View Full Version : Faction thread 4: Dwarves
check here .... https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1544083#post1544083
and you can see why I want to start outlining the units for this faction!
Congratualtions, now it's possible to make units of any height. Do the other characters aim lower to attack the dwarves?
Last night was a momentous evening for modding ( well...as far as I am concerned! )
I received in the mail a set of alpha tools from Knight Errant which when run, resulted in the application of a brand new set of bone start points straight into the standard animations. There swas a slight hitch, in that the location of ht eroot bone was not translated in proportion to the new position... but KnighErrant has found th emissing code, and I have a revised version to check. This, folks, means we now have the tools to take a CUSTOM SKELETON OF ANY PROPORTIONS and apply it to a STANDARD ANIMATION and move all the changes into it. NO NEED TO RE-WRITE ALL THE ANIMATIONS and it's just a matter of minutes work to make the whole thing work. The tools are not all that polished, but for an alpha release, they work well and efficiently.
This will give us Dwarves that work AND look like Dwarves, rather than hobbits. Also....the system will allow us to do Orcs with longer arms, broad shoulders and slightly shorter legs.
Downside...there is a limit to how many we can use, since it all adds up to systems overheads and an enlarged mod.
So..Dwarves will only get a limited number of skeletons to use. They will need 2h axemen, crossbowmen, mace ( will work for axes, hammers etc where a shield is used ) and I will also need to check how crew animations are done. Might need a Dwarf crew set too.
Orcs will get archers and swords or mace variants. Plus crew if needed.
Everything else will have to be done by scaling
Dogman55
05-23-2007, 20:38
Heh. Not sure if I understand what's been found, but either way, if it helps the mod, great!
In short ( excuse the pun ) we can make correctly proportioned Dwarves.
RTW modding was always limited by the skeletons. We could scale them up or down, but that was all we could do. Dwarves were done ... but they were scaled down people, which meant ALL the poportions were reduced. They looked like children... while fantasy Dwarves should be as broad sholdered as a human, and just shorter of leg. We couldn't do what we needed to make them correct.
Also....orces need slightly longer arms than a human, broad shoulders, and slightly shorter legs. Again....just using a normal human skeleton did not look good....I know...I tried!
But now, thanks to the work Grumpy Old Man and KnightErrant have put in to fully understand the MESH format and the animations that power them, and thanks to Caliban arranging to get a full set of stock animations released in an uncompressed and accessable form, we have the power to change the skeleton ANY WAY WE WANT. Better still....we can then force the stock animation routines to work on the new skeletons without having to re-write every single one of them! A stock skeleton uses about 50 or 60 animations. Each one would have to have been edited by hand. That would take weeks. With the alpha toolset KE sent me, I did the job in 5 minutes.
So...in summary .... I know have the tools and knowledge to stretch, tweak, scale and then animate any shape we want as long as it's broadly human, and not have to re-do ANY animations. Having done a lot of animation work for RTW mods...I know just how much work this has saved me, and how major a step this is towards making a really high quality fantasy mod. Dwarves have nver ben done properly in a TW game.... they were just tiny children made by scaling down .... no longer.
I'm happy about this...really happy!
This is only useful for re-positioned skeletons, not ones with different bones right?
Dogman55
05-24-2007, 01:55
Ah! That's more understadable! That sounds awesome! You did mention that you need to limit skeletons though, what exactly do you mean by that?
Casuir ...at the moment, we are just limited to moving bones about. This is fine for what we want to do for now. GOM is trying to build a scratch skeleton and implement animations for it. If that works..then the sky is the limit !
In short ( excuse the pun ) we can make correctly proportioned Dwarves.
RTW modding was always limited by the skeletons. We could scale them up or down, but that was all we could do. Dwarves were done ... but they were scaled down people, which meant ALL the poportions were reduced. They looked like children... while fantasy Dwarves should be as broad sholdered as a human, and just shorter of leg. We couldn't do what we needed to make them correct.
Also....orces need slightly longer arms than a human, broad shoulders, and slightly shorter legs. Again....just using a normal human skeleton did not look good....I know...I tried!
