Citadel:Total War units

[Celtic_Winter]

The point of this thread, is the development of the units to appear in this MOD(to be updated regularly).
First I will start off by posting the units, that as of now, have been suggested by Silver Rusher:
(quick note:Everything from Janissary musketeers down was submited by Suleimen the magnificent)
English Longbowmen: Welsh Longbowmen available also.

Superior Longbowmen:
Have quite a lot more skill at firing than regular longbows, and are armoured so are quite good melee as well.

Gascon Lancers:
Special norman lancers which form the bodyguard of the early english royal family.

Tudor Lancers:
In the Late Period the Tudors are the main family of England, and having lost all of their lands in France they can no longer produce Gascon Lancers.

Billmen

Puissant Pikemen:
Armoured pikemen with much longer pikes, approx. 8 metres in total, only available to English, French, Burgundians, Swiss and some Italian factions.

Hobilars D'Ordannce:
French Hobilars

Chevaliers D'Ordannce:
Superior french knights, possibly the best in the world. Form the French and Burgundian bodyguard.

French Musketeers:
Later in the game these men come out, lightly armoured, but with an incredible nack for firing muskets.

Gothic Militia:
Holding halberds and wearing gothic armour generally means the perfect fighting force, as cavalry and armoured infantry alike go down in front of the mighty cleave.

Halberdiers

Scale Broadswords:
Good early on, but are soon outclassed by heavier broadswordsmen.

Chain Broadswords:
Broadswordmen wearing chain mail. No further explanation needed.

Plate Broadswords:
Similar to Gothic broadswords, only without the very special armour that they posess.

Gothic Broadswords:
At the top of the broadsword class, these men carry heavy Gothic armour and large two handed swords with which they can slowly cut straight through enemy lines.

Macemen:
Carrying maces, morning stars and flails makes attacking armoured troops a whole lot easier as there is no need to actually pierce the armour but the shock itself is enough to kill the man inside.

Forester Macemen:
With the training of wandering through forests with maces, they are very fearsome when used at the right time.

Partisaniers:
Fearsome weapons, known as partisans were developed by the Italians and Germans to be wielded by men in Gothic armour. They have three points, the two on the sides slanting outwards to chop cut down on the enemy and 'cleave' them, and the one in front provides as good protection against cavalry as any pike.

Neapolitan Hussars:
In Naples, there is a national heritage for Feudal Knights, but now with the evolution of guns light cavalry are equally important. And that is when the Hussar comes in...

Balkanite Hussars:
Hussars from the Balkans and Poland are special in many ways, the fertile plains of Hungary, Wallachia and other areas field good horses and equally good light cavalrymen.

Guard of the 1st Canton:
In the space between the Juras and the Alps is some very flat and fertile land, which actually produce excellent horsemen. Dismounted they will become Swiss Armoured Pikes, which are also very usefull depending on which terrain is being fought on.

Swiss Guard:
Do not be confused with the name, as these men are not actually Swiss, but instead form the bodyguards of the Pope. They are fearsome lancers on horse and devastating sergeants on foot.

Alpine Foresters:
These are the hardy woodsmen of the Alps, using fear and surprise as their main weapons.

Janissary Muskteers:
Armed with matchlock musket, sword has no armor. Good missile troops but shouldn't be committed to battle against pure schock troops but can hold their own against light infantry. Can't fire in the rain. Disciplined, good morale.

Janissary Armoured Infantry:
Armed with wicked looking pole arms and shield, armouring flat ring chain mail, has a sword for close fighting. Good against cavalry and most infantry. Disciplined, excellent morale. Should not be pitted head to head against good quality spainish or swiss pikemen.

Janissary Archers:
Armed with a recurved bow, has a sword for close combat. Missiles good vs armour, high rate of fire (six shot a minute in real life, this makes 'em tire quick. draw wieght of bow is 150lbs). Extreme range of 500 yards. Can pierce though almost any armour with a spaure hit at 100 yards. Should be able to hit a man on horse back once every 4 shots at 280 yards. Good attack, weak defender.

