Discussion and Announcements

[DimeBagHo]

Extended Greek Mod

This mod aims to give the Greek factions the same sort of depth that the Roman factions have in vanilla RTW. It adds many new units to the Greek factions, new character traits, changes the way that some buildings work, and much more. I have tried to stay close to the "look and feel" of vanilla total war, so this mod should appeal to people who like vanilla RTW but who want to play a more developed version of the Greek factions.

You can take a look at the readme here (http://xgm.sourceforge.net/xgmreadme.html).
You can download it here (https://sourceforge.net/projects/xgm/files/).

Designed for RTW 1.5 and RTW:BI 1.6. It uses the -mod switch so it does not make any changes to your data directory. The mod includes SignifierOne's animation pack, Archer's Skymod, AnistasioTheGreat's Spartans, and ngr's Mundus Magnus map as an option.

Screenshots

01.https://img219.imageshack.us/img219/5662/xgm27bw.th.jpg (https://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xgm27bw.jpg) 02.https://img504.imageshack.us/img504/8793/pikeline5uw.th.jpg (https://img504.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pikeline5uw.jpg) 03.https://img504.imageshack.us/img504/928/nightraid9hj.th.jpg (https://img504.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nightraid9hj.jpg)
04.https://img104.imageshack.us/img104/2926/greeksadvance2jj.th.jpg (https://img104.imageshack.us/my.php?image=greeksadvance2jj.jpg) 05.https://img104.imageshack.us/img104/6361/waiting4yp.th.jpg (https://img104.imageshack.us/my.php?image=waiting4yp.jpg) 06.https://img104.imageshack.us/img104/2609/sacredband8wg.th.jpg (https://img104.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sacredband8wg.jpg)
07.https://img67.imageshack.us/img67/2870/sacredband015mn.th.jpg (https://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sacredband015mn.jpg) 08.https://img31.imageshack.us/img31/9092/fleet6ou.th.jpg (https://img31.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fleet6ou.jpg) 09.https://img212.imageshack.us/img212/1478/csbvshi7xz.th.jpg (https://img212.imageshack.us/my.php?image=csbvshi7xz.jpg)
10.https://img68.imageshack.us/img68/8902/xgmhypaspists0cs.th.jpg (https://img68.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xgmhypaspists0cs.jpg)

01. Macedonian Hypaspists hold the line against Pontic War Elephants
02. Krypteia carry out a night raid.
03. Pikeline (nice shot of Archer's Sky)
04. Greek army advancing.
05. Waiting for the enemy assault.
06. Carthaginian Sacred Band
07. Carthaginian Sacred Band clash with Spartan Royal Guard
08. Fleet pickets the mouth of the Adriatic
09. Sacred Band using shield wall.
10. Hypaspists at the gates of Carthage

[Wishazu]

the greeks are my favourite sp faction so i might check it out. you havnt touched any of the other factions then?

also i think i heard about a mod that was called Hellenic Total War or something like that. i think it was set in the period a few hundred years before rtw, where you just play as 1 of a number of greek cities battling for supremacy. does anyone know about this mod or whether its even for rtw?

[Myrddraal]

HTW is in the hosted mods section, and it is for MTW.

[DimeBagHo]

Wishazu - there are a couple of "big" mods for RTW in progress that deal with the Greeks in earlier periods (three if you count the Troy mod). One is "Age of Hellas" - set in the Peloponesian War period. The other is "The Successors - Total War" - set, obviously, just after the death of Alexander. I haven't been keeping up with AoH but TS-TW looks like it will be great. It's also hosted at Draksen.net if you want to take a look.

The XGM mods all of the Greek factions, although most of the focus so far has been on the Greek City States and Macedon. It's a small mod - but its one big advantage is that you can play it now ~;)

[steve]

damn now if this mod was for the patch and helped the weather be more realisitic then it would be perfect

[DimeBagHo]

steve - which patch? MGM and XGM are both designed for use with the official 1.2 patch.

I haven't changed the weather settings yet, but that sounds like a good idea. You will probably see it in the nest version.

[Wishazu]

thanks guys, im gonna finish my current rtr greek campaign and then i`ll give these a look.

[DimeBagHo]

Old links deleted.

[Laridus Konivaich]

Are there any screens of the new units? I want to see how the units look in comparison with those in vanilla!

[DimeBagHo]

Take a look at the readme (http://www.draksen.net/download/xgmreadme.html) (it has pictures), and here's a shot of the hypaspists (http://www.draksen.net/download/xgmreadme/XGM-Hypaspists.jpg).

[kreig]

reading about the helanic total war, there is another simular time
troy: total war
troytotalwar.111mb.com
just so happens im a member ~:cheers:

[DimeBagHo]

Small update to Version 2.1.1

-Meh_cd's new Spartan skin has been added.
-Greek ports now have Greek walls.
-A couple of alternative Spartan skins are included (the original skin, and the Peloponesian Era skin).

I'm going to be out of touch for about a week, so it may take a while for me to respond to questions ~:)

[DimeBagHo]

Guess I won't be out of touch after all. I'm in the middle of nowhere, but I can still get a weak wireless signal. :)

[steve]

This mod rocks! More Greek units and changing weather! ~D

[steve]

whats with the victory conditions? every game i play i lose at about 240 BC
and the game is over and it goes back to the main menu, even when i still have like 5 or 6 cities left?

[DimeBagHo]

Are you using any other mods? There is a problem like this that seems to crop up when people use one of the extended map mods with XGM. As a general rule, mixing mods does not work, unless they are specifically designed to work together.

BTW, when I get back in a few days I will release the files needed to use the Mundus Magnus map with XGM.

[steve]

yeah i downloaded both of what was posted. So what should i download to have the Greek mod with the weather change included? I will reinstall my game and start fresh this time as well.

[DimeBagHo]

Do a fresh install of RTW and the 1.2 patch, then install XGM 2.1.1, and then start a fresh campaign.

If you really want the extended map then the best idea is probably to wait a few days until I can organize a version that will work correctly with XGM.

[steve]

its still doing the victory thing when i still have citys left?

[DimeBagHo]

Did you start a fresh campaign? If you use an old saved game you will keep running into the same problems.

[SwordsMaster]

It works pretty well for me, except that for some reason the game itself knda slows down. And it doesnt have to do with resolution, or any other graphical details.

Any Ideas, or maybe I just need to defrag my HD....

Question, if I want to change morale and speed back to vanilla, what do I do?
I liked the speed of the battles.
Have all units been changed?
Besides, in this mod, a couple of units of militia hoplites can still decimate the spartans in head on battle.
And, would it be possible to include something to avoid cavalry jumping in the middle of the formation?

Thanks

[DimeBagHo]

Speed (or framerate at least) should not be significantly affected. All of the new units have full sets of LOD models and sprites.

Changing the movement rate back to vanilla is easy, but changing the morale and kill-rate back is a little more complicated. To change the movement rates you can either replace or edit the file for movement modifiers (unfortunately I can't remember the name, I can tell you when I get back, but it is in the data directory and the name is something obvious like data/desc_terrain_movement_modifiers.txt). To change morale and killrate you need to edit data/export_descr_units.txt.

I have only seen militia hoptites do well against Spartans in the town square. Not much that can be done about that - they get unbreakeable morale, and the phalanx formation itself makes them effective aganist anything.

Jumping horses can be fixed, although I haven't looked into doing it myself. I don't think I will include as default just because phalanx units are already very effective - but I might include it as an "extra".

[steve]

i did a fresh install of RTW and the 1.2 patch, then instaledl XGM 2.1.1, and then started a fresh campaign. and still its doing the victory thing.

[DimeBagHo]

steve - I'm not sure what would be causing it now, unless you have the "short campaign" option selected. Keep a saved game from just before it happens. When I get back I give you an e-mail address you can send it to. I'll have a look myself and see if I can figure out what the problem is.

[steve]

Thanks man. ~:cool:

[DimeBagHo]

I have released another small update (XGM 2.1.2). You can install this over XGM 2.1.1 if you already have that version installed. You should be able to continue with campaigns started under version 2.1.1 (but not earlier versions).

*Old links deleted* See the top post for updated links.

The main changes for version 2.1.2 are:

-Added files to integrate Mundus Magnus.
-Added ancillaries for all Greek temples..
-Added two new optional Spartan skins.
-Revised many character trait triggers.
-Legendary Conqueror requirements reduced.

A number of other small changes and tweaks were also made.

I have been playing with the Mundus Magnus map myself, and it works fine (and is an excellent map for Greek campaigns), but if you want to use it make sure you follow the installation instructions carefully.

The Legendary Conqueror traits are now much easier to obtain. You can now gain the traits even from defensive battles. The odds do not have to be against you - even (1:1) odds will do. A victory against a barbarian faction will count as a victory in Europe. Finally you only need to destroy 70% of the opposing force with 70% of your own force left intact.

All of the Greek temples now have suitable priest and priestess ancillaries, but they are only available to the factions which can build the temples "from scratch". The character traits associated with temples have also been revised to make them more governor friendly.

[DimeBagHo]

Draksen.net appears to be down, so here is an alternate download link (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=484).

[DimeBagHo]

And here is another link for the readme (http://homepage.mac.com/abradbury/xgmread/xgmreadme.html).

[Ianofsmeg16]

yo, great mod, is it just me or should there be alot more civilisation specific mods, nothing big, but civs like briton sohuld get beefed up

[DimeBagHo]

is it just me or should there be alot more civilisation specific mods

I think that would make a lot of sense. Making this sort of mod (single faction, or single culture, and designed to fit in with the vanilla game) is a great way to start modding, because you can start small, with a few improvements, and build up the mod as you learn how to do more things.

I think one reason why there are so few mods like this is that people start out with much larger ambitions, and it takes a long time for them to get to a public release version (EB actually started out as just a barbarian mod!). I started with very modest ambitions - I just wanted to add a few units to the GCS - and so I was able to make my first public release within 12 hours of deciding to make the mod.

[Ianofsmeg16]

I think that would make a lot of sense. Making this sort of mod (single faction, or single culture, and designed to fit in with the vanilla game) is a great way to start modding, because you can start small, with a few improvements, and build up the mod as you learn how to do more things.

I think one reason why there are so few mods like this is that people start out with much larger ambitions, and it takes a long time for them to get to a public release version (EB actually started out as just a barbarian mod!). I started with very modest ambitions - I just wanted to add a few units to the GCS - and so I was able to make my first public release within 12 hours of deciding to make the mod.

my point exactly, if these moddlers start small it doesnt matter
so any plans for more mods such as these ?
:charge: :duel: :duel: :charge:

[DimeBagHo]

I don't plan to do any other mods. The MGM and XGM take up a lot of time as it is. Of course I would be more than happy to help someone else get started on another culture mod.

[JasonA]

This sounds great. :-)
I installed it and started a game but not got much time at the moment.
In the original it was quite easy to beat the AI when you were fighting greeks (e.g. get lots of cavalry, get the phalanxes out of formation and hit them with the cavalry from behind first.)
Will the extra units and things mean the AI'll have more non-phalanx units and be able to fight off cavalry better? If so I was thinking of playing the Brutii again if it's more of a challenge.

(Sorry for the Noob question. I don't know anything about modding.)

Also, with regards to the looking at other factions etc... how easy would it be to get them working with this one rather than instead. I see lots of mods for single or multiple factions but I suspect they'll modify the same files and not work together. It'd be really nice, for example, if greeks and egypts were both modded to be able to take the new greek stuff against the new egypt stuff.
Does that make any sense?

And finally, does this mod only alter the data directory?
It'd be nice to not have to back up everything per mod I try.

Thanks for your patience with my noob-ness :-)

[DimeBagHo]

-The Greek Cities, Macedon, and Thrace should all be tougher opponents. But it is hard to say how much tougher - it can take them a while to get to the really good new units. All of the AI factions will do a little better as a result of some universal changes.

-Unfortunately mixing mods usually won't work. Other faction specific mods will change many of the same files, so the mods will over-write each other when you install them.

-All the changes are made to files in the data directory, so that is the only folder you need to make a back-up of.

[DimeBagHo]

A new version of the Minimal Greek Mod is out.

You can download it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=445).

1. All Greek factions will be playable.
2. The new naval units are dropped, but Greek ports give +1 exp.
3. Naval temple is adoptable by all Roman and Greek factions.
4. Corvus and Deceres are recruitable by all Greek factions with a naval temple.
5. Thessalians are dropped, but GCS get Companions, recruitable anywhere.
6. New general units are dropped, but vanilla units will be improved slightly.
7. Otherwise the unit line-up is the same as XGM.
8. More community bug fixes are included.

[JasonA]

I installed the Mundus Magnus map, then the extended greek mod and everything appeared to be working fine. However, sometimes during the AI's turn I get CTDs. As I save regularly it's only really a pain if I've just fought a big battle where I was attacked and didn't capture a city as a result of the battle. So a few questions:

Is there any way I can find out what has gone wrong to let you know?

Is there any way to make it auto-save after a battle?
(I can save after the battle if I capture a city, or if there is another battle can save just prior to that, but if it goes through a battle and then straight on to the rest of the AI's turn then I don't get a chance to save before it crashes.)

Is there anything obvious I could have done wrong? It usually seems to crash somewhere near the rebels turn, or at least in a faction near the end.

On to feedback:

May be my imagination/luck but Macadonians seem to recruit more cavalry which is good - makes it harder to beat them :-)

The romans can upgrade someof the greek temples to their own if they have temples with similar abilities. As Brutii beating the greeks it'd often let me upgrade their captured level 1 temples to level 2 of my own. Not a problem because I just don't do it but I thought maybe mention it as it may be to do with allowing greek factions to use each others' temples. I really don't think it's a problem tho as most people using the greeks mod will be playing greeks anyway I assume :-) (As I will be next, I just wondered what Brutii'd make of the new greeks.)

[JasonA]

Doh! Before someone else points hout how stupid I am, maybe I should check that it's not the naval temples that are being adopted - doh! Sorry about that as it could well be.
(Not at home so can't check.)

[DimeBagHo]

JasonA - After you installed MM and XGM, did you run the XGM-MM installer in the Extras folder? The steps should look like this:

1. Install RTW
2. Install the 1.2 patch.
3. Install MM.
4. Install XGM.
5. Run the XGM-MM installer from Extras.

Roman and Greek factions can adopt temples from their own culture and, because the same temple types are used by other cultures, they can often adopt temples from other cultures as well. For the Greeks that means there are only a handful of temples that they can't upgrade.

[Al Khalifah]

Do you have any plans to release a version of this mod using a smaller map more centralized around the Hellenic Peninsula and the Near East ?

[DimeBagHo]

Al Khalifah - I don't plan to make any new maps, but if you know of a suitable map in another mod I would be happy to make inquiries about including it in XGM.

