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barocca
07-17-2002, 15:48
This is a copy of the modding guide I have posted as a download at http://Doragon.cjb.net
(Medieval Section)

This will be updated as more information is 'uncovered'

================
barocca - 17 July 2002

This Document is a compilation of all the modders notes I have at hand,
written by (in no particular order) DrNo, TosaInu, the Count of Flanders, Choco, Tarrak/Kraxis, ShadesWolf, 96mgb, Swoosh So and all those others I have forgotten,
or just as important,
those whose questions inspired us to try! (oh yes, and me - barocca)

If anyone has anything to add please contact me at The Org's Modding Forum
- where you will also find all of the wise men I have listed above.
or contact me at Clan Doragon's forum - doragon.cjb.net,
or email me at barocca_x@hotmail.com,
and I will gladly include all new information

What we must do before editing

Backdrop Enhancement
To minimise Errors place the BackDrop batch file that should be in included in this download in this folder
..\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Textures\Backdrops\
and then run it.
All it does is copy backdrops from folders that have them to folders that do not.

If it will not run in your system simply open in notepad and copy manually
the format for each line is
(command "from directory" "to directory" /switches)
Overwrite where requested! - to minimise the number of steps required some overwriting occurs, BUT the files are being overwritten by copies of themselves.

WARNING - Your backdrops folder is about to change - backup a copy first,
and be aware it will go from 7.46MB to 64MB !!
- allowing any combination of Demo map, terrain, season and weather - all explained in this document.

What can we edit

Battle Definition File (the bdf)

The first section of the bdf file, descriptions and movies seem to be disabled for the demo, at least i can't find where to place appropriate files to force a change.

MapName::"Ridges2"
Architecture::AT_ISLAMIC
Terrain::LUSH
BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_HISTORICAL
Deployement::true
Season::spring
WeatherSequenceId::0

MapName::"Ridges2" - obvious - the map

Architecture::AT_ISLAMIC
//Architecture::AT_WESTERN_EUROPEAN
These are building types. Choose the style that suits your Mod.

Terrain::LUSH
//Terrain::ARID
//Terrain::ROCK_DESERT
Terrain Type - unsure of effect on weather


BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_HISTORICAL - set this key to avoid tutorial messages!
//BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_TUTORIAL - leaving this key in this field for a Mod on a Tutorial may have unforseen consequneces.


Deployement::true
not enabled?, could find no function for this field.


The Next 2 fields in combinataion are supposed to determine the weather,

Season::spring - valid choices spring, summer, winter, autumn
//Season::summer
//Season::autumn
//Season::winter

WeatherSequenceId::0
0 - very sunny
1 - sunny
2 - stormy - fog - rain
3 - cloudy - fog - snow - even in Season::summer!
numbers above 3 work, but produce same weather as 3,
also we don't have the correct tile sets or backdrops to give a realistic background/terrain portrayal, but at least we can fight in the rain and snow.
Try different combinations of season and weather.
REMEMBER, unless you have used the Backdrop batch file you may see various error messages when you try to run a game with altered weather.

PlAYER
Player::"Richard Coeur de Lion" 5 5 LOCAL "richard" 0 false 19588 28226 180 CHRISTIAN_CULTURE

First number after player name is the faction. i.e. 5
Second number is the alliance it belongs to. again 5.
LOCAL/ARTIFICIAL is Human or AI,
(I set 2 armies to LOCAL and ended up with waiting for deployment to end. i.e. no other human connected to deploy the other army.)

"Richard" is the army definition file name.
(the Demo will look for Richard.adf)

Not sure what the 0 is for. I have seen different numbers in different bdf's - best to leave alone,
IFF, however, you do find out what this field does, please let us know.

false/true dictates if you are attacker/defender.

The coordinates (maybe) for initial camera postion (Will have to check that one)
seems to be both for when you first enter the map, and camera returns here when you press "Continue"

Next is direction of facing. (in this case 180 degrees)
It would be wise to have opposing armies facing each other!