Azap ('bachelors') Muskets:
Armed with muskets and unarmoured. Many carry pole arms to rest their weapons on. They are well trained to use these and this gives them a great advantage when confronted by cavalry. They are volunteers and have good morale.

Azap Macemen:
Has mace and shield. Good morale.

Sipahi:
Is armoured in mail and plate. Wields mace. His horse is lightly armoured reflecting the heat i which they were likely to operate. He wears a 'turban' helm with a mail aventail.

Elite Siege Troops:
Fully armoured in mail and splints. His shield is of iron and could probaly resist the attentions of early muskets. He weilds a fearsome battle-axe and slung at his side is a sword for close combat. His helmet is engraved and has a feather plume.

Ottoman Infantryman:
Armed with javilein and a sword, he also wields a small shield for close combat. He is armoured only in leathers as he comes from the peasent stock. He wears a simple iron helm.

Voynik Auxiliary:
Armed with pole axe, a straight western style sword, he has a 'balkans' stlye shield for use when weilding his pole axe. He wears a mail coat that extend to his knees and has a simple iron helmet with a aventail.

North African Marine:
Armed with a crossbow and short curved sword. He wears a mail shirt to his waist that is covered by his simple clothing. He has a small shield for close combat.

[Celtic_Winter]

Now,
here are some units, that I have been brainstorming with.
If I have made a historical mistake with my description or the unit, please feel free to correct me.


last updated: December 2, 2004

cavalry:

Spakhs-
the spakh was one of the main cavalry units used by the Ottoman empire.
Usually armed with a spear and a sword, The Spakh is perfect for crushing
enemy formations. Armoured properly most of the time.


Tatar horse archers-
Tatar horse archers usually carried a bow and a small sword. Never really
being equiped with a lot of armor, the Tatar horse archer was one of the most
lethal archers of it´s time. Very weak vs cavalry and infantry attacks
but great at crippling light armor units.

Hussars-
(note:there will be different Hussars, Winged Hussars for Poland and Hungary and a mercenary Prussian Hussar wouldn't be a bad idea)
Light cavalry, one of the main back bones in European cavalry attacks. Their high speed made them excellent for ambushing enemy troops and chasing them off the battlfield. Usually very weak with very little armor, the hussar was great for chasing off the enemy or sneeking up behind the enemy, very effective if used properly.

Cossacks-
(note: like the Hussars, there will probably be different Cossacks in the game)
Russian for "Kazak"(In Turkish it means "Free man" or "Adventurer") the Cossacks come from the areas around the black and caspian sea. They where independent until they where asked by the Russians to give them military service in return of privileges.

infantry units:

Jannisaries-
(note:there will most likely be more than one type of Jannisaries in the MOD)
Jannisaries where the core of the Turkish armies. The jannisaries where christian slaves,
usually taken as children, and taught to be loyal to the Turkish forces since their enslavement.
The Jannisaries didn´t really wear armour, but where excellent with their musket. Weak against melee infantry.

Ottoman pikemen-
the ottoman pikemen usually occupied the frontline of the ottoman armies.
Their main goal was to defend the artillery and janissaries and to hold back
cavalry charges. Greatly effective towards cavlary, the ottoman pikemen
usually wore a chain mail.

Russian Strelet-
the Strelets where the basic unit of the Russian army for a long time.
Appeared around 1550, in order to be a Strelet, you had to inherit it
from your father. Armed with a properly desgined Russian musket,
the Samopal, The Strelets also carried sabers and pole axes. Excellent ranged units, but weak in close combat.

Venetian infantry-
The Venetian republic, being one of the most important powers of Christian Europe, made the Venetian infantry very lethal. They where well armored and where equipped with a shield, a pike and a small sword.



Neapolitanian infantry:
Naples, being the largest city in most of Italy for a while, was used to fighting several battles with different enemies. Being a city, that has been fought over for years, the Neapolitanians have mannaged to create an infantry that is above the average. Usually, citymen who use a typical chainmail, a large wodden shield with some iron applied to it and a a long sword or spear.

