Imperial Diet VII

[econ21]

[OOC] This thread is for players in the King of the Romans PBM to post in character public deliberations in the Imperial Diet. All out of character debate should be conducted in the OOC thread.

Full sessions of the Diet have two main functions: to elect a Chancellor, who manage the Empire, and to pass Edicts or Charter Amendments that will direct the Chancellor.

The Diet will be chaired by the Kaiser, the Prinz or the Diet Speaker.

Edicts need to be formally proposed as follows:

Edict 14.1 This House directs the Chancellor to occupy province X.

where 14.1 refers to the first proposed edict of the eleventh session of the Diet.

Edicts need two seconders (who should explicitly use the word "second" when supporting a motion) before they can be put to the vote. Where edicts conflict, the one with more votes takes precedence.



*****


Elberhard: Electors, we meet together at a new Diet for the first time in many a year. And, by God, those years have been @#$%^&!!! @#$%^&!!!ing sons born of @#$%^&!!! @#$%^&!!!ing mothers.

We meet together in Nuremburg, historic capitol of Bavaria, not of the Reich. The Reich’s ancient and proper capitol lies a shattered and ruined city under the oppressive rule of the Byzantines. The great urban populations of Rome, along with those of Antioch, Bologna and Venice have been mercilessly exterminated – man, woman and child – by the Greeks.

We meet together to govern a diminished Reich, with less than half the number of provinces it spanned at its height. Each House has been humbled and beaten down. Outremer is no more than a Citadel, alone and defiant.

We meet together battered, but still the most powerful nation on God’s earth. However, our power attracts few friends and many enemies. The great nation of England, home of our Empress, still stands by us. The Papacy also stands with us, although its opinion of us is sorely tried by the blasphemy and destruction of the religious extremists who have plagued our lands. So, we have few friends. But our foes are legion. We struggle to fend off multiple invasions. – not just from the Byzantines, but also the French, the Danes, the Poles, the Hungarians, the Venetians and the Sicilians. The @#$%^&!!!ing Mohammadens would like to get a piece of us, but complain they can’t get through the crowds of our Christian foes hammering at the gates of our Citadels!

We meet together, each and every Elector of the Reich. But there are empty chairs in the debating chamber. The seat at my right – the seat of the Reich’s greatest general, one of its most successful Chancellors, the late Duke of Swabia and Hans, is vacant. My brother was cut down – like Kaiser Siegfried - not by a foreign invader, but by one of our own! By one of our own! Think on this, Electors – most of those Electors who have died during the past cataclysm have not died at the hands of outsiders, but at the hands of Germans. They were not killed by strangers, but by brothers. We killed them. I have sworn to Duke Lothar that I will let the past be the past, so I will not dwell on this. But the lesson is stark – we are the greatest nation on earth and there is no greater threat to us than that which comes from within.

Electors, we meet in trying times but we do meet. We are here. We are back – together. We have an opportunity to plan, to unite and to turn the tide. Our enemies come on at us without imagination, strategy or guile. We must elect a Chancellor who can outthink and outfight our enemies. One who can restore and deploy the great resources of the Reich – above all, the many talents of our generals.

We also meet to pass legislation. But I urge you not to succumb to the temptation to promote petty individual ambitions and seek personal glory. Nor should you scheme to promote the interests of one House above the others. Worse still would be attempts to fundamentally change our Charter. Electors now is not the time for Constitutional Reform! Now is a time of crisis, a time for action – we cannot afford to fritter away our energies on the work of lawyers and any reconstruction we attempt in haste under the present duress will surely be botched. If we pass legislation, let it be focussed, enabling legislation – Edicts that allow the Chancellor to do what must be done for the good of the Reich.

And so, with those opening remarks, I now declare the 14th full session of the Diet open. There will be a five day period of debate. The deadline for Edicts and Charter Amendments to receive two seconders is 3.30pm Wednesday (UK time). All candidates for the position of Chancellor must declare themselves by that time and have proposed manifestoes here. There will then be a 24 hour period of voting.

I would like to begin the business of the Diet by proposing:

Charter Amendment 14.1: Antwerp is formally incorporated into the Reich.

The disastrous civil war in Swabia has greatly weakened our western flank, but it has brought one benefit – the city of Antwerp is now in German hands. It is a rich city and potentially protected from invasion by land Bruges and Hamburg. Unless CA 14.1 is passed, we will have to abandon it. Do I have two seconders?

[econ21]

Written by AussieGiant

Standing to address the Diet chamber, Duke Arnold is unusually attired in fine cloths rather than his traditional Obsidian Armour.

Covered from head to foot in predominately black, the Duke's coat of arms is embroidered on his black tunic, his Fathers sword hangs at his belt. For all intense and purposes he looks rather normal as apposed to his more intimidating self.

MY KAISER, PRINZ of the REALM, NOBLE LORDS!!!

The Duke's voice is as commanding and as near a physical force as always. The scribes and serving staff are rooted to the spot for some moments while his opening line seems to die slowly in the chamber.

Sweeping his gaze across the room the Duke can be seen smiling and seems in an expansive mood. He walks steadily onto the chamber floor, his spur shod riding boots chinking in a steady rhythm.

Regarding the position of Chancellor...recently I've placed great thought on the matter after being cooped up in Ragusa for some years.

There is a pause of some moments as he seems to contemplate a few thoughts.

I believe I am the perfect candidate at this time, therefore I am formally announcing my candidacy for the position!!

Silence is the immediate response.

Into that silence can be heard a clear but almost inaudible response from the Dukes Priest sitting some distance at the back of the Austrian benches.

My god have mercy on us all.

A raised eyebrow is all the response the Duke gives away.

Now, I know some of you might have reservations about me and my reputation, certainly my own Priest's comments maybe the first thought that has come to many of your minds, and I can't say that I am displeased with that type of response.

Because it is that very response, doubt and terror, that we must instill in our enemies, that I will certainly inflict on them as Chancellor.

We have been weakened, critically so, and like vultures circling a wounded lion our enemies have only blood and victory on their minds.

What I can guarantee, without a shadow of doubt, is that with my election to the position of Chancellor every King, Prince, Doge and Sultan on this earth with take stock for just a few moments before continuing their war against us, and it is in these moments that we will hold our lines then strike back and begin the rebuilding and reconquest of our LANDS!!!!

Striding purposefully across the Diet floor the Dread Knight Bane hands his Duke a parchment. Clapping his hands on the Dark Knights shoulder they confer for a few moments. As the fully helmed and armoured figure returns to the Austrian benches the Duke turns to address the assembly.

Without going into too much detail here are my credentials and strategy.

Reading now from the parchment the Duke continues.

I've marshaled the Eastern Front in what I would arguably say was a text book “Fighting Retreat” against enormous odds.

Raising his hand to indicate the Lord of Austria in attendance.

I'd like to personally pay tribute to my most senior noble and friend Lord Zirn. He actions and bravery were legend to me and I had only heard about them in letters from my sister...he is everything and more she has ever written.

Lorenz Zirn, as crazed a man as I've ever met, loyal to the end and always looking for a fight. He has all the qualities I could ask for!

Count Karolinger and Sir Tancred.

The Duke scans the Bavarian and Franconia benches before making eye contact with them both.

I've written to you both privately and as you know I've sent my heart felt thanks to your respective Dukes. In acknowledgment of your service to Austria I have had two head stones installed in the Austrian Chamber to forever engrave your contribution to the House.

I must also thank the Kaiser most recently for his assistance in Zagreb.

Finally my Lord Becker, who, even though we have had our differences managed to find common ground with me and resolve our issues without spilling German blood. His contribution to the defense of Austria was isolated but no less important to both the Houses of Franconia and Bavaria.

The Duke pauses, the memories of the crisis seem to linger in his eyes, clearly he has been greatly affected by the events that have unfolded. Finally he blinks away the memories and continues to read from the parchment.

I was the only senior noble NOT to get involved in that disastrous civil war in Swabia!!

I've been governing multiple provinces and men since I was a young man. The scale of the Empire is not beyond anything I have not done to date.

Essentially my lords the goals are clear and obvious.

Recover from the disastrous events of the past few years, restore the economy, and
retake our lost territories.

The difficulties we face in returning to our previous standing in the world will be immense but I firmly believe I am supremely qualified and have a clear track record of diplomacy, governance and military success to draw on.

Looking up from the parchment the Duke lets it fall to the floor. Placing his hands behind his back he begins to walk slowly around the chamber floor.

I'm not going to promise anything at this time. The economy is beginning to reorganise itself and I have no doubt that the military must be reorganized. Combine this with the need to reconstruct an enormous number of destroyed buildings and I am simply not going to make economic promises that I have no ability to guarantee. This includes recruitment and reinforcement!

Again the Duke pauses.

Pacing across the floor he begins to absorb a sense of increased energy, there is a fierce feeling of intensity and drive emanating from him.

At last he stops, raising his head suddenly he seems to lock eyes with everyone present, giving the impression that he is talking directly to each noble in the chamber on a personal level.

As he begins to speak, his voice is so quite that even the scribes lean forward to catch the words he is saying.

I want to be very clear at this time. I'm taking a clear stance on the Cataclysm, the Swabian Civil War AND the War of Reformation...it's over, they are in the past and I'm not interested in discussing them or attaching blame. There is an enormous amount of work to be done and I will only engage and work with those of you who are focused on the future and the goals I have outlined. If you bring up the past with me, expect me to end that debate with the resolve and fire I am famous for.

I'm not a forgiving man nor am I someone who forgets and I'm not asking you to...but to do anything but focus our energies on the future will simply jeopardies our ability to recover...AND THAT...IS ALL...I AM INTERESTED IN!!

In a sudden and blinding move his fathers sword flashes before the Diet chamber, arcs for a split second over his head and with enormous strength cleaves the Imperial Scribes desk in two pieces. Both scribes proceed to faint completely unharmed in their seats.

This type of action needs to be directed at our enemies and not against each other. If anyone is not with us then as Chancellor I will ensure anyone's...”alternative” approach to rebuilding will look something like the desk here in front of me.

Reaching into his pocket the Duke proceeds to flip and coin clear across the Diet floor to a page boy.

Be a good lad and get the Imperial Carpenter to replace this mess will you.

Swinging back towards the chamber the naked blade of his father sword reflecting in the light, Duke's smiling face seems at odds with the violence of only a few moments ago.

The glittering threat of violence in his eyes is unmistakable and makes the next sentence sound more of a warning than anything else said before.

We must be united my Lords!! It's clear in my mind, it is the right thing to do, and it's the only OPTION we have in our present circumstances.

Elect me Chancellor, and I will lead the Reich forward to rebirth, to reconstruction and to revenge!

With that the Duke sheaths his sword and returns to his seat. Upon finally taking a seat he leans forward in his chair for one last comment.

I look forward to discussing any details with you all. I now open the floor to any other candidate or questions.

[_Tristan_]

A young man, visibly French from his garments and complexion, makes his entry in the Diet. His tabard is travel-worn but through the dust a red cross can be seen on a field of once-pure white. Following close, behind him, a grizzled man in armour and wearing the same travel-worn tabard is bearing the young Lord's helm. He looks somewhat lost but eager and goes to take a seat on the benches reserved to Swabian Electors.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter von Essen:

A young man enters the Diet. It is clear that he is awed by it's awesomeness. He makes his way to the center. While attempting to show courage, it is clear that he is uneasy. Once at the center, he summons the conviction to speak without letting his voice shake too much.

Noblemen of the Reich! I am here to officially present myself before this august body. My name is Dieter von Essen and I have just married Count Zirn's eldest daughter. I am here to serve the Reich and Austria in these trying times. I will now officially swear fealty to the Kaiser and Duke Arnold.

Dieter walks up to the Kaiser's throne and kneels.

Mein Kaiser, I present myself to you as a noble of the Reich. May you use me as a humble servant to smite our enemies. God bless you and God bless the Reich!

Dieter then stands up and walks to the Austrian benches. He kneels before Duke Arnold.

Mein Duke, I present myself to you as an Austrian noble. May you use me as a humble servant to smite Austria's enemies. God bless you and God bless House Austria!

Dieter stands up, walks to the Austrian benches and stands before his new father-in-law.

Count Zirn, thank you again for giving me your daughter's hand in marriage. I hope I make you proud and do justice to the Zirn name.

Finally, Dieter sits in an Austrian seat and watches the proceedings with anticipation and excitement.

[_Tristan_]

The young Templar Lord rises from the benches of Swabia and reaches the center of the chamber.
Clearing his throat, he starts speaking in a soft but commanding voice.

Mes Seigneurs, pardon my poor command of your language but I was until now a Franc by name and heart but things have changed in my country and I have been forced to seek shelter somewhere else and where better than in the Empire.
I shall be known in these walls by the name Hugo von Holland.
Please do not ask questions if you think that name sounds strange, somethings are better left unsaid.

Falling with a knee to the ground, and head bowed, he continues.

Mon Empereur, I wish to express my most heartfelt thanks for the offer you made me and for accepting me among your Lords.
I did not expect such a welcome from our long-time enemies.

Mon Duc, I also wish to express my thanks for accepting me in the House of Swabia, thus allowing me to regain one day what is now lost to me, or at least have revenge for the wrongs done on me and mine.

To show my gratitude to you my Emperor, let me be the first to second your Edict.

The young Lord then walks back to the Swabian benches, getting a smile and a nod from the grizzled old warrior standing behind his bench.

[EDIT] : I had forgotten the name part...

[FactionHeir]

Ruppels sifts somewhat lost through all those papers and stops for a mere moment to speak before he returns to his read

I second the emperor's charter amendment

[OverKnight]

Matthias enters the Diet looking tired and travel worn, almost as if he has come fresh from a battle. He kneels before the Kaiser and then rises to speak to the Chamber.

My lords, it is good to be back. I had forgotten what it was like to have all of us in one place.

Matthias pauses as if a bit overwhelmed.

I, with the assistance of Sir Andreas von Salzgitter, have stemmed the Greek advance in Outremer. Their forces, which had been driving on Acre, have been thrown back. This has allowed me to attend this session personally.

While the Kaiser has wisely spoken about refraining from changing the Charter, I am afraid that the new situation in Outremer is something Kaiser Henry never envisioned when he authored the Charter of Outremer. A new Charter is needed to cope with these difficult times.

Believe me, I'd rather be driving the Greeks into the sea than proposing law, but is necessary.

Therefore I would like to propose:

Charter Amendment 14.2: A new Charter for Outremer is to be adopted, what is proposed below will completely replace all previous legislation relating to the Kingdom (Changes are in bold).

The Revised Charter of the Kingdom of Outremer

1. The Kingdom of Outremer will consist of Antioch, Acre and Adana as its core territories, they cannot be given or bartered away. If they are lost, they must be reclaimed as quickly as possible. The Kingdom may also include up to three more territories, with preference given to Aleppo, Damascus and Edessa. However, no conquest is allowed of any territories belonging to an ally.

2. The Kingdom of Outremer is an integral part of the Reich. It is not a fifth House.

3. The function of the Kingdom is mainly defensive: to safeguard Jerusalem and protect the gateway to Christendom. However, conquest is permitted against heathens and schismatics as long as it does not endanger the defense of Jerusalem. If a Pope assumes power who excommunicates the Reich, Jerusalem may be taken, if needed, as part of his removal, but it must be immediately donated back to the Church upon reconciliation.

4. The Kingdom will be overseen by a Viceroy of Outremer, who will be selected by the Emperor from among the current Crusaders. A Viceroy is appointed by the Emperor at each regular Diet Session. Viceroys may be reappointed. The Viceroy will renounce all loyalties to his House for the duration of his appointment. The Viceroy of Outremer is permitted to resign, if the Emperor is willing to accept the resignation, upon which a new Viceroy is appointed by the Emperor. If the Viceroy of Outremer is deemed incapable of his assignment, he may be impeached by the Emperor and two Dukes, by the Prince and three Dukes, or by the agreement of all four Dukes. Upon removal, the Emperor will appoint a new Viceroy.

5. The Viceroy will command an Army, equivalent to a Household Army with the Viceroy assuming the role of “Duke”. If the Kingdom is larger than or equal to three territories, a second such Army will be placed at his disposal. He may delegate the day to day command of the Army or Armies to other Generals.

6. Outremer’s provinces will be governed by Crusader Counts, except for the designated capital, which is the personal domain of the Viceroy. The Crusader Counts are appointed by the Viceroy and serve at his discretion. They will gain +1 influence, but only if they are not already a Count in their Duchy, and only for the duration of their appointment. The cap of 6 influence for all but the Emperor remains. If any County is left unassigned, the Viceroy will set the build queue for it.

7. Both the Viceroy and the Crusading Counts must be physically located outside Europe for the duration of their appointments.

8. All four Houses of the Reich have a stake in the Kingdom. While the loss of many of the original Outremer Counties currently negates apportionment by House, assignment of Counties will ensure that each Duchy is represented by a Crusader Count if one is present. All efforts will be made to assign a Swabian to Acre and a Bavarian to Adana. Once there are two newly acquired territories, they will be governed by representatives of Franconia and Austria. While historical precedents will be respected, priority will be given to Crusaders who are in Outremer.

9. The Viceroy of Outremer is allowed to propose two pieces of legislation per Diet Session related to Outremer. Prior to being tabled in the Diet, these must be seconded by two Crusaders, or if there is less than two Crusaders, one will suffice.

OOC: The Viceroy will have +2 influence as presently given to the King. All references in the Reich's Charter to the King of Outremer are to be changed to the Viceroy of Outremer.

Matthias pauses after reading the amendment.

I realize that the Kingdom now only consists of Acre, and that this proposal seems a bit odd considering the circumstances. But I swear that Outremer will be rebuilt, and to do so will require a strong foundation. This Charter provides that.

I would be glad to answer any questions about the Charter.

Matthias seats himself at the edge of the Bavarian section.

[Ferret]

I second CA 14.2

[Privateerkev]

Dieter von Essen stands,

Count Matthias,

I hereby second CA 14.2.

With Duke Arnold's permission and blessing, I wish to be reassigned to Outremer as soon as is practical in order to serve as Austria's representative in the Holy Land. My new bride has told me many tales of her life growing up in Damascus and it is my wish that Damascus once again come under the loving protective embrace of the Reich.

Dieter sits

[Ramses II CP]

I would urge that all members of the Diet take the words of Matthias Steffen to heart. Outremer is the key to the eventual defeat of the foul Byzantines, the very source of much of our latest difficulties. Despite being utterly abandoned by his companions, including his Kaiser, Matthias Steffen has, with vision and forethought, made the best of a terrible situation. Ask yourselves this, gentlemen, if we should abandon the homelands of Jesus to the Muslim and Orthodox hordes what wrath might fall upon the Holy Roman Empire from the heavens?

Matthias Steffen's amendment should be passed without pointless bickering from those of us hundreds of leagues distant from the situation.

I would further ask, of the Kaiser, is it really necessary to have two edicts to incorporate Antwerp into Swabia? Simply tie the two together in a single edict and it will have my support. Otherwise one must ask what exactly it is you intend to do with the city.

:egypt:

[_Tristan_]

Hugo von Holland stands from the Swabian benches and clears his throat.

King Steffen,

I have fought many battles against the Muslims from my Temple chapter house in the Levant.

If you would have me, I would gladly join you in the defense of Outremer.
Guillaume, that you can see behind me, will also come with me as well as my own retainers, Templar brothers all.
My sword is yours to command.

I hereby second CA 14.2.

France is too near for my own good at the moment... Too many memories...

Hugo sits back down, a sad and faraway look upon his face.

[Ramses II CP]

Fritz von Kastilien sweeps a sheaf of papers into a battered leather case, rises to his feet and raises his voice above the low rumble of varied discussion.

I stand now to announce my own candidacy for the position of Chancellor of the Reich.

While the lordly Duke Arnold has preceeded me in listing his admirable qualities, he has, as is his wont, settled rather single mindedly on a single possible course of action. 'Strike our enemies, drive fear into their hearts, and conquer them!' Very well said, one cannot help but concur and even cheer such a course.

And yet... if the cataclysmic events of the last few years have taught us anything, it should be that our enemies do not fear us, our armies are not immune to defeat, and our own decisions are sometimes more threatening than any external opponent. The Dread Duke is a fearsome and valiant warrior for the Reich, but his approach to the other aspects of governance reveal that his penchant for force extends well beyond the battlefield.

Here Fritz pauses to gesture gently at the broken remnants of the scribe's desk.

What the Reich needs in truth is a not merely a man who inspires fear in his friends and enemies alike, but a man whose experiences and characteristics mirror those of the Reich itself.

A man like me.

Again Fritz pauses to look across the chamber, well aware of a few discreet snickers and coughs.

Yes, like me, a man who has demonstrated valor in the field and at the walls.

A man who has conducted difficult negotiations with a dedicated foe, and brought home a ceasefire.

A man who has managed to remain devoutly faithful in a trying religious time, who has held steadfast his loyalty even in the face of horrific errors by the leadership of his nation, and who has made great sacrifices for the good of his House and his Empire.

Again Fritz pauses, just long enough to meet the Kaiser's gaze.

A man, too, who has erred, whose own mistakes have cost him personally just as the mistakes of the leadership of the Reich have had terrible consequences for us all.

I am that man who has suffered with the Reich, who has been wrong as has the Reich, and I am the man who has sought out the reasoning of his error and redeemed it in sacrifice.

Now Fritz's gaze travels across the entire room, quickly seeking out every noble and man of consequence.

Just as we of the Reich must all redeem ourselves.

It is early to speak of policy, but let me be clear that we will not retreat. Where Germans have planted our flag, there will the line be drawn. If any of us falter at the line let another arise to take his place. If any of us rebel, let every hand be raised against him and every face turned from him. Now is the time for solidarity. Now is the time for our return to glory and the path of righteousness. Now is the time for victory!

God be with you, nobles of the Reich!

Fritz returns to his seat, his face dark but unreadable.

[_Tristan_]

Hugo von Holland stands again and bows to Matthias Steffen, looking a bit flustered.

Lord Steffen, some people have made me remark that I shouldn't have called you King.
I hereby wish to present my excuses to any people who saw any malice in this.
Nevertheless, out of respect for the Lord I hope to serve, and in the light of the Charter Amendment you proposed, let me call you Viceroy.

So Viceroy Steffen, command me and I shall obey...

Hugo sits back down, with a look of assurance about him.

[Zim]

Another young man enters the Council chamber. He is somewhat above average size, with wide shoulders and a square jaw. He is wearing a traveler's cloak, a tabard with a crusading symbol, and chainmail armor, as well as the dust of a long travel. He moves to take a seat in the Outremer section by Matthias Steffen. Before he sits, he nods to Hugo and Dieter von Essen.

Hello gentlemen. I hope to fight by you in Outremer someday. It is a difficult situation, but quite satisfying to serve the Lord in such a way.

