View Full Version : Truth or hype....
Sir Kuma of The Org
12-15-2001, 01:32
From CA'S official site "Medieval Total WarTM features epic real time battles with over 10,000 warriors in the fighting at one time. "
10,000 warriors on the battlefield at the same time? To good to be true or what?
[This message has been edited by Sir Kuma of The Org (edited 12-14-2001).]
I sure hope it's true. Bigger is BETTER!
MagyarKhans Cham
12-15-2001, 02:00
bigger is not better if there are not more units included...
yes indeed, the Cham speaks the truth.
Matt
Do you mean the 16 unit limit? I would like to see that expand too. But if it can't, larger potential unit size is still OK by me, at least to a point.
But the inflexibility of unit formation makes simply upping unit size a no-no. I don't mean offer us more than the "close", "loose", "wedge", necessarily, I'm just talking about how everyone has to be perfectly straight and perfectly spaced and perfect and perfect all the time except in melee. This causes problems with greater unit sizes, even IMO with 120-men, though I must admit I was convinced of 60-man unit superiority early on and didn't do extensive testing.
Matt
I don't doubt the fact that it can't be done.However,will my computer handle it,I doubt it. 120 man unit s will be somewhat harder to controll. 300 or 400 man units or even higher would probibly be easiar.
Assuming that each opponent would have 5000 men to control with 120 man sized individual units,that would mean 41.6 indivigual units would be at your command. If the units were 300 in size,that would give you 16.6 units that you control. I know the .6 is irrelavent,but I'm just being precise.
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TeuTonic
I think they need some generals that can be controlled seperately
Murmandamus
12-15-2001, 05:27
If you look at the screenshot that shows the army it's still 16 units. Most units have 50 or 60 men and one has 100 so maybe they will just allow more armies on the field. In STW multiplayer you can do 2v2 games which if you used 120 man units would give you 7680 men. You wouldn't have to increase the unit size much to get over 10000. I would think a 3v3 game would be a little crowded but I've never played online.
Maybe the game shown is set at 60 man unit size so if it were set at 120 those 100 man units would be 200. A 2v2 game with those units would be well over 10000.
Guys,
You're forgetting that we can already have battles with over 10,000 men.
16 units at 120 men per unit multiplied by 8 players........... 15,360 men!
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Obake
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Quote Originally posted by Obake:
Guys,
You're forgetting that we can already have battles with over 10,000 men.
16 units at 120 men per unit multiplied by 8 players........... 15,360 men!
[/QUOTE]
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Well maybe you rich spoiled kids with the latest expensive fancy computers can http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif but its doubtfull the average population can play such high tech games. Which makes me believe that this 10,000 part is mostly hype.
I think I'll try a custom game with 8 players,120 man units and see what the lag is like. When I'm finished I'll post and tell you how it played out,expect to hear back from me say....two weeks http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
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TeuTonic
Hype. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
BakaGaijin
12-15-2001, 07:54
Agreed, Khan. Handling 120-man units in Shogun is ridiculous. Maybe if there were a way to specify the number or rows without doing the click-and-drag thing, it wouldn't be so hard. I dunno, like an alt-# thing. Press alt-3 to put the selected unit into three rows. And then make click-and-drag tell the unit to go to that spot, then look in that direction. That was basically the only thing I liked about Ground Control. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Furthermore, it seems to me that there will be a much wider range of unit size in MTW. We've already seen those special engineer units with like 12 guys each. I wouldn't be surprised if there were many more units sized differently from whatever the "standard" unit size will be.
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Disappear into the Darkness!!
MagyarKhans Cham
12-15-2001, 09:11
i think the large maps will be default, thus allowing different deployment zones, at least more logical than the ones we have now.
it would be nice to have additional 16 units who come alive after u clicked on it, after u deselcted one on the field who come under control of the AI, thus allwoing decimated units to be replaced.
btw my Khan thinks he can handle 20 units in battle. or why not have 16 units apart from 4 specials ones like the general and his staff as a single small unit and 3 subgenrals for boosting moral on certain locations.
bigger = no more modem play= i won't be online, unless i get cable soon or some faster cheap servive.....
