Turn-Based or Open Strategy

[Lehesu]

I am kind of feeling the need for another strategy game. Never liked the Civilization or Empire Earth series, although the idea was intriguing. I downloaded the Alpha Centauri demo and liked what I saw, as it gave some free reign as to what I could do, like developing my own units. However, I wasn't too good at the demo and never have really got the hang of the Civ style of play. Is there a strategy game, preferrably turn-based, that has this sense of open-endedness? I have been looking around and all I see is Civ and Total War up on the turn-based charts. Surely there is something else

[Mount Suribachi]

Lehusu, did you try the tutorial? It has a pretty good one - not sure if it comes with the demo though. I would highly, highly, recommend Alpha Centauri, its easily my favourite Civ game. It has a pretty good storyline, different ways to win, factions that have very different (but all good) playing styles, and best of all, customisable units which are limited pretty much by your own imagination. It also has a cool future in space vibe too it.

Did I mention I love SMAC?

Another favourite TBS of mine is the old Panzer General series (the hex version, not the crappy 3-d sequels).

I would give SMAC more time, any questions, just ask me.

[Bushido]

What about good old Masters of Orion 2? It's easily (imo) the best turn-based game, ever.

[hrvojej]

There are quite a few turn-based strategy games out there, so I don't know what you mean by this broad term.

For example, a few TBS games that I like:
Space empires IV
Dominions 2
Disciples 2
Age of Wonders 2

These are all very different from each other, but all good games. Also, the likes of Fallout tactics and Silent storm have turn based combat, i.e. tactical TBS. Have you ever tried Europa universalis and the like games? Those are not turn based, but they are certainly open-ended, and you can pause the action whenever you want.

[Scipio]

I know what you mean about Civ series I always had a problem with it(to dificult) but I adopted a strategy of building settlers and workers(build a lot of cities at the begining) and that brought up my economy hugely and then build a suitable army http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Lehesu]

Quote[/b] (hrvojej @ Feb. 16 2004,16:21)]There are quite a few turn-based strategy games out there, so I don't know what you mean by this broad term.

For example, a few TBS games that I like:
Space empires IV
Dominions 2
Disciples 2
Age of Wonders 2

These are all very different from each other, but all good games. Also, the likes of Fallout tactics and Silent storm have turn based combat, i.e. tactical TBS. Have you ever tried Europa universalis and the like games? Those are not turn based, but they are certainly open-ended, and you can pause the action whenever you want.
I own Disciples 2 and Fallout-Tactics...a lot of fun, those games. I tend to shy from most RTS nowadays because many , ie RON and Empire Earth, have that really stupid oversimplistic rock paper scissors thing.

[Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe]

Technically turn based, rather open ended; Europa Universalis 2

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

Louis,

[hrvojej]

If you like Fallout Tactics, keep an eye out on the new Jagged Alliance that is about to come out soon, as that's an open-ended TBS tactical game. If you like Disciples, you might want to check out Age of Wonders or Dominions, which are kind of in the same vein. And as already mentioned, if you crave for something like a Civilization but deeper, you should definitely try Europa Universalis 2 or any other game by Paradox if you haven't already.

Cheers,

[econ21]

The best empire-building game I've ever come across - aside from MTW - was Imperialism 2. It's a gem, maximising the challenges from exploration, research, production, warfare etc but minimising the micro-management (that can be a pain in Civ type games). Rather a steep learning curve, though.

I got a lot out of Heroes of Might and Magic 3 as well. More based on single scenarios (maps) than a linked campaign, but big maps could be almost comparable to Civ and MTW in scope. (There is a user-made one for the Lord of the Rings that is amazingly good). Shallow learning curve, although very rich in options.

[frogbeastegg]

I can second any recommendation for Alpha Centauri. That game is a froggy nightmare - numbers and stats galore. It took me 1 year of off and on playing to understand enough to play a game through to the end and win on the easiest difficulty, the thing is the game is so good I put the effort in to learn it rather than giving up after a month. That is a very high recommendation. I doubt it would take you a year to learn, try this guide (http://db.gamefaqs.com/computer/doswin/file/alien_crossfire_a.txt) it helped me enormously.

[Fragony]

If you are looking for a fun turn-based game I cannot recommend Silent Storm enough. It has pretty good AI, and most important, it is frigging hilarious. Your men say the most rediculous things ('he be flat like a beaver that cannot judge wind', and my favorite: 'I need a medic...pronto..I got cash'). If you can take the extreme goofiness you will have a blast with it.