[JasonA]

JasonA - After you installed MM and XGM, did you run the XGM-MM installer in the Extras folder? The steps should look like this:

1. Install RTW
2. Install the 1.2 patch.
3. Install MM.
4. Install XGM.
5. Run the XGM-MM installer from Extras.


I believe so because I followed the instructions in the readme.
Is there a quick way to check?
Is there anywhere to download a zip rather than exe version? Then I can see what gets modifed. Or is there any way to see what the exe puts where?

I'll try it again just to be sure on a new copy of the data directory but I think I remember doing all of this. Is it safe to do it again over the top (i.e. does it just unzip files?)


Roman and Greek factions can adopt temples from their own culture and, because the same temple types are used by other cultures, they can often adopt temples from other cultures as well. For the Greeks that means there are only a handful of temples that they can't upgrade.

That'll be what I saw then. Thanks for clarifying. My bad.

[JasonA]

OK, now I'm confused.
It finally occured to me to install to a different directory to have a look what got installed.
Here is my confusion:
The patch installs descr_regions.txt and descr_strat.txt
The wierd thing is that my descr_regions.txt in my install directory is exactly the same as the one in the patch. But the descr_strat.txt differs.
Either this means that descr_strat.txt gets changed in the course of the game or I messed up the install somehow.
(I definitely didn't have anything running at the time so haven't a clue what happened.)
I'll put the file over manually and see whether everything recovers - will descr_strat.txt changes nullify my save game?

[DimeBagHo]

Is there a quick way to check?
Take a look at the descr_strat.txt file in the Mundus Magnus campaign folder. The Greek general bodyguards should be "gc general's guard cavalry early" rather than "greek general's guard cavalry early".


Is there anywhere to download a zip rather than exe version? Then I can see what gets modifed. Or is there any way to see what the exe puts where?
Run the installer and tell it to install to another directory (like desktop).


Is it safe to do it again over the top (i.e. does it just unzip files?)
It should be OK to just go through the install steps again, but unfortunately you will have to start a new campaign for this to have any effect.

[DimeBagHo]

OK, now I'm confused.
It finally occured to me to install to a different directory to have a look what got installed.
Here is my confusion:
The patch installs descr_regions.txt and descr_strat.txt
The wierd thing is that my descr_regions.txt in my install directory is exactly the same as the one in the patch. But the descr_strat.txt differs.
Either this means that descr_strat.txt gets changed in the course of the game or I messed up the install somehow.
(I definitely didn't have anything running at the time so haven't a clue what happened.)
I'll put the file over manually and see whether everything recovers - will descr_strat.txt changes nullify my save game?

Here is what I think happened (another user had a similar problem). For some reason the desc_strat.txt file was marked as read only, so the installer skiped over it. That won't happen in future versions because I will change the installers to force over-write. Unfortunately it means that your current saved games (I mean the ones for the campaign you started with the wrong desc_strat.txt file) are bugged. Now that you have the right descr_strat.txt file you can start a new campaign, and you should not encounter the same problems, but unfortunately you can't continue the old campaign.

[JasonA]

Thanks a lot for your help on this, I really appreciate how helpful you have been.
And appreciate the effort you've taken to make this work :-)

I didn't think about read only, good thinking there as I couldn't see how it'd update one file and not the other.

I've copied the correct file over and started again. Everything seems to work so far, no crashes yet :-)
Thanks a lot.
(Would have said last night but the name resolution on my ISP was playing up so I couldn't get to the site :-( )

[eldal]

Hail DimeBagHo. I installed the Mundus Magna mod and your XGM mod as you suggest and everything seems to work OK. The problems are confusing me. The Corinthian Hyspaspists are not coming out of Corinth but from Sparta. The Spartan Hoplites don't come out at all. And finally the non-mercenary Rhodian Slingers and non-mercenary Cretan Archers don't come out at all also from Rhodes and from Cydonia. What might be the problem?

[eldal]

I forgot to tell you that I'm playing with the Greek Cities.
And I forgot also to congratulate you for the awesome new greek units you entered in the greatest (strategy) game ever.

[DimeBagHo]

eldal - Did you run the XGM-MM installer in the extras folder? The steps for making MM work with XGM go like this:

1. Install RTW
2. Install the official 1.2 patch.
3. Install MM
4. Install XGM
5. Run the XGM-MM installer from the extras folder.

If you skip a step, or get them in the wrong order, then weird things will happen.

[eldal]

:help: I did all the steps as you said but unfortunately the problem remain. If I put only the XGM then everything is OK. But if I put the MM first (with the propper way) then start the weird things. Does anyone else have the same problems or only me? Apart from that the new units are fantastic. I have one disagreement though. Why did you stop the production of Spartan Hoplites at Syracouses since this city was for ages colony of Spartan people. I undestand the discipline was not as good as it was at Sparta but anyway Spartans were their ancestors. And finally if you need some help with greek names or words I will be happy to help.

[DimeBagHo]

Syrcuse was a Corinthian colony and, although it had some ancient cultural connections with the Spartans, they never had the Spartan system of laws and training that produced Spartan hoplites. In fact Syracuse was democratic for much of it's history, making it more like Athens in many ways.

[DimeBagHo]

As for the problems with XGM and Mundus Magnus. Try downloading XGM again. Some people were having a problem with a file being set as read-only and then being skiped over by the XGM-MM installer. I updated the XGM 2.1.2 installers so that they would force over-write. That might help with your problem.

Otherwise - if you start with a clean install of RTW, and follow all the steps above, everything should work.

[eldal]

Sorry, you are right about the Syracuse. The Spartans just found the opportunity to "help" the Syracusians defeat the Athenian fleet during the pelloponesian war. They were just allies. But after their democracy (not as free as Athens democracy) uprisen the tyrant Dionysus who let Plato to try his oligarchic system in Syracuse.
I 'll let you know about the cooperation of MM and XGM.
Thanks anyway! ~:cheers:

[DimeBagHo]

eldal - If you run into the same problem with not being able to recruit the right units in the right places, try downloading XGM again, and doing a new install. I just discovered a problem that might explain what you were seeing.

If you do the XGM+MM install wrong, start a campaign, then do the XGM+MM install right, and start a new campaign, the new campaign will still be bugged because of a file (map.rwm) that is left over from the first time you started the MM campaign. I have made a new version of the XGM-MM installer that fixes this problem.

[eldal]

I am in the very pleasant place to inform you that with the downloading of the new XGM all problems solved. Many many thanks. I will win a greek cities campaign dedicated to you. :charge:

[Intru]

Yeah i wouldnt start one now if i were you, in the TWC forum, we were informed that the new version of the XGM mod is coming out in 1 to 2 days or at the most this week.

[DimeBagHo]

Version 2.2 is pretty much done, but the release is going to be held up until things get sorted out over at TWC.

You can see the new readme here (http://homepage.mac.com/abradbury/xgmread/xgmreadme.html).

[Intru]

dont do this to me man i join here to be able to here about the mod, loli guess ill wait

[eldal]

Is it going to work with the MM mod? Or you will release a new XGM-MM installer?

[Ianofsmeg16]

does XGM work with rome total realism 5.4.1?

[Intru]

TWC s gona be done for a long time i have heard, you should realy consider realesing it here :bow:

[DimeBagHo]

eldal - It should still work with Mundus Magnus, with the XGM-MM installer.

ian_of_smeg16 - No, XGM and RTR modify many of the same files so they will over-write eachother.

Intru - If TWC takes too long to get organized I will arrange for another host. But I think I will give it another day or two before I do that.

[Intru]

Agh i guess i could wait for one more day, but just remember this i will kill you for this!!!! :charge:

[DimeBagHo]

You can get the new version of XGM here: http://www.dimebagho.tk/

The main change from 2.1.2 are:
1. New Spartan skins and models from AnastasioTheGreat.
2. Athenian Marine Archers added (maybe with a new skin from meh_cd).
3. New Victory conditions for the Greek factions.
4. Hypaspists will have much heavier armour.

The new victory conditions are:
Greek Cities - Spread Greek culture: Fifty provinces + capture the four corners of the known world.
Macedon - Restore Alexander's Empire: Fifty provinces + capture Sparta, Alexandria, Antioch, and Susa.
Seleucids - A Great Empire Will Fall: Fifty provinces + capture the four Roman capitals.
Thrace - Black Sea Empire: Fifty provinces + capture every province on the Black Sea.

I have made a few other tweaks and changes including:
-A bunch of new bug fixes for vanilla bugs.
-Romans get Triarii sooner.
-Early cohorts are eliminated, and Late Cohorts show up sooner.
-Sarmatian Mercenaries have much heavier armour so they are now one of the best heavy cavalry units.
-Minimum date for Marius reforms moved forward to 220 BC.
-A surprise bonus for liberating a certain former Greek colony.

The new victory conditions and the "surprise bonus" are really trial runs for a missions system. If they work out OK, and people like them then I will make more for later versions.
Edit/Delete Message

[eldal]

Is the old saved games from the 2.1.2 version going to be playable with the new one? I'm asking because I'm bored of doing the procedure again and if it doesn't work again and again and again...

[eldal]

Can I install the new version without uninstalling the old or I'll have problems?

[DimeBagHo]

Can I install the new version without uninstalling the old or I'll have problems?
It should work OK. If you reinstall RTW some time what you should do is make a copy of the data directory and call it something like data_clean. Then when you want to uninstall a mod, or use a different mod, you can just delete or rename your data directory, and make a new one from the clean copy. That way you don't have to keep reinstalling the game each time.


Is the old saved games from the 2.1.2 version going to be playable with the new one?

Old saved games probably won't work correctly. If you want to finish your current campaign, don't install the new version until you are finished with the campaign.

[Ianofsmeg16]

Hi!
Do you know of anywhere else i can download Mundus Magnus, because twcenter's downloads bit seems to be messed up
and also, congrats to dimebagho for a great mod!! :bow: ~:cheers: :bow:

[DimeBagHo]

Hi!
Do you know of anywhere else i can download Mundus Magnus...

There were some links in the discussion thread over at TWC. Unfortunately TWC is not responding at the moment (DNS attack maybe?) so I can't provide a link.

[eldal]

DimeBagHo I played your mod a lot and it is fantastic. The XGM (2.0) doesn't work with MM though (probably you'll have to release a new XGM-MM).Also very cool the new victory contitions. :charge: :charge:

[DimeBagHo]

I have released an update for XGM (version 2.2.1). You can get here. (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=484)

The only changes are a few minor bug fixes.
-XGM-MM has been updated for Athenian Archers and should work fine now.
-The new victory conditions have been added for Mundus Magnus.
(but the old victory conditions have not been disabled for MM)
-Dogs have been completely removed from buildings.
(I missed one building level in version 2.2)

[eldal]

Magnificent, enormous, awesome. The new victory conditions for MM make us play a real huge TW with great, cool units. Bravo!!! ~D

[Ianofsmeg16]

Any plans for 3.0? i have some ideas...

1. Get rid of the brutii faction and give their provinces to the GCS, this is hisoricall correct to the time(keep the senate and scipii)

2. Beef up thrace, they are a very weak greek faction, or at least give them new skins or colours..the bright blue is just awefull!

3. Rename Egypt to Ptolemaic(sp??) Empire and give it greek units (basically macedon's but with a hint of african)

4. if you do no.1 then you have an extra faction slot, or an extra greek city (seperate Athens and sparta!!!)

I know this sounds large but hey, you can release it in bits, e.g 3.0 beefed up thrace..3.1 brutii gone, GCS get southern italy provinces..3.2 Seperate Athens and sparta into seperate factions and 3.3 Egypt renamed to ptolemaic empire and given extra units..something like that, keep this mod alive, it is a legend of a mod

[mentor]

Can u help me?
I've downloaded your XGM mod, but it's doesn't work!
I've installed RTW 1 + RTW 1.2 Patch anew, but compaign game crushes to desktop :( Why?
So, in fact, i don't have problems with other mods - all work fine... But custom battle work.
Thnx!

PS
U've made an excellent mod, and russian fans want play XGM too!

[sean8005]

im having a problem that someone else was having about crashing to desktop.

ive done all the steps correctly in the right order. which is

install game
install 1.2 patch
install mundus magnus
install Extended greek mod
install Extended greed mod in the extras folder

i have the newest version 2.2.1

run game. now i load up as the greeks, and after a few turns i crash to desktop Always on the rebels turn. only thing is i can't get past it. i can only go about 3 turns into a game and never any farther.

looks like i can play a regular game with the Extended Greeks(haven't tested it too far, although the AI is a little funky)

any help?

[sean8005]

ok looks like playing a regular game with the Extended Greeks is giving me the same problem, after a few turns i CTD, i don't know if i should try to reinstall the game with only the greek mod and see if that works. but im guessing it is most likely the Greek Mod Making the game crash, of course i have no idea why.

[Helgi]

[QUOTE=mentor]Can u help me?
I've downloaded your XGM mod, but it's doesn't work!
I've installed RTW 1 + RTW 1.2 Patch anew, but compaign game crushes to desktop :( Why?
QUOTE]
(Being a Newbie and all), it could be your system or just a bad download. I've installed RTW 1 + RTW 1.2 Patch and then XGM mod and I was golden I even changed my Spartan skin from the vanilla to the vertical with the short red cloak. When you get it up and running it's great. Best RTW Mod I've Played, waiting on NAP 2, Hyborian TW and Chiv. SP :duel: ~:cheers:

[Crusader4thepeople]

I keep getting an error saying failed to load mount directory. ANy help?

Oh and can i use the spartan skins on my vanilla RTW aswell?

[Helgi]

Ok, Crusader, wipe RTW from your system and and check what the system req.'s and if your system can handle it, then reload it and 1.2. Now if it is the download, then download a copy of XGM from a different site. I've never had a problem loading this mod and I do not recommend loading the spartan skin on to the vanilla, (I maybe wrong on this).

http://www.pch.gc.ca/progs/cpsc-ccsp/images/flag_old_fleur_d_l.gif

[Alexanderofmacedon]

Can we get some screens, or am I not looking hard enough?

[Teufelhunden]

Need some help with this one:
After I've installed both the XGM and Mundus Magnus according to the directions, I attempt to play a game. I go into provincial campaign, select Mundus Magnuss, hit the arrow, select my race (greek) and press the arrow to advance again. It pauses for a second, then drop me back at the Provincial Campaign selection screen and selecting the MM mod again and attempting to press the arrow to advance now does nothing! Any ideas?

-Teuf

[Crusader4thepeople]

System Requirements perfect ,reloaded, downloaded 1.2, dowloaded from other side, problem with mount directory.But thats not that important but do the new spartan skins work with vanilla?

[Helgi]

It did not work for me, and the Gods know how I detest the vanilla spartan skin, my favorite is a toss up between the Vertical and Horizontal plumed Spartan. and I had problems with Mundas, so I never bothered with it.