Well I think the ones you showed here in the RTW modding forums did look good, but this new ability is simply fantastic! More so, it assures me that there will be orcs, that they won´t get scrapped because of the difficult of making them. Great news indeed :2thumbsup:
On the crew animations bwian they were one of the few that showed changes made to the skeletons with a hex editor when we tried it. I'm pretty sure the changes were visible right through the siege engines animations and only reverted when idle. Piccy:
http://www.imagehosting.com/out.php/i560885_crew.png
http://www.imagehosting.com/out.php/i560892_crew2.png
Might be worth testing further, could cut down a bit more on anim overheads.
Look to be wardog anims in there as well, could be used for a few things
Right ... hte outline Unit List bit!
Warriors - goes without saying!
Miners
Troll Slayers
Hammerers
Crossbowmen
Thunderers
Long Beards
Dwarf crew will also be required. They will be made as simplified variations on the warriors with no shields and simple axes.
alexader
05-24-2007, 17:40
Bwian you rock once more,i think you will be writen in history.good work again and don't forget keep walking............:egypt:
You're a few:
Ironbreakers
Rangers
Cannon
Organ Gun
Flame cannon
Bolt thrower
Grudge thrower
Couple of other units in the Storm of Chaos book:
Brotherhood of Grimnir
Goblin Hewer
Should be restricted to Kazak Kadrin if included
DrZoidberg
05-26-2007, 09:07
You're a few:
Ironbreakers
Rangers
Cannon
Organ Gun
Flame cannon
Bolt thrower
Grudge thrower
Couple of other units in the Storm of Chaos book:
Brotherhood of Grimnir
Goblin Hewer
Should be restricted to Kazak Kadrin if included
I'm doing the army texts now. Are these to be included in the army list or are only Bwians?
Thats the point of these threads .... to discuss what units we need, what units are of benefit, and what units will best flesh out a faction.
Obviousely, we can't have every single possible unit for every faction...that would just be taking serious liberties with the number of units we can have in game. If we have 20 Dwraf units, then we couldn't make do with 5 chaos units ... we would need a similar number and complexity of variations if the factions were to be equally playable and fun.
If I was assaulting a Dwarf Army, what I would like to be up against:
Warriors – A necessary basic Unit
Slayers-Unique unit that many dwarf players will look forward to using
Thunderers- Dwarfs with guns are a must
Ironbreakers- Hard core defensive unit, the spine of any Dwarf army.
Others by priority:
Crossbowmen- Dwarfs will be stunted speed wise, and will need as much long range firepower as possible.
Hammerers- Good offensive Unit
Longbeards: I’m not sure what purpose they serve, are they highly experienced?
Rangers/miners are nice extras, but I don’t see them as being pivotal to a Dwarf army.
Dwarfs also deserve at least three to four war machines minimum:
Cannon
Organ Gun
Bolt thrower
Maybe the Grudge Thrower, if the flame cannon is too much effort to implement.
DrZoidberg
05-26-2007, 10:39
Thats the point of these threads .... to discuss what units we need, what units are of benefit, and what units will best flesh out a faction.
Obviousely, we can't have every single possible unit for every faction...that would just be taking serious liberties with the number of units we can have in game. If we have 20 Dwraf units, then we couldn't make do with 5 chaos units ... we would need a similar number and complexity of variations if the factions were to be equally playable and fun.
Ok, the magic, (completly arbitrary) number in the past hs been 10 so it's a good number to aim for. We can always add units later if we need them.
A hillarious feature I think we should include is the "old grumbling" Long beard rule. Dwarfs are so incredibly afraid of losing face in front of their elders that they get a moral boost whenever these old coots are around. Because if they'd show any fear these old men will after the battle make them eat it a million times over.
infantry
First the ones we can't live without
Dwarf Warriors
Dwarf Miners
Slayers, (troll/dragon/daemon)
Long Beards, (veteran warriors)
These three can IMHO be dropped. Ironbreakers make the most sense to keep. Hammerers would be impressive to have as a unit though.
Hammerers, (these are the kings bodyguard unit, we can lose them)
Ironbreakers, (this is just elite warriors)
Rangers, (these are special over-ground dwarves. I think we could and should lose them.)
ranged
Quarrellers, (Crossbowmen)
Thunderers, (hand gunners)
artillery
Cannon, (cannon)
Organ Gun, (ribault)
Flame cannon, (can we do these?)
Bolt thrower, (ballista)
Grudge thrower, (catapult)
DrZoidberg
05-26-2007, 10:44
I just thought I'd point out that I mean that we should have one unit for all different Slayers. They all look the same, it's their favorite victim that differs.
