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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
No. She was so bad during her debate v-Macron that she lost something like 8%. I am not a big believer of Polls, but remember she was given as front runner at the 1st round, then beaten at the 2nd, whoever was in front of her.
If you can follow the extreme-right/fascist channels on youtube, they considered this election as a defeat. Not because they thought she could win, but that she could climb towards the 50%. And she crushed. Her niece is seeing the problem and decided to withdrawn to prepared positions. Some key figures of the movement are now in disgrace as the tactics are now questioned.
The best illustration of this is the FN should be seen as THE opposition by the Macronist media.
But the fire power is aimed at Mélenchon, from the France Insoumise, leftist.
Reason is Le Pen and Macron have the same agenda in term of economical agenda, but differ on Europe... Fascism doesn't scare Capitalism.
I'm not sure how this relates to my post.
She underperformed from expectations, the party may still underperform, but with every terrorist attack and migrant riot over the next few years that macron fails to stop she will go out and say I told you so and the country will edge towards her.
As for that last line; are you kidding me? Le Pen is as milquetoast a fascist as it gets and the western media were still in panic mode up until the debate.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Le Pen gave up. She will not go as candidate to be a MP. It is official...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Citation needed, all I've seen is her daughter quitting politics.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
Reason is Le Pen and Macron have the same agenda in term of economical agenda, but differ on Europe...
And Melenchon shares with Le Pen her love of Putin. Under a close scrutiny everyone will be found to have similar views on something.
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Re: French Presidential Election
The childless mutti is delighted at least, first tanks now banks.
Nexit pretty please. Ain't going to happen I know, the fourth-reich is too strong
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
And Melenchon shares with Le Pen her love of Putin. Under a close scrutiny everyone will be found to have similar views on something.
That is of course a lie. Not one you create, one you repeat...
However, I give credit you don't read French, so question this would be difficult...
The Russian equivalent of Mélenchon is in jail thanks to Putin...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Greyblades
Citation needed, all I've seen is her daughter quitting politics.
Daughter? Her niece said she is quitting because she wants to be with her daughter. She just separated from partner apparently...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Niece, daughter, regardless I have not seen any indication Marine herself has quit politics and am wondering where you are sourcing your comment.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Not Marine. Well, technically, she has resigned from FN when she was qualified for the 2nd Round...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Wow, Macron's wife was his high-school teacher.
...Well, good for him!
Quote:
Je trouve Madame #BrigitteMacron bien plus jeune et bien plus élégante que tous ces détracteurs que je lis.. et surtout à quoi ça sert!? pic.twitter.com/TR0sruvU7d
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
That is of course a lie. Not one you create, one you repeat...
However, I give credit you don't read French, so question this would be difficult...
The Russian equivalent of Mélenchon is in jail thanks to Putin...
AFAIK, you don't read either Ukrainian or Russian, yet you could form your opinion of niceties of Ukrainian politics.
I don't read French, yet I can read some French sources in English:
http://www.france24.com/en/20170413-...ners-run-money
Quote:
Critics have slammed Mélenchon as soft on Russian President Vladimir Putin’s expansionism, tending as the Frenchman does to view Russia as a bulwark against US imperialism. “It’s the moment to negotiate borders,” Mélenchon said during one televised debate. “We must discuss all borders. For example, the border between Russia and Ukraine, is it at the extremity of Crimea or before?” he asked, raising the ire of an incredulous Benoît Hamon, the Socialist candidate, in particular.
As well as others:
https://intmassmedia.com/2017/04/21/...-are-confused/
Quote:
His Advisor on international Affairs of the George kuzmanović (Djordje Kuzmanovic) said on March 28, the Association “Franco-Russian dialogue” that the post of President of the Republic Jean-Luc Mélenchon would have established “a warm and (…) a partnership with Vladimir Putin or any other President elected by Russians”.
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...sidential-race
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Mélenchon is essentially a nationalist, despite his internationalist credo. And his sympathies for autocratic strongmen such as Vladimir Putin or Hugo Chávez cannot be easily swept aside, as if these were just missteps in an otherwise promising platform.
