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frogbeastegg
09-03-2007, 15:02
This topic is for the Chichimeca faction in Kingdoms expansion's Americas campaign. This faction needs to be unlocked before you can play it.

Rumpole
09-04-2007, 01:49
I tried this on Hard/Hard, but I think it may be impossible.

Your enemies have infinite money, especially the Tarascans, who get 12000 florins per turn.

You, on the other hand, are at negative 4000 florins per turn at the start. Your only hope is to build mines.


I set out to wipe out the Apaches and just barely succeeded by sending two large armies to take out Apache Camp and then the other Apache settlements. In the process I went broke and survived only by eliminating almost all my troops.

This worked until the Tarascans, whom I had been bribing regularly, sent full stacks after my two largest cities. Since they had several stacks to back these up, I just conceded.

Rumpole
09-04-2007, 13:47
Here is a set of starting moves that may work.

The strategic picture:

1. The Apaches have to be wiped out ASAP. Once they get a few villages, they will raid you. Fortunately they start with just one settlement.

2. The Tarascans have to be contained. If they grow big their extra 12K per turn will let them be too powerful.

3. Your economy is shaky at first, but their is great potential in gold and silver mining.

4. In the north are about 15 rebel settlements, yours for the taking once the Apaches are gone. The main threat will be the French coming west from Florida, but in beating the French you can get guns and horses.

Here are the opening moves.



Northern spy goes north, followed by the northern army and all but one scout infantry from Zacatecas. Target is Apache Camp.

Other spy goes south. Faction heir heads for Ocotlan, accompanied by 2 archer, 2 scouts, and 2 lancers. This is a suicide mission. When Ocotlan sallies, form a sorted double line. Use your general to kill as many enemy as he can. Once the line breaks, withdraw your archers. Losing the general will boost your finances by about 700 per year.

Southern army and the rest of Colotan heads for Ahuacatlan. Besiege it but wait for the rebels to sally. You can hold your losses to 100 men.

Emissary goes south to boost relations with the Tarascans. Treat them like the Pope. I was able to get an alliance on turn 6.

Once Ahuacatlan is taken, beseige Ocatlan. This time the enemy will not sally until the last turn, but you should win easily. Take what is left of your army and go after Cuahtemoc on the east coast. That should leave the Tarascans with only 4 settlements an the Aztecs at their rear.

In your settlements, build only roads, farming, and mines until you are running a profit. Refuse most candidates for adoption, but remember always to have a faction heir in case your leader drops dead.

Ocotlan will sally on turn 9. Gang up on the eagle and jaguar warriors, and do not pursue into the village. This is the last turn of the siege, so time is your ally. Losses should be under 200.
Head east with most of the troops. If the Tarascans have taken Cuahtemoc, head north to the Apache settlement in Coahuila.

At Apache Camp, beseige with your chief and your best troops. Wait for a sally, even though there are no walls. Cahrge the Apache infantry and archers, who have poor defense. Wait them out after they retreat into the village. Set the reinforcement army to defensive stance.
Losses will be about 500.

Consolidate your troops and send the chief west to Tongva with full stacks. Build a wall so you can start recruiting.


About turn 10 you should be running a profit. Now you can build a ball court in Colotan (for heavy infantry) and a palace complex in Zacatecas (for better archers).

Tongva sallied and fell on turn 16. Losses were about 400. This consolidates the northwest and leaves the Apaches with only one village.

On turn 16 mines become available in Zacatecas and Colotan. These produce a large income. Why they are not yet available in other large towns in a mystery.

The last two Apache towns, Coahuila and Comanche fell on turns 20 and 23. It was lucky that the Apaches left them without a decent garrison.

More edits:
After 40 turns I have taken all the rebel villages as far east as Chickasaw, 14 regions in all, and am about to meet the French. My allies the Tarascans have 9 regions and form a barrier between me and all the other factions. My big cities in the south have stone walls and garrisons that might hold off a single stack. Overall, though, my military is less than half that of any of the other surviving factions.

After winning three battles against the French, I gained the ability to build Chichimec Gunners from the Rack of Skulls. It took several more battles to be able to build Chichimec Riders, also from the Rack of Skulls.

Final edit:
With great effort I removed the French from Florida while maintaining my allaince with the Tarrascans. This gave me 20 regions. I then spent about 20 turns on an economic buildup to get my treasury up to 60,000.

Eventually the Trascans and Mayans, the other two remaining factions, went to war. I built five stacks of top-quality troops and a couple of extras. Since the Tarascans had finally moved their stacks away to the war front, I was able to move my stacks adjacent to five of their cities. On turn 115 I besieged all five simultaneously, and on the next turn I captured and exterminated all five to achieve "dominance."

I rank last in military strength, only 40% of either other faction, but I have met the requirement of 25 regions.

Rumpole
09-07-2007, 12:24
A warning about Chichimec gunners (when you get them).

