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Thread: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

  1. #31
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    3. Psellus' advice. If you can't win them, make them join you. You can always gather an army of mercs to crush them if needs be.... And you would be weakening the Sultan at the same time.
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  2. #32

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Oh, in case you're wondering, it's now late March, 1068.
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  3. #33
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    We are nearing Manzikert.

    We need to attack fast. But for now, we have to wait. Constructing forts along the main keys in Cappadocia is very important. The best horses, especially to equip Kataphraktoi and Klibanophoroi, are bred in Cappadocia. Cappadocia must be defended at all cost, but for now, wait.
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  4. #34
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Do not hesitate. Attack immediately. Do not allow these nomads to settle or gain any hold. They are the enemy within. Follow Scylitzes advice.
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  5. #35
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    #3
    The Turks are in search of somewhere to call home, let's give them that. They also look for a way to live, let's give them that as well.
    Lastly, it is wellknown that there is a lot of disagreement in the ranks of the Turks. It doesn't seem all that unlikely that these Turks will resent some of the other tribes for past actions.
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  6. #36
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Isn't it too risky to let the Turks immigrate the lands in huge numbers, just like the Visigoths of old Rome? I feel that we shouldn't make the mistake Rome made long ago, as some of your subordinates (the themes of Anatolia) may not be able (or unwilling) to give the Turks a "home sweet home" they seek. Your local indigenous population would lose their loyalty to you and the Turks won't be loyal to you either. They'll probably rebel as enemies from within, a destructive situation. Manzikert is coming. [Diogenes, historically, was the one to fight and John Ducas (I think...) betrayed him there - Michael Ducas (you) would rule later and ineffectually saw Asia Minor taken away by floods of Turkish horde-immigrants] This would ruin you. I strongly suggest other choices.

    However, the remaining choices are very hard to pick.

    John Ducas' - retraining and rearming available forces
    pros - stronger units in the pitched battle
    cons - loss of speed/initiative, no extra manpower

    Manuel's - gathering huge mercenary forces
    pros - increased manpower, if cavalry, greatly increased mobility and flexibility
    cons - emptied treasury, loss of initiative, possible betrayal by mercenaries at the height of the conflict

    John Scylitzes' - attack immediately
    pros - the initiative
    cons - no extra manpower, not as strong units as the first choice

    John Ducas' choice isn't worth it. The stronger units will do well in the pitched battle, true, but the situation will get worse quickly. Manuel's choice, though normally useful, is too dangerous; the Pechenegs historically betrayed Byzantine forces at Manzikert for the Turks - if this happens again we will be doomed in the field. So I choose the last choice: 4. Though I fear the campaign may be hard to conduct (especially NOT to get bogged down) the Imperial show of force is necessary to put a halt to the Turkish progress. Why, then, would your mother betray you for Diogenes had she not see the dangers of the situation? I doubt Ducas would betray you in the field like he did against Diogenes historically (did I confuse him with someone else?) and the Turks had not made that far in Cappadocia that you would be bogged down in your campaign. Defeat them early before they scatter far enough, and invade in much enough numbers to be too hard to crush.
    Last edited by AntiochusIII; 08-30-2005 at 23:59.

  7. #37

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    The more you think about it, the more you like Psellus' idea. The surest way to win a war is to turn your enemy's strength into your own. After discussing the particulars with the orator some more, he agrees to depart for the eastern provinces and direct the program himself. There he will meet up with Botaniates, who will help him deal with the martial side of the matter. You will miss Psellus' wise and steady presence, but you'll surely need a trustworthy supervisor on the scene, and no other appropriate candidate comes to mind. You watch him go with a heavy heart, as without your mother or Psellus your inner circle has begun to look discouragingly small.

