Last slot poll

[SwordsMaster]

So here are the options available to fill our last slot, vote and give some arguments, or background historical info

Enjoy

[cegorach]

Voted for Portugal.

Reasons:

1. It is 1480 AD in the beginning,

2. I want France to expand into Italy and possibly clash with Spain there,

3. Venice would be strenghtened this way which is useful to fight the Ottomans,

Regards Cegorach

[SwordsMaster]

Voted Portugal, I actually prefer Fez, but as there is no info I could gather over a week's research, I gave up...

[Duke Malcolm]

Fez, because I like the name.

[saundersag]

You should choose, fez because it may be the one that takes the most effort but it will also be the one with the greatest rewards. All the other factions are european and they are already very well represented while fez is more individual and intresting. It will add more variation to your factions with a non european faction which was one of the trade centres of africa and it's location was of great strategical importance.

So choose fez, vote for intresting not easy.

[Eastside Character]

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[Count, tHe dEmEnToR]

I voted Portugal for 3 reasons:

- First, even tough Portugal wasn't that so active in European terms, it actually had quite a lot of importance in the world. Portugal fought he Spanish and the Dutch and eventually regained a great part of it's former Atlantic power.

While Spain was facing the 30 years war, Portugal forming an alliance with Cataluña engaged in a rebellion that lasted for 28 years. In my opnion Portugal contributed to the end of the Spanish empire as the greatest in the world. In the end of the thirty years war, France replaced Spain as the greatest power.

- Also i think it would be interesting to see a historical campaign of the Portuguese Restoration, or at least a few historical battles such as Montijo - 1644 and Montes Carlos - 1665 (Spain vs Portugal), and also the Battle of the Guararapes (the Portuguese vs the Dutch).

- The last reason is because im Portuguese. I mean, what else could i do besides defending my country's presence?

Cheers,

[caesar44]

it was hard .... shuuuiw
at last voted for genoa because :
1. portugal historically did not played a major roll in europe (played in africa and s. america)
2. swiss - the same idea
3. fess - very interesting but...
4. saxony - the mod already have 2 or 3 german factions (or not ???)

[Narayanese]

I voted Portugal because saxony was split in three at the time, and genoa was too spread out, at least in early 15th century, had crimea, coast around city of genoa, and some islands.

[Eastside Character]

(...) genoa was too spread out, at least in early 15th century, had crimea, coast around city of genoa, and some islands.

You arent quite correct here. For the starting date 1480 AD Genoa would own the following:
- Liguria
- Corsica
- some islands are Chios and Samos but they wont get a region

This makes two possible provinces for Genoa, but its main strength was naval power. This is something people voting for Portugal often mention, but for the Mediterranean Genoa was far more important a naval power than rather colonially oriented Portugal. Genoese merchants established trade routes to ports such as: Southampton (England), Bajonna (France), La Coruna (Spain), Porto (Portugal), Lisbon (Portugal), Cadiz (Spain), Valencia (Spain), Barcelona (Spain), Narbonne (France), Marseilles (France), Sassari (Sardinia), Messana (Sicily), Modon (Greece), Kanea (Crete), Farama (Egypt), Adana (Turkey), Istanbul (Turkey), Keffe (Turkey), Sinope (Turkey), Trebzon (Turkey), Azov (Tatars). They were all over the inner sea.

Oh, and Christopher Columbus was Genoese.

Regards
EC

[Narayanese]

Ahhh, Genoa lost Crimea in 1475.

[Ignoramus]

Genoa, they were great rivals to Venice, they had Corsica as well as some land in the Black Sea region. Portugal, wasn't very militant at all.

[cegorach]

I think the poll should be closed on 1st June, so vote now

[AlexPeters]

First of all:
Hello again...

I voted for Switzerland and i'd like to comment some proposals.
Genoa is "dying" when the mods starts, the crimean possesions are overrun by steppe tribes and the expanding ottomans, their lines of supply are too long and their possessions in the eastern meditarranean are already lost.
Their land forces are inferior to those of their neighbours and their trade efforts are decreasing (compared to Venice).
Saxony is quite important during the reformation but has never been a real military power, splitted into different parts with rulers that hated each other (even brothers did). The unification of saxony only happened through external influence and/or by heritage.
The Berbers are also splitted and only Tunesia will rise to a certain power with effects on other nations, the other areas, as Fez or Algier are city states with little land they control. Their importance is naval only and becomes dangerous because of their continues raids along the coasts of italy, france and spain.
Portugal would have been my second choice, they are on their way up to a real power, some decisions (North African expedition) and some weak rulers lead to their fall only and of course the aggressive dominance of habsburg/spain. Beside those events they would have had the supllies of a huge colonial empire and the immense trade income from there which would have abled them to take more influence in europe.
Switzerland is the decisive power at least in the beginning of the mod, whoever they fight for is dominant. Their military skill is unreached at that time, even at the conference 1821 in vienna a part of treaty was dealing with them (they aren't allowed to serve as mercenaries from that time on until now).
The Landsknechts are formed only to have an alternative to their service.
Austria/HRE tried to conquer and/or dominate them and failed, the supported the southern german peasant uprisings and played a big role in the italian wars.
Zwingli and other important persons of the reformation have been working and spreading their faith from there also.

Alex

[Fianóglach]

IRELAND! But since that won't happen, I vote for Portugal, definately a powerhouse in it's own right.

[cegorach]

Perhaps the whole poll isn't necessary. According to some gossips about the Barbarian Invasion the limit of the factiopns will be removed entirely or at least much higher.

[Sundjata Keita]

Good, more is better. I could probably provide info about the berbers and fez if necessary, one of my fields of interest

Sundjata Keita

[SwordsMaster]

Good, more is better. I could probably provide info about the berbers and fez if necessary, one of my fields of interest

Sundjata Keita

Really? Apart from a couple of maps of dubious reliability I couldnt find anything on Fez, could you post a link or somehting?

[cegorach]

I agree with Swordmaster, I would be really greateful for any info about those countries - I can even give them a place in the MTW edition for now...

[cegorach]

IT IS DECIDED - PORTUGAL

Genoa, Switzerland and Fez ( if I get some information about it) will be added if possible later, other factions might appear as well if Barbarian Invasion will allow this

My Regards Cegorach