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Thread: RAT DROPPINGS

  1. #1

    Default RAT DROPPINGS

    I went to a cabin and relaxed on a bed. I felt some things that felt like small pebbles. It was too dark to see what I was touching so I just rubbed my fingers around them. I started to get real curious. I turned on the lights and saw that I was touching rat dung!

    Later on, I checked the internet to see if it's ok to touch rat droppings. Since a lot of you are really smart, I wanted your opinions on this so I posted this here.

    http://www.aaanimalcontrol.com/ratdiseases.htm
    RAT RELATED HEALTH HAZARDS & DISEASES

    Here is information on common diseases caused by rats, as gathered from the Center For Disease Control & Prevention http://www.cdc.gov

    Hantavirus Pulmonary Syndrome (HPS): Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome (HPS) is a deadly disease transmitted by infected rodents through urine, droppings, or saliva. Humans can contract the disease when they breathe in aerosolized virus. HPS was first recognized in 1993 and has since been identified throughout the United States. Although rare, HPS is potentially deadly. Rodent control in and around the home remains the primary strategy for preventing hantavirus infection.

    Murine Typhus: Murine typhus (caused by infection with R. typhi) occurs worldwide and is transmitted to humans by rat fleas. Flea-infested rats can be found throughout the year in humid tropical environments, but in temperate regions are most common during the warm summer months. Travelers who visit in rat-infested buildings and homes, especially in harbor or riverine environments, can be at risk for exposure to the agent of murine typhus.

    Rat-bite fever (RBF): Rat-bite fever (RBF) is a systemic bacterial illness caused by Streptobacillus moniliformis that can be acquired through the bite or scratch of a rodent or the ingestion of food or water contaminated with rat feces.

    Salmonella enterica serovar Typhimurium: As its name suggests, it causes a typhoid-like disease in mice. In humans S. Typhimurium does not cause as severe disease as S. Typhi, and is not normally fatal. The disease is characterized by diarrhea, abdominal cramps, vomiting and nausea, and generally lasts up to 7 days. Unfortunately, in immunocompromized people, that is the elderly, young, or people with depressed immune systems, Salmonella infections are often fatal if they are not treated with antibiotics.

    Leptospirosis: Leptospirosis is a bacterial disease that affects humans and animals. It is caused by bacteria of the genus Leptospira. In humans it causes a wide range of symptoms, and some infected persons may have no symptoms at all. Symptoms of leptospirosis include high fever, severe headache, chills, muscle aches, and vomiting, and may include jaundice (yellow skin and eyes), red eyes, abdominal pain, diarrhea, or a rash. If the disease is not treated, the patient could develop kidney damage, meningitis (inflammation of the membrane around the brain and spinal cord), liver failure, and respiratory distress. In rare cases death occurs.

    Eosinophilic Meningitis: Eosinophilic meningitis is an infection of the brain occurring in association with an increase in the number of eosinophils, white blood cells that are associated with infection with worms that penetrate into the body. The organism most commonly causing eosinophilic meningitis is a rat lung worm called angiostrongylus cantonensis.
    The hantavirus took my attention. I googled it:

    http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5850a3.htm
    Case 1

    On May 16, a boy aged 6 years who lived in Colorado went to a Texas hospital with a 2-day history of diarrhea and shortness of breath. On initial examination, the child had cyanotic lips and nail beds, with cold extremities. His pulse was 163, and his temperature was 101°F (38.3°C). Soon after arrival at the hospital, the child became apneic and had no palpable pulse. Chest compressions were initiated, and the child was intubated and ventilated. A chest radiograph revealed bilateral infiltrates, and blood analysis demonstrated elevated hematocrit, elevated WBC count, and thrombocytopenia (Table). Within 2 hours of admission to the hospital, the boy died from apparent cardiac failure secondary to shock. The child had been treated with intravenous fluids, ceftriaxone, epinephrine, atropine, and albuterol. The working diagnosis at the time of the child's death was shock and sepsis caused by pneumonia.