I would put Ironbreakers ahead of Miners, mainly out of personal preference for their cool armour. They would look MEAN on the battlefield with glittering metal armour and faceplates. Miners still make a lot of sense for a dwarf side, especialy as there will be probably be actual mine facilities they can be recruited from. The problem is that their special mining ability can't be translated into the game, while the Ironbreakers toughness fits perfectly, and they are an elite unit players can build towards.
Longbeards sound like they would offer high morale, and at the least would only need a facial texture change. Hammerers and Rangers do seem like the obvious ones to cut.
DrZoidberg
05-26-2007, 17:41
Longbeards sound like they would offer high morale, and at the least would only need a facial texture change.
You're forgetting the beard. They need to have their whole body covered by the beard. That's not just the face
Krazysigmarite
05-26-2007, 18:53
Out of curiosity, what is the total allowed ## of units in the game? I've read somewhere that it's 500, and that means that even if we used up all 31 faction slots, it'd still allow for 16 unique units per faction.
The game starts with 703 units and more can be added, so we don't need to worry about unit numbers yet.
Thats models, it includes mounts, upgrades and generals. The 500 limit reffers to the edu, but theres no way we can realisticly expect to make that many units. Better to do as bwian says and concentrate on a core selection for each faction, which can be expanded on later.
hmm... i just wonder what would you do to dwarves because they don't have ANY cavarly? Do you drop stables from tech tree or do you make an special infantry building where would be slayers or something?
There will be no cavalry units buildable by Dwarves, so there is little point in building one. The actual buildings can be limited by faction, so it is also fairly simple to comment out the stable tree for Dwarves.
If, however, they took over a settlement with a stable built in it, they would simply have a building that was of no benefit to them. Should be fairly straightforward.
And because of the lack of cavarly dwarfs should have more infantry than the other races. Just for balance. In my opinion dwarf military tech tree could go like this.
Tier 1:
Miners
Tier 2:
Miners
Warriors
Tier 3:
Miners
Warriors with +1exp
longbeards (Like warriors but good morale and +1-2 to defence skill, maybe a little better attack)
Tier 4:
Miners
Warrior with +1exp
Longbeards with +1exp
Ironbreakers
etc.
Hammerers could be the generals bodyguard because they actually is it.
Slayers? I don't get a place for them. Could they be in tech tree after or before warriors or should they have their own tech tree? That would replace the cavarly tech tree.
So what do you think?
And for Hammerers and Ironbreackers dwarf unit you could give "armour piercing" skill. Good Stamina and Good Morale would fit well too.
By the way could you make pistoliers for empire? Because they are so cool and tactical unit so would like to see it in the mod. :2thumbsup:
For slayers you could lock morale so they won't rout and they could charge without orders?
War machines could go almost same way as in real M2TW. I mean order would be Bolt thrower, Grudge thrower, Cannon and organ gun. I don't know about flame cannon...
Krazysigmarite
06-26-2007, 20:33
I'm currently working on a Pistolier unit :)
They will use the HRE's Reiters animations. But that's a bit off topic. We need an Empire thread :whip:
Just remember that as far as the units go, nothing has to be based off of any medieval tech tree. We are building things from the ground up, and with the flexibility of the engine, many things are possible. If the 'Charge Without Orders' trait is still in the game, that's perfect. It's easy to make a unit never break.
Unit can be made to be impetuous, which means they may charge without orders.
hmm... i just wonder what would you do to dwarves because they don't have ANY cavarly? Do you drop stables from tech tree or do you make an special infantry building where would be slayers or something?
For the slayers' building that would have to be a shrine of Grimnir eh (potentialy giving more experience to slayers units while improving: Shrine > Temple > Large Temple > Awesome Temple > Pantheon like in RTW)? Slayers created in Karak Kadrin could get additionnal xp or some other bonus (regional based special unit/bonus like in MTW).
How about special traits, ancillaries, titles for dwarf chars triggered by losses (city, battle...) to turn them into slayers, by the meaning of specific retinue, being unbreakable.... I know it's still far away, just throwing ideas...
I have plan some more dwarven tech system.
From cities you could get Miners, Slayers (Troll/Giant), Rangers and warmachines. I think that Miners and Slayers should be get from cities because that is the place where civilians really live and Miners and Slayers are civilians right? Or then Rangers will go to castle tech system and there could be Clansmen.
