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Thread: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

  1. #31
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    A so far but a minority of two wants the two dreadnoughts to stay with the Finns (could that have an impact on your voting Kage?)

    Ahem..My thoughts are only concerned to those forces that landed in Finnland and their safety...
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  2. #32
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by Franconicus
    Kraxis,
    how do you manage to motivate so many people to participate in your Interactive. Amazing! Congrat!!

    Please do not base your choices on Operation King Kurt, but be advised that I am keeping it in mind. We might get a chance to do it later.
    I think we have to have a strategy if we want to win. Just choosing the alternatives wont get us very far. The boundaries are too tough. So could you give us all likitations, so we can discuss a plan?
    I did not wish to keep you from formulating future plans, not at all. But all choices need to be taken in the immediate context aswell as a more broad future context.

    So formulating plans, and trying to keep them secret (good idea) but at the cost of intelligence and then blundering out might not be good for the near future.

    Mind you I am not picking goods and wrongs here as that is determined by the collective answers of both teams over time. And that might answer your question King Kurt. I always have a broad plan, where do I want to go? And try to stick to it. But any specifics I always leave up to my audience. And those details might very well lead to disaster, but at times I am forced to veer from the course, for instance Antiochus' Dilemma was one such case. Usually I have 'right' and 'wrong' options but they are of course gone here, all choices have benefits and penalties.

    To say it shortly, I make up each chapter as I go, each option's result being made up in advance. But there is a general guideline, in the case of Antiochus' Dilemma it was a major showdown with the Romans, but in that case the audience was a bit too intimidated.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  3. #33
    Nec Pluribus Impar Member SwordsMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    MAybe you should set up an actual command system. With a Grand Admiral, his HQ, several Admirals, and chosen ship captains....

    That'd push the level of immersion.
    Managing perceptions goes hand in hand with managing expectations - Masamune

    Pie is merely the power of the state intruding into the private lives of the working class. - Beirut

  4. #34
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Yes, but it would lead to a case of people arguing over seniority, 'should this person know this' ect ect... It would become a mess for me to control and would lead to people taking over themselves.

    I have been in this over at the .com where we had an RPG thread where each contributor was a medieval king/leader and the big boss was the Pope. Trust me, it had to be kept at a humerous level or else people would be killing each other. There was a snowball's chance in hell to be really serious. For instance I was the High Inquisitor of Poland and a hidden enemy of the Pope (in the political game, eventually I did attack militarily) and yet I launched a crusade to Edessa while my inquisition burned across eastern Europe. Meanwhile Russia and Byzantium kept invading and reinvading each other like there was no tomorrow. It was silly to be honest, fun but silly.
    Here I try to keep it as simple, yet as immersive and plausible as possible, and that is best done if we look at it from a singler person's view, at least each time (Fronconicus has shown that differing viewpoints might create interesting debates).

    The window for choices is closed... I need to post two chapters so in the meantime people can upset what I write if they come and change the selection of choices. So after this post and before the next chapter nothing can impact it.
    Last edited by Kraxis; 01-15-2006 at 15:30.
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  5. #35
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Chapter 2

    26th of February

    For just over a week you have been having especially the enlisted men in the very confined areas of the ships do serious physical workouts, with competions between the ships. Boxing, wrestling, running of various distances, and most importantly football matches. At first the crews weren't too keen on this, but by now they relish at the chances to beat each other at various sports. And initially there was little noise from the revolutionaries but as the workout began to gain popularity they began to become noisier and noisier. Trying to stirr the crews they have provoked fighting in town. To the casual observer it would seem that a full scale mutiny is on the verge of happening, but you have kept an eye on the men. Officers and NCOs have kept a clear record of who has been saying what and when, and it beomes clear that the crews themselves have not been particulary revolutionary, they have merely followed the best alternative to boredom. A small core of about 57 sailors have been identified as the worst rabblerousers.
    Another benefit of this program has been the physical part of the crews have become not only stronger and better (obviously) they are also getting healthier and more satisfied withtheir lousy jobs of shoveling coal or handling ammo.

