First Faction @ www.totalwar.com [Archive]

02-04-2002, 05:58

LOL I wonder what that little magnified island is...

Tera http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
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Dark Phoenix

02-04-2002, 09:06

Australia? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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"DP is correct" - Shiro

evilc

02-05-2002, 01:01

cuba?

Vanya

02-05-2002, 22:12

Its where Malt Liquor came from...

Hirosito

02-06-2002, 02:24

lol http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

02-07-2002, 00:23

And the maltesers. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)

Omegamann

02-07-2002, 19:58

Quote Originally posted by Dark Phoenix:
Well they have put up the first faction the Almohad. Here is the link (http://www.totalwar.com/community/medieval/fact/factmap.htm)

[/QUOTE]

The Byzantine Empire is up now, too

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-07-2002, 23:06

It seems to say,

"Be the Byzantine Empire, you can't loose!"

Fairly useful to know... Ah yeah Tera saw your tiny little island on the map finally, took me about 4 hours to spot it though http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"

02-08-2002, 02:15

Quote Originally posted by Toda Nebuchadnezzar:
It seems to say,

"Be the Byzantine Empire, you can't loose!"

Fairly useful to know... Ah yeah Tera saw your tiny little island on the map finally, took me about 4 hours to spot it though http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

[/QUOTE]

It's even magnified you blind b@stard! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
That's to outline it's fundamental importance http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

MUWHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!! http://terazawa.totalwar.org/evil.jpg

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Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)

[This message has been edited by Terazawa Tokugawa (edited 02-07-2002).]

Hirosito

02-08-2002, 02:15

well the guys to the south and east definftely have more space than the north europeans. maybe their provinces will be larger. Quote heavy taxes needed to sustain the Imperial[/QUOTE] will this really play a role? i hope it will

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

JAG

02-08-2002, 04:35

LOL tera u luney!

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crying is good in a boy . . . it shows they are sensitive

crying is not good in a man . . . it shows they are a wuss!!!!!

WarlordWarrior

Sir Kuma of The Org

02-08-2002, 07:31

Heads up Omegamann for calling this to our attention.

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Yes the camel sprites do look good, hope they sound good also...

02-09-2002, 02:29

Yes JAG, I know I'm right. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

------------------
Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-09-2002, 21:45

And I thought it was just a big Island in the middle of North Africa... Yes I know its magnified just to tell people that infact it is a real place, not just myth. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"

02-10-2002, 02:56

If it was a myth, I'm a god. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

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Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)

Dark Phoenix

02-10-2002, 09:17

I dont think that anyone from Cyprus or whatever country you are from Tera could be called a god. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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"DP is correct" - Shiro

02-10-2002, 20:22

You are becoming blind or what? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/mad.gif

I'm from it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

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Honour to Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.kenchi.cjb.net/).
I'm from Malta, but I'm not a Malteser. http://terazawa.totalwar.org/malta_md_clr.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)

theforce

02-10-2002, 20:22

I am from Cyprus and l am theforce :P

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Don't use only honour, use theforce, too.
http://lod.nipogames.com/default.html

Dark Phoenix

02-10-2002, 21:04

Got too from the same joke. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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"DP is correct" - Shiro

Grifman

02-11-2002, 06:24

Hmm, the Byzantines seem to hold much more than they did historically in 1095. Looks like they've given them the Caucasus and Armenia (both lost), Central Asia Minor (lost) and that strange patch of land running north from the mouth of the Danube (I don't think they ever historically controlled that). They also seems to control too much of the Balkans, though their strength there continually waxed and waned so that might be all right.

Grifman

Papewaio

02-11-2002, 10:15

If you have to take over the entire map to win then it doesn't really matter if the borders are a little out. Anyway the borders could be inclusive of cultural and allied provinces. So the influence of your kingdom will extend beyond just the lands you hold to those that are allied and to those with like ideals.

