View Full Version : The Black Hand [Concluded]
Sasaki Kojiro
10-25-2006, 22:08
Vernazza, Italy.
https://img273.imageshack.us/img273/7006/ichinqueterrevernazzaqd9.jpg
A small peaceful town. So small it had only one Policeman, Sasaki Kojiro, and his main duty involved sitting in the seaside cafe chatting with the owner. Until one day...
(more will be revealed later)
Rules:
Bold all votes, like this: Vote:Sasaki
Please unvote before changing vote: Unvote:Sasaki; Vote: Csar
Votes that are in a bigger font than normal only count for half :p
Unless otherwise notified, you will be allowed to post after death.
Don't quote, forward, or take screenshots of any pm's from me. If you want to convince people of your role you will have to do it through your own eloquence.
Invisibility mode required, except for mafiosos.
Signed up (28):
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Csar, the grand high underestimator of craftiness (guilty)
Divine Wind
Don Corleone
Reenk "Courteous" Roink
GeneralHankerchief
discovery1
Silver "YOU ARE ALL FOOLS" Rusher
Kage "I thought I was eighth even though I'm really ninth" musha
Sig Bing Kanctaphrax
Ignoramus
Dutch Guy
Sir Moody
Proletariat
Crazed "can't pick a mafia with a 50/50 chance" Rabbit
Husar
EMFM
Xiahou
Cowhead
doc_bean
AggonyDuck of the MightyGut
Masy
Glaucus
ByzantineKnight
Major Robert Dump
theRTWguru
Kommo "I'm still not telling you how I know" dus.
Drisos-hime
Divine Wind
10-25-2006, 22:17
Third place for DW :balloon2:
Don Corleone
10-25-2006, 22:20
Fourth! This is going to be a pain, keeping multiple game information separate. Speaking of which, those of you that haven't signed up for Two Kingdoms... still plenty of titles left.
Reenk Roink
10-25-2006, 22:20
First! :2thumbsup:
GeneralHankerchief
10-25-2006, 22:31
I seem to be noticing a trend in these games being more story-oriented...
In, btw.
discovery1
10-25-2006, 22:31
I'm in.
Awe that's wrong Sasaki. :inquisitive:
I say we lynch the Moderator of the Game.
Vote:Sasaki Kojiro
Silver Rusher
10-25-2006, 22:48
Silver "YOU ARE ALL FOOLS!" Rusher is going to be involved in the playing of this mafia-themed werewolf game of medium proportions.
I wish my name said:
Cs Sasaki is a mafioso Vote:Sasaki ar
Kagemusha
10-25-2006, 22:54
9th.:bow:(And people dont you now lynch me for editing this post)~;)
Big King Sanctaphrax
10-25-2006, 22:58
I'm in.
Ignoramus
10-25-2006, 23:11
I'm in.
Dutch_guy
10-25-2006, 23:27
Sign me up.
:balloon2:
Sir Moody
10-25-2006, 23:29
im in
Proletariat
10-25-2006, 23:53
In!
Crazed Rabbit
10-26-2006, 00:09
Crazed "Can't Pick a Mafia with 50/50 Odds" Rabbit is in.
CR
Man all I get is (guilty) by my name. weak
And I once though you were crafty Sasaki :(
Evil_Maniac From Mars
10-26-2006, 02:25
I'm in.
I'm ready for some more hot mafia action. :yes:
Cowhead418
10-26-2006, 03:55
Count me in.
doc_bean
10-26-2006, 12:15
Don_Bean signing up !
I'm hoping this will be another role fest !
First! :2thumbsup:
First in or first making an @ss of himself?
:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:... sorry couldn't resist.
AggonyDuck
10-26-2006, 20:47
Sign me up! This town will need my mighty gut!~:cheers:
Me please! Also, Oblivion reference? Or you just liked the name? Sounds fun anyway.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-26-2006, 20:58
From the Wikipedia article on Mafia.
Lets do it. Glaucus is ready to play.
ByzantineKnight
10-27-2006, 02:27
Sign me in too
Byzantine Knight
Major Robert Dump
10-27-2006, 03:15
Im in, since I dont have to worry about playing 2 games at once now :laugh4: :laugh4:
Alright Sasaki I got some questions. When do we start the game? After SR's is finished or before?
And when are we going to get some more information on the game?
Sasaki Kojiro
10-27-2006, 04:38
Alright Sasaki I got some questions. When do we start the game? After SR's is finished or before?
And when are we going to get some more information on the game?
I was about to post it but now I'm not.
I was about to post it but now I'm not.
Ok that makes me happy. Why do you hate freedome?:thumbsdown:
Death Match
10-27-2006, 05:34
I'm in
Kommodus
10-27-2006, 05:43
Please sign up Kommo "I'm still not telling you how I know" dus.
I've just been lynched innocent in the Godfather, sign me up! ~:)
:book: :smash: :yes:
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 02:26
Signups closed, I'll be sending out pm's.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 02:54
Sasaki Kojiro was enjoying his coffee in the seaside cafe of Verzanna at sunset.
https://img91.imageshack.us/img91/4700/5mm8.jpg
Hearing a screeching of tires he looked up in surprise, just in time to see a black sedan come to a halt outside the cafe.
https://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5820/carsbbiggt2.jpg
He barely had time to notice the gunmuzzle sticking out of the backseat window before the the cafe was ripped apart by machine gun fire. The car sped off and Sasaki was left laying in a pool of his own blood.
***
The town doctor had just informed the anxious citizens that though Sasaki's state was still critical there was a good chance he would live. If he had arrived minutes later he would not have been in time. As the crowd exited the hospital they were still discussing what had been the hottest topic for the past few hours, who had attempted to kill Sasaki and why?