    You also recalled Rheinland and Westfalen. Both the Finns and the crews of the two ships didn't like this, but there was little the ships were doing in Finland. And on the way back escorted by 6 torpedoboats they stumbled into a British convoy just north of the Danish island of Bornholm in the Baltic. The two heavy ships quickly sent the escorts to the bottom of the sea, then the torpedoboats helped in herding the merchants to German ports. An entire convoy captured, containing steel, coal, food and timber. A valuable haul.
    While the Admiralty was overjoyed, and you gained valuable influence with them, you were not. You had painstakingly made sure to keep the transfer secret from British Intelligence, but this chance encounter exposed the move. But at least the crews of the two ships got some needed training in gunnery and their moraly has soared from this 'success'.

    This was only part of your large scheme to keep the British in the dark of your ideas of winning the sea, if only temporarily. The wireless messages have been kept to a minimum, and only containing unimportant reports and requests. The Admiralty while not directly against this excercise haven't been to keen on keeping this up, and you know at some point they will start to blabber out your plans once more. You are certain that the wireless is the center of British Intelligence.
    Also, while you had the chance to scout out the North Sea with zeppelieners, you chose not to, to keep everything secret. As well as keepign the secondary forces in their limited service, but both forces are kept ready to deploy, especially the airships.

    Intelligence has indicated that the British battlecruisers left Rosyth the 18th, and the next day spies in Scapa Flow informed that heavy gunfire was heard from the large harbour. Presumably the British were training gunnery. You are not certain where the battlecruisers have gone, though traffic in Spaca has increased. Meanwhile you got a report on the number of enemy heavy units in Scapa Flow from the 18th, and other intelligence sources indicated that three or four heavy units are currently in Portsmouth. The numbes doesn't add up, even if you consider the Australia on convoy duty there is still a lack of three to six dreadnought (the reports are shaky on the precise numbers in Scapa). Intelligence has indicated that attention has been shown to the Med., but you are not sure of that as there is hardly any need for that. They HAVE to be here in the north, but where...
    As you think on it, it might be a good to find them. If they are nearby you can perhaps catch a limited force alone, and if they are farther away you might disrupt some shipping with raiders.
    But how should it be done? You could attempt to scout the near sea with small forces of ships, but should those be light cruisers, torpedoboats or perhaps even smaller vessels such as minesweepers and attackboats? Scout at night ot day? Of course the zeppeliners are a choice as well.

    You also think on what to do specifically with the revolutionaries. Imprisonment? Could be dangerous as the others crewmembers might get 'that' feeling back, but the Admiralty would like that a lot. A sneaky transfer to the secondary forces? Might just cause a revolution on those ships. Send them to the front? But it isn't likely that the Army will recieve them freely, you might have to pull some influence with the Admiralty.

    Also, now that the physical workout has done it's primary job, you don't know if it should be continued. Yes there is still much to be gained from it, but you would also like to trained the crews at sea. Especially the crews of Hindenburg wants to get to grips with the British, even if only in training, they are mainly the survivors of Lützow lost after Jutland due to the damage she had suffered. And both Baden and Bayern are fairly untested in larger manaeuvers, though trained well enough.

    So what will it be?


    1) The search for the lost British units.
    A) Send out ships to find them, you get to pick the composition (light cruisers and torpedoboats, small vessels for a shortrange search, heavy units to engage them... ect ect..)
    B) Use the zeppeliners. Define the searcharea for them, it can be all from 'everywhere' to a single zeppeliner just looking off your harbours (remember this is not an indication that you chose badly before just that the zeppeliners are on standby ready to do their job whenever you wish it, expect them to pop up as a choice for practically every chapter).
    C) Do not look at all. They should present themselves in time, also such active searches might expose something bad.

    2) The revolutionaries.
    A) Lock 'em up! This will likely generate influence from not only the Admiralty but also the Emperor himself. This can be very good indeed. But the regualr crews might not take to this very kindly.
    B) Ship them off to the secondary forces. This way they will be gone, yet not affect the regular crews with their 'martyrdom'. But they mgiht cause revolutionary thinking in the secondary units, which are even worse off with boredom.
    C) Use what little influence you have with the Admiralty to send them to the Western Front. That should make short work of them. They will never return.

