cant help it but i REALLY like that "the last legion" one...
total crap in historical terms but nice movie still
cant help it but i REALLY like that "the last legion" one...
total crap in historical terms but nice movie still
Gott mit dir, dem Bayernvolke,
Daß wir unsrer Väter wert,
fest in Eintracht und in Friede
bauen unseres Glückes Herd;
Daß der Freund da Hilfe finde,
Wehrhaft uns der Gegner schau,
Wo die Rauten-Banner wehen,
Unsre Farben – Weiß und Blau!
Although quite silly, but I also have to admit The last Legion's story has some appeal to me.
An old legion from the high empire emerges out of thin air in the last days of empire to save Rome from destruction, or even restore her to former glory, what a dream.
Maybe one day I will try to play a mod set in late empire like IB or IB II, but unfortunately they don't give me a Roman anti-reform to convert those poor soldiers back into the legions of Trajan...
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from Hannibal Khan the Great, Brennus, Tellos Athenaios, and Winsington III.
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I don't know if 1066 has been mentioned but its battle sequences stroke me as depicted quite accurately.
.
Last edited by Mouzafphaerre; 09-10-2010 at 16:21. Reason: link corrected
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Mouzafphaerre is known elsewhere as Urwendil/Urwendur/Kibilturg...
.
If they produced historically accurate films for every movie set in the past then everybody would be complaining that they were nothing but six hour snorefests that only about a half dozen anal retentive types would actually enjoy.
I think the main problem with hollywood though is that they believe the film going public is stupid,which is not the case,or that many studios do not want to put out the money to do historically accurate "niche" movies for little or no return on their investment
The bottom line is that people go to the theater to be entertained and to escape for a couple hours,not to be given history lessons.
The best case is when people go to see a movie like Gladiator,or The Patriot,or 300 that the movie actually gets them interested enough in the subject to learn more about it.
to be fair if the movies where entirelly historical accurate they would be named documentaries ... altough alot of errors do piss me off like the wrong type of swords being used (there just aren´t enough kontos in the herculean 50´s films)
Here is my take on this issue.
I think trying to define historical accuracy of any period is problematic for several reasons. The biggest reason, and the most applicable one to this debate, is that films are in and of themselves historical sources. Films made today, or yesterday, or 10 years ago, or even 10 years from now all come out of a social, cultural, and historical context. In this regard, the films, whether they depict events in the past, present, or future, are really depicting mentalities and values that people like today.
There are of course going to be a few that will stand out in various ways, and that do depict things in differing views. Combine with this the challenges in knowing anything, "exactly" from any time period as many historians are limited to a few documents, by a few people, or a few archaeological sites, in a few places. Out of this, one cannot gain "perfect" truth, so as far as I watch films, I see them as interpretations of events through the lens of the present.
With that perspective all films become historically accurate, but not necessarily to the time period presented.
When me and my dad saw Saving Private Ryan he said that the D-Day landing was the most realisic depiction of combat he ever saw and this was coming from someone who saw combat in 1968..or almost a quarter century latter.
So take from that what you will.
The most interseting part,at least from my perspective,was after they broke out of the beach and were moving up through a trench and dudes were getting dropped and everyone else was moving past them like nothing happened even if they got shot right in front of them..He said thats what they were trained to do and i thought it was heartless and he said i wouldnd't understand but you don't stop until you take your objective no matter what even if it was your best bud hit in front of you.
Yeah, the soldier's is a tough life...
My great grandpa used to say that the people who think just for a sec die...
It's all about training and the instinct it develops...
Last edited by Arjos; 09-14-2010 at 12:10.
On the other hand, Robin Hood was not only totally historically innacurate, but also innacurate to the Robin Hood story. D-Day naval invasions of Britain, the defense against which is led by some peasant and a woman, and King Richard was just killed? totally innacurate on every end of the spectrum.
