Fun time again Mars , which particular sets of laws would the Soviets have been bound by ?Yes, I'm still a little bitter about the Soviets.
(have a clue ....its one of the reasons the Nazis used to justify some of their war crimes in the East)
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Fun time again Mars , which particular sets of laws would the Soviets have been bound by ?Yes, I'm still a little bitter about the Soviets.
(have a clue ....its one of the reasons the Nazis used to justify some of their war crimes in the East)
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7677551.stm
Another big get america out rallly, yes its mainly driven by Sadr but it still shows something about the will of the people. I'm begining to doubt that we can truely do anything in Iraq anymore. My guess is we're out sometime in the first half of 2010 ethier way.
Even afgahnastan I'm having my doubts with. Yes we've crushed the Talbin yes I don't want them in power, but I don't think we can do anything unless if we flood the countryside with a half million troops and get reeady for a long grinding war of atrrition (which we probably can't afford). No matter how many offensives we make the taliban just reatreat into the mountains, rebuild and strike back. Not to mention that every civillian causiltiy that happens is another recuirting tool for Al quida.
When it occurs to a man that nature does not regard him as important and that she feels she would not maim the universe by disposing of him, he at first wishes to throw bricks at the temple, and he hates deeply the fact that there are no bricks and no temples
-Stephen Crane
AW: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
At least they decided to demonstrate instead of blowing up another marketplace.
"Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?"
-Abraham Lincoln
Four stage strategy from Yes, Minister:
Stage one we say nothing is going to happen.
Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.
Stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there's nothing we can do.
Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it's too late now.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Yeah rightAt least they decided to demonstrate instead of blowing up another marketplace.
So people don't get slaughtered in marketplaces anymore .
So I suppose people getting slaughtered in marketplaces don't count then .
Just because it ain't in your news sources doesn't mean it ain't happening anymore Spmelta...it just means the journalists ain't giving it much attenion nowadays as its got so monotomous
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Violence in general is down, though.
Maybe someone on Sadr's side got the brilliant idea of gathering protestors occasionally and see if that's more effective. For the new President it would be easier to do a "peace with honour" kind of exit then.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Sadr's side ????????? Thats the Iranian theocracy isn't it .Maybe someone on Sadr's side got the brilliant idea of gathering protestors occasionally and see if that's more effective.
Hmmmmm...Sadrs militia ended up fighting the government backed Badr brigade which is funded ,trained and originated from that Iran place with its theocracy thingy isn't it .
Wow Iran got the brilliant idea of telling one group to lay low for a while
Well done Fenring
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
What are you trying to say?
AW: Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
I'm very well aware that the violence is ongoing. I'm just glad that another 200 people weren't taken out by another bomb which for a while was the usual method for 'protesting.' It's obvious Sadr and his gang are trying to use legitimate means to show their influence. Though he's still a guy I'd rather see dead I was just pointing out that I'm happy he's attempting to use soft power as well, didn't realize I needed to explain myself.Originally Posted by Tribesman
Yeah right
So people don't get slaughtered in marketplaces anymore .
So I suppose people getting slaughtered in marketplaces don't count then .
Just because it ain't in your news sources doesn't mean it ain't happening anymore Spmelta...it just means the journalists ain't giving it much attenion nowadays as its got so monotomous
This is my primary news source it tracks a lot of the violence going on in Iraq and is far better than normal news sites when it comes to covering Iraq.
Last edited by spmetla; 10-20-2008 at 06:57.
"Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?"
-Abraham Lincoln
Four stage strategy from Yes, Minister:
Stage one we say nothing is going to happen.
Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.
Stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there's nothing we can do.
Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it's too late now.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Both Iraq, and I believe Afghanistan will turn out to be epic failures. The US isn't necessarily surrendering because it isn't giving anything really to the Iraqis after the pullout period, but it will be a peace I suppose, hopefully it will be a good one. I never liked the idea of Iraq from the beginning, and it's officially destroyed our tenure in Afghanistan. What the US needs to do, is formally withdraw from Iraq, put more boots on the ground in Afghanistan, re-administer from the center, while reaching out in whatever ways it can to rectify the situation there, you know, appease the Pakistanis in some small ways, and unfortunately include the Taliban in the government, hopefully the people might eventually turn sway, but that'd be long after we're already gone.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
And what trend have you noticed there over the past 6 months regarding the contested Kurdish/Arab areas and those where the ex-Sunni terrorists are now being paid by the US ?This is my primary news source it tracks a lot of the violence going on in Iraq and is far better than normal news sites when it comes to covering Iraq.
AW: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
The trend that I've noticed seems to be one of overall decrease in violence. Despite this there continues to be frequent attacks against Iraqi officials and security forces and their families. The contested areas have recently come into the spotlight again, especially Kirkuk, in which Peshmerga forces and Iraqi government forces have had confrontations though not armed conflict, yet. Some of the walled areas of Baghdad are now seeing those walls come down though some of the islands of sunnis in shia seas still retain their blast walls.
The diaspora of insurgents seems to have been primarily into Diyala and Mosul which are now seeing much more violence though not on a scale as was seen previously in the Sunni triangle.
The US paid militias/former terrorists right now are largely the reason that there has been a decrease in violence though many members of these groups are wary of the Iraqi government. The Iraqi governments efforts to incorporate these members into official security forces are being done slowly though there seems little desire to do it at all, the govt. preferring to maintain a Shia dominance in the security forces.
Unfortunately some of the US paid militias/former terrorists are using their 'safe' status to continue violence against the Iraqi govt and/or other militias.
The inability of the Iraqi government to incorporate militiamen into its own organization and payroll and the mistrust of these militiamen against the government could lead to the all out blood letting that was happening earlier. I hope that this issue can be solved somewhat satisfactorily and soon because when the US eventually stops paying these militias/former terrorists what will prevent them from once again becoming 'bad' militias.
Unfortunately I had zero net access from 30May to 28July so I've missed a good portion of news for the last six months. What is your analysis of the last 6 months in relation to the questions you asked me? Same assessment different conclusion or am I missing something big?
Edit: I forgot to mention the migration of a lot Baghdad's christians to Kurdistan and their refusal to leave which is drawing anti christian violence into Kurdistan as well.
Last edited by spmetla; 10-21-2008 at 04:27.
"Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?"
-Abraham Lincoln
Four stage strategy from Yes, Minister:
Stage one we say nothing is going to happen.
Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.
Stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there's nothing we can do.
Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it's too late now.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Wasn't that defense nullified at Nuremburg Tribes? I thought the "they weren't party to any of the relevant treaties" was held to be irrelevant vis-a-vis "crimes against humanity."
"The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman
"The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Seamus , did you notice the word "some" ?
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
I'm considering if I should even bother debating this or not.
Re: America to pull out of Iraq by 2011
Well do yourself a favour and if you do consider it then at least find out which treaties they are and what they say . Then find which specific actions the politicians and military hierachy of the Third Reich decided they could try and get away with because they said they didn't apply to Russians .I'm considering if I should even bother debating this or not.
It would work out so much better than putting forward your arguement and then trying to find "facts" to fit it again .
Yes there is a current lull , daily shootings are back to 2004 levels though daily bombings are still above the 2005 level .The trend that I've noticed seems to be one of overall decrease in violence.
Plus as you note the location has shifted which might be down to one large group telling its gunmen to stop for a while and another grouping being currently paid to stop .
I like your edit , a very important little thing , the pershmerga went through a lot of effort in the early occupation to get rid of the Christian communities in their territory , I wonder how much effort they will put in again before the next referendum on the future status of those areas .
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