[Stuperman]

I fully support My Brother-in-Law's ideas about the outremer, Our mission as the HRE is to protect the church from threats within, and without. This legislation gives us the legal tools we need to enforce God's will in the holy land.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter sits in silent awe as the Crusader nods at him. To him, these men are giants. Larger than life. He nervously nods back.

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza enters and takes his place at the Swabian bench, the place is different to Rome, but he soon takes it in his stride.

I have guaranteed my support, so I second CA 14.2.

I hear the Kaiser's call for past differences forgotten, so I willhave to, though with extreme difficulty...

Athalwolf glares at the bavarian bench.

While I congratulate the two men already putting themselves forward for such a difficult job, I wish to question their motives. Both men seem to have a, war like past, as Chancellor, would you rule the Reich through war? And would you take enough in to also control the government side of things?

I am assured, and reassured, that you would rule us greatly with military, but with resources...

Duke von Salza sits, and awaits a long answer.

[Stuperman]

Fredericus summons a paige, hands him a hastly scribbled note, and sends him towards the Swabian Deligation

[gibsonsg91921]

Ha, I see we have two strong candidates for Chancellor this term. I would vote for my friend Arnold, or my brother Fritz, on the basis of the spoils system. Of course, in times like these and in all others, the spoils system is complete and absolute folly. The Chancellor should be elected on the basis of merit. Perhaps a debate is in order to determine who is best suited to the position?

[Ramses II CP]

Duke von Salza I would hope that my negotiation of a ceasefire with the Russians and my gathering of overwhelming support for the Anti-Unification proclamation have proved that I have skills and experience beyond the battlefield. I concede that Duke Arnold has run a larger territory than I, but given the nature of Franconian politics in my lifetime I would hardly say he has managed a more complex set of circumstances than I.

Management of a nation's resources is not within the experience of any of the current candidates, so I claim to be as qualified as any.

:egypt:

[gibsonsg91921]

Tell me brother, and Duke Arnold, what will you do to bring the finances of the Reich into the black once again?

And trust me, my inquisitive attitude is not questioning your merit or the Duke's. Both of you seem very strong candidates and great warriors, but who shall garner the support of the masses?

[Stuperman]

By selling Greek slaves perhaps? what else would they be good for, I tried strapping a few to my plow, but 8 of those wastes-of-food couldn't do as well a single German Ox.

[Cecil XIX]

While Count Fritz has more experience dealing with foreign powers, it is Duke Arnold who has the better record of dealing with his fellow electors. I know from first-hand experience that he is quite capable of negotiating with any and all parties of the Reich with an even-handed but stern attitude.

[Northnovas]

The eldest member of the chamber rises and slowly makes his way to the floor from the Austrian benches. He acknowledges familiar faces on his way to the floor but there are also a lot of fresh new faces. This was becoming the new Reich.

My Kaiser, Electors, it feels good to be in a chamber and to discuss the business of the Reich. It has been a long time since we have gathered and though it is not Rome this building and city serves the purpose that is on hand. I have seen much in my years and it is good to see things come full circle and the stage of rebirth.

We have come through some dark times and there are very few here to remember how it all started. Let us take a moment and remember those brave nobles who are no longer with us……..

I am not here to talk about the past those are tales to be told elsewhere. I am here to talk about the future one that I will not see.

I am here to announce publicly my support for Duke Arnold. Why? It is his time. I have watched this boy become a man and mature into a statesman. Just think of the situation in Prague. His father Leopold was a fine Chancellor for us and it’s now it is his sons turn. I don’t support him because he is Austrian and family. No I support him because of his ability to manage in a crisis. Just look at how Austria had faced adversity and remained united. We need a man who will lead us through the difficult situation we found ourselves. We are not out of the woods yet. There are armies at our borders and cities. We have to fight to get some breathing room. Rebuild our infrastructure and then seek our vengeance one step at a time. Reclaim what is rightful ours and punish those that took advantage of us in a weak moment. Duke Arnold is our man to lead us in this time of renewal.

Noble Matthias Steffen, comrade warrior, a man of principles. He needs our help. I have spent my whole live in the Outremer defending the faith, recapturing the Holy City of Jerusalem in the Second Crusade from the heathens that occupied it. It is our duty to protect that city and what it represents. This Diet should not be bickering when and if and how much. We should be saying now, who and at all cost. I must caution those that think they are for the call to serve. It is a long and laborious journey, you may not return. You are taking on a special mission to serve God and the Kaiser to protect the faith. It takes a special individual. It was only God’s work that I left and ended up having to defend my own lands and if I could I would be leading the call back to the Outremer and assist Count Steffen.

Nobles, we have a lot of work to do lets focus on electing the right man for Chancellor answering the call of God and rebuilding this great nation. I pass the torch on to this generation to carry it proudly and let be your guiding light to correct the wrongs that have been done and make the Reich greater then it has very been.

The old man bows towards the Kaiser and slowly makes his way back to his seat.

[Zim]

If I may, my lords, what are your policies towards Outremer? It is in a difficult position, and it would take a strong Chancelor to improve it's situation.

[Ferret]

I am pledging my support to Fritz, despite the many disagreements we have had. I do not see how you can say that Arnold handled the Prague incident well, after failing to have enough men to attack, as he wanted, he was forced to simply accpet the insult to his rule and lose a County. Does the fact that Becker rebelled in the first place not suggest that Arnold's politics are not as efficient as you seem to think Karl? Perhaps your age has blinded your judgement.

Fritz, on the other hand, has made an entire nation of bitter enemies of the Reich bow to our knees in peace! The Russians were set on revenge and no man other than Fritz could have stopped their tides of warriors with his skills in the art of Politics. As for finaces I see Fritz as the superior in this area as well, not many can field an entire army of treasure hungry mercenaries and fund the lot from his own success!

Fritz is also far more helpful to other members of the Reich. He has benefited the entire House of Franconia and saved it from destruction many times, thus blocking the path for three of the Reich's greatest enemies into the rest of our Empire. Arnold has barely managed to hold on to his castle and made no attempt to help his fellow electors of Austria when almost of all the Counties there were threatened. No Karl, Fritz is the man to lead us to glory, greater glory than ever before!

[vpmd]

A man walks into the Diet, staring at the assembly of great, established noblemen around him as he walks somewhat awkwardly in the general direction of the Bavarian section with an scribe following him looking very nervous as well. Trying not to be too noticeable, he takes a seat in the Bavarian section, nodding at Matthias Steffen, clearly intimidated by the great Crusader. He sits down, hoping he will be assumed to be a new Bavarian elector and that he need not summon the sbility of speech to introduce himself.

[Cecil XIX]

My reasons had nothing to do with Duke Arnold's abilities as a leader. More importantly, the resolution of that situation came about because Duke Arnold was smart enough to want to avoid a repeat of the tragedy at Bran, as well as patient enough to continue negotiations until both parties were able to get what they wanted.

If anyone else besides Arnold had been Duke of Austria during the cataclysm, more German lives would have been wasted in fratricidal conflict and/or I would be before you putting forth a charter amendment recognizing the succession of Bohemia.

[Ignoramus]

Maximilian von Hapsburg rises to his feet.

Before I put forward mein edict, I must declare mein support for Arnold Salian, Duke of Austria, for Chancellor.

I now propose Charter Ammendment 14.3: "The Kaiser is granted authority to strip a Duke of his Duchy if a majority of electors of that House agrees."

Electors, we must not blame the current Kaiser for the woes of the last 40 years. It is true that he continued his predecessors policy of pursuing unification on religion with the Greeks. However, this was Kaiser Siegfried's policy, not Kaiser Elberhard's. Kaiser Elberhard's hands were tied. If he pulled out of the negotiations, then the Greeks would have a just causus belli against us. Doubtless, what was left of our already pathetic reputation would be shattered, and we would find even our allies, the English, joining the fray against us.

Nein, the greater blame must be attached to the Houses during this period of disaster. Electors hadn't enough respect for the authority of the Kaiser, that nothing held them back from rebelling from their Dukes.

I would fain propose another edict, but, alas, Diet procedure forbids me from doing so. Nevertheless, I will state what I think.

We must redistribute provinces in the Reich. Had we not such stark geograpical divisions amongst the Houses, then no rebellion would ever succeed. How would Herr Hummel have fared if Bruges had belogned to Bavaria? Or if Metz belonged to Franconia? We must overcome past sentiments and rebuild the Reich.

Maximilian begins to sit down, but hastily regains his feet.

And I also second Charter Ammendment 14.1.

[Northnovas]

To address young Dieter's remarks.
I thank you Edmund for your input. I am not disputing Fritz's ability has a general he absolutely saved the Franconia House from collapsing with the enemies at the gates and internal strife. You know nothing of Duke Arnold's ability to support his nobles with the best troops. He defended the citadel in order for us to gain professional troops to continue the fight. He shared his wealth. He may not have been at all fighting but he was there for support. Without his leadership their would be no Austria!!
He lead through diplomacy with Edmund in Prague. It was not about having sufficient men it was about priorities. He also stayed out of the Swabian ordeal.

Andreas your question the plan of the Outremer is in the documentation of this Diet. The goal is protecting Jerusalem and we learned the hard way. Duke Arnold is the one to get us back on footing in the Outremer.

[econ21]

Elberhard: I wish to publicly endorse King Matthias's revision of the Outremer Charter. Matthias was gracious enough to consult me on the draft and I agreed that it adapts my father's vision for Outremer to these more desperate times. I also congratulate Matthias on his great victory over the Byzantines. He is, of course, formally re-appointed as King of Outremer (or, if CA 14.2 passes, Viceroy).

I must inform the Electors that Duke Arnold is taking the opportunity provided by his breaking of the siege of Ragusa to conduct diplomatic negotiations with neighbouring powers. I believe he will return to the Diet on Monday.

Finally, I was remiss in not welcoming the many new Electors to their first Diet. I confess, there were so many new faces, I did not know all your names. Now, however, my wife ... I mean the scribes ... have provided me with a proper Electoral roll, so let me make good my earlier lack of manners.

Count Ehrhart Ruppel - I see in you the sword arm of the Duke of Swabia. You have already been of invaluable service against our enemies - both external and internal.

Count Ludwig von Bohmen - the return of a prodigal son is always most keenly felt.

Andreas von Salzgitter - may you grow to love the sun and sand of Outremer as much as I did. And if you happened to find any elephants, write me ... we can work something out.

Hugo von Holland - I was going to welcome any aid you could give us against the French, but your service in Outremer would be just as valued.

Count Dieter von Kassel - you have just attained full manhood and yet already your service to the Reich has been immeasurable.

Lukas Godwinson - Franconia must be reborn; it is well that we have young captains such as you to assist in the labour. Just watch those castle steps, they can be mighty slippery this time of year...

Count Lorenz Zirn - thank you for your services during the cataclysm and especially for assisting in the relief of Prague. Those Poles had me worried about Count Becker's militia army for a while...

Maxmillan von Hapsburg - I like the sound of your name, it seems to promise great things. Welcome, soldier! It is good to see you here.

Dieter von Essen - It is most welcome to see Austria emerge at last with so many prominent Electors. And congratulations, son! (sotto voce) At least that's one Elector who won't be sniffing round my daughter.

Hans von Bavaria - I heard you might be considering a life in the diplomatic service, but you made the smart choice, lad - diplomacy is for pussies. What House are you in, by the way?


@#$%^&!!!ing hell - you newcomers seem to outnumber us old timers! While you may make me feel old, your presence here makes the Reich young and strong! Welcome all!

[gibsonsg91921]

In response to Dieter's charges and Count Zirn's responses, I would say that Arnold's duties in during the cataclysm were not cowardly or incapable in the least. I will grant that Arnold possibly would have attacked Bohemia if he could, I concede that he was wise not to when he would have damaged his loyal Counts. He is blameless as far as I can see.

Fritz is very noble as well, saving his rival Dieter from being outnumbered in Magdeburg, as well as slaying large numbers of our enemies, saving Franconia when all seemed lost. His fortitude kept all Duchies safer. There are countless heroes of the cataclysm, sung and unsung, and Fritz is certainly amongst those numbers. He can lead the Reich just as ably as Arnold.

This will be a very close race. If one does not come out as a far better candidate than the other I will abstain from voting to keep the peace.

[deguerra]

After a long hard ride through French lines, Ludwig enters the Diet at Nürnberg. He looks around somewhat sheepishly at all the mighty men sitting in his midst, but there is a slight gleem of despise in his eyes as well

Mein Kaiser, I thank you for your kind remarks, and hope I prove as good a subject as you can wish for. I have lost my father some years ago, and it would do me honour to call you father, in symbol only of course, as you are father to all of your subjects, Dukes, Counts, Lords, Knights and Commoners.

I wish to briefly publically endorse the new charter for Outremer as well. I am in no position to do any more, but home that any small contribution I can give will help the most courageous and brave amongst us, who choose to fight for the Empire there.

I also fully agree that Antwerp should be incorporated into the Empire. Before now, I have considered it my duty to protect both Flemish cities, Bruges and Antwerp alike, but under the threat of French invasion I find myself incapable of guaranteeing the safety of Antwerps citizens, while I struggle to hold Bruges. I therefore fully endorse placing Antwerp into Eberhardts sheltering hands.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

*Noticing Elberhard's empty chair, he smiles. It appears that the Kaiser has gone out for a quick rest. "So much the better," he mumbles.*

Electors! Good people of the Reich! It warms my heart to see you all here, in Nuremburg, safe and organized. Finally, after the all the turmoil of the past years, I do hope that we are ready to rebuild our great Empire once again.

I have been invited to the Diet here, albeit in a non-voting capacity (he glares at the empty chair) to present my views and hopefully bring a formal end to the religious conflict that threatened to tear what was left of the country apart.

However, it is clear to everyone that I am no longer a simple theologian. Ever since early on in Siegfried von Kastilien's fateful reign as Chancellor, I, for the most part, have been around military men, political men. Men who were concerned with far more than religion. These people had more temporal strategies, strategies for winning battles, wars, strategies on how to go about the little politics that took place during the Cataclysm. Electors, it is safe to say that I have picked up a little bit of their thought patterns and knowledge.

And from what knowledge I do have, one thing is clear: We need to unify, and we need to show the world that we are unified. We need to show the world that there is no longer a Swabian Civil War, which I regret to have ever been a part of. We need to show the world that, once again, our House Armies will rise up and threaten all of those unfriendly nations that border our superior one. We need to show the world that, once again, we are united under Kaiser and Chancellor!!!

*His eyes darken.*

Most notably, we need to show the Byzantines.

These traitorous scum betrayed us. We had a good alliance going for over a century. We had a mutual defense pact in Outremer that seemingly only we, thanks to Matthias Steffen, honored. We even had damn fool of a Kaiser, God rest his soul, ready to "rule" with a much older, wiser Emperor whispering in the shadows through his daughter. But it was not enough!

Electors, they wanted Italy. They wanted Outremer. They wanted Austria. And by all accounts, they cared little for merely taking over the place. When they invaded, they killed. Slaughtered thousands, tens of thousands of innocent women and children. Electors, this was by no means a simple war of conquest. This was a war of extermination, a war to wipe us off the face of the map for some unknown offense we committed to them. A war of extreme greed.

Well, I say it's payback time. We need to show them, militarily and morally, that we are the stronger. We need to show them that we can conquer them and still be civil to their innocents. We need to show them that you can never threaten the Reich and get away with it!

I propose, along with the support of Kaiser Elberhard himself, a resolution that will focus our efforts for the next several decades, on eradicating the Byzantine menace once and for all!!!

Charter Amendment 14.4: All Byzantine settlements are to be conquered and incorporated into the Reich by 1500. To demonstrate the moral superiority of the Reich, no captured Byzantine settlements may be exterminated and all loot from them must to be donated to the Papacy.

Yes, this war will be long. Yes, it will be costly, and in more ways than one. But, Electors, there are some things worth the cost. There are some things that nobody can forgive. Rome, Bologna, Venice, Antioch; they lie in ruins, nearly deserted except for the unholy barracks that house Satan's instruments of destruction.

The first steps to this are to, naturally, take back what is ours. But then, we shall continue. We shall keep striking, keep fighting, keep pushing until Greece, and Turkey, and Constantinople itself once again is taken!

And then, Electors, when the last city falls, the world will shake. The world will tremble at our power, our might, our wrath. And the world will know to never anger the Reich again!

Siegfried von Kastilien had a dream. He wanted the Roman Empire reunited. And he shall see his dream occur. We will be reunited - through conquest! Under the golden Eagle! Where every Byzantine, still living in prosperous cities that pay taxes to Rome, kneels before their true ruler: The Kaiser of the Reich!

Electors, what say you?!

[Zim]

Andreas briefly has a deer in headlights expression, as if trying to both process the shock of being addressed by the Kaiser and the oddness of his words. He recovers and bows.

Mein Kaiser, thank you for the welcome. I miss the snow in my homeland, but otherwise I find the climate in Outremer quite pleasant. Should I see any elephants, I will report it to you immediately.

Andreas then bows respectfully to Zirn.

Lord Zirn, I am very pleased that both candidates are such clear supporters of Outremer. I do not doubt Duke Arnolds devotion to guarding Jerusalem. I only wished to draw specifics from them with my question. Perhaps it is an unreasonable question given that circumstances could change drastically and alter both the needs of the Reich as a whole and those of Outremer.

Count Ludwig receives a nod.

Hail Count Ludwig. It is a pleasure and privelege to meet the Count of my parents' adopted city. Would you happen to know them?

[flyd]

Lukas Godwinson had been present in the Franconian section during most of the debate. He acknowledged the Kaiser with a nod after being addressed, and was red in the face and visibly shaking with rage during Luther's speech, but has not said anything.

[Stuperman]

We must redistribute provinces in the Reich. Had we not such stark geograpical divisions amongst the Houses, then no rebellion would ever succeed. How would Herr Hummel have fared if Bruges had belogned to Bavaria? Or if Metz belonged to Franconia? We must overcome past sentiments and rebuild the Reich.


I do not understand...You advocate a policy that would provide support for such a rebel? This is nonsense! You advocate a policy that by your admission would make the riech weaker and more suseptable to attacks and brigandry. This after we have seen the devistation that such things can breed.

The Reich has lost almost half her territory in just 40 years, land that took more than 300 to amass, and we are by no means in the clear. We still have limited control in some provinces, and enemy armies run rampant on our lands. Gentlemen we still have much work to do before we can call ourselves true Germans and Guardians of the Church. Electors that encourage further weakening of the Reich should be dealt with harshly.

And Luther, We should conquor the Greeks, although I'd advocate more of a Kill them all Let God work it out Strategy.

[Zim]

Herr Fredericus, I believe that Herr von Hapsburg is saying that in a Reich where political power is less regionalized, it would be harder for a rebel to muster the resources to cause her harm. If Bruges were Bavarian, A Swabian pretender like Hummel would have had trouble controlling them.

I disagree with his assessment. Having territories assigned to Houses almost randomly, without thought to giving well organized regions to the Dukes, would hurt the Reich, I think, and have made it all but impossible for the Dukes to have marshalled their forces against foreign invasion during the Cataclysm.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

Count Erlach, as you have probably gleaned from my writings, I'm inclined to agree with your assessment. However, in the spirit of unity and reconciliation Kaiser Elberhard and I have agreed that the no extermination caveat be added.

I once again implore the Electors to support this important CA. We cannot let the Byzantines get away with what they have done.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter von Essen perks up when he hears the Kaiser speak his name. But his cheeks go red when the Kaiser brings up Princess Eue.

Mein Kaiser!

I swear I would never do such a thing! I am a happily married man! All men wish they could be so lucky as I!

Dieter puffs out his chest and pounds it to accentuate his point. It is obvious that the young man is not used to such lewd language coming from the Emperor.

[vpmd]

Hans, who has become more comfortable with his surroundins, stands upon being addressed by the Emperor.

Mein Kaiser, I belong to the noble house of Bavaria, as you may guess by my surname, which I hope I can represent well in the years to come.

Hans pauses and then adds as an afterthought;

I second Amendment 14.4. We must show the people the mercy the Greeks have not shown, particularly, for mighty and lasting empires are built on mercy, kindness, and trust of the people in the wisdom and nobility of their rulers, while massacres invariably are the downfall of the greatest empires.

Thinking this statement to be sufficient, Hans sits again.

[Ramses II CP]

I second Charter Amendment 14.4 as well. The Byzantines are far from my House lands, but they are at the root of all the troubles that have bedeviled the Reich.

Furthermore, I wish to say that my run for Chancellor must not become divisive! I am deeply grateful for your support Dieter, which shows wisdom and loyalty in equal measures. Yet while I may question if Duke Arnold is the most qualified contender, I do not question whether or not he is capable of the role. It seems clear to me that I am best prepared to take on the role of Chancellor, but I am not prepared to win at any cost, and if I were to be victorious over the Duke I would ask that nothing during the run be done or said in my favor that might alienate or disaffect any of the noble Dukes of the four Houses.

Onto to further questions:

Prinz Peter, as any who have been by the local bar can attest I have been studying the economic and other governmental reports continuously since my arrival in Nuremburg. There are thousands of details I have yet to grasp, but my general policy shall be one of consolidation of resources and and a careful examination of expenditures. I am not yet prepared to issue a detailed plan, but be assured it is in the works.

Crusader von Salzgitter, as our private exchanges should make clear, my policy towards Outremer is unmitigated support. What the Holy Lands need, they shall get, so long as it is within the means of the Reich to provide. God has entrusted us a sacred burden there and it is not for men to decide to set it aside. I swear that even if Acre should somehow be lost the Reich's commitment to the Levant would be unwavering under me.

Sir von Hapsburg, if you will forgive me, your plan sounds like a guaranteed way to drive more chaos and disorder into the heart of the Reich. If not for your services to date I would question whether you have the best interests of the Empire at heart. I suggest you reconsider your statements and reissue them. If the power of the Kaiser had not been far too great the madness of the attempted Unification could never have even begun, and you now propose to entrust that position with even more far reaching power. What's more your curious version of events does little to match the facts of the matter, most specifically including the Byzantine kidnapping and subsequent years of torture experienced by Matthias Steffen. It was only the steadfast intelligence of a few loyal Germans which narrowly averted the utter destruction of our whole people. Give them your thanks for your life, and withhold your petty insults.

Father Luther your comments are insightful as ever. I am pleased you were able to attend the Diet and look forward to more discussion of the Byzantine problem with you.

If there are further questions I shall assemble my notes and attempt to answer them in a timely manner.

:egypt:

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg rises to feet, with disdain evident on his face.

We Hapsburgs thank no one for our protection. We are perfectly capable of defending our estates, even when others can't.

I find it alarming that you advocate sending more men to the Outremer, when we can't even recruit more soldiers at home. For the Reich to survive, we must leave the Outremer to fend for itself. King Matthias is quite capable of holding the citadel at Acre, and now that the English are settled in the Levant, we should not fear Greek subjectgation.