[Lehesu]

I think I really want to get into Alpha Centauri, but it's so immense I don't even know how to get started Any advice?

[Fragony]

You can make it as complicated as you want. You can assign all but the most crucial tasks to your governers and just enjoy the combat and diplomacy, or you can play it as a perfectionist and control everything. It is really a learn as you go experience, part of the fun is finding out.

[Bushido]

How could I forget such classic as Steel Panthers - World at War? Hardcore tactical engagements so deep you'll drown Also, the Combat Mission serie is a superb tactical simulation covering all the different 2nd world war theatres such as eastern Europe (bring em könig tigers, rar) and north Africa.
There aren't words positive enough to correctly describe the sheer genius of the serie. The third installation brings you to north Africa. You can try to outperform the much praised Desert Fox, Erwin Rommel. You can try to stop the elusive Germans as they blitzkrieg you
The first two games of the serie, Combat Mission: Beyond the Overlord and Combat Mission: Barbarossa to Berlin are better than the 3rd game, Combat Mission: Africa Korps.

The battle system is made of pure fun with ingenoius design. Basically, you issue your orders during the Orders Phase and the enemy does the same. Then you hit GO and watch the battle unfold for 60 seconds until you get to issue new orders. Undiluted, brilliant fun.

Seriously, anyone with some sort of knack for tactical games should try out the CM:BO alpha demo, found on their website www.battlefront.com ; it's what got me hooked in these games.

I probably should warn those who are interested that the games do not have campaign of any sort. You can play individual battles or operations, which consist of some historical mini-campaign. You can also quick generate battles with varying settings.

Come on, who wouldn't want to get his ass kicked by US Army Major in Cavalry Regiment? Or a guy who studies tactics used in the 2nd world war for living? Enlist now

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Lehesu @ Feb. 20 2004,00:57)]I think I really want to get into Alpha Centauri, but it's so immense I don't even know how to get started Any advice?
Firstly check that guide I linked to before, while much of it will sail over your head if you just read the basic sections it will get you going on the right foot. Then you can come back for more advanced sections later as you want to expand your knowledge. This guide is so good it got published as an actual book, sadly unavailable in the UK. Of course the book has extra information the free version doesn't but the free version is the original...in a way this is the guide that inspired me and set my standards for my own guides. I have got a long way to go before I meet this masterpiece.

If you can get the Alien Crossfire add-on with it either separately or as a bundle in the Planetary Pack (I've got that) and start off as one of the two alien races as they are much more powerful than the other factions. You'll have a lot less to worry about, even if you do look like a fish. Play on easy and automate some tasks, basically the ones you don't want to deal with rather than any specific stuff. I found it easier to play a defensive game, sitting and expanding peacefully and guarding my own territory rather than attacking and invading. Eventually you can build the ultimate wonder, or get elected as president, or go for a score win so there is plenty of room for peaceful manoeuvre.

Finally this (http://apolyton.net/smac/) is a good site with some good forums. Bit hard to navigate and a lot quieter than it used to be but it should help.

[Mysterium]

I think everyone here handled all my suggestions. Age of Wonders 1 and 2 and Heroes of Might and Magic III or IV, but both of those suffer from the lack of open-ended feel. Fallout Tactics was just way too addictive for me (man, that thing screwed up my sleep schedule) but I'm a sucker for post-apocalyptic stuff. Oh, and I'm really surprised someone recommended Space Empires IV. Wonderful game, but I thought it was my own little indie gem . . .

Lehesu, SMAC is one of my favorite games of all time. I typically hate folk bragging about game skill (Yeah, well, I can beat it with my sound turned off on Expert using my nose to move the mouse and only right-clicking) but I've put enough time into SMAC to be very good at it. Frog's links are good ones, so check those out. And for the plain Alpha Centauri, no add-on, try either the Peacekeepers (they're the most balanced, no major strengths or weaknesses) or the Gaians (their early confluence with Planet turns a major obstacle into a strength). The learning curve takes a LONG time (that's a major drawback to the game) and if you don't like the CIV style, you might not like this once you learn it.

OH Take off Auto-design units and auto-prune obsolete units. That's like auto-resolve in MTW. If you leave those on, you'll never really learn what all the different unit enhacements do, and if you design/name your own units, you know what's going on (cause really, what the hell is a Trance Fusion Shard Behemoth, Mk2?)