    3) General maneuvers.
    A) Continue the physical program. Will lead to faster reloading and less tiring in battle, but little else. But you also risk nothing.
    B) Set out to train maneuvers and gunnery in the close waters. Small risk of running into a few mines but also makes the fleet ready to set after any enemy force nearby.
    C) You own choice, but remember nothing too complicated as you are still fairly new to the fleet as Admiral. They need to get to know you. Also each choice that is different from what ahs previously been suggested will be considered another seperate choice, effectively creating a D, an E and F and so on. You need to chose among youselves if you go with this. If all have one and doesn't agree it is up to the arguments.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  6. #36
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1) The search for the lost British units.B) Use the zeppeliners. Send zeppelins out to look for them but stay away from British fighters if possible.

    2) The revolutionaries.C) I think the men can talk less and do more in the trenches of the Western front.

    3) General maneuvers.B) Set out to train maneuvers and gunnery in the close waters.Now that the basic health is getting better we can start the training the crews in their posts.
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  7. #37
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1B... Where should they search?
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  8. #38
    Thread killer Member Rodion Romanovich's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1 - B, use the zeppeliners to search everywhere it's possible without risking losses for them. If we find them early and close to the North sea coast we can engage them right away with a force chosen to handle exactly the opposition the zeppeliners spotted (and some more to be safe).

    2 - how big revolutionaries are they, what have they done exactly? And how many are they?

    3 - B, risks of mines are small and we're expecting some incoming enemies, aren't we?
    Under construction...

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  9. #39
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1. B: Zeppelins. Search wherever it is deemed relatively safe from British fighters. No need to sacrifice our valuable Zeppelins yet. If we find the missing ships isolated we might be able to deal a crippling blow on the other forum's morale. If not, then it's valuable intelligence with few risks.

    2. C: Keep'em Quiet On the Western Front. Lock them up is martyrdom, the best of all rabblerousing techniques seen throughout history. Send them to secondary forces basically allow them to sow more trouble than they should. Get them on the Western Front might help fill the trenches with their corpses and feed the rats. Let them die heroes of the Old Second Reich and nothing more.

    3. B: Maneuvers and gunnery. The troops are in good enough condition now; they're not in the gyms, they're in the war. This, as you've stated, also keeps us ready to use our fleets in short notice: the missing ships could be anywhere doing anything, especially harmful things to our plans. Why, it seems the soldiers would now fancy a little gunnery that reminds them of glorious memories past, especially the Jutland veterans, and a small advantage in this matter might help in a pitched naval battle.

    Basically I agree with Kagemusha in all things.

  10. #40
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by LegioXXXUlpiaVictrix
    2 - how big revolutionaries are they, what have they done exactly? And how many are they?
    There are 57 of them (as I wrote earlier). It is uncertain what they have done as the rest of the enlisted men keep quiet out of loyalty, but their actions durings the last week has shown them to be less than loyal and rather destructive for morale. It is believed that they are communists and willing to let Germany lose the war, which is treason (in an autocratic state a lot of things are treason).
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  11. #41
    Evil Sadist Member discovery1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1) Send out the zeps. Scout away from fighter bases.

    2) Exile to the Western Front is good. defered shawow death sentence.

    3)Manuvers. We need the practice.


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  12. #42
    Vermonter and Seperatist Member Uesugi Kenshin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1)B, send them out, but make sure they avoid fighter bases and instruct them to use the weather to their advantage when possible.

    2) I think I'd go with C, they get their punishment and the oppurtunity to serve the reich.

    3)B, practice for the crews will help them hone their gunnery skills, we can't afford to miss. Also reloading in simulated battle should help improve their reloading time as well and the fleet needs to be ready to pounce on the Brits.
    "A man's dying is more his survivor's affair than his own."
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  13. #43
    Caged for your safety Member RabidGibbon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1: B Use the Zeppliners, study the norway to scotland route - I suspect the missing battleships are covering that route.

    2: B We need to save our admiltary influence for when it is important. If they want to cause revolution with the lesser forces then so be it. But perhaps their influence will be diluted when they are transferred.

