ELMO's LIST OF LEFT OUT'S IN RTW MP

[ElmarkOFear]

Well, here are a few of the big items which have been left out.

1. No logfiles. If they are there I can't find em.
2. Replays do not show any info. on mouse rollover, so you cannot tell who is who which makes replays useless.
3. No 4v4. 3v3 Max players. A big step backwards.
4. The restriction of one different faction for each player is back, like it was when MTW first came out. In a 3v3 no player can have the same faction as any of the others. Everyone has to pick a unique faction. At least it is this way in the custom battle feature. I am at work and haven't tested this online yet.
5. Sprites are so small they are hard to select. Camera views make this even worse. Will have to use "unrestricted camera" for Mp to be playable at all.
6. Found a bug in the group selection for macedonian pikemen: When grouped they will not obey any move or attack order: You have to select each unit individually. Not sure if this is intention though.
7. Games will not be quicker, they will last much, much longer, given the map size, the small sprites, the bad camera views, and the way units rout.
8. A lot of units do not appear to obey your commands. There is no "engage at will" command, so you have to keep a close eye out for any units standing around.
9. The AI is really stupid in the fact that it will chase a unit all the way off map and get exhausted, instead of turning the flank when it has the chance. In MTW the AI seemed to know how to flank. Might just be me though.


This is only from playing about 10 minutes worth of single player custom battles vs. the AI.

[spacecadet]

Have they included the classic user interface option - does it actually work like classic TW controls? Should i be cancelling my order from amazon now? Maybe one of those other battle sims coming out will be good..... :oops:

[Orda Khan]

3v3 or 4v4 max...ok so we need confirmation of this.
One player one faction...OH MY LIFE!!!!!!!!! Please tell me this is not so. How lame can you get? Talk about going backwards. If it was patched out of MTW why would they reintroduce it with RTW? This has to go and fast otherwise MP really will be dead. For one....faction v faction battles ( IMO ) looked more realistic and were more enjoyable but most importantly you could find yourself waiting in a game for ages, waiting for a person who don't mind playing as [ insert faction ]
Nobody yet has mentioned the unit run and kill speeds.....Are they still absurd?

Man I'm so disappointed at the moment. I'm at that stage where it's only days until I get my preordered copy and I'm trying desperately to convince myself not to cancel it

With all these reoccuring issues and the introduced new ones, I'm fast running out of 'pro' arguments

.....Orda

p.s. ... Go on then, add the final straw and tell me that all three Roman factions are available :furious3: :wall:

[CBR]

AFAIK all 21 factions are available in MP so that would mean all 3 Roman factions are there too.

Yes it really does feel like we are back to MTW 1.0 days. 4 years of development and MP still feels rushed with things missing..

I havent ordered the game yet and right now Im very disappointed.. 1 1/2 years of hype for nothing it seems.


CBR

[CBR]

I got the unit file last night and there is nothing about movement rates there. Dont know if its hidden in some other file..


CBR

[Aelwyn]

I was in my one and only online game last night with Elmo and some others.

I have to work so I'll keep this short....

Worst online gaming experience I've ever had. I'm going to play a few times more, and if it doesn't get better, I'm returning the game.

[UglyandHasty]

was the 3vs3 laggy ????

[ElmarkOFear]

Here is what you can expect from MP. You can decide for yourself if you think it is an improvement or not:

This is the first thing you see when you join the MP lobby: Notice where my cursor is: This is the only information you are given about the game settings. There is no more available info available to players joining a game.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Rome_game_lobby_001.sized.jpg



Here is the hosting screen: Notice there is only 6 player max for MP.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_1.sized.jpg



Here is the second hosting screen: Wonder what Scored Resolution is? It is not mentioned in the manual nor in the Prima Guide.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_2_part_1.sized.jpg



Here is a second picture of the 2nd hosting screen: The time limit minimum is 15 minutes. Not as bad as allowing for 2 minute games, but a time limit of 15 minutes for a 3v3 is probably very short.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_2_part_2.sized.jpg



Here is another hosting screen shot: Notice my cursor. You are limited to these denari levels. No more.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_3.sized.jpg



Here is a shot showing Legions Death having network problems joining my game. The game locked up. I could not kick him, and he could not connect. I had to go all the way back to the beginning and start over.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_3_network_problem.sized.jpg



Second shot showing Ice Shatter leaving the game. Only notification of this is found at the bottom chat area. The game locked up and I could not launch. Had to back all the way to the beginning again and start over.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Armyselectionscreen_1.sized.jpg



Another screenshot of the army selection process: Notice how the game allows you to overspend without stopping you. By the time you figure out what the problem is 3 minutes have passed. You then must back out your values until you are in the positive. Really makes since doesn't it?