Quote:
But what is most striking about the far-left leader is how he’s systematically refrained from ascribing any responsibility to Russia over the war in Ukraine and the annexation of Crimea
https://qz.com/961177/french-electio...ladimir-putin/
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A fiery demagogue in the communist tradition, Melenchon, is staunchly anti-American, detests the EU and globalization, and heavily favors Russia on geopolitical issues like the Ukraine crisis. He also opposes what he calls “illegal” sanctions against annexation of the Crimea.
http://www.politico.eu/article/jean-...ion-president/
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The other candidate that Mélenchon’s foreign policy outlook chimes with is National Front leader Marine Le Pen. On the EU, NATO and Russia, there is scarcely any daylight between them.
http://www.euronews.com/2017/04/14/j...f-his-policies
Quote:
International
develop closer ties with Russia.
Evidently, those "lies" about John Cougar Mellencamp are shared by too many people.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Oh look they elected a globalist banker
shock
awe
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Re: French Presidential Election
Worse, a French globalist banker.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
AFAIK, you don't read either Ukrainian or Russian, yet you could form your opinion of niceties of Ukrainian politics.
I don't read French, yet I can read some French sources in English: Evidently, those "lies" about John Cougar Mellencamp are shared by too many people.
I didn't form opinion based on other opinions as you do. But we had this "debate" before I won't start again.
You believe in the truth by repetition. Not me.
Concerning Mélenchon, the "international" media repeat what the French Media are saying. It is as simple that the proof by facebook, as I doubt they have each of them a specialist on French politic.
When you are not in favour to start a war against Russia you are pro-Putin. None on the link you provide is able to give one reference of Mélenchon's pro-Putin stance, or a fact. Or if you want more details about who use chemical weapons, you are pro-Assad.
All opponents to Macron/Holland were painted as Pro-Putin, pro Assad, etc.
Any way, I will be able to convince you as you don't want to have evidence when Putin's name is mentioned. So...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
I didn't form opinion based on other opinions as you do.
So you formed your opinion on events in Ukraine based on personal experience?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
You believe in the truth by repetition. Not me.
And you believe in world conspiracy against someone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
It is as simple that the proof by facebook, as I doubt they have each of them a specialist on French politic.
I doubt NONE of them do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
None on the link you provide is able to give one reference of Mélenchon's pro-Putin stance, or a fact.
The France24 reference containing Melenchon's citation says about his suggestion to "discuss the borders", first of all between Russia and Ukraine. Doesn't it chime with what Russia desires after annexing Crimea? And doesn't he realize what Pandora's box he wants to open by starting such a discussion?
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Re: French Presidential Election
1st question: when I see the insignia of the 2nd SS Das Reich on a Ukrainian Unit, I don't really need a detail opinion to make mine...
2nd question: No need a world conspiracy, just all media referring to one unique source... And conversion of interests as well...
3rd question: You are right, they just repeat what their French colleagues are saying...
4th question: Nope. Mélenchon did stress out that borders were not discussed. Not there is a need to discuss. He was quite clear that in fact he is against the annexation of Crimea by Russia, and it should be negotiated for a return (and the conditions allowing it) of Crimea in Ukraine. But of course, that wouldn't do it for "friend of Putin"...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Greyblades
Worse, a French globalist banker.
The worst ones, ask anyone.
Well, election stolen, now we'll have the worst of Hollande cooked by right-leaning clones...
Our Prime Minister is an ex-Areva executive... well Areva costs us billions every year, having been foolishly managed for fifteen years (and it still is). The man knows what it is to be a mercenary: first working to bleed the Republic, successfully, then beeing chosed to drive this same Republic out of mud. I already love this one.
Oh my... Voted Mélenchon on round one, blank on the second one. In my village, the Heiress got 35 first, 46 second. Pity. I'll soon leave for a place where she got 15 and 22. And will feel better there. Heading back far west, just in time. Bye-bye froggy white trash, Breton again on the first of July.
Shoud have voted for this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Cheminade , who wants to send the all morons on Planet Mars. Or did I misunderstand?
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
1st question: when I see the insignia of the 2nd SS Das Reich on a Ukrainian Unit, I don't really need a detail opinion to make mine...
