Civil War in the first 10 turns!

[Sethik]

Wow. Just wow.

I'm playing the latest RTR mod which makes a unified Rome. Romans start off with two cities and Italy is relatively neutral except for some Greeks on the southern tip. I started conquering cities in the immediate vcinity of my starting towns and eventually butted heads with the Greeks. After sending them packing and assassinating (I edited the strat.txt to start with a good assassin) their generals a bunch of times I am basically in control of the middle of Italy.

For fun I decide to assassinate some Senate Leaders. I knock one out with out a problem. The next one I try to kill catches my assassin. He dies and the Senate is pissed. I get a message that the Senate has now outlawed my Faction. At first I thought it was cool because I had never gotten to a civil war that early, but then I looked in the roman's unit stack...

4 Generals. 2 of which are 9/3/3. But that's not the worst part. The worst part are the cohorts. Pretorian Cohorts. 16 of them. All attributes MAXED. They each have 21 melee, 28 ranged, and 40 defense.



Any ideas?

Excuse me, I think I have to take a trip to the vomitoruim

Edit: My army is made up of a 2 Rhodian Slingers, 4 Hastai, 3 Princeps, 4 Trarii, 3 Velites, and 4 Generals. Most are vanilla.

[Mongoose]

my advice?


head for the hills!!!


Or just restart at that point

[Mikeus Caesar]

Eheheh....go up to them, put on a puppy face and say "i'm sorry?" If that doesn't work, run for the hills!!

[Sethik]

I'm thinking of trying to use some cheats or something!

Maybe auto_win will help. Till then I think I just left Roman dignity soiled in my pants.

[myz]

how can RTR have only one roman faction, i thought that was hardcoded, even the EB team says they cannot do away with three roman factions...

[Marcus Maxentius]

There's more to it, but the orignal factions are now different shades of red

[Sethik]

What they dide was made the brutii and scipii unplayable and gave them no cities. They are still in the strat.txt. It is really fun playing one Roman faction, though once you reunite Italy and Sciliy you have more wealth, population, than you know what to do with!

[Wishazu]

in my last greek campaign on Emperor/Emperor difficulties i lost a standard greek Army made up of lots of armoured and normal hoplites with a few support units in cluding 2 cretan archers. It got creamed man, nearly 1300 men butchered for about 150 Deaths inflicted. So, I thought "I aint having that!" i got a full stack Athenian army that had been beating the hell out of roman armies for the last 15 years and sent them into combat against the roman barbarians. Imagine my dismay when it got routed, a few units of Athenian hoplites and a general managed to escape to the hills and continue to raid other roman provinces. now with both my stacks in italy gone i was starting to worry about the cities i had captured that were now just garrisoned with militia hoplites, lol Anyways i called in the big guns, within 2 turns i had my Spartan army land on the italian coast and immediately attempt to seek battle with the senate. When it happened it was a bloodbath, ive never had an SP battle like it, it was intense but i eventually won it and that was the senate conquered, incidentally, they were the first faction to be wiped out :)

so good luck mate

[Count Belisarius]

Somehow, the RTR folks did it, hardcoded or not. RTR is a fantastic game, the game that RTW should have, could have, been. There are only two "Roman" factions in RTR: the Senate and the playable Romans in red. The good news is that if you are playing as the Romans, that unbelievably powerful Senatorial army will help fend off your enemies if they even remotely threaten Rome proper. When civil war time rolls around, however, you had better watch out.

The first time I took on the Senate in RTR, I had turned the Greeks into a major powerhouse. I had run the Macedonian barbarians off the continent, conquered Sicily totally (which is much harder in RTR btw), humbled mighty Carthage into accepting a shameful peace treaty, humiliated the distant Ptolemies by taking Crete and Rhodes, and reduced Dacia and Thrace both to meekly accepting my protection. My navies roamed the seas with impunity, cash was pouring in, and my armies stood supreme by land.

After making peace with the Ptolemies, thus making my borders reasonably secure, I turned my attention to the insolent Romans, whom I had smashed repeately on the field, preferring to take a defensive strategy in southern Italy until I had consolidated my Hellenic Empire elsewhere. I quickly drove up the peninsula with two full-stack armies of my best-equipped and most experienced troops. Over and over, the Romans reeled back in defeat . . . until I came within a turn's march of Roma itself.

A puny Senatorial army led by a mere 4-star general attacked one of my stacks led by a 7-star general. I had a stack of full-strength two-silver-chevron hoplites with upgraded weapons and armor, archers, peltasts, Greek cav, a backup general, even a unit of mercenary war elephants. I had a great army, a great general, and I had nearly overwhelming numbers. The Senate handed me my head.

In my arrogance, I deployed in standard single-line formation, disdaining mere trickery to win the battle. All the advantages were mine, right? I'll line up, overlap their line, turn their flanks, and put them to rout. We'll be eating dinner in the Forum tomorrow afternoon.

