VE day!

[TheSilverKnight]

Hooray! It's VE Day!
Let us all celebrate the end of the war in Europe 60 years on!
Drinks are on me! ~:cheers: ...except after 11, then they're on JAG ~D

Also, if anyone has any interesting accounts of the war, or the end of the war, whether it involves your parents or grandparents or whatever, share them here! ~:)

[Templar Knight]

remember the fallen who made this day possible ~:cheers:

[Ser Clegane]

Cheers to the end of war and the end of the darkest chapter in our history ~:cheers:

A big thanks for our generous neighbours and the last 60 years of peace ~:grouphug:

[Beirut]

The Nazis were LOSERS! Screw Hitler, Hess, Himler, and every SS scumbag skinhead who ever walked (and still walks) the Earth.

We won!

And if need be, we'll win again!

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/horsesass/SS.bmp

[Templar Knight]

Cheers to the end of war and to 60 years of peace between our nations ~:cheers:

long may it continue ~:)

[TheSilverKnight]

And if need be, we'll win again!

We already win...we always do ~D


And if need be, we'll win again!

Here here, mate! ~:)

[JAG]

Happy VE day people, let us remember how aweful WW2 was and how great the people who ended it were. ~:cheers:

[InsaneApache]

I have a couple of stories for you. I had a great-uncle , a grandad and an uncle in the war. My uncle is still alive though quite old now.

My great uncle Ted died 6 years ago, in the months before he died, I got into the habit of popping in to see him when I was buying from my suppliers in the city where he lived. Anyway he started telling me of his experiences in France in May 1940. He was in the BEF that was running pall mall for the coast, with the Wehrmacht in hot pursuit. During an air raid by Stukas he ran for cover and just as the planes were overhead he dived for cover under a train waiting in the sidings. The raid over he clambered out from his hideaway and dusting himself down looked around. He was slightly alarmed to see that the train he'd hidden under was full of ordnance. Thousands of anti-aircraft shells and other general munitions. He laughed when he was telling me, but admitted that at the time he ran as fast as he could to get away from that place.

When he arrived back in blighty he was dis-embarking from the ship that had rescued him, when he bumped into his brother (my grandad) on the dockside...now what were the odds against that one?

After being re-fitted they sent him off to the middle-east...and after the African campaign he was stationed in Mesopotamia (Iraq).

My grandad ended up invalidid out of the Army and so joined the RAF and worked on the barrage balloons for the rest of the war.

My uncle had the misfortune to be one of the British troops to enter Belsen. He never talks about it, in fact I only found out about it when my dad told me 2 years ago.

I am full of respect for all the people, men women, servicemen and civilians who did so much for freedom and democracy. :bow:

[Templar Knight]

My great uncle was with a Commando unit and they went in the night before D-Day to help clear the mines and artillery. He was also one of the first to enter the German concentration camps and sadly he never re-covered from what he saw, he died a few years ago.

Here's to all of them who fell and faught so that we may live in freedom :bow:

[Adrian II]

Here's to all of them who fell and faught so that we may live in freedom :bow:And make foults galore in our speling and grammor, eh? ~D

Seriously, I toast to that! ~:cheers:

I've watched a couple of veterans parades in The Netherlands, particularly the Canadian ones always seem to have a lot of atmosphere and mutual warmth between the veterans and the Dutch public. Took my kids to a documentary about the liberation of my hometown, again by Canadians - these fellows must have been all over the place at the time. The commemoration at the U.S. Margraven war cemetery wasn't bad either, even though my PM had another bad hair day. The speeches were rather good.

[Templar Knight]

And make foults galore in our speling and grammor, eh? ~D

Seriously, I toast to that! ~:cheers:


bugger off :shifty:
:thinking2:

~;)

[Axeknight]

VE day? Small cups of warmish, slightly weak tea with powdered milk and no sugar all round! ~:cheers: Please share the digestives - there is a war on, you know!

On a more serious note, my most heartfelt thanks to those who fought and died for the freedoms we still enjoy today. Let us never allow ourselves to take their sacrifices for granted. ~:cheers:

[Beirut]

My grandfather drove a tank for the American Army in WWI in France and whooped the Kaiser!

My father was a tank commander with the Canadian Army in WWII in Italy and whooped Hitler!

I'm sitting here playing with my computer, eating Ben & Jerry's ice cream, enjoying the freedom they bought me.

Thanks guys!