    An enzyme-linked immunosorbant assay (ELISA) performed by the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment revealed Sin Nombre hantavirus--specific serum immunoglobulin M (IgM). An environmental assessment conducted at the boy's home in Colorado found rodent droppings and nesting materials under his bed and in bushes in front of the home where the boy had played.

    Case 2

    On June 7, an adolescent boy aged 14 years went to a Washington emergency department with a 5-day history of shortness of breath, chest pain, cough, and fever. Upon admission, the child had a fever of 103°F (39.4°C), pulse of 100, and a respiratory rate varying between 40 and 60. He was thrombocytopenic and had elevated WBC with atypical lymphocytosis (Table). A chest radiograph revealed bilateral interstitial infiltrates. No details were provided regarding treatment or any suspicion of HPS.

    Because of worsening respiratory distress and hypoxia, the patient was intubated and mechanically ventilated for approximately 24 hours. He improved and was discharged home on June 13. An ELISA of serum detected Sin Nombre hantavirus--specific IgM at the Washington State Public Health Laboratories. A follow-up environmental assessment found rodent fecal contamination in a container of corn that the youth reported hand-grinding 8 days before illness onset.

    Case 3

    On July 12, a boy aged 6 years went to a Colorado emergency department with a 5-day history of fever (maximum 103°F [39.4°C]), erythematous facial rash, and myalgia. Upon admission the boy's pulse was 120, respiratory rate 48, and oxygen saturation 72% on room air. Dyspnea was apparent with coarse breath sounds, wheezes, and crackles on auscultation. His WBC count was elevated, and thrombocytopenia was noted (Table). A chest radiograph revealed bilateral diffuse pulmonary infiltrates with pleural effusions. HPS was suspected, and the boy was treated with intravenous fluids, ceftriaxone, and azithromycin.

    The boy was intubated and mechanically ventilated from July 12 to July 20; he was discharged on July 22. Serum ELISA performed by the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment revealed positive Sin Nombre hantavirus IgM. Family members reported that approximately 10 days before hospitalization the child was bitten on the finger by a mouse. During environmental assessment, evidence of rodent infestation was observed in outbuildings and abandoned vehicles but not within the house.

    Case 4

    On July 12, a girl aged 9 years living in Arizona went to a New Mexico hospital with chest pain and shortness of breath. Symptoms began with abdominal discomfort on July 6, which was followed by headache, vomiting, and myalgia. Upon examination, the girl's temperature was 99.9°F (37.7°C), and her pulse was 162. Laboratory findings included thrombocytopenia, elevated hematocrit, and elevated WBC count (Table). A chest radiograph revealed diffuse interstitial infiltrates. During transport to a tertiary care facility for further treatment, the child's temperature reached 103.8°F (39.9°C). HPS was suspected, and the girl was treated with intravenous fluids, ceftriaxone, and vancomycin.

    Because of worsening signs of pulmonary distress, the girl was intubated and received extracorporeal membrane oxygenation therapy for 4 days. She remained on a ventilator until July 22 and was hospitalized until August 5. Serum tested with a commercial immunoblot assay revealed Sin Nombre hantavirus immunoglobulin G (IgG). Evidence of rodents was found at three residences frequented by the girl in Arizona: the family home, grandparents' home, and a summer home where she played in an underground dugout that had rodent burrows.

    Case 5

    On November 25, an adolescent boy aged 13 years went to a California emergency department with a 5-day history of fever (maximum 102.6°F [39.2°C]), cough, posttussive vomiting, diarrhea, and abdominal pain. Physical examination revealed a tender chest, with crackles and diminished breath sounds in the lower lobes of the lungs, and a respiratory rate of 30. Laboratory findings included elevated WBC, elevated hematocrit, and thrombocytopenia (Table). Chest radiographs revealed diffuse interstitial opacities with pleural effusion. Treatment included intravenous fluids, ceftriaxone, clindamycin, and azithromycin. The patient received supplemental oxygen by nasal cannula and was discharged home on December 3.