Von Hapsburg resumes his seat.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

I disagree. If we continue to support Outremer then we open up a legitimate second front against the Byzantines. The Levant was the former location of some of our most advanced troop training centers. If we can get, say, Adana back then we can put pressure on the Greeks from the East as well as the West.

[Ignoramus]

Not bothering to stand up, von Hapsburg leans forward with a serious expression on his face.

The age of crusades has passed. While I, as any good Catholic, am glad to see the Holy City in Christian hands once more, I am not blind to the dangers of the Reich at home.

Should we strengthen the enemies of Christendom? It is true that the Greeks could hardly be called Christians, yet even they are more tolerable than the infidel.

[vpmd]

Overhearing von Hapsburg speak, Hans von Bavaria reply.


Perhaps I am too unfamiliar with the customs of the diet, but those words have a faint ring of treason to me. Forgive me if I am mistaken, but you seem to suggest that we should abandon a great opportunity to wipe out the hated Byzantines. Why should we show an ounce of mercy to them, when they could not find any mercy for the innocent people of half a dozen of our cities? They are vile and wicked and are preferable to none.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

Tolerable?

Tolerable??!?!

With all due respect, von Hapsburg, where have you been the past several years?

These... Byzantines lied to us. Betrayed us. They launched a full-scale invasion of Italy and Outremer, exterminating every city in their path. Murdering innocent women and children by the thousands. They sought to have every single solitary settlement in the Four Houses and Outremer burned to the ground! They sought to make the entire Western half of Europe a hollow ruin of itself!

Tolerable?!

No, von Hapsburg. The great Muslim Empires, worshipping an unholy figure, have not wrought this much combined destruction upon Christendom in their collective centuries of existence than the Byzantines have done in a few short years. They must pay.

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg rises to his feet.

Hyprocrite! Did not your words tear the Reich assunder? You caused the the Greeks to commit these atrocities, and you alone. You stirred up Peter von Kastilien and urged him to sack Constantinople. We could hardly expect mercy from the Greeks after that.

Your followers included Dietrich von Dassel and Wolfgang Hummel, both of whom wrecked Swabia and have brought the Reich to a precarious position.

You Lutherans are the curse of the Reich; we would be well rid of you.

Von Hapsburg resumes his seat.

[flyd]

Unable to remain quiet, Lukas Godwinson stands and speaks.

The Greeks were not the only ones to have wrought destruction. Internal fighting and...

Godwinson looks at Luther

... Religious conflict have claimed as many, if not more, lives than the actions of the Greeks. Yet, we have agreed to put that aside, and rightly so. And if old grudges against our own can be put aside, perhaps other forms of blind hatred can take a rest too.

Yes, what has been lost, must be regained. What is a threat must be eliminated. That is clear. But to call for a war of conquest for... revenge, at this hour... is... is...

Godwinson starts to lose his composure. If he could, he would hate Luther to death! He regains some composure, and finishes.

Well, Mr. Luther. You were allowed to speak freely in this Diet, the least you could have done is left your violent fanaticism at the door.

[Zim]

A curious expression falls over Andreas' face at the mention of religious conflicts.

Herr von Hapsburg, while I do not share the religious...sympathies that Herr Luther professes, I see little point in dredging up religious conflicts that have finally ended while the Reich is imploding. Luther has expressed regret over events in Swabia, and I was in Bruges when I saw the fruits of his penance. He helped raise the army used to free that city from French rule. The War of the Reformation has ended, and guilt can be assigned for it after the Reich recovers.

The Byzantines have shown no respect for civilian life, exterminating many of the largest cities in the Reich. I, for one, would hardly consider them "tolerable". Even now they march south on Acre, intending to take it and thereby control the Pope. This would be both a blasphemy and a danger to the Reich. If moral or religious reasons are not enough for you, surely the security of the Reich is a good enough reason to support the project of Outremer.

[Ramses II CP]

The War of Reformation was explicitly launched by the actions of a German who supported the Unification effort and returned to the Reich with the intent of making war on Father Luther and his disciples. History will not be lied about in these chambers! No one can force another to commit an atrocity, no more than I can force you to say such foolish things as to undermine your own cause. You do that on your own, just as the Byzantines exterminated our cities and slaughtered our citizens on their own.

Father Luther spoke the truth, revealed the Byzantine treachery, and on hearing it discussed openly the Greeks advanced their plan to destroy the Reich. It is only because of his foresight that the Reich still exists to this day.

Ask yourselves, gentlemen, what contributions have you made to the Reich, aside from slandering her supporters and applauding her butchers?

:egypt:

[flyd]

I should clarify my position. I do not care to blame either party for the war, or otherwise engage in historical discussion. What I take issue with is certain persons who bring up their own personal political and religious agendas at this time. Luther proposes that we conquer the entire Greek empire by 1500. Yes, we get it, he hates the Greeks. We've known that for a while now. What he fails to realize is that there may not even be a Reich by 1400, much less by 1500. He brings polarization into this body, when it is of critical importance that the soldiers of the Reich discuss in detail how we are to defend our homelands, which are still under great threat from all sides. I am interested in hearing that; I am not interested in hearing about how much Luther hates the Greeks.

Well, I shall retire for the night. Hopefully, tomorrow we shall have soldiers discussing important military matters.

[gibsonsg91921]

Peace, friends. A united Reich is a strong Reich.

The newcomer Lukas Godwinson is correct. Welcome to the Franconian benches.

While I am not a closet Lutheran and I believe strongly that the Greeks should be rid of in this world, we must consolidate our own borders before we make our rash vengeance.

Many years ago, I did what I felt should be done and left Franconia with the intention of sacking Constantinople with my best friend Tancred von Tyrolia. I stand by the fact that what I did was necessary, but I admit I my actions have much consequence. Hopefully in this Diet session my rashness should be repaid in the blood of our foes.

Not the blood of our friends. This next twenty years, we shall reclaim what was lost!

Our enemies will tremble at the thunder of our cavalry and the blast of our trumpets!

We shall be victorious!

And then, we will conquer the Greeks!

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

Squire Godwinson, you question the timing of the Charter Amendment proposed by myself and the Kaiser. You are not sure whether this Diet Session of 1340 is the proper moment to declare to the world that we are ready to strike back.

Why not? Clearly, the first steps to putting the Greeks in their rightful place once and for all is taking back what was once ours. After the stunning victories wrought by Bavaria in recent months, the Byzantines are now holding a defensive position in Italy.

The only way that these people would threaten the Reich's very existence now is if we let this line stand and allow them to reinforce themselves from their remaining Italian territories and Greece. Now, they are on the defensive. Why should we not begin the reconquest now?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

*nodding to the scribes*

Apologies for speaking twice in turn, but I request that on the official list of the proposed edicts and Amendments that Kaiser Elberhard's name be listed under "Proposed" for CA 14.4. He was just as much of an architect of it as I was.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter just waits as everyone is yelling and insulting each other. He waits for a quiet moment and then raises his hand. When everyone turns and stares at the young man, Dieters asks plainly,

CA 14.4 dictates that we must turn all loot from captured Byzantine settlements to the Pope.

But... what if we need the money?

[econ21]

Elberhard: Let me clarify my position on CA14.4. I do second it. Alexander Luther approached me with a draft proposing simply the conquest of Byzantium. Like Lukas Godwinson, my first reaction was dismay at the prospect of extending and amplifying the current bloody war we are experiencing. Even to this day, I confess I will not be heart broken if the proposal fails. It is, in part, to provide an outlet for the energies of our many young Electors and if they are content with a more pacific Reich, then I - as an old man - will not send them off to war.

However, you will note the extremely long deadline for this conquest. It need not interfere with the proper defence of the Reich or imply over-extending ourselves. Think on it - 1500 AD. You may almost consider it an aspiration.

I insisted on a clause banning extermination of conquered cities, otherwise we would become no better than those damnable sons of whores. Indeed, it was Byzantine extermination of our major cities that convinced me of the need to remove once and for all the threat that they pose to the Reich.

As to the requirement to donate all loot to the Papacy, that is to ensure that our new Greek subjects recognise that we act from the highest motives. We will not ransack their cities as freebooters and if some of generals are unable to restrain their men, the Reich will make full reparations to the Papacy for such dreadful acts.

OOC: CA 14.4 is partly "something to do" - a sort of glorious achievement that we can work towards for the rest of the game. If the majority of people don't want it, that's fine by me. The no loot clause is partly to stop us blitzing the AI too easily. Sacking is extraordinarily lucrative and if we restore the Reich to 30+ provinces, we will already be rolling in cash.

On another matter, I know I agreed to let the past be the past, but yet again I must challenge Fritz von Kastilien's absurd representation of history. He sees nothing, learns nothing and knows nothing. Jan von Hamburg was not crusading against Lutherans. In Swabia, Lutherans were only ever pawns in a secular struggle for power. I humbly suggest Fritz talk to his brother and fellow Lutheran Peter for a proper appreciation of the relation between Lutherism, the War of in Swabia and indeed another most grave matter that we have corresponded privately about.

The War of Reformation was an unintended byproduct of a grab for power by men who used Luther's teachings for their own ends. The late Jan von Hamburg, like myself, need make no apologies for defending the rightful Duke of Swabia - any Duke alive today would rightly expect such support from all the Diet if a rebel tried to kill them and usurp their position. When it comes to defending the Charter from overthrow by force of arms, one cannot be neutral.

Finally, I second Charter Amendment 14.3. Discussion has focussed on von Hapsburg's off the cuff opinions of the territorial coherence of Duchies, however, the amendment says nothing of that. It says that a Duke may be replaced if he loses the confidence of most of his Counts. I see some virtue in this. Consider, again, the Swabian civil war. The worst thing Hummel did was show that rebellion was possible - nay, not just possible but that a nobody could by force of arms march in and seize the Citadel of his Duke! Hopefully, Hummel's eventual fate - and that of von Dassel - will give would-be rebels pause for thought about the likely effect of rebellion on one's life expectancy. But the point remains - Electors may rebel and in rebelling gravely weaken the Reich.

CA 14.3 provides an alternative way of settling grievances. I cannot pretend that - had CA 14.3 existed - I would have forced my brother to step down in favour of Hummel or von Dassel. However, it might have provided an opportunity to intercede and perhaps reach an understanding not unlike that which Duke Arnold negotiated with Count Becker. I see CA 14.3 as strengthening the Reich, not weakening it.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter gulps before speaking after the Kaiser,

With all due respect my Kaiser, but the Reich is broke. And part of the reason why it is broke is because of the Byzantines. But they are not only our attackers, they are our neighbors. It is their settlements that are closest to some of our fronts.

A clause to demand the handover of loot hamstrings us right when we need the money most! How else are we going to get out of a deficit? I understand the spirit of the CA and see some merit in it. But why limit ourselves when we basically need to go all out?

If we are truly going to completely cut off a possible supply of money, I implore the Diet to think of some other way to make up the short-fall.

But I say lets fund our rebuilding from the coffers of our enemies. I see a certain symmetry...

But that's just my opinion sir...

Fearing he said too much too forcefully, Dieter yields the floor and heads to that new tavern he keeps hearing about.

[OverKnight]

Matthias listens to the debate in the Diet. He is pleased at the Kaiser's endorsement, and smiles when Karl Zirn speaks. When Fritz von Kastilien mentions his torture, a hand unconsciously comes up to the patch covering his ruined socket. Taking notice, Matthias puts it back down. His expression grows grim at von Hapsburg's "The age of Crusaders has passed" comment.

Rising, he addresses the Diet.

I thank those of you who have spoken in support of the proposed revisions. As for the one person who has spoken against it.

He fixes a one-eyed stare at Maximilian.

It saddens me that you were named after the patron Saint of Outremer. I ask for no more men from Europe for Outremer. If a few young nobles wish to join my cause, I cannot stop them. As for soldiers, we are capable of recruiting what we need in Acre.

I do not ask for special treatment for the Kingdom. All I ask from either candidate for Chancellor is a fighting chance. I understand that every part of the Reich faces challenges and resources are scarce. In fact in the battles I fought recently, I aimed to conserve my men, as I realize reinforcement may not come even with central authority restored.

A detailed reading of the proposed revision will reveal that Outremer is only due one army as long as it remains under three territories. After that, it would be two, the same as the Duchies receive and as the Kingdom has been granted in the past.

Matthias pauses.

Speaking of new Crusaders, I am heartened to hear that Hugo de Cervole and Dieter von Essen wish to take the Cross. But I must add my own advice to that of my friend Karl. The journey is long, the outcome is uncertain and there may not be Counties or commands waiting for you when you land. I wish to make Andreas a Count, but I cannot as long as I have only Acre. I wish to give Andreas an army, but I cannot divide our forces just yet in face of the large Greek armies. Also, with regards to Swabia, one of her noblemen is already in my service, and I do not wish to deprive the Duchy of another General in these troubled times.

I know such material things are of little concern when compared to the spiritual rewards of Crusading, but they should be considered. I would advise both of you to speak with your Dukes, consider their counsel and perhaps gain some battle experience before coming to Outremer. This is not a refusal, I will never turn away the faithful, but I do not have much to offer new arrivals just yet.

If you do come, you have my gratitude, but consider yourselves forewarned.

Matthias again pauses.

As for some of the legislation that has been proposed. I find CA 14.3 an invitation to mob rule. Each House should be able to solve any problems internally. I might reconsider if majority was changed to a super-majority of two thirds.

I agree with the spirit of CA 14.4, as I have good reason to hate the Greeks, but I find the terms of it too binding. The amendment will, in my opinion, require too much of a focus on them. The Reich has other enemies, we should leave ourselves the flexibility to deal with all of them. Also, the Church's financial standing is better than our own at this time. We will need florins to rebuild, and I believe this amendment requires too much money to go to the Pope. Again we should have flexibility in how we proceed in the future.

I will state that any lost Imperial lands I reconquer will be occupied, not exterminated or sacked. I wish to liberate Antioch and Adana, not destroy them.

Thank you my lords.

[_Tristan_]

Hugo von Holland stands and bows deeply at the Kaiser on hearing his name spoken aloud.

Mon Empereur, I thank you for your welcoming speech.

I take this opportunity to point out that I have received news from my network of agents still in that country.

Our cities there are under threat and though I long to follow in the footsteps of my templar brothers and defend Outremer, I think that my skills would be put to better use in defending the Reich from the French.

Bowing at Count Matthias Steffen, Hugo goes on.

Thus, if Count Steffen allows, I will meet him in Outremer once the French threat has been dealt with.

I know I'm not an Imperial Knight yet but I would request the command of a small force of men and lead them against the French General Roger de Mauchaut who my informers tell me is out in the open with men in his retinue. I have a personal revenge to take on that man and will in doing so further the interests of the Reich.

I eagerly wait on your authorizing such a foray on French soil.

Hugo then sits down, visibly content to have made this point.

[vpmd]

Hans von Bavaria has been silent, but now feels that he should put forth his opinion on 4.3:

With all due respect to the Kaiser, I believe 4.3 will bring chaos to the Reich. It can just as easily be a route for, say, power hungry electors and vengeful Emperors to depose a noble Duke. The bad effects outweigh the good.

I also disagree with Herr Matthias's assessment of 4.4. We will be dead and our sons will be dead, and many of their sons will be old men by the time we need to take the last Byzantine city. There is plenty of time.

[gibsonsg91921]

Lords, I have here the new arrangements for Franconia, which I shall now make public.

Three cities remain in our control - they are the capital Frankfurt, Hamburg, and Magdeburg. Frankfurt shall be under my control. Magdeburg will continue to have Dieter Bresch as her able Count. Hamburg shall be run by the hero returning from Outremer, Dieter von Kassel.

Four cities are incorporated yet not under our control. As they return under our power, Thorn shall be given to Tancred von Tyrolia, Stettin to Fritz von Kastilien, and Krakow to Lukas Godwinson. Breslau shall remain under my authority while there is no one else to govern it.

Also, as I shall now take command of the Prinz's Army, the First Franconian Household Army, known as the Prussian Army, shall be commanded by my brother Fritz von Kastilien. It shall be stationed to defend Hamburg from the north and east. The Second Franconian Household Army, or the Saxon Army, shall be commanded by Dieter Bresch. Its zone of control shall be Magdeburg and east.

With the Prinz's Army, I shall attempt to bring our borders back to our normal strength as well as assist any Duchy that is in dire need.

Thank you.

[Ramses II CP]

My Kasier I truly wish that I had the same starry eyed optimism about the pure and honest motives of the Exterminators of Rome that you have managed to find, but I see the world as it is. The Byzantines lured the Reich into a hideously unfavorable agreement by corrupting our then Kaiser, my brother. When we had entangled ourselves too deeply to escape they murdered our Emperor, my brother, your brilliant 'I have other suspects' rebuttal aside, and they kidnapped Matthias Steffen as the first steps in their plan to destroy us. Subsequently they have stolen the Reich's treasury and exterminated several German cities. The idea that they can be defended in these very chambers, even somehow held up as more pure than we, is repugnant and intolerable.

It was only the valiant and necessary actions of a few, in defiance of you and your insistence on carrying forward the mad plan of Unification, which prevented the Reich from falling, in the space of a few bare years, from the greatest nation of Europe to the lapdog of the Greeks. I myself was unable to take that action, trapped as I was by my foolishly optimistic loyalty to you, my Kaiser. Seeing the deaths of tens of thousands of my fellow Germans in the years since has washed away my stupidity. I regret to see that you have not yet been cleansed.

In any event I note that again you do not dispute the fact that Jan von Hamburg, your fellow in supporting the Unification, returned to the Reich with the sole goal of killing his fellow Germans. In that he succeeded beyond any scope he might have imagined, as well over a hundred thousand German souls fled this mortal coil at his instigation.

That he or his actions could be defended is similarly astonishing to the reverence with which you still speak of the Byzantines. Hapsburg's mindless statements can be excused as his inexperience, for yours... I will refuse to speculate out of respect for the office you hold.

Prinz Peter, your redistribution of territories appears quite ideal, however as I have conceded my failures in the governance of Stettin it may be best to assign me elsewhere. I will discuss the matter with you personally at some later date.

:egypt:

OOC: Just as an FYI, Econ, I know Fritz isn't 'right' but his version of events, setting aside OOC information, matches what a good Luthern with his knowledge would think, I believe. Plus it's much, much more fun this way. :laugh4:

[Ramses II CP]

One further note, regarding CA 14.4, if nothing else it will stand as a public declaration of our intent to redeem ourselves against our greatest foes. The time frame is so large it may well be that none of us here live to see it accomplished, so I do not believe it will affect, in any way, the funding or commission of our other wars and reclamations of territory.

:egypt:

[gibsonsg91921]

I will concede your points, Fritz, but leave Jan von Hamburg at peace. He returned to defend those loyal to the Reich, as did Elberhard and Dieter according to my assumptions. Let him rest in peace!

Those who will not rest in peace, are the Byzantines. What is in the past is over, do not cast the finger of blame any more. We are all to blame.

We shall drive them into the Black Sea! The waters will be choked with purple armor and red blood, and with their deaths prosperity shall return.

[Stuperman]

Perhaps this:

If a Byzantine held city is a former part of the Riech then the richest Greeks will have their assets siezed, and be made examples (OOC: Sacked, possible exception Rome) all other Greek cities are to be occupied with as little destruction as possible to show our moral superiority. With Possibility the same type of agreement on the French Front as well?

[Ramses II CP]

Fritz von Kastilien stands with a momentary look of pain.

I would warn electors from believing that the sack of a formerly German city can be limited to damaging only it's occupiers. This sounds quite promising and even just, but it works quite differently. I would suggest nearly the reverse, that we peacefully occupy the territories which were formerly owned and still have large German populations while sacking those cities in which the perfidious foe alone lives.

If we are to demonstrate moral superiority, however, we should, as suggested in the CA, refrain from sacking any of their cities.

:egypt:

[_Tristan_]

With Possibility the same type of agreement on the French Front as well?

Count Erlach, the French will get no quarters from me, whatever wrath I might incur in those chambers...

[Ferret]

It is good to see a change in ehaviour Fritz, I was shocked to discover the news of Stettin being sacked by yourself and it is nice to know that such atrocities will not take place again, at least by you. We do not need to take venegence on any citizens, especially not our own. War is a soldiers proffesion and they should be punished for any wrong-doings, not innocent bystanders.

[Zim]

Andreas waits for a lull in the conversation about the start of the Cataclysm, then rises and clears his throat. He has a paper in front of him, and as he talks it is obvious he is reciting a speech from it.

Excuse me, fellow Electors. I have just recently been honored with the responsibility to make a list of questions for our candidates for Chancelor. A few days hence, this list will be used to interview them, enabling the Electors to make an informed decision for who should lead the Reich. Should you have any questions in mind for one or both candidates, please inform me.

Looking nervous at what kind of reaction his speech might engender, Andreas sits down.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter is sitting in his chair rubbing his temples. It is clear he is under the weather. For what seems like an eternity, he finally speaks when he gets enough saliva in his mouth to wet it.

Now we're attempting to legislate morality? Didn't Jan von Hamburg try that once at the 1260 Diet? It didn't work then and I don't think it would work now.

No, take the sacking and exterminating clauses out of 14.4. Let us make those decisions for ourselves. Like we even need a peace of paper to demonstrate our moral superiority. Who are we trying to convince that we're superior to the Greeks? Ourselves?

In fact, take the timetable out of 14.4 as well. Wars on timetables never work out well. If we wish to legislate this war against the Greeks, lets at least do it through edicts which are more... measured.

Come to think of it, there is no real reason for 14.4... at all. None. We're already at war with the Greeks so it is really kind of redundant once you take out the hamstringing clauses.

I say that every Duke/King with Greek territories in their areas of responsibility should put forth edicts to take Greek settlements this term, if they want to. What happens to those settlements is more up to the Lords who will govern them.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

*softly chuckling*

Young von Essen, just because we are at war with a country does not mean that we automatically finish it off. Look at France, Poland, Hungary, Sicily, Egypt, and Venice. Venice especially. We've been fighting against these people since Sigismund der Stolze was Chancellor. We let 'em up after we knocked them off the Adriatic, and look what happens.

The Byzantines do not deserve this type of leniency. They must be eliminated.

[econ21]

Elberhard: But of course, Dieter von Essen - I see now you are right. We must legislate amorality! We must let our generals run freely around, exterminating at will like beasts! Damn it, man - why stay in Outremer and serve the cross? Go further east and find some of those @#$%^&!!!ing Mongols to serve. I think you would find their way of warfare more to your taste!

Note 14.4 does not require occupation, so no one will be forced to pick up chivalry points. Nor does it rule out execution of prisoners, so generals fighting Byzantines can still easily acquire dread points.

It is not a matter of requiring a piece of paper to show our moral superiority over the Byzantines. It is a matter of being moral. If we slaughter civilians - unarmed men, women and children - then we are are committing a crime so foul, where we stand in relation to the Byzantines, the Mongols or anyone else is irrelevant. We are going to hell, whether alone or in their company.