From castles you could get real army. Warriors, Quarrelers, Thunderers, Longbeards, Ironbreackers, warmachines etc.
Should Hammerers be general's bodyguard or independent unit or both?
If racial bonuses are doable then Dwarfs should get bonus to mining profit and maybe cheaper armour.
Is there going to be more faction threads. Empire and Bretonnia have units so they could have their own threads. Especially The Mighty Sigmarite Empire. :2thumbsup:
That's all... For this time.
Bonuses for mining are tricky because the abilites of buildings are set for all factions. While it is possible for dwarves to build a different set of mines that will provide more bonuses if this factions is conqured then another faction could build a regular mine in addtion to the dwarven one. It way be better if dwarves could build more mine related buildings or upgrade to a higher level of mines than other factions.
I believe that the EDU can be modified to change a unit's upgrade cost, so it is possible that dwarves can get cheaper upgrades.
Building effects can be set by faction.
overkill1991
06-29-2007, 18:26
I have plan some more dwarven tech system.
From cities you could get Miners, Slayers (Troll/Giant), Rangers and warmachines. I think that Miners and Slayers should be get from cities because that is the place where civilians really live and Miners and Slayers are civilians right? Or then Rangers will go to castle tech system and there could be Clansmen.
From castles you could get real army. Warriors, Quarrelers, Thunderers, Longbeards, Ironbreackers, warmachines etc.
Should Hammerers be general's bodyguard or independent unit or both?
If racial bonuses are doable then Dwarfs should get bonus to mining profit and maybe cheaper armour.
Is there going to be more faction threads. Empire and Bretonnia have units so they could have their own threads. Especially The Mighty Sigmarite Empire. :2thumbsup:
That's all... For this time.
Slayers aren't just civilians. every dwarf can become a slayer.
a slayer is basicly a dwarf that has done something bad etc.. and wants to redeem his sins by finding the strongest enemy possibly and die a honorable death in battle
DrZoidberg
06-30-2007, 10:13
Slayers aren't just civilians. every dwarf can become a slayer.
a slayer is basicly a dwarf that has done something bad etc.. and wants to redeem his sins by finding the strongest enemy possibly and die a honorable death in battle
Slayers in armies are Slayers who've gone out on their troll-/dragon-/whatever-slaying quest. Killed the beast but survived. Since they survived and the only way the can die honorable is in battle they give their services to a Dwarf lord/thane.
Since regular army is raised in castles, and militias are raised in cities, it makes most sense that Slayers returning from quests would gravitate toward castles only. They're basically the elite of elite. Just not so well armoured.
As far as I know most slayers are no elite troops. The stats of troll slayers are the same (apart from Ld) as simple warriors (at least in my old dwarf army book), they take advantage of being some sort of berserker to have easier fights against monsters and heroes as well as being unbreakable. They are doom seekers, as soon as they see an opportunity for a heroic death, they run towards it no matter what, may it be battle (if by any chance there is one around) or beasts (which I agree is the most common starting point).
In Grudge Bearer they describe slayers running in front of their armies towards a huge chaos dwarf army even if it's a waste of good dwarfs...they should be almost impossible to control (charge without orders and the such).
In Gotrek and Felix (dun remember which opus...think it's dragon slayer) they speak of the temple of Grimnir in Karak Kadrin being the center of the slayer community and the place where they solemnly take their oaths...therefore imho slayers should be “trained” wherever there is a temple of Grimnir be it town or castle.
Another suggestion is that slayer units surviving battles (shame on them) pick up negative points: create unrest in settlements, disband...a massive bonus would be to have them refusing to fight when the odds of the battle are in favour of their army :laugh4:
Another suggestion for temples and deities:
temple of Grungni
improved armors and/or weapons
temple of Grimnir
give xp to units or allows training of slayers (simple temple gives troll slayers, more advanced giant slayers,...)
temple of Valaya
bonus against unrest or faster population increase
Building effects can be set by faction.
Can you please explain how this can be achieved without creating a whole new building just for the dwarves?
alexader
06-30-2007, 16:03
Please tell me then what will be the goods if the slayers die in battle.what they will rise from their graves?ok i am just kidding,but the opposite may be intersted:egypt:
Can you please explain how this can be achieved without creating a whole new building just for the dwarves?
put "requires factions { whatever, }" after the effect.
