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frogbeastegg
10-04-2004, 17:23
This faction must be unlocked with game editing before you can play.

Red Harvest
10-08-2004, 19:54
This one is tough! I think I have it figured out on try #3 (very hard/very hard.) I had to drop my "no bribery" policy...after two failed attempts.

The fun part of playing Spain is that diplomacy really works and you need to be very good at it, you don't have money, you don't have armies, and you don't have much in the way of structures to build any cav or real infantry to start.

1. Key to money on the first move: disband all of those useless town militia units. This is worth 400 denarii per turn and increases population (unlike Rome, you NEED some population to get going.) This was the key to getting an economy and to upgrading towns sooner.

2. Build the money makers first! Build a mine, build traders, build low level ag, and build ports and roads. Spend as little as possible on units. Use max taxes.

3. The easy part is to ally with both Gaul and Carthage ASAP. Get trade rights.

4. Osca is both a great province, and your Achilles heel. The Julii will land there, intent on taking it. The Gauls will saunter by and attack if it is weak. You can hold it. It is the linchpin to surviving the early game. Send cav from Scallabis to Osca, avoid fighting along the way. Send the good infantry from Asturica to Osca. Buy mercs in Osca. Highest priority are Balearic slingers, buy them whenever you see them. Next up is the pila bearing infantry (you won't be able to build Scutarii for a very long time, these guys will have to do.) If you manage your economy well you can buy the best unit available every turn or two, else the Julii will buy them and attack you with them (yes, this happened to me in campaign #1.)

5. Build a couple of diplomats, don't build any other units early on. (Skirmishers and town militia don't hold up on the field and you can't afford their upkeep)

6. Bribe away brigands when you can! This is a credible method of maintaining peace without risking disaster, pay off the warlords. It is not really cheesy because it takes so much of your limited profit to do so and it is historically sensible. Some can't be bribed. However, they will stand and wait for you to build up an army that will kill them (and it can take while since some have two or three units of Balearics, plus a heavy cav leader.)

7. Dealing with the Julii in Osca. Don't attack them! Once you get enough cav and mercs in Osca you can whip them on the field so wait for them to attack. If you attack you will be at war with all of Rome, and Gaul will probably attack you as well. However, you might be able to bribe some of the Romans to go away. I did that with a few small Roman armies. Later they will land some unbribable armies and attack Osca, you should be able to kill them. (If you've bought up the mercs, the Julii expeditionary force won't be as strong as yours.) Now the key is on the same turn as you repulse them: hunt down a Julii army or diplomat with your own diplomat(s). They will take a ceasefire. Arrange trade. Result: you will not be at war with any of the Romans and you get a breather However, they will keep coming back.

8. Corduba/Cordoba. Unfortunately, Cordoba is rich and Carthage is getting kicked around everywhere, so you should take Cordoba when you have taken care of the early threats in Osca. As soon as I could build sufficient force I seiged and captured it. I enslaved rather than exterminated since I needed the population and I was having no trouble with loyalty. Taking Cordoba is worth about 2000 denarii per turn! The bad news is Gaul will break its alliance and won't trust you anymore... Note: I prepared for the Cordoba invasion by building cav stables, and experience shrines and blacksmith in Scallabis.

9. Send a diplomat to Numidia and arrange trade rights and alliance if you can. I built one ship in Cordoba to send him across. I also will march him to what is left of Carthage to arrange a ceasefire.

10. I am preparing to take Numantia from the Gauls. Haven't done it yet, and they have a full stack floating about... I've got a comfortable position built, and Gaul is in my cross hairs. :duel:

Tzar Kaloyan
10-16-2004, 04:11
Your post inspired me to take this faction! Taking up a challange was what I was looking for in my now previous campaign for the Dacians. Turns out it wasn't much of challange as there was just too much breathing room for the Dacians to expand quickly and get really dangerous. So, Spain it is on vhard/vhard.

Frankly, I expected a dire troop situation, but Spain starts with 2 decent armies. Merge these into one and you have an awesome army at start!

Your peninsula is like a bottle -- put an army up in Osca or ambushing in the passage, and you have secured your area, save from the sea invasions.

Furthermore, you only have 2 basic immediate challangers -- Gauls and Carthage. You have to take both their cities, but should do it in steps.

Carthage views itself as a world power, like the Romans, which makes them arrogant. That means that you should forget to extract large sums of money from them. In addition, they should get really busy elsewhere and probably won't have enough resources to reinforce their armies. Thus, the theory is that if you smash them before they get a chance to grow their presence on the peninsula, you won't be challanged too much by them. What I did was to send a diplomat to their ambushing army (he reaches it on the 2nd turn) and extract an alliance, trade rights and map information for a 2-turn tribute of 2,850 per turn. This gives me enough time to bring my Northern army (I left my old faction leader by himself to guard the town) and merge it with my Southern army, before paying a visit to my new ... 'allies.' ~;)

Gauls are really not interested in a war with you, at least not from what I have seen. Their first action is to take their troops out of the peninsula, probably to support the war against the Britons! Although their town lies smack in the middle of your area and from both strategical and tactical standpoint should be your first conquest, I would advise you leave it for after you have dealt with Carthage. In contrast to Carthage, the Gauls immediately accepted my proposal for an alliance, trade rights and map information and coughed up 2-turn tribute of 5,000 without any haggling! Like Arnold, I kill the people I like last! ~D

The diplomatic haggling should bring you some early money. Your first priority is to build roads, followed by economic buildings. Disbanding units is not always recommendable, although I would partially agree with you in this case -- getting rid of one of the two townwatch units in each of the cities allows you to continue maintaining order even at highest tax rates. Begin to gear up your army production in Osca -- it's where the fighting is going to be!

Well, this is just my assessment of looking at the map and playing for 4 turns. In theory it looks so wonderfully simple and straight forward. Now I need to get back to my campaign and start executing! Good fighting to you soldier, hope my rambling helped you. ~:cheers:

Tzar Kaloyan
10-16-2004, 07:19
Mdaaa, now I see what you meant about the Romans in Osca. The way to go is to send your armies there on turn one and wait for the Julii. They will come.

Looks like playing for the Spanish successfully is a third-try-can-succeed deal. My first two attempts were shortlived. Although the peninsula is fairly protected, the Julii keep disembarking next to Osca -- never seen such determined buggers!

The success of this third campaign so far rests on three things:

1) Single-mindedness. Everything is done to support the effort of defending Osca from Julii. An alliance was signed (and honored so far) with Carthage and although the Gauls refused an alliance, nothing was done to offend them (yes, that means no traspassing through their land)

2) Bribing. This was already discussed in the previous posts above -- I merely modified the strategy a bit. Since I did not want to anger the Gauls and open another front (my undoing in the second campaign), I had to raise an army on the East Coast exclusively. The best way to do it? Bribe the rebels!

Some of you, and I was in that camp before, look at the rebels as a punching bag to train your generals. Instead, as the Spanish, you should look at them as a very, and I can't emphacise enough the word VERY, cheap source of army units. Let's do a simple math: let's say you want to recruit 4 units of mercenaries -- cavalry, 2 infantry and a slinger. The cavalry will cost you ~850, the infantry -- ~750-800 each, and the slinger will be another 750. The total will be ~3,100. But my diplomat successfully bought out 2 such rebel armies for ~1,100 each! That is an ~80% discount! In fact I felt in such love with bribing, that I bought myself the Carthagenian army (the captain that guards the passage) for ~1,200!

3) Seal your key passages with strong rebel armies! Here is how you can execute this strategy (real example). A rebel army appeared just north of Osca. It had 5 strong units. In the city was my army of about 20 units with a 7-star general. My army attacked the rebels from the south. The rebels retreated further north towards the passage. I waited a turn (because if you do it the same turn you will actually fight them) and then repeated. The rebels retreated again, going up and into the passage. I left them alone and for 5 turns now, not a single Gaul army has come from there. And when I will need additional troops, I will send my diplomat to buy this army.

You can do the same with bridges and other key choke points that are not important as trade routes.

As for fighting the Romans, note that none of your early troops, even when lead by an experienced general, will stand toe-to-toe with the Roman troops (anything above a town watch). They will turn and run. It is utterly important to flank with another unit to give your frontal unit some breathing space. And remember -- the proper place for all this cavalry is charging from behind (or as bait to pull aside enemy units).

A good strategy against the Romans (and their mostly sword infantry units) is to use a strong first line of missile units -- slingers work best, backed by a second line (naked fanatics or iberian infantry) that can stop a charge if needed, but won't do much fighting otherwise. I then use about 6 round-shield cavalry units (3 on each flank) to flank the enemy and pursue. The idea is to advance within a shooting distance and start shooting. The Romans will either just stand there (thank the AI for this) or will attack you. In case of attack, give them a nice warcry from your second line -- that will slow them or stop them, giving your first line some more time to shoot. Once the Romans engage your infantry line, flank with cavalry. With a good general on your side, the Romans will route fairly quickly.

There are some variations you need to use depending on the Roman army you face. If the Romans have a lot of Velites, a shooting match will result in high casulties for you as well if you have similar missile units. In this case, charge with your cavalry, have the infantry run behind them, then pull the cavalry and let the infantry melee them. Run your cavalry around and hit their sides. Don't use your skirmishers UNLESS things are tight -- casulties from friendly fire can be fairly significant.

Another variation is when you face Roman family members and their cavalry. Those guys can kill an awful lot of your swordsmen and the AI just LOVES to charge with them. In such cases, I use a unit of Barbarian mercenaries to guard my center, while my cavalry protects my flanks. When the AI charges, I counterattack and in 90% of the cases manage to kill their general even before their infantry has reached my line.

As far as fighting the Gauls, cut their warbands with your iberians or naked fanatics, but above all USE the wardogs! A warband that has already engaged the dogs will route if another unit charges it.

Now, soldier, take the Spaniards on vhard/vhard and if you DON'T win the game with them, then ... just repeat the reading! ~D

I keep learning from my campaign and editing my post. One good way of attacking a strong enemy, in addition to bringing a strong army ~D , is to end your turn on a bridge. Once you start expanding north into Gaul territory, you will be well-advised to follow this strategy -- the Gauls are powerful (at least in my game) and they have full-stack armies in the south. By stopping on a bridge, you always ensure that if attacked, you will defend the bridge. It is much easier to stop a number of chosen soldiers at the bridge, then to face them out in the open!

