Tokens of My Confection [Concluded]

[NotACop]

Would like to hear where you are at @Newyn , can barely remember you playing this game

[novice]

My top three suspects are GH, Cuthilius and BSmith.

GH has done nothing useful, and was the counterwagon to both Zack and Scarlett (or rather, they may have been his counterwagon).
The one thing I can say in his defense is that he was (to be brutally frank) pretty useless in the last game as well, as town jailer. I've gathered that he's a strong player but I'm really not sure what his contributions are supposed to be either in this game or the last one.

Cuthilius pushed a bad case on Zack on day 2, and disappeared for most of days 2 and 3. Pizza hard vetoed voting him with dubious reasoning. GamerDude covered this.

BSmith stealth lynched Zack on day 2 and has been mostly absent ever since. Pizza did not support the case, which I felt was and is very valid. In general it's a case that scum can credibly support if it's wrong, so its lack of traction is suspicious.

We do need to block vote today. Vote: Cuthilius for now.

[novice]

NAC, this is the case on BSmith:

To reiterate my case on BSmith since nobody's even commented:
He voted Zack early in the day to "poke the bear". He said he would be around. He then did nothing.
After the lynch he says he left his vote on Zack because he felt Zack didn't push back hard enough.

This feels like BSmith "stealth lynching" Zack, i.e. silently leaving an unjustified vote on Zack and letting him hang, taking advantage of an opportunity to lynch a townie who could later prove hard to lynch.

I don't like how people ignore BSmith but are happy to jump on Scarlett and GH. The case on BSmith is more concrete, if you disagree with it at least say so.

Plus the fact that people are ignoring the case.

[novice]

I mean, DP, I can see here that you were well aware that an SK had already flipped. If Pizza was a SK that would had been 5 NKs being blocked/protected throughout this game, which is so far from likely that it gives a hint of you not really thinking things through at all.

Is that a scum tell in your opinion?

[NotACop]

Is that a scum tell in your opinion?

Probably it isn't, since scums rarely do stuff that are easy to prove as not making sense at all.
So it's more to see what kind of response he'll give(which probably won't be of much use as I'm stating this now).

[NotACop]

My top three suspects are GH, Cuthilius and BSmith.

GH has done nothing useful, and was the counterwagon to both Zack and Scarlett (or rather, they may have been his counterwagon).
The one thing I can say in his defense is that he was (to be brutally frank) pretty useless in the last game as well, as town jailer. I've gathered that he's a strong player but I'm really not sure what his contributions are supposed to be either in this game or the last one.

Cuthilius pushed a bad case on Zack on day 2, and disappeared for most of days 2 and 3. Pizza hard vetoed voting him with dubious reasoning. GamerDude covered this.

BSmith stealth lynched Zack on day 2 and has been mostly absent ever since. Pizza did not support the case, which I felt was and is very valid. In general it's a case that scum can credibly support if it's wrong, so its lack of traction is suspicious.

We do need to block vote today. Vote: Cuthilius for now.

Except that I haven't paid much attention to BSmith(I'll read the case, 2 sec), I like this guess at the last scums. GH has had a bad vibe for most of the game, and haven't really put in any attempt at solving that I remember. Cuth's D1 was really weird, the way he threw around suspicion left and right and said "changed my mind" almost identically a couple times, with no elaboration on what changed his mind.

[NotACop]

Fine point about BSmith.
I'll take a new read through the game, and see where it gets me

[NotACop]

on page 8 now.
fairly confident novice is town.
also think dp101 is town most of the town here, despite I actually had him on my mind as scum when reading tonight, but that was a bit connected with my belief that Sooh was scum, which was proven wrong this start of the day.

[NotACop]

GH still looking bad on this reread(go ahead call it tunneling Al Sips)

[NotACop]

really

so lynching yourself would be just as good as lynching monty?

i'm assuming not

who do you find scummy

who do you find towny

anybody you're convinced about either way

tone in this post from Cuth in response to Dp101 does not feel like they are scum partners at all.

[NotACop]

GH defending Cuth's one liner posts against El Barto on D1.

I also remember that Pizza said he liked my list on D2, only commenting that he wasn't sure on Cuth though(who I had towards town at the list). Think that's a comment he'd make on a scum partner a lot more often than a town. As there would be little to no reason for him to throw that kind of shade on town!Cuth in that situation, as it did nothing. More likely an attempt at distancing.

[NotACop]

so yeah, I think we'll find scums in both of Cuth and GH.

[NotACop]

Vote: Cuthillius

[NotACop]

the votes on gh are literally

1.khaan
2.zack in response to

it's not only GH defending Cuth. Here's Cuth defending GH

Also in this:

monty is a bad wagon

gh is a bad wagon

al is a REALLY bad wagon

my wagon is even worse

and there aren't other options

this makes me depressed

If Cuth is scum, I think this looks good for Al Sips, as I doubt he'd use the "REALLY bad wagon" phrasing to defend a scum.

[NotACop]

vote: Zack

I feel like poking a sleeping bear. It was either him or Pizza. Maybe I’ll unvote zack and then vote Pizza.

I don’t get the wagon on GH. (frankly I don’t think I’d get any wagon at the present time)

What I also don’t get: The writeup on Winston’s kill. I understand all of the words individually, yet when put together….