Jan von Hamburg only failed in 1260 because the flower of chivalry was waning in the Reich. I had hoped that the blood and chaos of the cataclysm might bring us back on a more righteous and ordered path. Luther and I reached an accommodation that we believed could satisfy both those like him who earnestly desire the anhilation of Byzantim and those like myself who are keen that we observe the most minimum standard of decency. If we all wish to run off like wolves, and fight our own little wars, then we are not a united Reich that aspires to lead Christiandom. We are just a gaggle of self-serving warlords.

As for Fritz's absurd statement that Jan von Hamburg came back to the Reich because he wanted to kill Germans, Jan came back to uphold the rule of law. Suppose villains comes into your neighbour's house and try to kill him, to steal his possessions. Would you do your duty and come to your neighbour's aid? If yes, then beware! For Fritz von Kastilien would accuse you of just wanting to kill Germans! Jan started no war. War was started by Hummel and then by Dietrich. Jan marched only to defend the rightful Duke of Swabia.

And for all his attempted re-invention of history, Fritz also knows that the war with Byzantium was started by the sack of Constantinople - painful as admitting that culpability may be to many here. Much easier to forget about history, to blame outside "corruption", to defame the dead, even to malign our own Kaisers than to accept that we too are not without sin.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter comes back into the Diet just in time to feel the stinging rebuke from the Kaiser.

My Kaiser, I fear you misunderstand me. I am not the sort to exterminate. I do however sometimes see the necessity to sack. We need money. And to sign something that "mandates" that we give up money we need seems unwise.

But I also hesitate at telling others what to do. I rather try to lead by example. I follow the chivalrous path because it feels right and I serve the Lord. Others may feel differently. Who am I to tell them what to do? I will live my life the best I can. If someone happens to draw inspiration out of that, that is great.

But I fear we get in trouble when we dictate through laws what people can and can not do.

With all due respect, I think you are too used to arguing with your political opponents. Not everyone who disagrees with you is automatically a butcher.

I don't have to prove my morality to you or anyone by signing a piece of paper. I've earned it through my actions on the battlefield! (OOC: has fair-in-rule trait)

Fearing going too far, Dieter sits.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

Essen, do you want the Byzantines gone or not?

[Privateerkev]

Of course I do. But I rather leave tactical and strategic decisions to the men on the ground. The Dukes and King have a better view of their corner of the war and can make decisions that are right for their situation. Trust in them to put forth edicts that will dictate measured and appropriate moves that fit with our available resources.

I'm a soldier and an officer. I know first hand that war is better fought by giving a measure of initiative to your local commanders. Study the Austrian front and what has gone on there for the last few years and you will see a good example. Duke Arnold was given command of the area, he delegated to local lords, who then delegated farther down. Central decisions were made from up high but they took local considerations into account.

Your CA threatens that. It basically legislates war with no flexibility. Just let us fight the war and support edicts that direct us towards recapturing territory.

If you are so concerned with the Reich fighting the Byzantines Father Luther, I suggest you join the army and help us fight them!

Dieter pounds the table to make his point.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

Do not lecture me on how to fight a war. I have seen as many campaigns drawn up as you. All that this CA does is say that Byzantium must cease to exist by 1500. That's it.

If you want to see things done in detail, then I suggest you use your personal Edict and actually do something about it.

[Privateerkev]

Oh and how much actual fighting have you done Father Luther?

Dieter points at his scar.

Unlike you, I have actually been fighting for the Reich. Like all of the other nobles here. Your just a spectator.

Hell, rumor has it that you ran like a scared little girl from Bern.

Speaking of Bern, how many Byzantines were there anyways? Oh wait, there weren't any!

You were too busy preaching war against Catholics to be bothered fighting the Orthodox.

So don't come in here and lecture soldiers how to fight a war. I'm only 16 and I've fought more war than you've watched from the sidelines.

As for my edict, I will not use it for such a thing. It is Duke Arnold's decision on what settlements get taken in Austria and it is only proper that such a decision be left to him, since he is Duke of that realm. When he returns, he will tell us what we are retaking and when. If he needs my edict to support his strategy, then I will gladly give it.

The same for Outremer. King Matthias is in a far better position to know what settlements to take back than I am. I would not dare to be so presumptuous in second-guessing him.

So Father Luther, sit back, and watch the proceedings. Soon you'll be gone and we can go about the business of actually governing without having to worry about our proceedings being colored by your religious fanaticism.

[econ21]

Elberhard: Essen, it is you who misunderstand me. I have not called you a butcher or chastised you for wanting to exterminate anyone. I am criticising your absurd view that laws should not tell people what they should or should not do. What the @#$%^&!!! else does a law do?

What would your laws look like?

Thou shalt not murder.

Well, ok, if you really want to, I guess that would be fine.

But I really, really hope you don't and instead are inspired by the radiant light that shines out of my arse!

YOU may not tell people what to do. But the Diet does. Our armies are OUR armies. They are not those of the generals who happen to command them. If they slaughter and rape, then the Reich slaughters and rapes. And we, the Diet, bear full moral responsibility for what is done by our soldiers, in our name and with our florins.

And for @#$%^&!!!s sake stop taking about pieces of paper that prove morality or I am going to have to add them to my copies of Fritz's proclamation in the smallest room of the Diet. We are talking about Edicts and Charter Amendments here, not pieces of paper. If you dismiss them as mere pieces of paper, then go back to the Tavern and leave the legislation to men who respect it for the sacred authority it embodies!

Oh, @#$%^&!!! it. I am through with this. I am off to the Tavern myself.

[Privateerkev]

Satisfied that he just gave the uppity priest a whumpin, Dieter realized that arguing with the Kaiser would be pointless.

You hear Dieter muttering something about "well he can just shove his pieces of paper up his arse then..."as he heads to the tavern.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

How fascinating. I am lectured by an uneducated little brat that thinks just because he can use a sword that his opinion is infinitely more valuable than a man whose life has been devoted to studying God and trying to do what he thinks is right.

Do not trivialize the Greeks. They are filthy traitors who would stab their own mothers in the back if they could get some more money about it. Every last declaration, proclamation, Edict, Amendment, and person that professes their eventual downfall will help us win this most righteous of wars.

[Ramses II CP]

My Kaiser I presume we are all to be thankful that you do not possess the same sense of justice you credit to von Hamburg, else Luther and Peter would be at the point of your sword and the Reich would once again be burning from end to end. Impugn Dietrich von Dassel all you like, but at a time when every warrior in the Reich was needed against our enemies two men raised armies and attacked a German who was keeping the peace inside a German city. As a direct result of that action over a hundred thousand citizens of the Reich died. You may wish to play favorites on which side is to blame, you may even attempt to dodge any blame yourself, but history is not so kind.

Furthermore the assassination of our Kaiser by the Byzantines clearly presaged the necessary sack of Constantinople. If the Byzantines had not been disorganized by that strike then surely every city in the Reich would have already gotten the same treatment they gave Rome.

You show loyalty to your friends, Elberhard, but you show little else. Jan, Dietrich, and Hummel are suffering the judgement of history. Father Luther has stood up like a man and accepted the consequences of his actions, as have I, as has Peter. I have yet to see that courage out of you.

That being said, it wearies me to incessantly dispute your fawning worship of the man who slew more Germans than even the Greeks have. I have more important things to discuss, and so I will leave the matter lying in the gutter you drug it down into.

:egypt:

[Zim]

Andreas stands to address the Diet.

Fellow Electors, I would like to propose my Edict for this session. As many of you know, the shape of Outremer has been permanantly changed. I do not mean by Byzantine conquests, for those will soon be reversed. I mean by the gifting of two of it's old settlements, Allepo and Damascus, to our English allies. They were given in good faith, and I doubt any of us would like to take them back from allies loyal to us through all our recent troubles.

As such, I wish to propose Edict 14.1.

Edict 14.1 The city of Nikosia will be conquered by the Reich.

Given the permanant gift of two Outremer settlements to England, we will eventually need to take two more to bring Outremer to it's original plan of six settlements. I think Nikosia is a perfect replacement for one of the two settlements.

As an Island, Nikosia is relatively safe from Greek attack. As a Castle it will be able to supply troops for the protection of Outremer. Better yet, it is in a perfect position to attack by see the Greeks in Anatolia, land forces on the Levant to defend other Outremer settlements (including the English ones), or even strike at Egypt on the odd chance they threaten the Pope at Jerusalem.

I know that at this point it seems unlikely that Outremer will agian be on the advance, but this is only temporary. Through the expert leadership of King Matthias Outremer will eventually reach it's old size. I would like Nikosia to be one of it's two new settlements.

Thank you for listening.

Andreas sits back down.

[OverKnight]

Matthias speaks.

I will second Edict 14.1.

Cyprus would be a very useful addition to Outremer. During the Cataclysm there was talk of falling back there when the Kaiser left. It would serve us well, as a source of reinforcement or, God forbid, a final redoubt.

The proximity of the island to Acre, and God willing, Antioch and Adana, would allow a small fleet to shuttle over a large army in multiple trips.

[_Tristan_]

Hugo stands, his red-cross tabard all-cleaned up from te dust of his travels

I second Edict 14.1.

Having fought in the Levant before, I can assure you that holding Cyprus is a stepping stone to acquiring many more territories.

It provides a training ground, helps our men get used to the warm climate, and can serve as a naval base for controling the waters of the Eastern Mediterranean Sea.

It is truly the naval lock of that region.

Nodding to Matthias Steffen and Andreas von Salzgitter, Hugo sits back down.

[gibsonsg91921]

I too second Edict 14.1.

edit: blast, tristan beat me.

[AussieGiant]

Reading a parchment while entering the Diet Chamber, the Duke is now in his usual attire of complete Obsidian Full Plate Armour.

Once having completely read through the note he looks up...frowns at the still destroyed desk of the Imperial scribe.

With a clear look of disgust he scans the attending servants and spy's the pageboy he had flipped the coin to some days ago...

...his black steel encased finger points at the young man and then directly in front of Duke present position.

It's clear what is about to happen.

After a few quiet words to a sheet white pageboy, he dutifully sprints from the Chamber.

I see there has been a few "issues" raised while I've been away. Would anyone care to ask me a direct question...

moving to take a seat the Dread Duke makes clear eye contact with Dieter Bresch before taking a seat.

[Ferret]

OOC: lol Dieter and Arnold are both in two places at the same time, never mind :clown:

Dieter returns the stare with no sign of emotion at all.

It is good to see you have returned, mein Duke

the last two words were said patronisingly

The new crusader, Andreas, is collecting a list of questions from all the electors to produce to Fritz. Oh, and I believe you may be contemplating running for Chancellor as well? In that case you may be asked a few questions though I do not know if you will be taken seriously.

[AussieGiant]

OOC: I just got back so it's a little strange being in the Tavern and here :laugh4:


Taking stock of Dieter's comments the Duke continues to lean back in his chair.

Bresch, I'm not sure why you're deliberately trying to goad me but you're certainly doing a bad job of it, by asking some of the stupidest £$%ing questions I've heard in a long time.

Paraphrasing Dieter

"You believe I maybe contemplating running for Chancellor?"

Shaking his head at the question the Duke leans over to Grom and a few of his retinue to pass a comment privately between then. The boisterous laughter clearly indicates a joke of some humor was made at someone's expense.

[Ferret]

That choice of words seemed to be the only ones suited to represent you indecisiveness that I have seen. I am not trying to goad you, merely speaking my mind.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Well your mind seems to be on another plane of existence Bresch, because the last thing anyone's called me in my life is indecisive.

Would you like to pick a specific issue to argue about, or simply exchange insults?

I don't mind either way, although I warn you, I've been practicing on Venetian diplomats all day so I'm in fine form!!

[Ferret]

How about the issue of Prague, I will be interested to know what really happened behind the scenes. Did you not plan to attack the Bohemians at first? Then realising your lack of forces you let Becker lay out the terms, quite the change in attitude don't you think?

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Bresch, I certain someone is putting you up to this because you're making no sense.

First you admit you have no idea what happened in Prague and then you go and make up some half assed accusation about a change in my attitude.

What change in my attitude are you referring to exactly?

And for the record, it was immediately apparent to me that I had no military options at all when Becker announced his separation.

Christ, Lord Becker has come out personally and made his own statement on the matter Bresch!!

So if you have some pent up frustrations then I can recommend a house across the road full of "ladies of the night", and they have amazing skills that will have you sleeping like a baby all night.

[Ferret]

According to the late Duke Ansehelm you had made plans with him to attack Becker, but those were stopped after his tragic death. I am merely curious on the matter as the whole truth was never revealed to me.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

I can personally confirm that military and diplomatic options were discussed in parallel at the early stages of the dispute.

However I'm afraid that until Lord Becker gives consent for me to speak of the matter in public then the agreement is a private affair between myself and a noble of my house.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter von Essen returns to the Diet. He gives a respectful head-nod to Duke Arnold before taking his seat. He reads up on the record of what has been spoken of before speaking.

Edict 14.1 already has the appropriate seconders, but I wholly support it.

It is my hope to see Outremer rebuilt. If possible, with Damascus to be included in that final configuration. But with Damascus being held by our allies, that is more a long term wish than any sort of practical short term strategy. So, we need to go with what is possible now or soon. Cyprus seems like it would be a fine addition.

As for the other matters discussed since my departure, can we possibly keep the unwarranted personal attacks to a minimum?

Dieter stares at Dieter Bresch when he says the last sentence.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

As I'm a candidate for Chancellor I'll make my thoughts known on the current legislation.

I certainly support CA's 14.1 and 14.2.

14.3...well how about this for my opinion...

CA 14.xxx The Dukes are granted authority to strip an Emperor of his Empire if a majority of elector in the Reich agree.

Sounds fair and reasonable to me!!!

I have no idea what Hapsburg was thinking when he came up with this but it's ill conceived in my view!!

14.4 is similar to something the late Jan von Hamburg attempts to pass and the same thing I said then applies to now.

Every General has direct responsibility of the Army he is assigned.

The consequences of his actions directly affects him, therefore it's his choice to determine at that time, in that place against that particular enemy what the choice shall be. I've never exterminated any city, but I respect any general's authority to do as he sees fit. If some people have issues then they should lobby hard to determine a particular nobles attitude on the subject before giving them command of one of the House Armies.

I will not support 14.4

Edict 14.1 I support.

[gibsonsg91921]

I have an edict to propose.

Edict 14.2 - When and if Franconia has no provinces under siege and both Household Armies are not needed to fight a battle, the either the Prussian Army or the Saxon Army is authorized to conquer Arhus.

I apologize for the complexity of this edict, but it is necessary to ensure that we are safe before we strike territories not part of the Reich. The Prinz's Army and one of the Household Armies can suffice for the reclamation of any territories in Franconia, and taking Arhus will drive the Danes of the mainland and secure a border.

[Stuperman]

I would like to second Edict 14.1 and 14.2. As for the charter ammendments, some are less well thought out than others.

[gibsonsg91921]

I would vote for CA 14.4 except that it is too binding and prevents reevaluation in the face of any changes in our economy.

[OverKnight]

Matthias, ducking back in, ponders a bit and speaks.

It would serve Franconia well to push the Danes across the Baltic. A few ships posted at the narrows would serve to prevent them from crossing back, leaving the Duchy with one fewer front.

I will second Edict 14.2.

[Ramses II CP]

Indeed, my noble friends, Hamburg even now stands under grave threat by two Danish armies posted just north of our border there. If we could close that avenue of attack by capturing Arhus then not only would the Danes have a long and difficult march to reach us, their ships would be subject to interdiction by the fleets our of mighty English allies.

At the moment I am quite concerned about Hamburg. One of the armies there is reportedly comprised of highly motivated and experienced men, perhaps their new Prince's Honor Guard, or even their King's men. Additionally I cannot march far enough to reach Hamburg (OOC: %^$^ negative trait!) and hold the walls.

This just serves to emphasize the importance of securing Franconia's northern flank so that we can concentrate on reclaiming lost territory.

Edict 14.2 does not need my second, but I provide it anyway, and beg your support for it.

:egypt:

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

After reading through the field reports across the Reich and Outremer, then I have to say the entire tactical situation is a "£%£"ing dogs breakfast at the moment!!

If even one general is defeated at this time it would greatly affect the entire defense of the Reich.

[Zim]

Andreas stands and clears his throat.

Duke Arnold and Count Fritz von Kastilien,
I have been charged with assembling questions from the Electors about your goals and qualifications for the position of Chancellor. It is your choice whether or not to answer any or all of them, but as these represent the concerns of the Electors it may be advisable to do so.

Without further ado:

1. What was the candidate's greatest achievement?

2. What was the candidate's worst mistake?

3. Will the candidate if he is to become chancellor commit to the retaking of a Duchy's former settlements even without an edict? What territorial objectives does the Chancellor set for their term?

4. Do you have any plans to heal the religious rifts in the Reich from the War of the Reformation?

5. Out of our current enemies, which would you prefer to seek peace with, and which destroy?

6. Which front would the Chancellor personally like to campaign on?

7. Would Imperial armies be committed to any other fronts?

8. Which field armies or fronts are in most urgent need of reinforcement?

9. As Chancellor, what would be your strategy in Outremer? How would you fight the Greeks and restore the Kingdom?

10. Would the Chancellor prioritize recruitment or building? What kinds of buildings would the Chancellor be more inclined to authorize?

11. How will the candidate treat those who did note vote him differently from those who did?

12. Why is does the candidate think he is better qualified than his rival?

[deguerra]

Ludwig rises

I would like to add one brief inofficial question:

What is the candiates position on and intentions for Antwerp?

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg calls out.

Antwerp is the possession of the Kaiser. The Chancellor has no control over it.

[deguerra]

Ludwig gives von Habsburg and icy glare

IF Sir von Hamburg were patient enough to read papers submitted to him (OOC the chancellor reports thread) he would realize that the emperor, in his wisdom, has just given the chancellors control over building order, and that is what I was interested in.

[Ramses II CP]

1. What was the candidate's greatest achievement?

For all my victories in the field I believe that my greatest achievement remains in my future. Perhaps it will be on the day when I finally stand face to face with my brother's killers.

2. What was the candidate's worst mistake?

Stettin. Need I elucidate?

3. Will the candidate, if he is to become chancellor, commit to the retaking of a Duchy's former settlements even without an edict? What territorial objectives does the Chancellor set for their term?

Edicts are merely politics. I will not permit their existence or lack thereof to obstruct our commanders in the field. I will negotiate closely with the Dukes and their subjects to gain a real world, ground understanding of the strategic and tactical considerations on each front. Where possible the Reich will advance, where necessary we will hold the line.

4. Do you have any plans to heal the religious rifts in the Reich from the War of the Reformation?

In part I have addressed this already with my Proclamation. There is no longer any need for a rift. Unification has been convincingly renounced by every noble of consequence in the Reich.

5. Out of our current enemies, which would you prefer to seek peace with, and which destroy?

I do not believe we need to actively seek peace with any of our enemies, however, if there were a strategic benefit to signing a ceasefire I would certainly attempt to take advantage of it. Glancing briefly at the map I can see benefits to at least temporary ceasefires with the Venetians and Sicilians, as their borders with us are small or on the sea and the potential trade benefits are significant. That being said, if the Dukes on those fronts do not wish peace it will not be forced upon them.

6. Which front would the Chancellor personally like to campaign on?

It is no secret that I mean to personally capture Arhus from the Danes. After that flank of Franconia is secure I will go whither my Duke sends me.

7. Would Imperial armies be committed to any other fronts?

Imperial armies would primarily be used for defense and reinforcement. I would consider them a forward reserve, so far as possible.

8. Which field armies or fronts are in most urgent need of reinforcement?

Outremer is in obvious need of reinforcement; they are facing immense pressure with only the resources of a single county to draw on. Next I would say Swabia is clearly in a troubling state, and the French pressure there is the greatest threat to the heart of the Reich. Second to that I would place Austria as they appear to be in danger of having Zagreb and Ragusa pinched off from the Empire. Next Franconia, where all that is left to defend is the heart of the Duchy, and then Bavaria has the best defensive options with the steep terrain and narrow passes but they are also under heavy pressure.

9. As Chancellor, what would be your strategy in Outremer? How would you fight the Greeks and restore the Kingdom?

I would need more close discussions with King Steffen, but it would appear to me that the Byzantines have their armies heavily concentrated at the front, and for the time being a defensive posture is logically best. The day will not be too long in coming when we can reclaim our lost holdings, and expand into Byzantine territory.

10. Would the Chancellor prioritize recruitment or building? What kinds of buildings would the Chancellor be more inclined to authorize?

In a time of often desperate defense, recruitment must be a priority. With that in mind, however, economic advancement feeds recruitment and will require the construction of some economic buildings as well as military structures. I will attempt to authorize whatever the Dukes and Counts wish, but where it is not possible I will endeavor to take the long view on buildings and the short view on recruitment.

11. How will the candidate treat those who did note vote him differently from those who did?

This question is insulting in the extreme, and I am disappointed that you would ask it Sir Andreas. It is meaningless to me whether or not a man chose me over Duke Arnold. I am here to serve, and if I am not chosen to serve then I will bow my head to the will of the majority.

12. Why does the candidate think he is better qualified than his rival?

I have answered this question in detail in my opening speech. To be brief, I have a broader base of experience in diplomatic matters and a similar level of command experience. Duke Arnold would make a fine Chancellor, but as the Reich has suffered, so have I. As the Reich has erred, so have I. And as the Reich will redeem itself, so will I.

:egypt:

[Zim]

Andreas looks up upon hearing Fritz's anger over one of te questions.

I meant no insult, Count von Kastilien. That particular question was not written by me, but by another Elector who insisted on remaining anonymous.

[deguerra]

Ludwig rises and bows respectfully to Fritz

Graf von Kastilien,

I hate to be intrusive, but could you also answer my question regarding Antwerp?

It is a topic rather dear to my heart

[Ramses II CP]

Of course Count von Bohmen, it seems clear to me that Antwerp must be incorporated into the Reich and the House of Swabia in all haste. Additionally the city has great potential for trade in a time when the economy is of crucial importance. I suspect Antwerp will become, like Hamburg, a great northern center for the Reich's trade goods and, in due time, a mighty port.

:egypt:

[deguerra]

Thankyou kindly for answering. I realize it is not a major issue like many of those being discussed, but to us Swabians, and my Flemish subjects it is obviously an issue of some importance. thankyou again for your consideration

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza rises hastily, so he ask his own question.

Both Chancellors, what would your intentions be with Swabia? We only have some four cities left with us, two of which are under heavy siege. Would you listen to our proposals of attack, proposals from ALL of Swabian Electors? How would you help?

Duke von Salza sits, and watches the two candiaties, and strangely, the Bavarian bench.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter stands up,

Gentlemen,

Let me take this opportunity to give my full endorsement to Duke Arnold for Chancellor.

He has my complete confidence in leading us towards recovery.