They noticed that the town billboard had been stripped clear of all the usual advertisements and announcements. Instead there was posted a single letter, which read:
Citizens of Verzanna:
Ours is an ancient order. We three have lived among you for many years, watching over this small town. It is with sad hearts that we inform you that three members of The Black Hand have infiltrated our town and are living amongst us. It was they who attacked our policeman. What purpose they have in this town we do not know, but rest assured we will do our best to protect the town by patrolling as watchmen (http://www.mafiascum.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl/Information_Roles) each night. We have some ability to hand out justice on our own (http://www.mafiascum.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl/Vigilante) but for the most part it will be up to the townspeople to rid Verzanna of these parasites.
There was no signature, just the symbol:
https://img100.imageshack.us/img100/4130/mason20compass20square2pw4.jpg
Proletariat
10-28-2006, 02:59
Not quite sure what you're getting at here, Sasaki. Sounds like something a mafioso would post.
Vote: SK
Not quite sure what you're getting at here, Sasaki. Sounds like something a mafioso would post.
Vote: SK
I only wonder why he would kill himself. :inquisitive:
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 03:11
Voting hasn't started yet and I'm not dead :tongue3:
Voting hasn't started yet and I'm not dead :tongue3:
No one can survive a mafia bullet even you. :thumbsdown: CHEATER
Vote: Sasaki
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 03:36
PM's sent. If you didn't get one you don't have a role sorry. Kills will be posted in ~24 hours.
Don Corleone
10-28-2006, 04:03
Has anybody checked the links yet? There's a page attached to one of them that has a whole bunch of roles. There's also a link that only talks about vigilantism, the one that says their own justice. Isn't that the same as the lynching?
GeneralHankerchief
10-28-2006, 04:56
Masons!
Ok people, check for people who are doing funny handshakes...
Major Robert Dump
10-28-2006, 10:49
Hmmm, so the three people who posted on the billboard are masons. So now when we vote to lynch someone our chances of killing an innocent roleplayer are even higher than usual because we also have a doctor and cops to worry about, and if the badguys only hit one person per round it keeps the odds in their favor longer. So do we have to lynch each round, what if the whole village abstained? I'm sure this suggestion will get me killed first again
Death Match
10-28-2006, 11:43
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...........................................................
Maybe. I feel like I want to kill somebody any moment. Major Robert Dump, that wasn't a wise thing to say. I hope that the mafia does not kill you the next round, but I am suspicious of you... Maybe you are "pretending" to be innocent... You must be a mafioso... WHY ELSE WOULD YOU WANT US NOT TO LYNCH?
Vote: Major Robert Dump
Major Robert Dump
10-28-2006, 12:20
because if we give the detective and masons time enough to do their job we wont go lynching innocents and the mafia will get themselves caught by the masons. I made the argument of abstaining in GII, but in that game there is only a doc and a detective. meanwhile, the mafia only killed one guy last round, that guy being me, and now the whole damn village cant figure out if the mafia is messing with them or if we got a mafia on the first lynch, which is wholly impossible due to the timetable.
Of all the people in all this game to lynch, why would I paint a big bullseye on my head for both the mafia and the village by asking about the ramifications of a town-wide abstain? TBH, this game intrigues me, I'm sorry I missed the first few
Don Corleone
10-28-2006, 20:25
I think we need to lynch, for the same reasons Sasaki explained in Godfather. I think it's really, really eerie how quiet it is. There's a couple of folks that usually lead the charge in terms of sifting through what we know, and they haven't said anything. Top of that list is Sigurd.
Vote: Sigurd.
GeneralHankerchief
10-28-2006, 20:44
I think we need to lynch, for the same reasons Sasaki explained in Godfather. I think it's really, really eerie how quiet it is. There's a couple of folks that usually lead the charge in terms of sifting through what we know, and they haven't said anything. Top of that list is Sigurd.
Vote: Sigurd.
Don, voting doesn't start until someone's been killed.
Don Corleone
10-28-2006, 20:47
Oh. I saw some debate already ongoing, I thought that we were picking a lynchee already. Sorry Sigurd.
Unvote: Sigurd
Vote: Abstain
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 22:06
The townspeople were still standing around the bulletin board in some confusion when a commotion back at the hospital got their attention. Hurrying back, they were greeted with the sight of the doctor examining Kommodus' throat. A mafioso had been waiting behind him when he got into his car and attempted to kill him with piano wire.
Those among the townspeople who had thought the letter from the "masons" was just an elaborate prank thought so no longer. Slowly they left the hospital and headed home for the night. Those with cars checked very carefully for mafioso's in the back seat.
Sigurd Fafnesbane was ruminating on the toilet. "Who were these members of the "The Black Hand" and what did they want? For that matter who were these Masons? Was it possible this had anything to do with the old legand about..." He stood up, and before he could finish his sentence his house was ripped apart by an explosion loud enough to waken the entire town, if any of them had managed to fall asleep.
Killed(1):
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Alive(27):
Csar
Divine Wind
Don Corleone
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
discovery1
Silver Rusher
Kagemusha
Big King Sanctaphrax
Ignoramus
Dutch Guy
Sir Moody
Proletariat
Crazed Rabbit
Husar
EMFM
Xiahou
Cowhead
doc_bean
AggonyDuck
Masy
Glaucus
ByzantineKnight
Major Robert Dump
theRTWguru
Kommodus
Drisos
Please remember to bold all votes. You have 24 hours. Time may be extended if there is enough discussion. Those who I feel are not participating enough will be eliminated...this may include people who show up every round just to abstain.