Maltz
11-06-2004, 10:30
I just tried a Vh/Vh campaign as the Spain for only about 5 years. I have gained 4 settlements (Carthage's Croduba + 3 of Gaul) and has a healthy income of 5000+/turn. I hope my experiences would be useful to you:

1) Spain is very poor at the beginning, so I didn't build any more unit except garrison peasants.

There are only 2 factions who will buy your map for about 2.5k each (in Vh, I am not sure in other settings). I have not exterminated a single town because I wish to keep the population and let them pay more taxes in the long run. So far 70% of my income is tax, then some trade and mining.

Once your diplomat travels far enough to sell maps to the Romans (4 chances in total), and meet other diplomats from all over the world, the poverty is officially over. Feel free to bribe all captains you see.

2) I separated my starting army into 2 groups, led by the 2 best generals (btw, the starting clan leader died in 3 turns). Spanish has great starting generals.

The first group took the Gaul settlement, the 2nd took the Carthage settlement. The AI usually sends out some captain-led army to look around, so it is easy to storm the castle. I sent my starting diplomat to bribe the Carthage army - free slinger and cavalry right away!

3) Many players mentioned that the starting army of Spain is poor. I think they are not that bad because their starting generals are really awesome. The round shield cavalry is good enough for a lot of purpose, while the skirmishers can be treated as regular food soldiers. Slingers kill a lot of warband in sieges.

So far only one battle was hard. The hard battle comes from Roman! The Julii soon landed a 8-unit army led by a 3-star family member, but after a bloody struggle ended up in a cross-sword close to my town. I gained 3 retinues in that single battle! The Julii just landed their 2nd army, but were 3 miserables hastati. Also, it is beside my new town. I am already quite happy that they no longer bother invading my starting pennisula.

4) Expansion is slow and rather linear, because there is really only 1 general directions to go: towards the European mainland. Thus the Spanish campaign is not really complicated. There is nothing very outragerous to try early on, so there is no crazy territorial gain. :embarassed:

5) Barbarians' settlements are good to "occupy" because there is no cultural penalty. However, barbarian lands are poor and always have economic hardship for the lack of ports. Taking 20 babarian towns (eliminating German and Brits) doesn't really mean "20" as Carthage or Numidia taking Italy, and of course not as Burtii taking Balkan. I'd rather march towards Rome even before Guals are gone. Leaving them weak prevent the Brits and Germans from their grand invasion. Buy some precious time for ourselves.

However, due to the long distance between Rome and Spain, by the time of the great Spanish invasion, Romans should have developed a bit and quite powerful. While finance is always tight, I guess there will be some really hard fights... ~:)

6) Somewho nodbody wants to ally with me, same as being Carthage and Numidia. Therefore, I have to be prepared to face Germania + Britania on one end, Roman on the other end.

So far although I am still winning, my 2 starting armies are not really looking healthy. Most units are about 1/2 strength and I really wish to grab a good town to retrain them all. I guess Gaul's starting capital looks good. ~D

Spain is not a really easy faction to do "crazy expansion", and there is certainly no future to stay and build in Vh/Vh. Our town's growth rate is essentially 0 !! ~:cool: Challenging faction. (not easier than Numidia I think)

Es Arkajae
01-08-2005, 07:53
Edit: This guide was written before the 1.2 patch, I'll be completely updating it once I've had a chance to re-evaluate the Spanish more and I will post in this spot to say I've done so. For now just a couple of tweaks regarding slingers and the two missing Spanish units. The rest remains unchanged so keep that in mind.
---------------------------------



Spain is not too difficult, however instead of allying with the Carthaginians at first I would instead reccommend allying with Gaul and then attacking Corduba. First off disband all those useless skirmisher units, and gather your roundshields and Scuttari together, and also hire some Spanish Mercenaries and balearic slingers if you can and march on Corduba, take it and you can then ignore Carthage for the rest of the game and let the Scipii wipe them out.

Corduba is a huge moneymaker if you can get it earlier it will make your job far easier, and you should definantly get it before it reaches 6,000 pop.

Numantia can wait until you're much better prepared, afterall the Gauls are the same culture as yours.

The whole peninsula is easy enough to seal off with just three forts guarding the northern passes (including the two along the coast).

I would also reccommend building a navy at putting it near Osca, as well as a diplomat, once you've conquered Spain and sealed it off and are upgrading for your assault on the world then sit your army in Osca, its close to where you'll be invading and it will be well placed in case a Julii army still gets through.

Use the diplomats to bribe landing Julii armies for as long as you can, and when/if war finally does break out then use your fleet to intercept incoming Julii fleets.

As for missile troops, normal slingers naturally are crap, you will have to use mercenary balearic slingers for most of the early game (or until you've upgraded enough), however one of the types of Spanish religious shrines gives a +3 missile modifier. What you should do is build your slingers in a settlement with a temple giving a +3 experience modifier and then transfer them to a settlement with the +3 missile modifier and retrain them, they will be even better than balearic mercenaries. I say this because slingers unlike balearic mercenaries can be retrained and casualties replaced so that you can take them with you on campaign far from Spain and not have to worry about replacing losses as you can do so in captured settlements.

For your armies the vast bulk should be Scuttari, you may be tempted here to build masses of Bull Warriors, but keep in mind that you need Sacred Circles of Esus to build them, so theres no topping them up in enemy territory from captured cities (unless you want to wait around to build the improvements).

And Scuttari aren't all that less than Bull warriors, especially since unlike the Bull Warriors which have to gain their experience you can build Scutarri with +3 experience with the right religious shrine. This puts them nearly on par with non-experienced Bull Warriors. In fact better in some regards as Scuttari have much better shields providing better protection from missile fire and they take only one turn to build. If on the defensive deploy your Scuttari in a battle line set to fire at will and with enough time to spare have them give a war cry. Sometimes the enemy army will rout just from the javellin volleys.

Bull Warriors though are incredible, they have excellent mellee stats (they also have war cry) their javelins inflict massive damage (+17 ) and they have +2 hit points, their shield is smaller than the Scutarri one but at least they have one. The only problem is that they're very expensive to build (although they don't cost too much to maintain considering), they take two turns to build and that they must be built in a city with a Sacred Circle of Esus which also means they can't be built with experience upgrades. These guys are tough as nails, have great stamina, strong morale and can inflict great damage both with their javelins and their swords.

I would reccommend deploying at least two units of them with your armies (which as said should mostly be Scuttari) the place for these guys is on your frontline flanks. Spain has no spearmen or phalanxes and these guys as damaging as they are and as tough and strong as they are are just what you will need to recieve flanking attacks from the enemy, whether from their cavalry or (if your opponent is fielding across a larger front than you) from multiple foot units all trying to turn your flank. Bull Warriors will lose formation under the initial impact from enemy cavalry, but they will hold their position and fight it out in melee with the enemy cavalry and will most likely win. They are also tough enough to take on two or even three enemy foot units at once. I've seen one unit of these guys hand a couple units of Chosen Swordsmen and two warbands their arses.


Oh and the Spanish are supposed to have Longshield Cavalry and Onagers, in actual fact they don't.

You have to mod the game files in export_descr_buildings to enable the Spanish to build them, just make sure to add the ability for spain to build Carthaginian medium cavalry to all the stable buildings including and after the second tier stable, and carthaginian onagers to all the missile buildings from the second tier missile buildings onwards. That way if you capture a 'civilised' city with higher tier buildings than you (a barbarian faction) can build you'll still be able to build these two units from them.

Claudius Maniacus Sextus
02-03-2005, 20:13
I as iberia concentrated the first building slot on econ.,gatherd all units(ex. miltia)in front of the bridge near the carthage's town.Attacked,conquerd,and enslaved the town.also got an alliance with gaul.Build a stable and and a barracks in evrey town,after that only build econ. and used my S-E town for upgr. military structures.made troops constantly for my future gaul campaing,until i had 2 full armys then attacked gaul in the peninsula.placed an army in the N for guarding.Now i control the hole peninsula.next conquerd palma some W african province(yup,war with numidia) finaly convinced carthage to a ceasefire.and after that trained armys containing 3bullwar.8scutari and slingers and cav.
sooo......further conquerd half of gaul teritory then stoped.conquerd more of africa,and so on.
I must mention that for my early peninsular campaing i used mass Iberian Infantry and cav. plus any mercs. i can hire.
This was on H/H and!!!........julii never landed.A tough game nontheless.
PS:Sorry for spelling :book:


Enjoy! :duel: ~:cheers:

Imperator
03-28-2005, 15:39
With the spanish you start off with a good army and several good commanders use them! First capture Numintia because the gauls pull out fairly quickly and the city is undefended. Next go for Corduba because its a really good city and beacuse they usually pull out the garrison you can bribe it easily. Watch Osca the Julii will come after it again and again, but after the first 3 trys they run out of steam and fight the gauls. After you control spain there are two options you can sail to numidia or you can push into gaul. Personally I attacked Numidia because they get long sheild calvalry whitch you have a hard time getting. I also built up an army in northern spain to hold back the julii and to slowly encroach on Gallic land. The gauls peut up a tough fight so you can't just wiz through and hope to win. If you are running low on money here's two usefull tips. 1. Take Palma its an island not far frome the coast of spain and a good money producer. 2. Watch the rebels in your land they will be popping up all over the place.

Good Luck
(P.S. you cand continue a temple of Ball to a temple of Esus)
(P.S.S it make people happier and trains naked fanatics and Bull Warriors)

Craterus
03-28-2005, 16:56
The Spanish sound like a good, challenging campaign. That's one to consider for the future. Thanks for the tips everyone.

cunobelinus
04-03-2005, 18:32
spanish bull warriors are good and there scuttari are good to but they have a hard time with julli who come over and gaul but if u ahve a fort in ever entrance to spain u can hold the gaul of but i found the julli not that hard

Craterus
04-03-2005, 18:51
In my (mine and Littlegannon's Spanish campaign) when the Julii came for Osca, they had a general who was stupid enough to accept Ceasefire and Trade rights everytime they sieged Osca. And then, when you hit end turn he sieges the town again. We continued to do this until we could field an army of the strength to oppose the Julii horde. When we attacked them, I (supreme cavalry commander) used two generals to rout almost the entire army.
Unfortunately, one general died as he routed after he was sent to oppose a few units of Hastati.
if u ahve a fort in ever entrance to spain u can hold the gaul of The forts were my idea!! ~D

But anyway, we'll keep you updated as the campaign progresses.

pezhetairoi
04-18-2005, 05:35
Two questions, because spain comes next as soon as I'm done with Scythia (which will be in three months' time, since I only have time to play twice a week)

a) What, don't the Gauls ever try to siege the forts?

and

b) that dumb Julii general--does he ever gve you money if you demand it from him?

tibilicus
04-18-2005, 15:40
can some one tell me how to game edit this faction to make it playable? Also if i do game edit will it make RTW not compatible when an expanshion comes out?