So for the mines it would be
mine_resource 7
mine_resource 9 requires factions {dwarves, }
Would this give the dwarves' a mine resource of 9 or 16?
Jubal_Barca
07-11-2007, 16:46
How about gyrocopter? That would be awesome...
@uaime the second one, you put requires factions {Elves, orcs and everyone else, } after the first bonus so the dwarfs wont get it.
A Norseman
08-20-2007, 00:28
Amazing work with the dwarfs so far, they look bether than many other gameplay dwarfs proffesionaly made by paid artists! But i am a little concerned about their balance in gameplay.
Remember that the dwarfs who are lacking the speed and mobility of other races and rely more on armor and guns, is a defencive race. They are most happy when they can fortify themselves on a hilltop and gun down the enemy from afar.
I know many TW players hate the ideas of "defencive" and "Offensive" armies, so i was kinda hoping you culd make it so that the dwarfs are less aggressive in battles, but not overly defencive.
The dwarfs have no cavalry whatsoever. But have the strongest armor in the old world. you have to find a way to balance this, as dwarfs wuld get easely Outmanovered by their quicker enemies, beeing surounded will be evryday bouissness for the average dwarf warrior, make him an effective fighter to counter this...
I have full faith in this mod, I assume you will sort it out..
The issue with Dwarves will be covered in balancing. They will have strong morale, and good defensive ability. To offset this, they will also be relatively expensive to maintain.
Their build times for armies will be long, and they will be hard to build up to huge scales for a major offensive. This is only natural for them. While they build and prepare, they will be hard to overrun or destroy.
Their lack of mobility will be an essential tactic to fight against them, and should be the over-riding consideration when playing them.
As far as basic stats go, they are not impetuous or ill-disciplined, and when facing them, they will be hard to break. We will try and replicate the basic dwarf attitude as far as teh game AI will allow.
OK....built so far for this faction:
1) Crew ( light armour and an axe when needed )
2) Miners
3) Warrior ( chainmail and an assortment of axes with shields )
4) Heavy Warrior ( breastplate or heavy scale armour, 2 handed weapon )
5) Longbeards. Warriors with...er....longer beards and fancy helmets!
6) Iron Breakers. Stacks of armour!
7) Quarellers
8) Thunderers
9) TrollSlayers
Only thing left to make are the artillery units now.
Unless, of course, someone can come up with something vital that I have overlooked! Hammerers were considered... but they are really only heavy infantry...which I have already made. Should I just modify the heavy infantry to make them hammerers? Would only need to delete the axes in the MS3D model!
aren't Hammerers the dwarfen body guard unit as they dont have cavalry?
overkill1991
09-25-2007, 14:40
OK....built so far for this faction:
1) Crew ( light armour and an axe when needed )
2) Miners
3) Warrior ( chainmail and an assortment of axes with shields )
4) Heavy Warrior ( breastplate or heavy scale armour, 2 handed weapon )
5) Longbeards. Warriors with...er....longer beards and fancy helmets!
6) Iron Breakers. Stacks of armour!
7) Quarellers
8) Thunderers
9) TrollSlayers
Only thing left to make are the artillery units now.
Unless, of course, someone can come up with something vital that I have overlooked! Hammerers were considered... but they are really only heavy infantry...which I have already made. Should I just modify the heavy infantry to make them hammerers? Would only need to delete the axes in the MS3D model!
I think you should.
A hammerer is much cooler than a ''heavy warrior'', and as you said, a hammerer is basicly the same, they only use big 2h hammers to smash people with :)
Taranaich
09-25-2007, 18:04
I agree, although I like two-handed axes as much as the next bearded warrior I think it's more appropriate to have Hammerers. They would serve pretty much the same function as Heavy Warriors, but already have a little history in the GW universe. Plus smashing foes with big fecking hammers is quintessentially dwarfish if you ask me.:smash:
You could always salvage the Heavy Warrior as an officer for the warriors.
lanky316
09-25-2007, 19:17
aren't Hammerers the dwarfen body guard unit as they dont have cavalry?
This is how I would consider doing them, but of course, you're the guys in charge!
OK...Hammerers they will become :beam:
I will add a couple of extra hammer variations to replace the axes, and that will make them nice for Hammerers. I will also add a standard bearer variant of the basic design so I can make officer units for the others.