AggonyDuck
10-28-2006, 22:17
Hmmmm, those were very brief kill descriptions and especially the Kommodus being saved part was a bit unclear. Although on further examination it does make sense. I had originally thought that the Mafioso was in the car, but it seems like the Mafioso was behind him and basically missed his chance when Kommodus entered his car.
Anyway, this started on a positively. We have one villager whom we know is innocent and at the same time the Mafia lost a kill. So we have gained a slight advantage now. Way to go doctor!:2thumbsup:
EDIT: Oh lol, I need to start reading things properly. Looks like the mafioso was in the car afterall, but somehow thanks to the doctor Kommodus survived.
Reenk Roink
10-28-2006, 22:31
Reenkmaistro is pleasantly surprised that a doctor was able to save a villager on Day 1. Kommodus has also been proven innocent. Of course, he is not able to point any fingers, and as such, he abstains, courteously. :bow:
Kagemusha
10-28-2006, 22:50
Good job from the Doctor.~:cheers: It seems that the mafia tryed to eliminate some of the most dangerous townspeople towards them at the first round. Thanks to Doc Kommodus was saved,but unfortunately we lost Sigurd. There is not much to go with at the moment so i will Abstain at the moment.
Csar abstains, courteously.
:D
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 23:00
Csar abstains, courteously.
:D
Just for reference, these are the kinds of posts I consider not-contributions :p
doc_bean
10-28-2006, 23:03
Well, I normally support lynching in the first round, however, with doctors, detectives AND masons running around, killing one of them might be too big a risk after all. Though I'm still rather unsure about that, I need to think it over and might vote when more people have posted...
For now I vote:abstain, rather reluctantly...
Analysing posting times, I'd say at least one of the mafiosi or the doctor does not live in America. Sasaki has been quite active I think, Sigurd wouldn't have been killed if the mafia knew he would be suspected, so Sasaki must have received the Sigurd murder before the other.
So after, a lot of thinking, I come up with the slightest possible clue to the identity of the mafia... well...:sweatdrop:
Vote: No Lynch
Just for now.
Oh and we as non-special-role villagers, what can we advise the doctor? Should he save Kommodus each round, or pick other that he thinks might be murdered? I don't really know which would be better for the town...:juggle2:
Just for reference, these are the kinds of posts I consider not-contributions :p
I don't even much like you anyways. :yes:
AggonyDuck
10-28-2006, 23:09
So the Masons are Watchmen and can act as a Vigilante too? Sounds interesting. So if we have three masons, then it's safe to assume that there propably is three mafia members too. The amount of Detectives and Doctors remains a mystery, but my guess is that there only is one detective and one or two doctors.
Also Sasaki, about the rules. I've noticed that you've added the rule "Invisibility mode required, except for mafiosos." Could you clarify exactly what this means and do I have to obey it?
Reenk Roink
10-28-2006, 23:11
Kommodus's situation is a tricky one.
One the one hand, he is a proven innocent. Those are bad for the mafia as it is one less potential suspect. The mafia will try to kill him. On the other hand, since the mafia at times do rise above their absolute ineptness, they may hold off killing him for a couple of rounds, while the doctor protects him, and then when the doctor leaves Kommodus in the lurch to protect another, they may strike. The mafia should be able to deduce this even with their challenged intellect. This has the potential to go in an infinite regress.
It becomes a game of who fakes out who...
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 23:12
Well if you're not using invisibility mode, then you must be a mafioso :tongue3:
I find watching to see who is pm'ing etc to a lame way to play the game.
Major Robert Dump
10-28-2006, 23:31
Kommodus emerges as the new town leader, cuz we all know he's innocent, and we can expect him to be in direct communication with the doc now. It's early in the game and we are already in line to sticking it to the mafia:laugh4: :laugh4:
It's obvious the mafia has followed or played the game before because they wanted to take out who they percieved as strong players. Kind of an obvious move, and the doc was on top of it. What I don't understand is why were there only 2 kills if there are 3 mafia?
I'm not voting yet, would like to hear some others chime in.
Don Corleone
10-28-2006, 23:32
Way to go Doctor!!! That totally kicks ass.
Well, clearly my suspicions about Sigurd were unfounded. But I still think that was the right line of reasoning... MRD is strangely quiet, he's my next vote.
Edit: Crap, and here he is.
Unvote: Major Robert Dump.
Vote: Abstain, for now
Silver Rusher
10-28-2006, 23:34
Nice one, doc.
Vote: Abstain
Subject to change.
Kommodus emerges as the new town leader, cuz we all know he's innocent, and we can expect him to be in direct communication with the doc now. It's early in the game and we are already in line to sticking it to the mafia:laugh4: :laugh4:
It's obvious the mafia has followed or played the game before because they wanted to take out who they percieved as strong players. Kind of an obvious move, and the doc was on top of it. What I don't understand is why were there only 2 kills if there are 3 mafia?
I'm not voting yet, would like to hear some others chime in.
It alternates between the three mafioso
Crazed Rabbit
10-28-2006, 23:44
Hmm, not enough info, and given the numerous good roles it might be safer to not lynch right now:
vote: no lynch
CR
Awesome save doctor! I guess Kommodus is a marked man...
No suspicions as yet thought
Vote: Abstain
Don Corleone
10-28-2006, 23:53
I'd really like to hear what Kommodus has to say. Hey, can the doctor be in the mafia? Can they target and protect themselves as a cover?