Dieter sits

[deguerra]

the Swabian bench hears Ludwig mutter sarcastically

Oh well young Dietrich supports Arnold. Thats a huge weight off everyone's minds.

somewhat OOC: :clown:

[Privateerkev]

Oh well young Dietrich supports Arnold. Thats a huge weight off everyone's minds.

Dietrich supports Duke Arnold too? Well that is good to hear. The problem is, the only Dietrich that has been around lately is Dietrich von Dassel and he is dead. Unless you mean Dietrich von Saxony. But he's been dead for years.

Yes, even the dead support Duke Arnold!

Somewhat more OOC than deguerra: :clown:

[deguerra]

damn, I try to make a snarky remark and fail. I suppose it is possible IC that Ludwig would not know Dieters name :D IN any case, Kev, I meant no insult, I am merely amused at young Dieters outspoken nature

[Privateerkev]

OOC: No insult taken. :D I have learned the hard way to check my spelling. I have been lambasted for how Jan spelled Elberhard wrong before. I have learned that mistakes in grammar, spelling, and province names are fair game. :2thumbsup:

[flyd]

The dead can support whomever they want, as long as we don't count their votes.

[Zim]

Andreas turns to Ludwig

Count Bohmen, there is no need to insult the young man by getting his name wrong. Youths often make such solemn pronouncements quite seriously, without thinking of how they sound to older ears.

Herr von Essen, I commend you for making a stand so early in the competition. I myself prefer to wait until both candidates have their say regarding the questions, but I fully understand you supporting your Duke

It wasn't a mistake, obviously von Bohmen did it on purpose to add to the insult..ok, maybe it was a mistake. :clown:

[deguerra]

I meant no offense, Andreas, and I do apologise for getting his name slightly wrong.

I am just of the opinion that the Diet floor is for debates, and that especially junior members ought to speak only when it is of utmost importance.

On that note, I will now be silent

[Zim]

Andreas smiles for what seems to be the first time when actually inside the Council Chamber.

In that case, if there is no debate going on here, and we junior members have nothing of importance to say, I think a few drinks at the tavern are in order. I'd like to hear the story of how you eluded our illustrious Duke, and how Jan freed my city, if you don't mind.

Herr Dieter, you are welcome to join us if you'd wish.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter nods to Andreas.

I'll join you when I finish explaining something.

Count Bohmen,

My support for Duke Arnold is because I do not approve of Sir Fritz's revisionist history.

He keeps wanting to heap blame for the War of Reformation solely on Jan von Hamburg, who I hear the Church has recently made a Saint.

I remember being with my family in Zagreb. I saw flyers from both Saint Jan and Father Luther. And you know what? They basically said the same thing. Just switch the names around and they were proclaiming the exact same thing. Saint Jan called for war on Lutherans. Father Luther called for war on Catholics.

I can only conclude that the War of Reformation was caused by both Saint Jan and Father Luther. But, since only one of them died, the other's supporters can attempt to rewrite history without the victim being able to defend himself.

Also, with regards to the death of Kaiser Siegfried, Sir Fritz is claiming something quite dubious. He claims Kaiser Siegfried was killed by the Byzantines. But Diet records clearly show that Duke Lothar's investigation found the real killers. It was Milanese money funding disgruntled Assassin Guild members.

Therefore, I choose Duke Arnold as my candidate for Chancellor.

I now hope that my post has become substantial enough for Count Bohmen's approval. I wish him well in his self-appointed role as "Diet police".

Now I'm off to the tavern where nothing need be important!

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza stands, glaring at the young Dieter von Essen.

I do not recall the continued efforts of this blaming you refer to. I am sure if we Lutherens had our own religious capital, Father Luther would be a saint as well. Unfortunely, the Pope is Catholic.

I call for another investigation into the late Kaiser's death, seeing as Duke Lothar was not, somewhat, trustworthy at the time...

Duke von Salza mutters to his fellow Swabians

and maybe he is still not...

He raises his voice

But I think the investigation was riddled with problems, and was followed hortly afterwards by the time of troubles. If we investgate again, perhaps more into this Milanese Guild, we can find certian people behind it.

Duke von Salza nods to the DIet at large, and then leaves the Diet for a drink.

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg stands to his feet and with great restraint begins to address the Diet.

In these troubled times, only Duke Arnold has the abilty and the sheer force of personality to whip the Reich's enemies into line. His very name causes the Hungarians and Venetians to quiver with fear, and he has prevented the enemy from penetrating to the heart of the Reich.

Von Kastilien, however, has appeared to change his tone to suit whoever's in power. His affair at Stettin was most disgraceful, and the way he carried himself during the last 10 years, as a pirate he brought shame to his family and to Franconia.

May I also remind the Diet that the Austrian Duke has been tirelessly labouring away for many decades, and has the experience to guide the Reich in a sound direction.

To the gullible Swabian electors. May I remind you yet again, that the Kaiser alone grants Imperial settlements to Houses, not the Chancellor. Von Kastilien's promise to hand Antwerp to Swabia is hollow.

Von Hapsburg resumes his seat.

[deguerra]

what Graf von Kastilien promises is between him and his concience. What I asked about is what he intended to to with Antwerp short-term (OOC: building orders etc) which our illustrious Kaiser has made the durisdiction of the chancellor.

Perhaps young von Hapsburg would be so kind as to think and read before opening his young mouth so wide the next time.

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza enters in time to hear von Hapsburg's words, and stands after Ludwig speaks.

I am in agreement with Count von Bohmen's words.

von Hapsburg, I am sure Duke Arnold does not need you as a lapdog speaking out more useless words of propaganda. I shall choose not to hear your just spoken words, and hope you shall speak later on wih dignity.

I am aware Duke Arnold has not spoken yet, come now, have you no reply to questions raised and the likes? Or are you letting lapdogs speak your words?
as spoken by von Hapsburg, do you care of the Reich's happenings? We hold Antwerp in great esteem, but here come your supporters and are taking votes from many electors in Swabia.

Duke von Salza glares at von Hapsburg, and then sits and nods to Count von Bohmen.

[Zim]

Andreas eyes von Hapsburg with the kind of look one might give a frog with two heads, conveying equal parts curiosity and distaste.

Herr von Hapsburg, what is this strange obsession you have with the status of Antwerp? Count von Kastilien said it was clear to him that Antwerp must be incorporated into Swabia. He did not say that doing such is in his power, or promise to do so.

At most I might expect a Franconian to worry about Antwerp, as it borders their House as well, but an Austrian? It is far from your homeland, and is the Kaiser's to do with as he pleases, not yours. Yet you argue with and insult members of the Diet senior to you, with more experience and holding high titles. Your unusual concern for the city perplexes me.

[AussieGiant]

Duke Arnold is handed the list of questions by his Priest, who whispers something into his ear. Frowning at the words being spoken he finally looks back at his Priest, who immediately takes a step back and resumes his seat.

Standing to address the chamber the Duke is clearly more annoyed at this line of questioning than he is letting on. Glancing back at his Priest for one last moment the Duke begins.

As von Kastilien has already answered these questions some of my responses will be rather similar. Some on the other hand wont be.

1. What was the candidate's greatest achievement?

To date I would have to say my ability to avoid getting married. Having seen some of my poor colleagues being brow beaten I've come to the conclusion that in the great scheme of things it has certainly been a boon rather than a curse.

There's an audible groan from a few of the Duke's retinue in the Austrian benches. Grom can be clearly seen chuckling to himself and even the Dread Knight Bane's body language indicates he is amused by the response.

2. What was the candidate's worst mistake?

There was a young serving girl in Ragusa...NOW she was a mistake...whiny, needy, she never gave me a moments peace.

At this line there is a loud and raucous laughter from the Duke's entire retinue save the Priest who can only look on in horror at what the Duke is saying.

3. Will the candidate if he is to become chancellor commit to the retaking of a Duchy's former settlements even without an edict? What territorial objectives does the Chancellor set for their term?

I don't believe there is any need for edicts to retake provinces that were once ours. The process of edicts and charter amendments is for those provinces that were not previously part of the Greater Reich in its former days.

Turning to a number of lawyers the Duke raises an eyebrow in question?

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

As for expansion...at this time it would be pure operational suicide to outline specifics. Targets of opportunity would be taken as long as it didn't jeopardize our current holdings.

4. Do you have any plans to heal the religious rifts in the Reich from the War of the Reformation?

There is no plan because in my mind it's over. I stated that in my speech and it doesn't change now. I will not work with or support any further attempt to address this topic. What has clearly been seen from this event is that Religion needs to be separated from the secular powers that govern this Reich. Neither side tried to calm the population and both sides inflamed the situation to tragic levels...in my view there is blood on both sides.

5. Out of our current enemies, which would you prefer to seek peace with, and which destroy?

If I'm elected I will certainly sound out all current enemies and see if terms can be reached. This could allow a diplomatic solution to a few of our more pressing military fronts. I hold little hope however as having already spoken to the Venetian's, they are supremely confident of continuing their attacks on us...even though it maybe over the dead bodies of some 10 000 troops I have personally overseen the death of.

6. Which front would the Chancellor personally like to campaign on?

Clearly I'll be located in Austria for the foreseeable future.

7. Would Imperial armies be committed to any other fronts?

This is something I've already discussed with the Kaiser. There are a number of army units that currently fall outside the legal framework we have. I will certainly not be disbanding these immediately but be looking to reconstitute them with the current authorised forces. Those that can't will be classified at “Imperial Troops” and be directly controlled by the Office of the Chancellor.

Clearly the Kaiser will be assisting Bavaria and Prince Peter's Army will be in Franconia...therefore Swabia and Austria will be compensate for the time being as all fronts are hard pressed.

8. Which field armies or fronts are in most urgent need of reinforcement?

ALL!! I'm not going to place any priority at this time. I'll listen to everyone's thoughts and make the tough choices myself.

9. As Chancellor, what would be your strategy in Outremer? How would you fight the Greeks and restore the Kingdom?

The strategy is similar to here in the Homelands. Reinforce as best as possible, fight defensively as a default tactic and counter punch when the opportunity presents itself. Matthias is perfect for the job. As for the Kingdom as a whole...then I'll quote my Father...”Outremer will be created one province at a time”.

10. Would the Chancellor prioritize recruitment or building? What kinds of buildings would the Chancellor be more inclined to authorize?

Recruiting is the first priority, once forces have been brought back up to fighting levels then the economy must be repaired. This is not a hard and fast process and it will be a delicate balancing act in the initial stages. Weighting will be given to troops and then slowly transitioned to more pure economic activities.

11. How will the candidate treat those who did note vote him differently from those who did?

I'll buy horses for everyone who voted for me and flowers for those who didn't!! Seems fair to me.

The Duke's Priest is clearly incredulous to some of the answers being given.

12. Why is does the candidate think he is better qualified than his rival?

Because Fritz doesn't like to drink and has never even bought me a drink. You simply can't trust a man who doesn't even have the decency to buy others a drink

[_Tristan_]

Hugo de Cervole stands and adresses the whole Diet.

Mes Seigneurs, you might see me as a French renegade, untrustworthy and out of place.

But, I've made my choice, France is forfeit to me and I stand here in these halls on the invitation of the Kaiser.

So let me tell you that all the name-calling and bickering I see among you does not bode well for the future of the Empire and its rebuilding.

Swabia is almost lost, our cities under siege by my former countrymen and still, you fight among you like dogs in a pen.

Now is the time for unity not for hard feelings and old feuds...

I say this also to the new Electors, stand down from your posing as old-time politicians... You are new to this game, as I am and I think it would be good for us to remain in the background and not speak our minds too openly for fear of resparkling those same old feuds.

That said, I will now stand down and hope my advice will find some grace in your hearts and minds.

Hugo then sits back down, looking disappointed with his fellow Electors.

[AussieGiant]

Seigneur de Cervole,

Your words ring true but alas I do not think there will be too many moments of peace here in the Diet.

It is what it is and we have traditionally be a fractious lot.

Swabia is in deep trouble and I fear we may lose two cities in the next few years.

[Zim]

Herr de Cervole,
I apologize if it seems like I have engaged in petty bickering. I see the wisdom of spending my first Diet listening rather than talking. However, it seems to me as if Herr von Hapsburg has gone out of his way to antagonize several other Electors, many in my own House. I truly regard his inclination to pick fights over things people did not even truly say about a city very far from his own lands. By confronting him directly I hope the issue will be settled and the older, wiser heads of the Diet be undistracted by the bickering of young men. It may be a vain hope, but I felt I had to try.

Andreas returns to his seat in the Outremer section.

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg is clearly not amused as he rises to speak.

A lapdog, Duke Athawolf? Hah! We Hapsburgs are nobody's lapdog. I chose to take service with the Austrian Duke because I am bored of managing mein estates in Styria, and because even I am alarmed about the state of the Reich at this current time.

As for young Salzgitter, I would concern yourself about the Levant; I warrant the Greeks will soon allow you no respite for your thoughts to dwell on your homeland.

Von Hapsburg resumes his seat.

[_Tristan_]

Hugo de Cervole stands again, bowing to Duke Arnold.

Duke Arnold, fractious lot you may be but unity should be the order of the day, sorry if I repeat myself.

The Empire was almost on the brink of disappearance and might still be if we continue like this. This whole electoral process does nothing to reconcile the different factions within the Reich.

Turning to Andreas von Salzgitter, he adds.

Andreas, mon ami, I'm not one to give lessons, speak your mind if you think it is worth it but do not let yourself be drawn into petty quarrels by persons who should know better.

The best way of dealing with the insults of some is simply to ignore them. Indifference and comtempt is worse than hatred.

[Zim]

Andreas begins chuckling to himself.

While I thank you for the compliment, Herr von Hapsburg, I am not sure a man ten years my junior and not yet knighted should call me young, all the while dodging a serious question asked of him.

He then turns to Hugo.

Sir, I believe you are correct. Conversing with Herr von Hapsburg does not enlighten me and amuses me only insofar as his answers have absolutely nothing to do with the subject being discussed. Moreover, he is not of a station that would require my answering him out of politeness. I shall take your advice and keep quiet, and listen to the more experienced members of the Diet.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Gentlemen,

You may bicker away until your hearts content. If that is what you wish to do then so be it. Every Duke here has seen more than his fair share of internal conflict...if anyone was to step too far out of line then back room comments would be made a pressure brought to bare that would end the issues...

...I'm more than happy to see the younger generation getting their feet wet, those that perform and do well will naturally rise to the top of at least the Ducal levels. They aren't hereditary unlike some positions.

On a serious note I do need to address the Kaiser.

Looking around to try and find him with no success Arnold heads back to the Austrian chamber.

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza stands and looks at Duke Arnold

Strangely Duke Arnold, this bickering has meaning, if you sort the mess, you will find that it has meaning, and a good result.

You are evading my question though, what would you do in response to recent French attacks?

Maxmillian, I assume you are not talking to me, as my name is Duke von Salza, and Athalwolf.

Duke von Salza sits in a satisfied manner and waits for Duke Arnold's reply

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg quietly calls out.

If I was in his position, I'd give Swabia a leader.

A page rushes to von Hapsburg's side, and whispers in his ear. Von Hapsburg grins and rises to his feet.

Excuse me, electors, but I have just received a report of alarming nature. By chance, a page happened to overhear a discussion in the Swabian chambers, and I find it of significant mutual interest to reveal it.

Athalwolf von Salza, commonly termed Duke of Swabia, has said something that perhaps he now may agree is unacceptable for an elector of the Reich. I now quote his statement:

"I also urge to the other Swabian Electors to ignore any comments spoken by young members of other Duchy's. There unlawful comments shall be brought to justice very... fast."

Turning to von Salza.

Brought to justice, eh? It would seem you have designs on our lives; how else could you legally administer such "justice". I need not remind electors that only the Kaiser has the right to decide whether comments are unsuitable, let alone unlawful.

Von Hapsburg sits down and awaits the Diet's response.

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza glares at Maxmillian

That sentence makes absolutely no sense at all,Maxmillian. I quietly wonder if it was aimed at me.

Duke von Salza sits, smirking.

[AussieGiant]

Frowning at Hapsburg's comment the Duke stares at him until he finally makes eye contact with the young noble.

Giving him a look that can only be described as: "Have you finished?"

The Duke looks back at von Salza.

I wasn't aware I was avoiding a question Athalwolf.

As you have not outlined who or where your two House Armies are or given them orders I'm a little perplexed at what you would like me to say.

If the French have half a brain Metz will be taken immediately and there's nothing we can do about that.

von Bohmen is currently in serious trouble in Bruge also and will simply have to survive as best he can. Without any further input from you then I'd recruit as best we could Staufen and have both you and Ruppel combine force and march on Metz. I certainly wouldn't be leaping past Metz to help Bruge as it would leave the interior of the Reich exposed.

Your thoughts Athalwolf?

[Warluster]

Athalwolf stands and nods, showing he gives satisfaction in the DUke's answer.

It is a good plan, but I know not what my fellow Swabians think of the matter, it is their opinion which will make the day. We hope for a quick blitzkrieg, it seems satisfavtory.

Unfortunely Arnold, we have no Household Armies present at this moment, the latest being destroyed at Bern. This problem will hopefully be solved in the next two years, I hope.

Duke von Salza nods at the Austrian bench, before sitting and waiting for his fellow's reply.

[Ignoramus]

Von Hapsburg rises to his feet.

Electors, it appears that I am unwelcome here; I understand. One who goes against the main opinion of the electors often suffers the same fate.

Perhaps I was unwise in some of mein comments, and for that forgive me. But I confess I was not brought up with doses of absurdity. I will remedy that.

For now, I am off to visit the Kaiser.

Von Hapsburg bows as he and his retinue leave the Diet.

[AussieGiant]

Raising his eyebrows at the departing Hapsburg, the Duke seems to shake his head in a little bewilderment at the young man.

Athalwolf, I am aware that there is little of the Swabian House armies remaining, but I would ask you to make your orders known in the Chancellor's book.

Please choose the General's you wish to lead them and their orders for the coming period. I will then do my best, if elected, to reconstitute them and place them in position to execute your orders.

[OverKnight]

Matthias follows the latest exchange and decides to speak.

Duke von Salza, as you are aware the Cataclysm disrupted the House Army system, either through civil strife, attrition in many battles or the raising of irregulars sworn to individual Electors and not Houses.

I was Chancellor when we went from one HA to two. The transition was difficult and not quick when it happened then. Many Electors were impatient with the process. Whoever becomes Chancellor will face an even more daunting task, trying to reassemble the HAs in the face of a stark shortage of Florins and active campaigning on every front.

My impression is that we will be relying on ersatz formations and levies for quite longer than two years, and that HAs will be reconstituted on the run. The results will not be perfect, but we should be patient. Central Authority has been restored, but remnants of the chaos from the Cataclysm will be felt for years. In my opinion Swabia has the most dire shortage of men, and should recieve priority for recruitment, but our Citadels, many of which have lost important facilities, can train only so many units a year.

I apologize if this is small comfort, but we must keep a sober assessment of our prospects lest we try to reach for too much too soon.

[deguerra]

Ludwig struggles to hide a satisfied grin as von Hapsburg leaves the chamber

to the Emperor indeed.

Herzog Arnold, I meant no disrespect either in my chastizing of young Dieter, nor in my somewhat aggravted remarks at von Hapsburg to you personally, your Duchy or your candidacy as chancellor. I hold you as an honourable and decent man, and I know that as long as there are men such as yourself to rule Austria, I need fear no...squabbling upstarts attempting to use Imperial policy for their own personal ends.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Count Ludwig,

Believe me when I say that the two young nobles of Austria are entirely responsible for their own actions and words until such time as I decide to get involved. Therefore I take no offense at anyone and their dealings with the two of them. They are old enough to fend for themselves and will represent the Duchy to the standards I require.

Being outspoken and full of "£$^* and spit" is nothing for either young men to be ashamed of.

[Ramses II CP]

I would urge everyone to allow Hapsburg to speak as much as he likes, for obviously the more words pass his lips the more clearly he reveals himself as a fool. Bellow on my young friend, it is always a pleasure when the Kaiser brings his personal jester to the Diet.

Young von Essen, as for 'Saint' Jan and my perspective on history... I've just had my left big toe sainted as well. Cost about 2 florins. Here's the patent from the Pope.

Fritz unrolls a rather ornamental document onto the table, but rolls it back up and puts it away before over much can be read.

I deeply suspect that if the Reich were to replace another Pope we could have Father Luther sainted with little trouble. Or a horse, if you know a good one, since a horse's *** has already made the trip.

Continuing on to my brother's execution, the Kaiser himself does not believe Duke Steffen's report. I have no idea what information the Duke based his conclusion on because he has not shared it publically, but hindsight is clear. One people took immense benefit from our Kaiser's death. The Byzantines. The subsequent disruption of the Reich and the passage of power to our good Emperor Elberhard opened the gates to a Byzantine territorial expansion beyond anything they had accomplished in hundreds of years and to the complicit theft of the Reich's treasury.

Where there is smoke, there is fire. You may disagree with me, but you cannot claim to know the truth of these matters. You accuse me of pushing an agenda, but clearly you are doing the same thing simply on the other side of the fence. I take no shame in saying that I am pursuing my brother's killers.

I will have further comments of more substance shortly, for now I must adjourn to the jakes.

:egypt:

[Northnovas]

Electors,

It is good to see the same behaviour back in the Diet. The young ones are always permitted to have a say and from their mouths come there wisdom. If someone has something to say speak and let you be heard.

It also good to see real issues come like men and resources brought up for debate Yes we are in a crises mode. There will have t be priorities and I see Swabia having the first in men and equipment. The French is our enemy not the other Houses. Once Duke von Salza proposes his strategy the focus will be on supplying him. The other Houses know that and will wait; we only have so many production centres.
The Outremer is another issue to protect Jerusalem and it would be King Steffen’s decision on what he needs and who should go. I have cautioned before it takes a special individual to answer the call but it is no use sending eager nobles to the Outremer with no command when they would be better served at home.
It is all about priorities and cooperation.
In this chamber Duke Arnold is the one who is addressing these issues and is making his best effort for a consensus with the Houses. These are the issues I want to debate how and when. There is no need to bring up the wrongs that have occurred in the past 20 years that a certain member running for Chancellor keeps bringing up on the floor.
It is time to move on for reconciliation amongst the Houses that will lead to cooperation and defeat of our enemies. The blame game is done and over there were mistakes made and events beyond our individual control. We have survived and now lest move forward.

Please excuse me for my candidate bias but I have seen the leadership in the Austrian House for a long time and can see that same leadership for the Reich has we begin a new era. We have a long road ahead of us.

[Ramses II CP]

Returning to the chamber Fritz withdraws another document from his battered case.

Very well then, just a few more remarks to address. Regarding Sir de Cervole's remarks, while we may seem fractured and uncoordinated in these chambers it is precisely because we settle these matters here that we can present one united front to our enemies in the field. Once I am chosen Chancellor I assure you the men who have spreads lies and insults on my good name will recant their actions in order to pursue their agendas more effectively. Politics in the Reich are not without rancor, but are also rarely irreversible.