Craterus
04-18-2005, 18:24
Two questions, because spain comes next as soon as I'm done with Scythia (which will be in three months' time, since I only have time to play twice a week)

a) What, don't the Gauls ever try to siege the forts?

and

b) that dumb Julii general--does he ever gve you money if you demand it from him?

Lol.

a) In this campaign (M/M), the Gaul don't usually siege forts but that is also because they weren't really given the chance to approach them.

b) I never tried to demand it but as you can see he was pretty stupid and he didn't ge ton with things. I guess the Julii got pretty annoyed with the "slow" progressso they sent some generals to encourae this guy to get to work. Eventually we (myself and a friend) got tired of the Julii causing devastation on our land so we attacked...

Ended as a heroic victory using only 3 or 4 units of cavalry... Unfortunately I lost a general but I decimated the Roman army and killed all three of their generals..

pezhetairoi
04-19-2005, 01:22
I still find it inconceivable that you can win a victory over full stacks of enemies with only just outnumbered shock cavalry. You'll have to show me sometime how you do it. Or hell, just tell me :) I've had pretty much enough of barbarian cavalry decimating themselves when I fling them into a flank-and-rear charge on a scipii legion.

But all that said, Spain is rather prospective for a faction. If you round out spain you get a very nicely easily defended region, although admittedly strategic direction is curtailed somewhat (i.e. Gaul). Although theoretically (I haven't even seen Spaniards before except when I meet them in battle as Romans) the Spaniards can expand south. Corduba-Tingi and Osca-Palma are excellent port pairs with pretty much higher-than-average trade income (so I've noticed), so perhaps instead of going into Gaul, the Spaniards could first capture these ports. Of course, that would entail war with Numidia but I think we can handle that. Javelinmen can be caught by Iberian infantry/spanish mercs after they run out of ammo, and besides, i can use macedonian tactics to catch the javelinmen. Desert infantry? A fig to them. Spain can capture Western Africa (-almost- like the Vandals) then move north to Gaul. Sounds like a nice way to introduce some variation (and higher early income) to the game. Of course, recognise that provinces like Dimmidi and Nepte are dispensable. To hell with defending them rigorously if the Scipii come knocking.

katank
04-19-2005, 01:30
I'd also like to see that, considering the round shields are horrible cav and drop dead quickly. Long shields require modding to get although they should be there for Spain.

Are you referring to general cav? Faction leader and faction heir general cav units with some valor can indeed rout whole armies.

To make the shock cav attack work, have the cav with strong charge hit the enemy infantry from multiple directions simultaneously.

This requires very high charge/attack cav and awesome timing. Mass is also key as is near perfect timing.

Macedonian light lancers for example are great and 2-3 units hitting a hastati unit simultaneously from all directions can instarout it. Howeve,r I do not see any cav other than general cav or maybe longshields doing so with Spain.

Craterus
04-19-2005, 17:40
I still find it inconceivable that you can win a victory over full stacks of enemies with only just outnumbered shock cavalry. You'll have to show me sometime how you do it. Or hell, just tell me :)

Can't give away the secrets just in case I ever meet you online.. lol ~D ~D
Actually, why not? Ok so, I was lucky enough to have most of the army (infantry, cav is useless with Spain) hiding in a forest.. I flanked the Julii with two generals and had them attack separate units together slowly routing them from one end to the other, using a multi-direction surprise-charge tactic most units routed before another unit could come to their aid... So I attacked along the Roman l,ine and I was lucky enough to rout the final enemies just as the half-units recoveredand began to come back. Then I sent the two cavalry units to attack them one by one, (one cavalry to one unit now, I separated them) Unfortunately one general was killed because he routed whilst taking on two units of Principes and he was killed as he ran but it was a great battle nonetheless. ~D ~:cool:


Are you referring to general cav? Faction leader and faction heir general cav units with some valor can indeed rout whole armies.

I am indeed referring to general's cav..

katank
04-19-2005, 21:47
Craterus, then your original post was misleading. You gave the impression that you only have 3-4 units of cav as your entire army that took on the enemy.

You also had infantry pinning in a forest and this matters a lot. General cav is also quite believable as round shields will do little even when charging a rear unless highly massed.

pezhetairoi
04-20-2005, 01:03
Ouch... I can't imagine what i'll do with my round shields now when I play spain. Pretty disheartening to know your buildable cavalry is useless. But, oh well. I suppose they should be some use at least on medium.

katank
04-20-2005, 01:42
On medium, they are still trash. I had a unit of Iberian inf pinning a hastati unit from the front and charged a round shield into the ear of the hastati.

Result: both iberia inf and round shield routing off the map with around half casualties for the hastati.

Results get a little better with the round shields being stacked inside each other in wedge mode. This is able to break through barbarian warbands.

Best to have the general cav being the actual shock force, leading a massive wedge with the round shields adding more weight to the charge and later peeling off individual units to chase routers.

Craterus
04-20-2005, 16:06
Craterus, then your original post was misleading. You gave the impression that you only have 3-4 units of cav as your entire army that took on the enemy.

You also had infantry pinning in a forest and this matters a lot. General cav is also quite believable as round shields will do little even when charging a rear unless highly massed.

The infantry was hidden in a forest for the whole, entire battle, they were not sent into action purely because I am a confident cavalry commander and I'm not so confident with infantry. NO PINNING INVOLVED! ~D


On medium, they are still trash. I had a unit of Iberian inf pinning a hastati unit from the front and charged a round shield into the ear of the hastati.

That's because Round Shields and Iberian Infantry are both useless lol.

pezhetairoi
04-21-2005, 02:18
.

This is able to break through barbarian warbands.



Wow. Big deal. Especially when hastati are what we have to worry about >.< Sigh. I think I'll have to spend on barbarian cavalry mercs. All these posts have just erased any faith I had in round shields. Time to switch back to infantry tactics. Or perhaps I should just sail to Caralis and import some hoplites.

Um Craterus, the Julii send full-stack armies at Osca, do they?

Craterus
04-21-2005, 16:28
They sent one good army to mine, but apparently they sometimes send 3 armies and then tthey run out of steam. If they come back, I'm going to try and decimate them like before (with 2 generals bodyguard).

katank
04-22-2005, 02:46
In my campaign, they landed in Osca on turn 5 which is about the fastest they can land there. They landed a 7 unit stack of hastati/townwatch with a good general.

Five turns later, a proper full stack showed up. It's really annoying ealy on and isn't that easy to deal with as Spain as you need all your resources to reuniting the Iberian penisula fast.

pezhetairoi
04-22-2005, 03:53
Well as I see it, should we do what the AI did, and spend everything we have on recruiting troops and mercs and reuniting the peninsula while making Osca dispensable? I.e. we allow Osca to be lost to the Julii while we reunite the peninsula, then try to engage them in a sally battle or something by sieging Osca back with one unit and 19 others as reinforcements or something...

Does that make any sense to you? I mean, Osca's rich, but that's better than spreading out your forces against a force that has an equal chance of beating you as you have of beating it...

HarunTaiwan
04-22-2005, 04:12
In my Spanish campaign, I've just out the last Julii city under seige.

Roundshields have served me well - you just need 6 units of them!

Also, keep in mind they can hide in the trees....nothing scares a Roman more than a charge to the back from the woods.

pezhetairoi
04-22-2005, 07:25
...6 units, in forests. I got that. Now, time to return to my Scythian campaign... all that questioning in previous posts was just preparing the ground for my switching to spain later, but I'm really quite scythian in outlook :-P

HarunTaiwan
04-22-2005, 11:03
Here's what I did, it was 1-3 odds and I had only 6 units or so of cav.

General unit is always visible, so the Captained cav was the bait. He sat in the open field.

There were woods flanking the direct path to the Captain. I hid the rest of the Cav there.

When the Julii army passed by, I sent all the concealed units to hit the flank. You need to send them all at once at one unit (or two.) Once they hit, either the unit routs or holds. If it holds, grab your units and have them charge a distant unit - they will "go through" the holding unit and usually it swamps them.

Then I ran around the rear killing doggies, velites, etc. Finally, I attacked his remaining infantry peicemeal... I was surprised it worked. Heroic Victory.

Craterus
04-22-2005, 15:44
Here's what I did, it was 1-3 odds and I had only 6 units or so of cav.

General unit is always visible, so the Captained cav was the bait. He sat in the open field.

There were woods flanking the direct path to the Captain. I hid the rest of the Cav there.

When the Julii army passed by, I sent all the concealed units to hit the flank. You need to send them all at once at one unit (or two.) Once they hit, either the unit routs or holds. If it holds, grab your units and have them charge a distant unit - they will "go through" the holding unit and usually it swamps them.

Then I ran around the rear killing doggies, velites, etc. Finally, I attacked his remaining infantry peicemeal... I was surprised it worked. Heroic Victory.

Nice strategy, not my kind of strategy but it seems to have worked perfectly there.

Yukon Cornelius
04-22-2005, 21:20
I'm surprised you managed to ambush the AI with concealed units. For some reason the enemy loves to head directly for my hidden units. They do not pass Go. They do not collect $200. They ignore my visible units and plow straight into the hidden ones. I play on VH/M, so maybe the AI units have ESP when the Strategic map is set to Very Hard (which would probably indicate a bug since, if the game's going to cheat like that, it should do so only on Very Hard Battle difficulty -- you know, since it happens during battle).

katank
04-22-2005, 23:01
This always occurs for all the TW games. Kinda ruins the hidden ability of some units. They tend to make a beeline for your hidden units.

Otherwise, you see something like a worthless AI unit of 1 man cav speeding ahead far in front of all their troops, run into your ambush, discove it, and run away.

Personally, I see no point in hiding. Woods are just good for barbarians and also for infantry screwing cav. Round shield do need 4-5 charging together to be effective. Like I said, the sheer mass can punch through many units. However, if the enemy manage to get infantry into the woods and catch your roundshields in the woods, then they are really dead.

pezhetairoi
04-25-2005, 04:23
But still, if the ambush tactic doesn't work, then why come up with it? And it IS effective when it works, almost insta-rout in a German-Gaul battle I once had. But why institute the ambush option if all the enemy is going to do is X-ray the woods, see the ambushers, and head straight for them?