    You soon recieve word from the court doctor that Diogenes has died of infection, as was expected. The next evening, Andronicus requests permission to enter your suite. "Brother, I know you have been busy of late," he says after some small talk, "but because you have been distracted by affairs of state, there are a few small things I thought might be best brought to your attention." After being motioned to continue, he goes on: "There are whispers among the servants that you intended the death of Diogenes. There are probably those who believe them. In addition, I have heard that the aristocrat Theodatus Arianites gave a speech to the senate that painted your rise to power as being won by trickery at the expense of your mother."

    "That is unfortunate," you note. "What was their reaction?"

    "Bear in mind that I wasn't there, but I'm told that their applause was more than courtesy required."

    You go to sleep that night worried about what your brother told you, but matters of international diplomacy have been catching your attention lately.

    The last of the letters arrive from foreign leaders, offering greetings or blessings. A polite one arrives from Alp Arslan of the Seljuk Empire, wishing you pleasant days. You did not recieve such a letter from the Pope, but that's not surprising: the two churches excommunicated one another in a feud between the Pope and the Patricarch of Constantinople fifteen years ago, and though a new person now occupies each position, hard feelings linger. You also did not recieve a letter from Robert Guiscard the Norman.

    Some of the couriers come bearing more than letters, however: a few carry minor gifts, and three have brought offers of true value: princesses. It appears that since becoming senior Emperor in Constantinople, you have become a very eligible bachelor. The ambassadors present their ladies with aplomb, each dressed in her nation's traditional garb but decked out with a few Greek touches so they don't seem too alien.

    From the Holy Roman Empire comes a light-haired woman named Helena of Swabia, sent by her mother, the dowager Empress Agnes, who, not unlike your own mother once did, sits as regent until her son comes of age. As for Helena herself, it is difficult to tell much about her personality from what little you have seen of her, but you've noticed that she is willing to smile at almost anyone, be they servants, guards, or even your co-Emperor, Constantine.

    The Khan of the Cumans sends Issedo, a young girl who generally keeps her eyes downcast politely, but you think she has a habit of studying people out of the corners of her eyes.

    The King of the Alans sends Maria, who also seems very demure, but you get the impression that this is not so much from cultural norms and courtesy, but rather the result of genuine shyness.

    On the other hand, thinking back to what Andronicus told you, one of the leading senators, Celcus Iagaris, has an eligible daughter who has begun attracting serious suitors. You've spoken with her a couple of times in passing, and she seems intelligent enough.

    Facing such a highly personal decision, you decide not to seek advice, but do some investigation yourself to discover the best choice. You may:

    1) Marry Helena of Swabia. While the Holy Roman Empire and Byzantium have many reasons to feud - both claim to be the successors of Rome, and both have historically laid claim to southern Italy - there is also a good reason to cooperate with the Germans, because you are both enemies of the Normans of Sicily. Also, marrying her would make you brother-in-law not only of the king of Germany, but of Solomon I of Hungary as well, who is married to Helena's sister. She is Catholic.

    2) Marry Issedo. The Cumans have been both helpful allies and dangerous enemies of Constantinople in the past. Marrying their princess should go a long way toward ensuring a benevolent relationship, and they could make critical allies against Hungary or the Pechenegs. She is a pagan, which gives you pause, but you get the impression of intelligence from her. Maybe she'll be willing to convert.

    3) Marry Maria. Though the Alans are not as strong as they once were, in recent years they have been on the rise again. They have long been on good terms with the Empire and practice good, Orthodox Christianity. Their location north of the Cacausus puts them in a position to be potential allies against the Turks if conflict breaks out in Armenia.

    4) Propose to Epiphania, the daughter of Celcus Iagaris. It seems unlikely that her father would reject an offer from an Emperor, and this could win you a powerful ally among the upper class.

    5) Marry no one yet. Alliances are a two-way street, and the Empire does not have the resources available at the moment to help anyone else with their problems. Besides, you don't have time for a domestic life.
    "All philosophy lies in two words, sustain and abstain."
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  8. #38
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I reckon this is the toughest one so far.... In matters of women a man can't ever be wise enough....