So what you are seeing are liked minded and like armed factions (grouping of Empires and kingdoms) not individual kingdoms.

Dark Phoenix

02-11-2002, 13:28

Well Shogun boarders were not totally historically correct from what people have said and I dont think MTW will be either.

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"DP is correct" - Shiro

Whitey

02-11-2002, 17:24

its not borders that particularly worry me - more of the turkish 'camel gun warriors' that worries me!

the wet gunny wedgie army on horseback?

please say it isn't true!!!

Vanya

02-12-2002, 22:49

Quote Originally posted by Whitey:
its not borders that particularly worry me - more of the turkish 'camel gun warriors' that worries me!

the wet gunny wedgie army on horseback?

please say it isn't true!!![/QUOTE]

ITS A BRAVE NEW WORLD! GAH!

theforce

02-13-2002, 02:31

The Byzantine empire at it's peak was a big as the Roman empire except Britian and some upper parts of Europe.
Anyway the goal is to kill the pope :P

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Don't use only honour, use theforce, too.
http://lod.nipogames.com/default.html

ShadesWolf

02-14-2002, 01:03

My guess the next faction will be Britain

any other offers ?

Leet Eriksson

02-14-2002, 02:36

camel gun warriors were just plain fiction imagined by the CA team so forget it the turks did'nt use camel gun warriors but it would fun to see some weired units(i think the gun warriors are the ultimate cavalry archers HAHAHAHAHAHAAH since camels+guns=Super Tanks forget the cavalry archers this units is gonna rule!)

Leet Eriksson

02-14-2002, 12:35

i think cataphracts will be like the knights equivelant in the eastern nations..

Grifman

02-15-2002, 07:10

Sorry, the Byzantine Empire was never as big as the original Roman Empire from which it was descended. At it's peak under Justinian in the mid 500's the Byzantines controlled the old Eastern Empire (Greece, Asia Minor, Syria, Palestine, and Egypt), and parts of the West (North Africa, southern Spain, and parts of Italy). They never controlled France, most of northern Spain, and Britain, or parts of Germany as the original Empire did.

And besides that's irrelevant. This game starts in 1095, when the Byzantines were limited to the Balkans and northern, western, and southern Asia Minor - as I stated previously.

Grifman

Bohemond

02-18-2002, 04:10

The Byzantines were a hopelessly decadent Nation that relied its military strength entirely on foreign mercenaries (namely Turks, Normans or Anglo-Saxons) Those eventually were the very force that betrayed and brought them down. They were surrounded by powerful enemies (Turkey, Venice) harassed by Norsemen and usually did nothing about it. Instead they were took pleasure in killing or mutilating their most gifted generals.

Leet Eriksson

02-18-2002, 19:30

the seljuks and turks should go under byzantine category(considering they were more byzantine than arabs)the seljuk-romans(or Salajikatul room)where th first poeple to fend of the crusades(the very first one that attacked constantinople rather than help it).

Grifman

02-18-2002, 23:22

Bohemond, what an apt reply given your name. Your perspective is one that long informed the West, largely based off the historian Gibbon's opinion of the Byzantines, but it is incorrect. In 1025, at the death of their greatest emperor, Basil II, the Byzantines controlled most of the Balkans, Greece, Asia Minor, Armenia, northern Mesoptamia, northern Syria, and southern Italy. The Emir of Aleppo was a vassal, supplying them with troops and money. Other than the Muslim empire, they were arguably the most powerful state in Europe.

Even after the disasterous defeat at Manzikert they were still a power. Under the leadership of three consecutive strong emperors, Alexius, John and Manual, they regained much of what had been lost to the Seljuks, and fyi, the Crusader states became their vassals, as they could not stand up to the Imperial army. (So much for western superiority http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif )

However, after the death of Manual, they had some bad emperors, and then the disasterous 4th Crusade came which broke the empire into various feuding pieces from which they never recovered. What a stupid crusade, attacking fellow Christians rather than the Muslims!