Wait, just had a thought. Could it be that the enemy was trying to ambush YOU? Hence his ambushers met your ambushers.... (the rest, as they say, is history.)

IliaDN
05-04-2005, 09:48
Thanks a lot for all who posted here : great advices.
I have just started spanish campaign on VH/VH(instead of numidians).
It is cool. :book: ~:cool:

IliaDN
05-04-2005, 13:22
So ... I don't know if anyone plays this campaign now, but:
1.I've started with selling map info to Carphage and Gauls, just after I made it I conquered Cordoba and Numantia;
2.I've saved in the beginning and after a few turns romans landed in Osca so I had to load this save(270 B.C.)- they had not landed in Osca this time even when it is about 250 B.C. their is no sight of romans on Osca, they did not even attack Gauls(by the way the town which is taken by Julii in the first or second turn(I don't remember the name) is owned by Gauls!!!!! ~:confused:
3.To this time I had conquered Cordoba,Numantia and two Gaullic prov to the North. ~:cool:

IliaDN
05-04-2005, 17:24
Well ... I see Spain is a popular faction, but ... it is cool anyway ... ~:cool:

Craterus
05-04-2005, 18:00
Right, make sure you take Narbo Martius and Massila.

Make sure to build forts in the pyreenees (sp?) to stop Gallic attacks. Then from Massila, march through the Alps and attack the Julii.

If you have taken Palma, sail across and take Caralis. Conquer it and build it up, then you can attack Scipii and Brutii through Sicily if you want or sail straight over to Italy. This is mine and littlegannon's strategy for sacking the Romans and once we have Rome, we'll be going along nicely.

Good Luck!!

IliaDN
05-04-2005, 18:04
Actually I am already fighting romans in Italy (I've taken Julii capital)
I am at war with Gauls and roman and neither of them bother me much.
But thanks for advice anyway! ~:)

Craterus
05-04-2005, 18:08
Oh, nice going, working pretty fast then eh?

I just want to play that campaign again but it seems unfair to finish it without littlegannon.

katank
05-04-2005, 23:15
I personally I'm against going into Gaul early on as Spain.

In my first Spanish campaign, I kept at the Gauls and pushed into Lemonum and Narbo Martius with armies. However, I just get hit by endless stacks of enemy warbands. The towns I take aren't worth the effort.

Sure, I get heroic victory after another but warbands in melee power > iberian inf. I can only produce town militia at town level which gets slaughtered if left alone even for a little while. Gave up on it out of sheer boredom of fighting 2-3 boring battles every turn against 4-6 warbands.

Second campaign, I united Iberia immediately, then smashed a Gallic invasion into my territory. Meanwhile, I pushed into Numidia at Tingi and then moved onto Cirta and Carthage in short succession. I built ports quickly in Scallabis and Carthago Nova. I sent a family member to smash a Julii landing at Osca and then took Palma with that army.

I just remained defensive against the Gauls and now they don't bother me much. I'm becoming filthy rich from the nice territories that I grabbed. I might sweep up rest of Africa and then go into Sicily. Spain invading from the Italy south is kinda funny but makes most sense in my situation.

You will indeed be the most unpopular faction on the planet, at war with no less than 7 factions at once but you can crush all of them and this is the best way to fuel your economy. They don't call this Total War for nothing.

IliaDN
05-05-2005, 05:02
Well I was at war with seven factions when I played carphaginians.
As for economy I have sold some maps each for about 5.000
As for Gauls I have just taken three coastal towns in their native lands and one in Italy (in other campaigns this town used to be romans)
Now I am fighting romans in Italy and bribe Scipii armies in Africa cause I don't want them to be strong there.

pezhetairoi
05-05-2005, 05:15
Well, Greece will be pretty unpopular too won't it? You have every chance of being at war with Seleucs, Macedon, the Romans and perhaps even Carthage right at the start... And if you feel like a warmonger, perhaps even Pontus and Egypt...

IliaDN
05-05-2005, 05:25
~D Yeah greeks campaign will be a hot one!

pezhetairoi
05-05-2005, 05:27
'hot' doesn't even come close. :-P I will enjoy the strategic challenge it poses. But more fun will be Carthage, because it doesn't have uber-hoplites that can stop all charges at the start of the game.

IliaDN
05-05-2005, 05:33
When I played carphage the game became pretty boring to me after defeating romans (and was pretty soon after beginning).Their elephants give nice chances in battle and also make possible to attack town without a ram.
As for greeks their hoplites can be easily otflanked even by infranture, so battle for Sicily will be a hard one.

katank
05-05-2005, 18:03
Actually, the Carthaginians are more fun for me due to their awesome blitz of the Romans. They get long shields and lybian spears once you take Rome. This makes for units that can actually hold the line and cav that can actually break units. Their starting elephant is by far their biggest asset. You just have really weak infantry though.

Greek hoplites are still nice. Turning off phalanx, turning quickly and reenabling phalanx allows for decent speed defense against flanking. Beside, having phalanxes on the flanks on an angle is good. The AI doesn't flank well anyhow. Often, they charge frontally into your center.

Craterus
05-05-2005, 18:13
I personally I'm against going into Gaul early on as Spain.

I mean you should take the first two and then cross the Alps for the Julii. This is how I'm going to do it.

pezhetairoi
05-06-2005, 01:39
When I played carphage the game became pretty boring to me after defeating romans (and was pretty soon after beginning).Their elephants give nice chances in battle and also make possible to attack town without a ram.
As for greeks their hoplites can be easily otflanked even by infranture, so battle for Sicily will be a hard one.

Says who hoplites can be easily outflanked by infantry? On aggressive, just concentrate everything on a blow to the centre, and the flanks will give way, as long as you keep a unit or two at the ends as reserve. On defensive, you don't even have to do anything, just sit around in a square/circle/polygon and let your militia cavalry do the shooting, and let your sharp pointy sticks do the talking. Always worked for me. I never left a defensive battle as Germans or Macedonians with any more than 10% casualties, and even that was only when four units of bodyguards charged one after another into the same phalanx, decimating it but eventually being stopped in its tracks and slaughtered by reserve melee infantry mercs.

katank
05-07-2005, 02:23
I mean you should take the first two and then cross the Alps for the Julii. This is how I'm going to do it.

Never tried that. I rather do island hopping. I find attacking into North Africa and Palma makes me a lot richer.

It seems to make sense to sack the Gallic towns on the way to the Julii but still is a pain. I find myself fighting about 8 warbands a turn for several turns straight.

It's boring but still attrition. It's ridiculous how much low level spanish inf sucks against warbands.

Craterus
05-07-2005, 23:07
I use Slingers vs. Warbands

If worst comes to worst, then I'll lure them with slingers (if they're ammo is exhausted and charge roud the back with cav.

katank
05-08-2005, 03:12
Slingers? you mean baelerics or regular slingers that you can build?

Baelerics are rare machine guns best deployed killing jucier targets than warbands.

As for regular slingers, then it does not contradict my belief that taking on Gaul before you get a city is counter productive.

IMHO, far bigger fish to fry elsewhere.

pezhetairoi
05-09-2005, 04:02
I know for a fact that Corduba-Tingi and Osca-Palma are good trade pairs. You get a gigantic trade boost in the first 10 turns or so after capturing both of these pairs, especially after ports have been built. So it makes sense to charge south across the Gibraltar.

Craterus
05-09-2005, 17:11
Slingers? you mean baelerics or regular slingers that you can build?

Baelerics are rare machine guns best deployed killing jucier targets than warbands.

As for regular slingers, then it does not contradict my belief that taking on Gaul before you get a city is counter productive.

IMHO, far bigger fish to fry elsewhere.

I always hire Balaerics and use them against any enemy. It's because the Gaul were pumping out armies of warbands against me, and the Balaerics can get some major kills against them.

IliaDN
05-11-2005, 05:34
So I have strong position in Italy and in West Europe and starting my african campaign, BUT maybe I will finish after my campaign for the Greek Cities.
P.S Bull warriors are cool.

Dromikaites
05-11-2005, 12:25
On medium, they are still trash. I had a unit of Iberian inf pinning a hastati unit from the front and charged a round shield into the ear of the hastati.

Result: both iberia inf and round shield routing off the map with around half casualties for the hastati.

Results get a little better with the round shields being stacked inside each other in wedge mode. This is able to break through barbarian warbands.

Best to have the general cav being the actual shock force, leading a massive wedge with the round shields adding more weight to the charge and later peeling off individual units to chase routers.

I found out that round shield cavalry and iberian infantry are OK if raised in cities with temples that give experience boosts (Epona for all sorts of troops or Teutatis for infantry). Also it's agood idea to improve their weapons and armor.

There is a feature I was neglecting in the begining of my Spain campaign, due to the fact I've first used round shields and iberians as Chartage. This feature is the warcry and warcry is available only for barbarian factions. Warcry improves the morale of the iberians and damages that of their foes. It also seems to improve the charge bonus of the troops yelling it before attacking.

Craterus
05-11-2005, 16:19
Warcry imporves attack also. I would still recommend not using Iberian infantry. Just build up fast and get some Scutarii, or better, BULL WARRIORS!!!

IliaDN
05-11-2005, 16:59
Even on VH/VH bull - warriors are cool.

pezhetairoi
05-12-2005, 00:59
Warcry imporves attack also. I would still recommend not using Iberian infantry. Just build up fast and get some Scutarii, or better, BULL WARRIORS!!!

i.e. sit tight in Spain and wait for population to grow? The Julii, it seems, will not give you that luxury... and most probably neither will the Carthaginians... :-(

Dromikaites
05-12-2005, 06:54
i.e. sit tight in Spain and wait for population to grow? The Julii, it seems, will not give you that luxury... and most probably neither will the Carthaginians... :-(

Another way of getting Bull Warriors is to capture cities with equivalent temples. My first Bull Warriors came from Corduba, where the Carthagenians had built a level 3 temple of Baal. The second batch came from Lugundunum, 'cause the Gauls also worship Esus. Any temple of law would do.

pezhetairoi
05-12-2005, 07:47
now that sounds more like how I play :-D

Craterus
05-12-2005, 17:29
I don't mean sit back, i mean conquer but make sure your money goes to building up towns.

pezhetairoi
05-13-2005, 01:25
ah... i see what you mean. I did that in my opening Scythian turns, too. I don't believe I built a single new unit until turn 10+...