[Suraknar]

Excelent Mod! Congratulations!!

This will work with MM v2...yes?

[Helgi]

MM v2 has not worked for me, though XGM works great on it's own and the ablity to change from that boring vanilla spartan to some of the other spartan skins, It's great.

[Suraknar]

Affirmative, just tryed it...

Installed Stock game
Installer Patch 1.2
Installed MM v2
Installed XGM
Installed XGM-MM

It does not work...Provincial Campaign does not start.

Reinstalled MM v2 on top of all... Provincial Campaign Starts Fine (Nice map :P)

I guess a new XGM-MM file is needed...

Unless I can somehow Integrate the Units from XGM to MM v2...

[DimeBagHo]

Glad you all like the mod. I have been doing other things for a while, but after the patch comes out I will look at doing a new version that works with the patch and MM2. No promises though - it depends very much on how much work is required.

[DimeBagHo]

It looks like XGM would have to be re-done from scratch to make it work with RTW 1.3. I will probably make a new version of XGM to work with RTW 1.3, but the first release will not contain anywhere near the content of XGM 2.2. It will probably just add some (or all) of the extra Greek units. Whether I make more complete versions afterwards will depend on (1) how much interest people show in getting new versions and (2) how much I start playing RTW again ~:) .

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.0 is done and available to download.

Version 3.0 is designed to work with RTW + 1.3 patch. It will not work with 1.2. I don't know whether it will work with RTW: BI (if someone wants to give it a try, let me know what happens).

There are no new features beyond what was in XGM 2.2.1, but a few things have been removed.
-Make RTW harder is no longer included (I don't think it will work with 1.3)
-XGM-MM is no longer included (I don't think MM works with 1.3)
-The movement and kill rate changes have been removed (they might be back in a later version)
-The Greek translations are gone (they will probably be back in a later version)
-A few minor tweaks are gone

Otherwise everything is there, all the units, buildings, victory conditions, etc.

You can download it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

[DimeBagHo]

XGM 3.1 is done and available for download.

You can download it here. (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712)

This new release comes hot on the heels of 3.0, but there were a few kinks with the transition to RTW 1.3 that I missed in 3.0 so it had to be done. On the plus side this new version should work with RTW:BI, and it uses the -mod:mymod command line switch so it does not overwrite any files in the RTW data folder.

The major changes are:

-Reworked to use the -mod switch
-Fixed some XGM/1.3 conficts including one CTD
-Fixed some minor RTW bugs
-Victory conditions now use descr_win_conditions.txt
-Greek factions can now build all Greek temples (required for 1.3)
-Roman factions can now build all Roman temples (required for 1.3)
-Weather mod removed (conflict with 1.3)
-War Elephants for Pontus added
-Cretan Archers for Seleucids added
-Recruitment for Athenian Marine archers changed (required for 1.3)
-Removed all factions except Greek + Pontus (mostly to save space)

If you have already started a campaign with XGM 3.0 there is no particular reason to install 3.1. There is one potential CTD in 3.0 but it is easy to avoid. You might get it if you go to the building browser in Athens and try to look at the Seige Engineer. If you do install 3.1 your saved games from 3.0 *might* work.

[DimeBagHo]

I have released a new version (3.1.1) to fix a problem with a couple of missing files.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM 3.2 is done and available for download.

You can download it here. (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712)

This new release adds some new low level units, and a bunch of gameplay changes. Saved games from XGM version 3.0 onwards should continue to work (although, because of the reversion to limited temple ownership, you might find yourself with some temples that you can't upgrade).

The major changes are:

-Reverted to limited temple ownership for Greek factions
-Added movement(-20%)/morale(+2)/killrate(-10%) mod
-Added weather mod (minor)
-Added night battles
-Added several new Greek traits
-Added slingers to Roman, Greek and Eastern factions
-Added archers to Carthage
-Added Eastern Heavy Infantry to Pontus and Parthia
-Changed Eastern Heavy Infantry to non-phlanax spear
-Changed all non-phalanx spear units to size 60 (except Triarii)
-Added Thureophoroi to GCS, Macedon, and Seleucids
-Added Thorakitai to GCS, Macedon, and Seleucids
-Added Spear Warband to Thrace
-Moved all javelin units to baracks
-Reduced number of mercs available in Greece
-Increased mercs available in Africa
-Triarii recruitable with city baracks
-All Hypaspists are now sword/javelin
-Corinthians reduced to 1 hp, cost also reduced

[Ianofsmeg16]

Nice one!
Have you thought about adding special abilities from BI into this? I remember seeing something about a guy who made hoplites able to do shield wall, and it looked better than the phalanx formation it has now.

[DimeBagHo]

Nice one!
Have you thought about adding special abilities from BI into this? I remember seeing something about a guy who made hoplites able to do shield wall, and it looked better than the phalanx formation it has now.
I'm looking into it, and I will include what I can.

Last time I checked RTW just ignores the shield wall flag, but I think that SPQR had it's own shield wall formation. I would like to get rid of the vanilla phalanx if only because it is so unbreakable for Roman troops - but none of the alternatives are entirely satisfactory.

[Zarax]

BI shield wall doesn't work in RTW, the pics with the hoplites in shield wall you saw are of ported units...

[DimeBagHo]

I've posted a small update (version 3.2.1) to fix a bug with one of the units in 3.2. Night battles are also considerably improved (I just figured out how to get all the lighting and torches going).

[DimeBagHo]

I've uploaded another small update (to version 3.2.2). The main changes are:

-Added War Elephants to Armenia and Egypt
-Added Early Legionaries to Seleucids
-All new units now have sprites
-Minor changes to some skins, unit cards, and descriptions
-Some changes to unit stats
-Marius event now required for all copy legionaries

I changed the armour ratings of a few units. Triarii now have better armour. Some other units have had their armour reduced a little (Armoured Hoplites, Hypaspists, and some pre-Marius cavalry units).

[DimeBagHo]

Another small update is available (to version 3.2.3). It fixes a couple of recruitment bugs and implements land bridges.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.3 is done and available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The major changes are:
-Added two new land bridges to Rhodes and Salamis
-Added balancing script to boost AI factions
-Added sub-faction leaders for GCS
-Changed GCS and Macedon starting positions
-Added Gastraphetes
-Reduced size and increased cost of new heavy infantry units
-Minor UI changes

Balancing Script: Macedon now puts up a better fight, although in the games I watched it still succumbed eventually to the pressure from an alliance of the Brutii and the GCS (which is more-or-less historical). The Seleucids no longer get crushed by attacks from all directions. In the games I watched they usually bacame a dominant player in Asia Minor, and held up, or even expanded elsewhere.

Sub-Factions Leaders: Each of the initial Greek city states now has it's own leader and ruling family.

[Zarax]

Excellent work, I've tried your mod and I must say I'm very impressed by the quality of your work.

If you've got some extra time there are a few things that you may want to add in order to improve other greek warfare styled faction, namely Carthage and Egypt.

Some quick suggestions:

- Remove phalanx formation from lybian and nubian spearmen, historically they were much more similar to your Thureophoroi than anything resembling phalangites, as they were historically deployed to cover the phalanx' flanks.

- Add phalanx pikemen (and maybe levy too, though I'd say they're optional) to Carthage

- Phoeni infantry should be more similar to Hypaspist, Carthaginian heavies (except phalangites) were equipped in a similar way to the roman triarii... A quick way would be to just give them the hoplite skeleton with slightly different textures and maybe an oval shield, stats should be ok like they are maybe except for mass (set it to 1.3 and it should work fine.

- Nile spearmen should be upped to 60 units and given the long phalanx pike (ptolemies had macedonian style phalangites, the nile guys can be easily fixed that way)

- Ptolemies had their own imitation legionaries, though they likely were lighter armoured than their macedonian counterparts... A quick way there would be to remove phalanx from pharaoh's guards and give them a shield.

Some other stuff I haven't tested:

- Seleucid early generals should use chariots, as they did at raphia and magnesia (though with little success) while later ones should have a cataphract - like bodyguard

Low priority stuff:

- Numidian generals should be eastern style ones, a reskinned pontic bodyguards would do fine

- Numidian cavalry is severely underpowered in game, either give to their light cav a melee stat boost or add a reskinned pontic heavy cav with the prec attribute (gaetulian mercenaries were historically used as shock cav), those were the guys that decided the punic wars and not some puny militia cav...

- Carthage should have light lancers instead of round shield cav

- iberian inf should be recruitable only in spain or carthage should be able to recruit numidian cav too... in the first case put libian spearmen down a level to compensate

Sorry if the list seems almost a total realism like mod, but most changed can be made with little work (I already modded most of them in the game except for reskins and model changes since I don't have any skill there) and would really add value to the MOD allowing for a much more varied gameplay.

[DimeBagHo]

Thanks Zarax, those all look like good suggestions.

There will be a small update comming out soon that will tweak a few things. Your suggested change for Nubian Spearmen will be included. It looks like CA already made Libyans non-phalanx in 1.3. Your other suggested changes for Carthage, Numidia, and Egypt will require a bit more work in terms of model changes and balance testing, so they will have to wait for a more substantial update.

I am not wild about the idea of putting Seleucid General's into chariots just because they tend to die too easily (guess CA got that part right ~:) ). But I do like the idea of changing the late version to cataphracts. Unfortunately that would break saved game compatibility so it will have to wait for a much bigger revision of the mod.

[Zarax]

Thanks Zarax, those all look like good suggestions.

There will be a small update comming out soon that will tweak a few things. Your suggested change for Nubian Spearmen will be included. It looks like CA already made Libyans non-phalanx in 1.3. Your other suggested changes for Carthage, Numidia, and Egypt will require a bit more work in terms of model changes and balance testing, so they will have to wait for a more substantial update.

I am not wild about the idea of putting Seleucid General's into chariots just because they tend to die too easily (guess CA got that part right ~:) ). But I do like the idea of changing the late version to cataphracts. Unfortunately that would break saved game compatibility so it will have to wait for a much bigger revision of the mod.

Let me know if you need help, I'm still a quite basic modder on RTW but I've got some spare time to do some basic rebalancing and refining (which came out quite well on MTW and I hope to do the same for RTW)...
If you pm me your e-mail I'd be glad to send you an unit file with some of the proposed changes (though not based on your mod yet)...

[Zarax]

I think I found a bug, it looks like that the greek factions gets their generals swapped, so that the heavier one comes before the marian reforms while the weaker variant comes after that... this is quite evident in custom battles as the armoured general pic gets the light one stats and vice versa...

Other than that I'd suggest to up hoplites to 50 men/unit as it would be more historical than having them of the same size as a legionary cohort...

As usual let me know if you need help...

P.S. did you receive the modded unit file i sent on your e-mail?

[DimeBagHo]

Zarax - I got the files. I've been working on switching the Egyptians to pikes.

Thanks for spotting the problem with the generals. It was not so serious - they just had the same names, same cost, and they were listed in the wrong order in custom battles. But the stats were otherwise correct, and everything worked fine in campaign. While I was looking at that stuff I found a handful of other small errors in cost and formation settings though ~;) .

[Zarax]

Glad to be of help, I'm dabbling with your mod to make a customized version with some slight touches on historical accuracy and roster variety, helps springing ideas for new things...

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.3.2 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The main changes are:
-Egyptian units have been brought in line with those of other successor states. Nubian Spearmen are now non-phalanx, and similar to Thureophoroi or Eastern Infantry. Nile Spearmen are now Nile Pikemen, and similar to Levy Pikemen. Pharaoh's Guards are now armed with pikes, and similar to Foot Companions or Silver Shield Pikemen. Egyptian Chariot Generals have been replaced with a cavalry bodyguard. The early and late bodyguard units are now similar to those of the Greek factions.
-Some unit masses have been changed to make sword units a little more effective against phalanx formations.
-The Senate now uses only Praetorian and Auxilary units.
-A bunch of other minor fixes and tweaks.

Zarax: As you can see I followed a number of your suggestions for the Egyptians. In the test campaigns I ran they usually held out for quite a while but eventually got squeezed between the Scipii and the Seleucids.

[Zarax]

Great, I'll test the changes and report later...

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.3.3 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The main changes are:
-Armoured Hoplites re-skinned
-Greek Cavalry re-skinned
-Greek Peltasts and some similar units now use javelin for melee as well as throwing
-Militia Cavalry and some similar units now use javelin for melee as well as throwing
-Error in some RTW pletast skins corrected
-Cavalry units re-balanced, most are now a little weaker

The skin and appearance changes are quite minor. Barbarian cavalry are mostly untouched. Civilised cavalry units have had their attacks lowered a little, and rebalanced. General units have been brought into line with their equivalent regular units, which meant quite a big reduction in attack for some general units.

Zarax: Numidian cavalry got a significant boost, but I haven't made any other changes to Numidian or Carthaginian cavalry yet.

[Zarax]

Great Job DimeBagHo, after some historical research I found another quick change that you might want to do:

Roman Velites shoud be similar to heavy peltast in stats and use square formation.
It seems that before the reforms Velites were supposed not only to do the usual screening job but also to actively engage the enemy skirmishers to clear the path for the legion... This was their way to compensate for the lackuster quality of their cavalry.

Anyways, if you want to focus on the important things I might help you by releasing a "foreigner macedonian style warfare edition" with your permission, so players that wants some extra depth for the punics and the like can get some quick and dirty add-on...

[Zarax]

Another quick note: I quite like the greek cavalry reskin, it makes them look "heavier", but the armoured hoplite one needs some extra touches imho, now they look too much like the vanilla hoplites, with only a darker cuirass... quite hard to spot the difference between them on the battlefield imho.

Edit: This also affects the carthaginian sacred band, they look like they're using the standard hoplite model with your reskin...

[DimeBagHo]

Yes, they both use the standard hoplite model now. The only difference is the helmet style. I think that the different shields make it easy enough to identify them on the battlefield though.

Feel free to make that add-on. If it works out I might merge it into XGM later.

I've been working on changing the Macedonian symbols and banners to use the Vergina Sun, rather than the ahistorical Laconian "L". Here's a couple of screenshots of what the new banners etc. look like (they are based on the ones made by Kos007 (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=653)).

https://img422.imageshack.us/img422/1379/verginasun2xp.th.jpg (https://img422.imageshack.us/my.php?image=verginasun2xp.jpg) https://img422.imageshack.us/img422/4106/verginasun22ys.th.jpg (https://img422.imageshack.us/my.php?image=verginasun22ys.jpg)

[Zarax]

Great! I'll make and add-on and upload it on my server for evaluation purposes.

BTW, if you got some extra time I think that either lybian spears or phoeni infantry needs a reskin... I'm more or less getting around that by using the standard hoplite model for the phoeni but it's not exactly the best choice...

