View Full Version : General WoT discussion
Myrddraal
04-02-2005, 11:45
I realise now that we need a thread for this. Just some notes, if you have any text which contains spoilers (info from later books), post them like this:
Spoiler (highlight the next line to read)
-:Put your text here:-
If you want to use this format, just quote my text to see how its done.
Myrddraal
04-02-2005, 11:50
Heres my question to you. The entire thing is a spoiler, so just highlight it:
Spoiler from the last book (highlight the next lines to read)
-:At the end of the last book, theres a Domani general who plans to attack the Seanchan. If I remember correctly, one of the Shienarans mentions his name when listing great generals... His plan is basically this: Hes going to ride across the Almoth plain with some Taraboner Freedom fighters, and do as much damage to the Seanchan as he can (burn camps etc etc). Then hes going to ride back across the Almoth Plain with, hopefully, the Seanchan hot on his heels. He then leads them into a trap. Have I got it right so far? But how can he possibly hope to pull this off. As far as I can see, hes got no hope of getting back across the Almoth plain if he'll have Raken chasing him... Perhaps Rand will help him out?:-
GodsPetMonkey
04-02-2005, 11:51
or better still, use the spoil tags....
this is done by putting your text between (SPOIL) and (/SPOIL). Replace the curved brackets with square ones!
Then those of us whe dont use the default theme (go the black theme!) wont be spoiled either!
It's a pleasure to bring here the inevitable newbie question.
I've managed to read the first 3 books within 3 weeks and so far I must admit it's been a very pleasant reading.
However, I've read too many reviews for my own safety. Many people seem to complain that the characters' behaviours (blushing every two seconds, smoothing dresses etc...) which are quite funny at the beginning are getting on the readers' nerves in the end. I've also heard of many chapters dedicated to practically useless characters, just for the purpose of ending Jordan's series at his twelfth book.
Now that I've bought 7 out the 10 books there's no going back, so you can reply in all honestly ~;)
So, is the storyline fading away? Do the numerous unimportant characters make you lose the track?
Black_Draen
04-02-2005, 20:18
Nah, I don't think so. In my opinion it only adds to the depth and background of the books. But of course, some patience is needed ~;)
Steppe Merc
04-02-2005, 20:33
Agreed. I still quite like it.
Myrddraal:
Rodel Ituralde was the guy. I think that he was going to use those Taraboners to infiltrate the Seanchan. A few hear, a few there until their through out the army. This way, not only will their be a battle, but also other Taraboners inside the Seanchan army, who might be able to convince their fellow country men to help. But also, I think that his orders might be from Graendal. I know that his latest orders from the king were weird, and the king might really be dead. So we don't know who exactly his orders are from, but the excellent general he is, he still might pull it off.
at some points he does over do it with unnecessary characters but on the other hand it does make the world seem fuller... it's always nice to know there are other figures out there besides the main characters. Although I do sometimes lose track of the minor characters and when they appear later its like... who is this?
Myrddraal
04-03-2005, 09:27
Hey I never noticed those tags....
I remeber about his orders being confused, the spreading of Chaos. If I remember correctly, his last order was to do something about the Seanchan, and it came amongst many other confusing orders. I though he was leaping on that order because thats what he wanted to do...
I hadn't remembered about infiltrating the Seanchan army... So is he still going to try to get back across the Almoth Plain? Why have I got that fixed in my mind....
Myrddraal
04-03-2005, 09:34
And as for the books going down in quality, you said it yourself, he wants to finish his books quite soon, so the next few will have to be quite dramatic, and he certainly will want to finish well. I personally think he won't finish at book 12... I think he'll extend it to Book 13.
I would not say that the quality of the books have gone down, they have however been given a more political perspective (which I happen to find just as intressting as heroes travelling in the wilds).
But I don't think he can close it up to book 13, he have said himself somewhere, don't remember where that he will need at least three books to just finish it. And I would acctually, belive it or not read ten (twenty in the swedish translation because they cut the books into two halfs) more.
But I am afraid that Jordan will die before he can finish the books in that case, and then I would be a bit angry. But I think that book 14, or maybe 15 is the earliest endings book. But I could be wrong of course.