Hey, and Froggy, if you like SMAC, which you do, and fanfiction, which I think you do, this is the greatest fanfic (for any game) I've ever read. Excepting, of course, everything on the ORG . . . http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

SMAC Fanfic Joe (http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk/SMACfiction.html)

[Lehesu]

Played the demo for SMAC and held up pretty good as the Peacekeepers. Got voted as planetary leader, those extra votes really help Probably going to buy the laptop pack, which has SMAC and the expansion with a bunch of useless games I don't want, but hey, 15 dollars? Can't beat it.

[Mysterium]

Yeah, I spotted that laptop pack at Best Buy last time I was down there. Can't beat $15. And Peacekeepers are handy for the planetary elections because of the 1 1/2 Planetary Council votes. It's always a good idea to try and get voted in early, because once someone else is in there, it's really hard to get them out. I've never seen the Leader change more than twice in one game.

Plus, if you like the world that SMAC creates, the the background they write for the different leaders/tech advances and such is just second to none. Really believable setting.

[rory_20_uk]

I liked Alpha Centuri more than civ 3 in many ways, although it was not without its failings:
Futuristic units do not have the same appeal for me as ones at least loosely based on the real world.
Odd occurences such as adding armour to planes made no difference as to the cost - build the best on all as it costs the same
The usual specials that can be built that can help to unbalance the game: the anti-sabateur tech allows you to have a very pro science society, as the downside is cancelled by the tech advance.

I liked to go for the tech guy: research early and often. Votes can be accrued by being the biggest (and usually the nastiest). Mind staple everyone all the time, be a complete bastard - you knowit makes sense http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Mysterium @ Feb. 20 2004,17:21)]Hey, and Froggy, if you like SMAC, which you do, and fanfiction, which I think you do, this is the greatest fanfic (for any game) I've ever read. Excepting, of course, everything on the ORG . . . http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

SMAC Fanfic Joe (http://http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk/SMACfiction.html)
That link isn't working, I think Mount Suribachi posted it in the Mead Hall a few months ago and the page wouldn't load for me then either.


I too prefer the setting of Civ3 but Civ3 was so disappointing even the appeal of stomping people with Egyptian chariots and then sending messages demanding tribute in the name of queen Cleo couldn't keep me playing. Corruption, limitation, lack of ability to cover the whole map in cities and reap huge incomes - ick. The diplomacy was good though, but I missed being able to bribe people to vote for me. If they ever fixed the corruption problem and let you build as many cities as you like Civ3 would become interesting again.

[rory_20_uk]

Or at the very least have more variables open to user manipulation. Possibly there are people out there that like the fact that corruption makes cities past a certain point utterly pointless... but a bar, tab or something that blets people vary it would probably not be that tough for designers, and be very useful for players.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Lehesu]

I actually like this sci-fi universe a lot better than old civ 2. Sure, the techs can be confusing, but I am getting the hang of it, and it provides an interesting gaming experience that is different than all of the historical strategies I own.

[Efrem Da King]

I have AC somewhere. Lose 80% of my games very quickly so I wouldn't count on being able to find it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif .


I enjoyed it. But then I put difficulty up to easy. I DON'T LIKE LOSING I only ever play easy or easiest difficulties on games no matter how good I am at them because the idea of being beaten by a comeputer makes me cry.









I therefore havn't play AC since and that was a couple of years ago. Wait. More than that.

Will have another look now.

[Efrem Da King]

Just so you know I found it, it was hidden under Mechwarrior 3.

[Mysterium]

Yah, the corruption in Civ III was just too debilitating to be enjoyable. I ended up farming other civilizations, just so that I could use their capitals like other forbidden palaces. And I HATE doing that. No matter how strategically sound, once I start beating a faction to a pulp, I have trouble letting up. Even now in MTW, I can only let a faction live if they're locked on their own little island and I don't have to look at them. Mercy ain't my strong suit.

Oh, sorry to be redundant with the post, didn't know Mount Suribachi already posted that. I went back and fixed the link, though, 'http' was in there too many times. It should work now.

[Lehesu]

GAH Ecodamage How do you fix it? Got a base pumping 4 ecodamage and the effects are being noted. Do I just have to destroy mines and other stuff? Or is their a building or something that could help it?

