, check out this link to the NY Times. Once the page pops up, click on the little pie-chart on the right side.

It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.

[Devastatin Dave]

Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,12:14)]It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.
Now that's a reliable news source LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[The Wizard]

It isn't? heh...

BTW dave 10 more posts and you'll reach that terrible date.. the fall of Constantinople http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/shock.gif

[The_Emperor]

Quote[/b] (daveinkorea @ Oct. 07 2003,18:31)]
Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,12:14)]It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.
Now that's a reliable news source LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
We shall see Dave... Most US Presidents are one-termers, and Bush has done worse than a lot of them.

But we will see when the elctions come around. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Mega Dux Bob]

Well my impression of his campaign promises were:

Cut Taxes: which he has done.

Allow Social Security investment in the Stock Market: even his detractors have chosen to forget this one.

Withdraw from the ABM treaty: he did

Government money for faith based charities: he did

Get tough with N Korea and China: he has.

Banning stem cell research (I think): he has.

Replacing the heads of state of the EU and most Arab states with CIA cyborgs. Beyond a slight problem with Cyborgs opperating system things are proceding well.

and nothing about Iraq.

So there you go.

[Devastatin Dave]

Quote[/b] (Mega Dux Bob @ Oct. 07 2003,12:51)]Well my impression of his campaign promises were:

Cut Taxes: which he has done.

Allow Social Security investment in the Stock Market: even his detractors have chosen to forget this one.

Withdraw from the ABM treaty: he did

Government money for faith based charities: he did

Get tough with N Korea and China: he has.

Banning stem cell research (I think): he has.

Replacing the heads of state of the EU and most Arab states with CIA cyborgs. Beyond a slight problem with Cyborgs opperating system things are proceding well.

and nothing about Iraq.

So there you go.
Now don't you come in here praising Bush and get these guys all riled up LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[LordUxbridge]

Virtues of Bush?.....sorry, thought this was about something COMPLETELY different......

[The_Emperor]

Quote[/b] (Mega Dux Bob @ Oct. 07 2003,18:51)]Well my impression of his campaign promises were:

Cut Taxes: which he has done.

Allow Social Security investment in the Stock Market: even his detractors have chosen to forget this one.

Withdraw from the ABM treaty: he did

Government money for faith based charities: he did

Get tough with N Korea and China: he has.

Banning stem cell research (I think): he has.

Replacing the heads of state of the EU and most Arab states with CIA cyborgs. Beyond a slight problem with Cyborgs opperating system things are proceding well.

and nothing about Iraq.

So there you go.
I wonder how many people would feel the same way when the elections come around

[Devastatin Dave]

Quote[/b] (The_Emperor @ Oct. 07 2003,13:06)]
Quote[/b] (Mega Dux Bob @ Oct. 07 2003,18:51)]Well my impression of his campaign promises were:

Cut Taxes: which he has done.

Allow Social Security investment in the Stock Market: even his detractors have chosen to forget this one.

Withdraw from the ABM treaty: he did

Government money for faith based charities: he did

Get tough with N Korea and China: he has.

Banning stem cell research (I think): he has.

Replacing the heads of state of the EU and most Arab states with CIA cyborgs. Beyond a slight problem with Cyborgs opperating system things are proceding well.

and nothing about Iraq.

So there you go.
I wonder how many people would feel the same way when the elections come around
I'd say about 60%. You'll see. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[mandt]

Quote[/b] (daveinkorea @ Oct. 07 2003,12:31)]
Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,12:14)]It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.
Now that's a reliable news source LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
Dave-

You don't believe the NY Times to be a reliable news source? Or do I completely misunderstand the thrust of this post?

[mandt]

Quote[/b] (Mega Dux Bob @ Oct. 07 2003,12:51)]Well my impression of his campaign promises were:

Cut Taxes: which he has done.

Allow Social Security investment in the Stock Market: even his detractors have chosen to forget this one.

Withdraw from the ABM treaty: he did

Government money for faith based charities: he did

Get tough with N Korea and China: he has.

Banning stem cell research (I think): he has.

Replacing the heads of state of the EU and most Arab states with CIA cyborgs. Beyond a slight problem with Cyborgs opperating system things are proceding well.

and nothing about Iraq.

So there you go.
Yup. Bush has done an excellent job of snookering his constituents. He has kept all the campaign promises we knew beforehand that America would be far better without.

And you're right about how he's handled the N. Koreans. They're obviously shakin' in their boots, as they keep on crankin' out those atomic bombs.

Ya know. Kay and the other guys searching for WMDs in Iraq are looking in the wrong place. They'd have better luck checking out North Korea.

[Kraxis]

Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,18:29)]Ya know. Kay and the other guys searching for WMDs in Iraq are looking in the wrong place. They'd have better luck checking out North Korea.
But... But that is dangerous http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[mandt]

Heh. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Devastatin Dave]

Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,18:22)]
Quote[/b] (daveinkorea @ Oct. 07 2003,12:31)]
Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,12:14)]It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.
Now that's a reliable news source LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
Dave-

You don't believe the NY Times to be a reliable news source? Or do I completely misunderstand the thrust of this post?
No, the NY Times is not a reliable news source. It is better used to wrap day old fish. Do a google on Jayson Blair and do some research on the NY Times reporting. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Heraclius]

Quote[/b] (daveinkorea @ Oct. 07 2003,19:43)]
Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,18:22)]
Quote[/b] (daveinkorea @ Oct. 07 2003,12:31)]
Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,12:14)]It's a series of surveys conducted by the NY Times over the past couple of years. It's very enlightening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/03/national/03POLL.html

You might need to subscribe. Go ahead. It's free. And you'll need Adobe Acrobat Reader. That's also free.
Now that's a reliable news source LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
Dave-

You don't believe the NY Times to be a reliable news source? Or do I completely misunderstand the thrust of this post?
No, the NY Times is not a reliable news source. It is better used to wrap day old fish. Do a google on Jayson Blair and do some research on the NY Times reporting. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
well I'm glad Ann Coulter, Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly are also doing their fair share to keep up the standards of American journalism. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[Aurelian]

Hey, check this one out. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif


Quote[/b] ]Study hits war views held by Fox fans

By David Folkenflik
Sun Staff
Originally published October 4, 2003

Heavy viewers of the Fox News Channel are nearly four times as likely to hold demonstrably untrue positions about the war in Iraq as media consumers who rely on National Public Radio or the Public Broadcasting System, according to a study released this week by a research center affiliated with the University of Maryland's School of Public Affairs.
When evidence surfaces that a significant portion of the public has just got a hole in the picture ... this is a potential problem in the way democracy functions, says Clay Ramsay, research director for the Washington-based Program on International Policy Attitudes, which studies foreign-policy issues.

Read the rest at:
http://www.sunspot.net/feature....adlines (http://www.sunspot.net/features/bal-to.fox04oct04,0,5444015.story?coll=bal-features-headlines)

[Mega Dux Bob]

Quote[/b] (mandt @ Oct. 07 2003,18:29)]Yup. Bush has done an excellent job of snookering his constituents. He has kept all the campaign promises we knew beforehand that America would be far better without.

And you're right about how he's handled the N. Koreans. They're obviously shakin' in their boots, as they keep on crankin' out those atomic bombs.

Ya know. Kay and the other guys searching for WMDs in Iraq are looking in the wrong place. They'd have better luck checking out North Korea.
Well the question was has Bush kept his campaign promises? not did they led to a better America?