Sasaki Kojiro
10-28-2006, 23:57
I'd really like to hear what Kommodus has to say. Hey, can the doctor be in the mafia? Can they target and protect themselves as a cover?
The mafia can target themselves but the doctor is not a mafioso.
Reenk Roink
10-29-2006, 00:17
Anyone else get a weird PM from "A_friend"? :inquisitive:
Dutch_guy
10-29-2006, 00:21
Anyone else get a weird PM from "A_friend"? :inquisitive:
No...
But, you have made me quite curious as to why, and who would go to such lengths (making a new account?) just to send a PM.
What did it say, Reenk ?
:balloon2:
Reenk Roink
10-29-2006, 00:25
Don Corleone and Major Robert Dump are mafia.
Kommodus, Proletariat, and You (Dutch_guy) are masons.
I didn't believe it, but he also said: "I will send this mail to all except the mafia and the masons"...
Weird...
Exactly the same as mine.
This is a sad excuse for a trick if one of the mafioso's did it.
Reenk Roink
10-29-2006, 00:33
This friend guy has me convinced on the validity of what he is saying, but he's also a bit rude... :no:
"Should I be angry with you" Pfft...
Still...
I would like to change my vote. No longer will I abstain, courteously. :bow:
I will vote for Don Corleone.
Also, this guy "A_friend" said that if he is killed the whole town loses. That is is reason for anonymity.
Among the three masons is a Mafia spy who he does not know.
Note: I am still not 100% sure about his claim. There is something still fishy.
Let us only kill one of his claimed Mafia, and let the other live while we gather more info.
Kagemusha
10-29-2006, 00:33
I received it also.So should we believe it and lynch Donand MRD to be sure, opinions?
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 00:34
Somebody created an account to send you a PM, their account name was "A friend" and "A Friend" told you that MRD and I were the mafia? Well, that might work, except that there's no A friend in the game. I'm not mafia, I don't know about MRD, but unless the mafia are idiots, they're only going to kill one person if you lynch him or I. If you lynch us both, that would end the game, right? We could try it.
Vote: Don Corleone
Edit, erh, no "A Friend" in the org.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 00:36
The following morning the town gathered in the square to discuss the explosion of last night. Unfortunatly they did not notice the dynamite hidden in the fountain. Bang.
Killed:
Csar
Divine Wind
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
discovery1
Silver Rusher
Kagemusha
Big King Sanctaphrax
Ignoramus
Dutch Guy
Sir Moody
Proletariat
Crazed Rabbit
Husar
EMFM
Xiahou
Cowhead
doc_bean
AggonyDuck
Masy
Glaucus
ByzantineKnight
theRTWguru
Drisos
Alive:
Kommodus
Major Robert Dump
Don Corleone
Mafia Victory!
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 00:38
So the game is over? That sucked
Kagemusha
10-29-2006, 00:38
:inquisitive:
Sir Moody
10-29-2006, 00:39
im confused :inquisitive:
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 00:40
Somebody sent out a PM claiming MRD and I were in the mafia. Apparently Sasaki got pissed and blew up the town.
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 00:40
Wow, I spent nearly an hour making a fake account and sending PMs for that ???
Hey Reenk if you post 2 mafia names they"re gonna know the third one is the spy !!!!
:furious3: :furious3: :furious3:
EDIT: and as for the PMing being an unfair thing to do, well maybe, but it was within the limits of the game, Kommodus was hot on my tail already, and it backfired like hell.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 00:41
I had to write that into the rules for the game to work. I didn't expect him to actually do it...
Also, shortest game EVAR
Woot Woot I win:2thumbsup:
Dumb Townspeople
Sir Moody
10-29-2006, 00:41
which suggests the pm was right (i got one too) but surely the only one who could have sent it was Sas... now im really confused :inquisitive:
That's the funnest Mafia game ever. Sasaki are we starting over or are going to just drop it? Though that was a good idea Doc Bean and Reenk wasn't smart for posting that PM. COME ON MAN THINK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 00:44
Sasaki, if you made Doc-bean a spy, of course he was going to rat us out, first chance he got. I don't see how that could have gone any other way.
Edit: Did Mrs. Corleone pay you to do that? :inquisitive:
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 00:46
Sasaki, if you made Doc-bean a spy, of course he was going to rat us out, first chance he got. I don't see how that could have gone any other way.
Well the rules were set up so if he ratted you out the town lost. Which is what happened.
If you've seen "the departed" or "infernal affairs" then you know the setup.
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 00:47
Clarification !
You have been randomly selected as a member of The Black Hand. Your fellow Mafiosos are Major Robert Dump and Don Corleone. You can kill 2 people each turn, sending me the names of who killed them and a description. You also have a mole among the Mason group, however you don’t know who he is, you lost contact while he was becoming a mason. You have 24 hours each night to send me your choices. I would strongly suggest using email and IM to communicate to avoid people who are watching who’s online.
Sasaki
That was the pm sent to MRD and Don. You are actually the undercover mason. The other two think you are a Mafioso. The Mason’s are Kommodus, Proletariat and Dutch_Guy. If you are killed by a Mafioso the town instantly loses. Be very careful about what you reveal. Remember there is a third Mafioso among the mason’s and you don’t know who he is.
and thanks for the support Don, even though I was a no good traitor :shame:
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 00:48
Well the rules were set up so if he ratted you out the town lost. Which is what happened.
If you've seen "the departed" or "infernal affairs" then you know the setup.
When where you going to decide to tell me the rules ? :huh2: :furious3:
What kind of weird thing was that?
Who besides Sasaki could know all that?