Craterus
05-26-2005, 20:53
Ok, the (mine and Littlegannon's) Spanish was resumed last weekend. Sorry, updates were put on hold due to schoolwork.

Right, we own all of Iberia, Narbo Martius, Massilia, all of Sicily and Sardinia.

We have a full stack waiting outside Rome, about to be attacked by their "wandering" full-stack. And we have just pounced upon Julii. Unfortunately Julii have 3 full stacks. Now I know why they haven't been expanding, too busy building up army upon army.

We are about to attack Brutii, and Scipii are already severely crippled. Their main forces are wiping out Numidia.

What I really want to know is: How do you take on Romans in battlefield? We played once vs. Julii and it was a phyyric victory, to say the least. They just broke through our main line.The flanks held well, but the centre collapsed.

Our strategy was Scutarii in front line. Bull Warriors second line. And 2 cav on each flank. General behind Bull Warriors.

pezhetairoi
05-27-2005, 06:38
If your strategy against Romans is to wait for them to attack you, then perhaps this will help in your defensive battles.

I've found that fighting defensive, it always pays to minimise the distance between your troops and the general, since no unit ever routs when the general is behind them. Take Germania, for example--I combine barb mercs and spear warbands into a semicircle (or a full circle if I have enough of them) of spears, with all cavalry and ranged units in the centre of the circle. Thus general is equidistant to all the troops and you get maximum morale boost for your troops.

Bull Warriors ought to be superior in holding power, so the part of the semicircle etc directly facing the line of enemy advance should be made up of them. Then protect your flanks with Scutarii, curving backwards as much as you have units, and then dump cavalry in the middle. Keep a spare unit or two of Bulls or something to use as a stopgap reserve should any disasters happen. Then just sit and wait.

When the enemy comes close, they will tend to charge obliquely at your flanks (since your Scutarii aren't facing them headon), so you actually outflank them a little. This will offset to some extent the fact that your Scutarii are inferior to your Bulls. With melee infantry such as yours they will be sure to flow around the flanks and take maximum advantage of that. As the Romans charge, you charge as well, so your Bulls' charge is used to the max and so you get the chance to break through -their- line, taking care to make sure your formation is still vaguely circular (or square, whichever you choose) and that your general is at the centre of it. Use your cavalry to counter any enemy cavalry charge into your circle.

It's the strategy of interior lines that Frederick the Great used on a grander scale--your cavalry and Bull reserve will be available to shore up any point on the circle in the same span of time as compared to the enemy who essentially can't march around your circle once he's engaged. Also, if you had 2 Bull reserves and 4 cav you could hurl 6 units into a line breach as compared to a full line where all you might have on hand of your 6 units' reserve was 2 units in immediate vicinity of the crisis point.

If you were feeling confident, you could leave your infantry to sink or swim and take your cavalry out the rear of the circle (there would be a gap at the rear that the AI never exploits unless it's a reinforcement coming from that direction), around the edge, and you can nicely flank and rear any unit you meet on the way, routing the enemy along the circumference of the circle. This is especially useful against enemy ranged units as soon as their melee are all engaged. They will be defenceless--especially Roman Archers. And all this while, your units at any point on the circle are much more accessible by your cav than in a full straight line.

Endgame: Assuming your cav has not been committed outside the circle, the endgame is simply when the first unit breaks after all enemy units have been committed--simply do a concentrated charge at the unit next to that sector and bingo, you'll be seeing blinking white flags everywhere you turn in no time at all. Your cavalry will be fresh and unharmed and ready for the pursuit. If you do it right, you can pursue those that hit the bulls (the frontline), cut them down and turn back to hit those that ran from the flanks, since they'd necessarily be further behind. If you do it right, you can end up with none escaping, and none even coming close to the edge of the map. Enemy routing cavalry not included, however.

Note though that this strategy is pure theory, I have never played the Spanish, nor have I ever faced them in field battle, so I don't know how well this works. But in short, the advantages: 1) Morale. Your general's morale bonus benefits all units instead of just the segment of line infront of the general. Your circle will never break as long as your general is there. 2) Interior lines. Reserves take less time to arrive, and the circle will grow stronger as it shrinks, like the British square. 3) Maximum utility of reserves. Reserves can reinforce any segment of the line in an equally short time, and they can all be concentrated instead of dispersed at either flank where they are not mutually supporting. 4) Mutual support. Especially for melee troops, if one unit is broken through, the enemy will be sufficiently close to other melee infantry in the circle (or alternatively, reserves) that they will take up the slack and contain the breach until you have time to respond.

Weaknesses: 1) This tactic only works on defensive when your troops are standing their ground and waiting for the enemy to come to you, and reminds me a lot of the Gothic laager at Adrianople... the cavalry were sheltered amidst the wagons until the time came to charge out from the gaps in between. It can win some massive victories, but can also become catastrophic defeats if all the enemy does is potter around shooting your shock troops to bits. 2) As mentioned before, if the enemy is range-heavy. For practical reasons (friendly fire) it is almost impossible to fit ranged units into the cramped conditions within the circle without shooting the heads off other nearby units unless you have a full stack, and the circle/square/polygon is very large, or you have very little reserves as a tradeoff for the usage of flaming arrows. 3) If you're using hoplites, it can get annoying since the phalanx rightward shift may open your circle up. Germanic phalanxes have a nasty habit of moving forward, also opening gaps in the circle. But using melee infantry you should have no problem.

Okayokay that's really enough. I shall stop now to avoid rambling on further. I should reckon this takes the record for the longest post--hope you had the patience to read it, Craterus and littlegannon, and sorry for the length :) Hope it's useful.

Craterus
05-27-2005, 17:42
No problem about the length - full of tips. Thanks!

Circle, Bulls centre, Scutarii flanks.

Got it! Hope it works against those Romans. Marian Reforms will be along in 25 turns or so.. A big defeat in the North will halt my advance terribly.

katank
05-28-2005, 16:52
Their republican units should not be able to stand up to bull warriors.

I frankly think that you should employ weak center strategy of Hannibal. Let the scutarii slowly cave and the bulls can autoflank. Your long shield horde can smash any point on the line you want. You general should be behind the scutarii always rallying and joining the fray if it looks ugly.

Always add some baeleric slingers and put them on the flanks. Run them forward to bypass enemy shields. A single unit of these boys esp. from Palma, can cut up a unit from no time.

If the enemy has little cav, you can use the slingers to rear attack with their shots and really drop enemy troops like flies.

Craterus
05-28-2005, 17:18
I don't think Spain gets Long Shields in campaign mode.

Warlord's Stables gives Warhounds and Round Shields. This is the same as the stable before it though.

katank
05-28-2005, 19:31
They have ownership of longshields and onagers. They are supposed to get them just like how the spanish generals shouldn't look like british ones.

Just mod in longshield and onagers. There is otherwise no point to giving Spain warlord stables.

Craterus
05-28-2005, 20:52
How do I mod them in? Will I need to restart my campaign for it to take effect?

katank
05-29-2005, 01:43
check the descr buildings file. look for stables buildings. For all the stables levels higher than level 2 (warlord or cavalry stables), look for the recruit longshield cav line or catharginian medium cav or whatever the heck they are called. It says requires faction {ct_carthage,} change that to {ct_carthage, spain,}

Do the same for onagers.

I don't think you need to restart your campaign for this to work.

katank
05-29-2005, 01:49
BTW, the general rule of thumb is that any changes to the campaign map requires scrapping the campaign but other changes don't.

An example of this is the adding of a region specific resource. Perhaps you want Forester Warbands to only be recruitable in Gaul and thus add a Gaul resource to their starting territories and requires the Gaul resource for recruitment.

Since this requires deleting the map files and regenerating the map, it requires a new campaign. In addition, the conditions at the start of the game as specified in the descr_strat file are only in effect at the beginning and needs a new campaign to reflect the changes.

cunobelinus
05-31-2005, 17:59
in my and craterus campaign we attacked the romans and he said that we should do it in s circle but our lines will still break i think we need to try and ambush them with a group of horses or something because we are defeating some of the julli btu 3 full stacks is ganna weaken our armys!

katank
05-31-2005, 20:47
You mean with your units all clumped in a circle? That could be bad as morale decreases with being surrounded. Circle are unnecessary. The AI almost never gets to your rear.

A line with refused flanks or crescent is usually sufficient.

How late into the game is it? A Spanish army with scutarii and bulls don't break easily. The Romans are still PreMarius, right?

Craterus
05-31-2005, 23:54
233 bc. It was all going well until they piledrived into the centre, theybroke through but ere finished off by our 2nd line of Bull Warriors. I wasn't too satisfied with this battle and there has to be a way of taking on the Romans without sustaining that many casualties.

katank
06-01-2005, 17:48
That's pretty late. In that case, make a shorter line and buff up the center more. The AI doesn't flank that much. You are on defense, right?

Craterus
06-01-2005, 19:36
Right, we hold the Alps. We have full stacks or 2/3 stacks on the Italian coasts. We own Sicily. Ok, I think we will just have a strong centre and use horses to protect the flanks, And if we're lucky, the Romans will pi;ledrive the centre and we can encircle them. Well, this campaign will be continued tomorrow, hopefully.

pezhetairoi
06-04-2005, 05:35
mmm katank, morale would not decrease with being surrounded because while in a circle, all fronts would be facing outwards---there would be no way at all for the enemy to get into the rear, so it's not actually possible to be surrounded... and I'm sure the morale effect is counteracted by the general. I tested out my hypothesis in custom battle mode wit 6 bulls and 7 scutarii, against a republican army of 6 principes, 5 hastati and 4 generals. Worked like a charm, until my comp crashed because the graphics couldn't take the strain during the pursuit phase. -_-" As it was, though, I only lost about 4-5% of my force. 3 Scutarii units (those on the refused flanks) managed to be unengaged, so I used them as artillery support cum line-breakers.

But remember! Don't -attack- the Romans using this! Only use it on defensive! You can adapt it for attack, I guess, if you move in a line towards the Romans, Bulls only. Scutarii are in a second line, concentrated behind the flanks. Once you've got the Romans lured towards you, halt and deploy your Scutarii into the flanks of the circle and prepare for impact. Usually, if you're close enough the Romans will keep coming even if you're numerically way superior.

