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Thread: Feedback wanted!

  1. #91
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Jesus! These pictures sure are beautiful. As for me, I don't mind having something small at all. The Bakemono would be quite befitting on a small scale as well, I guess - and it would add some sort of funny cuteness (image a horde of child-sized small devils bashing away at the knees of ever-severe, honourable and proud Akagi Duelists... admitted, it is a matter of taste, but I like the idea. I'll give it a shot with the Son Goku skeleton. We can always change back if it looks too stupid).
    Btw, the Dragon-Warriors of the monks in the last release somehow managed to elude my censorship. They are not finished, just a sketch. Lets see whether I can give them revolving claws.
    ...-and thanks for the new Shadow Warrior sounds, as always.

    P.S.: My wife will leave for a trip back to Japan for about a month beginning next monday - which might slow me down until then. You know, family>a>b>c...>x>y>BL (or at least I have to pretend to be of that opinion, haha!). The good news is: I will also be able to elude censorship for a month beginning next monday.

    @Saulot: Your help is most appreciated. Please send me a PM, and we'll talk about details.
    Rinsui

  2. #92
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    That's funny, my wife is leaving Japan for the States next week. Anyway, here's a gaki texture and skeleton. Give it a look and see if it's worth using.

    http://files.filefront.com/gaki+skel.../fileinfo.html

  3. #93
    Member Member Old Nick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I've been away for a while and wow,I can't believe how much progress you made.This is amazing,guys.

    Going to download and take alook at everything asap.

    I've one further suggestion but I don't know if that might not have been brought up already:Teppo/Muskets
    Would there be away to implement them, especially since there already are so many different projectiles ?I think they'd make a great addition to the mod and would be especially great to make the distinction between the progressive Zensen and conservative Akagi even clearer.

    I would offer to try and make the models (using Hoggy's as base of course) but I haven't modded RTW for years and all I ever did where some small changes on models and skins (if there is anything like that I can help you with I would do so gladly btw).

    Cheers

    ON

  4. #94
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    The new Singijeon more or less is a very primitive "Teppo" for the Choson. In the fictional timframe of BLTW, gunpowder is something really new that was only recently invented by the Zhuanshi. From there, it spread to India (in its heavy guns), Yuwan (in its thunderbombers). The sneaky Yuwan in turn sold the secret of gunpowder to the Karazai (Mongols) in exchange for an alliance against their common archenemy - the beforementioned Zhuanshi. How the Choson fit into that transition is explained in the unit descriptions ^^.
    Rinsui

  5. #95
    Member Member Old Nick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Just tried out the Singijeon wow,perfect,I really loved the sounds,they were actually better than NTW2's - and even better than the Singijeon (because they were a pleasant surprise): the Hwacha ,really awesome.

    I had some troubles though,at first the game would ctd,shortly after the first screen, show_err said nothing, worked with -nm though, so it seems there's a trouble with the intro/background vids.

    The game also hung itself when I tested the indian guns, the Zhuanshi guns worked fine though (used EAX3).I like the cannon sounds, but they could be a tad louder and longer.

    As for the Teppo, maybe they would make sense as an AOR unit in the territories of the Choson and/or Zhuanshi ?They could use the same projectiles as the Singijeon, the UI could be a problem though,well they're not that important anyway.

    This mod is getting better and better, thank you very much !

    Cheers,

    ON

    P.S.

    Another Idea would be jungles,I know EB has them and the Crusades mod has them too, I saw a guide to implement them somewhere as well, too bad I'm so inept in any things code-related.If you need me for small modelling/texturing I'd be glad to help though.
    Last edited by Old Nick; 07-16-2008 at 14:43.

  6. #96
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Dragon Warriors are pretty smooth. The game runs them, but on shutdown it gives a warning that they have different max ranges listed in different places, 18 or 30.

    Also, I think you need to change any originally barbarian and roman culture units to a voice type other than light_1, except Son Goku and the Snow Monkeys. At the moment practically the entire Chinese army is making monkey howls.

    Lastly, the chanting/praying animation and sounds work on all the monk units except the Sohei on foot and horseback. It doesn't seem to be skeleton or animation set based, as the Sadhu fanatics use the two handed set but can chant.

    Again, the Dragon Warrors are a great idea, very cool.

    EDIT: Realized that the reason the Shishi still use the horse sounds for charging and death from descr_sounds_units_anims is because the shishi's skeleton in descr_model_battle (fs_beast I think) points it at the horse 'event ANIM_...' entry.
    I am unable to edit the skeleton, but if anyone knows how to change the skeleton so that it points at the CAMEL 'event ANIM' sounds in units_anims then everything would be fixed.
    Last edited by kitagata; 07-21-2008 at 05:12.