[Mysterium]

Quote[/b] (Lehesu @ Feb. 21 2004,19:28)]GAH Ecodamage How do you fix it? Got a base pumping 4 ecodamage and the effects are being noted. Do I just have to destroy mines and other stuff? Or is their a building or something that could help it?
4 isn't too much to worry about. You can build Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests, those help with eco-damage. Certain shifts to social engineering help as well, I think. Otherwise, you'll just have to cut down on how many minerals you're producing by shifting production to different squares. But I typically don't worry about eco-damage until it gets up around 20 and the fungus is destroying my improvements every turn. But then, I'm a capitalist . . . progress at any cost http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-builder.gif

[frogbeastegg]

The link still isn't working.

I remember I set up a base that grubbed tonnes of mineral each turn with the assisitance of supply crawlers. I was able to build things so fast it wasn't funny...then the whole place got wiped out in a lengthy siege by a horde of furious fungus Each turn more fungus grew, at a faster rate than my own army and reinforcement supply. Those rocket launching mushrooms are hell when there are 20 or more bombarding away each turn

[Efrem Da King]

hmm


I played the spartans. I have conquered 2 people but the second people I conquer I more destroyed cause I used chemical weapons agianst them http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif .


I just love clicking a button saying commit atrocoty.

I got embargoed for 80 years. By everyone execpt the morganites cause I was helping them.

[rory_20_uk]

I think that there are some research options that help limit ecodamage (forget what they are). I like the extra factor that this adds to the game. Far better than the crude club of corruption that Civ 3 employes.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Efrem Da King]

Hey I prefer civ 3 to alpha centari, its 20 times easier to have a clue as to whats going on. Much less of a learning curve meaning that even if you suck like me, you can have a fun game quite soon in. THe interface of AC SUCKS Its not HOI bad but it is pointlessly confusing and could have been done waaayy better like in civ 3 for example.


The only thing I know how to do in AC is make units and build cities and communitcate. And attack with chemical weapons of course. The stupid interface is to blame http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-party2.gif .

[Mysterium]

Still not working? RRgh. Well, just google SMAC Fan Fiction and it's the second one, if you're interested.

[Divine Wind]

www.battlefront.com

Someone already mentioned this, but i think it needs another voice

Try Combat Mission: Beyond Overlord, Barborossa to Berlin, or the new version Afrika Corps.

Brilliant turn based strategy game.

[Ironside]

Citera[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 22 2004,04:23)]hmm


I played the spartans. I have conquered 2 people but the second people I conquer I more destroyed cause I used chemical weapons agianst them http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif .


I just love clicking a button saying commit atrocoty.

I got embargoed for 80 years. By everyone execpt the morganites cause I was helping them.
Funny I'm the only one that likes playing the nice guy? It's always fun conquering the world and still being noble.

[Efrem Da King]

Oh I just couldn't resist gassing UN Headquaters. Thats the only reason I play.

[Fragony]

Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 25 2004,03:57)]Oh I just couldn't resist gassing UN Headquaters. Thats the only reason I play.
Why do I get the feeling that you actually mean it ;)

[Mysterium]

Y'know, I've never actually been able to bring myself to commit an atrocity. Well, I think I used a planet buster, but that was just to see what it did and then I loaded my earlier game. It's the same reason I have a tough time assassinating princesses. Morals in gaming? What's that all about

[frogbeastegg]

Was this (http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=8570) the story you meant? I haven't read it yet but will do soon.

Morals in games? I can one up you on the princess count - I never marry mine off It just seems so wrong to force some poor girl to marry a typical MTW loony general. Not only has the princess has acid thrown in her face (those red burns come from somewhere) but she is expected to put up with some drunken lout who believes he is made of glass. Of course it is hardly a picnic for the general, but he has the advantage of being able to send his lovely unwanted wife away to some backwater castle he doesn't go within 20 miles of. She can hardly do that with her lovely unwanted husband. Also he gains a hefty chunk of prestige, she gains…um…nothing? I don't kill bad heirs either, or generals, or enemy 'harmless' units like princesses and emissaries.

In games like AC I never use nukes or do atrocities, most of the time I sit around being entirely peaceful until someone attacks me - then they get ruthlessly removed from the face of the planet. Bleeding heart froggy...until you give me reason to be otherwise, then cold hearted froggy.

