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View Full Version : "noobs" vs vets, happy vs disgruntled



1dread1lahll
10-01-2004, 17:33
First, before I get a bomb blast of angry protests from single players, this is a post for mutli-players. If you are a single player, as you post at least say so, so multi players can 'credit' you properly...
Ive noticed a vast array of differences if openion in the game; some hate it some love it....Its easy to see its the multi-player vets that are disatisified. And those who are pleased are the with the results are those who are rather only superfically involved with the game. The "vets" are the ones that spent a year or more discovering the undocumented game command/control features in STW/MTW, and thus I understand their displeasue as they discover these features gone in RTW. The superficially involved knew not the existance of these features, thus have no cause to be dissatisifed. When STW can out it was the greastest achievement in a tactical war game ever created. The ability to control an army or its units was the most complete, and most realistic ever created. Brilliant looking it was not, brilliant campain it was not......while MTW introduced problems it was a big improvement in all the realism of the battle mode. The campain and graphics improved but there were still better options out in the gaming world if one wanted graphics or campains. One can conclude then that to the "hard-core" 'die-hard" fans (Multi) battle realism in the form of commands/controls is what was the motivating factor in owning the game. Graphics and campain game experience less important.
Yet in the world of game makers the driving force is not battle command/control, but rather graphics. Reguardless of the game type better than 90% plus of users are only superficially involved in the game and 90% plus of them demand graphics to be #1. Thus while STW/MTW had battle C&C in position #1 of importance it has now dropped to #3. The 90% plus who were unaware of the extent of the C&C cant be displeased at its loss. Its the "hard-core" people who put C&C above graphics who have lost out.
The really sad thing is I really dont see why the C&C features were left out. My only thought is that the game, being built from a new engine was time consuming, and time ran out on the developers. With the fantastic graphics finished (and #1 in importance) the C&C (in spot #3) may have bee considered "good enough".

Gregoshi
10-01-2004, 20:11
lahll, can you give specific examples of the C&C defficiencies in RTW compared to STW/MTW? What kinds of things could you do in the previous games that you can't do in RTW? I don't mean to sound thick skulled, it is just that so many issues have been discussed about RTW, it all starts blurring together. Thanks.

Puzz3D
10-01-2004, 20:45
I took over a month off from MTW before RTW was released just so I could start RTW with a fresher outlook. I didn't expect the gameplay to be the same as MTW. I expected some or even a lot of imbalance in the units just due to the way upgrades work. I expected the interface to be different, but I didn't expect mastery of the interface to be the deciding factor in battles. I didn't expect units to move so quickly that they look silly. I thought CA had more of a commitment to realism than to treat unit speed as an arbitrary variable. With the accelerated speed of the game and the greater number of units to be controlled, the interface more than ever stands between the player and the execution of the tactics. Ideally, the interface should vanish as an impediment to making your moves. Right now that seems unattainable to me with this game unless things are slowed down, and I'm not motivated to become an interface master anyway because it's an arbitrary contrivance. Given the other problems such as divergence of battles and the multiplayer lobby, it's actually a pretty easy decision not to play multiplayer at all. Creative Assembly are the ones who set the standard of play in multiplayer with original STW, but with each game it's beginning to look like STW was to some extent a serendipitous phenomenon.

1dread1lahll
10-01-2004, 23:54
The interface, such as being able to task mulitply orders (go from loose formation to close while charging) and the abilty to have units in multiple groups, or 'groups with-in groups' such as archers in G1, foot meele in G2 cav in G3 and all of them in G4 (only an example) may-be I should have said 'interface' instead of 'command/control'...and I dont meen 'noobs' litterly, I was just easyer than saying superficially or moderitally involved over and over.