The Senate came straight on, contemptuously shrugging aside a hailstorm of arrows and javelins. They paused before engaging, cut loose a devastating volley of pila, and charged in hand-to-hand. All is going according to plan, thus far. I overlap their line, engage the endmost enemy units' flanks, and wait for the rout to start. Then I noticed that something was amiss. Ordinary Roman infantry has a tough time working their way through the hedge of hoplite spears in RTR (the hoplite formation is much more formidible than in RTW), but this was no ordinary infantry. My hoplites started dropping like flies, for no appreciable return, so I rushed my cavalry units around the flanks and crashed into the rear of the enemy's formations. Nothing but dead horses everywhere for my trouble. I was becoming somewhat alarmed at this point, so I sent my peltasts around to send a volley or three of javelins into the enemys' flanks. No result, except for my peltasts getting chewed up and routed by the enemy generals. In desperation, I sent my war elephants out, and they rampage down the enemy line from right to left, scattering EVERY SINGLE enemy unit in the line of battle, with the exception of their generals. Nothing. The enemy just reformed, and coolly went on about their business of slaughtering my poor hoplites. Then, two units disengaged, and loosed a volley of pila at my war elephants, killing fully a third of them, and routing the rest. After that, it was over. I had played my best cards and lost. The kill ratio was humiliating, something like 7-8 to 1, like I ususally do to the computer.

I had grossly underestimated the quality of the Senate's army, having neglected to send spies in before the battle. Heck, this was my first campaign in RTR, and I had no IDEA what I was getting into. Pride goeth before the fall, needless to say.

I gritted my teeth, went back on the strategic defensive, and regrouped. I came back several years later with a stack of Athenian, Corinthian and Spartan hoplites, and gave the Senate its comeuppance in a very hard-fought battle. But that's another story . . .

[Sethik]

One tactic I did in Old School Vanilla RTW was to assassinate the Senate Leadership. Wipe all of them out. What is left is a pretty powerful army standing outside of Rome. So I just bribed them. Bam! got myself a new toy to send the Gauls fleeing!

[Dutch_guy]

Also playing RTR

In my greek game I knew that I was never going to beat the senate army in the field, it being very early in the game , no spartans for me yet, ( with my basic armoured hoplite army ) so I decided to trap the big senate army - I built one decoy army ( a formidable one though not able to inflict great damage to the senate ) - and lured the arrogant senate army with it's 4 generals to the city of Ancona , with my 'number one army - led by Pyrrus himself - I quickly built forts behind the senate army, garrisoned with samnite mercs.

Now I could seige the City of Rome , which now contained only 2 units , a roman general ( 3 gold chevrons ) and 1 preat. cohort ( also 3 gold chevrons )
I sieged it and built towers and sap points, but I wasn't content to use them , as I knew that my hoplites would get slaughtered op on the walls by the merciless cohort unit.

I was content with starving them out.
I - at first - didn;t think that I would have enough time , but the senate didn't start besieging my fort immediately but just kept walking between ancona and a northern rebel province .
I geuss I was lucky.

after 8 turn or so , the senate army sallied forth.
I decided to autocalc. thinking it could be done since I had a full stack and they didn't have more than 130 units ( playing large )

I won , but at a tremendous cost more then 800 ( maybe more ) hoplites died for just 1 enemy general unit and a praetorian cohort...

[The Stranger]

try to get some YUTSEB ELES

[PseRamesses]

Wow. Just wow.

I'm playing the latest RTR mod which makes a unified Rome. Romans start off with two cities and Italy is relatively neutral except for some Greeks on the southern tip. I started conquering cities in the immediate vcinity of my starting towns and eventually butted heads with the Greeks. After sending them packing and assassinating (I edited the strat.txt to start with a good assassin) their generals a bunch of times I am basically in control of the middle of Italy.

For fun I decide to assassinate some Senate Leaders. I knock one out with out a problem. The next one I try to kill catches my assassin. He dies and the Senate is pissed. I get a message that the Senate has now outlawed my Faction. At first I thought it was cool because I had never gotten to a civil war that early, but then I looked in the roman's unit stack...

4 Generals. 2 of which are 9/3/3. But that's not the worst part. The worst part are the cohorts. Pretorian Cohorts. 16 of them. All attributes MAXED. They each have 21 melee, 28 ranged, and 40 defense.



Any ideas?

Excuse me, I think I have to take a trip to the vomitoruim

Edit: My army is made up of a 2 Rhodian Slingers, 4 Hastai, 3 Princeps, 4 Trarii, 3 Velites, and 4 Generals. Most are vanilla.

To take out the senare´s army with a low-grade one you´re really need to take losses, even lose 2-4 battles before inflicting enough casualities to Rome since you easilly can outbuild them. I usually bring in 4 onagers, 6 archers and 10 hoplites. I park my army on a hillside in Latium and wait for them to engage me and I always aim for their generals first with all my missile since the cohorts just laughs at the tickle-sensation of arrows and boulders.

[phred]

[QUOTE=Sethik]



Any ideas?

QUOTE]

I would try to offer them a province (or two) for peace/alliance.
It's too early in the game to take on those praetorians; you don't have the money to bribe them or the units to defeat them. Send your armies to finish taking southern Italy and hopefully the Senate won't beseige any of your towns.

Does anyone know if you can make peace with the Senate after they outlaw you?

[The Stranger]

ask a for peace/s new alliance. but it never is as tight as it was before.