Seeing one picture (like it was with Tyagnybok "making a nazi salute") is enough to form an opinion (like Ukraine is ruled by Nazis)? Then you are prone to jumping to conclusions and needless generalizations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
2nd question: No need a world conspiracy, just all media referring to one unique source... And conversion of interests as well...
I see. All the world is against a poor innocent man. He is in a besieged fortress. That somehow sounds familiar...
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
4th question: Nope. Mélenchon did stress out that borders were not discussed. Not there is a need to discuss. He was quite clear that in fact he is against the annexation of Crimea by Russia, and it should be negotiated for a return (and the conditions allowing it) of Crimea in Ukraine. But of course, that wouldn't do it for "friend of Putin"...
I refer you to his advisor's words that Melenchon would like to establish a warm partnership with Putin. He is against annexation but he wants to be a friend of the annexer? :dizzy2:
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Re: French Presidential Election
Name of the adviser? By the way, this prove you don't know how the guys work... Mélenchon's position is Russia is not an enemy... Again, I think, and I don't blame you for this, you rely on polluted sources...
The 2 others present no interest.
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Re: French Presidential Election
This is still about France, right?
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Re: French Presidential Election
You know Gilrandir. You can speak on how to make an apple pie and he will blame Putin for the sugar coating...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
Name of the adviser?
I gave this quote, but you seem to need repeating. Here you go:
His Advisor on international Affairs of the George kuzmanović (Djordje Kuzmanovic) said on March 28, the Association “Franco-Russian dialogue” that the post of President of the Republic Jean-Luc Mélenchon would have established “a warm and (…) a partnership with Vladimir Putin or any other President elected by Russians”.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
Again, I think, and I don't blame you for this, you rely on polluted sources...
If all the sources I referred to are polluted, perhaps the problem is not with the sources, but with the object they talk about?
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
You know Gilrandir. You can speak on how to make an apple pie and he will blame Putin for the sugar coating...
Sugar coating for an apple-pie? ~:confused:
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
Sugar coating for an apple-pie? ~:confused:
French Apple traditionally has a thin glaze (think very thin royal icing) on the top of the pie.
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Re: French Presidential Election
"His Advisor on international Affairs of the George kuzmanović (Djordje Kuzmanovic) said on March 28, the Association “Franco-Russian dialogue” that the post of President of the Republic Jean-Luc Mélenchon would have established “a warm and (…) a partnership with Vladimir Putin or any other President elected by Russians”." Right.
"Jean-Luc Melenchon wants to build relations of cooperation on science, culture and peace with Russia, whoever is its leader," Kuzmanovic said on his Twitter. This is the real one... Sorry... Took me some time and efforts to find it, but there is nothing I wouldn't do for an Organist...
“Un oubli”, explique celui qui a notamment été mis en cause en début d’année par le journaliste Nicolas Hénin dans son livre La France russe (éd. Fayard, 19 euros). Présenté comme la “muse de Mélenchon sur la question russe, ce dernier était situé sur ‘un axe rouge-brun’. Des “allégations complètement fausses” que l’intéressé dément formellement .» Il dément mais Besse Desmoulières répète quand même. Il s’agit pourtant de la reprise d’un ragot d’extrême droite sur fond de délit de sale nom. Monsieur Kuzmanovic est français, et l’origine serbe de ses parents ne donne pas le droit de le stigmatiser. Il n’est en rien ma « muse russe », expression dont les sous-entendus sont assez clairs pour me révulser de dégoût pour son auteure. Ce que les pécores qui pérorent ne peuvent savoir en lisant les vieilles fiches des collègues, c’est que Djordje a servi dans l’armée française sous drapeau ONU en Afghanistan. Suggérer qu’il soit un « rouge brun » est une infamie gratuitement énoncée sans le début d’un argument." Jean Luc Mélenchon in http://melenchon.fr/2016/11/14/le-mo...nchon-bashing/
That is the perfect illustration of what I said: France 24 repeating an "information" published by "Le Monde"... Information without any basis.