  7. #97
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Noted, both errors (dragon warriors range and chinese monkeys) will be corrected later today. Also scheduled is the first Gaki tryout.
    Last edited by Rinsui; 07-21-2008 at 13:44.
    Rinsui

  8. #98
    Speaker of Truth Senior Member Moros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Like the new dragons. Though I'd keep the old ones too if I were you. Make them two different units. The black ones being like the royal elephants, while the green ones like the medium indian elephants? That'd be awesome.

  9. #99
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Nope, sorry. Dragons are too special to be something "medium" in my opinion. One dragon for the whole game. No worries, though. It's about 8m tall. ;)
    Rinsui

  10. #100
    Speaker of Truth Senior Member Moros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!



    I didn't mean medium unit, I meant a medium dragon. Powerfull but the towered ones wouldn't be as powerfull as the black dragons. Them black being well overpowered really.

  11. #101
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Ah, yes... I understand what you mean. The stats are not finished, btw. In fact, they aren't even started. So don't wonder when your 10-man Ashigaru batallion wipes out a Samurai army. To clarify that alos: the "Black Dragon" is an ancestral unit, btw (Enma Dai-ou, the King of Hell), hence: not recruitable. Think of it as the "final boss" in this game.
    Rinsui

  12. #102
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Hey, things are looking really good!
    I just wanted to point out that beards on some units, including the yomi officer, still have black borders instead of invisible alpha channels.
    Also, you said that you finished all the units; will there be no full sized Bakemono? I didn't mean to replace them by suggesting the Gaki. The original Bakemono model is such a great model, I think it would be great as a medium or heavy weight Yomi unit, or as a mercenary.

  13. #103
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Hm. The beard's borders is a very strange and elusive bug I don't know the origin of. It may have something to do with they way I export .tga int .dss, or it may have something to do with the models themselves. Strangely, the black border sometimes disappears once you close in on the unit. Strange, strange. I'll look into this once again then.
    Your Gaki pushed out the Bakemono, that's right. The Yomi already have by far the largest unit roster of all factions, so there is little need for doubles.
    Rinsui

  14. #104
    Speaker of Truth Senior Member Moros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Will the normal dragons still be recruitable though?

  15. #105
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    As you insist on a definite answer: not in the version I am planning to release. I'll leave the .cas and .tga.dds files in though, so it should be a matter of minutes for an experienced modder like you to re-include them. Personally I hold the conviction that, even in a mythology game, dragons are waaaay to special to appear on the battlefield in dozens. But, again, this is a decision I am unable to defend with rational arguments; it is a matter of pure personal preference, and I am sure many will disagree. Some people think it's cool Gandalf slew the Balrog, some people think that's bullshit. In fact I secretly hope some modders will mod this mod after I'm finished modding...
    Rinsui

  16. #106
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    It's cool that you're ok with other modding. I've been redo-ing some of the units, roads and bridges, and the wooden walls to my own liking, and I was hoping it wouldn't be rude to post them at some point.
    Any chance of a Yuwan thunderbomber model instead of using the Karazai one?

  17. #107
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    ...ok. This should be doable. Btw, the Yuwan will be allied to the Karazai at the beginning, against their common archenemy, the Zhuanshi. The Thunderbombers are a co-production of the two nations, with the Yuwan providing the gunpowder secrets and the Karazai providing... well... the madmen throwing them. But I guess I can give them separate models each. Agreed. Don't expect too much, though. I'm pretty *done with* units, hahaha!
    Btw: what did you do to roads, bridges and walls? This sounds interesting...

    @Moros. To be upright: another reason why I am very reluctant to include the "normal" dragons is because their original model, if you look closely, definitely lacks quality of all the other BLTW ones. I admit I may be a little lunatic in that regard, but I invested a whopping 9 full hours to distill the Black one out of the Green ones. Please look at the last entry in the "Rinsuis updates" thread which shows the two versions in direct comparison. The Green dragon had unaligned textures, a stupily open jaw, a straight swifer-tail, a broken hip and neck, matchstick legs and did definitely not move like a reptile but rather like Mr. Crabs from Spongebob Squarepants. In consequence this means I'd have to use a downscaled Black Dragon model for the Green ones, too... but where is the coolness in: "Oh, yet another dragon. This times he's a little bigger. And not green. Whoa. What's on TV?". And as I said: I am too tired (mentally) to sacrifice another 9 hours of summertime to come up with something completely new. Please understand this decision.
    Last edited by Rinsui; 08-20-2008 at 00:24.
    Rinsui