And then culture lastly. Not sure what difference this will make.


//triggers
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
There are usually 3 of these,

This is a Custom Victory Trigger I have Made

//triggers
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::2, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 5, LABEL "Don't Let Your Troops Rout.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::3, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 4, LABEL "Rout or Kill Saladin's Army."
Trigger::4, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 4, LABEL "Kill Saladin."

//results
Result::1, alliances 5, style DEFEAT, battle "Jaffa"
Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY

//groups
Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Group::2, PRIMARY triggers 2 result_ids 1
Group::3, PRIMARY triggers 3 result_ids 2
Group::4, PRIMARY triggers 4 result_ids 2


//triggers
Trigger::1 - 2 - etc.
Simply Trigger number, needed for victory/defeat calculation
there are 2 Triggers avaiable to us for Demo
BT_GENERAL DIED - general died
BT_INCAPACITATE - all army routs

factions - faction/s this trigger applies to

LABEL "Insert any appropraite text here"

INVERT_CHECKBOX
This applies to Human Defeat Triggers,
It Means - If this event has NOT occured then Mark the Checkbox as Sucessfully Completed!


In the example above
Trigger 1 OR 2 will result in defeat,
Trigger 3 OR 4 will result in victory,

You could design a scenario where Defeat Occurs if the AI General Survives the battle, even Though the AI was routed from the field!
Simply have Only BT_GENERAL DIED triggers for Human and AI victory!
(You will have to escape out if Your army routs and your general was not killed - automatic defeat,
If you fail to kill enemy General, and his army routs you will also have to escape out - again automatic defeat, but then the goal was to Kill the general after all)

//results
Result::1, - Result ids number - simply an index number
alliances 5, - alliance this result applies to
style DEFEAT/VICTORY, - Outcome
battle "Jaffa" - Defeat Message to be displayed - cannot change this message - not required for VICTORY result.

Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY
self explanatory now!


//groups
now this is the list of events generated by triggers,
and which results to display for each trigger,
THE Group:: tag itself seems to have little actual meaning,
other than a 'pointer' or marker,
changing the order of the tags OR which Group contains which result seems to make no difference.

Group::1, - First Item in Battle Summary screen
PRIMARY - Demo only allows PRIMARY triggers, meaning absolute conditions.
triggers 1 - Trigger number
result_ids 1 - Which result to use for this trigger!

Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Means if Primary Trigger 1 occurs display results 1

And thats all there is for the Battle Definition File.

AN EXAMPLE OF KILL THE GENERAL TRIGGER SET

//triggers
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::4, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 4, LABEL "Kill Saladin."

//results
Result::1, alliances 5, style DEFEAT, battle "Jaffa"
Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY

//groups
Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Group::4, PRIMARY triggers 4 result_ids 2

remember if you fail to kill AI general you must esc out, if you rout and your General is NOT killed you must escae out.
You can practice chasing down routing units!


ARMY DEFINITION FILE (the adf)

UnitStart::"Unit"
- Seriously, unsure of requirements for this field, Unit works for me

InitialLeaderName::"Richard Coeur de Lion"
Does NOT have to match the name given in the bdf file!
I have seen identical Leader names work AND crash demo
- recommend different names each unit

IsGeneral::true
Is the General of this army - the Demo will select the first unit found in the list with this tag as the general - if he flees army morale suffers.

Position:: 19668 29556
Start location on map

Direction::180
direction of facing on map

GeneralRank::6
Rank - Each 2 ranks generates an additional Honour point to all units IF this unit is the actual general of the army
not sure of upper limit

LeaderHonour::10
The Generals personal Honour - applies to him only
not sure of upper limit

UnitMon::1
may not be used in Demo - other numbers have no effect

TroopType::Archers
unit type, do not use space's,
upper or lower case work for most units,
but the best bet is capitalise individual words
for example : ItalianLightInfantry

TroopNum::180
how many men in unit

TroopHonour::9
with the addition of generals rank bonus some astronomical numbers can be reached!
not sure of upper limit

Columns::60
how many columns from left to right,
a unit of 60 men in 20 columns will be 3 ranks deep

CurveRadius::1
do not know - plain and simple.