If you want, I give you Mélenchon's site, then you go to research the name of his "adviser" and you see the result. Deal?
http://melenchon.fr/
Here, you can find what Mélenchon really said:"Nous Français, n'avons rien à faire dans une histoire pareille, nous n'avons rien à faire à encourager les provocations contre les Russes, cela dit sans sympathie pour le gouvernement russe", "We French, have nothing to do in such story, we have nothing to do in encouraging provocations against Russia, this said with no sympathy for the Russian Government"
https://www.marianne.net/politique/j...ne-et-la-syrie
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
“Un oubli”, explique celui qui a notamment été mis en cause en début d’année par le journaliste Nicolas Hénin dans son livre La France russe (éd. Fayard, 19 euros). Présenté comme la “muse de Mélenchon sur la question russe, ce dernier était situé sur ‘un axe rouge-brun’. Des “allégations complètement fausses” que l’intéressé dément formellement .» Il dément mais Besse Desmoulières répète quand même. Il s’agit pourtant de la reprise d’un ragot d’extrême droite sur fond de délit de sale nom. Monsieur Kuzmanovic est français, et l’origine serbe de ses parents ne donne pas le droit de le stigmatiser. Il n’est en rien ma « muse russe », expression dont les sous-entendus sont assez clairs pour me révulser de dégoût pour son auteure. Ce que les pécores qui pérorent ne peuvent savoir en lisant les vieilles fiches des collègues, c’est que Djordje a servi dans l’armée française sous drapeau ONU en Afghanistan. Suggérer qu’il soit un « rouge brun » est une infamie gratuitement énoncée sans le début d’un argument." Jean Luc Mélenchon in
http://melenchon.fr/2016/11/14/le-mo...nchon-bashing/
Now what's the use of trying to show something to a person who can't read it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
That is the perfect illustration of what I said: France 24 repeating an "information" published by "Le Monde"... Information without any basis.
If you want, I give you Mélenchon's site, then you go to research the name of his "adviser" and you see the result. Deal?
http://melenchon.fr/
Do you enjoy urging non-French speakers to find something on a french site?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
The fact that you identify with the man makes me cautious in accepting this quote at a face value. Can the quote you give exclude others of a different nature?
Generally, I believe similar opinions that come from different quarters more that one opinion of an emotionally invested individual. I see no ground to suspect all sources (especially the British ones - I referred to the Guardian) in attempt to blacken a foreign politician. And I greatly doubt your claim that these sources neither understand anything in French politics nor have someone among their staff who do.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
Generally, I believe similar opinions that come from different quarters more that one opinion of an emotionally invested individual.
It was about time.
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
Do you enjoy urging non-French speakers to find something on a french site?
Of course he does, who doesn't?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
The fact that you identify with the man makes me cautious in accepting this quote at a face value. Can the quote you give exclude others of a different nature?
Melenchon has a very awkward leniency towards Maduro and the Castros. But no tenderness for Putin or North Korea, never. I'm not Brenus, maybe you can trust me. He just said Russia is an important actor and as such shall not be treated lightly. Isn't it what you want to make us understand too?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gilrandir
Generally, I believe similar opinions that come from different quarters more that one opinion of an emotionally invested individual. I see no ground to suspect all sources (especially the British ones - I referred to the Guardian) in attempt to blacken a foreign politician. And I greatly doubt your claim that these sources neither understand anything in French politics nor have someone among their staff who do.
Those sources have repeatedly proved unable to understand their own country's politics. Their staffs all come from the same brain-factories. Understanding there is still strenght in western communism is just out of question: they MUST support everything that looks a bit like good old Stalin, you know... And have councellors making the link with the Fascist. Because commies always seek for a Ribbentropp-Molotov Pact, you know...
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Re: French Presidential Election
"Generally, I believe similar opinions that come from different quarters more that one opinion of an emotionally invested individual." That is why I gave you 2 possibilities: Marianne is not known to be nice towards Mélenchon. Founder is more Bayrou (Center Right, so Rightist)...
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Re: French Presidential Election
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Brenus
"Generally, I believe similar opinions that come from different quarters more that one opinion of an emotionally invested individual." That is why I gave you 2 possibilities: Marianne is not known to be nice towards Mélenchon. Founder is more Bayrou (Center Right, so Rightist)...
This matter winds itself ever in new riddles, as Faramir used to say. Who's Marianne, who's Founder and is Bayrou an adjective to have degrees of comparison?