Ye this post from BSmith on D2 is pretty bad.

And he doesn't get the GH wagon, stating he probably wouldn't get any wagon at the present time. Strange thing to say regardless of what role GH actually has.

[NotACop]

Vote: Cuth
Mainly because his case against Zack is bad.
Tinfoiling on Pizza because he seems towny even though he didn't kill anyone last night.

interesting post from Newyn on D2 if Cuth is scum.

[NotACop]

Al sips also seems towny in tone as I'm reading through. Pretty sure he and GH are not scum partners as he comes in late on D2 and puts a fourth vote on GH so he could easily had ended up being the lynch instead of Zack, who had five votes.

[NotACop]

BSmith and Cuth both parked their D2 votes early on Zack and had no interest in reconsidering.

[NotACop]

Newyn voting Pizza early on D3 and Pizza responding with a vote on Newyn:

You believe I am scum and Cuth is scum and that I tried to lynch him d1.
You seem to be indicating you think Scarlett is scum, another person I have tried to get support for lynching.

I don't believe you believe that universe.

Vote: Newyn

Newyn then says he wants to lynch Cuth most of Pizza, Cuth and Alette:

There is almost no world where all 3 of you are scum together but you + Scarlett is entirely possible. I'm voting Cuth though because his case against Zack yesterday was complete BS. If he's scum, you look much better.

to which Pizza says:

Ok, let's start with Scarlett then.

I'm bussing Scarlett today. She's the wolfiest wolf, and I want to make myself look better. Then turn around and lynch me tomorrow.

Don't invert the order, because I'm a townie.

He suggests starting with Alette, having a preference of her instead of Cuth that he cares to say, despite he also cared to tell me on D2 that Cuth shouldn't be in town reads.

This looks really bad for Cuth imo

[Cuthillius]

Ok then, what was your late vote meant to do?

consolidate

technically i could have left my vote elsewhere with no point

that makes the vc uglier and the lynch i preferred didn't go through

"because there is no reason for town to wait so long to vote someone they actually want to die and there is no reason to vote for someone you don't want to kill, so only mafia is served by voting at this stage."

i was ok with pizza dying

i would have preferred gh

the same logic applies to pretty much everyone else who voted at EoD, but it's flawed

can you please look back at GH for me?

[NotACop]

shortly after he says this:

You can do that or I can lynch you today, Newyn. Let's make something happen. Either get out of my way or help me lead.

Right after he says:

I'm not following you on Cuth, unless Cuth's name is against someone like NotACop for the lynch.

And I'll still think wolves are pushing v/v wagons in such a case. I'd probably call for a cfd, ineffective as that may be.

Again, I'm seeing a picture of him defending Cuth hard

[NotACop]

@Cuthillius
sorry you rolled scum mate

[NotACop]

BSmith accused both me and Zack. He's very wrong, but he poked the bear. That gives him a pass. Well, let's see where he ends up voting today. but my first instinct on that is I don't think so.

Pizza wanting people not to mind BSmith, giving him a pass for really thin reasons.

[Cuthillius]

Cuthilius pushed a bad case on Zack on day 2, and disappeared for most of days 2 and 3. Pizza hard vetoed voting him with dubious reasoning. GamerDude covered this.

I pushed a case that was mostly founded around my understanding of Zack's meta

And I've barely been posting any of the days

I posted more on d1, but that was all in one chunk

so saying i disappeared after that is meh

and that's misusing the term 'veto'

[NotACop]

Townies I'd consider letting myself hang first before I vote them:
16. @NotACop

Pending entrance to that hallowed group:
17. @Cuthillius
11. @Sooh

Against
6. @BSmith- Lean against

I can't read these people. They have to be a strong townie today or they're endgame lynchbait. Need to separate from the wolfpack.
2. @El Barto- I have to iso and think.
13. @Al Sipsclar- Dunno
5. @Riedquat- Dunno
7. @novice- Dunno

For the lynch:
9. @GeneralHankerchief
3. @Dp101
14. @Newyn
15. @Scarlett Aria

Pick em.

There's never not a scum in Cuth+BSmith here. This is on D3. He voted GeneralHankerchief mid of D2 while his wagon wasn't really serious, and now on D3 where GeneralHankerchief could easily become a lynch, he suddenly has 4 persons in his lynch group, with GeneralHankerchief being the the furthest away from bottom of those 4.

[NotACop]

@novice seems like your scum reads makes a lot of sense as the last scums - feel free to take a look at the points I've pointed out now.

[Cuthillius]

hardclaim desperado

let's talk about this

i can shoot someone, if scum they will die at EoD and if town I die at EoD

if they are the top wagon the next highest wagon will be lynched instead

so forth

[novice]

@novice seems like your scum reads makes a lot of sense as the last scums - feel free to take a look at the points I've pointed out now.

Thanks, NAC, that's a very useful recap. Your additional points all fit nicely.

[novice]

hardclaim desperado

let's talk about this

i can shoot someone, if scum they will die at EoD and if town I die at EoD

if they are the top wagon the next highest wagon will be lynched instead

so forth

That's perfect. You should shoot GH or BSmith then.

[novice]

You have to shoot today to prove your claim. I guess you should shoot the one with the most votes at deadline-1 hours or something, and if you don't shoot we lynch you.