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Thread: Nusantara : Total War

  1. #91
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Allright... allright, so finally I've gone into conclusion that javelinmen standing on top of a small elephants are ridiculously like surfboarding men... oops, elephantboarding men...... and you two should stop citating BOBO!
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Adding some blue rabbit cavalry isn't a good idea, u know.....

    Ok, like it or not... we'll stick to standard indian elephant provided in vanilla, and maybe used armoured elephants for bodyguards (they are african, but I can manage skins to get more metallic side of them, so they are basicaly extended armour rather than body...)
    Last edited by Cute Wolf; 12-13-2009 at 00:05.

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  2. #92
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    We'll get this points to elephant balancing (allready tested how they wreak havoc (at this stat) against some model test units. Currently, cutewolf are working on refining his elephant skins...

    ; Gajah pekerja, diambil dari yang biasa dibuat kerja di hutan... ngga pake baju.
    type field worker elephants
    dictionary field_worker_elephants ; Gajah Pekerja
    category cavalry
    class heavy
    voice_type Medium_1
    soldier greek_peltast_elephant, 20, 10, 1
    mount gajah kecil
    mount_effect horse +5, chariot +7
    attributes sea_faring, can_run_amok, frighten_foot, frighten_mounted, very_hardy
    formation 6, 10, 12, 16, 4, square
    stat_health 1, 4
    stat_pri 7, 45, javelin, 70, 45, thrown, simple, piercing, spear, 15 ,1
    stat_pri_attr thrown ap
    stat_sec 7, 45, no, 0, 0, melee, other, blunt, none, 0 ,0.35
    stat_sec_attr area, launching, ap
    stat_pri_armour 5, 5, 0, flesh
    stat_sec_armour 16, 7, leather
    stat_heat -3
    stat_ground 0, 0, -5, -2
    stat_mental 11, impetuous, untrained
    stat_charge_dist 100
    stat_fire_delay 20000
    stat_food 60, 300
    stat_cost 6, 8000, 2000, 400, 400, 8000
    ownership sassanids, berbers, huns, goths, sarmatians, vandals, slave
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  3. #93
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic View Post
    We'll get this points to elephant balancing (allready tested how they wreak havoc (at this stat) against some model test units. Currently, cutewolf are working on refining his elephant skins...

    ; Gajah pekerja, diambil dari yang biasa dibuat kerja di hutan... ngga pake baju.
    type field worker elephants
    dictionary field_worker_elephants ; Gajah Pekerja
    category cavalry
    class heavy
    voice_type Medium_1
    soldier greek_peltast_elephant, 20, 10, 1
    mount gajah kecil
    mount_effect horse +5, chariot +7
    attributes sea_faring, can_run_amok, frighten_foot, frighten_mounted, very_hardy
    formation 6, 10, 12, 16, 4, square
    stat_health 1, 4
    stat_pri 7, 45, javelin, 70, 45, thrown, simple, piercing, spear, 15 ,1
    stat_pri_attr thrown ap
    stat_sec 7, 45, no, 0, 0, melee, other, blunt, none, 0 ,0.35
    stat_sec_attr area, launching, ap
    stat_pri_armour 5, 5, 0, flesh
    stat_sec_armour 16, 7, leather
    stat_heat -3
    stat_ground 0, 0, -5, -2
    stat_mental 11, impetuous, untrained
    stat_charge_dist 100
    stat_fire_delay 20000
    stat_food 60, 300
    stat_cost 6, 8000, 2000, 400, 400, 8000
    ownership sassanids, berbers, huns, goths, sarmatians, vandals, slave
    That's only for the elephants, right????
    maybe we should make the "Elephant Riflemen", like the Maratha ones. that can only be made when the
    Natives are allied with the Europeans, like the British in India,
    x2


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  4. #94
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Simply no, we didn't have Elephant gunmen animation for BI, maybe we could use the carriage ballista anims, but that will be ridiculous (allready tested with bucelarii as models), even our elephant javelinmen will use chariot javelinmen animation, means that the rider will hush-hush with his hand when moving...