[Zarax]

Here is it:

Foreign macedonian style warfare is a small (and quite crude for now) add-on for XGM, trying to get a better picture of how Carthage used a combined arms approach inspired by the greek and macedonian armies.

Some changes from XGM:

- Lybian spearmen now don't use phalanx anymore, as historically similar units were used as medium infantry to cover the phalanx flanks rather than being part of it.

- Phoeni infantry now uses short pikes and got slightly improved secondary attack to reflect the carthaginian interpretation of hypaspists, they still uses phalanx only becauses it allows them to switch to swords against infantry.
They will use the hoplit model until I will be able to find a proper alternative.

- Carthage now gets phalanx pikemen and light lancers, proper textures will be put in the next version.

- Roman cavalry now has lower morale to reflect their poor consideration in roman warfare

- Triarii now fight as short pike phalanx, to reflect their role as shield wass used mainly to allow safe retreat for the rest of the legion.

- Velites are now similar to heavy peltasts but still have small shield so they are vulnerable to missile fire.

- Numidian mercenaries and cavalry got their melee stats back to original values but 50% more ammo (sorry dimebagho, after some historical researh I found that as the best way to depict their real advantage)

- All general units now have their bodyguards halved to reflect the fact they weren't really involved in direct combat unless under dire circumstances.

The add-on is available at http://microsoftuse.temp.powweb.com/hosted/Data.exe

How to install: Just point the self extracting archive to the xgm/data folder, it will add and overwrite the necessary files.

How to uninstall: just reinstall XGM.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.3.4 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The main changes are:
-Macedon symbol changed to Vergina Sun
-Macedon and Seleucids can now build temple of Poseidon
-Script added to spawn GCS subfaction leader for Syracuse
-GCS can now build temple of Artemis
-All Roman factions can now recruit Arcani
-Epic Stone Walls (mostly) removed
-Hidden AI General bonus trait added (new campaigns only)
-All factions playable except Senate and Slaves
-Minor UI changes

The new banners and symbols for Macedon are based on the ones made by Kos007 with just some small changes to make them fit in with the style of the vanilla symbols for other factions. Allowing Macedon and the Seleucids to build temples of Poseidon makes it possible for them to build Hepteres and Deceres. I removed Epic Stone walls just because personally I don't like they way they look :). The AI General bonus gives all AI generals 2 command and 2 management points. I have also made it so that all AI generals have about a 20% chance of being able to fight night battles, even if they don't have sufficient command stars.

Nothing to do with the update, but worth noting anyway - I have been using Archer's Skymod with XGM and it (1) works fine, and (2) looks great. To install it with XGM you should install XGM first and then copy his RTW 1.3 files into xgm/data. The sky mod is here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=740).

Zarax: I agree about the Numidians. It seems they avoided melee whenever possible. I have adjusted their melee attack and morale to bring it in line with Greek Militia Cavalry, increased their ammo, and also given them some significant terrain bonuses for scrub and sand (ancient authors noted their ability to ride well in terrain where most cavalry couldn't ride at all).

[Zarax]

Great Job! I will update the add-on later to follow the new version...

[Ragnor_Lodbrok]

I'm playing XGM right now and it's fun.
But why do the Seleucids get the gastraphetes?Wasn't the gastraphete invented in Syracuse?

[Zarax]

The Gastraphete was invented in Greece around 400bc and was rendered obsolete by siege weapons like the ballistae and similar stuff.
The seleucid would be the best candidate to have an unit using it tactically, even though it's not the most historically accurate thing in the mod...

[DimeBagHo]

Zarax is right. Gastraphetes were old technology by the start of the game period, although they were probably still around, and the Greeks in general would have known how to make them. I gave them to the Seleucids for three reasons. They are a type of composite bow, so they work best in the dry climate of the Seleucid Empire. The skills required to make good composite bows would be more common in the east where the Seleucids are. Finally, the Seleucids would have the most reason to retain them because of the horse archers employed by their opponents.

I think they were invented in Syracuse though, and of course, in the game period, Syracuse built amazing seige weapons (mostly due to the genius of Archimedes). At some point I would like to add some unique seige weapons to Syracuse. It's a pity there is no way to do this:

https://img493.imageshack.us/img493/3736/200pxclawanimation6qy.gif

[Zarax]

Well, in the meantime I would give Syracuse somewhat better defences from the start, after all it was like constantinople in the middle ages: a very, very hard nut to crack. The romans took it only because a gate was left open as the defences were still pretty much intact even after 4 years.

BTW, if you can make an unique retinue tied to a city it would be cool to get Archimedes with an academy or something like that...

[DimeBagHo]

Archimedes is already in vanilla RTW. I set things up so that, when the GCS capture Syracuse, a script spawns Heiro of Syracuse with Archimedes in his retinue.

[Zarax]

Nice touch, great job...

[DimeBagHo]

I've made some changes to the way that Carthage recruits units. They should have mercenary heavy armies, but there seems to be no good way to make that happen just by adding in more mercenaries for hire. So I figured I might as well just let them train a variety of mercenary units. I made a few other changes as well.

Carthage now has three areas of recruitment: Carthage, Africa, and Spain. Sacred Band, and Sacred Band Cavalry, are only recruitable in Carthage and New Carthage. Iberian Infantry, Iberian Cavalary, and Iberian Mercenaries are only recruitable in Spain. Desert Peltasts, Desert Infantry, Libyan Infantry, Numidian Cavalry, Desert Cavalry, Desert Camel Warriors, and Desert Camel Archers, are only recruitable in Africa. Carthaginian Spearmen are only recruitable outside of Africa (these are low quality auxilaries). Also Poeni infantry can now be recruited, in two turns, with a City Barracks, while Sacred Band can be recruited in two turns with an Army Barracks.

[Zarax]

I think that's a bit too complex for the AI to manage...

If you import the changes I made in the add-on pack some posts ago you might want to build the resources this way:

Carthage: Sacred Band units

Africa: Lybian spears and numidian mercenaries

Spain: Iberian infantry and spanish mercenaries

Everywhere: Phoeni infantry (can use 2 turns if you mod them with +1 to 2nd attack and short pikes but still in phalanx so they can use both weapons effectively), round and long shield cavalry plus the usual auxiliaries.

I would also add to their roster the following units, as their equivalents were used historically:

- Phalanx pikes (at the same barracks level as phoeni), the seleucid skin fits nicely there (and actually the seleucid helped carthage in the 2nd punic war, there are second hand sources that states they even sent some manpower but it is certain they gave "military advisors" plus they gave shelter to hannibal after Zama... too bad they didn't trust him enough to command the army at magnesia)

- Light lancers were also used (though they were most likely gauls or spaniards) though that would take a bit more work on the model as there is no fitting skin for them...

Also, here's a couple things you may want to evaluate ask permission for:

http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=546 - This is a set of carthaginian and mercenary skins plus a few extra units

http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=363 - This small mod enables the hidden distinctive walls for each culture

I hope this will be helpful...

[Ilsamir Lord]

I'll need to get this one again I think, I had a previous version and I always liked playing as the Greeks.

[Zarax]

I'd absolutely recommend it, this mod is coming up pretty nicely...

[DimeBagHo]

Zarax: The AI seems to be handling the new system OK. As far as infantry goes the line-up in each region is pretty simple. The cavalry line-up in Africa is complicated, but I don't think it matters as much if cavalry units wind up being quite diverse.

I have been playing around with ways to include Macedonian style phalanxes. It's hard to get the balance right though.

(1) AI vs Human. Having two or three phalanx units in a stack is nearly useless. You need to persuade the AI to make stacks where about half the units are phalanax so that it has a decent line. But the relatively low attack and defense values for phalanx units makes them look unattractive to the AI when they have other options available.
(2) AI vs AI. Phalanx units get screwed in autocalc. Again, they have relatively low attack and defence values, and autocalc doesn't seem to weigh the phalanx ability high enough.
(3) Human vs AI. If you fix (1) and (2) then human players find it too easy to play the faction. Macedonian style phlanxes in general make life too easy for human players because they are so unbreakable from the front.

Of ccourse these are already problems for other Macedonian style factions - I just don't want to add them to the Carthaginians as well, especially when they have so much trouble holding up against the Romans as it is.

I suppose one solution would be to drop long pikes enitirely and use the shorter pike to represent the Macedonian style phalanx.

[DimeBagHo]

I suppose one solution would be to drop long pikes enitirely and use the shorter pike to represent the Macedonian style phalanx.

The more I think about it the more I like this idea. The different pike lengths are totally ahistorical - everyone was using longer pikes by the time of the game period. But there were other significant differences in the way that phalangites were equiped. Some used relatively small shields and light armour, others appear to have used relatively large shields and heavy armour. So it would still make sense to differentiate along the lines of smaller heavier units vs larger lighter units.

Balancing would also be *much* easier without the long pikes.

[Zarax]

Well, there's a few things to consider:

1) having few phalanx units per carthaginian stack isn't a bad thing on the historical side, as the phalangites never took more than one quarter of a typical carthaginian army (at least in the 2d punic war)... The problem is more on how to make the AI employ other heavy infantry to cover the flanks...

2) Have you tried modding phoeni infantry to be classified as heavy infantry, give them the short pike (not the hoplite one) and raising their sword attack to 6 or 7? In my tests the carthaginian tends to build them in decent amounts, and they quite capable of holding the line against roman infantry and cavalry...

3) What I found quite unbalancing is actually the land bridges on Sicily, especially that between Carthage and lilybaeum... The punics can afford loosing sicily (which is even easier now that there are no GCS there) but they absolutely gets crippled by often having a scipii stack knocking on carthage in 30 turns... That gives the romans a really easier start, which isn't something they quite need... If it was for me i'd give messana to the mamertines (strong rebels) and Syracuse back to GCS as sicily wasn't quite the roman playground for a long time.

3) Finally, even though carthage used a macedonian-like combined army approach they usually didn't have more than 1/3 of their army based on heavy units, usually divided between some phalangites and other, more flexible heavies to hold the center with the rest being a mix of light spaniards, medium spearmen like the lybians and a mix of light cavalry composed mostly by numidians and barbarian lancers with few heavier cav composed by the richer punics, all of course with some elephants to give the initial shock...

[DimeBagHo]

(2) I've tried using short_pike a little and I didn't like the results much. They have such a short reach in phalanx formation that the troops switch to swords almost immediately on contact with the enemy. I'll try some more experiments though. I am planing to make a new model for German spearmen so that they can use short-pike phalanx / long-spear non-phalanx rather than the current pike / sword setup.

(3) I would rather beef up the Carthaginians to slow down the Scipii than take away the land bridge. Giving Messana to the rebels might be worth a try though (as long as it doesn't fatally weaken the Scipii or prevent them from expanding at all).

For the cavalry, one possiblility is to make Iberian Cavalry into quite good light lancers, and to make Round Shield cavalry into low quality auxilaries.

[Pompei the Great]

The Carthaginians usually lose their cities quickly and make oodles of small armies, so they become sword fodder for the Scipii. My custom mod gives them good units, but they won't create a large army. What should I do?

[WhiteProphecy]

wdf

i tryied downloading the greek mod, i did, i also installed it, but right when i turn the greek mod on from my desktop, the RTW screen comes up, than it exits, what do i do?

[WhiteProphecy]

do i have to have the greek campaign unlocked? i had it unlocked than i had to reinstall RTW, now i lost all the campaigns i unlocked, is that why it wont work?

[WhiteProphecy]

ok, i got it where i can go on to the menu, now it says when i click on Imperial Campaign, it says

Pick somthing from the list





where is teh list?

[DimeBagHo]

Pompei the Great: Try giving them more money and larger populations in some of their smaller cities from the start. Part of the problem they have in vanilla RTW is that as soon as the fighting starts they lose all their trade and have no money. They can't even trade with their own colonies because most of them are not developed enough.

WhiteProphecy: Have you installed the 1.3 patch? Did you start the game with the "Extended Greek Mod" icon on your desktop? When the game started did you see a big picture of Athens with "Extended Greek Mod" in large gold writing at the top?

[Zarax]

(2) I've tried using short_pike a little and I didn't like the results much. They have such a short reach in phalanx formation that the troops switch to swords almost immediately on contact with the enemy. I'll try some more experiments though. I am planing to make a new model for German spearmen so that they can use short-pike phalanx / long-spear non-phalanx rather than the current pike / sword setup.

(3) I would rather beef up the Carthaginians to slow down the Scipii than take away the land bridge. Giving Messana to the rebels might be worth a try though (as long as it doesn't fatally weaken the Scipii or prevent them from expanding at all).

For the cavalry, one possiblility is to make Iberian Cavalry into quite good light lancers, and to make Round Shield cavalry into low quality auxilaries.

1) Short_pike is exactly what can make carthaginian heavies follow the historical unit... They will use the spear against cavalry and sword against infantry, making them a very good unit although somewhat weaker than principes and triarii... While not exactly a perfect setting that's what the carthaginian interpretation of hypaspists was.

2) I fear the problem is a bit complex here... Despite Hannibal running wild in Italy the 2nd punic war was mostly fought in Spain, the carthaginian economical and recruiting base.

3) I'd say change the round shields into something akin to light lancers or remove them fully... Aside from the sacred band and some other heavy cavalry corps the carthaginian totally relied on mercenaries like numidians and some barbarian cav...

[WhiteProphecy]

ok, i'll install the 1.3 patch

i hope this works!! lol

[WhiteProphecy]

alright, i got the greek mod to work, so far its awsome lookin, but i didnt play yet becuase everything is in GREEK!! lol but i think that is my fault, i downloaded the Greek Localization Mod 1.3, i think that puts the game in greek, than i downloaded the regular 1.3, and now the Greek Mod works, but it is still in Greek! how do i change it so its just in english?

[Zarax]

I fear you messed up your RTW and need to reinstall it... XGM doesn't use greek fonts...

[WhiteProphecy]

ya, i just reinstalled it, now i'm going to install virsion 1.3 regular

[WhiteProphecy]

yay, it worked

nice job on the mod man, the new skins kick ass!!!

[Zarax]

Here's some stuff that might be helpful for Carthage:

During the 6th and 5th centuries, most military commands were held by kings, but later the generalship was apparently dissociated from civil office. Even in the time of the kings, military authority appears to have been conferred upon the kings only for specific campaigns or in emergencies. The generals are said to have been regarded as potential overthrowers of the legal government, but in fact there is no record of any army commander's having attempted a coup d'état. Thus, unlike a Roman consul, the Suffetes did not take part in military affairs and the Carthaginians appointed professional generals, who were separate from the civil government.