I have been reviewing our army formations and funding situation, and I believe I have some effective economic measures prepared to deal with them, but my understanding is not yet complete. I will have a firm economic proposal to put on the table shortly, and I look forward to contributions from all sides to the plan.

Additionally I am starting to smell a scam surrounding Antwerp. As Sir Andreas raised the issue, so I ask directly, what exactly is Hapsburg's great interest in this matter? Given the ambiguous nature of the Kaiser's edict on the matter it is an issue of some importance. If our Kaiser were found to be scheming with this most disagreeable young noble... well, I can only hope some explanation is forthcoming.

There have been surprisingly few edicts proposed. Are there no more issues to be voted upon?

:egypt:

[Privateerkev]

After listening for awhile, Dieter speaks,

I am seeing a disturbing trend from some in here to "suppress dissent". I have every right to speak in these chambers, and to the best of my knowledge, I have observed every single protocol and decorum.

Yet, I keep getting lumped in with my colleage, Elector Hapsburg when people keep mentioning "two young electors." I believe this is a ploy by those who disagree with other people's candicacies and legislative agendas.

Let me make clear, while an Austrian brother, Hapsburg does not speak for me. I have my own thoughts on matters he speaks of but I will keep my opinions to myself. Any attempt to link the two of us, is simply a move of misdirection and is regrettable. Or is simply ignorance.

Sir Fritz,

While you have gone at length to just insult the Catholic Church, you have not actually addressed the issue of Lutheran complicity in the War of Reformation. While my mind is made up with regards to who should be Chancellor, perhaps other electors would like to hear more than insults heaped upon their faith.

As for the murder of Kaiser Siegfried, I have yet to see one shred of proof that the Byzantines were involved. All you offer is that they benefited. Well, correlation does not automatically equal causality. On the other hand, Duke Lothar has submitted reams of evidence to support his investigation. Including a confession. If you have a problem with his investigation or conclusions, then answer them directly instead of making your own spurious claim.

Now I will sit and await the flurry of comments about my age and how I should just shut up and let grown ups speak at the Diet. But such comments do little to alleviate the very situation that electors claim to care about.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold looks on while Dieter speaks. Once he is finished the Duke gives the young noble a admirable nod in congratulations and then eyes the chamber for any further comments by the assembled nobles.

[AussieGiant]

After waiting for some moments without any further comments Arnold is handed a parchment from his Military Engineer Sigfried.

Standing the Duke speaks.

Nobles of the Reich, I have examined the economic situation and have a series of measure I believe will be both successful and widely accepted:

1. Disband the immense fleets which carried Elberhard home, and disband all but a select few of the ships at Palermo. Over eight thousand florins are required just to keep those vessels afloat for a single two year per year.

2. The sale of the non-gunpowder siege works at Acre, Antwerp, and Palermo. These weapons are outmoded in the modern age and this would immediately raise over six thousand florins. Ballista makers at Zagreb, Genoa, and Nuremburg would raise the total to nearly nine thousand florins.

3. Prioritized repair of economic buildings throughout the Reich, notably the merchant bank at Bern and the warehouse at Hamburg.

4. Raising taxes across the Reich as high as seems tolerable, accompanied by a plea for aid and understand of the locals.

I have investigated the consequences of these actions and they are all in the best interests of the Reich. In particular phasing out the old system of siege works provides an immediate influx of funds to raise troops and deal with the remaining trouble spots around our homelands, while disbanding the fleets is a critically necessary move. Half of our expected debt is tied down in those ships. These reforms can demonstrate an adequate base upon which to build future economic success.

Raising his eyebrows at Fritz, the Dread Duke fires him a challenging glare and takes a seat.

[TinCow]

*The doors creak open suddenly, revealing a large contingent of Bavarian knights standing in the outside corridor. The sound of booming footsteps resounds through the hall for a few moments, resolving into the figure of Lothar Steffen clad in full plate. It is clearly a finely made suit of armor, but it is designed for combat, not ornamentation. The armor is scored in multiple places, indicating that it has seen heavy combat. As the doors close behind him, the Duke of Bavaria takes his seat at the head of the Bavarian section.*

I had hoped to sleep through all of this politicking, but my scribes have informed me that this body remains as disorganized and incompetent as ever. I have therefore interrupted my well-deserved rest to come and sort out the Reich's problems yet again. Perhaps one day the Diet will figure out how to manage the affairs of the Reich without my intervention, but apparently that day is not today.

*Lothar glares around the room, managing to look angry with everyone, without singling out a single person for particular scorn.*

I will start with what someone else should have done several days ago. Under Charter Amendment 10.2, conquest of various provinces requires an Edict. While that Amendment also exempts 33 provinces from that requirement, the legislation is old and does not account for many of the later acquisitions of the Reich. Accordingly, we are not legally allowed to reconquer several former provinces of the Reich, even if we wished to. I therefore propose the following Edict to ensure that whomever is elected Chancellor has the legal authority to retake whichever of our lost provinces that he is able to:

Edict 14.3: The Chancellor is authorized to conquer Caen, Paris, Rheims, Dijon, Marseilles, Ajaccio, Venice, Bologna, Florence, Rome, Naples, Stettin, Thorn, Breslau, Krakow, Vilnius, Budapest, Bran, Bucharest, Antioch, Adana, and Edessa. Any currently held provinces which are lost to the enemy during this Chancellorship term may also be reconquered.

I believe that should be sufficient to fulfill any legal problems we may encounter. I encourage the Diet to adopt a similar Edict at each future session until the Reich is fully restored, so that the Chancellors may always have a free hand to regain our former provinces in whatever manner he sees fit.

Now, moving on to other affairs, let me address the abomination that is Charter Amendment 14.3. Elector von Hapsburg, you had best be glad that you are a vassal of a man I respect greatly. Were you a Bavarian, I would have you publicly flogged for proposing such a treasonous Edict. No one has the ability to remove a Duke other than the Duke himself! Dukes must, by nature, make important decisions for their Houses. Sometimes these decisions will be unpopular, even if they are necessary. Allowing the Duke to be removed by a simple popularity vote amongst his Electors is injurious to the entire purpose of the Ducal title. I do not care what legislation is passed, no man will remove me from my Duchy without first removing my head from my shoulders. Anyone who tries via legislation will be disemboweled, drawn, and quartered while he still draws breath. If you wish to remove a Duke against his will, the proper and time-honored tradition is to get yourself an army and see about it like a proper man. At least then you will be worthy of a quick and clean death.

On the issue of Outremer, I am pleased to see that it is in the competent hands of my brother Matthias. I support his proposed Charter Amendment 14.2 but I still believe that Outremer is of secondary importance when compared to the problems which beset the Duchies. Indeed, I would generally be content to see Outremer limited to Acre alone. However, as has been pointed out by multiple Electors, Outremer holds the possibility of being a second front against the Byzantines, drawing their strength away from their holdings in Italy and the Balkans. I support sending some of our much needed resources to Outremer, so long as the Chancellor remembers that a “second front” should receive secondary priority. Only after all Duchies have had their basic needs provided for should additional monies and armies be made available to Outremer. This is essential, as the whole purpose of a second front is to distract from efforts on the main front. If the main front in Italy does not receive sufficient support, the second front itself becomes pointless.

I also wish to emphasize that the reconquest of Italy must receive priority over all other offensive efforts. This is not to say that the defenses of other Duchies should be reduced. Far from it, the Chancellor’s first job must be to ensure that no more of the Reich’s provinces are lost. However, once our territories are secure, the most important area of reconquest simply must be Italy. Anyone who argues otherwise is a fool. Italy is the trade center of the Reich and it is in large part due to its loss that we are in such a major financial crisis at the moment. Regaining Venice, Bologna, Florence, and Rome will go a long way to restoring the Imperial treasury, thus providing sufficient wealth for the other fronts to switch to the offensive in turn.

I am sure that some people will think I would say this out of self-interest, however those people are ignorant. Of course I wish to see my lost provinces regained. However, of the four provinces I just named, one is Austrian and one is the Imperial Capital! Anyone who believes the prioritization of the Italian front to be erroneous had best explain why regaining Rome itself should not be a priority and which other area of the Reich will provide for more income than Italy. Anyone who wishes to criticize this strategy without answering those questions might as well not speak up at all.

Finally, I wish to state publicly that I will be voting for Arnold. It is no secret that I have been friends with the Duke of Austria since we were children and this friendship is certainly part of the reason I support him. However, it should also be clear that Arnold is a man whose abilities are unequalled in strategy and tactics. Make no mistake about it, Electors, this Chancellorship will be dominated by military decisions. No one alive can equal Arnold’s abilities on the battlefield and Austria’s remarkable successes in holding back the Venetians and the Hungarians at the same time show that he is a very capable strategist as well. He is exactly the kind of man the Reich needs at the moment.

Fritz, do not take my statements as in insult. I greatly respect the efforts you have gone through to defend Franconia. You made difficult decisions, but those decisions were crucial in providing for the defense of your House’s lands. I consider it a travesty that your contributions have not been adequately rewarded by your own Duke. The notion that Dieter von Kassel, who has never even set foot in Franconia, should be Count of Hamburg instead of you is simply absurd. I can only hope that this ‘oversight’ is corrected quickly. It is a shame that you are running against Arnold, for if your competition was any other man, I would offer my support to you instead. I do hope you will not give up your political ambitions if you are not elected. The Reich needs more men like you with the moral fiber to do what is necessary, even when it is difficult.

[Cecil XIX]

Edmund Becker, who has for some reason entered with the Bavarian delegation, raises his hand to speak.

"I second Edict 14.3"

He then turns around and leaves.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter von Essen speaks:

I second Edict 14.3

[AussieGiant]

Arnold can't help but smile at the Duke of Bavaria even when his scorn filled visage locks with his for a few moments.

Blowing the clearly annoyed Bavarian Duke a kiss in greeting from across the chamber simply further enrages his friends already combative demeanor.

Well stones the £$%"ing crows and slap me on the ass with a Bavarian pancake!!!

Turning to the bench full of lawyers who pour over the various points of legislation, Arnold throws a number of books at them. With unerring accuracy he manages to brain quite of few of them before screaming

I THOUGHT I ASKED YOU £$%£$ING IDIOTS IF WE NEEDED EDICTS TO RETAKE PROVINCES!!??

Stunned silence is the resounding response that meets Arnold's murderous gaze. Glancing up at the vaulted ceiling the Duke raises his arms in silent pleading with the Lord Almighty. Look back at the bench of half concussed lawyers.

GET OUT...ALL OF YOU...YOU'RE ALL FIRED!!

Composing himself immediately he turns back to Lothar.

Glad you could make it Lothar, I knew there was a reason you needed to be here.

It seems your edict has the required seconders...

Glancing at the impressive suit of plate covering the Bavarian Duke, Arnold looks down at his own night black suit, then back at Lothars, then again back at his own...pausing he points an inquiring finger in the direction of Lothar and is about to say something...he hesitates, then shakes his head in disbelief before taking his seat to await the responses Lothar's speech must illicit from the gathered nobles.

Lothar, have you seen Elberhard?

[OverKnight]

Matthias watches Lothar's entrance with an expression of bemusement. This quickly turns to a scowl as he listens to the Duke's speech. He stands to respond.

Thank you for lending your legal expertise to these proceedings, Lothar. How could we accomplish anything without you?

I thank you for your support of CA 14.2. I will second Edict 14.3 in the same spirit.

As for the importance of Outremer. . .I disagree with you. I claim no primacy, but I will not have the history and accomplishments of the Kingdom dismissed as a "distraction" either. We need Outremer not just to fight the Greeks but to shield Jerusalem, the Holy City, to maintain influence over the Pope and to curb any further threats from the East. It is unfortunate you never served in Outremer, you would have a better idea of what is at stake if you did. I hope one day the scales will fall from your eyes.

All I ask for is a fighting chance.

Matthias resumes his seat.

[Ramses II CP]

Fritz rises and again addresses von Essen.

Insulted all Catholics or just your pet Saint? I have merely pointed out a practical reality. At this moment we have considerable... influence with the Pope, influence which was abused to have von Hamburg sainted. I don't mind that so much, it's good to show these other Catholic nations our power, but to claim that his sainthood has some larger meaning or somehow defends his butcher's actions is patently absurd. If other Catholics were offended by my remarks they may take it up with me personally, but your claims are clearly political and will be answered in kind. I am widely known as a vastly more pious man than yourself, so if you wish to limit your discussion to matters of religion we can conduct it in a more civil manner in private.

As to Duke Lothar's investigation, I have just told you that it was the Kaiser himself who informed me that the investigation was flawed and cut short by the eruption of the Cataclysm, and further that the Kaiser had his own suspects in mind. When two men so far opposed on a matter of politics and history concur that the current explanation is deeply flawed, well, only young whelps with axes to grind continue to bandy about bad information.

Fritz nods cordially to Duke Lothar Steffen, but his expression is impassive.

Pleased you could make it, Duke Steffen, and though I am disappointed to lack your support I am grateful for your compliments. Perhaps you will reconsider at a later date. Edict 14.3 is ideal. I had thought of proposing something similar myself, but I have been every bit as befuddled by the legal gymnastics of our charter as Duke Arnold's former employees on whether or not it was necessary.

Fritz's face twists briefly with anger before returning to it's stoney blankness as he returns Duke Arnold's challenging stare.

It would seem I am similarly beaten to the punch on announcing economic reforms. The nature of the Duke's remarks on the economy are such that I cannot help but, to some extent, echo them. A good idea must not be discarded simply for the expedient of political advancement.

I would add that it is my intent to commission more merchants from the merchant's guild to provide long term advancement of our economy, and the careful manipulation of the prices of foreign goods (OOC: Moving the far east merchants onto the most advantageous resources).

I would also consider an appeal to our English allies for a loan as they are currently reputed to be quite well off (OOC: Diplomatic manipulation? It won't be easy with our repuation, but worth a shot). Perhaps even our enemies can be blackmailed into paying us for temporary peace.

Trade rights should be secured with the Papacy, of course.

If and when I get the chance to sack Arhus that will add considerably to our funds, and I believe it will likely prove a necessary evil to maintain order in the Danish capital, but that is a further future move.

Those things being said, I confess that they are in many ways a sideline to the reforms proposed by Duke Arnold. My own studies have led me to much the same conclusions at the Duke, though I have had to perform them without a significant staff or the resources of a Dukedom.

Therefore I must second the reforms the Duke has proposed. They are, perhaps, crudely stated but also accurate and necessary.

Unconciously Fritz snarls at this thought, but it's clearly directed inward for having let the Duke get ahead of him rather than at anyone. He then sits and broods quietly for a time, withdrawn from the debate around him but probably still listening.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter sits back looking bored.

It seems you have again refused to answer my claims of Lutheran complicity regarding the War of Reformation. I have only brought this up because someone in here wished for me to better flesh out my reasons for supporting Duke Arnold. Your refusal to acknowledge basic history is a perfect example of why I will not vote for you. Since you keep refusing to discuss the matter, I am willing to let the whole matter drop instead of forcing you to keep ignoring basic facts.

As for my pet Saint, it seems you are twisting things. All I have done is point out an act of the Church. It says nothing of my personal politics or opinions. You seem to want to somehow link me with your old political opponent. I'm not sure how successful that will be.

You seem to welcome questions and concerns but then you verbally beat on a "young whelp" and play word games.

You have also completely failed to explain how Duke Lothar's proof is "bad information". Since I consider it "good information", repeating it in the Diet is not an indication of some sort of "axe to grind".

So, I believe I have brought up very reasonable points in light of your candicacy. Would you choose to answer them in a intelligent and mature matter? Or have you merely validated my belief that you are quite unfit to be Chancellor? If you can't even handle basic questions, then how can we be convinced that you can handle the job?

OOC: Pointing out something about a prior character does not automatically mean my current character in any way supports the prior one. All Dieter is doing is informing people of a political title. It would be like me saying George Bush is President of America. It doesn't mean I voted for him or agree with him at all. Calling Bush "President Bush" does not make him my pet president...

[Ramses II CP]

Essen, so far as I can tell you have asked no serious questions. Perhaps you would care to repeat them? I have simply been answering your absurd political claims in kind to the manner you present them to me. If you wish a polite discussion you must first become a polite questioner.

It is explicitly recorded in our history that the arrival of Jan and his call to recruitment touched off the War of Reformation. Feel free to look it up. For myself, I lived through it, fought the rebellions it touched off, and saw the consequences first hand of the rioting.

It has been repeatedly and explicity stated that Father Luther acknowledged his errors and is attempting to correct them. No such acknowledgement of error has come out of Jan or his old allies in attacking Father Luther's disciples, though they claim to be the more chivalrous men.

Your claims regarding my brother are a political needle you prod me with to attempt to make me lose my temper. I deny you this, and so you repeat yourself endlessly. It's quite boring. I urge you to take up the matter with the Kaiser, who, as I have repeatedly stated, sparked my own investigation into the assassination with his speculation. It seems clear to me that only one party could have taken benefit, and, once again, I will repeat that where there is smoke there is often fire.

OOC: I'd answer those questions in kind no matter which player put them forward Kev. :yes: No offense intended outside the RP, obviously. :beam:

:egypt:

[TinCow]

*The Duke of Bavaria cocks an eyebrow as he hears his name continually mentioned with regard to the investigation into Kaiser Siegfried's death.*

Electors, surely this avenue of debate is exhausted. I have supplied the Diet with all of the information I was able to produce at the time of that most heinous event. My statements regarding the Milanese assassins are recorded in the Diet records. Unfortunately, all of my personal papers and effects were lost when Florence was sacked by the Byzantines. I have naught but my words to back up my claims. The only other man who conducted an investigation into the assassination was Duke Hans, who is now also deceased. Thus, my words, and the Diet records, are the only information that remains available on the matter. All else is gossip and idle speculation.

I am not ignorant about what is said behind my back. I hear the rumors that I personally arranged for the Kaiser's death with the aid of some 'secret' organization. That is all quite absurd and I suggest that the creators of those rumors look to a career in the theater, as it is surely the stuff of fiction with which to excite the masses. Perhaps Kaiser Siegfried was killed by some Hungarian on a grassy hill?

In any case, whether you believe my words or not, it makes no difference. I have told the truth and you are all free to make up your own minds on the subject. If you believe that I tell the truth, then the matter is done with and it is time to move on. If you believe that I am a liar and a murderer, then you had best state it to me directly. We Bavarians know how to deal with liars and slanderers.

*Lothar turns to one of his squires.*

Boy, go and make sure my sword is sharpened. I may have need of it soon.

[Ramses II CP]

I would like to make it absolutely clear that I have no reason to believe any German was complicit in the death of my brother. I myself often found his policies abhorrent, but it is flatly inconceivable to me that an agent of the Reich could have had our own Kaiser harmed.

:egypt:

[vpmd]

Hans von Bavaria rushes in. He reviews the notes of a scribe he left behind.

Though it has the necessary seconders, I would like to declare my support, which is of little consequence, for Edict 14.3, and thank the Duke for bringing sense into the Diet.

von Bavaria resumes his seat int the Bavarian section

[TinCow]

I did, of course, understand that fully Fritz. You have made it very clear that you believe the Byzantines to be behind the Kaiser's death, not myself or any other Bavarians. My statements were not directed at you; they were intended for the unidentified men who have circulated these slanderous rumors. With hindsight, there is much credibility in your statements about the Greeks. Perhaps the Milanese were themselves working with the Byzantines. Even with their renowned business skills, it did seem strange to me that they were able to raise such a large sum of money so quickly. Unfortunately, with my papers lost and the guilty Milanese noblemen long since dead, not even I would have any way to verify such a claim. I suspect that future generations will still be discussing the matter long after every Elector in this room has ascended, or descended, to their justly earned afterlife.

[Privateerkev]

If my questions have already not been "serious" enough to be taken under your careful consideration, then I am of the opinion that they will never be serious enough to you.

I am done. I have explained my stance. I have explained why. I still think you have waffled on talking about Lutheran complicity in the War of Reformation. I still think you have waffled on why you believe Duke Lothar's evidence is wrong. I still think you have failed to prove why you should be Chancellor over Duke Arnold.

Since I truly believe my words will never be taken seriously by you, for the rest of the Diet, then further discussion is rather pointless. I have made my points and asked my questions. You have danced and danced. The success of your dancing will come out at the ballot box. If your dancing has convinced the majority of the voting power in the Diet, you get to be Chancellor. If your dancing is not suffecient, or turns people off, then you will not get to be Chancellor.

You know what, I don't even think you will be a bad Chancellor. I just believe Duke Arnold would be better than you. And your penchant for revisionist history is one reason why. If you can not take such honest criticism, then you truly need to rethink the whole idea of going into politics.

At least I will tell you what I think to your face. Others will smile at you and scheme behind your back. I have more respect for you than that, even though we might not agree on history. I might be Catholic, but I do not consider myself anti-Lutheran. All I have wanted is an acknowledgement that fanatacism on both sides helped cause the War of Reformation. As well as proof that the Byzantines killed our Kaiser.

[deguerra]

Ludwig rises, the strain of several days of Dieting clearly starting to show (OOC: God I'm tired :P)

1. Young von Essen speaks with a conviction that belies his years, and I thoroughly applaud any discussion he brings to the diet, and do not believe others should shut him down, so long as it is discussion. I too would like to hear from most honourable Fritz some of the answers that this young noble seeks, and stress, as he does, that we ask not out of disrespect or animosity, but simply to get a succinct answer. More manner, gentlemen, and less art!

2. Duke Arnold, could you please, as Fritz has, comment on your policy on Antwerp, should you become chancellor?

[gibsonsg91921]

Dearest friend Lothar, Péter says icily, the fact is that I did not grant Hamburg to Fritz von Kastilien because Stettin was his prior county and I assumed he would like it back. Also, being a freehold count, I have no authority to remove it from his power. Were he to give it up, as he did, I would give him a different land, one I am deliberating at this time.

I will not suffer criticism of my rule of Franconia from one who donates all of his house's treasury to rebellion.

In the spirit of forgiving, old friend, I second Edict 14.3.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter, upon hearing Count Bohmen speak, is simply shocked silent. Finally he just gives a nod of appreciation towards the Count.

OOC: No problem Ramses! No harm, no foul. :beam:

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Antwerp...I'm not sure why it is so vital to single out that particular city amongst many others.

My thoughts:

Excellent gunpowder units, not especially profitable given it's location, dangerously close to the front lines and has no garrison to speak of.

I'd would say that it will be under threat in the near future depending on how you Ludwig, fair in defending Bruge.

In all likely hood it may fall to the French.

[deguerra]

I thank you for your answer

you are correct, of course, Duke Arnold. But being the other half of Flanders, it is important to me.

