HAMELEONA & ASGAROTH'S WORKSHOP

[Hamata]

Liking those carthiginian sheilds asgaoroth keep it up

[Magneto]

New screenie:



Didn´t implent the other units till now. Sorry, but I have some time problems.

I had now half an hour time, and I´m going now to a very important table-tennis game. It will decide whether we advance (this means we move up a liga, right?) or not.

Wish me luck, plz.

[Asgaroth]

They look nice in my opinion,but it look's like something is wrong with their helmet,from the first unit....

When you make screens of the rest two units I have made then I will start working more.

I wish you the best of luck in your advance in the upper league !

[Magneto]

They look nice in my opinion,but it look's like something is wrong with their helmet,from the first unit....

When you make screens of the rest two units I have made then I will start working more.

I wish you the best of luck in your advance in the upper league !

So, didn´t went that well yesterday, but we have managed to keep a chance for advancing. If we win the next game clearly, we can still do it. :)

Here is a screen of the samnites, don´t mind their weird standing inside of their horses - I assigned the wrong skeleton. Its fixed now, but I am too lazy to make a new screenshot :P I included the files aswell. Copy descr_model_battle and export_descr_units in the data folder, and the file "HRTW", where I placed all your textures, in data/models_unit.

Then you can see ingame what you still have to change and what looks good. Btw, yes, the Helmet of the above unit is wrong. The "plumes?" are pitch black.



Desktop.7z

[Hamata]

lol i have had that same problem too.the way i fixed it is to give the unit the calvary skeleton while it is unmounted then give it a mount :D

[Magneto]

lol i have had that same problem too.the way i fixed it is to give the unit the calvary skeleton while it is unmounted then give it a mount :D

No. I really just assigned the wrong skeleton, i.e. the unmounted spearmen skeleton instead of the mounted version. Happens if you are tired.

[Asgaroth]

Btw, yes, the Helmet of the above unit is wrong. The "plumes?" are pitch black.

....They are dark blue not black.

The unit on the first screen.The one in front with the dark blue shield should be a swordsmen.You have put the texture for the wrong unit.That texture is for hastati,not poeni infantry.So give the texture to hastati and disable the throwing pilums they throw before charging...

SO :

UNIT_POENI_INFANTRY....Is for hastati.They are swordsmen and disable the throwing pilum....GIVE THE NAME TO THE UNIT-POENI SWORDSMEN,so that no mistakes or missunderstandment are made again.

UNIT_POENI_PHALANGITES.....is for Poeni Infantry-For the unit that was in rtw the phalangite one...The have a different chainmail a look more heavy armored now.

After you fix this,post the screens and I will make more units....Thank you !

If anythig is unclear just ask and I will try to,ake it more cleare to you.

[Magneto]

....They are dark blue not black.

The unit on the first screen.The one in front with the dark blue shield should be a swordsmen.You have put the texture for the wrong unit.That texture is for hastati,not poeni infantry.So give the texture to hastati and disable the throwing pilums they throw before charging...

SO :

UNIT_POENI_INFANTRY....Is for hastati.They are swordsmen and disable the throwing pilum....GIVE THE NAME TO THE UNIT-POENI SWORDSMEN,so that no mistakes or missunderstandment are made again.

UNIT_POENI_PHALANGITES.....is for Poeni Infantry-For the unit that was in rtw the phalangite one...The have a different chainmail a look more heavy armored now.

After you fix this,post the screens and I will make more units....Thank you !

If anythig is unclear just ask and I will try to,ake it more cleare to you.

You have left me confused.

Could you then please just alway state the model I am supposed to use for the unit? I mean, it is always me guessing, but if you call a texture exactly like a model, I assume you want me to implent it on this model.

[Asgaroth]

UNIT_POENI_INFANTRY.....rename the file into UNIT_ROMAN_HASTATI_CARTHAGE...Disable the throwing pillum!..In the text files where you can change the unit's name,what it will be called ingame,name it Poeni swordsmen.

UNIT_POENI_PHALANGITES....rename the file into UNIT_POENI_INFANTRY....In the text files where you can change the unit's name,what it will be called ingame,name it Poeni Phalangites.


That should do it.


Tell me after you are done so that we can continue.

[hameleona]

So, yours truly has done some work at last. And in his divine wisdom (or love-infused madness) has a question with capital "Q".

Carthaginian phalangites? Honestly? The nation famous for their week line infantry?

And, just to show you, that I am NOT sleeping - i made screens for the Carthaginians:





Last one is the unmounted samnite cavalry. I do have a question here, too. Did the samnites even had anything different from light javelin armed cavalry?

And yes, i have some sort of PC to work on. But as i said it's going to be slow.

Now, i need Asgaroth to decide how many reforms the romans will have, and i think (yeah, i do that some times) we should stay with vanilla recruitment system for now. So if my luck is good, my publisher will pay me in advance, witch will make me do more writers work, but i'll be able to work from home.

I have been working on a model for the past week (see a whole week for just one model... used to be 2 hours). It's almost done. The texture is plain-basic, so don't really laugh much when i submit it.

I again post the full pack of models + textures for HRTW. I have renamed stuff, made stuff more clear. Hope you like it.
http://www.2shared.com/file/hU5ZSaXk/HRTW.html
See ya ;)

PS: We have more models than we need. I'll ask asgaroth to re-update the roman roster - i have just too much roman models for only pre-marian army (5 or so cavalry models is just wrong for the romans).