    3: A Continue the physical training exercise

  14. #44
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 2

    [QUOTE=Kraxis][B]1) The search for the lost British units.
    B) Use the zeppeliners, study the norway to scotland route C) Do not look at all. They should present themselves in time, also such active searches might expose something bad.

    2) The revolutionaries.
    B) Ship them off to the secondary forces. Even though I do not like that. We should send them somewhere else, to the mine sweeper for example. This are very small boats, so they cannot do much damage and the sweepers have casualties too. Maybe we can send them to small units and arrest them after a while. So nobody would notice it.

    3) General maneuvers.
    B) Set out to train maneuvers and gunnery in the close waters.

  15. #45
    Thread killer Member Rodion Romanovich's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by Kraxis
    There are 57 of them (as I wrote earlier). It is uncertain what they have done as the rest of the enlisted men keep quiet out of loyalty, but their actions durings the last week has shown them to be less than loyal and rather destructive for morale. It is believed that they are communists and willing to let Germany lose the war, which is treason (in an autocratic state a lot of things are treason).
    Ok, then they're probably too big revolutionaries to dare using on our main forces. The other enlisted men seem difficult to judge - they may or may not be as much revolutionaries, so splitting the revolutionaries up among the others probably isn't enough to avoid mutiny or similar. I think I agree with Franconius about sending them to rather unimportant, small ships if possible, where they can't cause too much harm. My reason for wanting more detailed info on their actions was simply that if they're too many it would weaken the crews if they were moved away from the fleet, so if they could be redistributed among the crews in a way that would prevent mutiny and other critical things from happening at the moment of action, we wouldn't lose men. Both men and ships seem to be in shortage, after all. But 57 is a fairly low number. I still vote for keeping them in smaller ships though, where they can't cause as much harm should they choose mutiny. If they're on a very slow, very small ship, they'd need to be fools to attempt mutiny among our other ships.
    Under construction...

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  16. #46
    " Hammer of the East" Member King Kurt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    The battleships and possibly the battlecruisers must be in a port big enough for them. That means Portsmouth, London (but unlikely), Harwich or Rosyth - so our Zepplins should look there first. They should attempt to arrive over the port at dawn to give the best light while minimising the possibility of interception by fighters. If that comes up negative, then general sweeps of the North Sea is important. I think out recent sucess against the convoy may have flushed them out so we should start our search in that area. By the way, well done Kraxis on this part - naval wargaming is always characterised by initial frantic searching as information is power, so we should concentrate on finding this force.
    The revolutionaries? - I was tempted to suggest put all on a destroyer and put it on long patrols, but off to the Western front is the best idea. The unrest will undoubtedly return, but our activities over the next few months will slow that process down.
    We must start training at sea to improve our efficency. Also, it will provide a cover for the launch of our operation.

    Finally - an excellent source of info on the German navy http://www.german-navy.de/hochseeflotte/index.html It provides info on all the ships as well as some historical background.
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  17. #47
    Senior Member Senior Member English assassin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    IMHO:

    Revolutionaries and crews don't mix. Especially bored crews in second line ships. if treatuing them harshly may lead to more trouble, leaving them around to work their mischief and THEN treating them harshly will only be worse. Since it seems we can't just shoot them, we need them out of the way, either locked up or at the western front. I don't think the navy should ask the army to do its laundry for it, its just not right, so lock em up.

    Poor morale is down to boredom. Therefore I think some medium range destroyer sweeps into the southern north sea (edit: oops, I mean German Ocean ;-)) might improve morale, seamanship, and, who knows, tell us where the british ships are not. Orders should be not to engage a superior force, but to feel free to mix it if they encounter a destroyer flotilla, minelayers, or the like. I don't think the force should be supported by any heavier units as this will lead to a temptation for "mission creep" if the enemy are encountered, and the next thing we will know we will have Beattie on our necks with half a dozen battlecruiers, although stationing a few U boats on the destroyers line of withdrawal could do no harm. (NB need to make sure the U boat captains brush up on the boat recognition, possibly our boats should display some obvious recognition signal when they pass through U boat patrol area.)