And no way should the Byzantines be combined with the Seljuk Turks or other Muslims. Those were their dire enemies - combining them would be like combining the English and French!

Grifman

Bohemond

02-20-2002, 04:14

I am a Norman
I was born to conquer
If you are not able to rule your country
I will take care of that for you

My ode to the splendid Lords of Constantinople.

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-20-2002, 04:29

How long till the third faction is known about? Would someone like to hazard an educated guess?

What were the dates when the first two were released?

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"
http://www.gifs.net/animate/aniyin.gif

Hirosito

02-20-2002, 21:48

i think they were on mondays so the next one is 2 days late. oh well.

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Vanya

02-20-2002, 22:00

Quote Originally posted by Bohemond:

The Byzantines were a hopelessly decadent Nation that relied its military strength entirely on foreign mercenaries (namely Turks, Normans or Anglo-Saxons) ... [/QUOTE]

The vaunted Varangian Guard was made up of Norsemen... Vikings. They were feared by the Turks because they fought so fiercely... so much so, they were referred to as 'white devils'.

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-21-2002, 03:33

i guess the problem arrises when the mercenaries realise they are the only army and then sack the city themselves. I dont think this really happened though. (cant remember ever hearing about it...)

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"
http://www.gifs.net/animate/aniyin.gif

Leet Eriksson

02-21-2002, 04:30

the turks finnaly drove of the byzantine but if you look at them they called there country the Turkish Empire of Rome(i swear i saw it somewhere)and since the byzantine where very turkish(persian arabic whatever you like)in culture(VERY VERY VERY LATE TIME NOT WHEN THEY WERE STILL GREEKS KEEP THAT IN MIND)then i can only say they fall in byzantine category(Remember the byzantine of the late 1100 and 1400 where not even close to greek)even if they there enemies who cares aslong as they took over whats the porblem?

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-21-2002, 05:23

Indeed they may be Turks but if the Seljuks are put in then they will only be considered Byzatines. But also then the Seljuks and Saracens will hardly have any land between them. Its all higgldy piggldy if u ask me and no true set of factions can be drawn. (Well not all 12 from what CA have told us!)

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"
http://www.gifs.net/animate/aniyin.gif

Grifman

02-21-2002, 10:13

Faisal, no offense intended but where are you getting that the Byzantines were "very Turkish"? Again, no offense intended, but that's a bunch of bull. The Byzantines were Greek Orthodox, not Muslim. They spoke Greek, not Turkish. They were among the most literate people in Europe, the early Turks were mostly illiterate horsemen from the steppes. They didn't dress alike, no matter what others have supposed. Their architecture was different, their military tactics were different.

If you say they were the same or similar, please provide me evidence, (as I have offered here).

Grifman

Leet Eriksson

02-21-2002, 14:28

just look how arabic the byzantine where goto the factions chronicle and look at that long bearded man in arabic uniform ain't that enough evidence?hey np you ain't offending me.

Grifman

02-22-2002, 09:16

Sorry, Faisal, I wouldn't take a picture drawn for a computer game as evidence for anything. With that kind of logic I can prove that dwarves, elves and demons exist. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Grifman

Leet Eriksson

02-22-2002, 14:31

go to greece then and take a look some poeple there grow biig mustaches and wear turkish dress and a tarboush http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif btw did'nt you know the turks called themselves(the time they captured constantinople)The Ottoman Sultanate of Rome(What do they mean with rome exactly?).Its very obvious they changed in culture at the end of 1100s the establshing of the sultanate of room(rum)made the byz look very arabic(persian turk whatever you like they are all Islamic anyway)cuase they were very close to each other and half of the seljuk army was from byzantine origin.anyway who cares aslong as they look arabic(persian turk whatever you like they are all Islamic)in the game.

