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Thread: Feedback wanted!

  1. #1
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Feedback wanted!

    Greetings people!
    This thread is for your feedback.
    Want me to incorporate your personal ideas into
    the next release? Well, I can not promise I'll do,
    but I can promise I'll carefully consider every opinion.

    Moreover, you are free to decide on what faction,
    that is Japanese (Akagi/Zensen), Chinese (Zhuanshi/Yuwan),
    Mongolian(Karazai), Korean(Choson),Indian(Krishnapur),
    Demons(Yomi),Blue Lotus Sect(Monks),will be presented
    next on the updates page.

    Go ahead!

    P.S.: Anyone willing and able to help with some very specific tasks?
    Rinsui

  2. #2
    Member Member Old Nick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I've only one suggestion and I don't know how hard it would be to implement:
    In the mod End of Days 2, the cannons from BL have extra sounds and it's a vast improvement over the original catapult sounds, so those would be nice.

    Anyone willing and able to help with some very specific tasks?
    What would they be ?

    btw.

    I would like to see either Yomi,Krishnapur or
    Monks next, but I like all BL-Factions so it does not really matter.

    Anyway, great work so far, keep it up.
    Last edited by Old Nick; 05-16-2008 at 17:37.

  3. #3
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Ok. I never changed sounds so far (except for the music), but if others can do it, I can do it, too.
    The specific tasks I would like to have done... I'll tell you tomorrow!
    The Japanese will be finished tomorrow. Since the Yomi are extra-complicated, I guess I'll do the Krishnapuri next.
    Rinsui

  4. #4
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Well, I actually added my own Asian-style music to my version. I will send it to you later if you want, along with some info, just to see if it fits or not.

    Also, right now it seems like a lot has improved. The mod is starting to look alot nicer. As a modder, I am totally baffled as to how you managed to achieve a single soldier unit. Could you explain that quickly for me? I'm just dying to know. :D

  5. #5
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Hi Ticu,
    thanks for your mail, I wrote back.
    Rinsui

  6. #6
    Arcane Alcholic Member Drunk-Monk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I've never played Blue Lotus before but it looks very intresting, I have some suggestion for this mod though, do you think that you could include the seconday hp feature which allows you to have balanced auto resolve. Also could you eventaully modfolder this mod as it would mean that more people would try it. Also I reccomed you make a post in the TWcenter once you have finshed the patch, so more people can hear about your great work.

    Regards, Drunk-Monk

  7. #7
    Speaker of Truth Senior Member Moros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    The secondary HP system might be a good Idea to balance HA's in autocalc. This will also help making the elephant units not to strong in autocalc.

  8. #8
    Beauty hunter Senior Member Raz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    2HP's fail during battles though. Try having heavy cavalry charge an infantry unit with 2HP and the cavalry will be annihilated, while try again with the same units but remove the second HP and the cavalry will kill heaps more on the initial charge and thus turn the battle in the cav's favour.

    Wat I'm trying to say: 2 HP = Diluted charge power.
    Quote Originally Posted by drone
    I imagine an open-source project to recreate [Medieval: Total War] would be faced with an army of high-valour lawyers.

    Live your life out on Earth; I'm going to join the Sun.

  9. #9
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Unless, I'm wrong, I think they mean the secondary hp system, which isn't used on the battlemap, but only has an affect on the autocalc.

  10. #10
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Rinsui

  11. #11
    Member Member Old Nick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Nice updates !

    What about the specific tasks ?Done them yourselves already ?

  12. #12
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Ah. Specific tasks that have to be done in chronological order:

    Current:
    *Integrate the rest of the units (models, stats, 2D art, animations): my task
    *Integrate the new music: Ticu's + my task, done!
    *Fix the missing/non-functional custom battlemaps: Ticus task. Done!
    *Fix the sounds for the Krishnapuri and Zhuanshi heavy cannons: done!

    Near future (has to be done later due to internal dependencies):
    *Integrate the new building roster
    *Custom battle unit balancing: hiring as many people as possible!

    Farther future:
    *New rebel pools for each province
    *New mercenary pools for each province
    *Stratmap armies and cities re-distrubution (number, strength, buildings etc.)
    *Stratmap balancing
    *Scripting:Tentative. I am not too happy about how scripts work.
    Last edited by Rinsui; 05-31-2008 at 14:53.
    Rinsui

  13. #13
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    So. Krishnapuri are finished.
    What to do next?
    Orders, please ^.^/

    Edit: Next is the Karazai Khanate.
    Last edited by Rinsui; 05-31-2008 at 14:54.
    Rinsui

  14. #14
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I'm glad you included the old 'shiva' unit into the Krishnapur army. I've been messing around with the old beta for a while, and it feels far more appropriate for that unit not to be a Yomi. You might include the Vanara as well, perhaps as a buildable unit requiring a certain level of the Krishnapuri temple. It's another unit that seemed strange as a mercenary.
    The fishmen are demonic enough that they could be recruited by the Yomi. It could be a change of pace for the Yomi, if when they finally get to territories with ports they could start recruiting the fishmen.
    You could update some of the animations. The Battles of Asia mod has two Katana skeletons/animations which you might seek to use, they look great modded into the Akagi and Zensen. Also the two handed spear and two handed cavalry lancer skeletons that are floating around in various mods are also good.
    Lastly, if you can figure it out, adding some appropriate sounds to the firelances and thunderbombers. I've managed to add rocket sounds to the firelances, but couldn't get impact sounds to work. Dunno if there's an issue with the old programming or just my modding novice-ness, but if you can do it, it'd be cool.
    Keep up the good work, I look forward to seeing more of your fixes and improvements.