    I'm not sure how vulnerable the zeppelins are to mechanical failure (fairly, I suspect) or to enemy action (very, I imagine) but my guess is they will degrade with use quickly. IMHO they would be better saved for when their information could be of real tactical use, either by scouting in front of the fleet or by appearing where the fleet is not as a deception.

    Using them now will wind up telling us, at best, where the British used to be when the time comes to put to sea.

    And manouevres for the remainder of the fleet.
    "The only thing I've gotten out of this thread is that Navaros is claiming that Satan gave Man meat. Awesome." Gorebag

  18. #48
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Short info (for EA in particular):

    Beatty has resigned completely. The new battlecruiser commander is Vice-Admiral Pakenham (a divisional commander subordinate of Beatty when he held that command).
    You have no control over the U-boats at all. They have a specific command of their own, in fact you have only got control of the High Seas Fleet, meaning the minelayers/sweepers are not even under your control, though they will of course follow your directions if you request it, but nominally they are seperate.

    The zeppeliners are pretty reliable, but very easy to shoot down (hydrogen). They don't like strong winds of course, but the weather is a stable slow western wind with an almost full overcast, or at least that is what can be determined.
    As long as they do not meet fighters or get too close to enemy ships they should be fairly safe, and they have a very long range, making them alble to fly for long periods of time. But their numbers are fairly limited (no set number but if losses are too heavy the Admiralty might take them away).

    Results so far:

    1) B:8 (with a majority wanting a wide search clear of enemy airforces, meaning land), A:1 (King Kurt I suppose that is what you meant)

    2) C:5, B:3, A:1 (this can be turned if you are quick)

    3) B:8, A:1

    Will soon update.
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  19. #49
    Senior Member Senior Member English assassin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Doh, sorry, maybe I should actually read all the posts...
    "The only thing I've gotten out of this thread is that Navaros is claiming that Satan gave Man meat. Awesome." Gorebag

  20. #50
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by King Kurt
    The battleships and possibly the battlecruisers must be in a port big enough for them. That means Portsmouth, London (but unlikely), Harwich or Rosyth - so our Zepplins should look there first. They should attempt to arrive over the port at dawn to give the best light while minimising the possibility of interception by fighters.
    Couldn't we send some of our fighters or bombers over the Channel instead of the Zeps?

  21. #51
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by Franconicus
    Couldn't we send some of our fighters or bombers over the Channel instead of the Zeps?
    A possibility, but that fact remains that the airforces are the territory of the Army. And given how hard pressed they are in the air currently, the chance of them actually being willing to 'waste' time and fuel looking for something that might not even be there is very small. Later perhaps there is a chance to use influence (if it has been gained) to get planes.

    You have a small number of floatplanes, but their range is lousy and were developed to be used in conjunction with a tender.
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  22. #52
    Thread killer Member Rodion Romanovich's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by English assassin
    IMHO:

    Revolutionaries and crews don't mix. Especially bored crews in second line ships. if treatuing them harshly may lead to more trouble, leaving them around to work their mischief and THEN treating them harshly will only be worse. Since it seems we can't just shoot them, we need them out of the way, either locked up or at the western front. I don't think the navy should ask the army to do its laundry for it, its just not right, so lock em up.
    There are two ways of dealing with revolutionaries, one is dilution, one is isolation. Dilution seems bad because the rest are already bored and a little rebellious as it is. However isolation is possible, and isolation can be achieved without actually killing them, by simply putting them on some small, unimportant ship, with a few very loyal people keeping an eye on them. It's better if they do something big before we imprison them, than imprisoning them for almost nothing, that'd only reduce morale of the rest of the crew, making them worried that they maybe said something or did something that could make them suspect of being revolutionaries too. I vote option D, keep them on an unimportant ship and isolate them as far as possible, but have a few crewmen, known to be very loyal, among them in order to keep an eye on them.
    Under construction...