Vanya

02-22-2002, 22:10

Quote Originally posted by faisal:
go to greece then and take a look some poeple there grow biig mustaches and wear turkish dress and a tarboush http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif btw did'nt you know the turks called themselves(the time they captured constantinople)The Ottoman Sultanate of Rome(What do they mean with rome exactly?).Its very obvious they changed in culture at the end of 1100s the establshing of the sultanate of room(rum)made the byz look very arabic(persian turk whatever you like they are all Islamic anyway)cuase they were very close to each other and half of the seljuk army was from byzantine origin.anyway who cares aslong as they look arabic(persian turk whatever you like they are all Islamic)in the game.[/QUOTE]

LOL That is because the Turks displaced the previous inhabitants when they conquered those lands.

Just as Spaniards and southern Italians tend to be a little darker because of Moorish influence from their adventures in those lands.

And Romans were of a different stock than modern Europeans, who mostly are the descendants of the German barbarians that swept over western Europe after the fall of Rome. (In a way, that indicates Germans DID conquer the world... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/eek.gif And the Irish DID save civilization by preserving ancient texts during the Dark Ages... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/eek.gif ).

So... To say the Byzantines were Turkish would be absurd. The people you see there now are descendants of the victorious Turks...

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-23-2002, 04:01

So we are saying that the Byzantines are not Turks.

Hmmm I wonder if Im right in thinking that the Russians were descended from the Greeks because they pretty much have the same language.

But thats because they both use the Greek Orthodox Church. Dont actually know what Im getting at here...any ideas guys?

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"
http://www.gifs.net/animate/aniyin.gif

Leet Eriksson

02-23-2002, 04:22

In islam conqeured cities tend to stay the same with improving them and making them pay a monthly jizya but since turks are different from arabs i don't know what they did specificaly to the native inhabitants.

Whitey

02-23-2002, 17:49

as for upheaval, it was the Turks who put the Muslims in Bosnia...

They did in fact keep a few of the Byzantine institutions that they found in Constantinople (Greek Orthadox Patriach), and didn't change too much...but Constantinople was ruined after its sack of the 4th Crusade - and in truth, never recovered...

Hirosito

02-23-2002, 19:22

Quote I wonder if Im right in thinking that the Russians were descended from the Greeks because[/QUOTE]

nope sorry russians are slavonic people not helenistic ones.

Quote But thats because they both use the Greek Orthodox Church.[/QUOTE]

in its origins yes but now the russian church is called russian orthodox. just like the bulgarian is bulgarian orthodox but in its origins it's greek orthodox.

Quote they pretty much have the same language.[/QUOTE]

The russian language is not really similar to the greek one. greek is a mixture between cyrillic and latin. russian is just cyrillic.

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Grifman

02-23-2002, 22:37

The Russians are NOT descended from the Greeks. They are Russian Orthodox because Byzantine missionaries came there to evangelize. They use a Greek like alphabet, known as the Cyrillic alphabet, because a Byzantine monk, St. Cyrill, developed an alphabet for the illiterate Russians.

Faisal, instead of speculating about the connections between the Greeks and Turks, why don't you just go read some history about the region. There's no need to make silly speculations when there is plenty of history that explains and corrects alot of your speculations based upon in game artwork, LOL! The Byzantines are NOT Turks, they were Greeks and they have no connections to the Turks. If you disagree show me from historical works, not idle speculations.

Now get on with it . . . http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Grifman

Ooops, I had meant to say that the Russians are not descended from the Greeks.

[This message has been edited by Grifman (edited 02-23-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Grifman (edited 03-01-2002).]

Toda Nebuchadnezzar

02-24-2002, 01:25

Hiro no offence mate but I think present day Russian is derived from Greek.

Example: My dad can speak Greek (Ancient) and also he can speak Russian. Yet never learned Russian and has never been there and has no Russian friends.He works it out from his understanding of Greek.

Modern Greek is not the same as Orthodox Greek right? So if this is true couldn't russian be derived from ancient/orthodox greek and not modern greek?