FormationType::FORMATION_CLOSE
initial unit formation
FORMATION_LOOSE also works
FORMATION_WEDGE does not

MeleeMode::ENGAGE_AT_WILL
initial melee mode
SKIRMISH works for missile units
HOLD_FORMATION does not seem to work

FatigueLevel::FRESH
TIRED produces units who are Quite Tired, and will never recover to any state above that
EXHAUSTED produces Exhausted unit, again no recovery,
other fatigue levels crashed Demo.

HoldPosition::true
do not know - plain and simple.
changing value had no noticeable effect

GeneralIsDaimyo::true
The General of this Unit is the King of this faction,
again the Demo finds the First such List in the adf and ignores subsequent references

ArmourLevel::4
Additonal Armour Bonus (upper limit not known - possibly 4)
(similar to Armouries from STW)

WeaponLevel::4
Additional Weapon Bonus (upper limit not known - possibly 4)
(similar to SwordSmiths from STW)

UnitEnd::


Map co-ords
This is a matter of experiment, The map is just a grid.
how many squares in the grid depends on map.


Maps!
Some Warlords maps will work with the demo, although unusual results may occur.
Test all maps thoroughly, if you decide to edit the map in warlords - changing textures/models for example, please keep track of which textures work for the Demo, and which don't.
Then post that information at the org! and email it to me, and I'll add your notes to a map editing page at Clan Doragon's Medieval Site.
I haven't written one yet because I haven't edited any maps yet.


New Unit Types
(SOME - quite possibly there are more)
To implement these types simply edit into your adf the unit names as i have written them here,
upper or lower case seems to make little difference.

I will update this document if I have time to test for other units,
To get the fullsats on these unit types simply open the crusaders_unit_prod11.txt using excel
(best to make a copy and rename it to crusaders.xls)

Housecarle
at H6
att bonus 10 - armour piercing
def bonus 8 - has shield
armour 5 - has shield

HighlandClansman
at H6
att bonus 12
def bonus 4 - has shield
armour 3 - has shield

OrderFootSoldiers
at H6
att bonus 7 (8 vs Cav) - xtra ranks can fight
def bonus 11 (15 vs cav) - xtra ranks - has shield
armour 6 - has shield

Pikemen
at H6
att bonus 7 (9 vs cav) - xtra ranks
def bonus 4 (10 vs cav) - xtra ranks
armour 2

Halbardiers
at H6
att bonus 9 (12 vs cav) - arour peircing
def bonus 12 (13 vs cav)
armour 6

ItalianLightInfantry
at H6
att bonus 7 (8 vs cav) - xtra ranks
def bonus 11 (15 vs cav) - xtra ranks - has shield
armour 6 - has shield

UrbanMilitia
atH6
at H6
att bonus 8 (11 vs cav) - arour peircing
def bonus 6 (7 vs cav)
armour 2


While we can implement these unit types, and probably others that I have not had the time to test for, and we can create and use unit icons for the battle card display (at the bottom of screen)

I cannot determine how to implememnt weapons and shields,

for some of these types the demo tries to load the weapons and shields control files, but even if i create weapon and shield control files the actual weapons and shield do NOT appear in game - very disturbing!

ie pikemen,
I found an identical control file in the actions folder to the pikemen control file, and i found demo trying to load pikemen_w.txt and _s.txt files, but when i created the _w and _s files the demo loads THEM, but not the correct weapon and shield control files, (which are a subset)

So the weapons and shields are not displayed!

other unit types listed above,
the demo loads the actions text file, and the lbm file, but simply ignores weapons and shields.

still it is just a demo, and while we can have the units, in order to get the required stats into play, they will appear to be without shields and weapons.
The factors for theses ARE calculated into thecombat results.