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Armyselectionscreen_2.jpg



One last shot of Legions and how the game locked up due to network problems. Not his fault, but the game's.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Another_network_problem.sized.jpg

Also, there is no #ignore command no #ban command. There is a "Kick" button for the host, but it did not work when I tried to bump Legions out of the game, since he was having problems connecting to me.

This is what you have to look forward to for the next 1 to 2 years. I will not be around to suffer thru it. Hope this helps you decide on your purchasing decision. Single player is probably good, but MP is lacking much. You cannot play same faction as anybody else in the game. There IS only 3v3 no more. There is no Classic Interface mode. There is no more than what you see here.

[Crazed Rabbit]

This is what you have to look forward to for the next 1 to 2 years. I will not be around to suffer thru it. Hope this helps you decide on your purchasing decision. Single player is probably good, but MP is lacking much. You cannot play same faction as anybody else in the game. There IS only 3v3 no more. There is no Classic Interface mode. There is no more than what you see here.


Woe unto us. Years of development, all for this. It seems the only thing they improved were the graphics and strat map....and the digital cities look bad. One step foward, five backwards.

Well, I for one am definately not buying the game as it is.

Thanks for your detailed report Elmo.

Crazed Rabbit

[CBR]

This looks basically like MP is an open beta...we just dont have any idea how much will be fixed/added in a patch.

This is a disgrace!


CBR

[ElmarkOFear]

It is obvious, as with MTW, the multiplayer was tacked on during the very last day before release. I am going back to STW and MTW and wait until some other game comes out which might be fun to play MP. :(

If you look closely, nothing has been done to make this game more moddable, nor more easily moddable. All the things wrong with the game: speed, grouped units not taking commands, and lack of game features/options cannot be modded. These are things you will have to live with and try to make the best of if you decide to stay with RTW.

[UglyandHasty]

Elmo were the 3vs3 laggy at all ???

[CBR]

Some comments and questions regarding screenshots.

As far as I can see there is no era to select from. If modding can be done it will go back to MTW 1.1 days where you had to swap stats/eras before you could play mods.

http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Hosting_screen_3.sized.jpg

Whats the "teams" icons on right of player/cpu list?


http://imcintosh.com/ugly/albums/Rome-Victorys-and-Defeats/Armyselectionscreen_2.jpg

Whats the "Armies" icons on right upper corner?

How many upgrades max can you buy? Like max valor 3?

Is there a unit limit like in MTW of max 4 each?


CBR

[RTKLamorak]

:<

Man i really thought they would concentrate more on MP than they did with MTW, ive been telling myself that for the last year since i stopped playing VI.

From ppl's comments in this thread i am not filled with any confidence at all :S


and omfg @ 3v3 max!??!?!?!!?!??!?!?!?!?!??!

[t1master]

the teams icon are selectable roman numerals... you can have up to six teams it seems... so 2v2v2 appears poossible.

the armies icon on the next phase looks like the armies that your opponents took...

i agree with cbr, at best we've been given a beta of mp that doesn't look like anythings been done with it...

[ElmarkOFear]

CBR the armies icon is for those CPU players that the host has to pick armies for. It also has the other players faction ICON too. You click on the icon and pick the CPU armies or have the game pick a random army for them. This is where you wait for the game to launch as well and there is NO WAY to tell who hasn't chosen their armies yet.

[ElmarkOFear]

CBR: The team's icons are Roman Numeraled from I to VIII oddly enough. Since there is only up to 6 players in a game max., it makes me wonder if they took out the 4v4 at the last minute. Either way a really shoddy job and it shows us, once again, the lack of respect they have for the MP side of TW.

[ElmarkOFear]

CBR: Upgrades go to max 4 Experience (Valour/honor)
Max 3 wep and Max 3 arm. Same as in MTW. However units are very expensive and you are locked into those Denari levels you see in the one screenshot where my cursor listed them. I didn't stick around long enough to test out the max 4 cost penalty. Sorry. I could barely stand to take these screenshots without sending a nasty letter to CA. :) I will, however, see if the penalty is there in the Custom Battle mode. I am off to work now, but will let you know as soon as I get a chance to test it on my laptop at work and post here.