Ok, I think I have to steer this up....
Those order came indeed form Graendal, she sent them with a man claiming to have got them from a Lady Tuva who had been murdered by grey men for those order. Conveniently enough, the Lady Tuva was known as the kings retainer... and murdered by Graendal. Probably the king and the Council are all dead or captured by her. but she has left the area now, IIRC, and thats why he has no new orders.
And I told you about the infiltrating when we discussed this, Myrrdraal:P
And I do not mind the more political latest books, I feel thing closing up for the great action.
And I agree, go black theme!
UglyandHasty
04-05-2005, 15:21
I am also new to this series, i bought and read the seven first book in the last 6 weeks. So far it is one of the most interesting read i had. The depth and the varieties of characters and plot is what hook me to the Wheel of Time ! Do i need to say i keep an interested eye on your mod ? ~D
ps. i am honorary member of the Band of the Red Hand ! heheh Go Jack O Shadow go !
I think the Dragon Legion (not sure if this is the right English name) is cooler, and I would rather join them.
But anyway, welcome to the mod ~:cheers:
Myrddraal
04-06-2005, 10:26
Its Legion of the Dragon in English ~;)
pezhetairoi
04-21-2005, 08:37
Um, some information from interviews with RJ. I guess it's pretty much open information now among diehard WoT fans (like me), but anyway. Book 11 is called Knife of Dreams, and RJ has explicitly stated that he will end WoT at Book 12, no further. So we can expect either some very thick books, or some very frenetic action in the next two books. Yeah.
Wash the spears--Life is a dream
Wash the spears--All dreams must end.
Yes 12 books was the deal I had heard of. Personally I'm at the fifth and I'm truly hooked. I hope the end of the series will be as good as its beginning ~D
You also seem to be a Martin's fan like me pezhetairoi, thus I suggest you visit Amok's website (Art) (http://amoka.net/eng/gal/) you will be flabbergasted by his work ~D
I use a wallpaper (http://amoka.net/eng/gal/wall/robra1024.JPG) you may find interesting too.
Myrddraal
04-21-2005, 10:38
I think the only way in which he can resonably end the books by book 12 is thick books. Very thick books...
Yeah, I don't really see how that is possible...
pezhetairoi
04-22-2005, 07:15
well, we'll leave it to the maestro to wow us. Imagine that! Book 12, and it ends in an anticlimax after over 20 years of writing and waiting! Like, I dunno, Rand and Shaitan sign a peace treaty... >.< Let's make a wager how many thousands of people will be baying for his blood.
Mmm, sorry ldvs, wrong guess, I'm not a Martin fan, haven't yet read him :-) But ooooohwee artwork. Will read him as soon as I can take a break from studying philosophy of history. And... well, I'm afraid you will be sorely disappointed with regards to the quality of the writing after book 5. 6 and 7 are still okay, but book 8 is crap. Book 9 has redeeming qualities, and book 10 is...just a shadow. Book 11 better be good or travel to Charleston and lynch that old man myself.
pezhetairoi
04-22-2005, 07:19
oh, and did I mention? Darrell K Sweet's artwork (the waste of paint that's on the cover of every old-style wheel of time novel) is crap too. Factually inaccurate, physically inaccurate, etc. Example: on tGH (Great Hunt) cover, Loial (at least, I hope that's Loial) is way too short, even when you take perspective into account. On EotW, Moiraine looks like her butt's been glued to the horse so she can sit crosslegged on it. And in CoS, Rand's dragon tattoos look terrible, like golden bracelets when they're supposed to be coiling up his forearm, and he looks like he's pelvic-thrusting. There you go. A shame they got such a terrible artist with no respect for the story to do the artwork.
Mmm, sorry ldvs, wrong guess, I'm not a Martin fan, haven't yet read him :-) But ooooohwee artwork. Will read him as soon as I can take a break from studying philosophy of history. And... well, I'm afraid you will be sorely disappointed with regards to the quality of the writing after book 5. 6 and 7 are still okay, but book 8 is crap. Book 9 has redeeming qualities, and book 10 is...just a shadow. Book 11 better be good or travel to Charleston and lynch that old man myself.