UnitIcons

These we can do, Simply use the grafx lbm editor available from the org,
or send the image to me (cut out any background clutter please) and i'll convert it and send it back. (barocca_x@hotmail.com)
If you create an lbm for a unit type be sure to provide a suitably named copy and instructions on where the player needs to place the file in your download!

Errors

If you select a unit the game simply does not recognise 4 things may happen,
the demo may freeze,
the demo may spit out "failed to load hard sprites"
the demo may spit out "unknown error"
the battle will end automatically - "In Defeat"

If you mispell a unit name you will enter battle with "please wait while this battle is resolved" message
The Demo apparently can recognise a mispelt unit name, but does not know what to do about it!

If you assign a map into a different region? via the Terrain:: command a backdrop for that map may not be available and the demo will crash
- BEFORE it quits it will spit out an error message,
it is importnat to write it down, find the missing backdrop and copy the whole subfolder containing the backdrop into the directory the game could not find.
AND to make a note of it in your readme file!
so the user can do the same.

(OR include the backdrop batch file in your download - mentioned ealier)

barocca - DoragonBarocca - Doragon.cjb.net - barocca_x@hotmail.com
17 July 2002

------------------
Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

ShadesWolf
07-17-2002, 17:36
Good work m8

Choco
07-18-2002, 00:54
Yeah ... very nice compilation

Hirosito
07-18-2002, 03:10
cheers mate great stuff i have found out quite a few units which work in the demo. as i have been away i don't know whether you guys know this...any interest?

------------------
Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

barocca
07-18-2002, 10:52
definate interest
lets have'em...

------------------
Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

Choco
07-24-2002, 21:06
Some extra info for Modders ....


Siena72
Registered User
(7/21/02 1:38:34 pm)
Reply
Lithuanian Icons
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have created authentic Medieval Lithuanian flag icon for anyone to put in their MODs.
I used a simpler flag that Grand Dukes own forces fought under. It is authentic and mentioned in Griunvald battle's description.
The better known flag of Grand Duchy of Lithuania was a white horseman on the red background, but it is difficult to draw.

I also made shield icons with Lithuanian sign. So 14 shield icons.

I also made a list of historical Lithuanian names and wrote them in the format that MTW uses in its names.txt file.

I have tried replacing English flag with Lithuanian flag in Battle/Flags folder and in Jaffa battle English army was fighting under Lithuanian flags!!!
Also, I replace Eglish label names (those in {} brackets) with Lithuanian names and after Jaffa battle I got a list of commanders with Lithuanian names!!!

So here I just want to offer Lithuanian icons and names to anybody for free for use in the MODs or (if CA wants them) - hopefully in the game.

So woever want them, just post your e-mail, and I will sent that to you.



Siena72
Registered User
(7/23/02 5:40:24 pm)
Reply Re: Lithuanian Icons
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
this is how to change faction in demo's Jaffa battle:

if you want to play as different faction instead of English,

find Jaffa.bdf file in C Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit\Historical Battles\Jaffa

1. Then lookup line that begins with:
Player::"Richard the lion" 5 5 LOCAL ....

the "5 5" are faction number for England (5). Change it to desired faction number. It reapeats twice in that line
For example 16 is - Hungary. So change it to :
Player::"Richard the lion" 16 16 LOCAL ....


2. Lookup lines that begin with:
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5....
Trigger::2, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 5...

Again change 5 to your faction number. 16 for Hungary. Change it in both lines.

3. Lookup lines that begin with:
Result::1, alliances 5...
Result::2, alliances 5...

Again change 5 to your faction number. Change in both lines.


Faction numbers:
1 - ALmohads
2 - Byzantines
3 - Danish
4 - Egypt
5 - England
6 - France
7 - HRE
8 - Italy
9 - Poland
10 - Russia
11 - Castile
12 - Turkey
13 - Aragon
14 - Burgundy
15 - Golden Horde
16 - HUngary
17 - Novgorod
18 - Papal states
19 - Sicily
20 - Switzerland

Similarly you can chose your opponent faction.