    Testing for hantavirus was requested on day 4 of hospitalization. Serum was submitted to a commercial diagnostic laboratory, and Sin Nombre hantavirus IgM and IgG antibodies were detected by immunoblot assay. Extensive remodeling was under way in the youth's home at the time of illness, including removal and replacement of floors and walls. Three mice were trapped in the youth's kitchen and garage approximately 3 months before disease onset, but the patient had no known direct or indirect contact with the rodents.
    Oh dear! Will I be ok? Watch out for rats.
    Wooooo!!!

  2. #2
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    As always - see a doctor. Asking for medical advice on the Internet probably isn't the best idea.

    Oh and I doubt you have that virus given that it says you have to breath concentrated amounts of it (my understanding of aerosolised anyway).
    Last edited by CountArach; 02-02-2010 at 14:44.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Well I did rub my nose after touching the droppings. I didn't know what I was touching at that time.
    Wooooo!!!

  4. #4
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaka_Khan View Post
    Well I did rub my nose after touching the droppings. I didn't know what I was touching at that time.
    Like I said, see a Doctor. We do have some people with medical training here, but go to a Doctor anyway.
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  5. #5
    Hǫrðar Member Viking's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    For the years I've spent living on the country side (we had rats at the farm; though I myself never saw any), I've never heard about similar; but you never know I suppose.
    Last edited by Viking; 02-02-2010 at 15:14.
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  6. #6
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Get a cat/dog

  7. #7
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Don't worry too much.... if that was just a normal houserat, you should be fine anyway, as long as your neighbourhood didn't had some rat-related diseases recently...

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    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    No. Go to a doctor.
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  9. #9
    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    See a Docter, you could die.

    "Probably" doesn't cut it in those situations.
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  10. #10
    Guest Aemilius Paulus's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Yes, I would say that was a bit of an overreaction, but then again, you are a city dweller, and who knows, perhaps the rats are more dangerous in US... I too live in a city, but I spend quite a few summers in the countryside in Russia, with my grandparents.

    They leased their own grain fields, and in return got a portion of the harvest. It was kept in a granary, and it was not uncommon to find rat dropping, although the poison was well-spread (God, the rats are one lively bit, I remember seeing rats being poisoned, but staying alive nevertheless), and the containers in which the grain was stored were ideally rat-proof. Then again, there were quite a lot of grain seed lying around scattered, enough to attract the rats I suppose. But anyhow, the point is, I have touched the rat droppings, and have even killed rats - which necessitates touching them afterwards. Nothing ever happened to me . If it was a houserat that left the droppings, your chances of an infection are even lower, because infections normally spread in sizeable rat populations.

    I would not worry about it, but still, see the doctor, that cannot hurt (even if it does cost some money - your health is still #1).

  11. #11
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Make a will. You can't be too careful.
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  12. #12
    Backordered Member CrossLOPER's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Go to a doctor.
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  13. #13
    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Dude. Calm down. All of you, calm down.

    I have raised rodents as pets for 15 years. Rats are, in fact, my favorite pet. You will not get sick from touching rat droppings. You will not get sick from touching rat droppings. You will not get sick from touching rat droppings/

    First off, Hanta Virus is rare in rats and almost exclusively carried by DEER MICE. Second, you quite literally have to breathe the turds to catch it. Rubbing your nose does not count. Eating it does not count. Rubbing the poo on an open wound does not count.

    So lets review: Hanta in rats is rare. Must breathe wonderful turd into lungs to catch. Don't waste your money on a doctor over this
    Last edited by CountArach; 02-03-2010 at 00:58.
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    Guest Aemilius Paulus's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Well, considering my experience, I would listen to MRD, but I suppose this all comes down to how much money it will cost to see the doctor. Since my guess would be over $150, considering how effed-up healthcare is in US, I would say it is perhaps better to leave it alone. But then, also comes the consideration of how much you can afford...

