Nigel Farage's speech in the Euro Parliament

[Beskar]

if you want monetary union, you need political union, to justify a transfer union.

"we're one big family, we're in this together, of course we'll support uncle bob when he's having a hard time"

without that the euro, as currently constituted and populated, is a dangerous idiocy.

I told you we agree.

[Furunculus]

I told you we agree.

quite, now find me successful referenda from the peoples of all 27 nations agreeing to a common economic government, a transfer union to bring other 'regions' up to the competitiveness of places like germany, and a common foriegn policy on all substantial issues between all parties.

you didn't answer the question last time, and you can't this time either.

[Beskar]

quite, now find me successful referenda from the peoples of all 27 nations agreeing to a common economic government, a transfer union to bring other 'regions' up to the competitiveness of places like germany, and a common foriegn policy on all substantial issues between all parties.

you didn't answer the question last time, and you can't this time either.

I would create one, this is after I invested the time and effort in designing the structural framework to allow such an union to happen. No point voting yes when you haven't got the product developed to a degree so people can realistically vote "yes" on such a framework.

As unfortunate as it is, I do not run the European Union.

[Louis VI the Fat]

"we're one big family, we're in this together, of course we'll support uncle bob when he's having a hard time"

without that the euro, as currently constituted and populated, is a dangerous idiocy.

Up to two years ago the Irish enjoyed the highest standard of living in the Union, behind Luxembourg. Big cars, parties, second homes.

Meanwhile, a German could no longer afford to holiday in Ireland. Too expensive for tax-paying European citizens.

Then the Irish pyramid collapsed. Irish irresponsiblity and greed endangered the currency of Europe. This is not a game, Europe is not a casino. This is our pensions, our financial stability. Europe doesn't need irrsponsible crooks playing Europe like a casino. Like an infite ATM machine.

They partied, they had all the fun, they spend like crazy. At the expense and at the risk of the - less wealthy! - other Europeans. Now the gamble has become undone. The European taxpayer, who has worked and saved all these years, must send these savings as a loan, tens of billions of euros, to rescue his currency.

What should Europe do? Send free money? In that case, I know what I would do if I were in charge of a small country. I'd take the gamble too, risk it all. Ten years of fun, free money for me and my friends, and when the music stops, the bill is for Europe.
Therefore there must be some stern conditions to a bailout. Or else it will be an open invitation for others to take our pensions and gamble with them in a casino.


Ireland will now have to return to the income level of, what?, 2002, 2003? That's all.

[Furunculus]

I would create one, this is after I invested the time and effort in designing the structural framework to allow such an union to happen. No point voting yes when you haven't got the product developed to a degree so people can realistically vote "yes" on such a framework.

As unfortunate as it is, I do not run the European Union.

once again you neglect the part where this is a representative democracy peopled with citizens who have willingly consented to be ruled from brussels, why does this always escape you? is it because you know best?

Up to two years ago the Irish enjoyed the highest standard of living in the Union, behind Luxembourg. Big cars, parties, second homes.

Meanwhile, a German could no longer afford to holiday in Ireland. Too expensive for tax-paying European citizens.

Then the Irish pyramid collapsed. Irish irresponsiblity and greed endangered the currency of Europe. This is not a game, Europe is not a casino. This is our pensions, our financial stability. Europe doesn't need irrsponsible crooks playing Europe like a casino. Like an infite ATM machine.

They partied, they had all the fun, they spend like crazy. At the expense and at the risk of the - less wealthy! - other Europeans. Now the gamble has become undone. The European taxpayer, who has worked and saved all these years, must send these savings as a loan, tens of billions of euros, to rescue his currency.

What should Europe do? Send free money? In that case, I know what I would do if I were in charge of a small country. I'd take the gamble too, risk it all. Ten years of fun, free money for me and my friends, and when the music stops, the bill is for Europe.
Therefore there must be some stern conditions to a bailout. Or else it will be an open invitation for others to take our pensions and gamble with them in a casino.


Ireland will now have to return to the income level of, what?, 2002, 2003? That's all.

i'm sorry louis, i'm not sure how this answers the diagnosis that there is no common people to accept a common discipline, not too the prognosis that the Eurozone as currently constituted and populated, is a dangerous idiocy.......?

[Louis VI the Fat]

i'm sorry louis, i'm not sure how this...

I answered to the point that in 'one big family, one takes care of one another'.

There is a rationale behind the conditions of the bailout, behind the interest rate. In that light, the interest rate is still quite low.