[CBR]

Yes I have gone through the unit list and it seems even at 10k you can easily spend it all on units only.

From what Agravain said in a Net thread it does seem like it was a last minute change:


Here's what's in the readme file on the game CD.

"Multiplayer Team Limit
The final paragraph on page 72 of the Rome: Total War manual refers to the maximum number of teams available in Multiplayer battles, stating: “There can be up to eight teams”. Multiplayer options have been altered in the final release of the game, so now the maximum number of teams / players is six (I through VI in Roman Numerals)."


CBR

[CBR]

A couple of threads on .com

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotalwarfrm7.showMessage?topicID=7847.topic

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotalwarfrm7.showMessage?topicID=7771.topic

Last one not related to MP but just adds to stuff suddenly gone in RTW.


CBR

[Puzz3D]

I don't get it. Features in multiplayer proven to be good over the last 4 years have been discarded? The series seems to be passing from a serious online game to something you play for laughs. You couldn't possibly make rulings on disputed tourney battles without logfiles and replays with mouseover info. If RTW multiplayer has been released in an unfinished state, CA is responsible of negligence in causing countless hours of frustration to people who buy their game in good faith that multiplayer is evolving in a positive way from previous games in the series. Is CA's commitment to multiplayer only to sell a few more copies because it says multiplayer battles on the box? I know in MTW that CA did try to improve multiplayer after the initial release, in a patch, in the add-on and in a later patch to the add-on, but there is clearly someone or several people in high positions of influence that don't place much value on MP gameplay.

[d6veteran]

5. Sprites are so small they are hard to select. Camera views make this even worse. Will have to use "unrestricted camera" for Mp to be playable at all.
7. Games will not be quicker, they will last much, much longer, given the map size, the small sprites, the bad camera views, and the way units rout.


I can live with everything else, but these two really really detract from the game.


We all want restricted camera, but restricted camera is unbearable towards the end of the game when you have 5 men standing around but cannot route them. So you are basically out of the game but cannot watch the rest of the action.

Also don't play on any hills maps. The camera angle will not angle upwards so if you are on the slope of a hill point you cannot see ahead of you.

[Soulflame]

I haven't played any MTW multiplayet (yet).. since I only have it for about 2 months and am still enjoying the normal campaign.

But I certainly was planning on playing Rome MP... but it looks like I'm going to be really disappointed with it.

The problem is also; I don't see why they released it with all those negatives still attached. Surely after 4 years, another month wouldn't be a problem? Moreover since I don't see any rival game within the next month nor is it close to the holiday or summer seasons (which would make at least a little bit sense to put the game out a bit early and then patch it).

As dedicated as CA is, and they surely must remember past mistakes, why would the game be unfinished here?

It will probably be a mystery forever, because admitting mistakes can damage CA, which isn't a very good business decision. It also can't put the blame on the publisher, in fear of the relationship they have with Activision. Let's hope that CA, despite of the mystery, will come with some patch fixes soon.

[tootee]

hmm... RTW MP is all i'm interested in.. maybe I should cancel my 2 copy booking. :shame:

thanks for the updates.. hope to see more good news though. :bow:

[Skomatth]

I'm planning on waiting a month or so till there is more word (beside the fact I don't have my new comp. yet).

[Voigtkampf]

This all so very disappointing… :no:

I have never been into online gaming much because of my bad Internet connections back then, but that has changed somewhat in the past two years, and I missed the S:TW and M:TW MP playing days. It seemed stupid to me to go to M:TW online playing with Rome some six months ahead of me.

Now, all I hear about the MP aspect is not comforting. 3vs3 limitation, connecting problems, et cetera et cetera… I am not amused, as the British might say. While all the “historical inaccuracies” of the SP world couldn’t bother me much, the Bull warrior’s horns and alike, the complaints I read here from the people are much more unsettling to me and I am, as of now, for the first time truly concerned about the overall quality of the Rome game.

What is the answer? Well, like BF 1942 for instance, a good set of patches was required to make the barely playable game into on of the most favorite online FPS games. But was this necessary for Rome? And how long must we wait until the MP is being helped up to its feet?

I am so discomforted as of this moment...

[RTKLamorak]

you are right about BF1942 m8, but... CA has pretty much the worst patch policy in the industry from my experience over the last 4 years. Id be amazed if anything more than a basic SP bug fixing patch came out within the first 6 months, with maybe 1 to two of the less serious MP problems being solved.

