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Thread: The psychology of Total War gamming.

  1. #31
    Rolluplover Member Kocmoc's Avatar
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    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    Well, there are tons of things which could be improved.
    Alone the fact, that there is are no supplies in this game at all cut off a the whole "partisan" thing. If you bring this in, you had a lot more harassing. Im sure, that you would see a lot more activity on attack supplies, than real big battles.

    This said, there is a clear idea behind this, simply as that would kinda kill the initial idea of the great battles. I could go on, but everyone with some phantasy can imagine himself...

    I think that MP and SP sit in the same boot. At the end it has just some flaws which hardly can be adjust with the 10 year old basic TW-system.
    If you look at the different ideas behind the campaign and the online battle you actual will see why it is like this.

    In every TW game you increase the buildings, build more and more to get "new" and better units. This units has to be better, to give you something back. Thats a logic step if you think about the idea of an campaign. So while the MP ask for balance within all units, the MP dont really want such a balance. If you spent time and more money on newer units, you want something in return!

    The problem is here since many years, the solution is easy and is obvious, but never really got on the road.
    We need 2 different unit-setups.

    MP and SP never will focus on the same aspects, thats the nature of the different likings of those people.
    This isnt bad at all, its just a little bit more difficult to deal with for CA.
    We shouldnt look for things we can use or do together, we should look, how we can clearly divide those both parts.

    Cut it, and give the SP what they want and the SP what they want.
    The most fun i had at the time, as the units did run smooth, had very low bugs, the units did follow my orders... and the game was balanced, with a lower amount of units.
    The more units we have, the harder it is to balance it.

    I miss the focus on the most important aspects of the game: Gameplay, balance, good connections, no drops, a good amount of bugfree maps...

    There are so many ways to improve this game, but as long units run somewhere on the map, just not where i want them, as long people crash or drop from the game all the day,
    as long i give orders and the game just dont react.... as long those things are not solved, i dont care for better grafic, beautiful siege game, fire-arrows or shadows....
    All those vids I saw the last weeks/months are just eyecandy and nothing of this do work or solve on the wellknown problems.


    All in all, we speak here since months now, waiting once again for a game which most likely will disappoint many of us.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Senior Member Tomisama's Avatar
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    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    You English is great ;)

    And your observations are spot-on.

    Two games is really the only answer.

    One: Maybe a single player version for every era sold alone (always a market for this).

    Two: And a separate Total War Multiplayer SE (special edition) game, with add-on DLC unit packages and maps sold every time a new SP game is released. This would enable the same MP engine to be honed and perfected over time, and a never ending revenue from MPers adding new eras and armies.

    The hardest thing for us to remember is that for CA there is a bottom line, they have to make money, or no matter how great the ideas are, they won’t get done.

    My personal frustration is knowing that TW multiplayer started as an add-on and has never been promoted for its own sake. Every survey reinforces the notion that it would not be worth the effort, but the rating are skewed because there was no investment in the first place to drive the market for TW multiplayer. The overall market for multiplayer games is off the chart, but the development TW games never changes because it is safer to stick with what you have always had success with.

    That is a sound business policy and should be followed, but that does not mean that a new line of specifically multiplayer games can not be started. Most of the work is already done in SP, all that is needed is a new arm of MP specialists to develop the separate game.

    The two games could be sold separately or in combo (for a slightly better price than they are getting now). And once the MP version is sold to any player, there is the potential for sales of previous era game DLC (who use the same engine), that could bring in even more money.

    I believe the potential for multiplayer TW games (if developed properly) would soon out strip single player sales (with out loosing those sales), and we would all be the better for it.
    Last edited by Tomisama; 02-02-2011 at 20:56.
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  3. #33

    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    That is an interesting idea. Since we are seeing the death of LAN play for new pc titles, and you need to have an umbilical cord to the Internet, I think the winning sell there might be SaaS. A subscription based service for online multiplayer support.