[Byzantine Prince]

Tha't hillarious Beirut. ~:joker:

[A.Saturnus]

There have never before been 60 years of peace in Western Europe. Thanks to all who made that possible and that includes those who fought on the right side.

May we all have the compassion to long for peace, the strength to fight for freedom and justice and the wisdom to know when it is right to fight.

[KukriKhan]

May we all have the compassion to long for peace, the strength to fight for freedom and justice and the wisdom to know when it is right to fight.

Amen, Brother.

My color-blind Dad built tanks in Detroit. His (Canadian) brother fought in Holland & Germany. Neither talked much about it. Not for lack of us kids pestering them.

Thanks to them, and all others who sacrificed, often in a silent sense of duty owed to mankind. :bow:

[Adrian II]

My color-blind Dad built tanks in Detroit. His (Canadian) brother fought in Holland & Germany.Did your uncle ever go back? Many vets do in order to join parades, commemorations and festivities, and they get a heroes' welcome every time. They are driven around town in their original vehicles that have been maintained in an impeccable state by Dutch enthusiasts ever since 1945.

[KukriKhan]

I'm certain he would have appreciated that. Sadly, he died young (50) when his liver blew up (alcoholism). He never got the knack for civilian life after his army days.

[Macedon]

My grand father was a messenger/runner for the Partisans (he was too young for a rifle). My grand uncle fought and died in Stalingrad (he threw himself under a tank with a grenade). My grandmother fought with the Partisans (said she was a good shooter ~:cool: )

[Byzantine Prince]

I'm certain he would have appreciated that. Sadly, he died young (50) when his liver blew up (alcoholism). He never got the knack for civilian life after his army days.
Did you get any trigger time in the big red one there Kukhri? ~;) ~D

[PanzerJaeger]

This isnt a happy day in my house. Along with another lost war, much of my family was killed. My father is a bit biased and is still bitter as he believes the war against bolshevism was justified.

In any event, its a good thing Hitler was taken down but its hard to jump with joy..

[Gawain of Orkeny]

The Nazis were LOSERS!

Let us not forget they werent the only losers. So was most of Eastern Europe who didnt really win their freedom but were instead enslaved. Do any of you know who coined the prhase the Iron Curtain as is applies to Russia? and said it will decend across eastern europe and oppress the people there?

[TheSilverKnight]

Let us not forget they werent the only losers. So was most of Eastern Europe who didnt really win their freedom but were instead enslaved. Do any of you know who coined the prhase the Iron Curtain as is applies to Russia? and said it will decend across eastern europe and oppress the people there?

Winston Churchill after WWII

[Beirut]

Let us not forget they werent the only losers. So was most of Eastern Europe who didnt really win their freedom but were instead enslaved.

Absolutely. No argument there.

But my refering to Nazis as losers was not simply based on the fact that they lost, but that their entire mentality was that of the loser. Xenephobia based on racist dogma. Supremacy based on instilling fear. Fear of freedom lest a single voice speak a truth that could lead to the entire movement crumbling to dust. Sure Nazis were tough. But I know a lot of tough losers.

They were losers morally and intellectually. And so is anyone who ascribes to their viewpoints or celebrates their symbolism based on the false idea that it's cool, tough, and counter-culture.

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/horsesass/nazi.bmp

[Byzantine Prince]

Let us not forget they werent the only losers. So was most of Eastern Europe who didnt really win their freedom but were instead enslaved. Do any of you know who coined the prhase the Iron Curtain as is applies to Russia? and said it will decend across eastern europe and oppress the people there?
Yeah, equality and opportunity for a good living is evil. :rolleyes:

For the other side of the fence I direct you to JAG's sig. There's my answer to your "capitalism=good" crap.

[Redleg]

Yeah, equality and opportunity for a good living is evil. :rolleyes:

For the other side of the fence I direct you to JAG's sig. There's my answer to your "capitalism=good" crap.

LOL - no concept of what Gaiwan is speaking about. I guess you never read about what happen to Hungary and the Czech when they tried to rebel against the iron boot of the USSR.

http://nhs.needham.k12.ma.us/cur/Baker_00/2002_p5/baker_p5_1-02_nwv-jp/hungary_bloody_revolt.htm

http://www.onlineessays.com/essays/history/his066.php

[Redleg]

Happy VE day - for all those in Europe -

A bad period in your European History - may Europe always remember horrors of that war and never allow history to repeat itself.