I was deceived by your signature, it looked close to the quote from Martin's book. If you haven't read him yet, at least, I can swear you won't be disappointed. Very credible characters and such a suspense!! There are no super heroes. It's sometimes truly cruel but I think that's what makes it so addictive: you never know what will happen next.
As for Jordan's writing style, I've read many reviews so I did know what to expect after book 5 :embarassed: I'll see for myself.
I agree with you, the artwork is only vaguely accurate. Considering I've seen Amoka's artwork first though, it's difficult to find someone that matches his skills ~D
Don't listen to reviews, I like the rst too... they are ust a bit less action oriented. Never take inlfuence from reviews.
Yet, if not for the reviews, or your mod, I would never have bought the series so I guess one must sort the best reviews, written more objectively, and make one's choice ~:)
By Martin I'm assuming you mean ASOIAF. Great series. It's alot grittier and not so much a fairy tale like so many fantasy books have become. And i thought that sig was from ASOIAF.
By Martin I'm assuming you mean ASOIAF. Great series. It's alot grittier and not so much a fairy tale like so many fantasy books have become. And i thought that sig was from ASOIAF.
Yes by Martin I meant "A song of Ice and Fire" and your nick gives you away as a ASOIAF fan too.
Watch out though, Myrddraal will skin us alive if he sees his topic is degenerating into a "General ASOIAF discussion". ~D
Myrddraal
04-23-2005, 17:49
:evilgrin:
Haha, I like WoT too. I heard a rumor that Jordan doesn't want to write a 12th book, so the next book is going to be 300 pages long where all the main characters die and the shadow wins.
Steppe Merc
04-24-2005, 00:17
I hate the artwork. ~;) Makes me so angry... and the paperback's covers always come off.
Never happened for me... and I like the new black paperbacks, they are nice:) But the old sucks.
My covers were torn to hell. My EotW split in two.
pezhetairoi
05-06-2005, 01:58
Ah, back to the nick thing, my siggy are quotes from Oscar Wilde. We're talking -real- literature here, not fantasy ;-) And...well. Maybe it'll be something like Rand stands on the steps of Shayol Ghul in Book 11, and screams 'NOOOOOOO' as the lava in the volcano bubbles 'I AM YOUR FATHER.' XD
What's this about "new" black books with new covers? I've read the series twice (I can't help myself it's too good) but have to buy any of the books. I'm kinda in a reading lull right now and was thinking of reading WoT again. If the book covers are all new and special it might intice me a bit more to actually buy them. A few months ago I decided to actually buy books instead of borrow/library. BTW this is my favourite book/series and I really hope this mod turns out good and finishes.
If you're looking for something new to start, try A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. Martin. It's brillant, similar yet strikingly different from Jordan's fantasy.
Abokasee
05-07-2005, 13:18
SPOILER ALRET HIGH LIGHT TO READ!
the nazis were nice people they made panzers pink and return to castle wolfeinsten would exsisted
Sorry for asking, but what does ^'s message have to do with the Wheel of Time?
^ I haven't the slightest idea.....
I've heard the A Song of Ice and Fire isn't yet though. Is that true? I have heard from many people to read that series and I do plan on reading sometime, but preferably after it's finished because I hate reading an unfinished series. (except of course WoT....when new books come out I have an excuse to re-read the series)
A Song of Ice and Fire series isn't fnished yet. I think Martin plans on writting two more volumes after this one, so you see it's a lot "shorter" than WoT ~;)
It's truly the best series I've read so far (WoT isn't far behind but there's less suspense). You never know what to expect next because all the characters are vulnerable (they may die at the end of a chapter), the plots are complex and the storyline is just excellent. Another good point for Martin is that he describes only what is necessary and won't write half a page just to tell you how low a princess neckline is or fully detail a gown which you don't care about. In short, this is a must-buy ~D
Myrddraal
05-07-2005, 22:28
I think that was spam Abokasee, not only is it against the forum rules, but your doing it in my forumn. Don't...
A song of ice and fire? ive heard of it but if everyone agrees that it is as good or better than WOT then I'd like to give it a go. How many books are in the series currently?
Tres. Numero cuatro comes out in June.
