Human flesh search engine

[English assassin]

http://technology.timesonline.co.uk/...cle4213681.ece

No, not the latest aid for German cannibals, instead its a lynching for the digital age.

when 21-year-old Gao Qianhui sat down in front her webcam last month, she had far more important issues on her mind. Upset that the three-day mourning period for the 80,000 victims of the earthquake in southwest China had disrupted her television viewing schedule, she launched into a five-minute spew of vitriol and then posted the video online.

"I turn on the TV and see injured people, corpses, rotten bodies... I don’t want to watch these things. I have no choice.” Ms Gao sighed: “Come on, how many of you died? Just a few, right? There are so many people in China anyway.”

Within hours, Ms Gao had become the latest victim of a human flesh search engine, where Chinese netizens become cyber-vigilantes and online communities turn into the world’s largest lynch mobs.

Using the vast human power behind the Chinese web, every detail of Ms Gao’s life, from her home and work address in Liaoning province, north east China, to the fact that her parents were divorced, was dug up and published on hundreds of forums and chatrooms.

“Now humiliate her,” ordered one internet user, Yang Zhiyan.

The outraged reaction to the video drew the attention of the local police and they detained Ms Gao the next day. They did not make clear what law she was alleged to have broken.

Its not about Ms Gao's views, but about the social impact of having so much information available about more or less anyone.

Obviously, you don't need a mobile phone to exclude someone socially, and you can bully someone face to face. But the internet seems to have changed two things. First is that people do leave a quite amazing amount of personal information out there, that is very very easy to assemble. (Note to UK users: always go on the "marked" electoral register, always go ex directory.) And once it's out there it's out there for ever.

The other thing is that everyone can play. This woman needed to be told by a friend or her parents that her views were callous. She didn't need 5000 losers publicly baying for blood.

And yet, you can't avoid it. In my day as a student the evening's venue was just passed around by word of mouth. Now, if you don't use social networking sites and the like, you won't hear about a lot of what goes on. Text message bullying is a problem in schools, but if a teenager doesn't have a phone, they won't be part of the scene.

Better, worse, just different? I find the reduction in privacy pretty scary, but then if you always expected the whole world to be able to find out a lot about you, maybe you don't mind? Maybe the distributed group think of human flesh search engine is the future? If it is, is that any worse than the old days of a media mogul dictating what we read from the top down? Will we all have to grow up, eg about people in public life,when every candidate is of an age when their teenage facebook entries can be accessed and we can read about their drunken exploits?

I don't like it. I realise that the technology is just making visible less pleasant aspects of people's behavior (internets don't bully people, people bully people) but still, I find it all rather orwellian. After all, if the people collectively are Big Brother, there really can be no hope of a revolution.

Any thoughts?

And yes, the irony of posting this musing online has not escaped me...

[InsaneApache]

Any thoughts?

Yes.

[Adrian II]

Already some ten years ago, a story caught my eye about a French bankrobber on the run who was caught and arrested by tracing his electronic trail: credit card use, car rental, cctv pics. These days I guess the general public can do that, too, given a few hacks and some pointers from the authorities.*

I think that mob behaviour hasn't changed and that the Web is just another venue where it manifests itself.

The truly new issue is contained in the questions about privacy. How much of ourselves can we conceal from the rest of the world if we're supposed to work and live in a 'total' network environment - and I mean literally the rest of the entire world population?

Not much. The thought is depressing.

Edit
* watch this

[Reverend Joe]

I'm gonna buy a motorcycle and abandon society as much as possible.

In all seriousness, stuff like this scares me so damn much. There is no word in the english language strong enough to express my loathing of the no-privacy state of existence that I have been born into. Really that motorcycle thing isn't much of a joke, and it's not very funny, because I'm not really joking. I really feel like I am being driven further and further away from modern society. The only thing keeping me connected is human companionship and love. I hate it so much.

[Marshal Murat]

Mob mindsets will probably become more prevalent, especially in chatrooms and forums such as these. Under pseudonyms, respectable and despicable can mix in anonymity. While not a bad thing, the best way to diffuse mob mentality is to identify people individually. Here, however, it's so much more difficult to do so, and it will only cause greater problems.

That's probably why I want to move to somewhere remote and live. With the natives who cook lamb and baklava.

[Whacker]

My immediate reaction to this was, "This does not bode well for us when the zombies attack."

[Viking]

Well, I just did a Google search on myself; and I cannot say I was able to dig up much. Not even a photo.

[English assassin]

Good for you. I get a photo, work address, full work contact details, career summary, school, university, subject and grade at university (fortunately not too shabby), you can infer my age pretty accurately from the university details, the London borough I live in (and again you can reasonably guess which part), and my wife's name. Thats just on the first page of google. then google my wife's name and you get our home postcode. I haven't bothered doing it, but I know that with that data you can then access the online records of birth certificates, which will give you our full home address and the names and dates of birth of our children.