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  5. #95
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    I have a model for Infantry (I found it when I was searching Google)

    for some Militia
    but u know, I did'nt have a goddamn Idea where I found it, I think it's M2TW or something, cuz the units are'nt in one Standard Model
    Last edited by G. Septimus; 12-14-2009 at 14:03.
    x2


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  6. #96
    the Legatus Member Samofrome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius Septimus Severus View Post
    I have a model for Infantry (I found it when I was searching Google)

    for some Militia
    but u know, I did'nt have a goddamn Idea where I found it, I think it's M2TW or something, cuz the units are'nt in one Standard Model
    pardon me if you don't want me here, but it does come M2TW, because the men in that unit is wearing differant hair stlyes and bands.

  7. #97
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Samofrome View Post
    pardon me if you don't want me here, but it does come M2TW, because the men in that unit is wearing differant hair stlyes and bands.
    Hello, sam
    Care to Join usin our effort to make a mod????
    x2


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  8. #98
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Samofrome View Post
    pardon me if you don't want me here, but it does come M2TW, because the men in that unit is wearing differant hair stlyes and bands.
    Hiya, new face here.... are you a Singaporeans, Thai, Bruneian, Filipino, Kampucheans, or Vietnamese?
    Or you are Portugese, Dutch, Spaniard, French, English, German, or Turkish?

    It's a surprise to see you here.... we're need some help now!

    ---------------------

    And about M2TW models, there was several skins for a model, but apparently we can just keep the basic model, and reskin it for RTW puropses...

    My Projects : * Near East Total War * Nusantara Total War * Assyria Total War *
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  9. #99
    the Legatus Member Samofrome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Cute Wolf View Post
    Hiya, new face here.... are you a Singaporeans, Thai, Bruneian, Filipino, Kampucheans, or Vietnamese?
    Or you are Portugese, Dutch, Spaniard, French, English, German, or Turkish?

    It's a surprise to see you here.... we're need some help now!

    ---------------------

    And about M2TW models, there was several skins for a model, but apparently we can just keep the basic model, and reskin it for RTW puropses...
    Engilsh.

  10. #100
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Cute Wolf View Post
    Hiya, new face here.... are you a Singaporeans, Thai, Bruneian, Filipino, Kampucheans, or Vietnamese?
    Or you are Portugese, Dutch, Spaniard, French, English, German, or Turkish?

    It's a surprise to see you here.... we're need some help now!

    ---------------------

    And about M2TW models, there was several skins for a model, but apparently we can just keep the basic model, and reskin it for RTW puropses...
    He's a Brit, he lives in England,
    BTW, thx for wanting to help us, Sam
    x2


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  11. #101
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Heck... the lastest source we read (babad Sriwijaya).... suggest that the Javanese Spearmen..... use OVERHAND SPEAR!!!


    Now we must start to look for other's animation to be used in our mod... I allready confirm that with a real historian (he was history lecturer in UPI, we've meet when I ruining reading the UPI library about history...), he says that the evidence of Javanese line spearmen use overhand spear fighting could be seen in the Prajurit Jogo Karyo, from Palembang, Cirebon, and Yogyakarta, that still could be seen (in ceremony) even today... as they use overhand naturally because they tend to fight in really dense formation (Heck! that was too similar with Hoplite warfare!!!)



    Maybe we can use javelinmen animation for melee what did you think?