  15. #15
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    The Krishnapur are looking great, though there might be a few issue's that I will PM you about. I honestly think that the Shivas should remain with the Yomi. They are demons after all, and it would probably be better to keep all cultural demons on one side and the somewhat more realistic units on the other - the way it was in the first place.

    Also Kitagata, I did not know about the 2-weapon animations. We should check those out. Another animation set I think would be interesting is the 2-handed sword. It would look alot better on the mighty swordsmen and the no-dachi Samurai. As far as I know, the Ashigaru used 2-handed spears, so that is definately something to look into.

    Thank you so much for the info.

  16. #16
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Greetings Ticu,
    I hope you don't mind If I make the reply to your PM public; it may inspire discussion. And give people an impression of what we are working on.

    First of all: yes, your maps are right what I needed. And the panorama pictures prove a certain love for details that surely fits my taste! I just finished integrating them into the newest patch; as always, all you have to do is copy-past the data folder. You will realize I played around a little with the names; for example, to evade repetitiveness, one of "Flatlands" and "Grassy Flatlands" was changed into "Anvil of the Gods". Those two maps are nearly identical anyway.

    Next to answer your questions:
    Yes, the animations of the 1-man (woman) units are not finished. For now, I was happy to manage 1-man units at all ^^/. The killing three men with one swing will stay, and the launching will, too. The point is that those units are really, really special. Their appearance will (possibly) be scripted, so they are really unique (non-recruitable). If one swing would kill just one enemy, they would need half an hour to finish off a unit of ashigaru spearmen no matter how high their stats are. And you are right, unit radius and the like will have to be adjusted.

    If you have a 2-handed animation that does not look like holding an axe, I will happily include it for the Akagi Duelists. The dagger animation is just a little better than the original 2-handed one. Please try to dig it up, it will certainly look even better. The Zensen get the Kamikaze instead of the mighty swordsmen. Both units are similar in fighting power, but the Kamikaze are a little faster and harder to control (and a bit better armoured, and... no need for details here!). At a certain point I realized that more units doesn't make a game any better. It just makes it more complicated to manage, and lo! BLTW is about fun, not about manymany. Basically, both the Kamikaze and the Akagi Duelists are the unique top-class units of their respective factions. (Apart from the Heroes).

    Of course the Krishnapur Scouts and the Dalit Scouts are clones. The Krishnapur Scouts will not appear in the final game. I just left them in for now to have a reference unit for comparison. Basically all yellow-background units will ultimately disappear (the patch I just sent you already did that for the Krishnapuri).

    No, your comments are not boring me. They are very, very helpful (see the animation stuff above - I had no idea those exist!). Ultimately, I have no intention to succumb to all the wishes and critique people confront me with; some are simply incompatible (see the two posts above), and I invested by far too much time in this to hand over the final stake in decision-making. However, there is things where I have to admit the work of others is simply superior to my own - your splash screen is one example.

    There will be some few totally new units - the dragon warriors of the monk are one example. Their .cas and animations file are finished, but give me some time; integrating a simple unit is done in about 20 minutes. The holy Gor-haw modifications (skin, .cas, description, riders) took me about 6 hours. Yes, the model is not the original one, haha! (Though I fear few will notice).

    Plan for the future...
    1. New Duelist animations
    2. I never expected new custom battles could be done that fast. Ah.There is another special task I could use some help with. When you use the rebel faction in custom battles, you will realize they have white flags and a roman interface. I guess it has something to do with a faulty culture tag somewhere, but until now I was unable to find out where...

    @Kitagata: Vanara will be in, first as rebels, and perhaps (much later) as part of another faction not in the original game. If you could provide me with the firelance rocked sounds or those animation, please go ahead! I'll happily make use of them. The whole culture of the Krishnapuri will be centered around the jealous and fierce Goddess Kali (no matter what final fantasy makes you believe - Shiva is a man, after all? ^^/). Why not have her display some of her wrath on the battlefield?
    Last edited by Rinsui; 05-31-2008 at 23:21.
    Rinsui

  17. #17
    Arcane Alcholic Member Drunk-Monk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Could you use the mod-switch feature this would be very useful and attract more people to play the mod.

    Well done on reviving this intriguing mod.