1. I this line
Player::"Sultan Saladin" 4 4 ARTIFICIAL "saladin"...

change both 4 to your desired opposing faction

2. In this line:
Trigger::3, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 4...

Again change 4 to desired opposing faction number.



Siena72
Registered User
(7/23/02 5:49:40 pm)
Reply Re: Lithuanian Icons
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
if you use Lithuanian icons, there is more work involved.

First you have to replace Flag of one of playable factions with Lithuanian flag

Flags are in C Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\Flags

You can find flags by faction numbers. So just copy Lithuanian flag to that folder, then move that flag that you are going to replace to different folder (so you can copy it back later to restore original flag). Then rename Lithuanian flag icon to the name of flag that you want to replace.

Also, you can replace names if you want. They are in
C Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Loc\Eng
ames.txt file

If replacing names, make sure you replace names of right faction and replace only those that are in {} brackets.

Then do changes that I described in previous post. Use faction number of the faction which flag you just replaced.
It works best with faction that has red original color (like Polish or English), because Lithuanian flag is red.

If you change to Lithuanian icons, then if you use units that have signs on their shields (like ChivalricKnights in demo), then replace also shield icons of same faction with Lithuanian ones.
Shiels icons are in
C Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\FacShield\Lores

and

C Program Files\Total War\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\FacShield\Hires


Edited by: Siena72 at: 7/23/02 6:11:01 pm

barocca
07-25-2002, 01:36
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
thats from the .com forum MTW if anyone else wants to go ask him for them,
PLUS I'll add siena's information to the updated guide in about 10 hours,
(i have to leave here in about 15 minutes
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif why can't i have a job that allows me to work when i want to work...)



------------------
Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

Target
07-25-2002, 03:30
You guys seem to be having loadsa fun modding so I'll throw in my tuppence worth. Regarding reinforcements:

Someone has correctly said elsewhere that if you add more than 16 units to an .adf file, the extras become available as reinforcements. You can also force units to act as reinforcements and delay the time when they become avaiable by adding the following line to the unit parameters (unit parameters are all those between UnitStart:: and UnitEnd:: )

Reinforcements::

so, if you want a unit to wait 5 minutes before coming on as a reinforcement, type in Reinforcements::300

This can be applied to any unit, so you can set up scenarios where you start the battle with only 4 units and then eventually another 12 turn up.

Unfortunately, this also highlights a bug in the demo (which, under normal circumstances you'd never see, so I don't feel really guilty about it) that if your 4 units get crushed before the other 12 turn up, you'll have to twiddle your thumbs until the rest of your army turns up.



------------------
Quote MagyarKhans Cham:
i even suspect Target is coming here to hype things up.[/QUOTE]

[This message has been edited by Target (edited 07-24-2002).]

barocca
07-25-2002, 18:40
Guide updated with Target's and Siena's data included,
(table of factions and flags, reinforcments, how to 'create' your own faction etc.)
plus download of lithuania flag, shield icons and names
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

enter throguh the Doragon Portal,
select the medieval link,
then select modding guide,
will take you to the mods section home page
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

------------------
Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

Kraellin
07-26-2002, 01:03
ah! welcome back, Target! good to see you here again! rofl, i see you havent changed your sig ;)

that's great info, target. thanks :)

and good work from all the folks doing mods. very nice. only thing i cant figure out is why do we now need the full game? ;) oh yeah, something about a campaign ;)

it's looking good, target. it's readily apparent that a lot of work has gone into this game. i'm really looking forward to seeing how the vices and virtues is going to affect things.

K.


------------------
The only absolute is that there are no absolutes.

Choco
07-26-2002, 01:15
hey Target ... that is a really good tip.

It opens a whole array of modding possibilities. I can't wait to run something like that

Kraxis
07-26-2002, 04:11
Yeah... Shadeswolf already created a MOD with it. It is a very nice feature.
Thanks Target.