Wallachian militia-
Wallachia, being a relatively not very important country during this time period, not as powerful as other states such as France or Piedmont, did mannage to leave their mark behind in European history. Famous for their leader, Vlad Tepes, most Wallachian armies consisted of militia being backed up by a few archers and some noble cavalry from the richer Wallachian families.
Wallachian militia usually wore very little armor, but where excellent defenders of their lands.

Wallachian boyar cavalry-
The Wallachian cavalry was made up of noble blood. Meaning, that just about everyone that was part of the Wallachian boyar cavalry, was of an important family. The Wallachian boyar cavlary where well armored and where properly trained. Perfect for fighting against melee infantry and cavalry.


Artillery-
Mortar-
Used mostly for siege purpouses, the mortar was one of the artillery pieces that was used the most during several years. Very weak against pretty much all attacks, but very useful when used for siege purpouses.

Bombard-
Similar to the mortar, but a bit more powerful. Used for siege purpouses and sometimes against infantry.

Naval units-
Galley-
Expensive but can change the tide of a battle easily. Equiped with forward mounted cannons, the galley has a big advantage over many warships due to speed and the way their cannons are positioned.

Frigate-
Easy to build and powerful. They are not as strong as a galley, but they can fire faster than the galley. They can maneuver faster and like the galley, they are equiped with side mounted cannons, which gives them an advantage in big sea battles.

Yacht-
A weak version of the galley. Their cannons take a long time to reload and they are not equiped the same way the galley has them equiped.

Venetian galley-
Venice, being one of the main sea powers of Europe during this time period, had one or the most powerful navies in the world. The Venetian galley is a little stronger than the regular Galley due to it's design and amount of cannons.

[Uesugi Kenshin]

I believe that some of the Turkish Jannissaries were armoured and they were considered the cream of the crop because of their high discipline and skill, many christian families under Ottoman rule even bribed officials to accept their children into the Jannisary forces!

[SwordsMaster]

Excellent heavy infantry unit but weak against melee infantry.

That is a bit of a contradiction isnt it?

[Celtic_Winter]

That is a bit of a contradiction isnt it?

I apologize, I made myself not very clear with that statement.
by heavy infantry, I meant like, with muskets, as very good units with those weapons. Like I mentioned, there will be different types of Jannisaries, They will all have different strengths and weaknesses.

[Silver Rusher]

Thanks for this CW. Keep up the good work!

[Celtic_Winter]

The cossacks, post to be updated.
Cossacks-

Ukranian sich Cossack-
The Ukranian cossack, Unlike the other Cossacks, dosnt carry a spear but a sword and a bow. Good for tactical attacks on enemy flanks.

Don Cossack-
Not as powerful as the Ukranian Sich Cossack, the Don Cossack uses a spear and is not as heavily armored. Good for melee cavalry attacks.

[Celtic_Winter]

(to be updated)
Hussars-

Neapolitan Hussars:
In Naples, there is a national heritage for Feudal Knights, but now with the evolution of guns light cavalry are equally important. And that is when the Hussar comes in...

Hussars:
The Hussar is a rather weak unit, but if used properly and with skill, it can be very effective. The Hussars carry a sword and are not heavily armoured.
very useful for ambushes or assisting heavy cavalry attacks.

Winged Hussar:
The Winged Hussar, was usually found with the Polish armies, but at times, you could find them in other European armies. The Winged Hussar, is equiped with a pike and wears proper armor. Excellent heavy cavalry unit. Very fast, well armored and very effective against melee infantry and cavalry, the Winged Hussars, where highly respected.

[andriyko]

The cossacks, post to be updated.
Cossacks-

Ukranian sich Cossack-
The Ukranian cossack, Unlike the other Cossacks, dosnt carry a spear but a sword and a bow. Good for tactical attacks on enemy flanks.

Don Cossack-
Not as powerful as the Ukranian Sich Cossack, the Don Cossack uses a spear and is not as heavily armored. Good for melee cavalry attacks.

Two points:
1. Cossacks Cavalry didn't carry missile wepon in battle, usually (both pike and sabre were often used though). Instead, Cossack Infantry is famous for it (Cossack Musketeers together w/ Janissaries were the best in the region).