[Ramses II CP]

Very well, as there is common interest among more than one elector, I will attempt to find those questions in the transcript and cover them adequately per Sir von Essen's private letter.

Here we are, my stance on the Lutheran contribution to the War of Reformation. Father Luther's warnings about the inevitable Byzantine treachery stirred up righteous anger about the errors of the Reich's leadership in setting us on the path of Unification. This clearly had a role in preparing the Reich for the coming violence, but gathering sticks does not create a fire. Luther brought together men of like minds to stop an action which he rightly predicted to have disasterous consequences.

Let's be clear, Luther's tracts and words have been proven out by history. In all the hundreds of years since the dominance of old Rome have so many cities ever been exterminated by one nation? Even by all the people of Europe?

No. Byzantium's atrocities are beyond any conception I could manage, even as a staunch Lutheran, before the war; but they were not beyond Father Luther's comprehension. Luther gathered the tinder that would burst into flame, but he did so purposefully, with the intent of saving the Reich from itself. Jan von Hamburg was the spark that caused Luther's justly angry supporters and starry eyed detractors to burst into flame. There is blame aplenty to go around, but let us never forget that without a spark the orderly transformation of the Reich's body politic into a Lutheran group might have been violence free.

I stress might because there is no certainty. What is certain is that a single event began the War of Reformation and lit the fires of rebellion and rioting, and that even was the return of Jan and his rabble rousing call to arms.

On to the matter of Kaiser Siegfried, my brother, and his assassination. I have only the proof of primary benefit to argue in my favor. Duke Steffen's investigation was, in my view and the view of the Emperor, incomplete and inadequate, cut short as it was by the cataclysm and the loss of his home city. I do not believe my version of these events to be conclusively true, but they best fit the information I am in possession of. As I challenged the Emperor, so I challenge all of you; if you know something regarding my brother's death that I do not, speak now.

Blood calls to blood, and if it is not my fate to die first I will see my brother's murderers as their eyes glaze over and their trip to **** begins.

Was there another issue?

Fritz's voice has remained calm throughout this speech, but by the end of it the papers in his hands are a twisted wreck. Without glancing down Fritz discards them on the floor, and takes his seat.

:egypt:

[vpmd]

Wildly trying to break the tension that has filled the room, Hans von Bavaria quickly scribbles down a few sentences and decides to just get over introducing his edict, though he has not really worked everything out yet.

The English are the only friend we have at the present, and we would do well to aid them however we can. I know our forces in Outremer are spread thin and there are thousands of Byzantines headed toward Acre, but still, I would propose this:

Edict 14.4: In the likely case of a Turkish attack on the English in Damascus, a force shall be sent to aid the English if possible and if it seems there is any hope left for the situation.


I am not very well-informed about the Outremer, so forgive me and inform me if this Edict betrays any of my ignorance or inexperience.


Knowing it is not very well thought out, Hans resumes his seat praying that it will at least be noticed.

[Zim]

Andreas stands.

I will second Edict 14.4, Herr von Bavaria. As difficult as it is to imagine having the spare forces to help the English at Damascus in the near future, failing to do so would not only allow an ally to lose land we gave them, a terrible consequence in and of itself, but open a second front in Outremer against the Turks. If forces are by some miracle available, we must spare them for such an endeavor.

[deguerra]

I will second edit 14.4 also

[OverKnight]

Matthias thinks a bit before speaking on the newest proposal.

I must admit that the English predicament in Damascus has mostly escaped my notice. I have been focused on the Greek armies marching south on Acre.

Outremer owes the English, their agreement to take possession of Aleppo and Damascus has helped us greatly in defending against the Byzantines. The Turks taking Damascus would be an unfortunate blow, as they would then border us and Jerusalem.

I do wish to assist the English, but I am not sure I have the forces to do so currently. Two large Greek armies threaten my position north of Acre and the Citadel itself. Not only do they block the most direct route to Damascus, but if I do move east, that will leave Acre open to assault. Those armies will have to be destroyed or dispersed before a force can be sent to Damascus.

Andreas and I, working with the Chancellor, will do what we can to enforce this edict if it passes, but any assistance is at least four years off.

I wish I could offer more, but keeping Acre and my army intact is my highest priority.

I will consult the latest reports when I can and see if I can figure something out.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter stands up,

First off, I want to offer my appreciation to Sir Fritz in patiently attending to the questions of young electors.

To see him acknowledge the very complex layers of history is heartening. I won't pretend to completely agree with his interpretation of history. But I have a feeling that trained historians will be going over the details of this War for hundreds of years. So I won't pretend to have some sort of deeper understanding. All I wished was for Sir Fritz to acknowledge that there was complexity and multiple reasons for the War. He has done so and I am satisfied.

As for the issue of the Kaiser's murder, it seems there was more to the issue than the Diet records made clear. While I am not yet convinced that the Byzantines are responsible, I do hope we one day learn the truth. In that, Sir Fritz and I can at least agree.

I still have my choice for Chancellor. It is due in no part to some sort of deficiency on the part of Sir Fritz. It is only due to the exceedingly high quality of Duke Arnold. When silver is placed next to gold, it does not in any way diminish the glean of silver.

But I did owe Sir Fritz an apology for something I said and I have given my apology to him in person. I was wrong when I called him "unfit". I am young and new to the Diet. My emotions got the better of me and I offer no excuses.

Dieter gives a slight bow of the head to Sir Fritz

Now on to the topic of Edict 14.4. This edict does have the required seconders but I do support it. While it is no secret that I wish to see Damascus returned to the care of the Reich, I much rather see the English govern that city, rather than the Turks.

[vpmd]

von Bavaria speaks again, noticably more confident:

I am glad that the Edict has the required seconders, and would like the Electors to consider a point which I failed to mention earlier. The Turks are the enemy of both the Egyptians and the Byzantines. Perhaps defeating them at Damascus would cause them to focus more of their attention on these two enemies instead, who are also of course, our foes. Though the situation would be bad if their army took Damascus, it would be much worse if their southward bound armies were diverted to the west once they saw our situation.

I had the same reservations as Herr Steffen, which was why I was somewhat lacking in confidence in the edict. However, though I personally wish to serve in Bavaria or Italy to become more experienced, I hope that others will come to the aid of Outremer and this will be able to be accomplished if not immediately, then hopefully before Christian rule of Damascus is merely a distant memory.

[FactionHeir]

Ehrhart surveys the diet hall, somewhat unsure of the reaction he will receive for putting forth an edict before reading off a scroll

My esteemed nobles of the empire, I put forth to you an edict of Swabia:
Edict 14.4 Wolfgang Hümmel and Dietrich von Dassel will be confined to the Pillory rather than the main Mausoleum proper.

My belief on this matter is that these two traitorous rebels should not sully the ground our honorable and noble ancestors rest upon. They are not worthy to be worshipped together with men such as our most exalted emperors and dukes that are buried there, and are more comparable to men such as the late Jens von Kassel, who turned against the empire and German authority.

It is common knowledge that they are guilty of high treason, iciting rebellion, unlawful occupation of German lands, conspiring to rebel, premeditated murder of fellow Germans and disobeying authority. Indeed, they were the first to spill the blood of German soldiers before any loyalist had, at Normandy, Bern and Staufen. When told to cease their rebellion and rejoin the empire without many consequences, they refused and instead continued the fraticide and directly caused the loss of German lands to the French and possibly the Byzantines to the south as well, as Swabia was unable to lend her forces to her neighbor duchies.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

In that case, I demand that you include Duke Hans and Jan von Hamburg to the list, as they also participated in the same premediated murder of Germans as their fellows did. Jan von Hamburg particularly deserted his post at Outremer, leaving the defense of this important eastern front to the maligned Matthias Steffen, to sail to Europe, recruit an army solely for the purpose of killing Germans, and helped start the War of Reformation in the process, which claimed over a hundred thousand lives.

The war is over, Ruppel. Let it die.

[TinCow]

I applaud the good Elector Ruppel for his wise policy of barring all those who are unworthy from eternal rest in the Mausoleum. However, I do not think this legislation goes far enough. I will agree with Edict 14.4 if the names of Hans and Jan von Hamburg are added to the list.

Hans was the first Elector in history to take up arms against a fellow German when he marched against Peter von Kastilien and Tancred von Tyrolia. He was also personally responsible for the deaths of thousands of Germans at Metz and Bern.

Jan von Hamburg, in turn, abandoned his appointed position as King of Outremer without even so much as consulting with his fellow Crusaders before leaving, thus causing a crisis of military leadership which jeapordized the entire defense of Outremer. He struck a deal with a Pope who was an enemy of the Reich, a Pope who was later removed from power through the wise actions of Kaiser Elberhard and Dieter von Kassel. He sold an ancient and valued relic of Christendom to further his own means of transportation. Then, when he arrived back in the Reich, he also took up arms against fellow Germans, slaying them happily in cold blood. As if that were not enough, he was responsible for sparking the War of Reformation, which cost well over 100,000 civilian lives and untold amounts of economic damange.

While we're at it, let us add both Edmund Becker and Ludwig von Bohmen to that list, as they both rebelled against authority. Though they are not yet dead, we should surely ensure that they are properly rewarded for their treachery. For that matter, let us also add Peter von Kastilien and Tancred von Tyrolia, as they surely rebelled against Kaiser Siegfried and violated the Charter when they marched on, and sacked, Constantinople.

Let us also add the names of Lorenz Zirn and Fritz von Kastilien, for they committed the atrocious crimes of sacking their own cities. Dieter von Kassel should similarly be reprimanded for killing a Pope, which, of course, should also require retroactive legislation to ensure that Kaiser Heinrich, Otto von Kassel, and Gerhard Steffen are added to the pillory for similar crimes. We must not, of course, forget my own crimes in supporting the above named rebels, so I must certainly reside there at the end of my days as well.

Have I missed anyone else that has erred and is deserving of scorn? I certainly hope not, for it would certainly taint the Reich to have any unworthy man resting at eternal peace with Christ. It is, after all, our job to determine whether a man's soul is damned for eternity, not that of the Lord Almighty.

[FactionHeir]

If you wish to include them, please propose it in your own edict, Luther.

Both of the men you name did not start a rebellion and both wished to stop the war via diplomacy. However, as neither of the rebels were willing to cease their rebellion and fight the French instead with almost no repercussions from the late Duke Hans, it was necessary to use force after the rebels had murdered fellow Germans first to prevent further escalation. King Jan, god rest his soul, returned from Outremer with the stated goal of preventing Swabia from falling to the rebels and to counteract the influence of your fanatics at Bern. Afterall, there was not only the Christian army, but the Lutheran army as well.

Luther, the war may the over, but should we honest Germans really wish to dishonor and desecrate our forefathers by laying to rest two traitors of the empire next to them and worship them in the same breath? I think not.

[AussieGiant]

Shaking his head in astonishment at his life long friend, Arnold can only look on as the fury and venom spews forth from Lothar's mouth.


£$% me, I'm glad I didn't make that list!!

Christ on the Cross, we are a bunch of heathen scum when it's all said and done.

[TinCow]

Truer words were never spoken, Arnold. I propose that every Elector that has ever lived be cast into the pillory. Surely we have all sinned in some way or another. We cannot pollute the pure resting grounds of the Imperial Mausoleum with villains like Maximillian Mandorf, who is rumored to have raped a priest, even if he has been declared a Saint since then. Let us clear all the filth out and leave the Mausoleum clean and barren, the way Eden was after those abominations, Adam and Eve, were tossed out on their arses.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

My fanatics?

What madness is this?

I called for the formation of a second Lutheran army specifically after Jan von Hamburg arrived and created a rabble of his own! Get your facts straight.

[FactionHeir]

Hans was the first Elector in history to take up arms against a fellow German when he marched against Peter von Kastilien and Tancred von Tyrolia. He was also personally responsible for the deaths of thousands of Germans at Metz and Bern.

And yet he did not kill a single German man in the process of pursuing Prince Peter, but aided his capture peacefully. He has also only raised his sword against the rebels at Bern after Dassel had attacked its loyal German garrison with cannons and arms that you supplied him with.
At Metz, he fought rebels that were more French than German. The kind of unorganized rabble that every elector has faced during the period of the cataclysm.



Jan von Hamburg, in turn, abandoned his appointed position as King of Outremer without even so much as consulting with his fellow Crusaders before leaving, thus causing a crisis of military leadership which jeapordized the entire defense of Outremer. He struck a deal with a Pope who was an enemy of the Reich, a Pope who was later removed from power through the wise actions of Kaiser Elberhard and Dieter von Kassel. He sold an ancient and valued relic of Christendom to further his own means of transportation. Then, when he arrived back in the Reich, he also took up arms against fellow Germans, slaying them happily in cold blood. As if that were not enough, he was responsible for sparking the War of Reformation, which cost well over 100,000 civilian lives and untold amounts of economic damange.

From what I know, he left his position secretly as not to alert those who supported the unlawful rebellion in Swabia. The pope may have been an enemy, but he became one only through the actions of Dietrich von Dassel who killed the pope and exterminated the papal city of Durazzo. If it were not for Dassel, King Jan would have returned via vessels provided by a friendly pope. The war of reformation, as we all know was started through the violent offspring of Lutheran teachings in several small hamlets across the empire already. It was only tipped off when both Dassel, Luther, and Jan called for men of faith to gather at Bern. Again, if Dassel had not rebelled or joined forces with the rightful Duke at that time as he was offered, this would not have occured.

[TinCow]

Ah, you are entirely correct, Elector Ruppel. Your wisdom once again prevails. We must ensure that those who were the ultimate cause of all this suffering be sent to the Pillory. We must, of course, ensure that Kaiser Siegfried is placed there as well. Surely no one is bold enough to state that this entire conflict was not caused by his unilateral and vastly unpopular decision to unite the Reich with the Byzantine Empire. There is our ultimate culprit, and a man who must also join the rest of the list in mortuary purgatory.

[FactionHeir]

Duke Lothar, the point behind my proposed edict is not to banish anyone who has sinned in their life to the pillory, but rather those who openly rebelled against Imperial authority thus commiting high treason, were the first to spill German blood, and did not stop when asked to do so by lawful authority.

As we all well know, good men such as Prince Peter, Edmund Becker and Ludwig von Böhmen saw reason and rejoined the empire without spilling German blood. Contrast this to Dassel and Hümmel. As you suggested in your letter you wrote and presented, you did have second thoughts about supporting such rebellions and that it may not have been the best thing to do.

[TinCow]

Well, then the first German blood that was spilt on the battlefield was between Wolfgang Hummel and Athalwolf von Salza. Indeed, I believe it was Athalwolf's crossbowmen who notched up the first few fatalities. Thank you for reminding me that your own Duke must then be added to the list.

[FactionHeir]

If I remember correctly, the battle of Normandy ensued when Hümmel moved to attack Duke von Salza and Rheims. Defending your own lands against rebels certainly is legal I would presume?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

The root cause of the Swabian Civil War occured early on during Kaiser Siegfried's reign when Wolfgang Hummel was directly ordered to assault and occupy the city of Bruges.

The city, at the time, was suffering from an unholy Plague, where around 50% of its inhabitants were either already sick or dead. Now, this was common knowledge at the time. And yet Hans still ordered Hummel in. Wolfgang Hummel, a loyal vassal of Swabia at the time, was specifically ordered by his Duke to, pretty much, get the plague and die.

But, since Hans was already Duke at the time, he is a hero.

[TinCow]

Legal? Is that how we are defining this, then? All men who have broken laws are to be sent to the Pillory? Well now, that is certainly a bold statement, but I agree to it. We must, therefore, obviously include the late Ulrich Hummel for his violations of the law during his Chancellorship. It also brings us back around the Peter von Kastilien and Tancred von Tyrolia, who declared war on an ally of the Reich without the approval of the Diet. Thank you for continuing to improve our list of those unworthy of spending eternity in anything approaching quiet dignity.

[FactionHeir]

From what I gather in the archives, it was not known to Swabia nor the empire that Bruges was plague infested. Indeed, Hümmel himself in a letter to the late Duke Hans expressed the wish to be able to take command of the Swabian Household Army and be allowed to take Bruges.

[Warluster]

Duke von Salza hears of the accusations against him

Yes, I may have spilled German blood, but it was worthless, rebel blood! I was defending our homeland!? If I wanted to not kill fellow Germans, can you think of what would've happened if I let Hummel past?

I would like to second Erhart Ruppel's edict.

I would like to point out, there are other ways of refusing to do something then rebelling and killing fellow Germans. He could've directly appealed to the Kaiser?

DUke von Salza sits down

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

You are examining the wrong maps, Ruppel. It was common knowledge in that time period. Indeed, all the up-to-date maps of that era (OOC: savegames) had that Bruges was beplagued already marked on there!

[FactionHeir]

My apologis Duke Lothar, but I believe you are taking my words out of context.
I clearly stated that it would be legal to defend yourself and your lands if you are attacked.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

I see. And you are now apparantely the sole determiner of what is and is not legal.

My apologies Ruppel, let me now swear fealty to you.

[FactionHeir]

The archives state that it was only known that Bruges was infested with the plague after it was taken or during the battle. (OOC: We did not have a spy there and the turn Hümmel moved into Bruges, it was not possible to see whether it was infested, only when he actually started laying siege to it)
Yet he decided to press the battle rather than retreat.

[TinCow]

Then surely Duke Hans must again be subject to the Pillory. He attacked the good people of Metz, who were only defending themselves against an outside aggressor. Surely the citizens of the city themselves are capable of defending their own lands? If they take up arms against an outsider, then the outsider must, by nature, be the attacker and not the defender of their homes. This will again force us to include Lorenz Zirn and Fritz von Kastilien into the list. Also, it casts doubt on Wolfgang Hummel himself, for he was beloved by the people of Bruges, likely more so than any Lord has been loved by a people. Surely his efforts in defending the people of Bruges against Hans and Athalwolf's attempt to reconquer them is legal by your standards. After all, Bruges was clearly his land not only by right of conquest, but also by the desire of the people themselves.

[AussieGiant]

Obviously amused by the thrust and counter thrust Arnold can be seen writing down ever name mentioned by any of the combatants. To no one in particular the Duke looks over his shoulder to his fellow Austrian nobles and his retinue.

I'm still highly impressed that I haven't made it onto anyone's list, although I'm sure my father would be unhappy considering the legacy he gave me and how much time I've invested in maintaining and expanding upon it.

I'm rather shocked actually.

Now looking entirely glum at not being mentioned Arnold resumes his note taking

[Ferret]

Come now, we cannot be endorsing traitors can we? I pledge my support to this Edict.

Dieter turns to Luther but does not talk directly to him.

And what of this heretic? Was it the Kaiser's decision to let the man who caused such loss of life in our sacred Empire into these most important of halls?

[FactionHeir]

I shall ask you to consult your geographer on this matter. Caen, Bruges, and Metz are all part of the Duchy of Swabia and thus subject to the Duke of Swabia or the Count assigned to rule the lands.

As Metz rebelled against the Duke and indeed against the empire by throwing out its garrison and destroying Imperial property, while being ruled by a local mob, it was clearly a valid target for the Duke to restore his authority at.

Hümmel on the other hand unlawfully occupied Caen and Bruges, preventing their funds and arms to reach the lawful Duke and consequently Imperial men at arms that needed equipment to defend their homes against rebellion and the French. If you contrast this with Edmund Becker, Hümmel used those forces to attack fellow Germans and refused to reconcile on favorable terms while Edmund Becker used his troops to defend against foreigners only and eventually rejoined his Duchy.

[TinCow]

True, true, rebels must certainly lose any rights to their lands, be they peasant hovels or entire Duchies. The Pillory must be limited to those who attack lands that are rightfully and legally held by others. This is excellent, as it vastly increases our list. For, with the exception of the newer arrivals into the Diet, nearly every Elector in the Reich, living and dead, has been responsible for attacking foreign lands that they did not have any legal right to. I will not bother to list all of the names of the nobles who have conquered a foreign city, but I hope Arnold will be pleased to note that he can finally be included on these grounds.

*Lothar nods his head respectfully to the Duke of Austria.*

Welcome to Purgatory, my friend! It seems to be a popular place these days.

[AussieGiant]

Standing abruptly and raising his fist in triumph, Arnold lets out a cry of success

Yyyyesssss!!!!!

Now we're talkin' Lothar!!!

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alexander Luther:

As a matter of fact, Bresch, it was. And I immensely regret falling for his deception, for I was lured here on the basis that we were able to be reconciled and beyond these petty disputes! These people are dead and have lost in their causes. Should the Lord see fit, their ultimate judgement will be decided elsewhere.

For now, we should focus on issues for the living. Living! Why must we debate on what section of some Mausoleum two Electors fall in when there are Byzantine territories that need to be reconquered??!

Finally, I once again request that I be granted a vote in this Diet. With people like Bresch improperly slandering my name after I have repeatedly apologized, I must be allowed to defend my honor.

[Ramses II CP]

History is written by the victors, eh Ruppel? Consider this, Peter will be Kaiser in due time and who will be the victors then?

I will be blunt, it matters not one whit what you do with my remains once I'm dead. I've seen enough meat chopped, chewed, and in every other guise mistreated to know it's real worth. Those men are dead. They can't help us defend the walls. Do with them as you will for all of me, but realize this; in your own time you too will be castigated and humiliated by those who come after. This is the fate of all prominent men. Think on it well before you attack those who have gone before you.

Now, where will the Not-Imperial-but-ever-so-much-better Mausoleum for Heroes of the Resistance againt ****fool Unification be placed? I'd volunteer Hamburg, but I fear if my young friend the Count of Hamburg ever makes it out of Palermo to see it he may not be too pleased.

With a contemptuous shrug Fritz returns to his seat.

:egypt:

[FactionHeir]

I have argued my point, and it is not about rewriting large volumes of history, but simply to pay our respects to our ancestors who have fallen in defence of a unified empire and who have helped forge our empire rather than wantonly destroy it for their own petty squabbles and refusing to come to the aid of their fellow electors.

Now, since you are so clever Duke Lothar, you certainly wish to tell me why Jens von Kassel is confined to the Pillory when men such as Hümmel and Dassel are not? Has he committed any greater atrocities than those men have?

And Luther, of course we wish to reclaim our lands, but as the diet does not close for another day and there was little talk about anything still ongoing, I felt that this would be a good time to present this edict. Whether or not we debate and vote on it or not, the diet will not be cut short either way and we might as well use this time. If you do not wish for debate, you may find the tavern next door.

[gibsonsg91921]

Perhaps everyone, not just electors, whoever fought a battle against German rebels since the beginning of time should be confined to the Pillory. Hamburg was a rebel German city long ago. Now it may be considered one of the greatest cities of the Reich, but Dietrich von Saxony and his army of swine surely attacked it and killed Germans.

[Privateerkev]

Alexander Luther:Finally, I once again request that I be granted a vote in this Diet. With people like Bresch improperly slandering my name after I have repeatedly apologized, I must be allowed to defend my honor.