And that is with me being fairly careful to keep my net presence low. This is just the data forced out of me by being a partner in a law firm, having run for election, and having had children.

And that is the problem. You have to give up a lot of data to play any part in society. And that data is then out there for ever (the big break in terms of getting my data is data that the BBC is STILL displaying from an election in 2001. Which I lost anyway. Come to think of it I may e mail the Information Commissioner about that.)

[KukriKhan]

Well, I just did a Google search on myself; and I cannot say I was able to dig up much. Not even a photo.

Heh. Me too. Results: I live in New York, British Columbia, Rhode Island, Ireland... apparently everywhere but California. I am a Doctor, Lawyer, Photographer, Professor of History, Physics, and Anthropology. I sell Real Estate, and have run for political office in Kentucky, Florida, and Michigan. I once served time in an El Paso, Texas jail.

I am an amazing fellow! Or at least my namesakes are. So, I'm not overly-worried about my internet footprints at this time. But, point taken, as to the future, when Google et al, will be more able to drill down thru results to "find" the actual 'me'.

At the moment, it's still easier to find me using a phone book, than it is to build an accurate bio using 'net search engines.

-edit-
having cross-posted with EA, who got the opposite result with his name, I'll start to worry more.

[Adrian II]

And that is the problem. You have to give up a lot of data to play any pasrt in society. And that data is then out there for ever [..]

Voilà.

I remember interviewing Slavoj Žižek years before he became a campus guru. This was after the fall of both the USSR and Yugoslavia, but Žižek was still fascinated with the Stalinism of the period in which he grew up. It permeated his thinking. According to Žižek the Internet, which came thirty years after Stalin's death, would have been the perfect Stalinist tool. He said: "The brilliant catch is that you have to be in cyberspace to exist, and at the same time you can no longer erase anything you have ever done there, including the time and location in which you did it. YOu are building your own file, and any authority can use it against you at any convenient moment."

[English assassin]

having cross-posted with EA, who got the opposite result with his name, I'll start to worry more.

To be fair, Kukri, I could also have been a hang-glider who died recently and had a number of touching tributes, or a variety of minor figures in Cornish local government (my surname originates in and is still more or less only found in Cornwall).

But assuming you know I am alive, and don't live in Cornwall, you get the rest.

The sense of pseudonyms on internet forums becomes very clear.

[naut]

Well, I just did a Google search on myself; and I cannot say I was able to dig up much. Not even a photo.

If I took Google's results to be the truth I'd be an old scientist. Two, problems I'm not old or a scientist.

Much easier to use Facebook, since so many people fail to use Privacy settings.

I'm gonna buy a motorcycle and abandon society as much as possible.

[KukriKhan]

To be fair, Kukri, I could also have been a hang-glider who died recently and had a number of touching tributes, or a variety of minor figures in Cornish local government (my surname originates in and is still more or less only found in Cornwall).

But assuming you know I am alive, and don't live in Cornwall, you get the rest.

The sense of pseudonyms on internet forums becomes very clear.

Indeed.

Nevertheless, thinking about it, and the fate of China's Ms. Gao in your OP, I admit the liklihood of successfully identifying and locating the human behind the KukriKhan pseudonym (if 20 determined searchers made a concerted effort) would be quite high.

A sobering thought; and a depressing one, given AdrianII's interview with Slavoj Žižek.

[Viking]

Good for you. I get a photo, work address, full work contact details, career summary, school, university, subject and grade at university (fortunately not too shabby), you can infer my age pretty accurately from the university details, the London borough I live in (and again you can reasonably guess which part), and my wife's name. Thats just on the first page of google. then google my wife's name and you get our home postcode. I haven't bothered doing it, but I know that with that data you can then access the online records of birth certificates, which will give you our full home address and the names and dates of birth of our children.

And that is with me being fairly careful to keep my net presence low. This is just the data forced out of me by being a partner in a law firm, having run for election, and having had children.

And that is the problem. You have to give up a lot of data to play any part in society. And that data is then out there for ever (the big break in terms of getting my data is data that the BBC is STILL displaying from an election in 2001. Which I lost anyway. Come to think of it I may e mail the Information Commissioner about that.)

Well I get my full adress up (and my mobilephone number even), fair enough. On the google search there's only two persons that could be me, also.

Nevertheless, thinking about it, and the fate of China's Ms. Gao in your OP, I admit the liklihood of successfully identifying and locating the human behind the KukriKhan pseudonym (if 20 determined searchers made a concerted effort) would be quite high.

There is indeed a way to identify me also, starting with my Org nick. That's being me and knowing how to do it; for someone random I expect the odds to be rather low.

[Louis VI the Fat]

I get a photo, work address, full work contact details, career summary, school, university, subject and grade at university (fortunately not too shabby), you can infer my age pretty accurately from the university details, the London borough I live in (and again you can reasonably guess which part), and my wife's name. Thats just on the first page of google. then google my wife's name and you get our home postcode.