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  23. #53
    " Hammer of the East" Member King Kurt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Quote Originally Posted by Kraxis
    Results so far:

    1) B:8 (with a majority wanting a wide search clear of enemy airforces, meaning land), A:1 (King Kurt I suppose that is what you meant)

    .
    No - I am a Zepplin man - but I tried to be a bit more specific over what I wanted them to do. We must look at the ports - I am sure that can be done without putting them at too great a risk. I would also suggest that ships do not pose much threat to the Zeps. My grandfather served on HMS Dragon - a light cruiser - from about 1920 to 1925 and I remember him saying their only AA weapon was a Lewis gun in the Crow's nest! I do think we should show some agression and a little less caution - Beaty going is interesting - he had some of the Nelson touch - but was also rather likely to dive in where others would be more cautious - so the new man will be less predictable.
    "Some people say MTW is a matter of life or death - but you have to realise it is more important than that"
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  24. #54
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Well by this time, in real history, Beatty was the Grand Fleet commander, the new one is your esteemed opponents.

    The ships were perhaps not too great a danger unless the zeps got close but several did get shot down as most of the heavier units beginning to carry a few big AA guns, and as you know even a fiarly close burst would be enough to risk the zep. In fact I think one of the BBs did bag a zep.
    Last edited by Kraxis; 01-17-2006 at 23:15.
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  25. #55
    Member Member Flavius Clemens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    As per the majority views - use the Zeppelinsfor a widespread search, and go for fleet maneouvers and gunnery training.
    The tougher question is the punishment for the revolutionaries. I don't particularly want to use up our influence with the powers that be, but it's probably a safer option to get them transfered to the Western Front - and at least that way they get to do their bit for the Fatherland. With luck we'll soon be restoring our influence with some more British scalps.
    Non me rogare, loquare non lingua latinus

  26. #56
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    After thinking it over for a while you come to a few conclusions about what to do, but before you do anything else you send a very proper request to the Admiralty to take the revolutionaries off your hand. They might be a risk to future operations you argue, and then hope that they will no longer be your problem. In case they might not be willing to do this for you you plan on transferring them to the minesweepers.

    After you have sent off the message you call in Captain Fuchs and order him to send a further message to the zeppeliner bases that they are to go on full patrol as soon as possible, covering the North Sea from Heligoland to western Norway and as far west as to cover Dover as well.

    Then you begin to formulate the orders for the coming trials and training.
    Within the hour quartermasters begin to load on food, water and other supplies and even before you leave port there are requests for restocking of munitions. The trains should arrive in a few days.
    For hours the dockworkers and crews labour with loading the ships with corditebags, heavy shells and plenty of light ammunition for the lighters guns. You expect the fleet will be ready to sail the following morning.

    Already a few hours after launch you get the first report from the southernmost zeppeliner, V91. It has sighted four heavy and three medium units 35 nautical miles northwest of Heligoland. The captain is certain that it has not been spotted due to the heavy cloudcover, and even offers to bomb the ships. You order it to keep on station for the time being, and await replacement forthe watch.
    In the morning you get another report, this time from zeppeliner Z22, covering the deep expanse northwest of Jutland. It has spotted a convoy heading towards what it expects to be Hartlepool, that is heavily escorted by three heavy units and a number of smaller units. It will try to get closer but the strong winds might expose the airship, so the captain can't say for sure that it is unseen.
    This is followed by the answer from the Admiralty:
    "Vice-Admiral
    We find it interesting that you wish to get rid of the 'unwanted' crewmen by sending them to the front. We expected that you would have deal with treason in a more stately and military fashion, trial and imprisonment/execution.
    But we find that your choice might have some merit, so we have contacted the Army and they are willing to recieve the rabblerousers. Hopefully this will be the end of the issue."
    You read between the lines that the Admiralty was very annoyed with this request but that it couldn't just brush you off. You get the feeling that you will not be able to do much until you have won some influence again.

    Just as you sail out with all heavy ships, but Rheinland and Westfalen, which both needed some rest after their prolonged stay at sea, you recieve yet another report, this time from V43, stating that three heavy units have just entered the port of Dover. Because of the proximity to the English coast the captain says that he is forced to retreat as both fighters and AA guns dot the area. He is afraid that he has been spotted and won't be returning the next days at the very least.
    Z22 then reports in again. It has managed to get closer to the convoy. It seems to be sailing at a mere 4 knots. Observation has convinced the captain that the three heavy units are two battleships and a battlecruiser, perhaps of the Invincible or Indefatigable class. But he dares not get closer, and instead has opted to return to refuel.
    As the fleet exit port you plot in the positions of the enemy forces. It seems they are within range of each other to reinforce at least the force near Heligoland but not too soon. This is a great opportunity.