[Mysterium]

My best starts are usually ones where I get attacked early on, actually. It almost always turns out to be the Believers, then I just snap up all of Miriam's bases and have twice the population base to start from. Then is sit back, get a nice tech advantage, and try to keep everyone getting along. I'm always the one asking everyone to make peace with everyone else. But even though I never commit atrocities, I still can't handle Lal whining.

As to the story, yes, that's the one. It's stellar. However, the site I was reading from didn't have the final chapters and I assumed they weren't written. I will now go read them. I am in your debt for finding them. :deep bow, flourish, exuent to go waste time:

On to sci-fi land . . . http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-alien.gif

[Mount Suribachi]

Mysterium/Froggy thats not the best fan fiction ever that I linked to. To find the one I was on about search the apolyton SMAC story forums for The Forgotten Faction, it really is superb. Have you read it mysterium? I'll try & find the time to read the one you posted.

As for atrocoties, I too like to play the nice guy - peacekeepers & Gaians are my favourite and I play to their strenghts, which means being the good guy :D I only ever use biochems against the aliens, its a battle for survival and the first time I got the surviving refugees fleeing the city message, I was filled with a thirst for vengeance http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif So I gas the alien scum, they deserve it

I only use Planetbusters in the endgame if I'm just playing out time till I've conquered the last faction - usually the aliens are on the receiving end of that too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif

As for nerve stapling, I've never ever used that.


Efram I find your comments about the interface strange, from the very beginning I've found SMAC to be very easy to get into & learn - maybe cos I played a lot of Civ2 before that and it is basically Civ2 in space.

Lehusu I'm glad you got the game, there really is tremendous depth to it, especially the social engineering & unit design.

Finally, the guide that Froggy linked to (wouldn't work for me) I assume is Velocyrixs guide. It is without question the best strategy guide I've ever read, even better than Froggys efforts, if such a thing were possible. I thought I was a pretty good SMAC player till I read that. It blew my mind all the strategys in there that I'd never thought of. I would play the game for a bit longer to get a feel for it before I read the guide though if I was you.

[Mount Suribachi]

Oh, and when I've got time I'll post about my best ever game of SMAC. If I had even more time I'd have done a proper story about it, it was one of those superb gaming moments :)

[frogbeastegg]

Humph, that link is strange. It takes you to a page telling you that there is a large warning on every HTML page asking you not to link to faqs directly. Am I the only one not seeing any of these warnings on any part of gamefaqs?

Anyway it was Velocyrix's guide, found under pc->'s'->Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri.

Velo's work is much, much better than mine - he really knows and understands the game. He isn't borrowing second hand stuff he semi understands from else where and trying to mash thousands of posts read over more thna a year together into one guide, and credit people he doesn't remember. I am an average player trying to write both what I know and what I can't do; he is an advanced player writing what he knows. He also seems to have dealt with the fallout his work created better than me. Velo is an inspiration, as I said before this guide set the standards I aimed for.

[Mysterium]

Perhaps it wasn't the best fanfic ever, I suppose. Of course, I never ever use hyperbole. Ever.

Haven't read Forgotten Faction, but I will when I get time. I love SMAC Fanfic, because the game itself gave such a wonderful look at huge possibilities in the back-story, as if the whole thing had been thought out, but they weren't going to tell you.

[Lehesu]

My favorite faction has to be the Morganites so far. Pulling a ridiculous amount of energy per turns is just very satisfing for a greedy person like me. It's hilarious when you can rush build secret projects and lose less than a quarter of your savings. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Kalle]

Here are two great turnbased strategy games.

Clash of steel

Panzer general (the first one)

Civ II was the best civ game imo allthough i like the trade and border system in number III.

The best realtime strategy imo is starcraft.

Kalle

[Mount Suribachi]

Froggy, I tried the links I posted for The Forgotten Faction, and though it took about 15 seconds to do it, I managed to connect to the forum and download the thread. I don't know why you couldn't do it. Perhaps if you try again. Can you connect to the Apolyton.net forums at all?

Mysterium You should seek it out (thread with links is on page 2 of Mead Hall). The forgotten faction are the Hillbillies btw.

Now I'm off to install SMAC

[Mysterium]

The Hillbillies, Mt. Suribachi? Oh dear. From that the tone is probably a bit, um, lighter than the one I'm currently reading. I'll jump on that bandwagon next. I'd love to hear your story as well.

Lehesu, I am a fan of the Morganites, too. I typically play either them or the University (I'm equal parts tech and money greedy). Then I try find whichever faction I'm not playing and get a nice money/tech symbiosis going.