The Phoenician populations were always small, and since these communities depended on trade to survive, it was decided to exempt citizens from military service under normal circumstances, and to use the wealth of the community to hire mercenary armies. For this they were criticized by 19th and early 20th century scholars, who valued the military service of the modern nation state (conscript armies of citizens loyal to the state), and for this reason compared the Carthaginian army unfavorably with the native army of the Romans. In fact, the Carthaginian military seems to have been no worse than the Roman, and proved disloyal only at the end of the First Punic War, when the Carthaginians could not pay rewards they had promised.

Up to the 6th century, the armies of Carthage were apparently citizen levies similar to those of all city-states of the early classical period. But Carthage was too small to provide for the defense of widely scattered settlements, and it turned increasingly to mercenaries, officered by Carthaginians, with citizen contingents appearing only occasionally.By the 3rd century BC, citizens were exempt from military service (to manage Punic trading interests and industries). Given the limited Carthaginian population (even though the city probably did eventually have a population in the low 100,000s), the decision seems to have made sense. If they had fought the Romans with their own population, they probably would have succumbed earlier than they did, and their mercenary military came close to defeating the Romans. Carthage was served quite well by its officer corp despite very exacting Punic standards. They usually crucified generals who lost and were reluctant reinforce winning generals, lest too many troops feed tyrannical ambitions.

Being traders, the Carthaginians naturally were skilled seamen and had a particularly potent navy of about 200 ships. This was of course necessary to maintain contact with their overseas settlements.

Since the Carthaginians needed money for their armies and navy, they were apparently severe in their exactions of money from the native populations they controlled, especially among the Libyans (the Berber natives of North Africa). As merchants, they had a bad reputation among the Greeks. There are numerous references to them in the Odyssey, uniformly hostile.

Libyans were considered particularly suitable for light infantry, the inhabitants of the later Numidia and Mauretania for light cavalry; Iberians and Celtiberians from Spain were used in both capacities. In the 4th century the Carthaginians also hired Gauls, Campanians, and even Greeks. The disadvantages of mercenary armies were more than outweighed by the fact that Carthage could never have stood the losses incurred in a whole series of wars in Sicily and elsewhere. Very little is known about the manning of the Carthaginian fleet; technically, it was not overwhelmingly superior to those of the Greeks, but it was larger and had the benefit of experienced sailors from Carthage's maritime settlements.

The Carthaginian Army during the First Punic War

The Carthaginian army was composed primarily of mercenary troops. Africa, Spain and Gaul were their recruiting grounds, an inexhaustible treasury of warriors as long as the money lasted which they received as pay.

The Berbers were a splendid cavalry; they rode without saddle or bridle, a weapon in each hand; on foot they were merely a horde or savages with elephant-hide shields, long spears, and bear-skins floating from their shoulders. The troops of Spain were the best infantry that the Carthaginians possessed; they wore a white uniform with purple facings; they fought with pointed swords. The Gauls were brave troops but were badly armed; they were naked to the waist; their cutlasses were made of soft iron and had to be straightened after every blow. The Balearic Islands supplied a regiment of slingers whose balls of hardened clay whizzed through the air like bullets, broke armour, and shot men dead.

We read much of the Sacred Legion in the Sicilian wars. It was composed of young nobles, who wore dazzling white shields and breast-plates which were works of art; who even in the camp never drank except from goblets of silver and of gold. But this corps had apparently become extinct, and the Carthaginians only officered their troops, who they looked upon as ammunition, and to whom their orders were delivered through interpreters. The various regiments of the Carthaginian army had therefore nothing in common with one another or with those by whom they were led. They rushed to battle in confusion, "with sounds, discordant as their various tribes," and with no higher feeling than the hope of plunder or the excitement which the act of fighting arouses in the brave soldier.

The Carthaginian Army in Spain
The Carthaginian armies in Spain, though hardly uniform in composition, shared certain common features. They were generally composed of both African and Spanish contingents. The African professional troops were considered far more valuable than the Iberian tribal levies.

The heavy infantry spearmen of Libya formed the backbone. They were armed with pikes or long spears, and probably fought in a formation similar to the Macedonian phalanx. The Libyan infantry proved to be a match for Rome's legionaries throughout the Second Punic War. These spearmen were augmented by Balearic slingers, renowned as the finest missile troops in the world at the time, along with Numidian archers and javelinmen.

It was, however, the mounted arm of the Carthaginian army that was decidedly superior to its Roman counterpart. The javelin-armed Numidians were far and away the finest light cavalry in the western world. Those superb horsemen provided Carthage the margin of victory time and again. Heavy cavalry, in the form of Libyan-Phoenician horsemen, though few in numbers, provided shock action to complement the fire of the Numidians.

A key element of the Carthaginian army was its elephants. Hannibal took elephants across the Alps, but most died on the journey or after the battle of the Trebbia.

[DimeBagHo]

WhiteProphecy: I'm glad you got it working ~:) .

Zarax: Here are a few possibilities I'am trying out at the moment.

(1) Libyans as heavy non-phalanx spear (better than Thorakitai, not as good as Triarii), Poeni equivalent to Armoured Hoplites, Sacred Band equivalent to hypaspists (either regular and recruitable anywhere, or Corinthian and recruitable in Carthage/New Carthage only).

(2) Libyans equivalent to phalanx pike (and recruitable anywhere), Poeni equivalent to Triarii, Sacred Band equivalent to hypaspists.

(3) Libyans equivalent to phalanx pike (and recruitable anywhere), Poeni equivalent to Silver Shield pike, Sacred Band equivalent to hypaspists.

I'm going to test out your short-pike/sword combination some more. If I like the results I might make Sacred Band use that set-up. If I like the results a lot I might switch all of the hypaspists to that set-up ~:).

[Zarax]

Well, I would avoid to change the carthaginians into another greek style faction...

I've spent some extra hours reading everything I could find about the Carthaginian army, and that's what I found:

- Their phalanx was pretty much composed of levies, so that it wasn't expected to move on the battlefield but only to absorb the brunt of the enemy charge while other units were the real killer. Levt pikemen might cover that.

- The core of most armies was composed of north african/celtiberian veteran heavy infantry, composed by the most loyal and reliable mercenary troops available.
Their task was to protect the phalanx flanks and they seemed to be armed pretty much like the classical hoplites, with a shorter spear and sword.
Those were the only infantry capable of going toe to toe with the romans, often taking the fight to the bitter end. Phoeni infantry with the short pike phalanx and a raised sword attack pretty much cover that role.

- A mix of celt warbands, composed mostly by gauls and ligurians were on the left of the phalanx, these were also mercenaries but considered not as good or reliable as the north africans. Making the sword warband mercenary in the gaulish regions would cover that, scutarii are already available.

- A mix of medium infantry from lybia and other places, armed with helmes, shield, a short spear and little else... not very reliable guys, they usually melted before the roman infantry. Libyan spears without phalanx may cover that, but either them or the phoeni needs a reskin as the look pretty much the same unit in battle....

- In Spain there was a lot (almost half of most armies there) of low quality light iberian infantry, mostly good for bulk and little else...

- Cavalry was composed mostly by numidians (they should get extra ammo to represent their ability to divert the enemy for most of the battle, it seems their hand to hand capability was ext to none) as we all know, plus some barbaric light lancers (modified round shields?) and a few heavier ones (Long shields should do the trick).

- The Sacred Band never fought outside african home defence, so that they should be available only in Carthage imho... Aside from their cavalry arm that looks like the usual companion copy there is little info about the infantry, but CA's interpretation looks acceptable to me...

- And of course elephants, though the cataphracted ones shouldn't be there and even the war elephants are a big stretch (they should be availabe only as mercenaries imho)

How to balance all this stuff on the player side?

Well, with the exception of the elite heavies, most Carthaginian army was composed of what they could scrape from the local warbands or hastily raised levies... Their combat capability ranges from shamefl to capable but they got one thing in common: as soon as thing started going bad, they would look for the nearest bus out of town... In other words, most units should have pretty low morale, so that only under a good general they got any hope to be an effective fighting force.
This is quite historical, as almost every carthaginian army that wasn't lucky enough to have hannibal as general was soundly beaten, with only the north african troops putting a real fight (baecula, ilipa, metaurus)...

That said, could you script to have a general appear with a custom bodyguard after the game starts? If yes, it would be interesting to spawn a guy called Hannibal Barca with a war elephant bodyguard (a bit of stretch but he actually rode a war elephant in battle, the legendary surus who survived the war until Zama)... I'm sure it would quite turn the tide of the campaign for a while in autocalc...

[Zarax]

BTW, spotted another little bug... Hypaspist are still classified as spearmen, this is likely to give the AI some pain...

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.4 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The main changes are:
-All pike formations now use the same pike length
-Revised Carthaginian recruiting, added mercenaries and levy pike
-Added Levy Pikemen to Thrace
-Hypaspists and Sacred Band now use spears/swords
-Added Forest and War Elephants to Numidia
-Changed Cathaginian starting position
-Changed Britons starting position.

Zarax: Thanks for the research. I deceided to give the Carthaginians a levy pike unit, recruitable anywhere, but otherwise no pike units. Libyans and Poeni are quite similar Triarii style units. Poeni are just as good as Triarii but more expensive. Libyans are not quite as good, but much cheaper. They do look a little different now, with Poeni having better looking armour. Sacred band are now short pike/swords.

[Zarax]

Great! I will give it a run ASAP...

BTW, after some further research I'm almost tempted to add javelins to the lowly iberian infantry... They seemed to use a javelin/light spear combination but I fear that would be quite unbalancing ingame...

Also: I'm not too sure about giving greeks and carthaginian too many similarities about their elite infantry, consider that carthaginian armies were considered nimbler than romans, who in turn were more flexible than greeks/macedonians...

Confusing? I know...

[Zarax]

Just ran a quick test... Excellent stuff!
Now, i've just got a question...? How did you made those great looking carthaginian phalangites and how did you change the hypaspist weapons? Are you a modeler?

[DimeBagHo]

I can do some fairly rudimentry modeling, like swapping weapons, shields, that sort of thing. The Carthaginian levy pikemen are just Iberian Infantry with a sword added as a secondary weapon, and shields relinked and repositioned. The Gastrapehetes are my most ambitious effort sor far. I made their crossbows out of the ones in BI.

In fact the hypaspists didn't require any change to the model. If you give a unit the phalanx attribute then their primary weapon will become a pike no matter what weapon the model has.

[Zarax]

Cool stuff... BTW: The phoeni needs to use short pike phalanx (like the sacred band one) if they still have a secondary weapon, so does the hypaspists, otherwise they will just stick to their spears with obvious effects against infantry, especially romans...

[DimeBagHo]

Hypaspists are short pike/sword now. I have changed the kill rate for spearmen so they are all more effective against infantry than they used to be. Sword infantry still have an advantage, but it is not quite as decisive. Poeni have the same stats as Triarii so they can handle anything the Romans have pre-Marius. Libyans will do quite well against Principes, although they will lose an otherwise even fight.

[WhiteProphecy]

I was goffing around looking at all the campaigns and stuff, dude, you dont have any iberian infantry for the Spanish!!!!! and i'm sorry, but what is with the greek cities not having that city in Scily. Also, dude i'm sorry, but you connect the Iberian Pinunsula with Northern Africa, that defeats the purpose of having a navy their, also by Rhodes, Scily to Rome, you connected all the good islands and stuff so you dont need a Navy. I know it is just autocalculate with the navy and you dont see anything, but still if i have all of Scily,i would like to move some armies out of Scily, and have a navy guarding it to not let Cartharge or Rome to try and take it over, come on, please make an edited virsion of all this, btw the new units are nice though.

[Zarax]

The land briges are a temporary measure made to compensate for the AI problems with naval invasions arose in 1.3, I think they will go out as soon as the problem will be fixed.

About Syracuse, I think the change has been done because it was a quite independent city-state, with little or no support from hellas...

[WhiteProphecy]

ok about the naval thing but Syracuse, that is awsome that it is independent, that why it is so fun to control that terictory so far away, becuase you can take all of Scily, and than march into Italy.

[Zarax]

Well, now you can control greece and then march into Italy and Sicily too...

[DimeBagHo]

WhiteProphecy:

(1) If you don't want the land bridges you can revert to the vanilla map quite easily. Run the XGM installer again, and then before you start a campaign, delete the following files:

xgm\Data\world\maps\base\map_heights.hgt
xgm\Data\world\maps\base\map_regions.tga

But, personally I find it a lot more fun to have to defend my cities rather than rely on the naval incompetence of the AI. You don't have to use the bridges yourself, and really the AI can't function without them.

(2) Carthage still has Iberian infantry (and Scutarii now) but only in Iberia (spain).

(3) Defending Syracuse was fun, but historically Syracuse was never a member of any of the alliances of the Greek Cities in this period. Besides, it just made things too easy for the GCS to be able to dominate Sicily and Greece so early in the game. Now you have to fight your way through two or three factions just to start expanding, rather than being able to shut down two Roman factions before they even get going.

[Zarax]

BTW, I noticed a strange thng DimebagHo, in my current Carthage campaign the AI seemed to be using the navy a bit better than before... While I haven't got any real naval invasion (I think the AI just wanted to use the land bridges) my ports were under constant blockade by the romans, at least until they were still able to field a navy...

[Zarax]

Dude, you made it!
This mod really rocks!
I'm having one of the most epic campaigns ever with the carthaginians, with some truly extensive battles against the greeks now that the romans are gone... The combination of armoured phalangites and hypaspists can be a truly hard nut to crack, even against a mix of sacred band, carthage levy phalangites and mercenary hoplites (modded to be like a lower quality hypaspists) they does serious damage, especially the Corinthians that are more than a match to my best units... I don't know why, but now i really dread facing a stack with some spartans that is approaching against my elite army... When I brought on my war elephants they answered with ballistaes, giving me some real pains as my cavalry couldn't cross the enemy phalangites...

[Zarax]

DimeBagHo, are you working on some update?

EDIT: I'm experimenting in a version that uses the BI exe to get the additional features... Let me know if you're interested in that...

[DimeBagHo]

At the moment I'm working on some minor changes. Egypt is going to get Levy Phalangite and Phalangite equivalent units, rather than just the current Nile Phalangites (which are just a little better than levies).

I have played around a bit with using the BI exe (mostly to see whether the shield wall formation would make a good replacement for the phalanx formation). Let me know how things go for you.

[Zarax]

Well, please try to not make the eggies a macedonian clone like RTR did, their phalanxes were of lower quality historically anyways... In an historically correct game the egyptian player should use the strenght of numbers rather than army quality...
If you want to boost the nile pikes a bit you might give them a combat bonus in desert instead and make them hardier...

About BI, how did you made xgm work with the exe? I've been able to import some stuff but not make the whole thing working...

[Zarax]

Well, if I can find a way to merge your mod with this one I think we'll get practically on perfection: http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=722

[DimeBagHo]

Borsook's mod is what got me interested in playing around with the BI exe. I couldn't figure out how to get it to work correctly with the -mod switch - so I had to overwrite stuff in the main data directory to get XGM going with it. Another obvious downside is that I would either have to maintain two versions of XGM or drop support for RTW 1.3.