2. No sizeable body of Cossacks existed to form Don Cossacks before mid 18th century. Also, they were same Sitch Cossacks who migrated there.

Also, word Cossack has many versions of origin, free man just seem to romantized to be true -- most likely it's Turkik for rogue/brihand.

PS Before you ask: no, I didn't base my statement on the game "Cossack", the game just seems to be quite accurate ;)

[Celtic_Winter]

Two points:
1. Cossacks Cavalry didn't carry missile wepon in battle, usually (both pike and sabre were often used though). Instead, Cossack Infantry is famous for it (Cossack Musketeers together w/ Janissaries were the best in the region).

2. No sizeable body of Cossacks existed to form Don Cossacks before mid 18th century. Also, they were same Sitch Cossacks who migrated there.

Also, word Cossack has many versions of origin, free man just seem to romantized to be true -- most likely it's Turkik for rogue/brihand.

PS Before you ask: no, I didn't base my statement on the game "Cossack", the game just seems to be quite accurate ;)

Hey Andriyko,
thank you for the corrections. Apparently, this small book I have on the cossacks, has a sketch of a cossack with a sword and a bow, but ill take your word for it.

[cegorach]

I am from a rival mod, but I am posting this to correct one serious mistake in the list.

"Hussars:
The Hussar is a rather weak unit, but if used properly and with skill, it can be very effective. The Hussars carry a sword and are not heavily armoured.
very useful for ambushes or assisting heavy cavalry attacks.

Winged Hussar:
The Winged Hussar, was usually found with the Polish armies, but at times, you could find them in other European armies. The Winged Hussar, is equiped with a pike and wears proper armor. Excellent heavy cavalry unit. Very fast, well armored and very effective against melee infantry and cavalry, the Winged Hussars, where highly respected."


First thing at that time light Hussars were using a lance and a curved shield with a sabre as the secondary weapon.
There were several types of this units

Szekely Hussars ( armed with bow as well), Hungarian Hussars ( armoured), Croatian Hussars ( lighter than the Hungarian), Rac ( Serbian Hussars) and Ussaria ( Polish light hussars).

All came from the Rac, but were different in some way.
Rac should be mercenaries.




Later ( around 1570)

Polish Winged Hussars ( Husaria) appeared - a very different cavalry unit, which dominated the battlefields of middle/eastern Europe for more than a century and were invincible for about 50 years ( to 1626).
They were fast, armoured ( not really heavily) and very disciplined. Used horses with incredible stamina, 5 m long HOLLOW lances, 1,5 long sword, a special 'Husaria' sabres, wheellock pistols and sometimes an axe or a warhammer.
Wings - 1 earlier, 2 after around 1630 which could scare anemy horses and infantrymen and protected from Tatar lassooes.
Were using several types of formation to counter all kind of enemies - from iron-hard Swedish infantry to agile Tatars and numerous Russian or Ottoman troops.

When winning usually were using about 100 dead, killing 30-100 times more. When losing usually they did most of damage in enemy ranks, and every defeat they suffered was something worth describing in details.


Because they were so successfull some armies tried to copy them, which proved to be impossible.
You simply cannot give wings somebody and expect him to be as good as this unique unit.
The only unit worth mentioning is Russian 'Gusary ' - there were about 1000 of them ( maximum), but were never so good as Husaria ( which scared even Gustav Adolph).

Anyway here are the decsriptions of both units from P&M TW for MTW, use them if you like.

One thing to note Russian Gusary didn't use the 1,5 m long lance-like sword, which was one of most important weapons of the Hussars.


"Gusary are the russian response to the Polish Winged Hussars. Although they look similar and are armed with similar weapons they are still a copy, and a copy is rarely as good as the original"

"Polish Winged Hussars are the very elite of the Polish army. Armed with 5 m. long hollowed lances, heavy sabres, pistols, 1.5 long swords and mounted on the best steeds in the country these professional soldiers are the scourge of all enemies of the Commonwealth. Thanks to their lances and special tactics even enemy pikemen are in trouble."


If you need more info just ask.

My regards Cegorach/Hetman

[Uesugi Kenshin]

Nice to know.