Oh, I just learnt something about my strategy from a Germanic-Greek battle. Don't use the circle strategy in a phalanx-phalanx struggle. You'll get the worst of it.

crazybastard
06-05-2005, 01:42
Playing on M/M, as of right now I own the whole Iberian pennisula and Narbo Martius (or something like that) but all of my cities have incredibly slow growth rate (2-3%) and I want to upgrade them to get the Bull warriors very badly...any suggestions?

katank
06-05-2005, 15:08
@pez, I recall the circle against HAs. I personally used HAs and always shot at the shieldless side by rotating, forcing the enemy to rotate. Eventually, their forces were all clumped in the very middle in a bit of a circle and still routed spontaneously. There may very well be morale penalties for macro surrounded.

@crazybastard, go into Italy and take nice big cities from the Romans. Or, build up lots of farming, drop taxes to lowest, and disband peasants into the target regions to boost pop.

Also, move governors out of cities except for the ones you want to grow right before you enslave. Then gift a city to an enemy and enslave it again.

antisocialmunky
06-05-2005, 17:09
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=48770

@

El Bastardo Loco

pezhetairoi
06-10-2005, 09:25
crazybastard, I'm playing Spain now and I'm making 10k a turn in profit. What I did was, after unifying the peninsula, build one ship at carthago nova port and just move straightaway to the Julii territory and beat them to pieces. Ignore Narbo Martius. After taking Numantia, send Segovax to Gaul and sell them map info for big big tribute, they will ask you to become a protectorate in return for even bigger bigger tribute. The fools. Agree, and immediately cancel military access. Clever you :-) Then, build forts at the approaches from Gaul into Spain (there are 4 of them, two right next to one another in the north, one next to Osca, and one on the south coast). Garrison each with one town militia and bingo, the gauls'll never bother you again. Then, have fun with the Romans :-) In quick succession I took down the Julii (who hadn't even had time yet to send their first invasion of Osca, or their invasion of Caralis) and then Rome after a brilliant battle in which I forced the Senate grand army to fight a river crossing battle against me ^_^. Took a breath while building sacred circles of Esus in Rome, then pushed on to Capua and Croton. Not Tarentum, because in my game the Brutii had a nasty 19 unit garrison, so I hit poorly defended Croton and they predictably came out of Tarentum so I could trash them in the field. Then it was Tarentum, and now I have the biggest army in the Italian Peninsula about to cross to Greece, a three-quarter size crossing Palma-Caralis-Sicily to wipe out the Scipii, and another one of the same size advancing on Carthage to annihilate it. If I play it right in another 10 turns at most I will have taken down Carthage and all the Romans. But it's slow going, I'm almost at turn 30 already. Still remember at this time as the Greeks I already had 40 provinces. Oh well. I've come up with a more open formation of Spanish deployment for attacking Romans with as little as Iberians--will share it next time I have time! It's worked like a charm, so i daresay it works for any occasion.

katank
06-10-2005, 22:38
That is great speed. Did you go after Numidia?

pezhetairoi
06-14-2005, 12:21
I immediately raced for Cirta after Tingi, then took a detour to down Carthage and Thapsus. Now I have an army headed for Dimmidi, and nicely bribed another Carthaginian one consisting mainly of Iberians and Roundshields headed for Leptis Magna

katank
06-14-2005, 18:04
That's the expansion route I took.

Dimmidi isn't worth much and can wait. I ended up taking Siwa before Dimmidi.

Garvanko
06-14-2005, 20:49
You truly are a Legendary Commander, pez. :bow:

pezhetairoi
06-21-2005, 02:11
why thank you for the compliment. :-) I've ended my spanish game (burnout, my game crashed (see thread in Colosseum) and I want to try Egypt once I get it restarted) with about 30+ provinces. I own all Italy thanks to that preemptive strike, I've annihilated the Brutii, having had to chase them with two armies and two diplomats all the way from Apollonia to Vicus Marcomannii to down the last factioner. I own all lower Greece (Sparta, Athens, Corinth). This was due to a stroke of luck as my spanish swordsmen are incredibly crappy against hoplites, so I used diplomats as the shock troops. I managed to bribe 4 greek factioners (IN ONE ARMY) to my side, and recruited enough mercenaries to lay siege to and storm Sparta with their own greek troops. Now preparing to crush Macedonia in 3 turns flat. In the west, the Gauls have fought 3 major 20 vs 20 stack battles with me, and gotten trashed. I now own all western Gaul up to Condate Redonum, as well as southern Germania. In the south, I own all western Africa, and Cyrene. In the east, I own Kydonia and Rhodes and I actually owned Pergamum but gave it away to Pontus in return for alliance and an attack on Seleucids. The Pergamum army is now en route by ship to Antioch, which is the real prize. I've an army on the sea on a 20-large-boat-navy that surrounds and trashes any any in its way en route to Alexandria while the Cyrene army heads for Siwwa and Thebes. Altogether now army deployment are as follows, 3rd Army currently recuperating in Athens, 4th Army at Nepte en route to Lepcis Magna tp take ship to Chersonesos (I know, it's quite a long way), 5th Army en route to Antioch, 6th Army at Trier about to descend on Alesia and the two Gaulish rebel provinces, 7th Army at the border of Armorica (so much for indomitable Gauls) moving for Samarobriva, 8th army at Vicus Gothi laying siege, 9th Army at Cyrene, 10th army moving by ship to land near Thessalonica from Sparta... btw the numbers of my armies tells you the order of their formation.

katank
06-21-2005, 23:25
Are you playing 1.2? Using diplomats as shock troops, lol.

I did that a lot in 1.0 and 1.1 but not so any more. The hapless AI often have nearly full captain-led stacks running around which are perfect prey.

That's a lot of armies. Guess you must have conquered fast and furious. How much upkeep does all of that cost?

I've never maintained more than 5 armies in my games but then again, I don't go for much of a blazing speed endgame.

Craterus
07-02-2005, 22:03
Ok. We got going again. About to assault Rome, we were attacked by the massive Roman force. Tried Hannibal's "weak-centre tactic" and we deployed as far back as possible, it didn't work too well. Then we re-loaded and tried a three-line tactic. This worked. But our depleted force was attacked the next turn by half-Roman stack, with Scipii and Julii reinforcements. Needless to say, being attacked by 3 different directions meant that we lost.

That force is now almost dead.

It is a short campaign so only one more region is needed and then we win. We are hoping to breed a force in Italy, and attack Croton. It would be nice to take Rome for the final settlement, but the army is almost dead and it is v ery well protected (4 armies).

pezhetairoi
07-03-2005, 07:22
Ho hum, nice to know it's gotten going again :-) Hurray!

Katank, it probably cost me about 10k in upkeep, but I still made 10-20k a turn, because I captured some really good trade pairs and developed port cities. And I fully developed those that weren't. Quite a comfortable margin even with 7 armies, 5 of them full-stack, running around like loose cannons.

Garvanko
12-05-2005, 23:13
Wow, Spain is fun. Especially, if you do them right.

I just started a campaign after a month off from RTW and BI. Took Corduba, Tingi, Numantia, Palma, Cirtis, Carthage and Thapsus in that order. The key of course is to get the economics right in the first ten turns or so. Corduba got me Bull Warriors (though I havent used them yet!) before I even captured Palma!

I like the Scutarii and Spanish Mercs though. A poor man's Plumbatarii, but effective nonetheless. Really flexible unit roster.

And those temples!! ~:cheers:

The only problem you'll have is chronic alcoholism! :bow:

Patriarch of Constantinople
05-06-2006, 04:57
Hi all im a new guy and I need some help playing Spain
I modded the descr_strt to make it playable but when i click on it to play the game crashes. Ive been looking forward to Spain but I cant play it.
Can someone help?:help:

Patriarch of Constantinople
05-06-2006, 06:54
Nevermind I found out how to do it

Patriarch of Constantinople
05-06-2006, 07:03
Ok so Ive been playing it and heres my progress:

Starting game:
Immediatly i began building economic buildings and getting tribute from neighboring regions. i also make ports for trade and a strong navy. i take Corduba and Numantia then get ceasfires from Gaul and Carthage after. so when my economy is running smoothly i start making Iberian inf. and Sucartii. these would be important as Gaul has started to invade Spain to take back what it lost. eventually after some close called decisive victories i not only pushed out the Gauls but took 2 of there provinces. this began a conflict with the Gauls I like to call Spainic-Gallic wars. my navy will play in important role later on...

well thats all i got so far ill keep you informed

Patriarch of Constantinople
05-06-2006, 16:42
oops sorry just found out i should post that in stories sorry

Tzar Dusan of Serbs
05-07-2006, 17:01
I don't like Spain they have poor armies from my point of view.If you wan't to play sucessfully you must bribe everyone you can,and honestly I find that boring.I wan't to play with them but their Scutarii are to weak for chosen swordsman of the gauls even swordsman if used corectly is beter then scutarii.In Spain you can build real economic empire,but what after that?
Where to expand?I would expand further north to Gaul but we all know that without bribery that would not be possible,also I don't think that any force Spain can built can match Roman post Marius Army.Only good troop is Bull warior,and I must said that they are awesome troops,but I realy find it borring to play with just one selection of troops.Can anybody say that I'm wrong?I admit that Spain is Chalenge but I dont think its possible win this campaighn withaout bribery,so I anostly believe that this faction can not rule the world without cheating(and I find bribery as cheating!!!!).
If someone have other opinion I would like if he share this opinion with me,thanks

Avicenna
05-08-2006, 16:48
Scutarii volleys are always powerful. There is no way they are weak: the Roman legions were modelled after the Scutarii, with the scutum and gladius. The Gauls have low morale, and after the two volleys at least one unit should rout. Afterwards, just send in the bull warriors and cavalry and use the Roman tactics of divide and conquer. If even Numidia can defeat armies, Iberia is definitely no problem. The Gauls especially are easy prey: They're under attack by at least the Julii and Britons, if not the Germans. Gaul is usually the first faction to fall.

grapedog
08-26-2006, 08:37
I'm using v1.5 of vanilla RTW, no BI, and I'm using the unofficial bug fix patch.

Since this is only my second campaign after not having played for at least a year, feels more like 2...I'm having fun. The spaniards are definately tough with both Gaul and Julii coming right at me. I took the benefit of saving before a big fight and doing some auto-resolve battles. In my next 5-6 turns I'll see two fulls stacks of Julii, and 2 1/2 fulls stacks of Gauls all heading to Osca.

As soon as I loaded up the game, I went and took over the single carthaginian town and the gaulish town. First buildings in all my towns were roads and mines and markets...so I'm getting plenty of cash. I'm not bribing anyone as I don't like to us it, but I am picking up as many units in the field that my generals can find, as possible.

