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Polar
08-21-2001, 05:59
I made a map, but I want to thoroughly test it before I upload it. So I ask the experienced map makers, how do you test a map for possible bugs?

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Polar the ugly

Kraellin
08-21-2001, 11:44
hi polar,

the best way is online. give it to a friend who can also get online with it and test it on the server. with the new game modes this is even more true now, since the new games modes cant be played in single. it's also best to test it in 2v2 or better, but that's not always possible or practical.

K.


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I'm sorry, but i never apologize.

Polar
08-21-2001, 17:58
thx krae.

My map is created for 3v3 or 4v4 games. It's hard to gether many people to test it. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif

Is there a way to form a small map testing group to examine the maps before posting it on the main page? Since the map editor is a build in function now, I can imagine a lot of people starting to make custom maps. The quality control will become a problem.....well, you know what I mean http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

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Polar the ugly

Polar
08-21-2001, 18:04
And I can't even play online for now... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif

Anyway, I'll just upload it, maybe Tosa can have a look before he decides to post it or not.

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Polar the ugly

Vanya
08-21-2001, 21:12
This is a problem that will not go away: to test online, others need your map. But, often it is expected that the map be tested before being published at the ORG, etc (loosely, sure...). So what are you to do?

Test in custom battles and publish it for others to use. With any luck, somebody else will download the map and you can actually try out a 2v2 MP game on it!

With that being said, I still have never seen anybody online hosting a game on my map, vanyasake. So just because you upload it doesn't mean people will download it... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif

I am working on another map... but I must admit, I try to make tactically interesting maps... not the bland pancakes favored by most. (Call me a suka, but me likes the curves!) http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Kraellin
08-22-2001, 02:09
vanya is right. this is an old catch 22 sort of thing. what might be possible is if i accepted terazawa's offer to make a map makers section on the org. we could put an uplink on it for test maps that anyone could download and test with others. if you downloaded these you would do so with the understanding that these are not necessarily finished and polished maps. we could also put any tools and snippets we might come up with for easy access to the map makers.

i'm not much of a web designer. i've done a few things here and there, but i'm no pro and it would probably be a fairly sloppy site, but hey, when yer creating a world there's gonna be a little mess ;) we could prolly also put some sort of little forum in there for feedback responses to tests and ideas and such. or we could just use the mods forum.

dunno, i'll talk to tera some more about it.

K.


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I'm sorry, but i never apologize.

Vanya
08-22-2001, 04:04
Good idea! And you could use a naming convention to identify 'test' maps... like add a '_dev', '_test', '_tmp', or '_draft' suffix to the map name. So, using my map as an example, any of the following would be test map names:

vanyasake_dev
vanyasake_test
vanyasake_tmp
vanyasake_draft

This would leave the following name as the polished final version:

vanyasake

http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Of course, this is all mute if youz all don't agree to a standard naming convention, which the current tag system is of sorts...

Kraellin
08-23-2001, 02:07
vanya,

yes, i talked to tosa yesterday about all this and he suggested something like that as well.

what we came up with was something like this, and i'll leave this posted for a bit before actually doing anything. what we thought might be a good way to do this was to have a test/review/map-makers page(s) as part of the .org. rather than upload maps to tosa for posting on the main custom maps page, you'd upload maps to the 'test' map(s) page. these would automatically be listed for anyone to download, but, your map wouldnt be moved to the main custom maps page till it more or less 'passed inspection'. i hate the idea of being a map cop and am still not sure i want to do it, but i've also noticed a lot of the new stuff needs work but it gets posted anyways cause we want to encourage folks to make maps. in the past, with only a few of us making maps we sort of policed each other's work. tosa would tell me if he found a goof or i'd notice on kiku's site that a particular map had this texture flaw or that and we'd just correct these ourselves. there is also no easy, centralized location for gettting one's maps out to others to help test them to make them better. so, i'm proposing here a way to instill a little quality control management. i dont want to be a map cop or a censor or even a censurer, which is why i'm saying that when you posted your maps on the 'test' site they would automatically still be available for anyone to download. we dont want to put barriers on all the nice new stuff the new map makers (and old) are doing, but it might be a good idea from the standpoint of the 'public' to make a bit of a distinction FOR THEM in what maps are 'finished' and 'polished' and which maps are still in the test/review stage. a map on the test pages might well be a stellar map and completely bug free and so on, so i dont want to stop someone from being able to download it, but looking at it from a player's point of view, he/she might not want anything but absolutely polished maps on his harddrive. i dunno.

i absolutely refuse to 'rate' maps. this is such an arbitrary and personal taste sort of thing that one person's 'rating' can be absolute gibberish to someone else. i 'might' review maps and that is something completely different. a review is simply saying 'here's what i found.'. it's just an observing of what's there without opinion interjected. that, i might do. "this map has a lot of trees on the defender's side and a small hill in the middle. it's a large map, mostly flat and a coastline on the eastern edge"....that's a review. a rating would be more like, 'i liked this map because it had a lot of trees on the defender's side, but didnt like the little hill in the middle and the eastern edge coastline was very poorly done.' see the difference? i've always figured, tell folks what's there and let them decide if it's good or bad for themselves.

anyways, we'd look over the maps on the test site, tell the map maker what we found, let others test it as well, post findings in this forum and let the map maker re-do it if he/she liked. if it then met the simple standards of 'no bugs (causes crashes or oddball unit hangups) and no obvious texture mismatches and blatant building goofs (houses sliding down a hill) or other abnormal, illogical anomolies, why, we'd then move it over to the main custom maps page as a 'finished' map.

i want to stress that this in no way means we're barring folks from posting maps on the .org or limiting others from getting ahold of those maps. in fact, if it can be done, i'd like the test maps site to automatically add a map to the list on the test maps site when it's been uploaded so others can instantly download it. currently, when posting, you have to wait for maps to be checked for at least viruses and major flaws, so this would actually speed up availability. what it would slow down is being designated a 'finished' map and being posted on the main custom maps site.

but, all of this is just currently in the 'thunk' stage. i'm not promising anything, even that i will do it. this is more of a survey, at the moment, than anything else. so post yer thoughts and lemme know what ya think. if it aint something that's needed and wanted then i wont do it; simple as that. non map makers shld post their thoughts here too, since they will also be affected by any such project.

K.


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I'm sorry, but i never apologize.

TosaInu
08-26-2001, 05:57
The TestArea is up. http://www.totalwar.org/maps