Had a great uncle who was a tank platoon leader in the 2nd Armored Division - and my grandfather was a Forward Observer for the 45th Division.

[Devastatin Dave]

My wife's Granfather is burried over in Belgium, my great uncle Lamar fought over there (he passed away back in 02 while I was in Korea). What an incredible generation of people. I honor my European brothers for all the loss and struggle they endured. God bless you all. I salute my Canadian brothers for there many, many losses in their fight to help Europe throw off the yoke of a fascist prick. I salute my Australian brothers for their fight against the Axis. I salute the Russian People for the tremendous sacrifices they took in order to push the Eastern front all the way to Berlin. And I thank the Brittish people for their resolute and complete commitment to free Europe from the evils of the racist and criminally insane Nazis.

PS, sorry for the tardiness of my post, the new little girl is working us to death!!!

God bless you all.

...But on a more important note, there are the two "H"s when it comes to safety when having sex with goats. Always remember "Hoof and Horns". These will get you every time. A well lubed goat is wonderful, but if you don't protect yourself from the hoof and the horns, disaster could and will strike. The worst injury I've ever recieved from animal sex was from a Billy that didn't like me being his Bubba...

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Winston Churchill after WWII

Not even close.

[TheSilverKnight]

PS, sorry for the tardiness of my post, the new little girl is working us to death!!!

God bless you all.

That's alright mate
Congrats on the new baby girl ~:cheers:

[TheSilverKnight]

Not even close.

Serious? ~:eek: I usually know these things! OMG!! :dizzy2:

[PanzerJaeger]

Yeah, equality and opportunity for a good living is evil.

You know absolutely nothing. Your beloved communism caused far more suffering and deaths than nazism ever did.

Just because Germany has a monopoly on guilt over ww2 does not erase the 30,000,000 who died under the system that created "equality and opportunity for a good living". ~:rolleyes:

[Byzantine Prince]

Not even close.
It was Reagan if I'm not mistaken.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

It was Reagan if I'm not mistaken.

Your way further off than he was . At least he picked the guy who said it second and who many attribute it too..

Heres the exact quote


An iron curtain would fall over this enormous territory controlled by the Soviet Union, behind which nations would be slaughtered.

[KukriKhan]

Did you get any trigger time in the big red one there Kukhri? ~;) ~D

Let's see: wink smiley & grin smiley ... hmmm. He means no harm, just trying to lighten the mood. Good plan BP. :thumbsup:

My Big Red One time was 40 years later, in what was called the 1IDF (1st Infantry Division, Forward, aka 3rd Brigade, 1st Infantry). No shooting involved (that is what you meant by 'trigger time', yes?); just many practice runs to the Fulda Gap. Seems silly now, since the soviet horde never came tumbling thru. At the time, it seemed deadly serious, and I guess it was; we carried dual BCI (Basic Combat Issue) of both 'training' and 'live' ammo.

[KukriKhan]

Your way further off than he was . At least he picked the guy who said it second and who many attribute it too..

Heres the exact quote

So your choice is Goebels. Some others attribute it earlier to Queen Elisabeth of Belgium.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

So your choice is Goebels. Some others attribute it earlier to Queen Elisabeth of Belgium.

Well it was Goebbels who firat used it in the manner described but actually the first time the phrase was employed in English was by Ethel Snowden, wife of Philip the future "Iron Chancellor", in 1920, following a visit to Russia. She wrote abook of her visit in which she spoke of being "behind the Iron Curtain at last". There is an apparently well-researched history of the phrase and its
genealogy at

http://homepages.cs.ncl.ac.uk/chris.holt/home.informal/bar/politics/iron.curtain

I dont know anything about Queen Elisabeth of Belgium saying it. But Goebbels was the answer i was looking for. In some ways he was quite prophetic.


All the same, the fact that Goebbels' use was so close in its anticipation
of Churchill's, and was meant in exactly the same way and in the same
context, adds an interesting twist to the tale. That Churchill was forced to
admit to Gallacher that he had indeed borrowed it from Goebbels is
sufficient proof of what had inspired him to use the phrase in the first
place.



The Year 2000

by Joseph Goebbels

The three enemy war leaders, American sources report, have agreed at the Yalta Conference to Roosevelt's proposal for an occupation program that will destroy and exterminate the German people up until the year 2000. One must grant the somewhat grandiose nature of the proposal. It reminds one of the skyscrapers in New York that soar high into the sky, and whose upper stories sway in the wind. What will the world look like in the year 2000? Stalin, Churchill and Roosevelt have determined it, at least insofar as the German people are concerned. One may however doubt if they and we will act in the predicted manner.