    Blasting ahead to the eastern gap between Heligoland and Jutland, you begin to formulate plans with Vice-Admiral Bodicker of the battlecruisers. You quickly end up with a couple of plans and variations of them.
    First plan, made by Bodicker, is a bold and speedy attack on the convoy with the battlecruisers and light cruisers to deal with destroyers and merchants. They should be stronger than the British force alone. Meanwhile the battleships would position themselves between the forward force and crush them as they raced to intercept the retreating battlecruisers (would have to assume the British would launch their own battlecruisers and that you would expect that and run for home. Risky if the British are aware where your are.
    The second, of your own planning is an attack on the forward force, of which there are a couple of variations:
    The first is a slow deliberate attack by the entire fleet, no fancy stuff, but it is unlikely that the light forces or minelayers will be affected at all, and the large force could get a bit problematic to maneuver around. And of course larger numbers means bigger cahnce of something going wrong (mines, grounding, collision ect).
    The second is a sneaky attack by three of the best battlecruisers from the north intent on destroying minelayers and light units, then they are supposed to be 'surprised' by the strong enemy force and flee northeast into the arms of the strongest nine battlships and the remaining two battlecruisers. The others would be put in reserve further to the southeast. Tomorrow morning would be a good choice for this as it would make the enemy gunnery harder, yours easier and the light would also shroud the battlefleet from longe range spotting.
    Hopefully these two actions will send the other two groups to the rescue, or perhaps the British battlecruisers. But even if it is not then you will still have gotten rid of four heavy units for little cost to yourself.
    Of course you also consider not engaging at all and just follow on with your plans of maneuvers and gunnery.

    You also consider what to do with the zeppeliners.
    You could let the covering zeppeliner try and bomb the British forward force and actively scout the sea towards Scapa Flow.
    You could also create a screen of airships halfway across the North Sea, while keeping taps on the forward force.
    Lastly you can let them continue as they are now (follow the forward force and the convoy at range).

    What will it be?


    1) A: Attack the convoy with the battlecruisers and ambush the forward force.
    B: Plow ahead with the entire force and overwhelm the forward force.
    C: Be sneaky by luring the forward force away to it's destruction.
    D: Drop any thought of attacks and carry out the training south of Heligoland.

    2) A: Let the zeppeliners be more active.
    B: Create a screen across the North Sea.
    C: Be more reserved with their use.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  27. #57

    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1) A

    It seems like the best choice to me. :)

    2) B
    Friendship, Fun & Honour!

    "The Prussian army always attacks."
    -Frederick the Great

  28. #58
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Ok.We have to remember we are dealing with sneaky bunch of people here. Option 1) D.Lets practice first and then start doing our fancy manouvers.
    Option 2)A.Knowledge is power.But dont let them be too active.We dont want to get them killed.
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  29. #59
    Member Member Flavius Clemens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    1 C. This seems to me to have the best chance of surprise. After the accidental sucess by Rheinland and Westfalen the British may be assuming we're starting a programme of convoy raids and deliberately setting out this convoy as bait. Also from the Zep reports there is more chance the convoy has spotted its shadower. So if they are expecting an attack on the convoy better to go for the forward force instead. As we haven't had time for practice manoevers, throwing all the fleet in at once might end up in chaos. Plan C isn't too complicated and keeps our ships in more manageable divisions.

    2 C. No bombing of the forward force, it would let them know we know they're there and loose the benefit of surprise, but do need to keep an eye on the targets in case the RN turns out to have something up its sleeve that we haven't thought of.
    Non me rogare, loquare non lingua latinus

  30. #60
    Member Member Flavius Clemens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Interactive History V: The Duel of the Sea

    Though it now occurs to me that given our suspicions that the British are reading our radio signals, the reconnaissance reports from the Zeppelins might already have been picked up, in which case we don't quite have the element of surprise we might have hoped for... Hmm...
    Non me rogare, loquare non lingua latinus

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