[Efrem Da King]

Quote[/b] (Fragony @ Feb. 25 2004,10:36)]
Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 25 2004,03:57)]Oh I just couldn't resist gassing UN Headquaters. Thats the only reason I play.
Why do I get the feeling that you actually mean it ;)
Doesn't the idea of having millions of people dieing from gass that slowly and painfully kills them in the UN Headqauters make you happy too? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Fragony]

Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 27 2004,03:37)]
Quote[/b] (Fragony @ Feb. 25 2004,10:36)]
Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 25 2004,03:57)]Oh I just couldn't resist gassing UN Headquaters. Thats the only reason I play.
Why do I get the feeling that you actually mean it ;)
Doesn't the idea of having millions of people dieing from gass that slowly and painfully kills them in the UN Headqauters make you happy too? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
Ok you convinded me, where do I sign up http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif

[Efrem Da King]

Well play anyone ofther than the humanitarians (my archenemies I WILL KILL THEM EVERY GAME I PLAY) build up a strong airforce armed with chemical weapons (its a special option once you have researched it) then allie with the fundies or capatalists. The humanitarians ALWAYS start wars with them. Then you can say you were invaded (thats what I did) And take out a city a turn. I like to surround UN headqauters and just destroy it over the about 7 turns. Let it repair. THEN SMASH IT AGAIN WOOOOOT

[Lehesu]

I like it when the ai really wants a truce. They will give you anything, research, money, just for a truce. So I accept and get the goods. And the next turn, I start bombing his cities to rubble again. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif

[Efrem Da King]

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif



Thats just plain dishonerable


I NEVER Brake a treaty or deal.


I also rarely make them http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif .

[Lehesu]

When you are playing as the Spartans, nothing is dishonorable (readies Planet Buster) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Fragony]

My biggest gripe with SMAC is (and you REALLY have to search for gripes) that there is no real counter system in the weapons department, except for the psi combat (armour is no issue there). When you research a new weapon the new weapon is just better, not just better for certain circumstances. I know that it involves other costs/building time etc, but it would be cool to have REALLY specialised troops. Oh if SMAC only got a sequal..... I would be all over it.

[Efrem Da King]

What do you buy??

Do you get a special ability?

If so what?

To go for full armour or build WAAAAY quicker and give missiles for long range bombardment. All those options. Its hardly newest dominates, cause the other army should have more.

[frogbeastegg]

Quote[/b] (Lehesu @ Feb. 28 2004,00:45)]I like it when the ai really wants a truce. They will give you anything, research, money, just for a truce. So I accept and get the goods. And the next turn, I start bombing his cities to rubble again. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif
If you do that too much your reputation will be ruined and no one will trust you

[Lehesu]

Quote[/b] (frogbeastegg @ Feb. 28 2004,04:55)]
Quote[/b] (Lehesu @ Feb. 28 2004,00:45)]I like it when the ai really wants a truce. They will give you anything, research, money, just for a truce. So I accept and get the goods. And the next turn, I start bombing his cities to rubble again. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif
If you do that too much your reputation will be ruined and no one will trust you
Not that that matters when you are planetary governor with 100+ votes and a stockpile of planet busters... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[Efrem Da King]

WHAT ARE PLANET BUSTERSS????? AND HOW DO I GET ONE

[Lehesu]

Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 28 2004,19:11)]WHAT ARE PLANET BUSTERSS????? AND HOW DO I GET ONE
Mail in 300 box tops plus shipping and handling to this address:

Morgan Industries Inc.
Morgan City, Planet
210 Greed Lane


Allow three to four days for delivery.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[Efrem Da King]

So only morganits can get em. BUT WHAT ARE THEY??

[Mount Suribachi]

Efram, they are SMACs nukes.

As for my best ever game

part 1

First of all a word about my playing style. I'm most definately a builder and I like to win by either transcendance or diplomacy. I like to tech up & keep small ground forces protected by a large air-force. Because of this getting to Doctrine: Air Power is one of my game priorities. Having needlejets when no-one else does is a *huge* advantage and if you can build Cloudbase Academy you assume a dominant position.