    EDIT : After reading much about the royal bloodline of mainline Indonesian monarch and Kingdoms
    -> Sriwijaya -> Kediri -> Singosari -> Majapahit -> Demak -> Pajang -> Mataram -> Yogyakarta
    we've known that the first Sriwijaya King (Dapunta Hyang Sri Jayanasa), was land on Sumatran shore with a refugee force of 20000 men strong. He was the eldest of surviving Princes of Sakawana Dynasty (Saka dynasty in India), that sucesfully evade the Ghupta's attempt to wipe them out of existance. He led his army that made of surviving nobility to evade Saka genocide that happened in India, and for more interesting things to point out, the Saka Dynasty adopt Hinduism... BUT DID NOT ADOPT THE CONCEPT OF CASTE!!! - Just like what happened in Indonesian Hindus today!!!

    His core troops was made with Heavily armoured nobles, wearing helmet that shaped like (kacang mete) - that explains WHY TRADITIONAL JAVANESE HELMETS HAVE TEH SHAPE JUST LIKE PHRYGIAN CAPS!!!

    And armed with bows and lances... his levies including some mounted archer scouts (WUT mounted archers?) and bow and sword armed levies.... (so we're saka descendants afterall....)

    Well, those Hoplite like fighting style must be carried off from Baktria.....
    I didn't think we'll discover this kind of surprising facts.....

    ==================================================================

    For more interesting Information... Why the most Javanese Nobles have *cough* much lighter skin than most commoners?
    That was happened because they aren't the native Javanese at all (at least they wasn't native 1400 years ago *cough*), they are Saka, and they tend to give their Saka blood to their fellow Saka... (that's why the rich Javanese family in not so long time ago forbids their daughters to marry lesser classes... no caste.. yes, but "pseudo interracial" marriage are rare (I call this pseudo because all were belongs to one Javanese race now). And while the nobility usually kept their archery skills, they gradually lost taste on daily horse riding (who want to rode a horse in muddy fields?), but still employs much light horse archers as scouts, as well as keeping some elite armoured HA for the nobility. The muddy plains on Indonesian archipelago (and java as the best case), did give some advantage to hit and run archery, but Quite disadvantage towards charging cavalry, that's why the Cataphract type of fighting are quickly phased out, in a favour of Bows and Swords combo. In the other hands, heavy infantry fighting in towns, seems to largely untouched until the advent of gunpowders (they still wearing plate/mail/scale armour, and fought as Saka Hoplites). that was why, Javanese heavy spearmen are depicted fought in very dense formation, while their lesser militia brethren fought much different way, with underhand spears...... Damn.... white Javanese are more Saka......

    Too bad... Sonic is Black Javanese....
    Last edited by Cute Wolf; 12-17-2009 at 15:37.

    My Projects : * Near East Total War * Nusantara Total War * Assyria Total War *
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  12. #102
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Cute Wolf View Post
    Heck... the lastest source we read (babad Sriwijaya).... suggest that the Javanese Spearmen..... use OVERHAND SPEAR!!!


    Now we must start to look for other's animation to be used in our mod... I allready confirm that with a real historian (he was history lecturer in UPI, we've meet when I ruining reading the UPI library about history...), he says that the evidence of Javanese line spearmen use overhand spear fighting could be seen in the Prajurit Jogo Karyo, from Palembang, Cirebon, and Yogyakarta, that still could be seen (in ceremony) even today... as they use overhand naturally because they tend to fight in really dense formation (Heck! that was too similar with Hoplite warfare!!!)



    Maybe we can use javelinmen animation for melee what did you think?

    EDIT : After reading much about the royal bloodline of mainline Indonesian monarch and Kingdoms
    -> Sriwijaya -> Kediri -> Singosari -> Majapahit -> Demak -> Pajang -> Mataram -> Yogyakarta
    we've known that the first Sriwijaya King (Dapunta Hyang Sri Jayanasa), was land on Sumatran shore with a refugee force of 20000 men strong. He was the eldest of surviving Princes of Sakawana Dynasty (Saka dynasty in India), that sucesfully evade the Ghupta's attempt to wipe them out of existance. He led his army that made of surviving nobility to evade Saka genocide that happened in India, and for more interesting things to point out, the Saka Dynasty adopt Hinduism... BUT DID NOT ADOPT THE CONCEPT OF CASTE!!! - Just like what happened in Indonesian Hindus today!!!