:inquisitive:
Better luck next time:laugh4:
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 00:51
When where you going to decide to tell me the rules ? :huh2: :furious3:
I was originally going to say something like "no pming anybody" but decided it would be less unnatural to write the rules so that it would be a bad move to reveal what you knew, unless there was only one mafioso left in which case you would naturally reveal yourself (which you couldn't have done with a "don't reveal anything" rule).
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 00:51
Clarification !
and thanks for the support Don, even though I was a no good traitor :shame:
Well, I didn't get that you were a rat. I thought somebody snooped us, something I definitely have to learn about (invisible, not invisible, how do you break into other people's PM accounts :dizzy2: )
Anyway, I was really hoping they were going to lynch MRD & me, then you could start popping them off one at a time and they wouldn't have a clue what was going on.
Oh well. And don't feel ashamed. It was your destiny, Judas. Just kiddin. :laugh4:
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 00:57
I was originally going to say something like "no pming anybody" but decided it would be less unnatural to write the rules so that it would be a bad move to reveal what you knew, unless there was only one mafioso left in which case you would naturally reveal yourself (which you couldn't have done with a "don't reveal anything" rule).
Well, as far as I can tell, I acted perfectly within the rules. I even believe the game would have been balanced. Don and MRD MUST have guessed there was a spy amongst us, so the chances of them catching me would have been significant, even if I had managed to survive, the villagers needed to follow my advice and lynch Don and MRD and the right mason (Kommodus, it seems), before I got killed for whatever reason.
And if the watch worked the way the rules you posted describe them, there was a chance I would have been killed while on a kill to keep my cover, Kommodus already knew I was mafia, if he wasn't the mafia spy (I still don't know) he could have had me by next round.
It could have been an interesting game imho.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 01:01
Kommodus knew you killed Sigurd, he didn't know whether you were mafia or mason, and he couldn't kill anybody until the other 2 mafia were dead. Also, you can only be ID'd by the watchen, and being lynched wouldn't make the town lose. Would have been interesting.
If I ever try it again I'll try to make the rules a bit more tamper proof.
You were entirely within the rules of the game btw, though I think multiple accounts are against org rules...honestly I didn't consider that one.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 01:33
This was how the game was setup.
Don Corleone and MRD were regular mafiosos. They thought doc_bean was a mafioso but he was actually a masonic spy.
Dutch guy was a vigilante and a regular mason, Prole was a watchman and a regular mason, Kommodus was an undercover mafioso who they only thought was a mason.
Kommodus didn't know who the mafia were and they didn't know who he was.
doc_bean knew who the masons were but couldn't tell them anything because if the mafia killed him the game was over. I should have made this clearer, they game faulted on this point.
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 02:11
With a doctor, a detective, a watchman and the three masons, one a mole in the mafia, the Townspeople had a huge advantage in this game. Letting the mason's mole in the Watchman know who everyone was, especially the doctor, made their edge insurmountable. No offense Sasaki, but you need to balance these rules a little more. There's no way the mafia can win, espeically if they're not told one of them could be a mole. I didn't even THINK along those lines until Kommodus got protected, and then I just thought I was being paranoid.
Crazed Rabbit
10-29-2006, 02:15
:inquisitive:
Well, that was...not fun.
Oh well.
Crazed Rabbit
GeneralHankerchief
10-29-2006, 02:20
...
...whoa, I missed it all.
So doc_bean ratting on the mafia ended the game?
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 02:56
With a doctor, a detective, a watchman and the three masons, one a mole in the mafia, the Townspeople had a huge advantage in this game. Letting the mason's mole in the Watchman know who everyone was, especially the doctor, made their edge insurmountable. No offense Sasaki, but you need to balance these rules a little more. There's no way the mafia can win, espeically if they're not told one of them could be a mole. I didn't even THINK along those lines until Kommodus got protected, and then I just thought I was being paranoid.
Meh, there was plenty of way for the mafia to win. Kommodus had already been "proven" innocent remember. And doc_bean would have had to pretend to be a mafioso. Also, there was no detective and there was no doctor.
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 03:22
Think about it for a second. The mason's mole with the mafia is a huge advantage. That's twice that a mafia kill wont' go through, as it's most likely that the mafia won't figure out that they have a rat until the doctor protects somebody twice. If the mason's mole is smart, he'll only use this to protect somebody he really truly believes the town needs, like Kommodus, so it could be a while before that 2nd confirming protection happens and by then, the mafia may not put 2 & 2 together. In the interim, the mole can be out slowly building support among the town and letting the other two masons know who to watch and when. What can the mafia do to protect themselves in such a case? What's more, the two true mafia need to reach the conclusion separately, and SILENTLY. As soon as they mention that they suspect that one of them isn't on the up and up, the mole just whacks one of them.
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 03:38
Think about it for a second. The mason's mole with the mafia is a huge advantage. That's twice that a mafia kill wont' go through, as it's most likely that the mafia won't figure out that they have a rat until the doctor protects somebody twice. If the mason's mole is smart, he'll only use this to protect somebody he really truly believes the town needs, like Kommodus, so it could be a while before that 2nd confirming protection happens and by then, the mafia may not put 2 & 2 together. In the interim, the mole can be out slowly building support among the town and letting the other two masons know who to watch and when. What can the mafia do to protect themselves in such a case? What's more, the two true mafia need to reach the conclusion separately, and SILENTLY. As soon as they mention that they suspect that one of them isn't on the up and up, the mole just whacks one of them.
~:confused: doc_bean doesn't have the power to protect anyone. The only reason he didn't kill Kommodus is that I made the undercover mafia member immune, he was the reason for the fake doctor role. If doc_bean had tried to kill anyone else he would have succeeded. And don't forget Kommodus had an extremely powerful position as well.