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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
"non nobis Domine non nobis sed Nomine tuo da gloriam"
http://www.gifs.net/animate/aniyin.gif

Leet Eriksson

02-24-2002, 05:40

what connections i did'nt say they were connected(you do relize turks come from mongolia but are not mongols)heck i ment the greek(byz) changed their culture to look like turk whats so bad about that?everyone changes why do you see everyone wearing jeans and a shirt?cuase they changed no nations these days stick to traditonal clothes so i can't see french wearing old renaisance tights and jackets or japanese with kimono or whatever heck the arabs even left their turbans.everyone changes and this is a fact.

Jaguara

03-02-2002, 03:15

Let's have the new faction already...

Bohemond

03-02-2002, 04:45

I speek a bit Russian and I can guarantee you that it's VERY much different to greek. There is, however, a connection, because the Greeks christianized the russians (and bulgarians), who therefore still use the same letters. Russian has an astounding number of lended terms from Greek (or through he same path, Latin), but the core language is slavic and very very different from any Romanic (or Germanic) language.

Interestingly, Romania, despite its geographic position in between other Eastern European Countries, has a very Romanic language (hence the name) and is an important decendant of Greek-Byzantinian Tradition. (Don'T want to raise another "I-want-this-faction.topic", however.

And, to give my 5 cents to the other debate, of course the Byzantinians were Greeks, the Greeks were no Turks, so therefore they should in no case be one faction!
If they looked similar to the Turks, wasn't it in reality mostly working the other way round (i.e. the Turks / Arabs were imitating the Byzantinians at the time because of their geographical closeness ??). At least the Byzantinians were the more advanced of the two, weren't they?

Vlad The Impaler

03-02-2002, 07:04

Romania , my beloved country , is an latin island in an slavonic sea.there an exception, Hungary
btw, i ll never pretend that Romania must be an faction in M:TW we were little as space; but Otomans never cross Danube as rulers http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

Cheetah

03-02-2002, 15:33

Still no third faction!!! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/mad.gif

Leet Eriksson

03-02-2002, 16:39

i agree with bohemond they are not turks and have no connections with them but they looked alike in terms of cultur.

Vlad The Impaler

03-02-2002, 17:14

yes faisal; byzantiniens& russians are very much alike ,same as chineses &japanese: they have similitudes&compatibilyties but the difference between them is big including the cultures

Hirosito

03-02-2002, 18:45

i tend to agree with bohemond although nearly all military terms in russian german.

as bohemond said some terms in russian will be anciet greek cos they were christianised from there but otherwise, no.
bohemond are you from the ex-GDR?

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Vlad The Impaler

03-02-2002, 18:59

i 4get the http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

Anssi Hakkinen

03-04-2002, 04:45

Am I the only one who can't access the Almohad anymore either?

Shiro

03-04-2002, 09:11

No you're not.

Vanya

03-04-2002, 22:00

GAH! Where is the next faction?!? Wasn't there supposed to be one announced every week?!? GAH! We should be on 5 or 6 by now!!! GAH!

Leet Eriksson

03-04-2002, 22:13

GAH!i agree with you GAH but there are some good news GAH you know that if the developers stay quite for some time that means they are working on the game GAH!

Dark Phoenix

03-04-2002, 23:13

Its every second week I am sure.