The default is that skirmish mode is off (even though it is on for archers). With weak defense and melee, there is no way you would want your gunners in melee. So select them all and turn skirmish on at the start of each battle.

Gaius Terentius Varro
09-08-2007, 15:07
I took a different route and totally skipped going north. I went south with my 3 stacks and took the 3 rebel cities AFTER I wiped out the Tarascans. My reasoning was that the distances were lot smaller and there is loads of gold and silver there = mines (Huaxtepec gives 1280 gold a turn from the mines alone) so mining is a huge bonus while the northern provinces are poor and really far apart. And it's more fun since the Aztecs throw unlimited stacks against you (H/VH). Another reason is that your troops get bonuses in shrub and forest (that would be southeast) while apaches get bonuses in desert which is the whole north west area of the map.
Word of warning i had my Faction Heir go rebel on me on start of turn 2 guy has 0 loyalty. In my next campaign he's gonna be leading the charge... alone :D. Didn't even know that a faction heir could go rebel before this one. EDIT I actually added a line to
( LoyaltyStarter 1 ) descr_strat.txt for all faction heirs that were missing loyalty since it makes no sense that all wanted to play Robin Hood. One yes but not all.

http://ww2.beffo.se/upload/pic~/5ur84oa9nbyp.JPG

You have great melee infantry (well there is 112 of them anyways and they have 25 in morale) in Guachichil Warriors and ok archers in Zacatecos Archers (actually in archer vs archer duels the Chichimec Hunters are better since they have a shield, = 5 def, which the Zacatecos Archers lack = 0 def) so I didn't bother making anything else till I went up against the Spanish that's when i started making spearmen. By the time I ran into the Apaches I had firearms and they didn't like it.
A tip: you can sacrifice units to convert ppl to your religion: You get 6% for five units.
This pic is taken from turn 26 where i am mopping up the rest of the aztecs who have 3 small towns and one stack left and bathing in cash:

https://img481.imageshack.us/img481/9205/namnlsgf1.jpg

Now basically every town can produce 2 of my best units every turn so I can replenish my losses which are pretty high. Oh and don't keep your generals in settlements there are no buildings you can build (grain silo) to stop the Fiscally challenged/trading trait from increasing so you'll end up with all of them having it.

kitbogha
11-10-2007, 19:55
Thanks all for your advice, I am due to start a Chichimec campaign when my Apaches finish their campaign and it looks like a fascinating one. They have certainly proved stubborn adversaries in my current game and appear to have what the Apaches lack early on-heavy infantry!:indian_chief:

kitbogha
11-14-2007, 15:40
Wow....started the Chichimeca campaign this morning and within 15 moves have already taken 7 Rebel/Apache settlements following a mixture of the helpful advice above and my own instincts.
Have allied myself to Tarascans, Tlaxcallans and Aztecs and have trade agreements with the Spanish (although I expect some of those alliances to come under pressure as I am forced to take sides in their disputes to come). I am hoping that this will keep my southern neighbours happy whilst I take out the Apaches. My plan is to let them fight out their differences and weaken each other until I consolidate my position and find the French to take on and achieve weapons technology upgrades, and then..... :evilgrin: .
I am very impressed with the starting units and those you can upgrade to so quickly in the game. I almost rang in sick to work this morning so I could keep playing!!

kitbogha
11-15-2007, 17:39
A quick question if anyone is out there-I know the Chichimec have the ability to adapt others weapons and technology: this would normally be gained through fighting the colonials. If the Apaches have this technology (ie horses and guns), does fighting them allow for upgrades?

Ozzman1O1
01-30-2008, 01:28
Yes,And advice on your campaign,A nomad cultered faction stands no chance against the mesoamericans,Stop worring about navajoa and start destroying tarascans before they get to powerful..ps,My greatest general deserted to the aztecs,But without tarascans,your fine

kitbogha
01-30-2008, 16:56
I feel the Chichimecs stand more of a chance than the Apaches, who I was playing before (I achieved victory conditions but was left unsatified as I like to make a nice tidy map with everything in my dominion) . The main problem with the nomads is a lack of heavy infantry, you are swamped and beaten by the mesos' heavy infantry which can be countered by the Chichmecs own heavy squads. I look forward to continuing this campaign, which I have on the back burner at the minute. Once my Lithuanians take over medieval Europe I will return to this one.

kitbogha
02-07-2008, 15:47
Wow, just had the most amazing battle against the Apaches! I was trapped by two of their huge armies and after retreating once was unable to a second time and had my hand forced. Fools! Against their two stacks, mainly comprised of archers, I saw no real alternative but to charge, and my stack mainly Zacatecos spearmen and four units of Guachachils routed both their armies, taking over 1200 prisoners!! Now, if only I'd had some horsemen to chase their routers I'm sure I could have captured more.