Don Corleone
10-29-2006, 03:47
So there wasn't really a doctor? I thought Doc Bean PM'd the doctor and told him to protect Kommodus.
Kommodus
10-29-2006, 04:55
Ok, whoa. Everything always seems to go down while I'm away. Don Corleone, you wanted to hear what I have to say? Well, here it is.
I was, in fact, posing as one of the Masons (a watchman), but I was actually an undercover member of the Black Hand. However, I didn't know the other mafiosi and they didn't know me. I knew that in order to help the mafia to the fullest extent possible, I would have to figure out who they were, and secretly communicate with them.
Here's how being a watchman works: you can watch someone's house at night, and if the mafia kill that person, there's a chance you will identify the killer. If both watchmen observe the same house, this chance is 100%, but if only one watches the house, the chance is only 50%.
Therefore, before the game even started, I convinced my fellow Masons that the best strategy was to patrol separately early in the game in order to cover more ground, and then patrol together once we had some idea of who the mafia would attack. While Proletariat chose to watch Major Robert Dump's house, I fortuitously chose Sigurd Fafnesbane, reasoning that the mafia would try to take out their greatest threats first.
The ploy worked better than I could've possibly imagined. I got a successful "dice roll" and identified doc_bean as Sigurd's killer. Because I'm working for the mafia, I immediately PM'd my fellow Masons and told them I had failed to identify Sigurd's killer.
My next move was a tricky one. Was doc_bean really a mafioso, or was he the undercover Mason? I had no way of knowing, but there was a 2/3 chance that he was really a mafioso. Besides, I reasoned that the undercover Mason, trying to help the town win, wouldn't want to kill such a potentially helpful townsperson. I took a calculated risk and sent doc_bean this message:
I know it was you who killed Sigurd Fafnesbane, Mr. Bean.
Got your attention? Good - pay attention carefully, because what I have to say could determine whether the Black Hand succeeds in taking Verzanna or not.
Why, you ask, am I telling you this, if I know that you are guilty? It's quite simple, you see. I am actually a fellow member of the Black Hand - an undercover Mafioso, posing as one of the Masons. I am working secretly to undermine their work and to bring victory to the Black Hand. As a watchman, I was watching Sigurd, and I saw you commit the murder. My fellow Masons know nothing of this, as I have claimed that I failed to spot his killer.
What you do not know is that the Black Hand has also been infiltrated by a Mason. Obviously I am taking a calculated risk that this is not you, and that one of your team-mates is the traitor. Therefore I insist that you do not tell either of them that you've received this message.
What you must do is this: immediately send me the identities of the other two members of the Black Hand. I'll handle it from there. Also, be sure to keep me up-to-date on the Black Hand's plans. This information will help me influence my fellow Masons to dance to the mafia's tune. Once I know you can be trusted, I'll send you the identities of my fellow Masons so that the Black Hand can eliminate that threat.
Also, now that you know there's a traitor in your midst, keep your eyes and ears open and see if you can figure out who it is.
I appreciate the attempt on my life, though - that kind of respect can only be earned. Now that you know I'm on your side, however, you must make sure that it doesn't happen again. The time will come for me to sacrifice my life for the cause, but that time has not yet come.
How do you know you can trust me, you ask? Simple - if I were not loyal to the Black Hand, I wouldn't be telling you this; instead, you'd be dead within a day. If you weren't lynched, you'd have a vigilante's bolt in you before the next sunrise.
I look forward to your reply.
I reasoned that if doc_bean was really a mafioso (which was more likely than not), our cause would get a huge boost. He could feed me information on the identities and plans of the mafia, and I could mislead the other Masons and get them killed off by giving away their identities. :evil:
However, if doc_bean was the undercover Mason, I figured I'd be dealing my side a rather large blow, because now doc_bean would know the truth about me. He could've done several things with this information, such as convincing the mafia to keep trying to kill me, eliminating the undercover mafioso and helping the town. Or he could've pretended to be a mafioso and given me false information.
Instead, however, he tried the illegal tactic of ratting out the mafia to the townspeople. Not a good move, doc_bean - I handed you a way to help the townspeople win, and instead of using it you handed the game to the mafia. :no:
Here's the thing: back when I was starting Cosa Nuova, Pannonian suggested the idea of having two factions, each with a mole in the other. I thought this was an extremely cool idea, but I foresaw a problem: what could prevent the fake mafioso from simply announcing his role and identifying the rest of the mafia publicly? He would die, sure, but he'd guarantee a townsperson victory and therefore achieve his goal.
The only way to stop this is to set up a rule that if he actually does this, his side automatically loses. This is what Sasaki did. I thought of doing it in Cosa Nuova, but decided that it wasn't strong enough; could I really risk an abrupt end to my game simply because someone I don't know decides to do something crazy? Apparently my fears were well-founded.
Proletariat and Dutch_guy: Sorry about the whole deception thing. I really do prefer being one of the good guys, but this time it didn't work out that way. If we'd all been true Masons, we'd have nailed the mafia for sure: I think the strategy I picked really was sound, and we did successfully predict a mafia target on the first try!
And Sasaki, I thought that this game setup was fantastic. The existence of two competing factions, each of which has a mole in the other, adds so many levels of intrigue and tactics. Unfortunately you weren't quite able to solve the problem it creates, but with this experience you may succeed next time.
Good night everybody! ~:wave:
Sasaki Kojiro
10-29-2006, 05:07
Yup, that's how the game was intended to be played. Too bad it didn't work out, maybe next time.