A song of ice and fire? ive heard of it but if everyone agrees that it is as good or better than WOT then I'd like to give it a go. How many books are in the series currently?
Here's Martin official website: http://georgerrmartin.com/
The number of books depends on where you buy them. I bought the UK version so there were four books:
- Book one: A game of thrones
- Book two: A clash of kings
- Book three, often split in two: A storm of swords
Beware, though. It's sometimes truly cruel, so if you only like stories where the good guy always win in the end, this series isn't for you.
naa I get sick of the good guy always winning, unless its in some clever way that I wouldn't have thought of. that is one of the reasons I like WOT, people you wouldn't expect are always disappearing. Thanks for the book count and names.
I must say that having immortal, omnipotent, deathproof heroes is irritating. The ASOIAF series sounds good. I might try it.
pezhetairoi
05-10-2005, 02:18
lol, reminder, reminder! This is WoT discussion, it's becoming GRRMartin discussion... beware! beware! :-P The new black covers make the WoT books look sleeker and more sophisticated. They also look less painful, since Darrell K Sweet's sour-looking work is eliminated from the covers and replaced by the simple Wheel and Snake logo. Definitely more worth buying than the original design. I regret buying my WoT series so early because now I've got to complete my series with the same bad decor.
TurnLeft
05-10-2005, 04:33
Heh, I cant understand why they kept letting him do covers... he is the master of misproportion. The WOT RPG books have some better art in them which helps to fix that awful Loial pic on The Dragon Reborn.
The best ones (I believe) are Eye of the World and Path of Daggers.
I never really had a problem with the illustrations... they were more of something to glance at so I had a general idea what a person looked like before I got caught up in the story and completely forgot how he wanted everyone to look.
In the newer versions of the books, was anything changed story wise? Maybe a touch up here and there? or was it just a cover change because the world hates this guy's drawings.
Final thing, hows the mod coming along?
Yes the illustrations aren't really that great a bother. He's not bad at drawing, it's just that his illustrations have nothing to do with the books (CoS has to be the worst, in my opinion ~D ).
As for the mod, Myrddraal was temporarly sacked by his master and won't return until he's able to spell his name correctly: Shaidar Haran ~:thumb:
Myrddraal
05-24-2005, 20:23
The mod is on the backburner for a couple of weeks, after that, we'll be working on releasing a demo in the form of some historical battle(s).
sweet a demo. ~:cheers: I remember when you released that Aes Sedai unit way back and have been excited about the game since. Hopefully there will be some Ashaman in the demo (hint.hint.)
pezhetairoi
05-25-2005, 04:20
oooh let there be, let there be. Wait...there are RPG books? Holy cow. This purist here has been stuck on the guides and the original series.
Nice that you will release a demo, won't have to wait THAT terrible long. ~:)
I was wondering who were your least favorite characters in the series. I mean, not just the fact they're the good or the bad guys, but rather their behaviour, their thoughts, etc...
Bear in my I'm reading the seventh book so the characters may change their behaviour later though I doubt it.
In my opinion, the Trakand family is plagued, I can't bear neither Elayne nor Gawyn.
Elayne because she's too haughty and thinks everyone must do what she says, and also because she keeps saying "Rand's mine, I'll bond him, he's mine and he'll have to obey..." (at least she'll succeed in bonding him...).
I dislike Gawyn too. He's gullible (he believes blindly the rumors saying Rand killed his mother) and can hardly comes up with something clever. He also keeps saying he'll kill Rand when Rand could actually blows up his head like a rotten melon if he even tried to...
So what are yours?
I agree with you there, it should be common sense to investigate a rumor instead of following it blindly. The same with Elayne. She needs some lessons in seducing and living with men, get rid of the leash.
I think Jordan should pull a George R.R Martin and do something expected. LET Gawyn (sp?) try to kill Rand, and let Rand blow his head to pieces. That would be funny. Mat's gotta be my favortite character, least has to be Egwene, her chapters are soooo boring....
I think Jordan should pull a George R.R Martin and do something expected. LET Gawyn (sp?) try to kill Rand, and let Rand blow his head to pieces. That would be funny.
Yes, some cruelty would bring good changes, especially when we could get rid of half-witted characters like him :evilgrin: You're right, Egwene's chapters are hardly interesting although I think they're better once she accedes to a higher position in the hierarchy.