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"DP is correct" - Shiro

Hirosito

03-05-2002, 01:27

lol DP, yeah every time i access this thread the first thing i do is click on the link but i'm dissapointed every time and now i'll go check what's up with the almohad

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Hirosito

03-05-2002, 01:28

nope doesn't work

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

theforce

03-05-2002, 01:45

faisal. I live in Cyprus and l speak Greek. I am a an Amecian Cypriot who lived in the Greek part of Cyprus for a long time and studied history of Byzantium for a long time.
Grifman has a good knowledge of the Byzantine history. Anyway Byzantines were Greek. They spoked greek(a sort of newer version of ancient Greek which l also study at school). Byzantines had no relations with the Turks except that they were enemies. You can say the Byzantines were a mix of ancient Greek civilazation with Christian belief.
Also like the Roman empire the military strenght of Byzantine army didn't rely on numbers. They adopted a fighting stype of Romans and Greeks. So in order to make up for the low numbers of men they had they had mercenaries. The Turks depended on numbers.
Like the siege of The City was with like 130000 men(someone correct if me if wrong) and the defenders had only 7000).
Anyway my point is that the Byantines are not Turks. They had some loose connections with the West aka Pope but Pope betrayed them cause he wanted to rule the Orthodox church so he didn't helped them while they were under siege by da Turks.

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Don't use only honour, use theforce, too.

Leet Eriksson

03-05-2002, 18:10

**********************************************its probably those turks that are up to no good again.well to tell ya the truth the turks is now considered an athiest country and would shoot any muslim who wears a scarf or turban so they are not considered muslims anyway as for the byz they relied on numbers in the days of the arab expansion the arabs that were heavily outnumbered in that time as for the turks your probably right they outnumbered the byz but i dunno..

[This message has been edited by faisal (edited 03-05-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Sir Kuma of The Org (edited 03-05-2002).]

Grifman

03-06-2002, 10:08

theforce,

Thank you for your compliments. I've got a number of books on Byzantium and have always been fascinated by an empire that existed for 1,000 years after the Fall of Rome and was the medieval extension of the Roman Empire.

Faisal, fyi - again, the Arabs, after the initial conquest of the Byzantine possessions of Palestine, Syria and Egypt, easily outnumbered the Byzantines. There's no way the Byzantines with just Greece and Asia Minor, outnumbered the Arabs, with all of Arabia, Mesopotamia, Palestine, Syria, Egypt and North Africa. It's been estimated by scholars that the tax revenues of the Caliphate were 10 to 20 times that of Byzantium at its height.

Grifman

Leet Eriksson

03-06-2002, 16:41

well the arabs outnumbered the byz very late after there conquest stopped in spain though before that(in the old days of mohammed and the rashidi reign)they got easily outnumbered by the byz due to the size and population of the empire.

theforce

03-06-2002, 19:02

We see that every empire gets beated at the end. It doesn't matter how powerful it is. The size of areas the conquer makes their military incapable if facing threats and raids. Example for an army to mobilize from one part of the empire to face a threat it took quite a while.
I believe that the empire was doomed after the the church devided. That was the heaviest blow to the empire. Well l am sure about the Turks. They always have a numerical advantage. An example would be the siege of Famagusta in 1570. 250000 turkish troops were facing abn army around 7000.The siege lasted for a year. The defenders killed 80000 men and had to come to a deal with the Turkish attackers after the food and ammunition were all out.

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Don't use only honour, use theforce, too.

Hirosito

03-06-2002, 23:43

the almohad is back up and it has screenshots linked to the info. the camels do look good

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Leet Eriksson

03-07-2002, 14:04

kewl!that explais why the mohads section was inactive for some time i can't wait until they post britian.

Hirosito

03-08-2002, 01:10

how come you are a fan of britain faisal

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.

Leet Eriksson

03-08-2002, 04:55

Actually got some british freinds 'ere and somehow i liked there sense of humour and their vast knowledge of history so i started to love any game related to britian its just plain cool you know.. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

Britian Kicks Ass Big Time!!!

Hirosito

03-09-2002, 00:27

to be honest i can't decide which faction i'll play first. in shogun it was easy i didn't have a clue about any of them and the mori's warrior monks looked wicked so i took them. but in europe it's hard. i know i wont take the french,spanish or italians. i'm not likely to take one of the muslim countries. but that still leaves a lot of choice.

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Hirosito Mori

Gentile or Jew
O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.