Murmandamus
12-15-2001, 19:20
It would be nice to have those shortcut keys for 60 man units BakaGaijin.
BakaGaijin
12-15-2001, 21:23
Indeed. Such a simple interface addition would make life so much better for those of us who don't like clicking. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
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Disappear into the Darkness!!
Kraellin
12-15-2001, 23:15
hmmm, since it's possible to have 8-player games online and each man can have up to 16 units, and 8 x 16 = 128; why not allow a 4-player game to have up to 32 units each and a 2-player game to have up to 64 units each?
K.
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I'm sorry, but i never apologize.
Sir Kuma of The Org
12-15-2001, 23:32
Originally posted by Murmandamus:
It would be nice to have those shortcut keys for 60 man units BakaGaijin.
____________________________________________
Yes Shortcut or Hot Keys would be appreciated!!!!!!!!!!!!!
theforce
12-16-2001, 00:19
A bigger number of troops in each unit wouldn't be as good as 60 men with more units. That would allow better battles and the battles would seem epic http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
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Don't use only honour, use theforce, too.
http://lod.nipogames.com/default.html
ShadesWolf
12-16-2001, 01:17
Just a thought how about different unit size in the same game
ie 60,100,120 etc
So you could have an elite unit of 60, and a less well trained unit on 120 to add spice to the game.
ShadesWolf
12-16-2001, 01:20
In my opinion 41 units would be hard to control and 300+ men in a unit would also be hard to control. I look forward to seeing how they will do the 10,000
ShadesWolf
12-16-2001, 01:24
And my final thought on this subject
What about Lag, it is bad enough at the moment, I hope they will sort this out,
In my book more men = game/network runs slow, more lag. We already know that large battles and rain (unless u have cable or ASDL) means u have a good chance to drop.
Now I only have a 56K connection, no cable in my area and no other broadband connection (currently) I hope they arent going to make this can unplayable for me online ?
BSM_Skkzarg
12-16-2001, 06:14
Note - you can use Alt-Click once you have a unit in the proper setting (4x15, 3x20, etc) and move them to a spot without having to drag them a new "box".
As for lag - this is why we have requested true TCP/IP connection - to help reduce lag, among other things.
Qapla!
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
I tried 8 players,120 man units in a custom battle. The lag time was so bad it was like watching an orgy in a old folks home. To run that many say 5000 of your own troops,you'll have too have the zoom out option to a greater degree to cover the whole battle field map. Then at that point graphic quality will be of little importants. Might as well have icons to represent a certain amount of troops.
All in all, I think this is no more than deceptive advertizing.
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TeuTonic
BakaGaijin
12-17-2001, 16:35
Skkz: Actually, that moves them without changing their facing. Even a simple click will keep them in their proper rows. BUT, that does no good for the times when you actually DO want to change the number of rows a unit has. This system in Shogun is flaky as all Hell. Half the time, you have to drag them across the whole map before you can put them into the setting you want. And God forbid you should try to reorder your men while they're in trees...
It could be tons easier, is what I'm saying.
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Disappear into the Darkness!!
Catiline
12-17-2001, 22:09
Don't skulk in trees then Baka http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
LOL i saw someone moaning about hiding in trees as cheating the other day.
I like the seperate commands idea a lot, but then i'd like a lot less direct control than I have now. If they were to beef up AI unit handling i'd like to see some form of command radius overwhich you hve direct control, anohter over which you have some, and finally none or very little unless you send a sub general with sat flanking forces. to compensate I'd also like to see an intrerim phase between deployment and bettle, where you give the broad outlines of your plan to units, whilst being able to see the enemy deployment.
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Oderint dum metuant
Sir Kuma of The Org
12-19-2001, 07:43
Truth??????
(from the official site) "The epic battles and castle sieges feature over 10000 warriors".....Maybe not on the map at the same time?
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