TosaInu
07-26-2002, 22:52
Konnichiwa Target sama,

Nice! Is it possible to start a battle with army A and army B and have army C enter the scene after 20 minutes?

I recall the timelimit in STW WE/MI. One of those Historical battles made use of that: the attacker had to conquer a riverprovince within some 30 minutes or a new enemy army would make it impossible to win. The 2nd enemy army never showed up, the attacker just lost after 30 mins. It would be nice to make it just very hard to win by adding the 2nd defender after 30 mins.

Perhaps this should be regulated in the BDF file?

------------------
Ja mata
Toda MizuTosaInu
Daimyo Takiyama Shi

http://www.takiyama.cjb.net

Target
07-27-2002, 00:22
Hey guys. Thanks for the feedback - glad you like it.

Tosa - I suspect that suggesting that an army turns up and kicks your backside after 30 minutes was just flavour text for explaining why there's was a 30 minute time limit.

As to delaying an entire army... damn, that'll work with the demo code ( and it's bug ), but not with the fix i put in for the final version. The way the full game sits at the moment, once you run out of live units it checks to see if you have any reinforcements that can be assembled right at that second. If you haven't ( if they've still got a few minutes to wait ), then your army is deemed routed and you lose. Great for most situations, except the one where you want to delay an ENTIRE army.

Arzez! Isn't it always the way that there's always one thing you haven't thought of?

------------------
Quote MagyarKhans Cham:
i even suspect Target is coming here to hype things up.[/QUOTE]

TosaInu
07-27-2002, 01:19
Konnichiwa Target sama,

I understand, it will have drawbacks (when you're supposed to be dead). Wouldn't it be possible to make entire army delay, part of the BDF file? The delayed reinforcement is part of the ADF.

Call me stubborn, I want to try to kill that 2nd army after 30 mins, perhaps some Hiei Monks are underway to help me :-).

------------------
Ja mata
Toda MizuTosaInu
Daimyo Takiyama Shi

http://www.takiyama.cjb.net

Choco
07-27-2002, 02:41
I agree that delaying a full army should be possible somewow with the BDF file

NOW ... I have nio idea how to do it and I haven't checked deeply the BDF files

BUT I just got a crazy idea:
In some of the original early training missions (when you are learning how to control your army) the enemy army shows after a while, so I suspect there is some line in the original .bdf files controlling the delay feature.

No the problem is to locate it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Kraellin
07-27-2002, 02:51
target,

you wouldnt happen to know if there's been anything added so that we can convert stw/we/mi maps over to mtw maps, do you? i've been browsing thru the file structure a bit and about the only thing i can see that would require a converter would be maps with models and possibly some of the textures. as far as i can tell, the tile structure is still the same, so it wouldnt be a major piece of programming, i would think.

K.


------------------
The only absolute is that there are no absolutes.

Target
07-27-2002, 04:47
Tosa:
I'll see what i can do, although the chances are you'll have to wait for the patch I'm afraid.

Choco:
The army delay in the tutorial is actually hardcoded into the game because. The appearance of enemy unit is the result of the user performing tasks ( clicking Dialog boxes, completing stages in the lesson, etc, etc ). As a result, they need to turn up at a specified time and it would have been too much hassle to sort out the tutorials as external files. You won't find what you're looking for in the .bdf files. Trust me on this.

Kraellin:
We never make life simple for ourselves http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif The map file format has changed quite radically - the models and the textures and probably the trees would all cause problems when converting Shogun maps to Medieval. All you're likely to end up with that might be useable is the gradients of the map - and I'm not even sure about that. I'll take a look but I wouldn't get your hopes up.

------------------
Quote MagyarKhans Cham:
i even suspect Target is coming here to hype things up.[/QUOTE]

barocca
07-27-2002, 06:13
Target

some of the Warlords/Mongols maps will work in the demo,
(sort of)
but some textures are different,

Ridges2 is a good example,
the trees show up,
but some phsychotic designed the road system, try it and you'll see what i mean...