[Suleimen the Magnificent]

Spanish Musketmen
Armed with a heavy spanish musket and has a rapier for self defence. As these are professenial soldiers they are armoured in proper spanish war gear (helm, breastplate ect.). As muskets could only be used by strong men I think they should be a 2 turn unit.

Spanish Pikemen
Armed with a long (5.2m) pike and a sword for close combat. Well protected by armour. Should not be too proficant with his sword.

Spanish Harquebusier
Armed with a arquebuse and a broad sword. Has only spanish style helm.

'Gentlemen Adventurer' (any other name ideas?)
Mercenary. Recruitable in Spanish-French-Italian Mederterain (sp?) coasts. Armed with hand and half sword. Armoured in a similar fashion to gothic foot knight (but more up to date. I'll try post a pic soon). Expensive to recruit and mantain.

I'll try and post more later.

Do you want ideas for ships yet?

[Celtic_Winter]

Spanish Musketmen
Armed with a heavy spanish musket and has a rapier for self defence. As these are professenial soldiers they are armoured in proper spanish war gear (helm, breastplate ect.). As muskets could only be used by strong men I think they should be a 2 turn unit.

Spanish Pikemen
Armed with a long (5.2m) pike and a sword for close combat. Well protected by armour. Should not be too proficant with his sword.

Spanish Harquebusier
Armed with a arquebuse and a broad sword. Has only spanish style helm.

'Gentlemen Adventurer' (any other name ideas?)
Mercenary. Recruitable in Spanish-French-Italian Mederterain (sp?) coasts. Armed with hand and half sword. Armoured in a similar fashion to gothic foot knight (but more up to date. I'll try post a pic soon). Expensive to recruit and mantain.

I'll try and post more later.

Do you want ideas for ships yet?

those are good. Thanks there suleimen!
yes. Ships would be good. I have some information about them in my computer, but I am not too sure about how accurate it is

[Silver Rusher]

Suleman! I thought you would never return. Welcome back.

[Suleimen the Magnificent]

Sorry Silver, I have had a few deaths in the family lately.

Celtic Winter, most of the direct info I have for Mediterranean navies comes for John Francis Guilmartin Jr's 'Gunpowder and Galleys'. Most of the stuff that I post about atlantic fleets will be use more indirect evidence but probably will still be accurate. But the book has a bit about them too. I'll try anyway.

What is your info about? (Mediterranean or Atlantic?)

[Uesugi Kenshin]

That sucks....

[Celtic_Winter]

Sorry Silver, I have had a few deaths in the family lately.

Celtic Winter, most of the direct info I have for Mediterranean navies comes for John Francis Guilmartin Jr's 'Gunpowder and Galleys'. Most of the stuff that I post about atlantic fleets will be use more indirect evidence but probably will still be accurate. But the book has a bit about them too. I'll try anyway.

What is your info about? (Mediterranean or Atlantic?)

It's mainly about the mediterenean. But I have some information about atlantic as well.

[Suleimen the Magnificent]

Infantry
Soldados (Spanish Naval Swordsmen) (my spanish is no good, is this correct?)
Armed with rapiers or broadswords. Lightly armoured, small breastplate (no backplate). Should be recruitable in port-type structure. Expensive to maintain. (Might be better as a Merc. Can mercs be faction specific?)

Companeros Sobresalientes (Spanish Naval Harquebusier)
Armed and armoured similar to Spanish Harquebusier. But is much better trained, both in marksmanship and in the use of his sword. A small unit (cav size?), 2 turns to train to simulate the social condition in which they were created.

Venitean (sp?) Swordsman
Armed with sword and armoured in leather. Has a buckler. Excellent light fighters.

Venitean Crossbowmen
Recruited from their formidable naval contingent these crossbowmen are armed with a sword and a crossbow. Armoured in leathers. They should be good with their swords as naval combat demands it.