  15. #15
    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Paging Doctor Rory....
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

  16. #16

    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    "Don't ask the internet. Go see a doctor" is so incredibly contradictory. If we have no medical training how are we supposed to know he needs to see a doctor?

  17. #17
    Guest Aemilius Paulus's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Hosakawa Tito View Post
    Paging Doctor Rory....
    IIRC he is a medic? An ambulance medic (maybe even paramedic)? I believe I read him saying that somewhere. Then again, I could easily be wrong.

  18. #18
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro View Post
    "Don't ask the internet. Go see a doctor" is so incredibly contradictory. If we have no medical training how are we supposed to know he needs to see a doctor?
    Parents take their children to the Doctor all the time without any medical training.
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  19. #19

    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by CountArach View Post
    Parents take their children to the Doctor all the time without any medical training.
    This is true, but off topic. One cannot authoritatively state that a doctor needs to be seen unless you have medical training. That's the contradiction when paired with saying one shouldn't get medical advice from the internet. "Go to a doctor" IS medical advice.

  20. #20
    Poll Smoker Senior Member CountArach's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro View Post
    This is true, but off topic. One cannot authoritatively state that a doctor needs to be seen unless you have medical training. That's the contradiction when paired with saying one shouldn't get medical advice from the internet. "Go to a doctor" IS medical advice.
    I would say that it isn't medical advice, simply because it is a precautionary measure.
    Rest in Peace TosaInu, the Org will be your legacy
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    Nothing established by violence and maintained by force, nothing that degrades humanity and is based on contempt for human personality, can endure.

  21. #21
    Moderator Moderator Gregoshi's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Oh, nevermind. This isn't about politics...
    This space intentionally left blank

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    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro View Post
    This is true, but off topic. One cannot authoritatively state that a doctor needs to be seen unless you have medical training. That's the contradiction when paired with saying one shouldn't get medical advice from the internet. "Go to a doctor" IS medical advice.
    It's medical advice in the sense that we admit we know balls about what we're talking about. We are authoritatively stating that we don't know anything. Indeed, it is a contradiction, but only one if you are needlessly nitpicky about definitions. The alternative, telling him "I dunno" doesn't accomplish anything.
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  23. #23
    Probably Drunk Member Reverend Joe's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    How about just ask a damn doctor? No charge as long as you can do it over the phone, and I guarantee they will know how to advise the situation better than a random person on a forum. It's not just the anonymity, it's the ability to ask someone you know and trust.

  24. #24
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Don't put your hands in your mouth after touching the droppings.
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  25. #25
    Member Megas Methuselah's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    I remember I killed a mouse with my hockey stick once. My grandpa used to use a broom, then he'd step on them with his work boots and you could hear all those dirty bones cracking.

  26. #26
    Backordered Member CrossLOPER's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Megas Methuselah View Post
    I remember I killed a mouse with my hockey stick once. My grandpa used to use a broom, then he'd step on them with his work boots and you could hear all those dirty bones cracking.
    Completely unnecessary.
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  27. #27
    Guest Aemilius Paulus's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by CrossLOPER View Post
    Completely unnecessary.
    Yeah, Meff is like that often times. Completely unnecessary I say... But he does not listen...

  28. #28
    Moderator Moderator Gregoshi's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Quote Originally Posted by Megas Methuselah View Post
    ...then he'd step on them with his work boots and you could hear all those dirty bones cracking.
    Here's the perfect holiday for your Grandpa...

    This space intentionally left blank

  29. #29
    Friend of Lady Luck Member Mooks's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    My aunt did the same thing...then BAM! Four years later dropped dead from cancer.
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  30. #30
    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: RAT DROPPINGS

    Your aunt got cancer from rat droppings?
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