Sab'yn Status

[Ibrahim]

Great work Ibrahim. My exams are done so I'll have more time to contribute.

just as mine did as well. I can restart the effirt at full throttle.

I'll get the nouns and verb stems done. are you going to your library? you can use it to collect the pronouns, prepositions, and grammatical stuff.

[Moros]

just as mine did as well. I can restart the effirt at full throttle.

I'll get the nouns and verb stems done. are you going to your library? you can use it to collect the pronouns, prepositions, and grammatical stuff.

I'm gonna look up grammar books and the likes on Semetic languages and Sabaic. And try to find as much as possible, not sure how much that's going to be though. But as they also teach Aramaic, Akkadian and similar languages at my uni, there must be books about it. Probably gonna do Aramaic myself next year so.

[Moros]

After doing some searches I've found a Sabaic dictionary. I've also got that book we talked about, describing semetic languages

[Ibrahim]

After doing some searches I've found a Sabaic dictionary. I've also got that book we talked about, describing semetic languages

can you scan the former?

If so, may, you send copies of the scan to me?

[Moros]

Sure.

[Moros]

Okay just spend the last 4 hours reading a dictionary. And yes it's as boring as it sounds. Got to page 103, but now I'm truely fed up. It made a nice list though, which I'll share after doing a proper transliteration. Also you cant believe how many words they have for destroying things, for dams and for camels.

[Ibrahim]

Okay just spend the last 4 hours reading a dictionary. And yes it's as boring as it sounds. Got to page 103, but now I'm truely fed up. It made a nice list though, which I'll share after doing a proper transliteration. Also you cant believe how many words they have for destroying things, for dams and for camels.

well, arabic has 3-4 dozen words for camel: jamal, ibil, naaqah, thaniyya, baazil, and the list goes on...
in fact, Arabic has more words for camel than the inuits have for snow.


well, I'll be waiting..

[desert]

Well, the Inuits never did have many words for snow.

But 3-4 dozen is a lot.

[Moros]

well, arabic has 3-4 dozen words for camel: jamal, ibil, naaqah, thaniyya, baazil, and the list goes on...
in fact, Arabic has more words for camel than the inuits have for snow.


well, I'll be waiting..

How did you do them backwards '?'-like symbols. I'm temporarly using brackets instead of them '(' or ')'. I'm gonna make the list in the Sabaic alphabet followed by a transscripted version and followed by a more readible sort of transcirption/phonetic. (possibly with vowels)

Any suggestions on doing the latter? Also I'm using Sabaean44.ttf for sabaic, you can download it for free. (use google).

[Ibrahim]

How did you do them backwards '?'-like symbols. I'm temporarly using brackets instead of them '(' or ')'. I'm gonna make the list in the Sabaic alphabet followed by a transscripted version and followed by a more readible sort of transcirption/phonetic. (possibly with vowels)

Any suggestions on doing the latter? Also I'm using Sabaean44.ttf for sabaic, you can download it for free. (use google).

well, if the curve faces to the right (exactly like ?), I usually place a ' in its place. if its backwards, I place a 3 instead. otherwise, I can't make those signs directly. (besides, they can be confusing: I once mistranliterated the sabaic for "father" as 3b, instead of the correct 'b).

I think I'll have to share the standard I came up with, to ease problems.

EDIT: moros, I'll send you the "semetic standard" I came up with. I use it to compare sabaic to Arabic and akkadian. I send it to you, as the signs are distinctive for each sound, easing transcription. I used it for the mini lexicon.

[Moros]

Okidoki. yeah little difference can make a big change in meaning. I noticed a misspelling in EBI of mlk to mkl. So our king became a granary...

[Ibrahim]

Okidoki. yeah little difference can make a big change in meaning. I noticed a misspelling in EBI of mlk to mkl. So our king became a granary...

aye, a common problem with semetic: its all too easy to pun, and/ or mix up.

[Ibrahim]

any news on the work on your end, Moros?

going slowly here.

[MeinPanzer]

I recently got a hold of "Warfare in Ancient South Arabia: 2nd - 3rd c. AD" by A.F.L. Beeston, which is an annotated collection of epigraphical sources relating to warfare from the specified time period. This was the first time that details of campaigns were given in dedications, and so these reveal quite a bit of information about warfare in general. Are you making use of these sources for the Sabaeans in EBII? Of course, this relates to a period chronologically removed from the EB timeframe, but it seems that few elements of South Arabian warfare changed in the mean time, so much of the information is still very relevant.

[paullus]

that sounds like an excellent source, i'll look into it.

[Moros]

Ibrahim: sorry for my absence but my internet was broken, and today it's finally working again.

[Ibrahim]

Ibrahim: sorry for my absence but my internet was broken, and today it's finally working again.

no hurry here. been busy lately.

[Ibrahim]

hey Moros!