Damn... I missed it all.
We really shouldn't play this during the weekends.
Reenk Roink
10-29-2006, 06:10
:bow:
I feel like candy. :balloon:
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 09:56
Instead, however, he tried the illegal tactic of ratting out the mafia to the townspeople. Not a good move, doc_bean - I handed you a way to help the townspeople win, and instead of using it you handed the game to the mafia. :no:
No one said it wasn't allowed, even Sasaki admits I played by the rules.
I originally wanted to inform only a few people of my role, none masons and hope they'd believe me and help me. I however saw two problems with this, first off they'd have to beleive me, if they didn't adn I posted under my real alias they could even turn against me, second, they'd have to generate enough momentum to lynch the real mafia and avoid getting killed themselves (well, this wouldn't be a disaster, but it would have hurt my cause badly).
I figured PMing everyone as 'A_friend' would be my best bet. All the villagers had to do was bandwagon one of the mafia, while hopefully keeping quiet about the second one (not necessary since the mafia would probably be to confused as to what happened), the detectives could check out the second named mafioso the second night and prove me right, a little PMing from their part would have ensured they'd both be death and we'd only have Kommodus to deal with. A maximum of three lynches remained before he'd be death if everyone would stick to the plan (fat chance) giving Kommodus a rather small but existing chance of killing me in the mean time.
That was the best possible scenario I could imagine when I PMed everyone. However I didn't expect it to go down like this. There'd probalby be a lot of arguing about whether or not I was telling the truth and the villagers would probably stop following the plan pretty soon. Some one with too much time on his hands could have figured out my alias by my posting times (and my use of the underscore, a small mistake on my part).
Kommodus PMing me was both a blessing and a curse, on the one hand I had a good rrason to believe he really was the last mafioso, OTOH would the town believ eif I told them to lynch the one person they were sure was innoncent. We'll never see what kind of fall out that would have given, unfortunatly.
What really happened: Reenk posting my PMing and thus exposing me (Don and MRD are rather new to the game so they might not have figured out what had happened in time, but Kommodus now knew who the other mafia were, and could simply ask them for my name, if he explained what had happened) was worse than I any nightmare scenario I had imagined. (All is forgiven though Reenk ~:grouphug:)
I guess I made a mistake in not spelling everything out clear enough in my PM. I should have suggested a best course of action, I should have made clearer I was a mafia spy and I should have said they should PM each other and definatly not post it in the thread(I thought these were both obvious). But I didn't want to give my identity away for fear of the villagers turning against me, so I thought a short, to the point PM would have been the best option. I was wrong :shame:
For those who care: here is the PM I sent:
[mafia] I know you're innocent
And I know who's guilty !
Don Corleone and Major Robert Dump are mafia.
Kommodus, Proletariat and Dutch_Guy are the masons, however, one of them is a mafia spy.
The good news is the mafia doesn't know who it is. The bad news is that I don't know either.
I will not reveal my identity just yet, because if something goes wrong and I die, the town loses !
I will send this mail to all except the mafia and the masons.
Happy lynching !
I took me about half an hour to create an alternate account and PM everybody, however watching the chaos during the next half hour did make it worth it :laugh4: . Although I fear no one else enjoyed that as much as I did.
Sorry this game ended up being so short. I hope the villagers have better luck next time :medievalcheers:
Major Robert Dump
10-29-2006, 10:27
HAHAHA
I just sent Doc and Don emails before coming here. Anyway, in that email I made a pitch that if one of us were going to be lynched, that person will claim a good guy role and beg the doctor for protection when the hits fall that night. At the worst, he gains half a day to live and we kill one of our own who was gonna die anyway. At the best, we try to kill him, the doc saves him, and now the whole town thinks a mafia goon is innocent.
Would have been interesting turn of events, with or without the mole in the mafia.
Interesting also is that the reason i didn't kill anyone first turn is that I behind the curve as the other mafia were up and emailing while I was at work. When I got home, the decisions had been made and the kills posted. I really had no problem with them acting without me, obviously it worked for my advantage, but I was going to try to convince the boys not to hit such high profile targets. I just wanted to wait til the last minute to see who was and wasn't posting.
I also assumed (without all the spyroles takne into consideration) that since Kommodus appeared innocent, the Doc, Detective and Masons would already be in contact with him. In retrospect that would have really worked well for the mafia, but like I said, I didn't know about the mafia spy. I was also going to suggest waiting a couple of rounds and then doubling up on Kommodus with two hitmen so he would be unsavable by a doc.
Crazy turn of events, I should have assainated "A Friend" first round :laugh4: :laugh4:
Dutch_guy
10-29-2006, 10:59
Proletariat and Dutch_guy: Sorry about the whole deception thing. I really do prefer being one of the good guys, but this time it didn't work out that way. If we'd all been true Masons, we'd have nailed the mafia for sure: I think the strategy I picked really was sound, and we did successfully predict a mafia target on the first try!
I was going to ask if a mason could be a mafia member, I really was, but then again I dismissed that thought as stupid and unrealistic a moment later. I figured your predictions as to who would be killed were just too good, now I realise you were merely lucky, but it did raise suspicion though. Had we known there was a mole in our midst I think you'd be our first choice, mainly due to your correct predictions as to who's house we should check out. But we didn't.
But anyhow, to be fair, you had me completely fooled, and I'm probably speaking for Prole too. Too bad this game had to end so soon, would have made for a good one I suppose.
:balloon2:
Silver Rusher
10-29-2006, 13:22
ROFLMFAO.
Sasaki, maybe you should try sticking to simpler rules in the future.