:wall:
:wall:
:wall:
:wall:

[Soulflame]

Don't put it all on CA, I was informed it was Activisions decision not to release patches and that CA even spent some of their own time on it (as in not fully paid). Don't know if it's true, but looking at how CA is present on these forums and are pretty helpfull, I'm inclined to believe it.
Still, it doesn't change the situation much...

[Shahed]

Thanks for the update Elmo. You saved me a lot of time...no RTW MP for me. :)

[Aelwyn]

Yeah, it really looks like I'm bringing my copy back. I have about 3 more days to decide. But I buy these games strictly for the MP. Why would they neglect it so much? Why should I even bother buying anything else from Activision or CA? The SP campaign is slightly fun, but I'd rather have the $50 than 10 or so hours I'll play it.

[Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe]

Ok, there are some couple of issues associated with gamespy, or with game features like the number of player. No logfile, I can live with. 1 faction limit is dumb for sure, but it's not a big deal to fix (and next, we can mod extra 'mirror' faction, can we?) and Ca might even patch it.

But at least, do the battles play good? Are they fun and interesting to fight? Is it a rush game? A slow manoeuver game? How are different kind of units behaving?

Would someone be kind enough to post screenshot of RTW MP battles explaining a bit how things happen?

Louis,

[Dimeola]

Have only been able to get into a few as the server is flooded and they are limiting to 30 players. MP lag somewhat fixes the speed issue. MP firstly look incredible!!! Units handle just fine. They can patch/mod the faction problem. I enjoyed MP.....and being able to field Spartans, macedonian Phalanx, Legionairres.....gotta play.
D

[d6veteran]

The SP campaign is slightly fun, but I'd rather have the $50 than 10 or so hours I'll play it.

You can't complete even the short campaign in 10 hours. FYI: the depth they have added in the single player game is epic.

There is still hope for the multiplayer.

[d6veteran]

But at least, do the battles play good? Are they fun and interesting to fight? Is it a rush game? A slow manoeuver game? How are different kind of units behaving?



I think once you get past the connection issues the battles are fun to play!

[Shahed]

LOL ! D6 sounds just like me...about 2 years ago. Which clan are you in D6 ?

[d6veteran]

LOL ! D6 sounds just like me...about 2 years ago. Which clan are you in D6 ?

My clan is 1RD (1st Red Devils). We started out as a CoD clan but we are branching off into other games we like. We played the heck out of MTW online. I played STW online but sans clan.

If you want to hook up sometime we use TeamSpeak to talk and coordinate while we play.

www.1rd.org.

Go to Total War forum for details.

[d6veteran]

Here's a great summary of what is *missing* from the RTW multiplayer:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotalwarfrm11.showMessage?topicID=245.topic

[ElmarkOFear]

Yup D6, I agree. That post was well thought out, and well written and didn't overly rant (except maybe near the end.) Just how discussions need to be held.

[Shahed]

My clan is 1RD (1st Red Devils). We started out as a CoD clan but we are branching off into other games we like. We played the heck out of MTW online. I played STW online but sans clan.

If you want to hook up sometime we use TeamSpeak to talk and coordinate while we play.

www.1rd.org.

Go to Total War forum for details.


Hey thanks for the reply. Yeah, sounds good...bit short on time but would like to hook up. I'm afraid I'll give RTW MP a miss till it's more stable. I don't have that kind of time, but yeah i'd still like to sign into your TS and chat sometime.

Do you guys play America's Army ? The link to the squad i'm in is in my profile. We have a 3 Teamspeak servers (1 main, and two backups) running 24/7. Most of us are pretty busy with life at the moment but please feel invited to join our forum or our TS at any time.

Salute !

[Jango Fett]

yes please do! visit the legion forum and visit our teamspeak.

[FearZeus]

FearZeus's list

1) logging on is a multiplayers nightmare
2) chat lobby has gone backwards
3) multiplayer games lagg
4) units when viewed from max height looks bad, can't tell what each units are? the yellow arrows look terrible
5) commands are delayed (maybe this should come under lagg but it seems to be a delay aswell)
6) deployment is a pain, moving army in formation seems impossible now
7) chat in game is no good at all and looks bad, what good is it hitting 2 buttons to give a quick command to an allie when in the heat of battle! as aposed to one button in MTW

I could go on but this is a quick post as i'm going shopping atm, but generally I feel RTW has gone backwards, to say i'm disapointed is an understatement. Sadly i'm now leaving RTW but will keep an eye on the forums.