A general comment for the Veniteans, I think all their units should be very costly to maintain so that the player is forced to raise them only in a time of war. This would simulate that fact that when the veniteans went to war they were forced to draw troops from their merchant classes, with the resulting loss of profit.

edit: have renamed Spanish Naval Harquebusier, and naval swordsman, as per Celtic Winter's suggestion

[Celtic_Winter]

Maybe to make the names of the units more interesting, we can have them in the native languages. For example, for Aragonese infantry, we can have it like "infanteria Aragonesa". But then again, that might confuse the player a bit..

[Silver Rusher]

Oh, well I'm very sorry to hear that Suleiman.

[Suleimen the Magnificent]

Celtic Winter, I would like you to state in the first post of this thread that everthing from 'Jassinary Musketeers' down was submitted by myself. Thank you.

Also, I say that I post my ideas for ships and ypu post yours and we see which sounds both the most sensible and the most viable.

[Silver Rusher]

Celtic Winter, I would like you to state in the first post of this thread that everthing from 'Jassinary Musketeers' down was submitted by myself. Thank you.

Also, I say that I post my ideas for ships and ypu post yours and we see which sounds both the most sensible and the most viable.

Very strange, when I made the list it gave credit to you. Maybe he just accidently left it out. I'll edit it now-

EDIT: OK, I can't edit his post. When CW gets back I'm sure he'll edit it.

[Celtic_Winter]

Celtic Winter, I would like you to state in the first post of this thread that everthing from 'Jassinary Musketeers' down was submitted by myself. Thank you.

Also, I say that I post my ideas for ships and ypu post yours and we see which sounds both the most sensible and the most viable.

Finished. I apologize for not giving you credit.
I have already posted some of the ship information I have, check it out.
And I can do all the language translating for the Italian,Spanish and maybe German units since those are the languages I know.

[Yggdrasill]

All right, I'll post now what I think should be the Ottoman cavalry. I really have a lot of info on this subject and I compiled as best as could be done given the limitations and the requirement to generalize for the purposes of gameplay, so I strongly suggest that you make this list the official one, as I am not just guessing here. I'll back up every unit with a picture to give the modellers something to work with without delay. I've also tried to somehow standardise the models so as not to create too much job for them.

Of course you're free to give suggestion and correct if I'm wrong, but don't do it if you only have a vague recollection of something you read years ago.

1. Kapikullu Sipahi - or Sipahi of the Porte as they were labelled in MTW, this is the same thing only 'official'. To model it, basically copy the Sipahi in scale armour 1530 on the site I posted. You won't find a better model than this (in fact the artist who made it basically copied a surviving armour in Florence). The horse armour is a lot shorter than the one in RTW Cataphract type units, extending just below the horse's belly (so as not to impede movement). It is armed with a heavy lance and a sabre, however somebody should animate a couched lance type charge for this (and other) cav unit. The helmet is a standard sisak, a very often type which we will be using for many other units as well so it's worth modelling accurately.

2. Timarli Sipahi - or a basic sipahi unit funded through the timar system of land grants. Somewhat lighter (i'll send you a picture Rusher, as soon as I can find a scanner), horse was armoured as well but only with a chanfron (a plate thet covered the front of the horse's head) and a scale apron to protect the chest and neck (basically half of the armour worn by number 1 guy - this is optional as it wasn't that often). Armed also with a lance and sabre (we need to model a sabre as well since there are none in RTW). This was basic battle cav for the Ottomans. The way it should be modelled is that number 1 are similar to the sacred band of Carthage (takes 2 turns to train, very expensive, very effective, fights to the death) while number two is a more cost effective variant.

3. Gebelis - armed retainers of the sipahi, they were armed at the expense of the sipahi, had no land grants of their own but hoped to acquire one throuh service. Should be modelled according to the Ottoman Sipahi from the batlle of Sisak 1593 on the aforementioned site. Armed with a bow and a sabre, but not classed as light cav.
Important - is it possible to give units both a bow and a shield to use with a sabre? It is impoortant since Ottoman cav and Jannissaries used shield slung over the saddle or back while shooting arrows.