Steppe Merc
05-27-2005, 13:27
I like Elayne a lot better than Egwene, though I think Min is the coolest. Gawyn is sort of annoying, and really dumb for following any of the Aes Sedai, much less the Tower ones.
Can't really think there is anyone that I really dislike, I don't have much love with Elayne or the girl that married Lan (can't spell her name :embarassed: )
But when I think about them, they just got character, and so I can't say that I don't like any of them.
If you're looking for something new to start, try A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. Martin. It's brillant, similar yet strikingly different from Jordan's fantasy.
I know we said we would stop talking about this but on a final note:
I just got the first 3 and my god, that is an amazing series. I never expected half of that to happen and with all the plot twists... it's good. It's up there with WoT now in my humble opinion, although WoT has me in suspense over the next book.
Well, after about 6 months, I post again...The Return of Naeblis! (:D)
Regarding A Song of Ice and Fire, i tried to get a mod started for that when RTW initially came out, didn't get much support, but if this team is looking for a challenge after WoT, well...i'd say ASoIaF is a perfect adaptation for RTW , as it is basically a fantasy political book, and since Martin generally explains the layout of the grounds of a battle, losses, strategy etc, it'd wouldn't be too hard to create custom battles for it.
Yea I found a couple mods kicking around for ASOIAF but they disappeared. Would be cool to see one for that though, and to me it could be easily arranged. The main island always reminded me of Great Britain so you could use the map from viking invasion and expand it eastward to incorporate the other lands in the book. Possible? Anyway welcome back.
There is one. It doesn't look as good as this, but it's still about ASOIAF. It's called Westeros: Total War. Though it looks kind of dead.
http://westerostw.us/phpbb/
Have to agree that WoT and ASOI&F are my two favorite series. Martin's seems a tad better to me to read than Jordans but I think Jordan's world adapts to the Total War setting much more easily. Jordan's world has the neccesary various factions, traits, unique units, etc that make it a good fit. Martin's armies are much more streamlined. There are differences of course but much fewer. A knight is a knight is a knight. Throw in generic kinds of footmen and archers and a few more units and you've got the entire cast. Differences between the Lannistars and the Tully's for example are more about idiology and political or economic position than their respective men at arms. Whereas on the other hand, the people of Saldea and Andor have numerous and easily discerned differences.
I bumped this for renly:)
Anyway, while I'm posting I can remind you, no KOD spoilers. If you want to discuss it, pm me or smz since I know he has read, and I have too, or you wait for about a week or something, and we will open a topic about KOD and what we can use in the mod. Until then, no KOD info in any topic.
Thanks.
No spoilers, I'm still in the prolouge.
Steppe Merc
10-24-2005, 01:55
Yeah, it would suck to have it spoiled. Not that it matters to me now... ~D
I quite it seriously spoiled like one month before release... that sucked, yes...
Myrddraal
10-31-2005, 03:52
there is a spoiler tag...
AND PLEASE:
Answer using Spoiler tags, those who haven't read the book yet DON'T WANT TO KNOW!
Sorry, I didn't mean it like that. My question does not involve KoD at all, it's from CoT. Just something I forgot and I'm too lazy to go back and check.
McFungos
10-31-2005, 08:21
Renly,
it's in Winter's Heart, chapter 31 "what the Aelfinn said"
You should have made your post in Wotmania, Dragonmount or Theoryland not here.
You know, since I use the black layoutout I see that spoiler directly...:P Well, read McFungus answer...
Renly,
it's in Winter's Heart, chapter 31 "what the Aelfinn said"
You should have made your post in Wotmania, Dragonmount or Theoryland not here.
Thanks, didn't feel like going to any other WoT site, that's all I needed. I'll just delete the question now, since other people probably use the black background, too.
4th Dimension
11-06-2005, 01:23
What was the question if I may ask?
McFungos
11-06-2005, 07:36
The question was :
Where Mat iniated the mariage ceremony with Tuon ?
Where he said that Tuon was his wife 3 times ?
I have only recently discovered these books I love them. I am near the end of book nine I have been reading them none stop. ~D :charge:
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