I have trade agreements with most of the factions near me save all the roman factions and the gauls.

I started to fortify Osca and I have 4 towns as my unit producing towns, I've gone all Esus temples for now because I want Bull Warriors, and naked fanatics are nice also and I'm not good at running multiple temples and moving troops around to get the benefits of all the different temples. I had 2 of three forts set up around Osca, but I've had to pull back all my troops to Osca and a 5 star general that I've cultivated thats hanging out next to Osca. I own all of the spanish peninsula, and I managed to bribe one rebel town thats almost directly south of Italy...near the egypt area...which I will use later on.

My strategy after the next few turns of constant full stack fights is going to be building up my navy which I'm working on now, and taking that little island off the coast of Osca. That place is a hatasti breeding ground for the Julii and that needs to stop. I figure if I can field a decent navy in that area, I can sink a lot of Julii ships and keep them weak. Then I can work on the gauls, I think if I can nab two or three towns of theirs I can break their momentum.

For unit make up's, I'm using mainly what I can dredge up for mercenaries...Iberian infantry, and some skirmishers are the bulk. I have some naked fanatics coming in, but I'm not relying on them because of the 2 turn build time...which kinda sucks, but it's still doable, they are nice shock troops and can definately hold a line from what I've seen so far. I'm aiming for bull warriors, then perhaps a good mix of 3-4 cav units and 3-4 archer units. I'll have to see what they have later on down the line.

I think overall, I'm going to sweep north in Gaul lands, and take out the Britons as well....leaving Germania intact and see if I can keep good relations with them. Then I'll head into the Italian peninsula...I hate trying for Africa and East asia because there are so few provinces for the size of the area as opposed to Italy/Greece/Macedonia.

Every time I've played a Roman campaign, the Brutti go east, the Julii go west and the Scipii go south. It will be interesting to see how it turns out if I can nip the romans in the butt early and see if some of the other factions can hold their own for once.

So far I like the spanish, but I'll have to get a bit deeper into their roster of units before I can make a final determination. I have a weakness for cavalry, I love em...and I know thats not one of spains hot points. I'll update this info in another bunch of turns to let you know how my plan worked out...

grapedog
08-27-2006, 01:06
I haven't started from my spot last night, but I've been thinking strategy over. If I go east and try and take some of the italian boot, I'll probably have the senate on me for the entire game, but I'm thinking about taking the islands between spain and italy so I can better control the Julii/Scipii navy. I think after that, I'm in a toss-up after that. I can go south and fight off the Brutii, or I can go north and fight the gauls. I figure south might be the better option though, if I can control the islands and block Scipii, i can let the gauls/germans and britons take their tolls on the Julii...hopefully keeping them smaller and I can work on Scipii, letting the Brutii head West into Greece and Macedonia.

Right now none of the factions of Rome will talk to me, so I'm going to see if I can secure contracts with everyone else, and then just beat up the romans navy wise and see how much the rest of the factions can beat up on the romans. I'll try and sell cash and maps and anything for factions to attack Roman areas...I'd love to see the Romans quashed since they always seem to win anyhow.

Seamus Fermanagh
08-27-2006, 04:56
I actually thought pretty well of the Spanish roundshields in an old spain game. Took lots of casualties, but I then had 6 somewhat over-sized units at 2 silver or better -- fun to play with. It was a medium game, I think, so I had lots of fun sending doggies into packs of gauls.

grapedog
08-28-2006, 23:20
As it sometimes happens, things did not go exactly to plan. The Gauls kept sending huge armies at me, though the Julii stopped. I got so annoyed with the Gauls that I took Narbo Martius(my main general is right now 10 stars...but 60 years old).

I also took the next island over to the East from Palma, SE from Narbo Martius...a Julii settlement. The Julii are now sending armies by boat but I keep sinking them, while the Gauls just keep coming after me. The Britons are going after Germania, and Germania is being squeezed by Dacia as well who has expanded quite a bit from my last map update.

I'm debating what to do now, I think I may just trash all the buildings on that little island east of Palma and let it revolt and leave the island. Let the Julii come back in and fix it. I'll pull back and finish off the Gauls I think since they are being so annoying. They can't have much left in the tank, and I have roughly three full stacks of armies marching around.

The only real problem is money, after playing the Brutii campaign it's a definate shock to the system, but it's still do-able, I'm just much slower in my growth.

--------------

edit/add: Its a bunch of turns later and everything has turned to crap...Numidia was my one big trading buddy, but they declared on me. I had three 10 stack navy's out and about killing Romans, but when Numidia declared me it all went to hell and I went into serious negative numbers. Somehow Gaul is STILL throwing full stacks at me, though it's almost all warbands with a few chosen archers and swordsmen. Julii has also stepped up their attacks AND their navy...most of my coastal cities and gaul cities have been under seige and unable to retrain troops because of my negative cash flow.

I managed to take the Numidia town just south of spain across the ocean, i ransacked it, exterminated the populace and retrained most of my troops. These next few turns could break me, but I think I can pull through. I'll try and sack one more Numidia town, then destroy all the buildings and gift it for peace. I grabbed a ceasefire with them for one turn before they re-declared...so, I'm gonna have to teach them a lesson. I've been gearing up for Gaul, and those extra troops are the only thing saving me at this point...so hopefully If I can get Numidia to back off, I can retrain and finally nip Gaul in the head, chest and extremeties once and for all...

I don't know WHAT in the hell the Romans are doing, they are no where to be found...shouldn't Scipii be taking over the southern continent...well, he's not...and Julii are not taking over Gaul...I don't know whats going on sadly....i was hoping the Romans would do their things, but they are not....

----------------------------

Another edit/add:


Ok, it's been a bunch more turns, i did some auto-resolving even though it generates higher losses to get through some tougher parts more quickly, and get back into the black.

The Gauls got a mid sized army into my mainland and captured one of my cities breifly...but I took it back about 3 turns later with mix and match units from the surrounding cities.

I went further south on the southern continent and grabbed the next Numidia town...

I also took Lemonum briefly, trashed all the buildings and pulled out. I grabbed Lugdunum and Alesia too...the turn after I took Alesia I got hit with the friggin plague. I had 5 generals in that army...and they are all infected now.

I'm on the warpath and Gaul is going to get a serious beat down now...

I don't think I'll win this one in the time alloted to me yet, I've been exterminating as I go for the extra cash to re-train all my troops, i know that will come back to haunt me cash wise down the road, not pulling in as much taxes, but I won't have to worry as much about troops hopefully.

Ezephkiel
04-09-2007, 18:18
Hi, first post for me.

I decided to start a spanish campaign the other week (H/H), been playing a long greek one and gotten sick of phalanx, so wanted to go far away as possible.

Started off pretty slow, and just got control of the iberian penninsula, concentrating on my economy for the start, the gauls kept coming in their massive armies, so my army was training itself, up, even though it needed to be reinforced quite heavily.

[Got a picture but i need to post atleast 1 post apparently]

As you can see, theres quite a few super powers in the world at the moment!

Im allied with egypt, armenia and scythia.

At war with the romans and gaul.

Carthage and gaul are allied, and the britons are just at war with everyone i think, they keep attacking my navy, then signing ceasefires every so often. But they're getting their arses kicked by the Scipii now, who are pushing into middle europe.

Pontus is a protectorate of the brutii, who are using them to attack into armenia.

I've recently taken segesta and raised it twice, going to build barbarian buildings , does it convert it slowly over time?

I've left the remainder of the gauls as a buffer inbetween britain and plan on joining in when the romans have their civil war (gonna be ugly in greece)

Ive got 3 armies, pretty similar to the one in the picture, gonna have to send one back to spain soon though to do some massacreing of cities.

I'll keep you updated if anything interesting happens ;)

Ezephkiel
04-09-2007, 18:23
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v621/merp/spain.jpg
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v621/merp/spain.jpg

Sorry, image for the post above, i couldn't see an edit button (don't know if that would count as 1 post aswell)

Caius
04-09-2007, 18:49
Welocme to the org!


Sorry, image for the post above, i couldn't see an edit button (don't know if that would count as 1 post aswell
You need to be a member to edit your own posts.


I've left the remainder of the gauls as a buffer inbetween britain and plan on joining in when the romans have their civil war (gonna be ugly in greece)
Romans wont have civil war if you are other faction.

I suggest ambushes in Sardinia.There are lots of trees to make good ambushes.

Also, Prepare (very) good navies and disenbark in Londinium, Ebracum and Deva.Siege and capture.Then go to Samarobriva and start the end of the British people!

Caius

Ezephkiel
04-09-2007, 19:04
Thanks for the info.

My navy is pretty strong, got about 3 fleets at 300 men strong each (on large unit size) with gold and silver chevrons, got them early to stop the romans landing in oscar.

I've managed to trash a few post marius julii armies using the hammer and anvil technique, the cavalry seems to be performing more than its stats show it to though, but i ain't complaining.

I think i might take sicily now i know they won't have a civil war. Can't be bothered to go north anymore, want some sun.

Maybe i can boat across an army into carthage at gibralta, help out my egyptian allies, although it'll probably lead to war with them, maybe just tingi, so i can get a foothold.

Do spain get access to onagers or any siege artillery?

Caius
04-09-2007, 19:22
Do spain get access to onagers or any siege artillery?
Im not sure.

Poulp'
04-09-2007, 19:31
They do in custom battle; I don't think they can in imperial campaign, you'll need a fix for that.

Roman_Man#3
04-09-2007, 20:32
Welcome to the Org.

Dont mean to burst Caius' bubble, but the Romans can get the Civil war even when you are not a roman faction. It just takes longer than usual.

Unless I am totally mistaken. But I dont think so:beam:

RM3

Caius
04-09-2007, 20:42
Welcome to the Org.

Dont mean to burst Caius' bubble, but the Romans can get the Civil war even when you are not a roman faction. It just takes longer than usual.

Unless I am totally mistaken. But I dont think so:beam:

RM3
Bad Rm3:whip:

You will burn for that :beam:

Im confused.

Caius
09-13-2007, 18:44
I've played a M/M/N(ormal style) as Spain, and it went horribly. I delayed the war. That was the wrong thing I could do.

I started again. I quicly movilized my troops. In nine years, I destroyed the Cartaghinian town of Corduba, and Numantia went down also. I lost some Generals, I seem to have bad luck.

Now, Im heading for Narbo Martius. What should be my next objetive?