Nice Bwian! So... where are the pictures? :yes: :beam:
Jubal_Barca
09-26-2007, 19:52
The 'heavy warrior' should still be included, as the dwarf warriors get a 2h axe equipment option in the army book.
Basically 2h axes are preferred by some clans fr thier warriors, hammererers are bodyguards only.
I'll do a variant on the basic warrior with 2H weapons. Won't take mych effort to do... I'll use the longer scale/chain option I have done for the Hammerers, and add back the 2h axes. Throw in some helmet variants and some extra arm-armour and gauntlets, and we are done.
Just need to finish off some skins, and then I can screenshot it.
Just now, I am trying to make sense of the extra files that make up the Artillery pieces. That...and why there are 2 very different models for a Dwarf Cannon. One 'traditional' Napoleonic type pattern...and one that looks like it came off a warship.
A Norseman
09-29-2007, 17:34
What kind have you planned for bodyguards? surly you will not use "generals bodyguards"
im sure that they will use the units that specify themselves as generals body guards empire greatswords / knights dwarfs hammerers chaos chosen warriors / knights
Dwarves will have a dwarf unit for Bodyguard purposes. I am going to do a 'Heavy Infantry' unit which will serve as a bodyguard type unit.
For our mod, each faction will have to have it's own unique bodyguard units. Chaos will have Chaos Knights...Tomb Kings will have Tomb-Guards.... and so on. No way would we use stock 'bodyguard' units!
I also need to do some General models for each faction. That will be a challenge!
I hope to see some lords ridding dragons and such :laugh4:
OK...that's the Dwarves just about done!
Just finished making all the low detail lods for the Dwarf faction, and put placeholder stock siege weapons in forthe full set of dwarf siege artillery.
we have:
Crewmen
Miners
Warriors
Heavy Warriors
Hammerers
Iron Breakers
Slayers
Longbeards
Quarrellers
Thunderers
plus a musician and standard bearer
artillery is
Bolt Thrower
Grudge Thrower
Flame Cannon
Organ Gun
Cannon
Phew.
Just need to touch up a few textures ( grey up the longbeards beards, add some colour to the shield textures... that sort of thing ) and then we are done. First faction to be finished!
sounds good.
you should make a thread with a list of all the races units that are complete then evryone can see at a glance whats been done :beam:
That is definitely going to happen as soon as I get the time. I want to get a good set of screenshots up, and have a proper 'Faction' thread for each as a showcase. The thread itself will be locked...since these threads form the discussion threads, and the finsihed faction threads will only get clogged up with comments and chat, which is self defeating really.
I can also mirror those posts over at TWC, to keep the profile up. I also considered setting up a website to showcase the finished factions. Don't know if that would work better, or just take up more of my time that I could be devoting to other stuff!
ask somone else to make the website :beam:
I can make websites, so I could set up a website. Forums are more difficult though (it may be better to use this forum or TWC's).
DrZoidberg
10-21-2007, 21:05
Development is amazingly fast Bwian. I can't but applaud. :applause:
yup...and 2 more units added this weekend. would have been more, but for the M2TW engine refusing all attempts at me using proper alpha textures and deciding on an 'on/off' approach to this....which made making host units that look good impossible :furious3:
Also, work on chariots continues, and I have also been working on making the tomb swarms work better so I can re-use the skeleton I am building for rat swarms and bat swarms too.
Final ongoing project is to make the Bone Giant affect troops around it like an elephant. Did something similar for RTW, by replacing a set of elephant anims with a carefully selected set of human ones. Will try and do the same again.
Meanwhile....I am open to suggestions as to how I can do a Spirit Host. Nearly time for another progress summary thread I think...especially since the forum is heading for it's 2000th post!
Eufarius
10-22-2007, 00:33
Yeah son! congrats!!
keep it up on the chariots.
DrZoidberg
10-22-2007, 16:12
Meanwhile....I am open to suggestions as to how I can do a Spirit Host. Nearly time for another progress summary thread I think...especially since the forum is heading for it's 2000th post!
How about taking a knight, (or any other unit) and making them paler and transparent/translucent? Or are all skins, all or nothing?
i think the problem he is having is that it can either be transparent or solid not a % like slightly seethrough
A Norseman
10-28-2007, 11:34
So.. wich unit do you intend to be the generals bodyguard?