    Anyway, number 1 is definitely not a viable option, as the Germans are a potential enemy and the princess seems a bit..... of short-lasting convictions shall we say..... And besides, of all your concerns, Sicily is probably one of the least important ones. Its loss doesn't subtract significantly from the Empire, but Anatolia's loss does.

    The pagan is also out of the question. Not only the Pope would not send you his blessing, but your own patriarch will be irated and will sell you to the Germans you just refused. Could get VERY nasty....

    Maria or Epiphania?

    I'd say Maria (3) as you will need to secure the turkish border ASAP to turn your efforts into re-assembling your military machine to suit pressing needs. And we are nearing Manzikert as said earlier so you will need allies on that side.

    5. Seems like a viable option also and I'm willing to reconsider 3 to 5 if someone can think of a suitable objection to number 3.

    number 4 could be a good option, but I don't think the Emperor of Byzantium should mix himself with his councelors. Keep the distances and advice your brother to marry her. That way, you still get a political ally, and your brother has proven himself trustworthy enough to be admitted into your inner circle.
    Last edited by SwordsMaster; 08-31-2005 at 19:27.
    Managing perceptions goes hand in hand with managing expectations - Masamune

    Pie is merely the power of the state intruding into the private lives of the working class. - Beirut

  9. #39

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I'll go with Epiphania, because I think it's rather important to have enough support at home. Wouldn't want people to conspire against you while you're busy on campaign or something like that.
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  10. #40
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I would go with Maria of the Alans. They would make good allies against the Turks and it seems dangerous to allow a courtier a foot in the door to the throneroom.
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  11. #41
    Come to daddy Member Geoffrey S's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Maria sounds good; certainly a useful alliance if things start brewing in the eastern parts of the empire. Definitely not Epiphania, as obviously raising a noble above the rest won't help the somewhat strained relationship between Michael and the upper class. Issedo's tempting, but probably too bright and a potential risk later on.

    Looking back on things, punishing Diogenes and Michael's mother was proably a bad idea. It strained relations with the senate, and the mother was excellent at administration. Vykke, is there any chance when the story is over you indicate what the best options were and potential results?
    "The facts of history cannot be purely objective, since they become facts of history only in virtue of the significance attached to them by the historian." E.H. Carr

  12. #42

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I could probably go over a few of the more important choices.

    Looks like you're gonna be chillin' with Maria. SwordsMaster suggested in his response that you ask Andronicus to marry Epiphania instead. Let's have another vote to see if the rest of you think that's acceptable. SwordsMaster doesn't get another vote on it, I'm afraid.

    (I might allow "suggestions" in posts like this to go to vote, if they're made in the first post and I don't think they're too unreasonable or out of Michael's character. No guarantees though. Arbitrary, aren't I? )
    "All philosophy lies in two words, sustain and abstain."
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  13. #43
    Come to daddy Member Geoffrey S's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Getting Andronicus to marry her is an excellent idea. At worst it may be seen as a snub to Epiphania's family, but not if Andronicus is publicly shown to be important when it comes to running the empire.
    "The facts of history cannot be purely objective, since they become facts of history only in virtue of the significance attached to them by the historian." E.H. Carr

  14. #44
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I think it could be dangerous to marry your brother to the daughter of a powrful courtier. Together they could plot your downfall.
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    "Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes, or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison." - C. S. Lewis

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    (Insert innuendo here) Member Balloon Bomber Champion DemonArchangel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    The thing is, Michael's brother has already proven himself reliable, so he's not a threat. Bringing Epiphania's family onto the side of the Imperial Court by marrying Andronicus to her is an excellent idea, assuming that of course, Epiphania or her father doesn't plant any poisonous seeds in his mind. Of course, that risk is minor if Michael makes it clear that he is in charge.
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    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Do not marry yourself, but let Andronicus marry the noblewoman.
    It is a perfect tradeoff. Andronicus would feel more in on the stuff going on, and it would also be a great honour to the Iagaris famility to be married into the Imperial family. Especially since they haven't known of your personal aspirations in that department. A brother of the Emperor is a major step up compared to the other suitors.
    And by not marrying yourself, you get a chance to get to know those with sincere intentions and of course the girls' personalities and backgrounds. As note this is a minefield and we need to step very carefully.
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  17. #47
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    I agree with the others, Andronicus proves surprisingly reliable for a brother of the emperor (he declared loyalty to you against his/your mother and Diogenes, and warned you about situation in the senate rather than plotting with them against you quietly). And Epiphania's family would be pleased to join the Imperial family, anyway. The emperor's brother is second to the emperor himself in the Imperial family.