Yes, Father Luther should either be given the right to vote or he should lose the ability to propose a CA/edict.

If your an elector, you gain both abilities. If your not, you have neither abilities and are only a spectator.

Since CA 14.4 already is co-proposed by Kaiser Elberhard, taking Father Luther's name off of the legislation will not effect whether the legislation makes it on the ballot.

The Charter is quite clear on Elector rights. If Father Luther is not an elector, then he simply does not have elector rights. If he is an elector, then he can vote.

[deguerra]

Ludwig rises, concern on his face

I have said many times before, that I am not one worthy to speak of loyalty. I put loyalty to my employer before that of the Reich and my Kaiser, and I can never repay that price.

Perhaps, then, to save my own immortal soul, but also because I am a religious man and believe that after death, only the Lord shall have the right to judge us, I cannot support this edict.

I am sorry, Duke von Salza, if you preceive this as yet more disloyalty on my behalf. It is not meant as such, or disloyalty to our most noble house, or as disrespect to you or Herr Ruppel in any way. I understand your reasons for this edict. I just hope you can understand mine.

Ludwig bows slightly to the room at large, and then more profusely to his Duke and sits

[TinCow]

Elector Ruppel, the reason Jens von Kassel is confined to the Pillory is simple: no man thought enough of him to defend his worth in the Diet. He had no friends or admirers and all unanimously considered him a traitor and worthy of disgrace. Clearly that is not the case with either Dietrich von Dassel or Wolfgang Hummel. You may view those men as vile traitors, but I, for one, believe that they were noble and honorable men who were fighting to make the Reich a better place. Whatever sins they may have committed and whatever laws they may have broken, I do not believe that their errors are sufficient to condemn them to permanent disgrace in death. They have paid for their mistakes with their lives, surely that is enough.

I would also like to ask a serious question, discarding all sarcasm. Why have you not included Jan von der Pfalz in your edict? He was a rebel just as much as Wolfgang and Dietrich. He knew exactly which side he was joining when he pledged loyalty to Wolfgang. Furthermore, unlike Ludwig von Bohmen, Jan von der Pfalz never reconciled with Duke Athalwolf. He died an unrepentant rebel, yet you have chosen to ignore his 'crimes' though they are identical to the other two men you name. If you truly believe that all true rebels should receive the Pillory, then Jan must be included with your legislation. If you do not include him, we can only conclude that you have proposed this legislation out of a personal vendetta against men who have already paid the highest price for their actions.

Let the dead rest in peace, Ehrhart, they can do you no more harm.

[OverKnight]

Matthias stands after he can take no more of the present debate.

Enough! It is obvious this Diet Session has gone on too long. We should have kept it to the customary three days, as we have gone from debating legislation to refighting the battles of the past.

What did the Kaiser ask when he opened the Session? "Let the past be the past". Yet here we now are, fighting in the mud over semantics and where we should rebury our dead.

We are better than this. We need to be better than this, or our enemies will triumph.

It is obvious that enmity still remains amongst us, but we must put it aside and focus on rebuilding the Reich. There are wounds that will never heal, except when we are all dead, and no legislation or verbal sparring can close them. But we must go on anyway, or this Empire will fall.

Matthias takes his seat, with a sidelong glance at the empty throne.


OOC: FH's edict should be 14.5 not 14.4.

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1779254&postcount=15

[deguerra]

I am in complete accord. Let us finish this now, and be over with it.

[econ21]

Elberhard: I believe this Diet has run its course. I am closing this full Diet session. Ballots will be prepared shortly. Debate and discussion may continue.

[FactionHeir]

It seems we will have to agree to disagree then, for my belief is that neither Hümmel nor Dassel were honorable nor noble, as honorable and noble men would not openly rebel against authority, wantonly destroy Imperial property, refuse to rejoin to fight the French, and commit treason. Nay, honorable men would put aside their differences when given that offer and wait for a diet session to bring across their point rather than deplete Imperial resources and throw the empire into even deeper peril. The late Duke offered such, but these men rejected.
Of course I will not disagree that Jens von Kassel did not have many supporters, but the diet protocols also do not show that there ever was a vote to place him in the Pillory. Who made the decision then?

Now, as for Pfalz, he may have died a rebel, but never did he attack fellow Germans when he had the opportunity to do so by coming to Staufen and instead focussed his attention north to defend against Danes and Frenchmen. That is honorable. Indeed, he kept out of the war except by name.

[econ21]

Elberhard: Given the state of the voting and Fritz von Kastilien's conceding defeat, I am happy to announce that Duke Arnold is now Chancellor of the Reich!

[OverKnight]

Matthias speaks.

Congratulations to Duke Arnold. Having been a Chancellor, I praise him for taking the position during such trying times.

Matthias bows to the Kaiser.

With your Majesty's leave, I will depart for Outremer. The task ahead of myself and Andreas is daunting, but I will not rest until the Kingdom has regained its standing.

May God preserve us and smite our enemies.

Matthias exits.

[Northnovas]

Karl Zirn speaks,

Excellent news! We can now move forward. Matthias, I wish you safety in your travels and success with your enemies. How I only wish I could return with you. Good Luck my friend.

The old count slowly walks out of the Diet ready to return home.

[AussieGiant]

Standing and moving to the chamber floor Arnold says a few words to Matthias and Karl as they leave.

Proceeding onto the floor the Duke is clearly very focused.

My Liege, Prinz Peter, Viceroy Matthias, Dukes, Nobles of the Reich.

I accept the vote that has been cast here over the past few days and would like to thank Fritz for conducting himself with honour and decorum in his campaign against me.

I certainly have no issue with any of the men that vote in favour of Fritz and I would like them to know that at this time.

I will now move the Chancellors office to Ragusa and you will all receive orders and recommendations forthwith.

[econ21]

Elberhard: All knights flying Imperial colours, including those in the most advanced Gothic armour, now swear a personal oath of allegiance to the Kaiser. Those existing regiments that were able to do so, have joined my army in its march on Rome.

I wish to announce that any other Imperial regiments that have not joined me may stay with their current commanders. Similarly, any future regiments that the Chancellor wishes to recruit may be freely deployed. I will only call upon those regiments in the event of a future rebellion against lawful authority.

As for those regiments that have already joined me, I require their services for the moment until Captain Draganos and his army of Latinkon have been disposed of. Thereafter, any surplus regiments will be sent to where they are most in need. Swabia seems the most likely candidate.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

So I'm free to recruit them as I see fit, those that haven't joined you can stay where they are and after you've got your arse into gear and hammered those two other Byzantine armies any Imperial Knights in the reinforcement column can be redeployed...most likely going to Swabia?

Is that the translation I can use Oh might one?

[econ21]

Elberhard: Sadly, Chancellor, my arse - although still magnificent - is not as young as it once was, but I will endeavour to move it as fast as I can. However, I am glad to see your hearing and mind remain as razor sharp as ever, Arnold.

[_Tristan_]

Perhaps I could be of use in leading those men to Swabia ?

Once their use ot our Emperor is over, of course...

[AussieGiant]

Elberhard: Sadly, Chancellor, my arse - although still magnificent - is not as young as it once was, but I will endeavour to move it as fast as I can. However, I am glad to see your hearing and mind remain as razor sharp as ever, Arnold.

Arnold:

Indeed your Majesty, the gossip from the English section of my entourage has confirmed that, even though it is somewhat older, your arse is still as fine a specimen of German flesh as can be gazed upon by womankind!!

I'm looking forward to seeing it in action on my way to Ragusa.

Karolinger!!! Get off those god damn boats will you!!!??

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

My lords!! The Reich is in serious trouble.

I refer you to the current reports.

(OOC: Latest save in the Orders and Reports thread)

The lose of Milan has crippled us...we have no florins and the plague has struck in Staufen:

https://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x79/aussiegiant/1340/1342/medieval22007-12-2414-09-09-95.jpg

https://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x79/aussiegiant/1340/1342/medieval22007-12-2413-13-44-14.jpg

Rather than make unilateral moves, I would have your thoughts on the matter which will then allow me to make the cuts that are necessary.

[TinCow]

I believe it is obvious that all excess resources that can be gathered must be directed towards Italy. As we have already seen, the loss of these cities is crippling to the Imperial Treasury. Genoa now stands isolated and defenseless and a powerful French army is marching on it as we speak. Even if I were to march there with the remnants of my army, I would not be able to hold it. We thus face losing the last of our Italian cities and suffering a further blow to our income. If this happens, we may never recover.

I know there are few resources to spare, but we must find some way to fund recruitment. Perhaps destruction of all non-essential buildings across the Reich will allow for a full levy from both Innsbruck and Genoa. In truth, even this will be a stopgap measure. I believe that the fate of the Reich lies in the hands of Kaiser Elberhard and Freidrich Karolinger. God help us all.

[econ21]

Elberhard:

Count Karolinger is currently on reserve duty for a while, Lothar: as Duke perhaps you would wish to provide orders for the movement of his army? (Household Army Otto?)

As for my army, I am intending to strike Manouel of Zavarinikeia and then take the bridge to Venice. Unfortunately, I am not sure I will be able to get the city under siege this year. I would welcome any thoughts from Duke Lothar or others on alternative moves.

I would welcome the Chancellor's views - or anyone else's - about the best way to get the four spare regiments of Imperial knights to Swabia.

[TinCow]

Kaiser Elberhard,

My answer depends on whether you believe you will need BHA Otto to aid you in attacking the armies around Venice. If you do not, I would prefer that it march west to aid me at Milan. Of course, that would only be possible if the route was clear. If it is not, I would prefer that it remain near you for safety. With Count Karolinger on reserve duty, I do not want to leave the fate of that army in battle to chance.

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

Kaiser, you're movements are what I would have requested.

I'm becoming somewhat less tolerant of politics and other issues that do not have any immediate result on our strategic situation. Therefore I'm not interested in sending those Imperial Knight all the way to Swabia but rather using them immediately in Northern Italy for maximum effect.

The various theater's of war are as follows:

Swabia is now fully defensive due to plague and no further income.

Franconia is also defensive until the siege in Magdeburg is resolved, therefore freeing it up to attack.

You have the ability to attack and so does von Kassel.

Austria also has the ability to attack which it will.

In essence the armies that can engage in offensive operations MUST do so immediately to alleviate our economic situation.

If troops die then I have no problem with it...our overheads must be reduced in some way and fighting is one of them.

I will therefore be recommending that both the Swabian and Franconia forces that are not under siege be placed in defensible but hopefully tempting positions for the French and Danish to attack. This will expend some of their forces against us and allow for a better offensive operations in the future. Additionally von Kassel can't simply sit in Palermo and wait. I will also be recommending that he leaves a token force there and marches into southern Italy.

We simply can not have any units unused at this time.

[FactionHeir]

While there is no doubt that Bavaria needs aid as well, Swabia stands to lose two further counties this very year, namely Metz and Bruges. That would reduce Swabia to exactly Staufen, which is plague-ridden, and Bern. I believe that reinforcements of some kind, as emperor Elberhard has generously proposed, would be of aid to stop the French advance, because at this very moment, there is little hope of even waging a defensive war against France without any influx of heavy cavalry.

If Metz and Bruges fall this year, then the road to Frankfurt and Nuremburg is wide open. And we are all aware that our heartlands are almost completely undefended and would require even more time to be reinforced.

[TinCow]

I would like to point out that if Genoa falls, Bavaria will consist only of the citadel at Innsbruck and even that settlement is threatened by a nearby Hungarian force. No Duchy is in a more dire situation than Bavaria.

[FactionHeir]

Of course I am aware of the Bavarian plight, but as of now, both Genoa and Innsbruck stand unbesieged, while Bruges and Metz will likely fall to the French unless some miracle happens, leaving both Duchies with exactly two counties.

However, Swabia has less than 1 full army and Bavaria has two armies at her disposal.

I will not argue over who would be more deserving or who has absolutely greater need. Both Duchies are badly hit and could use some help.

[TinCow]

That is absurd. First of all, I do not think Bruges is in any serious risk of falling. Ludwig von Bohmen is a capable commander and he has a large army to help him defend the city. The French forces that besiege him are not unusually highly experienced or otherwise advantaged in any exceptional manner. I expect Bruges to resist the siege and destroy the attacking force, thus limiting Swabia's only threat to the movements around Metz.

Furthermore, I do not know how you can possibly say that Bavaria has two armies at her disposal. BHA Gerhard has been all but destroyed and BHA Otto is the only significant force remaining in Bavaria. If you mean that the Kaiser's army counts as a Bavarian army, I should remind you that it is moving on Venice, which is an Austrian city, and is not earmarked to aid Milan or Genoa. Genoa will almost certainly be under siege by a powerful French army next year.

Furthermore, the Imperial Knights you are requesting are on foot and will take many years to reach Swabia. By the time they arrive, the issue will be decided there one way or another. In contrast, they can be of immediate assistance on the Italian front. It is simply absurd to send them to Swabia at this time.

[gibsonsg91921]

We must cut the size of Household Armies that are in reserve and continue to have taxes high. I understand there are few reserve Household Armies, but we must be conservative nonetheless.

[AussieGiant]

My Lords, Gentlemen,

Make your cases here and go ahead and commence your authorised attacks using the forces under your command (OOC: The save is open for any an all generals to take the initiative. I've taken screenies of the opening events so do as you please), once these have finished I'll then make the determinations I must as Chancellor.

I'm on the way to Ragusa as I write this so I shall be back with the 2nd AHA by the end of this season.

I have to point out at this time that there is no possible way I will authorise a 6 year trip for four regiments of DIK when they can be engaged in battle effectively right now...that simply will not happen at this time.

Likewise von Kassel will be ordered to leave whatever troops he deems necessary to defend Palermo and then proceed to the southern part of Italy to commence offensive actions down there.

If you're an army commander you better be productive right now or I will begin reducing regiments and allocating resources to commanders that can produce results immediately. The only exceptions are Swabia and Franconia. Although I am now loathed to use Staufen given the plague or to invest resources in war theater's which are deadlocked with the enemy.

Duke Steffen's recent actions are an example of what must be done to receive what little resources I maybe able to eek out of this situation.

The Chancellor.

[OverKnight]

A letter arrives from Outremer.


Kaiser Elberhard, Chancellor Arnold and my fellow Electors. It seems that the Greeks have left the way to Antioch open after the destruction of Captain Modestos and his men. I am dispatching Sir Andreas with a portion of the Army of Outremer, including Cannon, to retake the city. Once the city is taken, I will make my way, once again, to the Iron Bridge with the remainder of the army.

The reconquest has started. It may take a long time, but by God it has finally begun.

On the topic of reinforcements and expenses, I have suffecient men at the moment. Though if Antioch is taken it will need repairs and militia troops when the city can recruit them.

May God aid Duke Arnold in his duties. No Chancellor has faced such difficulties.

Viceroy Matthias

[AussieGiant]

Arnold:

I've spoken to Sir Andreas already Viceroy and he is cleared to proceed as you have planned.

God speed and good luck. Some good news is desperately needed. Might I also add that Fritz has done an impressive job near Hamburg.

Austria nobles:

I would ask Lord Zirn to split his forces as best as possible and attack the Hungarian half stack between him and Vienna and also send part of the 1st AHA to Vienna to assist in the defense of the siege which is surely about to begin.

I would also ask Lorzen Zirn to destroy the Polish forces near Zagreb!!!

Austria!! Attack now or we shall lose the initiative.

The Chancellor

[econ21]

Elberhard:

Chancellor, Electors, I present to you ... Venice.

She is but a shadow of her former self, with not even a functioning market. But she is still Venice, the love of my uncle Leopold and the most @#$%^&!!!ing beautiful city in the world.

In view of the losses my army is sustaining and the impracticality of transferring them to Swabia, I will retain command of the four spare regiments of dismounted Imperial knights for now. They guard the bridge to Venice as we speak.

In light of the formidable Byzantine army at Bologna, careful consideration must be given to the movement and command of Bavarian Household Army Otto. One of the bridges in North Italy would appear to be the most defensible location. And I wonder if young Hans von Bavaria should be assigned as an aide to Count Karolinger (who is on reserve duty) just in case? It might be wise for his Duke or the Chancellor to contact Hans to check on his availability.

[Zim]

Another letter arrives from Outremer, bearing the mark of Andreas von Salzgitter.


Gentlemen, Antioch has been retaken for about the loss of 40 spearmen. The Byzantines left it in bad shape, and many buildings need repaired. I would kindly ask permission of the Chancellor for taxes to be set to low if Matthias does not give instructions that forbid it. It is needed to keep the order here.

Also, loyal merchants, gladdened of our return, have donated a little over 1,000 florins to the Imperial Coffers. If at all possible, perhaps this could be spent on repairs or militia to guard the city and keep order.

Thank you for reading,
Andreas von Salzgitter, Crusader

[TinCow]

This is splendid news! With the recapture of Venice and Antioch, along with the possibility of saving Hamburg, our financial situation may turn around soon enough. If we can generate sufficient profit to recruit on at least two fronts at once, I believe we will be able to emerge from this situation victorious.

[Ramses II CP]

Indeed, brilliantly done Chancellor, you appear to be leading us to victory on nearly all fronts with minimal sacrifices!

(OOC: Err, Fritz is still in the field, so this doesn't make much sense, but after his 'thoughts' in the battle I felt guilty or something. :idea2: )

Fritz von Kastilien

:egypt:

[OverKnight]

A letter arrives from Outremer


Electors,

With the seizure of Antioch, I would like to announce that it is, once again, the capital of Outremer.

This leaves Acre without a governor. I am pleased to elevate Sir Andreas von Salzgitter to the rank of Crusader Count. Acre is now his to command.

I congratulate Count Andreas, he more than deserves it.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Herrmann Steffen:

RIGHT!!!

Let's get down to business, shall we?

*Herrmann carefully examines all the spots on the Bavarian bench before choosing one, dusting it off, and sitting down. He looks around, then promptly rises.*

How do you do everyone, my name is Herrmann Steffen, I'm honored to be here, blah blah blah. Actually, I'm not - well, I am, but I'm not honored to be here here...

Anyway!

My point is, why am I stuck in bloody Nuremburg?! The place isn't even Bavarian anymore! What, did they think I, at the wisened age of 16, would be a good governor? HAH! Why am I not down in Italy, fighting with my comrades to take Italy back! Or...

*Herrmann rummages around.*

Christ Almighty, are there no maps around in this place?!

*After about a minute's waiting, a page carrying a large pile of scrolls rushes over to Herrmann.*

Much better. As I was saying: Or...

*Herrmann undoes one of the scrolls, finds his place, and points dramatically.*

Prague!!!

The place is in danger of a Polish attack. It must not be allowed to fall! Lorenz Zirn, an extremely capable general, is on the scene but he could use some extra heavy cavalry, could he not?

Chancellor, or Steward, or Kaiser, or whoever the heck's in charge of this operation, if you send me to Prague right now then I could get there in time to assist Lorenz in any operation we might plan for this campaign season! He gets some help, Prague gets saved, I get knighted... everybody wins!

*He pauses, then adds as an afterthought.*

Oh, congrats Uncle Matthias on all your victories in Outremer.

[Ramses II CP]

Yes, business, shall we? What in the name of all that is Holy is that pathetic old wreck doing controlling the Empire? Duke Arnold is ill, has he no second? Does the position truly devolve instantly to the Kaiser?

Why, the man still blathers on about my proclamation as though every man in Europe with letters hasn't already read it.

Furthermore what was a bloody Russian plague ship doing at the docks in Ragusa? Does our esteemed Kaiser have no comment on the matter? No concern for the health of our Chancellor? No dispatching his personal physician to the scene?

This smacks of treachery gentlemen! Treachery on the part of the Rus, if not... other parties as well. The Byzantines for one, and likely their sycophants the world over as well. Ragusa is not far from their border or their Italian ports, and certainly they have the means to purchase and outfit a ship as Russian.

The Reich is suffering a dark day. God help Duke Arnold, and God help the Reich!

Fritz von Kastilien

(OOC: Okay, I'm trapped at Hamburg momentarily, so consider this on hold until I get free or a letter or something. Couldn't let the Kaiser's comments pass. ;))

:egypt:

[OverKnight]

A message arrives from Outremer.


Kaiser Elberhard and my fellow Electors,

I have taken Adana in a night assault. The first settlement we took in the East has now been returned to Outremer, praise be to the Allmighty.

Casualties were light for attacking a Citadel.

Let me share these scouting reports as well.

https://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb88/douglaslain/vulnerablegreek.jpg

We have breached the main Byzantine line in the east, the settlements behind it are highly vulnerable. If this body and the Kaiser deem it wise, the sacking of these two Greek settlements would aid our treasury and disrupt our mortal enemy.

While no edict authorizing the permanent seizure of Caesarea has been passed, I feel it would be a welcome addition to Outremer. As a Citadel, it would replace Aleppo, and it would be easy to hold in the face of religious unrest. Iconium is another story, I feel it should just be raided for now.

I await the input of this body and the decision of the Kaiser.

I also pray that Chancellor Arnold will recover and be able to resume his duties.

Viceroy Matthias Steffen

Edit: Post Scriptum: I ordered repairs for the walls to begin at Adana. I made a bit of a mess going in, but if the Kaiser feels it is too expensive, I'm sure repairs can be delayed for a few years. I also took the liberty of razing the Catapult works for 1066 florins.

[Privateerkev]

Dieter unrolls a copy of the Charter on his desk

Lets see...

I'm looking for the part of the Charter that says that the Kaiser automatically takes over as Chancellor when the current Chancellor can not perform his duties.

Hmmm....

I can't find that part.

Can someone tell me what clause stipulates this?

Anyone?

[flyd]

Arnold is still chancellor. If he wishes to have someone he trusts run day to day matters for a while, I see no issue with that.

[Privateerkev]

Ok, can someone please point out the clause in the Charter that allows the Chancellor to choose a second.

Nothing against the Kaiser, but I did not vote for him to be Chancellor. And since the Charter does not go over this possibility, it is obvious we need some sort of legal resolution.

Or do we just ignore inconvenient laws?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Herrmann Steffen:

Well, someone's got to keep this show running! I mean, we all saw what happened during the period where there was no central leadership. We all remember right? Treachery, massive loss of territories, massive loss of cash, three separate rebellions... death... uh...

Anyway!!!

I agree that this issue needs to be addressed at the next Diet Session, but doing it now would be a waste of time. By the time we drag everyone's butts in here to call for a session and propose resolution that will straighten this out, Uncle Arnold will have fully recovered from the plague and yelled at all of us for acting like little fairies.

[Privateerkev]

Ok, can someone point out the clause that makes it legal for there to be "second" to Chancellor until the next Diet session?

And I am still waiting on answers to my first two questions.

So, now that makes 3.

And it pains me to hear that following the law is a "waste of time."

[flyd]

Point out the clause that makes it illegal. This is also hardly the first time a steward has been appointed. With a lack of law either prohibiting or allowing, we'll follow tradition.