ElmarkOFear
10-02-2004, 01:24
Easier to spell too Lahll! LOL I had a unit of armored elephants chase down (from behind) 3 fresh units of heavy cav. I never knew ancient elephants could run that fast. :)

Pitt_Slayer
10-02-2004, 09:48
well i think RTW is a Mix of age of empire's and lord of the ring's

a 12 or 13 year old walks into his or her local game shop and WILL look at the screenshot's!!! on the back of computer game case.

choice:

(1) screenshots from stw\mtw
(2) screenshots from RTW or lord of the ring's or some other total pointless game.

which one do you think they will buy?????
lets say they buy stw or mtw as its per sept 2004.

hmm i'm a 12 year old, this game called stw\mtw is to hard to understand!!!
every time i play online some bully with a clan tag, beats me with-in 2 mins, then he calls me a noob, and my aillie's moan that i charged him in a 4vs4 and after that game "no one will battle with me now" this game isnt fun :hide:

i'll play age of empires or lord of the ring's as its easy to win ~D
and when i go to school i'll boast to all my pals "that i won lastnight" playing age of empires and my pals will go out and BUY age of empire's ~D
coz i lost at TW every time i played and everyone was nasty to me
"i'll tell my pals its a crap game"

every newbie you and other's trash, then insult is probably lossing CA 4 or 5 sale's at least.
don't take-it to heart or think i'm trying to insult you as i'm not!!!
i've battled with you many a time and your a good player and have a lot more ability and gamemanship then many of the so called vet's and at least you battled me under your real name unlike many others (no names said here)
so i totally respect you.
but do you get my point???

CA arent silly their looking for max game sale's!!!!
that's way many thing's have changed!!!!
i posted warnings about trashing newbies before and others have too BUT the stw vets have their heads so far up their own B*Ms they couldnt see this coming.....
peeps want to enjoy a computer game they don't want to be trash then insulted about it also.

i've battled many a newbie and realize they were new, i relaxed a little and tryed to get them interested,
(hehe was starting up a clan at the time)

i know maybe nearly 100 peeps who are very good players now BUT when i battled them at first "they were noobs" even tho i havent been on mtw for age's i know that they'll say hi to me and class me as a good friend if i get back into MP with RTW

we where all noobs to start with!!! so lets not forget that

ElmarkOFear
10-02-2004, 14:10
Hey Pitt! I consider myself a professional noob. Unlike all those amateur noobs (who are now veterans), I continue to make the same mistakes and refuse to learn how to get any better. :) Takes a lot of hard work to maintain this level of noobishness.

Pitt_Slayer
10-02-2004, 17:14
hehe lmao thank you elmark ~D
it's refreshing to see you being professional about status ~D i'm just a semi-pro noob!! ~:cheers:
but hopefully i'll become pro noob very shortly

(if i ever get log-in RTW) :furious3:

ichi
10-02-2004, 21:17
Hey Pitt! I consider myself a professional noob. Unlike all those amateur noobs (who are now veterans), I continue to make the same mistakes and refuse to learn how to get any better. :) Takes a lot of hard work to maintain this level of noobishness.

Haha Elmo

I don't even have to work hard at maintaining my noobyness, I'm a natural!!!!

ichi

ElmarkOFear
10-03-2004, 00:46
LOL Ichi. Yes, but my men have the only Gaming Shoe contract in the online world. They run so fast they have their own Nike label called the Elmarko's. Michael Jordan is jealous too! :)

1dread1lahll
10-03-2004, 03:59
Pitt,...you hit the nail on the head.....most game buyers want a nice looking game, want to win at it, and dont want to spend the time discovering a bewildering array of features to become a consistant victor. Thus a game like 'coin toss'; no skill needed and you win 50% of the time right from the start, becomes the popular choice. Of course you never win more than 50% no matter how long or how hard you try. thus such a game does not develop a following because you cant become a consistant winner. And a game series that switiches from the first (STW style) format to the 'coin toss' format is likly to be a disappointment to thos fans that spent the time discovering features. But the marketing people dont care if the game is installed on your PC for 3 years (like STW) or a few weeks (like many of the games in my beer coaster collection), the money they get is the same. How-ever the foulness of people in multi-player is not limited to vets or skilled players, but Ive found that it infects people of all skill levels, ages, in 'clans' or not.

Oh yes, I like the new look to the room.....

Pitt_Slayer
10-03-2004, 07:35
you put it alot better then i could :bow:
well said lahll ~:cheers:

like the new look too ~D

Duke John
10-03-2004, 13:42
At the back of the box, below the 3 small screenshots:

Easily manage vast cities and gigantic battles with the aid of advisors, auto managing tools and pick-up-and-play controls.

Forge an empire on the revolutionary 3D campaign map with an intuitive display of your cities and armies.

Command unique units, from Carthaginian elephants and Scythed war chariots to Roman war dogs, using intuitive controls.

I think they wanted to make something clear...