[Zarax]

Well, your latest version got pretty much anything a player would want for such a MOD, a good compromise would to keep maintaining the RTW version only for bugfixes while doing the bulk of development on the BI one... The other nice thing in Borsook's work is that it developed most of the "hidden units" left by CA, giving some quite interesting bonuses...

[Zarax]

I did some tests with mixing XGM and RTWEP... The BI exe is definitely better working than the 1.3 RTW one, naval invasions aren't broken and the AI seems smarter than the vanilla one.

[Zarax]

Ok, here's a quick tutorial on how to use XGM with the BI exe:

advantages:

- BI AI is smarter than RTW one and naval invasions works

- You can easily mod the EDU file to add BI formations

disadvantages:

- overwrites the vanilla campaign, so if you got other mods installed it's likely they will be broken

- untested and unoptimized so it's likely that there will be some bugs and uses redundant data for now

instructions:

- go to your rtw folder and double click on the xgm subfolder

- copy (don't cut, it won't work!) all the content using ctrl+c

- go back into the rtw main folder and paste everything, overwriting when it asks to

- in your desktop (or programs menu) right click in the xgm link, select properties and change the target to: "C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod: -show_err -nm

note that if you didn't install RTW in "C:\program files" you will have to change the path to the one of choice, actually it might be safer just to copy "-mod: -show_err -nm" (without the "") over -mod: xgm and replacing RomeTW.exe with RomeTW-BI.exe.

If someone is interested i'll make an optimized unit file and publish it provided DimeBagHo gives me the permission to do it...

NOTE: Remember to back-up your RTW folder before doing it!

[Zarax]

Two quick suggestions for the next version:

1) Make balearic slingers recruitable in Palma

2) You might want to include files to make the MOD compatible with the MM 1.3 patch and/or Warmap...

[DimeBagHo]

Zarax: Feel free to release that optimised unit file. The next version might take a while - maybe a week or so. I'm back to playing BF2 so it's hard to find time for modding :).

[Zarax]

That's good, I'm currently reinstalling MTW+BI as I managed to mess up the game beyond repair trying to merge MM 1.3 and XGM...

That said, I'm thinking to tune down the eggys a bit at the start as they still will kill the seleucid a bit too often and eventually turn on carthage after that... Needless to say, numidian cav + elephants are an excellent counter to eggys with a bit of cav support (even toned down the general's cav are still capable to turn the tide of the battle, they will only show some extra problems on prolonged battles) but their numbers make them quite a painful thing to manage, especially with the BI exe that fixes naval invasions.

[Lentonius]

is there any screenshots?
:san_huh:


happy holidays:san_smiley: :san_smiley:

[Zarax]

Readme got some screenshots, all units are quite fitting to vanilla RTW visuals but the good stuff is not on the eyecandy here...

[Zarax]

BI optimization for XGM is now available!

http://microsoftuse.temp.powweb.com/hosted/xgmbizx.exe

Features:

- includes instructions to activate xgm using BI exe

- optimized files for BI allows swimming and BI formations for various units

- toned down general bodyguards

- added a new recruitable mercenary for Carthage, made Phoeni Infantry slightly harder to recruit to compensate

not included in the mod but suggested:

remove the land bridges as the BI exe has working naval invasions so no need for them.

DimeBagHo, I hope you'll like my little additions to your great work, let me know if something needs to be changed :)

[Kaldhore]

Seeing how im involved in another game for a week - should I download this mod now or should I wait for 1.5 Patch compatibility?

It looks fantastic BTW I always prefered the Greeks to the romans :P

[DimeBagHo]

Lentonius: Zarax is right. Some of the new units look nice (you can see most of them in the readme) but my aim has always been to improve gameplay, and to improve the tactical and strategic options available to the Greeks, rather than to improve the way the game looks.

Kaldhore: According to CA the new patch will not break saved game compatibility, so you are probably safe to download XGM and start a campaign now.

Zarax: According to CA naval invasions will be fixed in the 1.5 patch, so I will probably remove the land bridges once the patch comes out (I might make them an optional extra).

I think I will hold off on releasing the next version until after the patch comes out. I also think that I will stick with the RTW exe for future versions of XGM, but include your BI files as an option.

[Zarax]

I will take care of the BI optimization, the files I made should be 100% compatible with 1.3 too, the only difference is that the extra stuff won't show...

BTW, if you can add an hidden resource for palma and one for the "hellenistic lands" (greece, southern italy and eastern mediterranean) you would help me a lot as i'm thinking about implementing some very light and hidden AOR to fine tune some game balance aspects and give some more character to a few factions...

[DimeBagHo]

BTW, if you can add an hidden resource for palma and one for the "hellenistic lands" (greece, southern italy and eastern mediterranean) you would help me a lot as i'm thinking about implementing some very light and hidden AOR to fine tune some game balance aspects and give some more character to a few factions...
I will. In fact I was thinking about implementing several new AORs so that I could give each region its own native levies, and limit the recruitment of some elite units.

[Zarax]

I was thinking about something lighter than that, mostly to emphasize the role of mercenaries...

If you want to send me some betas i can test them and give you some early feedback too...

[Kaldhore]

Kaldhore: According to CA the new patch will not break saved game compatibility, so you are probably safe to download XGM and start a campaign now.


Cheers dude

[DimeBagHo]

The next version is pretty much done. I am still playing around with some of the unit descriptions and waiting for the patch. The changes are mostly just to tidy up the transition to the new phalangite units started in the previous version.

GCS - The unit line-up is now much closer to the other Greek factions.

Militia Phalangites - similar to other levy phalangite units.
Phalangites - similar to other phalangite units.
Armoured Phalangites - similar to Foot Companions (etc), except that they have significantly heavier armour, but lower attack.
Spartan Phalangites - no longer an uber unit, but still very good, they are similar to Foot Companions (etc) except that they have an excellent sword attack, and higher morale.

Egypt - Added a levy phalangite unit, and made Nile Phalangites similar to other Greek phalangite units.

Carthage - Added Balearic Slingers recruitable in Palma.

I have also fixed up some unit voices, and corrected some unit descriptions. Land bridges will become an optional extra.

Zarax - I have added a hidden_resource "hellenic" and added it to all of the provinces that had significant Greek populations, including some outliers like Bosphoros, Cyrenaica, and Transalpine Gaul. Send me an e-mail at dimebagwhore@yahoo.com and I will send back a beta of the new version.

[Zarax]

Hmm, I'm not too enthusiast into uniforming factions too much, making the hellenistic factions too similar to each other the RTR way would hurt both the fun and realism factor...

How about:

Macedonians - they stay more or less the same as now

Greeks - better equipped phalangites but suffers from high upkeep and lower morale as they lacked a real standing army except for the spartans and few other elites

Seleucid - good unit roster but can recruit good troops only in hellenistic areas and have to rely on low morale light infantry and levy pikes everywhere else.

Egypt - Lots of low quality infantry, levy quality pikes and usually low morale except for the elites.
Bonus in desert but very low armour for most troops.

Historically egypt had very low quality troops except for the macedonian elite and relied more on numbers and a few mercs than anything else...
They won at Raphia over the seleucids mostly thanks to sheer numerical superiority and due to the fact that Seleukos was very poor at maintaning army cohesion despite being able to break the enemy left.

In detail:

Nubian spears - theuphoroi level infantry, maybe slightly better against cav. Good stamina, bonus in desert

Nile inf - levy quality phalangites with low armour but good stamina and bonus in desert

Desert axemen - decent quality flankers, low armour but good morale and very hardy. Bonus in desert

Pharaoh guards - those were the macedonians, capable hypaspist-like infantry with excellent morale and great stamina.

[DimeBagHo]

I have e-mailed the beta for XGM 3.4.1 to you.

Here is what I have done with Greek infantry units:

Elite units including Foot Companions, Silver Shield Phalangites and Legionaries, Bronze Shield Phalangites, Armoured Phalangites, Pharaoh's Guard, and Hypaspists, are only recruitable in hellenic provinces.

Levy phalangite units are all pretty similar, except for Carthaginian levies which have somewhat better armour. The regular phalangite units are all pretty similar except for the Egyptians which have lighter armour.

There are some significant differences between the elite phalangite units. Some of the GCS units are significantly more expensive.

The GCS cavalry line-up has changed a little as well. Thessalians are gone, replaced by a heavy cavalry unit equiped with shields.

The line-up is now: Greek Militia Cavalry (much the same), Greek Light Cavalry (formerly Greek cavalry), Greek Cavalry (similar to Macedonian Cavalry, 2 turns to recruit), Greek Armoured Cavalry (similar to Praetorian Cavalry, three turns to recruit, but now recruitable anywhere).

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.4.1 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

-Updated to work with 1.5/1.6 patches
-Removed Thessalian Cavalry
-Added Greek Armoured Cavalry
-Added Levy Phalangites to Egypt
-Added Militia Phalangites to GCS
-Increased size of GCS phalanx units
-Added AOR for elite phalanx units
-Removed land bridges from default install
-Tweaked various unit costs and stats

Most of the changes are either updates for the 1.5/1.6 patch, or tidying up the transition to phalangite units.

[buckZor]

I just wanted to express how much darn fun I am having with this mod. I am running Rome v1.3 with a EGM of a few versions back and I am not going near the Rome 1.5 patch, or the expansion until I play through all the Greek factions. I don't know really what changes you've made, alot of the abbreviations escape me as Im a casual player, but its darn good and I'll stay with your mod as long as you develop it.

I don't have any intention to buy the expansion for awhile because theres just so much to the basic game and I don't want to screw anything up, especially with your greek mod.

[Zarax]

XGM works fine with BI installed and with 1.5 too, so the worst thing that may happen there is that you have to reinstall it after you apply the patch.
I'm currently updating the BI optimization for XGM, so if you plan to buy BI you'll get the extra features on XGM too...

[DimeBagHo]

buckZor: Glad you like the mod. You should be pretty safe installing the 1.5 patch and the most recent version of XGM. There have been some important bug fixes in RTW and XGM so I recommend it.

[Zarax]

BI optimization for XGM 3.4.1 is now available!

http://microsoftuse.temp.powweb.com/hosted/xgmbizx.exe

Features:

- includes instructions to activate xgm using BI exe

- optimized files for BI allows swimming and BI formations for various units

- toned down general bodyguards

- added a new recruitable mercenary for Carthage, fixed a small bug with Lybian spearmen recruitment

[Trickle]

Is the extended greek mod likely to be compatible with some of the 1.3/1.5 strap maps that have recently appeard (1.3 Mundus magnus and the large scale vanilla 'warmap' map?

I'm assuming not (or not easily) with specific towns linked to units?

[DimeBagHo]

Trickle: It's not compatible "as is" but the changes needed are relatively minor. If I can stop myself from playing for an hour or two I will put together a version of Mundus Magnus for XGM.

[Trickle]

Thanks for the reply! Will look out for further updates :)

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.4.2 is available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

-Added an installer for the Mundus Magnus map (in the Extras folder)
-Fixed night battles
-Some minor XGM bug fixes and tweaks

Mundus Magnus works, and I have had it going for 100 turns or so without seeing any problems, but otherwise I haven't had much time to test it. Use at your own risk. Let me know if you have any problems with it, or see anything weird. Some features of XGM have not yet been implemented for Mundus Magnus.

[GrimSta]

DimeBagHo, this mod goes from strength to strength! and check your PM's :san_wink:

[Trickle]

How quick was that? Will need to find some time over the Christmas period to test this for you having responded so amazingly quick! Thank you :notworthy:

[Magussen]

First, lot of thanks for a mod that I enjoy considerably ( even after all those hours spent on that game) , that works smoothly, is well balanced, very impressive.
Now my question....
I have always been frustrated by the way non roman AI factions in RTW won't attack roman AI settlements regardless of the odds.
Fortunately that ended with BI (obviously ! ) and I had great hopes in the use of the BI engine for your mod, thanks to Zarax.
Well it is not the case, the romans continue to enjoy their impunity, even with the BI engine.
I suspect it is caused by the senate superfaction thing in descr strat.
Is there a way to modify XGM so that there would be an alliance of roman factions WITHOUT a superfaction, or an unique roman power, also without the superfaction ?
Even having the romans at war with each other would be preferable to the present situation.
Thanks for your time,
Magussen.

[DimeBagHo]

Magussen: You can remove the super-faction and sub-faction lines. As far as I know the result will just be that the Senate will behave like any other faction (i.e. it will make war on other Roman factions and expand). That might get messy if you leave the Senate as is - because they get nothing but Praetorian units in XGM.

What difficulty level do you usually play on? On H and VH I have seen the Carthaginians, Gauls, GCS, and Macedonians attack Roman settlements (I don't remember with other factions). One thing that has bothered me is that the Macedonians seem unwilling to attack GCS settlements, even if you start the game with them at war, and will a huge army sitting next to a lightly defended settlement.

[Magussen]

I play always normal, since I cant stand biased results ( I become fussy with old age ) .
The non roman AI will attack roman towns only if one roman faction is played by myself.
In my game, Macedon and GCS are happily at war after a few turns, weakening each other and leaving alone poorly defended roman settlements.
I will try with the super/sub factions lines edited out.
Thanks for your quick answer,
Magussen.

[cunobelinus]

Ive been playing this for a month now i just put the MM map on and i wanted to play normal rome total war online on 1.5 patch .And it keeps crashing out of it but when i play without the MM map it works fine but i really like playing with the MM map so does anyone no how to fix this problem

[Zarax]

Just wait for the next version, it will likely get some extra MM optimization...

[cunobelinus]

Would you reccommenend that i uninstall and reinstall without it then

[SomeNick]

Ah posted thankyou in another thread and...

I like how it has a desk top icon to play the game from as fiddling with the data folder usually puts me off mods as a newbie to mucking around with files etc.

Thanks for making the greek factions fun again.:2thumbsup:

[Ragnor_Lodbrok]

Is there a way to get back the old optical version of the armoured hoplite with Corinthian helmet?

[DimeBagHo]

littlegannon: Mundus Magnus messes up the map locations used for multiplayer battles, so if you want to play multiplayer with XGM just run the XGM installer again (it will reomve all the MM stuff) and then run XGM-MM again when you want to go back to your campaign.

SomeNick: Glad you like the mod.

Ragnor_Lodbrok: Yes there is, and it's pretty easy if you don't mind editing test files. All you need to do is replace the armored hoplite entry in xgm/data/descr_models_units.txt with the original entry from data/descr_models_units.txt. A few people have asked about this so I might make it an option in the next version.

[Trickle]

How quick was that? Will need to find some time over the Christmas period to test this...Never did test the mundus magnus map, but I did get the vanilla warmap (basically just the world folder) working more or less fine - starting units were borked (standard vanilla rtw units such as red cloaked spartans), but everything else was fine.