In my game I was the UN and Planet was divided into 2 large continents, North and South (henceforth NC & SC) The Hive very quickly wiped out the other 3 factions and assumed dominance of the North (don't they always). In the South was the UN, gaians & Spartans. The Spartans tried attacking me but I gave them a good kicking and they were left with 2 cities in the SE with tiny populations & signed a pact of submission. I was pact brothers with the Gaians and through tech sharing I rapidly climbed the tech ladder, soon leaving them behind. The had the Northern strip of SC and I had the rest and there was very little space left for me to expand into apart from a barren patch in the NE part of SC. On a little peninsula sticking out to the north there were just enough resources to justify establishing a city there which I did, leaving it slowly grow and pretty much forgetting about it.

Anyway one year I get a seismic event type message. Turns out that my little penisula had just become joined to the NC by the thinnest strip of land. My city was very isolated and there were no roads there yet so reinforcing the tiny garrison (which being a size 3 city had taken forever) would take forever. Then one day I suddenly notice Hive units coming down that thin strip of land from the North - an invasion force I say invasion force, it was the SMAC equivalent of the Golden Horde There were literally dozens & dozens of Hive units stacked into those few squares My tiny garrison would stand no chance and there was no hope of reinforcement. The UNAF was my only hope.

Operating at maximum range from my own & Gaian cities, my needlejets could just reach the advancing hive army. A crash production program of attach jets was ordered, but for now my small AF of about a dozen units would have to do. Round the clock bombing operations were ordered and turn after turn my planes poured death and destruction upon the Hive army. When my needlejets were down to 50% efficiency I would ground them for a turn for repair & replenishment and they were sorely missed whenever I did so. Several times my City came under bombardment as hive artillery came within range and once or twice advance Hive scouts got to the city borders but they were always beaten back by my Air Force in the nick of time.

It was my very own Battle of Britain, constantly hanging in the balance, would my few be enough to hold back the enemy hordes?



To be continued...

[Efrem Da King]

Have you armed your needle jets with chemicals?? That +50% attack is very usefull.

[Mount Suribachi]

I was the UN, and I don't do WMDs unless its against the aliens. I'm the good guy http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[Efrem Da King]

But the humanitarians are the evil group in my games. Brother lal is evil and must be killed.

[RisingSun]

My arch enemies were, and always will be, the Believers. It seems like they always just want to pick a fight with me. I remember my best game of SMAC ever was when I was stranded on one oblong continent with the Believers, and things finally erupted. I had a tech advantage, but they had air superiority and overwhelming numbers. And I mean OVERWHELMING. Lucky for me, my scientists discovered chemical warfare, and the Believing scum soon asphyxiated on the plains of the continent. Of course I was embargoed for about four hundred years or something like that, but it didn't matter. (I used gas every chance I could, even just on regular units) Then I got a healthy tech lead, made hovertanks and all sorts of frighteningly effective infantry and ships, and took their sea bases, followed by a pincer movement from my territory and several sea-borne invasions. Of course, the Hive decided they wanted to ally against me (along with pretty much everyone else) so my planet buster technicians finally got some target practice, if you catch my drift. Never di finish that game, though...

Where did you guys get the X-Pac??? I can never find it.

Efrem, anybody can get planet busters, and they are great. They totally wipe out a city, and any units in the squares around it. AND NOT JUST UNITS They turn the ACTUAL LAND into water. Can you imagine taking a tour? Yes, and over here is Lake Efrem, named after our glorious leader. *Boy raises hand* Yes? What used to be here before we came? Why, that's simple. UN Headquarters.

It takes a long time to build them until you get the better power plant technologies.

[Lehesu]

The X-Pack is no longer sold separately for pc, I believe. I got mine through the laptop pack, the only way it is now sold.

[Mysterium]

Quote[/b] (Lehesu @ Feb. 28 2004,20:46)]
Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Feb. 28 2004,19:11)]WHAT ARE PLANET BUSTERSS????? AND HOW DO I GET ONE
Mail in 300 box tops plus shipping and handling to this address:

Morgan Industries Inc.
Morgan City, Planet
210 Greed Lane


Allow three to four days for delivery.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif
That, sir, was really damn funny. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Efrem Da King]

Efrem, anybody can get planet busters, and they are great. They totally wipe out a city, and any units in the squares around it. AND NOT JUST UNITS They turn the ACTUAL LAND into water.



OMG OMG I WANT THEM I will have to load up the game to see if I can

[Mysterium]

Quote[/b] (Efrem Da King @ Mar. 01 2004,00:56)]OMG OMG I WANT THEM I will have to load up the game to see if I can
Oh dear, there goes Chiron. Nothing within 16-22 squares of his bases will every be safe again . . .