  18. #48
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Ha! I should have inherited that byzantine throne with my cunning and my wisdom....
    Managing perceptions goes hand in hand with managing expectations - Masamune

    Pie is merely the power of the state intruding into the private lives of the working class. - Beirut

  19. #49

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    It's a tough decision, but Maria looks like the best choice. These Catholics and pagans are too alien and you're not sure you can trust Germany or the Cumans, either. Maria, on the other hand, is Orthodox, and too timid to pose a threat. Also, the Alans were important allies before they were subjugated by the Khazars, and may become so again, especially with the potential for war in the east. You send Helena and Issedo away politely. Maria, for her part, seems to be overjoyed that she was picked, and takes up residence in one of your guest suites until the marriage can take place. Still, you wish you could take advantage of the opportunity Epiphania offers. After some consideration, you talk to Andronicus and explain to him your need to secure good relations with the upper class. He quickly agrees.

    Andronicus proposes to Epiphania the next day. He told you later that she herself was a bit indecisive, but her father readily agreed to let his daughter marry him. He may not be an emperor like his brothers, but he's still a Ducas. He's not concerned about her hesitation, claiming that it's to be expected that she'd be a little taken aback by an offer from such an unexpected quarter. With the help of the eunuchs, you begin planning a dual wedding, suitable for an Emperor of Rome and the princess of Alania. Naturally, you begin spending more time with your chosen, and find her sweet-tempered and very quiet, using her words sparingly in private and almost never in public. Your youngest brother Constantine even puts in some appearances and helps now and then. He's become very reserved since the aborted wedding and seems to spend most of his time by himself these days. You worry about him, but you notice that Andronicus has taken an interest in cheering him up, so hopefully he'll pull out of it.

    Of course, the demands of governing never cease. Another month goes by, with occasional reports from Psellus. Things are not going as well as he'd hoped. While he's suppressed the violence to a certain extent, there is still too much, and he's so far had little success in Christianizing the barbarians (though he didn't expect it to happen overnight). He says that the most pressing problem is that Turcomen continue to cross over from Seljuk territory, and they have nowhere to go but to drive Greeks off their land. He begs that you ask the Sultan to stop the emigration from his end, perhaps sweetening the deal with a gift. Once that happens, he believes, then the plundering will stop and there will be a good chance for peace. Then real pacification and conversion can begin for those who have already crossed over. After showing this letter to the Caesar, he agrees with the goal, but not with the method. "Bribing the Sultan will probably not work. Threaten with military force. Our army is large and with the threat of war over his shoulder, he would surely begin to rein in his nomads as he should have been doing all along."

    Meanwhile, other disturbing reports have been coming in from Bulgaria. Banditry has been on the rise recently, with thugs collecting tolls from passersby and robbing tax collectors. One important tax shipment has gone missing completely. Even more worrying, Pecheneg raiders have begun slipping past the border-forts again and attacking villages. The Bulgarian theme, with many of its troops now serving in the Imperial army, has not been able to protect itself from this threat, though they've reported victory in a few minor skirmishes. Some accounts say that the highwaymen have been helping the Pechenegs by providing them hiding places after raids or when troops come by, while others say that groups of bandits have actually been seen protecting villages from attack. You speak to your available generals on the matter.