I have managed to finally get the preposition collection finished; I'm sending it to organize word searches and grammar. the idea I hope is that we can cut up the languages so to speak, and look each part up, saving time, and more importantly, effort, for future work. I started with this paper: it details all prepositions used in Sabaean. It should help you with looking for those. the next time round I'll try to send pronouns:


http://files.filefront.com/prepositi.../fileinfo.html

again, you have to find them in the library dictionary, as I have none.

[Moros]

great, I've not been doing much on sabaic lately because of other EB research and because of a paper I'm having to write. Will get you an update shortly though.

[Moros]

I recently got a hold of "Warfare in Ancient South Arabia: 2nd - 3rd c. AD" by A.F.L. Beeston, which is an annotated collection of epigraphical sources relating to warfare from the specified time period. This was the first time that details of campaigns were given in dedications, and so these reveal quite a bit of information about warfare in general. Are you making use of these sources for the Sabaeans in EBII? Of course, this relates to a period chronologically removed from the EB timeframe, but it seems that few elements of South Arabian warfare changed in the mean time, so much of the information is still very relevant.

Found the book. Gonna read it after I've finished my little paper which I need to turn in this friday.

[athanaric]

Is it decided yet whether the Arabian and Sabaic units will keep their javelins? I have heard some people here (at least Ibrahim) say that they didn't use javelins during the EB timeframe.

Btw.: Anyone else notice the change in Moros' signature?

[Ibrahim]

Is it decided yet whether the Arabian and Sabaic units will keep their javelins? I have heard some people here (at least Ibrahim) say that they didn't use javelins during the EB timeframe.

Btw.: Anyone else notice the change in Moros' signature?

me and Meinpanzer actually*. And no, I don't know what the EB team thinks. but if recommendations are followed, units native to Arabia won't have javelins (ethiopeian? sure, give them such). this is because there is no evidence of such a weapon, either in stelae, or in the literature, in the hands of an Arabian* (whether from saba' or the Arabs)

and yes, Moros' sig has changed; he is advertising a new, unknown faction. I'm wondering what it is.

*Actually, meinpanzer was the one who explained it for Saba'. he noted that, while they may have been used, bows predominated (as missile weapons). It was a PM. but there is no conclusive evidence, for Saba' at least, that javelins were used.

*mentioned with ehiopeians, and by the 7th century, in yemeni hands.

[Nirvanish]

I'm sure that someone has seen this already but I figured I would post it anyways.
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/arabia1.html
It gives accounts of "Arabia" from Herodotus, Strabo, Dio Cassius, Ammianus Marcellinus and Procopius. Though the accuracy should no doubt be in question it maybe of some interest to anyone working on Sab'yn.

[Ibrahim]

I'm sure that someone has seen this already but I figured I would post it anyways.
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/arabia1.html
It gives accounts of "Arabia" from Herodotus, Strabo, Dio Cassius, Ammianus Marcellinus and Procopius. Though the accuracy should no doubt be in question it maybe of some interest to anyone working on Sab'yn.

its ok when viewed in greek eyes, but ignore the modern annotations.

[Nirvanish]

Yeah I don't think those annotations were necessary. If I find anything else that appears relevant I will post it.

[Moros]

Many petroglyphs show bows, I havn't seen many depicting javelins yet. Though one possibly could be, but at the moment I have not yet made a full conclusion. I'm looking around for evidence and if it is proven that I really can't find any, than the Sabaeans will not get any javelins. When I, or the better the EB team, has taken a final stance, I'll come and tell.

[Moros]

me and Meinpanzer actually*. And no, I don't know what the EB team thinks. but if recommendations are followed, units native to Arabia won't have javelins (ethiopeian? sure, give them such). this is because there is no evidence of such a weapon, either in stelae, or in the literature, in the hands of an Arabian* (whether from saba' or the Arabs)

and yes, Moros' sig has changed; he is advertising a new, unknown faction. I'm wondering what it is.

*Actually, meinpanzer was the one who explained it for Saba'. he noted that, while they may have been used, bows predominated (as missile weapons). It was a PM. but there is no conclusive evidence, for Saba' at least, that javelins were used.

*mentioned with ehiopeians, and by the 7th century, in yemeni hands.

After some more reading and concepting the outline of the Sabaean army together with paullus, I can tell you that there will be javelins. Though not sure if there gonna be that many. Probably for peasant levies and light cavalry.

[MeinPanzer]

After some more reading and concepting the outline of the Sabaean army together with paullus, I can tell you that there will be javelins. Though not sure if there gonna be that many. Probably for peasant levies and light cavalry.

What evidence did you find that supported the use of javelins, especially for light cavalry?

[Moros]

What evidence did you find that supported the use of javelins, especially for light cavalry?

For example the book of Beeston. Who mentions cavalry harassing enemies. The bow on the other hand will be mostly reserved for elite units. As shown in warrior freezes.

[athanaric]

The bow on the other hand will be mostly reserved for elite units.

So, no more Sabaean (light) Archers?

Well, I'll be happy whether you give Saba's troops javelins or not. Gameplay wise the Arabian cavalry kinda sucks without javelins. Still, historical accuracy is better than gameplay. After all, this isn't Starcraft (EB II looks much better than Starcraft II).