4. Akinji - the famous light cav, armed with bows and sabre and shield. Will post a great pen drawing later.

5. Deli - scout, light horseman, armed with a lance shield and sabre. Picture pending, also great pen drawing

6. Voyniq cavalry - these were Cristian vassals that served the sultan. Should be modelled like a cross between Western heavy cav and turkish sipahi. These are very important and in at least two major battles were instrumental in Ottoman victory (Varna and Nicopolis). Did not exist beyond the 15th century. We'll model them like a copy of a Hungarian armoured cav, maybe change the colour or something. Will post a picture when I get around to creating Hungarian units.

7. Some merc cav (like the Numidians for Carthage) - Tatar horse archer (I think everybody knows how they looked like, but if necessary, I have a great pic), Arab cav (for use in the desert), Wallachian cav (the only one I can offer no info on, I have only one picture and it isn't very good, maybe somebody can help).

And for the love of everything NO CAMELS!

As a final note, I think we really should be getting started on doing comprehensive lists of units for other factions as well. This is by far the most difficult thing to do. I'll post the same for the Russians, Italians, Moors and the Mamluks (and yes I vote for them too!). I can also help a lot with the English, Spanish (during the 15th century period), Germans and French during the 16th.

I hope to post info on Ottoman infantry by tomorrow evening.

Also, if anybody has any info on the Spanish infantry known as TERCIOS it is vital. They were widely regarded as the best infantry during early to late 16th century but I have absaolutely no info on them. I even don't know how they were armed (pikes, guns or sword and buckler?). A picture would be great.

[Silver Rusher]

I'll use a system of levels for this.

Level 1: Akinji (or "Turkish Horsemen" as they may well be labelled)

Level 2: Timarli Sipahi (I'd label this as Sipahi to avoid confusion)

Level 3: Voynik/Voyniq Cavalry

Level 4: Gebelis

And the Kapikullu Sipahi shall be the general's guard. I feel the Deli to seem fairly useless so I shall regret that I think they would take up too much space in the game. Not everyone can just look at a cavalry unit called "Kapikullu Sipahi" and say, "Oh yeah, of course I know what that is."

That is the ottoman's cavalry list.

Ottoman Infantry List:

Level 1: Town Guardsman

Level 2: Ottoman Infantry

Level 3: Janissary

Level 4: Janissary Heavy Infantry

And the recommended archer list is coming soon.

[Yggdrasill]

Well Delis are essentially not necessary, so it wouldn't hurt eliminating them.

Everything else is as I suggested except...

Akinjis have to be named Akinjis. It's just the way it is. Naming them Tukish cav or something similar would be like naming Companion cavalry of Macedonia Heavy cavalry. This is the name they were feared all over Europe. This is the name you should name them in the mod. Please. Akin means raid, plunder, attack - this is what they did - attacked, pillaged, burned, basically destroyed the opponents ability to fight. This is a must.

As for Sipahi instead of Timarli S., I guess it's fine. To avoid confusion. But, please General's Sipahi sounds so generic, unimaginative... either name them as I suggested, or Sipahi of the Porte or at the very least Sultan's Sipahi... Names are a very cheap way of adding credibility and historical accuracy to the game. We're not CA, we can't do everything to their high standards. We need simple little tricks like this.

Also, the infantry list needs some work. For one, azaps never used maces, they were infantry archers, then pioneers, and then finally arquebus armed infantry.


The merc cav are basically cav that other factions are gonna use (tatar archer) or we already have them (arab cav, sort of).

Do you still want me to post pictures? It seems that you have this already figured out how you want it to be.

[Silver Rusher]

Alright, alright. Just light feedback is needed. It's not the final list, just a primer kind of thing. A lot of the infantry were Suleiman's idea.

[Silver Rusher]

Some Ottoman Range Units:

Level 1: Archers

Level 2: Azap Bowmen

Level 3: Janissary Bowmen

Level 4: Trebuchet

And Gunpowder units:

Level 1: Handgunners

Level 2: Janissary Arquebusiers

Level 3: Ballistic Cannon

Level 4: Siege Cannon

Feedback would be nice.

[Silver Rusher]

And Polish Cavalry (feedback would be nice):

Level 1: Light Hussars

Level 2: Horse Archers

Level 3: Hussars

Level 4: Winged Hussars