*checks internet*

Hey, cool! I see that you are practically neighbours with Doris lessing! What's she like?


Me, I always try to be careful about what records I leave, and what private information I share on the internets. There's not much one can do about the first - it never ceases to amaze me for example what amount of information just about any civil servant I ever speak to manages to retrieve at the push of a button.

One other thing, slightly related, is that my passport was stolen a few years ago. Apparantly, somebody somewhere is living a parallel life as, well, me. It keeps coming back at me, all the time. It certainly made for a very interesting afternoon in an East European airport two years ago.

[English assassin]

Hey, cool! I see that you are practically neighbours with Doris Lessing! What's she like?

She's a lovely old lady, until she gets a few Guinnesses in her, then she roams the streets smashing streetlamps with her empties and singing absolutely filthy rugby chants.

And stop messing with my head

[Adrian II]

singing absolutely filthy rugby chants.

Sounds like my kind of girl.

[Whacker]

Sounds like this new search engine is a resounding success for some Orgahs!

[CountArach]

Fortunately I share a last name with a famous Australian cleebrity who recently received a lot of publicity and I have a fairly common first name, so I get plenty of articles written about this celebrity by people with my first name.

Ahhh the joys of anonymity.

[Geoffrey S]

It is kinda creepy. A little while ago I used some very basic information about myself, and using that managed to link it to progressively more personal information - nothing like bank information or the like, but where I live, photo's, regular locations. Not too bothered about it for myself, but more so about younger people.

[cegorach]

Voilà.

I remember interviewing Slavoj Žižek years before he became a campus guru. This was after the fall of both the USSR and Yugoslavia, but Žižek was still fascinated with the Stalinism of the period in which he grew up. It permeated his thinking. According to Žižek the Internet, which came thirty years after Stalin's death, would have been the perfect Stalinist tool. He said: "The brilliant catch is that you have to be in cyberspace to exist, and at the same time you can no longer erase anything you have ever done there, including the time and location in which you did it. YOu are building your own file, and any authority can use it against you at any convenient moment."

So true, but thankfully I am certain people would manage to cheat the authorities thans to the Internet too.


The main issue is the level of popular support - something which is happening with the lynching mob wordwide is quite frightening and the Chinese are the prime example in recent years.

*checks internet*

Hey, cool! I see that you are practically neighbours with Doris lessing! What's she like?


Me, I always try to be careful about what records I leave, and what private information I share on the internets. There's not much one can do about the first - it never ceases to amaze me for example what amount of information just about any civil servant I ever speak to manages to retrieve at the push of a button.

One other thing, slightly related, is that my passport was stolen a few years ago. Apparantly, somebody somewhere is living a parallel life as, well, me. It keeps coming back at me, all the time. It certainly made for a very interesting afternoon in an East European airport two years ago.

Closer than you think...


At least drug smuggling, arms dealing and women trafficking is easier now, Louis, thanks !
or shall I rather thank...
I must admit you have gained rather fearsome reputation in some countries BTW.

[Adrian II]

Closer than you think...

The trouble is that after Cegorach passed that passport to Fragony and he passed it to me, I then sent it to DevDave.

Let me put it this way, Louis, I wouldn't go anywhere near Bangkok using your own name..

[Ironside]

The trouble is that after Cegorach passed that passport to Fragony and he passed it to me, I then sent it to DevDave.

Let me put it this way, Louis, I wouldn't go anywhere near Bangkok using your own name..

Wasn't that around the time he stopped being in Korea and gained the nickname Devastating?

Although, it should been the first time that passport went around the org I think.

Edit: Personally I'm pretty resistant this far, my name shows up in some lists for some competitions, that's about it. I could get plenty of info on a German with the same name though.

[Ronin]

A first impact search with my real full name reveals only the university where I studied...and if you know the usernames I use around the web you can find a couple of avatars with my face from some forums...

I can live with that.

[Reverend Joe]

Tried searching my name under a number of combinations -- full name, full name with quotes (which got literally no hits whatsoever), first and last name with and without middle initial... nothing.

In fact, it seems I have died several times prior to the 1910's.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Full name - no relevant hits, for me or for anyone else with that name.
First and last name - a couple of people (two), no relevant hits

[woad&fangs]

I found myself on the 4th page of a google search.

The first 3 pages were mostly about a dead cop and some guitar player.

[cegorach]

I tried to find myself and didn't - went through 20 google pages with results and nothing.

The Louis passport helped a lot I guess, besides in my work fame is hardly a desirable thing.

[TevashSzat]

Its not that bad for me; Basically everyone knows me by a pseudonym since my real name is really hard to pronounce if you're not a native Chinese speaker. Thus, very few even know my "real" name put on official things. A search of my real name though, brings up my facebook page as the first hit, so that might be a bit alarming....

[LittleGrizzly]

My name is common as crap... i gave up before finding myself, im mainly a jockey but i do a bit of fashion go banned from racing for 17 days recently though... God knows why...