No one can predict the distant future, but there are some facts and possibilities that are clear over the coming fifty years. For example, none of the three enemy statesmen who developed this brilliant plan will still be alive, England will have at most 20 million inhabitants, our children's children will have had children, and that the events of this war will have sunk into myth. One can also predict with a high degree of certainty that Europe will be a united continent in the year 2000. One will fly from Berlin to Paris for breakfast in fifteen minutes, and our most modern weapons will be seen as antiques, and much more. Germany, however, will still be under military occupation according to the plans of the Yalta Conference, and the English and Americans will be training its people in democracy. How empty the brains of these three charlatans must be — at least in the case of two of them!

The third, Stalin, follows much more far-reaching goals than his two comrades. He certainly does not plan to announce them publicly, but he and his 200 million slaves will fight bitterly and toughly for them. He sees the world differently than do those plutocratic brains. He sees a future in which the entire world is subjected to the dictatorship of the Moscow Internationale, which means the Kremlin. His dream may seem fantastic and absurd, but if we Germans do not stop him, it will undoubtedly become reality. That will happen as follows: If the German people lay down their weapons, the Soviets, according to the agreement between Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin, would occupy all of East and Southeast Europe along with the greater part of the Reich. An iron curtain would fall over this enormous territory controlled by the Soviet Union, behind which nations would be slaughtered. The Jewish press in London and New York would probably still be applauding. All that would be left is human raw material, a stupid, fermenting mass of millions of desperate proletarianized working animals who would only know what the Kremlin wanted them to know about the rest of the world. Without leadership, they would fall helplessly into the hands of the Soviet blood dictatorship. The remainder of Europe would fall into chaotic political and social confusion that would prepare the way for the Bolshevization that will follow. Life and existence in these nations would become hell, which was after all the point of the exercise.

Aside from domestic problems of economic, social and political nature, England would suffer a declining population that would leave it even less able to defend its interests in Europe and the rest of the world than it is today. In 1948, Roosevelt's campaign for reelection would fail, just as Wilson's did after the First World War, and a Republican isolationist would become president of the USA. His first official act would likely be to withdraw American troops from the European witch's kettle. The entire population of the USA would doubtless approve. Since there would be no other military power on the continent, in the best case 60 British divisions would face 600 Soviet divisions. Bolshevism certainly would not have been idle during the period. A Labor government, perhaps even a radical half-Bolshevist one, would be in power in England. Under the pressure of public opinion whipped up by the Jewish press and a people weary of war, it would soon announce its lack of interest in Europe. How fast such things can happen is clear from the example of Poland today.

The so-called Third World War would likely be short, and our continent would be at the feet of the mechanized robots from the steppes. That would be an unfortunate situation for Bolshevism. It would without doubt leap over to England and set the land of classic democracy ablaze. The iron curtain would fall once more over this vast tragedy of nations. Over the next five years, hundreds of millions of slaves would build tanks, fighters and bombers; then the general assault on the USA would begin. The Western Hemisphere, which despite lying accusations we have never threatened, would then be in the gravest danger. One day those in the USA will curse the day in which a long-forgotten American president released a communiqué at a conference at Yalta, which will long since have sunk into legend.

The democracies are not up to dealing with the Bolshevist system, since they use entirely different methods. They are as helpless against it as were the bourgeois parties in Germany over against the communists before we took power. In contrast to the USA, the Soviet system needs to take no regard for public opinion or its people's living standard. It therefore has no need to fear American economic competition, not to mention its military. Even were the war to end as Roosevelt and Churchill imagine, the plutocratic countries would be defenseless before the competition from the Soviet Union on the world market, unless they decided to greatly reduce wages and living standards. But if they were to do that, they would not be able to resist Bolshevist agitation. However things turn out, Stalin would always be the winner and Roosevelt and Churchill the losers. The Anglo-American war policy has reached a dead end. They have called up the spirits, and can no longer get rid of them. Our predictions, beginning with Poland, are beginning to be confirmed by a remarkable series of current events. One can only smile when the English and Americans forge plans for the year 2000. They will be happy if they survive until 1950.