[Zarax]

Bad installation or you installed it over another mod most likely...

[DimeBagHo]

Trickle: Unless you changed the starting greek general units, you might run into a problem when the marian reforms occur. Also the lack of certain hidden resources will cause a problem for recruiting some units.

[fireant]

I've downloaded and ran the installer for the mod (on a fresh copy of RTW with 1.3 patch) The game starts up fine but when I click on the imperial campaign I get a message that says "Please select and item from the list." I've gone through the Prologue before installing the mod.

Afer exiting the game I get this message : "Script Error in xgm/data/world/maps/campaign/imperial_campaign/descr_strat.txt, at line 26, column 1.

Expected start date of campaign or battle."

All I needed to do was apply the 1.5 patch, sorry for the dumb question.

[Devastatin Dave]

Dime Bag, this is the greatest mod I've ever played. I love the Greeks and this mod has just perfected them. Thank you!!!

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.5.1 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Added BI-XGM in Extras
-Added SignifierOne's animation pack
-Added Archer's Skymod
-Regular Hypaspists reverted to javelin/sword
-Corinthian Hypaspists replaced with Sacred Band
-Carthaginian Sacred Band reskined
-Sacred Band Units are now, over-hand, spear only, "hoplites"
-Companions/Immortals added to Parthia
-Spartan Royal Guard added
-Early legionaries removed
-Urban Cohort converted to garrison unit
-Corinth now starts as Macedonian
-Various features added to MM-XGM
-Various XGM and RTW bug fixes

Note: BI-XGM allows you to run XGM with the BI executable, so you get shield wall etc.

[Cesare diBorja]

Great Mod. Not all buggy like some others. Having lots o' fun here.


diBorgia

[pyradyn]

I cant see to get this mod to work. First i was having the problem that fireant was having then i updated to 1.5 and got the same problem so i reinstalled RTW all together and patched through to 1.5 now the game wont even start and i get an error saying Generic Error: Could not find areial map 'settlement_roman_level_1' in database

Any ideas iv tried to install the mod about 14 times now all with no aval

[DimeBagHo]

pyradyn: The problem is probably files being left behind when you uninstall, so they are still there and causing problems when you re-install. Try this: Uninstall RTW, then find the game folder (probably C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\) and delete it. Then re-install RTW, patch, etc.

Before you delete the game folder you might want to make a copy of saved games, and preferences.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.5.2 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Disabled gladiator uprising (it's bugged)
-Enabled editable settlement names by default
-Restored default win conditions for Mundus Magnus
-Changed Britons starting position
-Slightly improved Seleucid starting settlements

This is not the much-awaited XGM 4.0 with political factions, etc, but just a minor update with a few tweaks and bug-fixes. If you are using Froggie5's text files for the modding legions pack, it should still work fine.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.5.3 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Added recruitable generals
-Replaced Eastern watch towers with Roman style
-Morale for elephant units increased slightly
-Iberian infantry recruiting corrected for Spain
-Spanish generals corrected
-Added corrected custom locations file for Mundus Magnus
-Alexander trait now requires crushing victories

This is mostly a bug-fixer.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.0 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Egypt re-named to the Ptolemaic Empire
-Ethiopian Axemen added to Ptolemies
-Agema Axemen added to Ptolemies
-Basilikon Guard added to Ptolemies
-Desert Axemen removed
-Various Ptolemaic units re-skinned and re-named
-Iberian Spearmen added
-Silk Road added
-All civilised factions can now build highways along the Silk Road
-Caravans added to all civilised factions
-Caravans limited to eastern regions
-Royal Barracks adeded to GCS, Carthage, Ptolemies
-Spartan Phalangites moved to Royal Barracks
-Carthaginian Sacred Band moved to Royal Barracks
-Dockyards added to Ptolemies
-Macedonian and Thracian Illyrians removed
-AOR Illyrians (recruitable by all factions in Illyria) added
-AOR Italian Infantry (recruitable by most factions in Italy) added
-AOR Desert Infantry (recruitable by most factions in Africa) added
-AOR Numidian Cavalry (recruitable by most factions in Africa) added
-AOR Eastern Infantry (recruitable by most factions in the East) added

The New Ptolemaic Units

1.https://img516.imageshack.us/img516/900/levypikemen0ab.th.jpg (https://img516.imageshack.us/my.php?image=levypikemen0ab.jpg) 2.https://img516.imageshack.us/img516/118/phalangites0yy.th.jpg (https://img516.imageshack.us/my.php?image=phalangites0yy.jpg) 3.https://img155.imageshack.us/img155/4005/agemaphalangites5mo.th.jpg (https://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=agemaphalangites5mo.jpg)
4.https://img217.imageshack.us/img217/455/ethiopianaxemen4hm.th.jpg (https://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ethiopianaxemen4hm.jpg) 5.https://img217.imageshack.us/img217/2654/agemaaxemen9nk.th.jpg (https://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=agemaaxemen9nk.jpg) 6.https://img145.imageshack.us/img145/4404/archers5fp.th.jpg (https://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=archers5fp.jpg)
7.https://img145.imageshack.us/img145/2760/basilikonguard3fg.th.jpg (https://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=basilikonguard3fg.jpg) 8.https://img145.imageshack.us/img145/57/basilikonfight7ai.th.jpg (https://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=basilikonfight7ai.jpg)

1. Levy Phalangites - with a round shield now. 2. Phalangites - again with a round shield now. 3. Agema Phalangites - these are a replacement for Pharoah's Guards. 4. Ethiopian Axemen - replacement for Desert Axemen. 5. Agema Axemen - new Army Barracks level unit. 6. New elite archer unit, along with the new Ptolemaic officier. 7. Basilikon guards. Royal Barracks level over-hand "hoplite" unit. 8. Basilikon Guards in action.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.1 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Added Unified Rome provincial campaigns
-"Italian" units re-named to "Italic"
-Spartan Phalangites moved back to Army Barracks
-Greek Sacred Band moved to Royal Barracks
-Minor bug fixes

[Cesare diBorja]

Cool!

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.2 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-All temples can be upgraded by all factions
-Minor bug fixes

[buckZor]

Im not seeing an explanation as to why the Spartan Royal guard was made a 30 turn build? They are very similar in strength to the Sacred Band. In my case I just love seeing the spartan artwork on the field and I just would rather they be moved to a high level barracks and build time bumped to around 3 years (6 turns). *shrug*

Also, I recently patched to 1.5, installed 3.6.2 of XGM and started a new GCS campaign on Hard/Hard (I'd been playing 3.3.2 XGM w/1.3 forever). I am noticing that I am getting my arse kicked pretty bad, Im struggling to survive and Im wondering about some other changes you've made..

1) Why are the Macedonians so strong at the start? Have you tried to deal with their Phalangites with silly theuropurolalapolopoli? They attacked me in turn 3 and they have plenty of thorokatalakabillybi, pikemen, macedonian cav, yowzer!

2) Whats with the level 3 rebels everywhere in the starting cities? And also, the rebels are aggressive (which I really like :) ) you get close to their cities now and they'll frackin attack!

3) Money change.. I am struggling financially, this has never happened to me before playing GCS.. *boggle*

4) Armoured hoplite art change.. I had to dig quite a bit to find the fix on this, please include instructions with future releases to make the Armo hoppies look bad-arse again :) What possessed you to wussify them?

There are many, many changes you've made that Im very happy with.. I love your mod its the only thing I play now for going on 2 years.

[DimeBagHo]

Im not seeing an explanation as to why the Spartan Royal guard was made a 30 turn build? They are very similar in strength to the Sacred Band. In my case I just love seeing the spartan artwork on the field and I just would rather they be moved to a high level barracks and build time bumped to around 3 years (6 turns). *shrug*
I really should put some more details in the readme - a lot of people have asked about this. Historically the Spartan Royal Guard consisted of just 300 men. The aim of the long recruiting time is to make it possible (but expensive) to replace losses, but impractical to have more than one unit. You can still recruit Spartan phalangites, which have another version of ATG's model and skin, with an Army barracks in Sparta. So if you just like the art work there is no need to worry. :)

1) Why are the Macedonians so strong at the start? Have you tried to deal with their Phalangites with silly theuropurolalapolopoli? They attacked me in turn 3 and they have plenty of thorokatalakabillybi, pikemen, macedonian cav, yowzer!
Historically the Greek Cities tried to eject the Macedonians from Greece right around the start of the game period, but they got stomped. To avoid the same fate you need to bide your time, recruit a decent number of levy phalangites in Sparta, hire mercenaries, and strike when you have a force that is capable of taking Corinth and then holding off the Macedonians. It can be done, but you have to be cautious at the start. Even taking rebel settlements can attract unwanted attention from the other Greek powers.

2) Whats with the level 3 rebels everywhere in the starting cities? And also, the rebels are aggressive (which I really like :) ) you get close to their cities now and they'll frackin attack!
The rebels have been toned down a bit in recent releases, but they are still no push-over.

3) Money change.. I am struggling financially, this has never happened to me before playing GCS.. *boggle*
Money can be a bit of a struggle at the start, but once you get ports and roads built it should be OK. Later when you get control of Greece and the coast of Asia Monor you will be rolling in cash.

4) Armoured hoplite art change.. I had to dig quite a bit to find the fix on this, please include instructions with future releases to make the Armo hoppies look bad-arse again :) What possessed you to wussify them?
Common complaint. :) I changed them for two reasons - I didn't like the old model, and historically Corinthian helmets were no longer used in the game period. But I probably will write up some instructions for changing them back.

There are many, many changes you've made that Im very happy with.. I love your mod its the only thing I play now for going on 2 years.
I'm glad you like it. :)

*Edit* I have added instructions for restoring the old Armoured Hoplite model and skin to the readme.

[buckZor]

Thanks DBH for your responses and continued development! If you'll endure me, I have some follow-up ones:

Levy Phalangites in sparta...? huh? I believe that unit is only available to the Macedonian uber-horde.. and they have plenty of them.

You commented on my level 3 rebel statement, but Im still curious as to the reasoning for beefing up Rebels? Im on the fence whether I like it or not. One thing Im noticing also is Rebel Pirate ships.. yowch! They are all over me, I have to move in fleets of 3 if I leave a port or BAM arse kickin.

and finally.. what about the sub alliance between the Greek states that has been often mentioned in recent versions? I expected some sort of loose alliance between the other Greeks similar to the Roman faction alliance..?

My game is now at turn 15 or so and Im holding my own against the Macedons, I managed somehow to wrestle Corinth from them. The Scipii have beseiged me at Apollonia and now the Seleucids have attacked me with serious venom, I took a peek with FOW disabled temporarily and they have HUGE stacks enroute, I am sure to lose my footing on their continent. What perplexes me is that there is no combat going on anywhere else, the Gauls and Julii just BARELY have begun their combat, on like turn 12.. The Seleucids are at war with NOBODY else, why pick on me? I have two cities on their continent, and they are surrounded by other factions which they are not allied with.. This is just such a different campaign than I've seen before and frankly I don't believe I can win on Hard/Hard and would be surprised if any above average players could (without cheating).

[DimeBagHo]

Levy Phalangites in sparta...? huh? I believe that unit is only available to the Macedonian uber-horde..
I think the GCS equivalent might be called Militia Phalangites. Of course if you can get a City Barracks built and start recruiting regular Phalangites that is even better.

You commented on my level 3 rebel statement, but Im still curious as to the reasoning for beefing up Rebels?
I didn't make the Mundus Magnus map - the original set-up made by ngr had *much* stronger rebel garrisons. Some of them had 9 exp!. I think the idea was to slow development and make the rebels more of a challenge. Personally I prefer it if the other factions expand more rapidly so I have progressively toned down the rebels. In the current version of XGM they only get 2 exp, less money, and I am planning to replace rebel Phalangite units with Militia Phalangites.

One thing Im noticing also is Rebel Pirate ships.. yowch! They are all over me, I have to move in fleets of 3 if I leave a port or BAM arse kickin.
I've noticed that as well. I think I like the pirate fleets - it really keeps the pressure on to maintain control of the seas.

and finally.. what about the sub alliance between the Greek states that has been often mentioned in recent versions? I expected some sort of loose alliance between the other Greeks similar to the Roman faction alliance..?
I think you are refering to the sub-factions? That is just within the GCS. Instead of all your family members being "of Sparta" they are now "of Sparta", "of Athens" and so on. You get leaders for each of the major city states. Mostly this is just to facilitate role-playing the city states as mini-factions. The Greek factions will continue to war with each-other just as they did historically.

My game is now at turn 15 or so and Im holding my own against the Macedons, I managed somehow to wrestle Corinth from them. The Scipii have beseiged me at Apollonia and now the Seleucids have attacked me with serious venom, I took a peek with FOW disabled temporarily and they have HUGE stacks enroute, I am sure to lose my footing on their continent.
You may have tried to expand too quickly - in my current campaign I didn't make a move in Asia minor until the Seleucids moved on Pergamum in 252 BC. The war with them has been tough - I lost two major battles - but it is still going my way.

What perplexes me is that there is no combat going on anywhere else, the Gauls and Julii just BARELY have begun their combat, on like turn 12.. The Seleucids are at war with NOBODY else, why pick on me?
It does take a while for the war between the Gauls and the Julii to heat up. In my own campaign there is a massive war going on between them now, which has helped a lot to keep the Romans off my back. An alliance of the Jullii and the Germans finally has the upper hand - so I expect hordes of red legionaries to be comming my way soon. Which is why I am busy establishing Thrace as a buffer state in the Balkans and on my northern border.

The campaign is definitely winable. It's not like the AI has suddenly become smart or anything. But you do need to employ some strategy.

[buckZor]

But none of the GCS phalangies can stand toe-to-toe against those damn pikes. I have to have a unit to back flank while my shorty phalangies occupy them spear on pike. :(

Oh and you said 300 spartans, so shouldnt GCS start with 3 units of the royal guard? Because I started with a single unit, 100 men.

[Cesare diBorja]

3.6.2XGM, so far, is the toughest mod I have played yet. I do enjoy making my own generals as well so as not to sacrifice my family members. Some are now level 5 or 6. My Krypteia, properly used make great commandos as do the Hypaspists and Athenian Marine Archers. I have two Spartan Royal Guard units and about 10 Spartan Phalangists units. I also have several Sacred band units which I use to lead fort garrisons.

Question-How do you make generals head other units?
I have tried but can only make hc units.