Big King Sanctaphrax
10-29-2006, 14:11
What the hell happened? I log on, get some kind of bizarre Deep Throat-esque PM, check the thread and everything is done. Woah.
We really shouldn't play this during the weekends.
This is actually a very good idea.
Edit: Just read the thread. Reenk, you n00b! ~;)
Major Robert Dump
10-29-2006, 16:24
Actually, no offense to Reenk or to Doc Bean, but doc left the parameters of the game by making a new forum member who intervened, and that seemed to disrupt the spirit of the game.
I'm glad Reenk intervened as he did, because as it stood Don and I had no clue what was going on, and it never occured to me (maybe Don too) that someone in the mafia was a mole and got a different PM than the others. It still would have been interesting to be trying to work the cards against the grain, but seriously, I would have never have guessed we had a mole in the mafia since we seemed to be at a huge disadvantage already. In the future I suppose I will share PMs with my fellow teammates, it just never occured to me. In fact, if it looked like I was gonna be lynched I was going to suggest the mafia kill me. I knew the mafia had a mole in the masons, but we didnt know who he was and had no earthly idea the "doctor" was a dummy gig.
Oh well, considering the PM from "a friend" I'm glad it ended when it did. PMs like that are supposed to come from someone in the game who is identifyable, that way there is a risk involved for the person sticking his neck out and the people who recieve the PM can judge it accordingly basedon the person actions. Doing it anonymously and out of character seems to defeat the purpose of signing up in the first place
I say no more moles in the future :yes:
Major Robert Dump
10-29-2006, 18:19
nah its all cool, now that i look back at emails i even see that Doc suggested he not go invisible, which should have set off alarms for me, but i was too lame to think that we had a mole in the mafia, even though i knew we would have a mole in the masons. Prolly in the future, as long as everyone knows what the roles are, it would make for a long, grueling fun game. Had i even suspected a mole in the mafia I would not have been as cordial to my teammates, except for the fact that between the 3 of us we only got to have 2 kills, so we would obviously have to vote and coordinate somewhat
doc_bean
10-29-2006, 18:43
nah its all cool, now that i look back at emails i even see that Doc suggested he not go invisible, which should have set off alarms for me, but i was too lame to think that we had a mole in the mafia, even though i knew we would have a mole in the masons. Prolly in the future, as long as everyone knows what the roles are, it would make for a long, grueling fun game. Had i even suspected a mole in the mafia I would not have been as cordial to my teammates, except for the fact that between the 3 of us we only got to have 2 kills, so we would obviously have to vote and coordinate somewhat
Actually the invisible thing was just confusion from my part :oops:
The way these games usually work is that they are (relatively) symmetric, so if one side has a spy you can bet the other side has one too. Besides, there would have been 4 mafiosi otherwise which would have been an awful lot compared to the (pretty) small number of villagers.
I didn't think Kommodus would be immortal at night though, I feel that was a rule we should have been told about. If the game was played further I would have suggested that we should kill Kommodus again...
Reenk Roink
10-29-2006, 18:57
I guess I should explain myself as well.
It started off like any other mafia game, and my first posts had to do with the usual mafia/doctor/detective stuff, how to fake out the mafia, etc...
Once again, I ripped on the mafia, hoping they would get mad and kill me (as I had no special role) so that helpful people would have better chances to remain alive.
"A_friend's" PM changed everything (doc_bean has already posted the PM and most of you all should have got it, so I won't bother reposting it).
Frankly, I was surprised that nobody had made it public by the time I did. My post of "Anyone else get a weird PM from "A_friend"? :inquisitive:" was just to cut the 'hush-hush' that was so obvious. I knew he had made true on his claim, as my PM was a [FW] message (meaning he had sent it to multiple people) and he was private messaging 20 minutes after I received my message.
When Dutch_guy inquired into the PM, I became more inclined to listen to this "friend" but then this PM just showed me that we (villagers) had to kill everyone he named and him.
https://img283.imageshack.us/img283/7131/1nr7.jpg (https://imageshack.us)
The fact that he actually thought that because Dutch_guy remained ignorant of the PM "proved" his honesty struck me as quite stupid, even compensating for the fact that being a mafia lowers intelligence. For God's sake man, you told us that you were not going to send the PM's to the people you called Masons and Mafia! ~;p
It was sort of a dilemma for me. I couldn't ignore him, but I wasn't convinced and his proof was terrible logic. I decided it was best to kill both mafias and all three masons as well as "A_friend" himself.
I voted for Don first, but told the villagers not to kill MRD yet. I wanted to keep him alive, for if both of them were dead, this "friend" would get rid of his rivals.
I had planned for us to lynch Don, and have the detective investigate everyone named by "A_friend" for another opinion on their roles when the game abruptly ended.
Now it all makes sense, and actually, it was quite a fun game for its brevity. I know that a lot of people didn't even get to post, but at least for me, it was fun. :grin2:
We should thank doc_bean by the way, he made it so interesting. :beam:
Oh, and I'm happy with my action of making "A_friend" public. :yes:
https://img163.imageshack.us/img163/8956/hedonismbot800fb0.jpg (https://imageshack.us)
(one thing I didn't pay attention to is the underscore in A_friend"... makes sense now though...)
Crazed Rabbit
10-30-2006, 04:22
Well, it certainly was a good idea Sasaki, and would've played out well had doc been a little more cautious in telling the people the truth, and communicated to them the urgency of not repeating verbatim what he had said, or just played Kommodus as a sucker.
Reenk...you remind me of this guy (http://download.lardlad.com/sounds/season12/error17.mp3)...
CR
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