    Since they are already up to nearly a title every year now, focus on implementing some sort of nerfed online campaigns, for different ages. Give support for single battles, add historical scenarios and update with new ones every so often. That covers all your multiplayer support. I know I'd probably be sucked into an annual subscription for $20-30 yearly...a reasonable month to month would definitely suck me in.

    No, I don't think they will do it, but that would be pretty cool. What do you think?

  4. #34
    Senior Member Senior Member Fisherking's Avatar
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    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    @ Tomisama


    I think that if we are looking for achievable goals we are not going to see a developer do two games.


    Balanced units for competitive head to head play and maps should be obtainable, however.


    If they are moving toward online campaigns it would require more of the historical dynamics of unit strengths and weaknesses to meet broader player expectations.

    Any game purporting to portray Historical eras or events needs to exhibit some of the flavor of the time and tactical advantages between units is more or less the essence of that depiction.


    Two unit sets with the ability to select the set in play might be more achievable.

    I just don’t see a sufficient economic return on two tailored games, even though the current model doesn’t make anyone happy.

    Or is what you propos simply a MP engine where any units could be loaded and played with only a basic change of skins & stats?
    Last edited by Fisherking; 02-03-2011 at 12:07.


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  5. #35
    Rolluplover Member Kocmoc's Avatar
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    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    Well, one first step could be, to come up with 2 different unit-setups. Same units but different stats.
    While the stats for SP should be reflect the tech-tree in the campaign and therefore have imbalances, the stats for MP should have same units (maybe some less) but balanced stats.

    I think, that this would already give us a huge improvement in gameplay.


    Another word to the onlinecampaigns, i saw many people asking for it for many years and as we finally got it, its not really used at all.
    There are many reason for it. One thing is the time, it takes you too much time to play it and if you always need opponents who have the same free time, else you cant play on.
    Every successful online game has a quick way to get you into the action (let mmos out here).
    I see the time curve as the major problem with TW online gaming, this would be a good thing to ask people for it: "How much time you need till you got a game running in average?"

    I remember many times, where it took really long to get a game, people come in and leave or got kicked...
    Especially if you want to play 3v3 or 4v4... its really hard. If you now imagine, that your the first guy who get ripped and just "played" 5-10 mins.... well, thats another disaster.

    Just look at other good games, there you get really quick into the action and have some fun.


    In my opinion should CA focus a lot more on the functionality, again, the basics has to be done in the first place.


    Koc

  6. #36
    Senior Member Senior Member Tomisama's Avatar
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    Default Re: The psychology of Total War gamming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisherking View Post
    Or is what you propos simply a MP engine where any units could be loaded and played with only a basic change of skins & stats?
    This was more of what I had in mind. Plus some things that we don’t have now for multiplayer, that could then be developed by a small team focused on enhancing and expanding the services available to the MP community.

    Every year when they come out with a new game, they would also make a new MP DLC package available. Since all packages from all eras are run on the same base engine, you would then own a collectable selection of eras to play at any time.

    Along with this would be a server based match-maker data base, that would allow you to program in your availability times, and the match-maker would present your match desires to others programming same availability parameters for cross conformation for scheduling, and having the game you want (or your team wants).

    Other MP enhancements mentioned here and on other on other org forums could include streamed in process game data, to provide the ability for audiences to be able to watch (or record for later or from archive) live global game tourneys developed around the service.

    Advancement in recorded replay viewing, like time code selectable review (forward and reverse) to see and study the action, would improve everyone’s game. And local and global competitions would drive desire to do so.

    For multiplayer gamers of almost any stripe, the ability to watch a favorite team play in a 4v4 international prize tournament would be great entertainment. Maybe even worth the price of owning the MP version of the game, just to be able to watch.

    I wish you could all see the extensive preparation that goes into these big tournament games, and the results can be as exciting as any sporting event. And these are people you know, and can play with yourself, unlike other sporting events.

    It is all very possible and doable now. You just have to have the faith of Dave of Wendy’s restaurant chain, when he said “Build it and they will come.”, and give it a shot.

    Good Luck All!!!
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