    Manuel requests to be sent to deal with the problem himself. "I would like to take 3,000 each of our mercenary spearmen, light infantry, and those native Bulgarian archers, supported by 1,000 Khazar medium lancers. With this army, along with those serving the theme, I'll ferret out the bandits piecemeal. Once they've been eliminated, the Pechenegs won't have anywhere to hide and will be much easier to stop. I might find that tax shipment, too."

    Bryennius would rather he was sent instead, with a more cavalry-heavy army. "Let me take 3,000 of the tagmata cavalry. With those men behind me, as well as a couple thousand each of Alan light cavalry, Bulgarian archers, and light infantry, and a handful of spearmen as backup, I'll have the maneuverability and strength to stop the Pechenegs as they come across the border. I'll let the thematic troops deal with the bandits."

    John Ducas has a different suggestion. "Recall Crispinus the Frank from Bari. He's not doing anything there, and I'm told that smaller-scale tactics-heavy conflicts are what he does best - just the sort of fighting that will be taking place here. As for troops, let him take his kinsmen, the knights - he'd know how to use them best - and I recommend sending out a force mainly made up of Imperial regulars, with Alan light cavalry to back them up. We can let him decide the particulars when he gets here."

    You face two decisions, one diplomatic and one strategic.

    A - The Sultan:
    1) Firmly request that he stop the Turcomen from migrating into Imperial territory, without including either a bribe or ultimatum. Your mother already asked him to and he didn't, but he might take a letter from you more seriously. It seems a bit unlikely to work, but you haven't got anything to lose.

    2) Send a bribe. Gold can work wonders in the world of diplomacy. You'd have to really scrape the bottom of your treasury to come up with one of useful size, though. Plus, although you've never heard of Alp Arslan reneging on a deal, there's always the risk that he'll decide to pocket it and then do what he wants anyway.

    3) Threaten to attack if he doesn't stop this nonsense. You're pretty sure his army is smaller than yours, so hopefully he'll comply. The risk, of course, is that he won't, forcing you to either back down or start very difficult and costly war.

    B - The situation in Bulgaria:
    1) Send Manuel. The forces he's requesting aren't critical, and you've come to value his military mind. Plus, he just might find those taxes. It sounds like his plan might take a while, though.

    2) Send Bryennius. He wants to bring most of your best cavalry unit, but his plan promises a faster stop to the raiding. You don't know much about Bryennius yet either; this would be a good test of his mettle.

    3) Send Crispinus. Ducas seems to think he'd do well, and if you follow your uncle's advice, he'd have a relatively tough and reliable army. You might prefer to keep those troops at home, though. You're not sure yet what strategy he'd take, but you can ask him to explain it before he leaves. You could always veto it.

    4) Go yourself. This relatively small-scale campaign would be a good way to try your hand at military matters. You'll be choosing what forces to take yourself. NOTE: If you choose to go yourself, the wedding will have to be postponed until you get back.
    "All philosophy lies in two words, sustain and abstain."
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  20. #50
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    ARGHHHH!!!! That Turkish situation is damn impossible.
    I know that Alp Arslan was an honourable man, so perhaps the gift will make him reign in the tribes, but at the same time they were notoriously independant and they did end up killing him.

    *Sigh*

    A2 and B3
    You need to be home to deal with the economy and the enentual results of the gift, be they good or bad. Meanwhile Crispinus will mak certain that the campaign in Bulgaria will be short. And Bari is hardly worth the effort at the moment.
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  21. #51
    (Insert innuendo here) Member Balloon Bomber Champion DemonArchangel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Send Mr. Crispinus.

    And for Arslan, maybe the situation could be solved instead by somehow getting one or more of the turkish nobles to attack Arslan, after all, they did value their independence.
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  22. #52
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    But you don't want to make a choice? Yeah, I felt much like it too, it is simply a lottery there, and a bad one. Pick either plague, kolera or ebola.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  23. #53
    Member Member Alexander the Pretty Good's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    A stinks. I don't like A.