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Correct, at first he said he would repay the Crusaders the same way as they'd done in in 1099. Then Balian gave his monologue about how they'd burn the Dome of the Rock to the ground and kill every man, woman and child and all the Saracen captives (5,000 in total). At that point, Saladin discussed with his advisors, and he gave the Christians free passage if every man would pay 10 dinars, every woman 5 and every child (of both sexes) 2 dinars. If they would not pay (and not leave), they'd be sold into slavery. Balian proceeded to ransom all the poor for a total amount of 30,000 dinars, to which Saladin complied.Saladin didn't just let the people of Jerusalem leave.
It has to be said though, that after the Bishop of Jerusalem had left with all the treasure, and some people were unable to leave the city, Saladin, his brother, and his brother in-law paid for the free passage of those people out of their own treasury.
This space intentionally left blank.
just watched two more eastern and not really EB timeframe movies: "Red Cliff" and "Legend of goemon"
first was actually quite nice tho it reminded me a lot of the illias with the company of heroes/lords/generals and the camera tracks where ... "exotic" maybe that's just my western opinion. for a layman the armor and equipment looked ok although I doubt the battle really worked the way shown in the movie.
second one actually beat 300 in anachronisms and well pretty much every other field there is. I was actually only slightly annoyed(chinese uniforms, egytian style pandoras box, untill Nobunaga showed up in a red full plate armor and a double bladed double sided sword, funnily he later stood infront of a gothic window. by then I could ignore the gatling cannons and stromtrooper samurai and ...
not to mention the extreme jumpyness we often see in japanese media which(combined with the sword cult) surpassed Star wars in every way. I really wonder why they added a guardrail to the "bottomless pit".
has anyone else seen the two?
"Who fights can lose, who doesn't fight has already lost."
- Pyrrhus of Epirus
"Durch diese hohle Gasse muss er kommen..."
- Leonidas of Sparta
"People called Romanes they go the House"
- Alaric the Visigoth
Red Cliff was pretty ridiculous in a totally awesome way. Doesn't really even follow the Romance of the Three Kingdoms that well either.
Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.
"Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009
Kingdom of Heaven was terrible in terms of historical accuracy (Ottoman renaissance armoury, saber wielding Saracens...), as was Gladiator and Robin Hood (Cate Blanchett is wearing a Sallet!)
@representation of Rome in Gladiator: Too clean and white. HBO's Rome is more accurate, painted temples, mud and graffitti.
Thing thats sucks about 90% of historical war movies is the unrealistic representation of armour. Yeah they spent a fortune to wear heavy armour that gets piercing by everything like its made of paper...
My list of accurate Films:
Flesh+Blood (About Landsknechts)
Alatriste (Most accurate depiction of warfare, weaponry, armour and clothing of such an early time since Cromwell)
Cromwell
Master and Commander (Unbelievable, an expansive hollywood movie thats accurate even in tiny details!)
Barry Lyndon
"This Declares likewise to all Laborers, or such as are called Poor people, that they shall not dare to work for Hire, for any Landlord, or for any that is lifted up above others; for by their labours, they have lifted up Tyrants and Tyranny; and by denying to labor for Hire, they shall pull them down again." - William Everard
what exactly do you mean with ridiculous? the story which was really quite far off history at least from what the wiki article states or the equipment? I'm a total noob on Chinese non treasure fleet navy so I don't have a clue about the accuracy of the ships whereas the armor looked at least somewhat plausible(unlike goemon). The tactics did not at all look very accurate but I'm no expert on chinese military.
mhhh more movies to check, YAY!
"Who fights can lose, who doesn't fight has already lost."
- Pyrrhus of Epirus
"Durch diese hohle Gasse muss er kommen..."
- Leonidas of Sparta
"People called Romanes they go the House"
- Alaric the Visigoth
I think a main problem with modern "Crusade" movies are that they are made for todays audience.
They fall into the same trap as my high school history teacher did teaching about the colonization of the Americas when she said it was based upon the 3 G's..Gold,Glory and God.
They use the most current socially acceptable and politically correct "interpration" of history.
Instead of looking at events in the context of history they look at them from the context of today.
Just my two cents.
Story.
Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.
"Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009
no for me ;)
"Who fights can lose, who doesn't fight has already lost."
- Pyrrhus of Epirus
"Durch diese hohle Gasse muss er kommen..."
- Leonidas of Sparta
"People called Romanes they go the House"
- Alaric the Visigoth
reviewed the thread and i can't believe all the praise for saving private ryan.
ugh
i'm not going to start typing up all the inaccuracies with that film, but let me just say that they are GLARING and NUMEROUS. right down from typical hollywood fantasy endings with tiger tanks to the mindnumbingly poor tactical choices (why they couldn't just write a better plot defies me) and the general poor performance of hardened german soldiers.... who knows. good flick though, if pretty dated by now. wtf beach were they supposed to be landing at? ugh, so bothersome.
but anyway.
yeah the stormtrooper effect really makes a move take longer but is silly every time ;)
on the revived thread:
just watched "timeline" again and igronring all the obvious historical inaccuracies and stuff but wha reall made me laugh was that when the 100years war specialists(4 americans and one frenchman) get caught by the english they claim to be scots (and the french guy admits he's french duh! ) I mean c'mon!
I'm not an expert on anglo french relations
nor the 100year war
nor the 14th and 15th century
BUT I know that at all possible occasions the french were allied with the scots or at least sided with them against the English so why on earth did they have to claim that?!?!?! sure claiming you're scottish is rather smart confronted a french army but not when captured by the english.
why could they not simply say they're Welsh, or even english with their burgundian interpreter as burgundy was allied with england(at least it is in AoK :D )
a silly movie
"Who fights can lose, who doesn't fight has already lost."
- Pyrrhus of Epirus
"Durch diese hohle Gasse muss er kommen..."
- Leonidas of Sparta
"People called Romanes they go the House"
- Alaric the Visigoth
What do you guys think of Joan of Arc movie? I mean the better one with Leelee Sobieski as Joan and Neil Patrick Harris as dauphin. (I hope I don't mention it second time in this thread)
my balloons
I like it several times better than the other one by Milla Jovovich [where, it seems to me, she was portrayed as a psychologically disturbed person] nor the old one with the Swedish actress what's-her-name. Not one of the three appears historically accurate to me, though. Hawooh.
"Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent." ~Salvor Hardin
This did occur a few times apart from Roman invasions...the battle of portsmouth harbour circa 500Ad was one of the first post Rome
http://nestmitchtri.blogspot.com/200...h-harbour.html
and after this the danes were all over us like a bad rash
Not saying it is accurate but....
Saving Private Ryan was good not because of its historical accuracy, but because of the fact that it showed the war in a more dramatic, gory and realistic way than most Hollywood movies do. To be honest, I don't really care about the film itself nor can I remember its plot. I do, however, remember the Omaha beach landing scene pretty well. This is how I think war should be presented in the movies. I don't know about you, but I hate pretentious and "heroic" films with pathetic battle scenes filled with slow motion effects, Spartan-like endurance of the "good" soldiers and idealised behaviour. Sometimes Hollywood can really kill movie themes with great potential. So much boring and unrealistic crap has been produced about Vietnam that nobody is bothered about this topic anymore.
Don't know if this one has been mentioned before, The Crusades: Crescent and the Cross . One of the best documentaries I've seen. Historically accurate AFAIK and some good actors, like the one who plays William of Tyre. Constantinople and Alexios Komnenos however look very Persian, don't know if that is too accurate.
Last edited by Skullheadhq; 07-06-2011 at 09:47.
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And what about The Medici: Godfathers of the Renaissance?
"When the candles are out all women are fair."
-Plutarch, Coniugia Praecepta 46
Nasty grimy renaissance authenticity.
Absolutely loved it, stylish stylish movie.
Wasn't there a bit of lore-rape? Not too bad as entertainment though.
Yeah but the comment about snooefest was apposite, this one took ages. great bit of film making for realism and cinematography and it was even true to the book more or less..which was alos a bit boring.
I like your taste though, I must have a look at Cromwell.
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