  18. #108
    Speaker of Truth Senior Member Moros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rinsui View Post
    @Moros. To be upright: another reason why I am very reluctant to include the "normal" dragons is because their original model, if you look closely, definitely lacks quality of all the other BLTW ones. I admit I may be a little lunatic in that regard, but I invested a whopping 9 full hours to distill the Black one out of the Green ones. Please look at the last entry in the "Rinsuis updates" thread which shows the two versions in direct comparison. The Green dragon had unaligned textures, a stupily open jaw, a straight swifer-tail, a broken hip and neck, matchstick legs and did definitely not move like a reptile but rather like Mr. Crabs from Spongebob Squarepants. In consequence this means I'd have to use a downscaled Black Dragon model for the Green ones, too... but where is the coolness in: "Oh, yet another dragon. This times he's a little bigger. And not green. Whoa. What's on TV?". And as I said: I am too tired (mentally) to sacrifice another 9 hours of summertime to come up with something completely new. Please understand this decision.
    No problems at all Rinsui. I just was wondering. I'm glad you're doing the already incredible amount of work you're doing. Respect mate.

  19. #109
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I took the Chinese stone wall skin and cut it to fit and shadow properly on the bridge and road. Problem is that the textures streach on the road differently than on the bridge, so the two don't line up quite right. Plus the road appears in the Japanese settlements, and the Chinese wall color looks all wrong next too the Japanese buildings. I'm going to try a new texture.

    Just a small error I noticed, units entering and exiting the gatehouses on the large wooden wall float. They walk up an invisible staircase. Also the Singijeon's in-battle description doesn't have it's picture, just the generic peasant.

    edit: went back and looked at vanilla rtw and bi and the tiles for the roads and bridges don't blend well in the first place! I didn't remember that.
    Last edited by kitagata; 08-21-2008 at 19:26.

  20. #110
    Member Member shizzzm's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Wow. I visited this forum when it was still under hoggy, and I really enjoyed Blue Lotus despite its random CTDS and stuff. I'm so glad its revived now, with expansions on the Korean and Mongol factions. But the Filefront server doesn't seem to work, and I can't test out this brilliant work. Is there a way someone can upload these files to Rapidshare or something?

    Thanks, and Great Job!

  21. #111
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Once I'm finished with the beta stats, I'll re-upload a new base version. That should take care of the matter ^^.
    Rinsui

  22. #112
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    That nice new King Enma is just calling out for a voice. Here are some sounds for him, and fixes so the Kappa Elephants make elephant sounds.

    http://files.filefront.com/Enma+Kapp.../fileinfo.html

    Hope it works.

  23. #113
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    !
    Great. I am also happy to announce I found a way to decrease the fire rates of the heavy Ashigaru Crossbowmen and the Singijeon. I'll contact you later, Kitagata.
    Rinsui

  24. #114
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Things are kinda slow on the board, so I thought I'd post a couple images of the bridge that I've been messing with.





    If I can, for myself I'm going to try to switch the settlement streets for the Chinese and Japanese factions. It seems more appropriate for finely paved streets to go to the Chinese and dirt or cobblestone streets to go to the Japanese.

    Does anyone have any info on how to do this, or feelings on changing the streets?
    Last edited by kitagata; 09-05-2008 at 17:32.

  25. #115
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    I admit things must look quite slow at the moment, but the last week I've been very busy (an verage of 3h/d) with playtesting the new unit stats. It is actually quite difficult to come up with a good and somehow realistic formula. This is an (not further explained) template I'm using.

    Level-up points per level: about 12 worth points, Militia only 8
    1. type
    dictionary
    category
    class
    voice_type
    soldier
    officer
    Morale Base 0
    AT Base 2
    DEF Base 2
    Formation
    -Archer 1, 2, 2, 4, 3
    -Swordsman 1.3, 2, 2.6, 4, 4
    -Spearman 1, 1, 2, 2, 4
    -Cavalry 1.5, 4, 3, 8, 3
    Speed
    Weight
    Kill counter
    2. Armour:
    Simple Helmet: +1
    Heavy Helmet: +2
    Simple Shins: +1
    Heavy Shins: +2
    Leather Koshi: +1
    Metal koshi: +2
    Nude 0
    Light Cloth 1
    Multi-Layer Cloth 2
    Leather BP 2
    Metal BP 3
    HQ Armour +1
    Iron Wall Ultra Heavy Full Fused Armour Set: 16

    Shield:
    None 0
    Small Buckler 1
    Large Buckler 2
    Small Round Shield 3
    Large Round Shield 4
    Tower Shield 5
    Pavise 6

    Heat: Base 2+Armour:2, Armour Malus halved if mounted and horse unarmoured
    Speed: See what the unit looks like.

