TARGET morale issue need to be solved

[Rath]

Just popping in to again say how much i hate the new morale setting.

Having played STW for about a year now online and having played MI since it came out about 2 weeks ago over here i am very frustrated by the changes that have occured.

High honour peasents, both guns and YA, seem to be the "elite" units now due to their cheapness, both in upgrading honour and armour/weapons...with the almost non-apparent morale removing the main weakness that these units possessed... i am surely no historical buff but i thought peasents were basically there to make up the numbers, not be the elits units.

Games are now won on who has the best units and as that famous wolf pointed to, out manouvering your opponent is of minimal value, as even if u catch your opponents army in the flank they will 99.999999% of the time hold allowing the rest of their forces to turn on you...even leaving the flanker at a disadvantage as they may have full units held up by the last few men of that still holding flank.

So pleeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaase fix this issue whoever u are that has the power to do so...it is ruining the experience for the majority of people who have loved the game for so long.

Just revert back to the old morale...those who don't like their units running until the last 5 men can still play games like that by just upping the koku amount...that way everyone will be happy...also the morale switch is a nifty idea.

Thx.
Rath...

[Kocmoc]

they got our money and we can wait till dezember for a new patch......

and they realy want to change something??

koc

[MagyarKhans Cham]

make it into an option button..

[Raging Road Rodent]

Well, its seems that this moral issue really does ruin combat. Thats too bad. That makes two reasons why I will not get the expansion pack. The first being the fact that EA has cunningly only distributed the expansion pack in Canada with the original STW, and decided to charge 50 dollars for it. Since I don't want to buy STW twice, and the moral thingy ruins the game, why get it?

[KumaRatta Yamamoto]

First choice: "make it into an option button." (magyar's idea)This way everybody is happy.

Second choice: Tune it down a bit, somewhere between the old and new morale setting. A compromise.

VERY IMPORTANT: DON'T touch the morale system in the SP campaigns, they work fine!!!

[monkeydan]

Raging Road Rodent - get just the X-Pack through the EA store at ea.com. It costs about $30 (in our Canadian dollars) including shipping.

[Kocmoc]

i payed 29,99 DM for the add on, thats 15 $
50 or 30 $ are quite too much!!!


koc

[monkeydan]

Kocmoc - you paid about the same as I did - just I also had to pay for shipping because they wouldn't sell MI in stores here.
(30 DM being about $22 CAN + $7 shipping)

[MagyarKhans Cham]

i paid 59 guilders which is about 52 DM or 25 US dollars, am i ripped of (again) here?

[Perec_Dojo]

Khan, $25 seems about average (it's what I paid mail-order). After following the numerous threads on morale, I wanted to throw in my newbie/mass-market/single-playing opinion on the side of...

VETS!

imo, you guys seem to have everyone's interests at heart, even those of the folks who don't agree with you. I remember my frustration with the game when I first played, and how these frustrations came not only from the dominance of morale tactics, but from the usual problems of online play, like campers, etc. I never figured out the clan system, so I was never trained properly, and ended up as a thoroughly average and mediocre online player, and stopped playing Shogun altogether due to my dissatisfaction with the SP campaigns.

Now, as everyone agrees, SP is much improved, but MP is quite controversial. I always wanted to be a good MP, but just because I wasn't does not mean I want a change in the morale!

On principle the influence of morale on armies (and yes, I'm talking about in this particular game) is quite appealing to me. It forces you to fight with your wits, and to obey the rules of war (at least as interpreted by the simulation). The specific points brought up by many of the vets are quite convincing to me (inability to rout low-h units diminishes the role of flanking, armies no longer have to behave as a unit, taisho doesn't function as head of army, so "decapitation" often meaningless, etc).

(Digression)

Dispatches from the Great Khan are almost invariably the most incisive; why is he not heeded more? He is also dogged in repeating messages in many disperate threads so that no one misses them. I hate to think he and his loyal servants are looked askance because English is not their native tongue.

(End Digression)

Also, their solutions always seem bent towards options to give everyone what they want, while their detractors seem to take their arguments as some sort of elitist affront. I think that those who want morale to stay "as-is" and who reject the proposals given by the vets do so because they want the play-style that they enjoy to be the "normal" setting. I remember reading in an earlier post about the so-called "stigma" of high-koku games. Though this idea was quickly dropped in the thread in which it appeared, I think that really, this is what must be avoided if the community is to find peace and concensus on this issue.

To wit, I would suggest that a solution that everyone will accept lies in finding two different modes (of course, now I am merely parroting what has been said before) that are considered equal by the community at large--an "old" mode and the new one.

I think, in closing, that the onus falls on the vets to be extra-diplomatic in their efforts. Right is on your side, but that is not what matters. What matters is that the correct solution be found, and with the minimum of "dishonor". No one likes to think that their way of playing is less honorable, and because it seems you have been misunderstood thus far, you must take EXTRA care not to offend, especially since it was never your intention. I believe that during this period of evaluation it is the best way to ensure the integrity of what is most surely the most interesting and yes, the most polite, thoughtful, and well-behaved online gaming community I have ever witnessed or been a part of.

Cheer!

[Magyar Khan]

ok another vote for an optionbutton so players can choose for themselves.

[TakeshidaSo]

Although, "who's counting" comes to mind, it's also another vote for civility, and diplomatic behavior. Two things that are either; a part of, or included within tact.

Of course, all these things can be rather well faked, if you can only keep from appearing angry, or insulting.

---------------------------------------------

Petition for MI improvements.

1). MORALE>

Morale is increased by 2 points for each honor upgrade. MI's has increased morale by 12 pts. Thats a morale increase equivalent to 6 honor upgrades, which is nearly triple that of a units base cost. This increase was to a system where 18 pts. is considered impetuous, and the range was from -4 morale for YA, to +8 morale for WM, and ND. For every 2 honor upgrades morale is raised by 4 pts., and the units cost is almost doubled (96%). Campaign costs, and base unit stats, are for H0 units. The cost of custom and online units is for an H2 unit, and so they have +4 to morale, and double the value of campaign units. The incongruous pricing suggests a change, and the campaigns would be challenging with H2 units.

Solution:
Make the default campaign unit an H2 unit, and set the default morale in MI back 12 points.
Alternate:
Set the custom, and online default to H0, and lower MI morale settings by 8 pts.