No thinking Englishman fails to see this today. The British prime minister wore a Russian fur coat at the Yalta Conference. This aroused unhappy comment in the English public. When the London news agencies later reported that it was a Canadian fur coat, no one believed them. People saw in the matter a symbol of England's subordination to the Kremlin's will. What happened to the days when England had an important, even decisive say in world affairs! An influential American Senator recently remarked: "England is only a small appendix of Europe!" His comrades treat it that way already. Has it deserved any better? At a dramatic moment in European history, it declared war against the Reich, unleashing a world conflagration that not only went out of control but threatens to leave England itself in ruins. A tiny extension of Germany into purely German territories to the East was sufficient ground to see a threat to the European balance of power. In the resulting war, England found it necessary to throw out its 200-year-old policy of the balance of power. Now a world power has entered Europe that begins to the East in Vladivostok and will not rest in the West until it has incorporated Great Britain itself into its dictatorship.

It is more than naive for the British prime minister to plan for the political and social status of the Reich in the year 2000. In the coming years and decades, England will probably have other concerns. It will have to fight desperately to maintain a small portion of its former power in the world. It received the first blows in the First World War, and now during the Second World War faces the final coup de grace.

One can imagine things turning out differently, but it is now too late. The Führer made numerous proposals to London, the last time four weeks before the war began. He proposed that German and British foreign policy work together, that the Reich would respect England's sea power as England would respect the Reich's land power, and that parity would exist in the air. Both powers would join in guaranteeing world peace, and the British Empire would be a critical component of that peace. Germany would even be ready to defend that Empire with military means if it were necessary. Under such conditions, Bolshevism would have been confined to its original breeding grounds. It would have been sealed off from the rest of the world. Now Bolshevism is at the Oder River. Everything depends on the steadfastness of German soldiers. Will Bolshevism to pushed back to the East, or will its fury flood over Western Europe? That is the war situation. The Yalta Communiqué does not change things in the least. Things depend only on this crisis of human culture. It will be solved by us, or it will not be solved at all. Those are the alternatives.

We Germans are not the only ones who say this. Every thinking person knows that today, as so often in the past, the German people have a European mission. We may not lose our courage, even though the mission brings with it enormous pain and suffering. The foolish know-it-alls have brought the world more than once to the edge of the abyss. At the last moment, the sight of the terrifying misery alarmed humanity enough for it to take the decisive step backwards at the critical moment. That will be the case this time as well. We have lost a great deal in this war. About all we have left are our military forces and our ideals. We may not give these up. They are the foundation of our existence and of the fulfillment of our historical obligations. It is hard and terrible, but also honorable. We were given our duty because we alone have the necessary character and steadfastness. Any other people would have collapsed. We, however, like Atlas carry the weight of the world on our shoulders and do not doubt.

Germany will not be occupied by its enemies in the year 2000. The German nation will be the intellectual leader of civilized humanity. We are earning that right in this war. This world struggle with our enemies will live on only as a bad dream in people's memories. Our children and their children will erect monuments to their fathers and mothers for the pain they suffered, for the stoic steadfastness with which they bore all, for the bravery they showed, for the heroism with which they fought, for the loyalty with which they held to their Führer and his ideals in difficult times. Our hopes will come true in their world and our ideals will be reality. We must never forget that when we see the storms of this wild age reflected in the eyes of our children. Let us act so that we will earn their eternal blessings, not their curses.

[KukriKhan]

No offense intended Gawain. But is it not the pinnacle of irony that you post a Goebbels' screed in a VE thread on VE Day?

[Ser Clegane]

But is it not the pinnacle of irony that you post a Goebbels' screed in a VE thread on VE Day?

Indeed - and I expect that this thread, which is meant to celebrate the liberation of Western Europe (and IMO also e.g., Poland was better off under Soviet rule than under Nazi-rule) will not turn into a discussion about the rather limited prophetic abilities of Goebbels.

If somebody would like to start a new thread to discuss issues around the role of the Soviet Union after WWII, please do so :bow:

[Papewaio]

One Grandfather was in the NZ infantry and never left NZ.

The other Grandfather was Welsh, he couldn't get into the army because of his feet. So he signed up with the Airforce in '39. He ended up a tail gunner in a Lancaster Bomber (tail end charlie = because it was the most dangerous position to be in). He flew over Germany and later on was a Burma Star.

One Great-Uncle was killed in his hospital bed in the fall of Singapore.

Another Great-Uncle was in Dunkirk and Normandy. So both going out and back in.