    3. Extra Weapons:
    Kill Value = Range/100*Attack Power
    AP average 3
    Ammo Value = Ammo/28
    Examples:
    27 Armour 9 units dead with 9
    7 dead with 1
    12 dead with 4,6
    16 dead with 4,8
    15 dead with 5,6
    so it's *very* roughly kill rate * 3


    4. AT Boni (2,3,4...)
    RAT Boni (4,5,...)
    Range Boni (4)
    Ammo Boni (?)
    5. DEF Boni (2,3,4...)
    6. Mental Boni
    7. Abilities, Formations
    8. 2-handed heavy weapon bonus AT*4/3 (down) DEF*3/4 (down)
    AP bonus Axe,Mace,Poleaxe
    DEF*3/4 Axe, Mace, Poleaxe
    Charge Bonus Lance Cav: 1, DEF*2/3
    (AT,DEF)*(1-(Armour+Shield)*2.5%) (down)
    9. Charge Boni
    1/2 all (up)
    2/3 heavy 2-handed,cavalry (up)
    1 Lance cavalry
    10. Spear Boni
    Spear 4
    Naginata 2
    Pike 6
    11. Scrub: All except Elephant*2/3, Chariot*1/3 exact, negative down
    Sand: Cariot*2/3
    Wood: Cav*2/3, Chariot*1/3
    Snow: Camel,Elephant*2/3, 25% (Nude), 50% (Light Cloth), 75% (Multi-layer Cloth)
    12. Worth
    13. Cost

    Training: 12 P per level (AT,DF first increase costs 2, then 3,4,... per step counter reset)

    Note this template is combined with a "worth" table that assigns a set value for every stat increase, ability and th like.

    ...so...
    stay tuned. One thing I *drastically* changed was the effectiveness of archers. It is a all-too-well known tactic of human players to "outrange" the AI, which is not intelligent, but rather an exploit. Likewise, I considered it fairly unrealistic that a bunch of lowly Ashigaru Bowmen could decimate a contingent of from-head-to-toe-steel-plated Naginata Samurai by half before they could do anything about it. If armour was that ineffective, there would be no armour in the first place. Personal opinion here.
    Rinsui

  26. #116
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    There's a building boundary problem with Japanese settlements. At least with the "minor city" level, The "Large Residence" now blocks some of the roads, making movement impossible.

  27. #117
    Member Member shizzzm's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Just played the new base version today. Two words. Absolutely brilliant. However, I did note a problem that, while it did not hinder gameplay, still got on my nerves.

    There seems to be a sprite problem with most units on the battle map; when I zoom out to command my armies, they all carry Akagi banners. The only units that don't seem to have this problem are the monks. Wierd.

    Um, all the units on the campaign map seem to be dummies. Look like terra cotta warriors. Lol.

    Also I felt that the Choson units were a bit bland compared to the other factions, and I was wondering if it was possible creating a sort of Phalanx unit with the Jangchang spears by giving them shields and the phalanx technique avaliable to the greek spearmen in Rome TW. Just a suggestion. Anyways, great job guys and thanks for the great mod!

  28. #118
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Actually, the "Banners" they carry is the sprite of a chinese standard. Just a placeholder, as sprites will be implemented last. You know, there is always tiny tweaks and changes to be made until the very last minute, and generating sprites is an automatic process -> no need to waste time at this stage.
    The stats of the Choson are not implemented yet, but I can say that much: they will have the very best ranged attack units (and a secret special Ship) of all nations. The dummies are, well... dummies. Campaign is next on the list.
    Rinsui

  29. #119
    Member Member kitagata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Hey, got some fun stuff today!
    I put together sounds for the shambling undead in the Yomi army.
    Here's the link to the sound and text files. Also included are fixes so the Krishnapur elephant units actually make sounds, AND fixes so only Son Goku and the Snow Monkies howl.

    http://files.filefront.com/Undead+an.../fileinfo.html

    I think the zombie sounds add tremendously to the feel of playing the Yomi. Really liking it.
    Hope you feel the same.

  30. #120
    Current Blue Lotus TW Leader Member Rinsui's Avatar
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    Default Re: Feedback wanted!

    Kitagata,
    there's no need to comment your work. It's excellent as usual. However, the thing that impresses me most is the way you present it. Every zip you send contains a very well-structurated and informative readme. This saves me hours of time. Thank you.
    So. This had to be noted once.
    Rinsui

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