Poulp'
09-13-2007, 18:55
first of all, Palma and Sardinia, they're great trade centres and you can stage invasions from there in peace.
from here on, you should consider how you plan to expand: going north into Gaul, south into North Africa ? or you can also organize raiding parties and sack the roman cities to finance your growth at home. Let the romans or whoever take the cities back and come back in a few years.

Caius
09-13-2007, 18:59
I dont want to deal with Romans. So, I will head Gauls and kill them all.

Then, I will see.

Poulp'
09-13-2007, 20:03
If you can wait for them to tech up a bit, you can reap what THEY sow (culture penalty free, no fat nor sugar)

the problem with going for the gauls is that Pyreneans are such a good barrier that I'm reluctant about going across.

Seamus Fermanagh
09-13-2007, 21:11
Fun alternative.

Defend at the Pyrenees. Forts in both Northern passes and a good defensive field army near Osca. This will become the focus of a lot of Julii and Gallic attention. You can bleed them pretty well there and train up several strong fighting units for subsequent attacks.

Equip an invasion force and a follow on force and go take Ireland. Follow on force is 4-6 Town militia and 8-12 peasants. Take Ireland, garrison with town militia, disband peasants to build population. Should have a port going and trade with your Northern ports. :yes:

Then, once you've paused and sorted things out, take Britain from the North down. The Brits are rarely prepared for this and usually have most of their fighters across the channel. Consolidate.

Now you should have 2 well trained strike armies: 1 in Britain and 1 in Spain. Send the Spanish army forward along the isles to attack Italy OR along North Africa after Carthage. Use the Northern force to hit Gaul, Germany or the remnants of the Brits as you see fit. None of the Northern Barb forces is particularly well set to handle an attack from the North like that.

Poulp'
09-13-2007, 22:23
funny, I used this strategy with the Britons
there's nothing like Brit Chariots sieging Corduba, with that feeling of "where did they come from ?"

Caius
09-13-2007, 22:48
I will capture Samarobriva, and Brits wont be smart enough to recapture it.

Morgoth-NL
01-27-2008, 18:15
i am playing a h/h spain campaign i have a question shall i invade gaul or africa

mrdun
01-27-2008, 18:34
I would say either. Just not both. Gaul would secure you back ie if you plumped for Africa Gaul could cross the pairofknees but Afica opens up more sea trade but Scipii and Egypt. Gaul, you also run ino romans but there is more towns so possibly more money/ easier conquest. Heads or tails mate

Paradox
01-27-2008, 19:37
I would suggest you start by unifying Iberia and eliminating the Gauls, than it would be a good time to invade Africa.

Morgoth-NL
01-27-2008, 20:42
its going pretty good i invade africa and capture Carthage

Morgoth-NL
01-27-2008, 21:00
https://img118.imageshack.us/img118/9295/asdasdhp3.png

mrdun
01-27-2008, 22:33
Jee wizz, you going to take sicily then move up through Italy? early game with Spain I would say was mad. :p

Morgoth-NL
01-28-2008, 15:09
it was easier then i thought it will be i hope the romans are not to strong

Hannibalbarc
01-29-2008, 01:29
Thats almost an exact imitation of my last last spanish campaign, I had the same territories as you do, unfortunitly thats as far as I got because I accidently deleted the save.

Good Ship Chuckle
01-30-2008, 05:31
I've never felt compelled to play spain. They seem like a faction that CA made simply to fill the space of the Iberian peninsular.

King_of_Pontus
03-19-2009, 09:07
to stop the romans just attack and enslave :whip: palma and caralis that sould stop the :furious3: romans i pretty soon had the julli coming for caesefire and got 5000 out of them! :surrender2: OK no for a diagram after the senate attacked me when I walked through Italy. The wizard is the senate and the dragon (to be) is my spanish armies. I tell you their principes were torn to shreds by my bull warriors. :wizard:

Alp Arlsan
03-25-2009, 10:42
What an outrageous post KoP, there are however some valuable facts hidden in there. Your bull warriors will tear apart most which stand in your way but unfortunately are quite expensive. Iberia in barbarian hands is not at all wealthy and the capture of island provinces will increase trade income and also weaken the Romans.

I suggest that you unify Spain then launch an attack on Italy through the Apls taking Narbo and Massilla on the way, use mercenaries if you need to but it would be better to use all of your treasury to fund two armies, tactical know how will be the key to defeating army after army in Italy. It will be a hard fight but if you wait then the Romans will become far too powerful.

dAbY()
09-27-2009, 11:48
Iberians


Overview

- Spain begins with one of the largest beginning armies... You have a large amount of Skirmishers in Scallabis, some Cavalry in Osca, a normal garrison in Carthago Nova, and a force containing 2 Scutarii and some cavalry in Asturica. 3 Towns are walled, Osca is unwalled, but has a strong garrison, to balance things. There are some bribeable Rebel armies near Numantia and Asturica. Bribe these to gain Iberian Infantry early on.

- Spain generally has large revenues in their towns. All towns have such a high public order, that you can put every town on "Very High Tax Rate"... you should really do this... With barbarians growth is not as important as with non-barbarian factions, as barbarians can only achieve the 3rd level of town. So take it easy with growth, and concentrate on money first

- Spain has a Carthaginian based army, with 2 unique units, and 1 barbarian unit. They have Scutarii, basically the type of soldiers the Romans based historically their warfare on, so, strong unit. They also have Bull Warriors, excessively strong for a normal infantry unit, use this one too. They also have Naked Fanatics, but I don't advise using these, they really cost too much in comparison to their strength, they have high attack, yes, but one spear, arrow or stone on their heads and they die... leave these out. We all know about Carthaginian units, quite useful troops, use them.

Campaigning

A campaign strategy as Spain is always difficult, to make it more easy, make sure you have a good starting base, from which you can expand later. When the game starts, build in all towns Traders or Land Clearance. Wait for two turns, and build the other. Within four turns, all your towns have a Trader, and Land Clearance. After this build roads, and build in Osca, Carthago Nova and Asturica Town Militia, and in Scallabis a unit of Peasants. now your 6th turn comes, time to make a move. Move all your troops near the Gaul town, except Town Militia and Peasants, let your Diplomat bribe the Rebel armies. Bribing them gives you four Iberian Infantry, and one unit of Peasants. Put the Iberian Infantry in your main army, put the Peasant in Scallabis. Lay siege to the Gaul town. If they attack, crush them, even on H/H, your troops are stronger and better, so... expect no trouble. In the meantime, build in Carthago Nova, Scallabis and Osca shrines to Epona. In Asturica a shrine to Esus, so you can build Bull Warriors later on. Begin preparing a force to attack the Carthaginian town (Corduba) but don't attack until you have siezed the Gaul town. When you have it, occupy it. Same with Carthaginian. If they have moved their troops out of the town, bribe them. Don't worry about money, around the 7th turn you will already have about 20000 denarii on H/H. So you sohuld have some more when you attack Carthage (about the 15th turn or so) Also occupy this one. Keep expanding your towns in the meantime, remember : economy first, then Shrines, then Tavern (Public Order building), then Military, then Armory/Blacksmith, then walls. That is the best build order (generally) for Spain. When you have a basic economy, quite a bulk of units, let them guard the passages from Gaul. Capture Palma to increase Sea trade, as your Sea Trade will soon become very important. Keep building towards the highest level of town. Dump a small force near Tingi, but don't attack yet. Do the same with Narbo Martius. (Do this when you have nearly fully built each town) When each Town you posess is fully built, attack Narbo Martius and Tingi. Dump a small force in Caralis and Syracuse. Don't attack yet. When you have Narbo Martius and Tingi, Capture Massilia, Cirta and Caralis. When you have those, prepare to attack Carthage, Thapsus and the Syracusian (sp?) towns. Make a excessively large force of Scutarii and Bull Warriors, especially near Carthage. Capture Carthage Thapsus and all Syracusian (sp?) towns. Now you have your basic Mediterranean sea trade. Keep expanding further and further, and you should have no trouble, as all your cities will bring in huge amounts of money, and your Bull Warriors will simply crush anything they run into.

Spanish Armies

Spain has, surprisingly, a huge choice of making armies. Their units form good combinations with eachother, becouse they are all of similar strength. Except Bull Warriors, but these units are quite exceptional. So... what should your regular Spanish army look like? Here are some good choices :

Early stage Army

5 Iberian Infantry
7 Skirmishers
4 Round Shield Cavalry

Middle (expansion) stage Army

5 Scutarii
5 Iberian Infantry
5 Skirmishers
5 Round Shield Cavalry

Late (conquest) stage Army

7 Bull Warriors
5 Scutarii
4 Slingers
4 Long Shield Cavalry

These armies perform very well, in each stage, you may use your own strategies, as Spanish warfare has a huge variety of strategies. Just make sure your main Infantry units always stick together and all will be fine.

ROMANS!!! ARGH!!!

One of the biggest Spanish problems are the Romans. Many people seem to be having trouble killing the Brutii in later stages... The Roman's weakness is their back. By the time you start killing Romans you will have Lonng Shield Cavalry and Bull Warriors. Use your Bull Warriors to crash into Roman troops, and let your Long Shield Cavalry charge from the back, and all will be fine. Let your Bull Warriors finish off the Cavalry too (A Bull Warrior unit can kill a Praetorian Cavalry unit head on on Hard setting... take advantage of this) Just let your Bulls take care of everything and use your Long Shield Cavalry as support, and let your Slingers take care of Archers.

Your Scutarii are a good counter for the Romans Pila throwing units. Let your Scutarii do the same to them, and Crash your Bulls in, that works well against the stronger (Marian) Roman troops.

IceWolf
09-29-2009, 14:29
The problem I had with Spain was that their elite units took 2 turns to complete and I couldnt raise troops fast enough to fight the Romans and Carthaginians.

Icewolf

Rokondo
10-01-2009, 14:05
Spain sound good to play :)
I will try it :idea2:

Quintus.JC
10-01-2009, 20:32
Spain sound good to play :)
I will try it :idea2:

Unfortunately Spain is one of the unplayable factions in the game, however you can easily gain access to them by altering the des cr_strat files. You should try the other playable factions though, they're awesome fun! :2thumbsup:

Welcome to the guild Rokando. :ave:

G. Septimus
10-10-2009, 14:42
~:pimp:yeah, if mod the descr_strat files they're really fun to play

and welcome to the guild Rokondo :beam:

G. Septimus
10-10-2009, 14:45
I mean , try to mod the descr_strat files