    A1 - you can't afford a bribe, and threat of violence will just make the Sultan less happy with you. With Psellus still working, maybe you can get lucky - if not, you still have that problem, but not the problem of an angry Sultan and angry Turcomen. Plus, a bribe might insult the Sultan. And the Sultan won't be so keen on attacking you if it means going through Turcomen territory if the Turcomen aren't so "controllable." I don't know. That's why A sucks.

    B is easier to analyze, I think. I also think speed is necessary, to resolve the profit-damaging banditry and Pechenig incursions. You WILL lose money in the Turcoman strategy of asking nicely. So would a bribe. And I'm not convinced threats are good. So you need to stop losing money on two fronts. To do this, send Manuel. He will be more reliable than Bryennius, who also wants all your troops that you may need against the Turks. As a plus, those Bulgarian archers should be very effective in their homeland.

    B1.

    And there hasn't been too many easy choices, reading over this great thread.

  24. #54

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Kraxis, if you hate the choices, you can suggest a new one under the rules I just established since you posted first. If it's something complicated (such as trying to turn the Turkish nobility against Alp Arslan, like DemonArchangel suggested) then it'd probably require several more choices of its own, to determine how you're going to attempt it. But you're not entirely hemmed in to the ones I gave you.

    If it's just more information you want, then it's certainly reasonable to ask for more. I might or might not give it to you, but it's worth a shot. ;)
    "All philosophy lies in two words, sustain and abstain."
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  25. #55
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    A1. No need for violence straight away.

    B4. You´ll need some reputation as a commander to make your words and specially threats weight in the minds of others. I would suggest you take Crispinus with you though to have someone to back you up if you screw up.
    Managing perceptions goes hand in hand with managing expectations - Masamune

    Pie is merely the power of the state intruding into the private lives of the working class. - Beirut

  26. #56
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    In that case Vykke I propose a meeting with Arslan (and I can see the others are equally afraid of A), he is honourable and would likely meet you. Of course that will mean you can't go on campaign in Bulgaria.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  27. #57
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    A1 and B4
    The marriage is not very urgent and it would be good if you got some military skill yourself and it would raise the soldiers' view of you. Going to war with the Turks when they are not in a weakened position could be very risky as was demonstrated with Myriokephalon about a century later.
    www.thechap.net
    "We were not born into this world to be happy, but to do our duty." Bismarck
    "You can't be a successful Dictator and design women's underclothing. One or the other. Not both." The Right Hon. Bertram Wilberforce Wooster
    "Man, being reasonable, must get drunk; the best of life is but intoxication" - Lord Byron
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  28. #58

    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    Okay, since A1 won, other than Kraxis' suggestion, we'll run it like any other choice, but you can choose between sending the letter and setting up a personal meeting with Arslan.

    1) Send the letter asking him to stop. As said before, there's nothing to lose, and it doesn't remove you from the capital.

    2) Try to set up a meeting with him. If it works, you'll be able to conduct more sophistocated diplomacy in person, and if you manage to make a favorable impression it might help relations with the Seljuks a lot. The downside is that if he agrees it would remove you from Constantinople for several weeks, and you might end up unable to reach a solution anyway.
    "All philosophy lies in two words, sustain and abstain."
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  29. #59
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    2. If you want them well done, do them yourself. I wouldn't go into Turk territory for the meeting though, just out of precaution....
    Managing perceptions goes hand in hand with managing expectations - Masamune

    Pie is merely the power of the state intruding into the private lives of the working class. - Beirut

  30. #60
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Alternate History: Michael's Crucible

    2. Definitely. A meeting place on the border would be best (a barge in the middle of a river perhaps?) and you would be able to discuss matters of state, ruler to ruler.
    www.thechap.net
    "We were not born into this world to be happy, but to do our duty." Bismarck
    "You can't be a successful Dictator and design women's underclothing. One or the other. Not both." The Right Hon. Bertram Wilberforce Wooster
    "Man, being reasonable, must get drunk; the best of life is but intoxication" - Lord Byron
    "Where men are forbidden to honour a king they honour millionaires, athletes, or film-stars instead: even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison." - C. S. Lewis

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