    His core troops was made with Heavily armoured nobles, wearing helmet that shaped like (kacang mete) - that explains WHY TRADITIONAL JAVANESE HELMETS HAVE TEH SHAPE JUST LIKE PHRYGIAN CAPS!!!

    And armed with bows and lances... his levies including some mounted archer scouts (WUT mounted archers?) and bow and sword armed levies.... (so we're saka descendants afterall....)

    Well, those Hoplite like fighting style must be carried off from Baktria.....
    I didn't think we'll discover this kind of surprising facts.....

    ==================================================================

    For more interesting Information... Why the most Javanese Nobles have *cough* much lighter skin than most commoners?
    That was happened because they aren't the native Javanese at all (at least they wasn't native 1400 years ago *cough*), they are Saka, and they tend to give their Saka blood to their fellow Saka... (that's why the rich Javanese family in not so long time ago forbids their daughters to marry lesser classes... no caste.. yes, but "pseudo interracial" marriage are rare (I call this pseudo because all were belongs to one Javanese race now). And while the nobility usually kept their archery skills, they gradually lost taste on daily horse riding (who want to rode a horse in muddy fields?), but still employs much light horse archers as scouts, as well as keeping some elite armoured HA for the nobility. The muddy plains on Indonesian archipelago (and java as the best case), did give some advantage to hit and run archery, but Quite disadvantage towards charging cavalry, that's why the Cataphract type of fighting are quickly phased out, in a favour of Bows and Swords combo. In the other hands, heavy infantry fighting in towns, seems to largely untouched until the advent of gunpowders (they still wearing plate/mail/scale armour, and fought as Saka Hoplites). that was why, Javanese heavy spearmen are depicted fought in very dense formation, while their lesser militia brethren fought much different way, with underhand spears...... Damn.... white Javanese are more Saka......

    Too bad... Sonic is Black Javanese....
    If you wanna know, I'm also Black.
    If you try to see, most of the JAvans are Black, except those who are from Dutch Descedants (like my Grandmother)
    x2


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  13. #103
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius Septimus Severus View Post
    If you wanna know, I'm also Black.
    If you try to see, most of the JAvans are Black, except those who are from Dutch Descedants (like my Grandmother)
    No, kraton descendants are distinctly yellow (not white!!!) you can observe that...
    I know, dutch blood also give lighter skin, but try to browse the pics of javanese nobility too...

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  14. #104
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Well, before seeing the evidence first hand (also talk much with mr Sarwono the historian), It's hard to believe that Javanese Noble Heavy infantry fought as armoured hoplites.

    EDIT: So, what we should do with them? Change the elite hoplite's headgear? or Made entirely new model?

    Oh yeah... GSS, if you want to look for evidence... Look at mr Soeharto's portait. His face was typical Javanese noblemen. Light Yellow-Whitish skin, a bit little eyes (but still larger than Chinese), well built strature (as opposed to thin strature of average javanese)


    and his family

    Yeah, he was the best example of how Javanese nobility look like...

    The Sultans of Yogyakarta, Sri Sultan Hamengkubuwono IX


    And Hamengkubuwono X


    Certainly they are don't like the Javanese commoners... compare that with my face on facebook, or your face
    Last edited by Rahwana; 12-18-2009 at 09:19.
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  15. #105
    Member Member holeymad's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    do u guys still need help with this???

    if so doing what?

  16. #106
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by holeymad View Post
    do u guys still need help with this???

    if so doing what?
    Sonic is still doing the Unit thingy........
    better wit 'til he finishes. then we go to the next step
    x2


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  17. #107
    Member Member holeymad's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    ok just say if u need some help... i can do lots of things but i can do nice unit cards in 3ds max if u want.
    all anarchist groups in the world are oppossed to all forms of organisation and government...
    and yet they have leaders
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  18. #108
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Hmm... you can done some unit modelling, than we'll need your help... just wait when sonic comes back from his hometown (this holiday is also semester holiday for students, he gonna back to his hometown too...).