  18. #18
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I guess this is possible for the final product, yes. I just read it up, and it doesn't seem awfully complicated to implement.
    Rinsui

  19. #19
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I suppose we could continue the conversation in here.

    Alright first of all, I would suggest keeping all attack attributes of the 1-soldier units, except for the launching attribute. That way, they stay just as powerful as before, and they appear more martial artsy (for lack of a better term) than superhuman.

    Another similar thing could be done for the jiang sheng and hong shue fei. YOu may have heard of the attack speed attribute. To make them appear mroe skilled than macho, perhaps we could simply lower the attack speed all the way down, so that they attack every second rather than waiting a while after each attack. I've tried doing that before. It looks pretty good in game.

    I will try to dig upsome of the animations I have. I believe I have a 2-handed sword and 2-handed spear set. I will play around with those. Try acquiring the 2-sword animation set that kitagata was talking about.

    And about the rebel ui. That was kept that way because the players were never meant to play as the rebels. I don't see why we would need to change it.

    Cheers! And great job on the Krishnapur faction!

  20. #20
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I'd be happy to send along some animations and rocket/cannon/gun sound effects. How should I do it? I'm new to the forums, is there a way I can pass them along here? Or could I get someone's email?

  21. #21
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Thank you so much, Kitagata.
    I would recommend storing all the sounds onto a zip file and uploading them either on filefront.
    http://www.filefront.com/
    Zshare
    http://www.zshare.net/
    or some other file host.

    Post your link when you've done that.

    Thanks again!

  22. #22
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Just uploaded to filefront. Hope it works!

    http://files.filefront.com/BL+animat.../fileinfo.html

    Hey, I don't suppose you guys would release the custom music you put together for forum listening would you? I'd like to see what direction you're taking the asian/demon ambiance.

  23. #23
    Member Member Ticu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Well, I suppose it wouldnt hurt. It's only music after all. :P

    http://files.filefront.com/blmusicne.../fileinfo.html

    A lot of the previous music was kept, though a few new pieces were added. It's some of the best asian freeware stuff online as far as I know.

    The animations you sent were totally amazing! I am sure we will have use for most of them. I believe many Asian troop types used 2-handed spears. The katana animations will go well with the Samurai, and perhaps some of the other units. I'm not sure if the horizontal bow animation could work nicely for some units. I don't think the musket animations will be used, but perhaps they would work for the fire lances.

    The sounds you sent seem to be of a much better quality than the cannon animation currently included in BL, and I'm sure we could use it.
    Last edited by Ticu; 06-02-2008 at 03:28.

  24. #24
    The Orthodox Scot Member Zenith Darksea's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Now I am not a person who enjoys fantasy games. I usually stick rigidly to historical (or pseudo-historical, as in the case of RTW) settings, not for one moment considering fantasy.

    However, the first time I played Blue Lotus I was absolutely captivated by it. It was just so original, so much fun to play, so interesting. I thought that it was an incredible shame when the original team gave up working on it. Having seen what you are doing for it, Rinsui, I am both impressed and very happy indeed. It looks like you are bringing new depth to the mod and making it stable and reliable to play!

    Forgive me if this has already been proposed, and especially if it is unfeasible, but I wonder if you would consider introducing a Zone of Recruitment system? That is a feature of mods like RTR that I quite like, since not only is it a bit odd for a Japanese faction to capture a city in India and be able immediately to turn out samurai, but it would also add a great deal of variety if the player was able to train the basic units of the other factions (except perhaps for the demons). I understand of course that this may be too much work, or not what you had in mind for Blue Lotus.

  25. #25
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Not at all. This system IS implemented already ^^/
    Rinsui

  26. #26
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    If anyone else has been goofing around with the more recent beta, here's a couple files with new anims to style things up a little bit. Just add the anim names into descr_model_battle.

    http://files.filefront.com/Added+in+.../fileinfo.html

    Now those duelists LOOK like they got skills...

  27. #27
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Excellent. I just integrated them into the new patch already (release Sunday, 08.06.2008)
    Thanks again for the help,
    Rinsui

  28. #28
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Hmm Kitagata!
    The new Katana animation and the new Monted Standardbearer animations were promptly used. The two-handed spear animation was also used for the Yari spearmen, but not the Ashigaru, since it is too slow (movement speed). The "Katana" animation and the new "Swordsman" animation seem to be the same thing (at least I could not tell the difference); likewise, I can not tell any difference between the new foot_archer animations and the old archer animations...? Hmm. The rest is just wonderful, and I guess we will need the musket animation after all, haha ^^/
    By the way, you seem to be proficient at editing sounds. May I get back to you once the new firelances are implemented?

    And... it's faction selection time again. What faction should I do next? You got time to decide until this evening. Hurry up, guys ;)
    Rinsui

  29. #29
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Ok. Since no specific orders have arrived yet, I think I'll expand the Rebel factions for a while.
    Come on guys, this is your chance to decide on what poor me has to work on ^^/
    Rinsui

  30. #30
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Do the Chinese!

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