Jubal_Barca
10-28-2007, 12:04
Hammerers I believe, since this is their actual function.
Taranaich
10-28-2007, 19:34
I tried making a semi-translucent unit, but I didn't have much luck either. The closest I got was using a sort of "tile" pattern in the alpha channel. Parts like the head and torso were covered in large white blocks and small black ones, and the reverse for limbs. It looks pretty lame, and doesn't seem to work in any range further than close up, but it was something.
Right, so I've been lurking for a little while now, watching this brilliant mod. I'm generally awe-struck by how awesome a lot of your stuff looks (Tomb Kings, Greenskins, Empire). However, I do have a few commentaries on the look of your Dwarfs. (By the way, you've spelled it wrong :P )
Now, before I tell you this, I just want you to know that I hate telling people to correct something that I can't do better myself. Also, the screens on which I base some of this are likely out-dated.
The weapons seem to be too large, pretty much all of them. Especially in relation to the handles, looks like you're putting anvils on twigs. (This has probably already been brought to your attention). The main concern was with the Longbeards (I think?) and the Ironbreakers I saw. I caught a glimpse of some mining picks that looked weird though, the actual pick looked too long, too thin and too round.
The beards could use a little better texturing, but no big concern. Compared to vanilla MTW, they're very much the same.
Perhaps a few little extra 'thingies' on the models could be nice, like tankards, pouches, w/e.
Oh, and a final idea regarding Dwarfs: If it is possible without looking dumb, could you strap shields on their backs? First of all, it looks nice. Secondly, it is a part of the Hammerer look.
With that said, if you are interested in the services of a newbie modeller (still have a -lot- t learn), I would be pleased to help you with the simple stuff, ie. inanimate stuff, weapons and the like, simple changes in models, so you talented guys can work on the harder things.
Steel*Faith
02-01-2008, 11:20
I agree Severe. A good reference for Dwarfs is the concept art for Warhammer online by Mythic.
Caradrayan
04-12-2008, 16:09
I hope it's not too late for suggestions.
I strongly suggest the hammerers should be the bodyguard unit, not a unit on their own. In the fluff that is exactly what they are, and they gain moral bonuses when the Dwarf lord is with the unit.
Perhaps that's what you meant Bwain with the list you posted, if so, 2 handed axes could be the weapon employed by "heavy infantry" The list has the option for basic warriors to use one-handed weapon (axe, or maybe mace) and sheild, or 2 handed weapons (read: 2 handed axes)
I will second the suggestion that longbeards should improve morale, to reflect their "old grumblers" ability. And I'll agree that rangers should be cut. If you decide to cut anything from that list it should be miners. They will be redundant on the battlefield with whatever unit uses 2handed weapons.
I also had a suggestion for the dwarven economy and settlement setup. If you keep the city/castle distinction, dwarves should have all castles. This would reflect several things: 1st, Dwarves would have great siege defense. Their settlements should be rock hard. 2nd, they would have slow population growth. 3rd, they would have a weak economy, compared to factions with cities, so the dwarven player would be strapped for cash. This would bring home to the player the dwarven obsession with gold.
If the dwarves capture a city, they could get alot of money, and support much larger armies, but their city tech tree should be stunted, so the cities aren't self supporting.
The teutonic order in kingdoms has that. Can only get minor cities or lower and their castles were pretty awesome. But not so sure on having really low economy. The dwarfs are one of the richest civs in warhammer with the massive demand for dwarf made goods and all the mines. However they have a great reluctance to spend it on anything other than the nessecites. Maybe you could put in a market or trade route in castles but im not sure if that is possible. Possibly increasing the amount of gems/gold/iron/coal and the kings purse.
About the "Dwarves should get mining bonuses" simply make it that whenever a dwarf character is created, he simply gets a Mining Bonus trait. Simple really... :grin2:
Goncalou
03-10-2009, 23:49
Raz excellent idea, but you also need to make all dwarves have a trait that something like 'Enjoys a Drink, +1 popularity' you know kinda like the one in M2TW
prayeks09
11-25-2009, 02:58
Or, the "when will I be online in WAR" thread.
Running around on your own in The Old World can be a bit dull, so lets meet up
Ill start:
This evening Ill prepare Eava for ZulAman. After that Id like some beta testing and do a public quest or some-such. Whos up for that?
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