    Just hope he didn't forget to finish off his translation job....

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  19. #109
    Member Member holeymad's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    here are some examples of some unit cards that i made... id be very interested in msking them...
    all anarchist groups in the world are oppossed to all forms of organisation and government...
    and yet they have leaders
    - holeymad


    carpe nocteim - seize the night - holeymad


    this was the result of a quiz i did

  20. #110
    Member Member holeymad's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by holeymad View Post
    here are some examples of some unit cards that i made... id be very interested in msking them...






    and small ones:









    all of theme were my custom textures except for the cahriot that was dont by mattwill... hes a user at rome total war heaven.
    all anarchist groups in the world are oppossed to all forms of organisation and government...
    and yet they have leaders
    - holeymad


    carpe nocteim - seize the night - holeymad


    this was the result of a quiz i did

  21. #111
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by holeymad View Post






    and small ones:









    all of theme were my custom textures except for the cahriot that was dont by mattwill... hes a user at rome total war heaven.
    We were searching some1 like u
    x2


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  22. #112
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Well, after sonic contact me, as he had consulting several history students, we've get several historians (but still students) helping sonic right now, but they are neither orgah's not total war fan, but they just want to help us recreate the historical battles of Medieval Indonesian history for education purpose. And well, we've allready got some conclusion, according to their input:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Lumayan banget, ada 2 anak UPI temennya Sonic, dan beberapa anak UGM (ngga tau semua totalnya berapa, sonic yg tau, tapi gw udah kontak via email), bagian pendidikan sejarah yang setuju mau bantu kita lebih dalam buat riset unit dan kondisi geopolitik di Indonesia saat itu, asal nanti kalau udah jadi, mereka boleh memakai animasi film dari mod ini buat materi edukasi sejarah di tingkat SMP dan SMA. Lumayan, sudah dikonsultasiin ke dosen - dosen mereka juga, dan mereka setuju membantu kita dalam menggali info yang dibutuhkan. Ngga harus cari-cari materi dari situs musium di Belanda lagi heheeh.....

    Cuman sebagai gantinya, mereka minta kalau kita serius dalam mengerjakan modifikasi ini.....
    Nga boleh pasang babi bakar yang bisa lari - lari sebagai bonus, atau pasang muka babi di wajah malingsia dah....


    Well, this mod will apply this:

    1) Unit naming in their authentic / common native tongue naming.
    2) Rather realistic AOR system (because we will still get all region recruitable for some basic factional units)
    3) Almost Realistic unit size and division (luckily, the battles in Indonesian archipelago this time is fought mostly in hundreds to thousand scale, large unit size is more than enough)


    But here is the downside, as we must redone something in our Portugese invasion mod:
    1) They want us to redone some faction naming and symbols, especially on our some too generic factions, or using misplaced symbols for native kingdoms (proper war flag as faction symbol, not just the faction seal).
    2) They did appreciate all the hardcoded aspects of BI engine, and the more screwed up M2TW possibility (so my distorted and chubby islands of my map is still fine), but all they want is realistic representation of battle system (slower, but more morale based), and rational unit cost, upkeep, and training system (still not yet clear, what they want... sonic isn't back yet)
    3) Heavy modified field and siege battle behaviours, tweaked more closely to the standard way of fighting that time, remove the stone city walls and only important cities and capital could get exspensive wooden walls, so elephants could still easily bust it (DUH!) - but some cities will get stone walls pre built to represent they are allready built city walls, but with several growth penalty, so they are more like fortress (so they are forever town, or large town, with limited military training capability).