Thanks
diBorgia

[DimeBagHo]

But none of the GCS phalangies can stand toe-to-toe against those damn pikes. I have to have a unit to back flank while my shorty phalangies occupy them spear on pike. :(
All the Greek phalanx units have the same length pike now. But if you play on h or vh then the AI will have the advantage in a straight up fight, so you do have to flank. Fortunately XGM prvides you with lots of units which can do that. :)

Oh and you said 300 spartans, so shouldnt GCS start with 3 units of the royal guard? Because I started with a single unit, 100 men.
Well a Roman cohort was typically about 500 men. If we take that as a scale then one unit of Spartan Royal Guards is more than enough to represent the Spartan 300.

Question-How do you make generals head other units?
I've never tried, but as far as I know you just have to add the general_unit attribute. I think there is a guide in the scriptorium here.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.4 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Added Ptolemaic Hetairoi/Companions
-Reskined Greek Armoured cavalry
-Reskined Macedonian and Seleucid Hetairoi/Companions
-Reskined Late Greek Generals

Here are some screen shots of the new skins:

01.https://img470.imageshack.us/img470/3421/greekarmouredcav3jt.th.jpg (https://img470.imageshack.us/my.php?image=greekarmouredcav3jt.jpg) 02.https://img147.imageshack.us/img147/668/greekarmouredguard2ku.th.jpg (https://img147.imageshack.us/my.php?image=greekarmouredguard2ku.jpg) 03.https://img147.imageshack.us/img147/6461/egypthetairoi1ag.th.jpg (https://img147.imageshack.us/my.php?image=egypthetairoi1ag.jpg)
04.https://img147.imageshack.us/img147/7641/macedonhetairoi4nj.th.jpg (https://img147.imageshack.us/my.php?image=macedonhetairoi4nj.jpg) 05.https://img67.imageshack.us/img67/2497/seleucidhetairoi0dt.th.jpg (https://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?image=seleucidhetairoi0dt.jpg)

01. GCS Armoured Cavalry, 02. GCS Armoured Bodyguards, 03. Ptolemaic Hetairoi/Late Bodyguards, 04. Macedonian Hetairoi/Late Bodyguards, 05. Seleucid Hetairoi/Late Bodyguards

[buckZor]

baaaahhhh I just upgraded to 3.6.2 ya stinker!!!! Looks great though DBH!

[Cesare diBorja]

Any plans to add the 'lithobolos' to the game. It is the stonethrower ballista. 'earliest cannon-style weapon'. It would be cool.

diBorgia

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.6 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).

The major changes are:

-Added Thracian Thorakitai
-Added Thracian Peltasts
-Added Thracian Cavalry
-Reskined Thracian Falxmen
-Reskined Thracian Early Bodyguard
-Converted Thracian Late Bodyguard to Scythian Lancers
-Reskined Thracian Noble Cavalry
-Reskined and modified Bastarne
-Removed Bastarne from Thrace
-Removed Greek Peltasts from Thrace
-Removed Militia Cavalry from Thrace
-Replaced Thracian Mercenaries with Thracian Peltasts
-Added AOR Thracian Peltasts (recruitable by all factions in Thrace)
-Added AOR Cilician Pirates (recruitable by all factions in Cilicia)
-Added AOR Median Cavalry (recruitable by all factions in Media)
-Added AOR Greek Mercenaries (recruitable by all factions in Hellenic regions)
-Added AOR Scutarii (recruitable by all factions in Iberia)
-Converted remaining mercenaries to use slave skins
-Updated sprites

Cesare diBorja: That's a possibility. I've been thinking about adding a unique seige unit to Syracuse for a while.

[Cesare diBorja]

wouldn't it be simple to just take a ballista and make fire stones( large sling bullets

p.s. got a bug that makes game freeze after a delay of play. never had it before.

Great mod additions, DBH

[DimeBagHo]

It's easy enough to make - it's more a question of what it's use would be. I prefer not to add units that have no tactical purpose.

[Cesare diBorja]

It was used as an effective go-between for ballistae and onagers. Quicker to deploy than onagers, more powerful than ballistae. Historically speaking the game would be more accurate.

diBorgia

[NeoSpartan]

Dude, I gotta give it to you, you just made the Greek Campain a lot better than it already was. But what I like the best is that FINALY hoplites use the spears the right way.

HOWEVER I am extremely dissapointed on the preformance of the Royal Spartan Guard in battle. I mean, for taking so long to get, so expensive to retrain, they are NOT that great.

Now, I understand your point for making them take 30yrs to make and so expensive to re-train. But I believe it would also make sence to have Royal Spartans be stronger. Not like a GOD unit or anything, but with higher pts for melee attack, higher pts for defence skill, and higher stamina.

I mean... they are not just Spartans, they are ROYAL SPARTANS! I am sure you can imagine how hard it would be for a Spartan to become 1 of the 300 Royal Guard. Hell being a Spartan is hard enough already!

[Dooz]

Being a Spartan doesn't make you that much harder to kill or have supernatural abilities to kill others. They were still humans afterall. The long training time doesn't necessitate a super unit. It's just for accurate representation of their use.

[Cesare diBorja]

Elite and super elite mythos are blown way out of proportion these days. Too much super hero crap going around that people think these individuals actually exist. Various 'special' forces are indeed talented to a high degree. The United States has lost alot of SF personnel due the irregular use of the units in the war against terrorism (now in the thousands). These men and women still die. So what if they kill 10-35 persons. If you only have a hundred of them and they face 10000 without support, how long will they last. They'll kill a third of the enemy and die overrun by their enemies buddies. Happened alot in Vietnam. It was no different for the Spartans no matter what their training. Going to war is different from playing 'at war'.

diBorgia

[NeoSpartan]

Being a Spartan doesn't make you that much harder to kill or have supernatural abilities to kill others. They were still humans afterall. The long training time doesn't necessitate a super unit. It's just for accurate representation of their use.


:wall: Dang it fellas I know... Alright, I'll give you an example of what I mean by making them "Stronger".

A Spartan Royal Guard has 7pts for Defence Skill to add to his "Total Defence". Vs a Phalangite/Thorekitai/Greek Mercenary who has 5pts for Defence Skill. So, what I am arguing for, is to Increase the Spartan Royal Guard's Defence Skill (FOR EXAMPLE) to 12 Defense Skill pts instead of 7pts. AND LEAVE Shield and Armor pts THE SAME. (because naturally Armor and Shield have nothing to do with ABILITY, just as a seramic plate is going to stop a bullet the same way no matter who wears it, either a Green Barret, or a Grunt.)


Oh and guys I am having a little trouble:
-For some reason the the units are not getting tired and neither is the enemy. I don't have the game in Arcade mode and I can have any unit running around it is always "FRESH". Is there a way to fix this?......... :help:

[DimeBagHo]

The Spartan Royal Guard get 2 hitpoints, which can make them extremely hard to kill. But there is nothing special about their defense stats otherwise, so they can get worn down, especially if they are under missile fire for a while, or if you throw them into combat too often in one battle. I might take a look at increasing their defense a little though.

Wonderland and Cesare diBorja are also correct that they were not supermen. Most of their advantage in earlier times was that they were professional, and highly trained, in a time when most soldiers were not. By the time of the game period all of the Greek powers, and of course the Romans as well, had professional military forces. Most of them had highly trained elite units as well. So although the Spartans were still a very effective fighting force, they no longer had the huge advantages that they enjoyed two or three centuries earlier.

On the matter of fatigue - it is switched off by default now because the AI does not know how to manage it. The advantage is that the AI will always arrive fresh for a fight, instead of being exhausted already by running around all over the place. If you prefer to have it switched on, there are instruction in the readme (check the "Modding XGM" section).

[Zarax]

DBH, for some reason I cannot access to TWC so I'll post here:

I found a couple minor issues with the latest release:

- Thracian peltasts should get a better fitting icon imho, the older falxmen one can be misleading

- Iberians shouldn't be able to recruit the mercenary AOR unit, AI mixes them with scutarii ending with lots of half units they cannot merge...

[NeoSpartan]

"On the matter of fatigue - it is switched off by default now because the AI does not know how to manage it. The advantage is that the AI will always arrive fresh for a fight, instead of being exhausted already by running around all over the place. If you prefer to have it switched on, there are instruction in the readme (check the "Modding XGM" section)."

--Thanks for the heads-up man.... and that I think about is I will leave it switched on.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM version 3.6.7 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).
You can see the readme here (http://home.comcast.net/~cyumoto/xgmreadme.html).

The major changes are:

-Added Late Poeni Infantry
-Added Late Scutarii
-Added AOR Italic Legionaries (recruitable by all civilised factions in Italy)
-Added AOR Horse Archers (recruitable by most factions in eastern Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Infantry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Cavalry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Increased unit size of Desert Infantry, decreased morale
-Moved Desert Infantry to Barracks
-Decreased morale of many AOR/mercenary units by 2
-Reduced recruiting costs of many Barbarian units
-Increased Barbarian starting populations on vanilla map
-Increased defense of all units by 2
-Increased defense of spear units by additional 2
-Decreased lethality of spear units from 0.74 to 0.64
-Decreased lethality of phalanx units from 0.9 to 0.64
-Increased attack of phalangite and elite phalangite units by 2
-Phalanx units now suffer high penalties in scrub and forest
-General units now only 1 hitpoint, but defense and armour increased by 2
-Decreased range of elite archer units to 150, Gastraphetes to 170
-Decreased range of elite slinger units to 100
-Removed Elephant resource from Media on vanilla map
-Changed requirements for Alexander traits
-Temple bonuses extensively revised
-Javelin and Pilae speeds reduced
-Movement rates reduced to 70% of vanilla


The Barbarian and Steppe AOR units are not available on Mundus Magnus yet.

[Helgi]

Loved using the Spartan Royal Guard, when I took Cydonia, was caught off guard with their card but when I went into battle, loved the skin used, and boy, tough indeed.

[Helgi]

Will 3.6.7 affect a 3.6.6 saved game?

[DimeBagHo]

Saved games (back to version 3.1) should be fine.

[Helgi]

XGM version 3.6.7 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).
You can see the readme here (http://home.comcast.net/~cyumoto/xgmreadme.html).

The major changes are:

-Added Late Poeni Infantry
-Added Late Scutarii
-Added AOR Italic Legionaries (recruitable by all civilised factions in Italy)
-Added AOR Horse Archers (recruitable by most factions in eastern Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Infantry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Cavalry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Increased unit size of Desert Infantry, decreased morale
-Moved Desert Infantry to Barracks
-Decreased morale of many AOR/mercenary units by 2
-Reduced recruiting costs of many Barbarian units
-Increased Barbarian starting populations on vanilla map
-Increased defense of all units by 2
-Increased defense of spear units by additional 2
-Decreased lethality of spear units from 0.74 to 0.64
-Decreased lethality of phalanx units from 0.9 to 0.64
-Increased attack of phalangite and elite phalangite units by 2
-Phalanx units now suffer high penalties in scrub and forest
-General units now only 1 hitpoint, but defense and armour increased by 2
-Decreased range of elite archer units to 150, Gastraphetes to 170
-Decreased range of elite slinger units to 100
-Removed Elephant resource from Media on vanilla map
-Changed requirements for Alexander traits
-Temple bonuses extensively revised
-Javelin and Pilae speeds reduced
-Movement rates reduced to 70% of vanilla


The Barbarian and Steppe AOR units are not available on Mundus Magnus yet.


Tried to download version 3.6.7 and was having problems is there a issue with the link or something?

[Helgi]

XGM version 3.6.7 is now available for download.

You can get it here (http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/index.php?mod=712).
You can see the readme here (http://home.comcast.net/~cyumoto/xgmreadme.html).

The major changes are:

-Added Late Poeni Infantry
-Added Late Scutarii
-Added AOR Italic Legionaries (recruitable by all civilised factions in Italy)
-Added AOR Horse Archers (recruitable by most factions in eastern Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Infantry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Added AOR Barbarian Cavalry (recruitable by all factions in western Barbarian regions)
-Increased unit size of Desert Infantry, decreased morale
-Moved Desert Infantry to Barracks
-Decreased morale of many AOR/mercenary units by 2
-Reduced recruiting costs of many Barbarian units
-Increased Barbarian starting populations on vanilla map
-Increased defense of all units by 2
-Increased defense of spear units by additional 2
-Decreased lethality of spear units from 0.74 to 0.64
-Decreased lethality of phalanx units from 0.9 to 0.64
-Increased attack of phalangite and elite phalangite units by 2
-Phalanx units now suffer high penalties in scrub and forest
-General units now only 1 hitpoint, but defense and armour increased by 2
-Decreased range of elite archer units to 150, Gastraphetes to 170
-Decreased range of elite slinger units to 100
-Removed Elephant resource from Media on vanilla map
-Changed requirements for Alexander traits
-Temple bonuses extensively revised
-Javelin and Pilae speeds reduced
-Movement rates reduced to 70% of vanilla


The Barbarian and Steppe AOR units are not available on Mundus Magnus yet.

Nevermind got it now

[Rufats]

Hi guys, I'm new here, liked the idea very much, so, I downloaded the file, installed, but it doesn't work. On RTW BI 1.6 vanilla. Any suggestions? Thanks a lot.

[DimeBagHo]

XGM is designed to work with RTW 1.5 or RTW:BI 1.6. Here are some common problems that people have:

1. You have other mods installed.
2. You haven't patched to 1.5/1.6. Check the options screen to see what version you have. Just because you ran the patch installer, doesn't mean it actually worked. :)
3. Your download didn't complete so you have a broken copy. I think it should refuse to install in this case, but some people did have this problem in the past. Check the zip file size - it should be around 18.5 MB.

If you could provide more details about what is going wrong that might help as well. Does it fail to install? Fail to start up? Fail to start a new campaign?

[Rufats]

First of all, thanks for answering. I do have RTW:BI 1.6 installed. Xgm installation is also o.k., cause I can run the mod. The problem is: I cannot start imperial campaign and on the provincial campaign ( it's Unified Rome!!!), I don't see any XGM and I cannot pick UR too. It looks like RTW does not recognize XGM at all. And no mod has been installed before.

[DimeBagHo]

When you try to start the Imperial Campaign does it say something like "please select from the list"? That usually means you don't have the 1.6 patch installed. Do you have the Gold Edition of RTW? That claims to be 1.6 but in the US (at least) it's not.

[Rufats]

"please select from the list" - exactly. That means that patch 1.6 is not installed? And I have RTW, then BI, no golden edition. What should I do?

[Rufats]

Damn, I stopped playing games couple of years ago, then I bought RTW and it's not working properly. This is ridiculous, I don't care about money that I paid, but you have to get what you paid for ?

[DimeBagHo]

You can get the patch here: http://www.sega.com/support/pcdownloads/rometotalwar_patch/v1.6/English/rome_total_war_patch_1-6.zip
Just download and install.

[Rufats]

Will this work?

[DimeBagHo]

It should work fine. That's the official patch for RTW:BI to bring it up to the latest version. You can take a look at the notes here: http://www.totalwar.com/community/download.htm