Target
07-27-2002, 15:15
I stand corrected http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Were all trees placed individually on the maps in Shogun? It's been over a year and I can't quite remember if forest ground-textures were there for the S/MI/WE or if they're new for Medieval.

It sounds like individually placed trees will turn up OK, but woodlands built using ground textures would be screwed, because the texture indices have all changed around. Models definately would be a problem and there'd still be a fair amount of rearranging of textures to do.

------------------
Quote MagyarKhans Cham:
i even suspect Target is coming here to hype things up.[/QUOTE]

TosaInu
07-27-2002, 16:33
Konnichiwa Target sama,

Thanks. I understand.

Maps. I managed to load the Aki map to MTW without adjustions. The map was recognisable in heights and woods, but it had 'weird' texturing. Ridges2 is made by Kraellin using the demo editor (STW Battletrainer jan 2000), it uses textures that have trees attached to it, to make the woods (the demo editor only supported about 100 single trees).

MTW/Textures/Ground has three subdirectories Arid, RockyDesert and Lush. Each containing 170 TGA textures. The very first thing I did was trying to customise one of the TGA files with PaintShop Pro. The texture showed up exactely as I made it. A very nice feature, we're in your debt.

The second thing I tried was adding a custom folder to MTW/Textures/Ground. It was called Tosa (that might be why it didn't work) and contained all textures from the directory Lush. I edited a BDF file so that it tried to use textures from Tosa. It did not work. I may need to edit backdrop folders as well?

The idea is that one could add custom folders to MTW/Textures/Ground and create their own textures. MTW would simply scan MTW/Textures/Ground for available folders, and only load the folder required for a map.

The STW textures are not in TGA format (it may be possible for CA to convert the format used in STW to TGA). Is it possible to add a 4th folder to MTW/Textures/Ground containing the 161 STW textures? The texture ID's in STW maps will then still correspond with the proper TGA file (fans could even sort things out if needed, people love to be involved).

What seems needed is a kind of header in the jjm file with info about which texture directory is used (by default, as the game may have an override mechanism). An convertor would be needed to convert plain STW jjm files into MTW ones (putting in the directory info). An org patron made a similair thing to make STW maps compatible with the Battle Trainer editor (http://www.totalwar.org/maps/Tools.shtml Robs mapconvertors).

This tool could ask the user to enter paths to directories and then add the info (hex format?)into the jjm file.

In a similair way, the mapeditor should allow the user to load custom directories to ease editing custom maps with custom textures.

It may be that the game offers any map to be played as either Arid, RockyDesert or Lush. The 4th mode should be custom in which case the path info from the jjm file itself is used.



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Ja mata
Toda MizuTosaInu
Daimyo Takiyama Shi

http://www.takiyama.cjb.net

Kraellin
07-27-2002, 19:45
target,

what he ^ said :) whatever you could do here would be fine. as tosa points out, we can now edit the .tga's, and that unto itself is quite an addition to the game. if it were also possible to bring the stw/we/mi maps forward into the new game, that would be great. if it's too late for this, why then, we thank you for your time in looking into it.

'Kraellin:
We never make life simple for ourselves.' yes, i do understand. i think tosa may have hit on a possible solution with his paths idea. if the path to the texture folders isnt hardwired, but could be input by the end user, then we could simply create a directory(s) with the old textures/models etc. and have the game look there when we wanted to use an stw/we/mi map.

at any rate, it's good to see you back here, target. is longjohn2 still around?

K.


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The only absolute is that there are no absolutes.

barocca
08-03-2002, 16:44
nearly time to compile this thread to a single document

reinforcemnt entry point - still not determined!

If your general dies, any reinforcements yet to deploy will do so WITHOUT any bonus from the generals rank!!!

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Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

[This message has been edited by barocca (edited 08-03-2002).]