    Oh yeah, the list of change is Redone the Factions: here it is....
    - Aceh Darussalam (using crescent moon and 8 pointed star as symbol, the 5 pointed star is used at peace time, and it was used later)
    - Kesultanan Syah Malaka (Kesultanan was part of his name... it was proper way they are called that time, the faction symbol is right though.)
    - Nagari Sriwijaya (using lotus flower as symbol, not the Royal stamp (the former symbol proposed by me is the Stamp), had primarily hindu-buddhist FM, because....)
    - Palembang Darussalam (allready there, and they are pissed off with their Sriwijayan neighbours, even when they share soo much unit... the historians insist that they are SEPARATE entity that coexisted, later they become large kingdom....)
    - Pakuan Pajajaran (Yeah, the Ganesha symbol is ok)
    - Bintara Jawi (rather than too generic "Kasultanan Jawi", the symbol is ok)
    - Nagari Majapahit (all is ok)
    - Portugal (all is ok, but the unit is revamped again.... not just porting out M2TW damn....)

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  23. #113
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Ok, so our recent addition of real history students (for doing their own research and final project) on historical research front is both blessing and a "curse" as we now must working this mod seriously.

    Well, I suggest to doing some restructurisation and keeping our ORG side, to get a better shape, because the "real historians" are allready taking the historical research project.

    How about that wolf? which position that we shall appoint (outside the historical research, because you allready told me that I was the historical research coordinator and real world public relations). While the map is almost complete now, and your ill intentioned attempt to fill flaming pigs vs elephant footballers as unit list is terminated now. Heheheh, so you must work seriously now wolf...
    Angkara Murka di Macapada

  24. #114
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Well, yeah, just waiting GSS to confirm this, and I'll start a new, more serious thread about this at the forge.

    My Projects : * Near East Total War * Nusantara Total War * Assyria Total War *
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  25. #115
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Don't forget to round up all the interested member and confirming them
    Angkara Murka di Macapada

  26. #116
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Wolf? GSS? What are you doin? I'm fed up with overseeing historians... and you two didn't work a lot like me....
    Angkara Murka di Macapada

  27. #117
    U14 Footballer Member G. Septimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Quote Originally Posted by Sonic View Post
    Wolf? GSS? What are you doin? I'm fed up with overseeing historians... and you two didn't work a lot like me....
    U said we were going to make a new Thread???
    where is it????
    x2


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  28. #118
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Well, you are the one who must work with teh historians directly because you are the one who knows some of them personally

    If you can create something with sotosop as I do, I'll switch with you...

    My Projects : * Near East Total War * Nusantara Total War * Assyria Total War *
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    Also known as SPIKE in TWC

  29. #119
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    Sonic is finally finished his Unit Balancing & cost calculating sheet (taking consideration of that day's cost of life, maintaining the arms cost, distance, wage rate, and many more thingies that I didn't understand - and with sleeping in my room for two night only for doing that calculation, with all his yellowish books, well, this sheet isn't finished yet, and I didn't quite understand, what it was for... all the numbers and rupiah refrences on paper, but at least, I want to shown his unit list and some of our EDU)

    Well, at least our historian team (aside from some who refuse to work with us after knowing that leader is me...), doing their job rather nicely (well, so almost all the historians who works with us (3 students)) are either Sonic's friend, or woman.....

    Put your hopes high comrades! We're now working in our best pace!

    EDIT: removed the attachments, posted the newer version w cav balance on my last post
    Last edited by Cute Wolf; 01-20-2010 at 04:35.

    My Projects : * Near East Total War * Nusantara Total War * Assyria Total War *
    * Watch the mind-blowing game : My Little Ponies : The Mafia Game!!! *

    Also known as SPIKE in TWC

  30. #120
    Member Member Rahwana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nusantara : Total War

    At least, one job of creating a wholesale calculation about what they eat, what the price of weapons, what size of their families, and what their background wealth for infantry is finished..... Thank you for two day's food wolf
    Angkara Murka di Macapada

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