That is because there is another mechanism at work. The other side of the coin. Which is, that it is not 'Ireland' which partied, and it is not 'Ireland' which must foot the bill now. It were the wealthy Irish and their foreign friends who made billions, and the ordinary Irishman who must pay the bill now. Most Irish never saw a whole lot of the money to begin with. Now, it has disappeared into the hands of a few. The bill is for the others.

This is the tragedy behind the bailout. Any condition that punishes, seeks retribution, hits the wrong people. In effect, the bondholders and the politicians are holding the Irish people ransom. Are making Europe complicit in the robbery of them.


WHEN WILL THE DEATH PENALTY BE REINSTATED IM SICK OF THIS HANG SOME BONDHOLDERS AND SPECULATORS ALREADY

[InsaneApache]

If you restore the death penalty you'd have to leave the EU.

It seems that Beskar doesn't like democracy that much. All those pesky peasants voting the wrong way, what, what. Pip pip.

[Vladimir]

If you restore the death penalty you'd have to leave the EU.

It seems that Beskar doesn't like democracy that much. All those pesky peasants voting the wrong way, what, what. Pip pip.

I wonder if his water is blue.

[Beskar]

I wonder if his water is blue.

Depends on what it is reflecting.

[Furunculus]

Mervyn Kings own moment of fame from the wiki-leaks revelations:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...e-Osborne.html

“Leaders in Germany and France have recognised that allowing monetary union to happen without corresponding political cohesion was a mistake and one that needed to be rectified.”

A stupid, dumb, ridiculous political project sparked by ideological idiocy, that should never have been borne into this world.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Mervyn Kings own moment of fame from the wiki-leaks revelations:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...e-Osborne.html

“Leaders in Germany and France have recognised that allowing monetary union to happen without corresponding political cohesion was a mistake and one that needed to be rectified.”

A stupid, dumb, ridiculous political project sparked by ideological idiocy, that should never have been borne into this world.

I am not sure you are not reading something else into this. Not the monetary union is the mistake. The mistake is a monetary union without corresponding policial union. Rectifying this mistake means not to abolish the monetary union, but to deepen the political cohesion. That is what he expects to happen, and this is what is revealed in the leaked cable.

Mervyn King, the governor of the Bank of England, believes political cohesion will accelerate because of the crisis:

Other cables disclosed that Mr King believes the economic crisis among eurozone countries will accelerate political union.

The Governor told US diplomats: “Leaders in Germany and France have recognised that allowing monetary union to happen without corresponding political cohesion was a mistake and one that needed to be rectified.”

Let's hope he'll be proven right!


Although I disagree it was a mistake. We have known all along that the single currency is one step of a project, that should lead to more tax harmonisation, economic integration, and political cohesion. In boom times, governments have the luxury of postponing reform. Now there shall have to be structural reforms in a crisis atmosphere. But then, that's customary.

[Furunculus]

I am not sure you are not reading something else into this. Not the monetary union is the mistake. The mistake is a monetary union without corresponding policial union. Rectifying this mistake means not to abolish the monetary union, but to deepen the political cohesion. That is what he expects to happen, and this is what is revealed in the leaked cable.

Mervyn King, the governor of the Bank of England, believes political cohesion will accelerate because of the crisis:

Other cables disclosed that Mr King believes the economic crisis among eurozone countries will accelerate political union.

The Governor told US diplomats: “Leaders in Germany and France have recognised that allowing monetary union to happen without corresponding political cohesion was a mistake and one that needed to be rectified.”

Let's hope he'll be proven right!


Although I disagree it was a mistake. We have known all along that the single currency is one step of a project, that should lead to more tax harmonisation, economic integration, and political cohesion. In boom times, governments have the luxury of postponing reform. Now there shall have to be structural reforms in a crisis atmosphere. But then, that's customary.

no, i get that, as said to Beskar some hours ago:

Germany's rules based system now being implemented would work without the PIIGS, but as constituted with all 17 (18?) members it can only EVER work with political union to justify that transfer union and regulatory harmony required of a monetary union.

until you have a mandate for that political union, or the periphery leaves it's a stupid, dumb, ridiculous political project sparked by ideological idiocy, that should never have been borne into this world!

well good luck with that political union, brussels has already turned ireland and greece into satrapies, and generated the loathing of moderate europhiles such as GC, in a couple of months you can add portugal to that list, and then spain.

i always said that ever-deeper-union would lead to a more remote and more authoritarian EU, i didn't realise it would start to happen so soon!

EUSSR FTW.

[Vladimir]

Just give the regional governors direct control over their territories.