[Lehesu]

I have a strange desire for a picture of Brother Lal's face with a big old x over it, like in no-smoking signs. I would put that sucker in my sig in a heart beat. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Mount Suribachi]

Hey Lehusu, you should use the Faction Editor to create a Kikkoman faction http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[Lehesu]

Quote[/b] (Mount Suribachi @ Mar. 03 2004,01:59)]Hey Lehusu, you should use the Faction Editor to create a Kikkoman faction http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif
I could imagine a warhead for a new missile. We have fungal, tectonic, and planet buster. Why not soy?

[Mysterium]

Hey, Mr. Mount, I read the Forgotten Faction over at Apolyton, but I could only find volumes 1 and 2. It cut off right when the Caretakers were about to hire Morganites for building the subspace beacons, and the probe work was just getting interesting Am I missing it, or has it gone the Way of Most Fanfic and will never be finished?

[Kekvit Irae]

I absolutely love SMAC I got the expansion pack when it came out, and I love the fact you can create new factions from scratch, instead of just renaming your leader or faction name.
It also helped that I was a Civ player back when the original Civilization was being sold in stores.
Oh, and Colonization is sweet too. Civ for the exploration and conquest of the Americas.

My second favorite of the Civ games would be the CivII expansion pack, Fantastic Worlds (I think), which added new worlds, new techs, and a load of other stuff, including a sky world and an underworld (and Alpha Centauri for the normal game), and you could move units (which had the ability) between the worlds

EDIT: Correction, it was CivII: Test of Time, not CivII: Fantastic Worlds.

[ElmarkOFear]

Lehesu take if from an old Alpha Centauri veteran. The game is very difficult and you should get a strategy guide to fully learn and enjoy its many detailed decisions which lead to a good game. The AI is very tough. I played quite a bit of email and online games too. They take forever to play, but i had a few fanatical SMAC friends to play with on a regular basis. I was a killer University player.

If you want some tips let me know.

If you like turn-based war games, the best out there now is the Combat Mission games. Combat Mission Barbarossa and Combat Mission Afrika Corp are the best in the series. You can play it online, or PBEM. The AI is very tough too.

[Mount Suribachi]

Quote[/b] (Mysterium @ Mar. 26 2004,00:24)]Hey, Mr. Mount, I read the Forgotten Faction over at Apolyton, but I could only find volumes 1 and 2. It cut off right when the Caretakers were about to hire Morganites for building the subspace beacons, and the probe work was just getting interesting Am I missing it, or has it gone the Way of Most Fanfic and will never be finished?
Sadly, as far as I am aware, thats it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif I remember seeing a post where some of the Apolyton vets were trying to track down the author, to no avail http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif Its such a shame as what we have is sooo brilliant.

BTW, I read Joe. Brilliant Superb writing I felt it lost it just a little towards the end - I didn't find Lal very believable & it seemed a little rushed, but thats nitpicking because my expectation were so high because of the first 80% which was such brilliant writing. Real can't put it down stuff http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-book2.gif

[Mysterium]

Yah, the ending was a little of a let-down for me as well. Not because it wasn't good, but because it was only as good as what had gone before. All of the political machination in the UN in the end there? I felt like the story built it up and it didn't deliver. Sort of like a rocket launch where just the top pops off and nothing happens.

But man, can that woman write probe team missions. I mean, phew The thing where they stole his heard after breaking onto the mag-train was absolutely wonderful.

That's really too bad about the Forgotten Faction. Best writing of Progenitors I've seen. Makes me want to try my hand at some SMAC fiction again . . .

So, the Laptop Pack is the only place to get Crossfire now? I'm ashamed to say http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-embarassed.gif , I've actually never played the x-pansion pack. Which is riDICulous.

Kekvit, what's that about 3 worlds you were saying? Sounds kinda like the Cavewars thing (anyone ever play that?). I loved being able to build units *above* someone, then tunnel down and destroy them . . . mwaha.

[Kekvit Irae]

Quote[/b] (Mysterium @ Mar. 26 2004,14:50)]Kekvit, what's that about 3 worlds you were saying? Sounds kinda like the Cavewars thing (anyone ever play that?). I loved being able to build units *above* someone, then tunnel down and destroy them . . . mwaha.
http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/188899.asp