[Asgaroth]

Hy there friend.How are things ?

Did the samnites even had anything different from light javelin armed cavalry?

Yes.They had their own army and they were even quite powerful until the romans conquered them.After that they partly appeared in roman or carthaginian armies.

Carthaginian phalangites? Honestly? The nation famous for their week line infantry?

Yes.The Carthaginians did have phalanx units but the thing is that they didn't used them so often as the greeks and their army wasn't so oriented on the phalanx units as the macedonian or seleucid army...In our roaster they will have only two phalanx units.

First one is Liby-Phoenician phgalangites and the second is Sacred Band of Tanit.That is all.

Here you are a link of another game-0 A.D...Scroll down under the title Second Punic War and go to the fifth paragraph.

http://wildfiregames.com/0ad/page.php?p=10678

I'll ask asgaroth to re-update the roman roster

However the roasters are on the first page of this therad and the are re updated as we make units.

Leave the romans for now.We will do them last as they have to many things to do for them.The reforms will be vanilla.


In global,very nice work hameleona !

And don't worry how slow or fast are we.The most important is the intension to do something and by my word we will finish this mod.

[hameleona]

Hy there friend.How are things ?

Well, not bad, not great. I'm moving around in a bad mood today, but otherwise it's all ok :)

Yes.They had their own army and they were even quite powerful until the romans conquered them.After that they partly appeared in roman or carthaginian armies.

I do know that. The point is, that when i researched them for The Unification of Italy, i didn't find any proof of medium or heavy cavalry. Not to mention, that Italy as a whole is not famos

Yes.The Carthaginians did have phalanx units but the thing is that they didn't used them so often as the greeks and their army wasn't so oriented on the phalanx units as the macedonian or seleucid army...In our roaster they will have only two phalanx units.

First one is Liby-Phoenician phgalangites and the second is Sacred Band of Tanit.That is all.

I see... didn't really know that they had it. But even then, the Sacred Band was destroyed in 310BC. Just for my own interest - what is that new Sacred Band?
I do have some questions for carthage:
What iberian units will they use? Scutiarii? The vanilla Iberian infantry? Iberian Spearmen?
Also what numidian units will they use? Numidian Cavalry is there i suppose, but what about numidian infantry (as light javelin armed skirmishers)?
Baelric slingers?

No need to rush, but i feel in the mood of creating some units :lol:
(actually my gf has a lot of exams coming up and i can model, while she is studying ;) )
(so yeah, that means i need research)

I see, that for now we will have a basic vanilla overhaul, and then new factions. I like the idea of making a strong base, and then moving forward.

[Asgaroth]

Last night I was stuck with the campaign description for the Brutii,but I found out what was the problem.Now I have problem with the Senate faction,in other words the Bosporans and that is why I am slow.

I do know that. The point is, that when i researched them for The Unification of Italy, i didn't find any proof of medium or heavy cavalry. Not to mention, that Italy as a whole is not famos

I only found that they were used as cavalry units in Carthaginian army,which is reasonable because the Romans took away their homeland.

Just for my own interest - what is that new Sacred Band?

Sacred band of Tanit.

What iberian units will they use? Scutiarii? The vanilla Iberian infantry? Iberian Spearmen?

Half of the Carthaginian roaster is on the first page and it is already done.

The next unit in line to be made is the Celtic infantry :

And I will reskin or add something if necessary.

Model-Warband(Gaul)
Body-Principes
Shield-Nacked fanatics
Weapon-long sword(barbarian swordsmen-gaul)
Helmet-hastati(without feathers of course)

Scutiarii? The vanilla Iberian infantry?

Yes,Yes.About iberian spearmen I will think because 16 units maximum.

Also what numidian units will they use?

Numidian cavalry,numidian skirmishes and slingers they already have(we will just make their status better and change their name into Baeleric slingers)


Remember we are going step by step,but it will be done.I don't like to start 120 thing at once.So for now you can do the Celtic infantry unit,that is all.

[hameleona]

since Carthage is quite interesting faction, i suggest the following rooster chages (i have taken the DMB in account, so just think if you like the idea)

Units trained everywhere:
Town watch
Peltasts
Sacred Band of Tanit*
Poeni Phalangites*
Poeni swordsmen*

The units marked with * should cost more.

Iberian infantry
Scutarii
(those two are basically one and the same unit if i get the intention of Romes creators. Or the Iberian infantry is the analog of the Poeni swordsmen. Both ways - don't see a need for both)
Samnite Cavalry
Celtic Swordsmen
and all the other units that we think of, should be AOR. Cheaper than the Poeni ones, but limited from the AOR (so that we don't have Scutarii recruited in Thebes)

Since Chartage used many mercs, it won't be a problem to make them a lot of AOR units for them.

Starting the Celtic Swordsmen now. Hope i'll post screens later. :)

[Asgaroth]

those two are basically one and the same

No.

Scutarii are scutarii and iberian infantry should be the synonime for iberian caetrati,search a bit on the net and you will find the picture OR go to my profile into albums and you will see a bunch of carthaginian units I have put there for you,but something went wrong and I don't know if it works.Youu have the Celtic swordsmen also there.

since Carthage is quite interesting faction, i suggest the following rooster chages

I like the unit roaster,but it is half way done.I will post you the AOR units tomorrow as it is rather late now and you will tell me what you think.

Starting the Celtic Swordsmen now. Hope i'll post screens later. :)

No problem friend.We are going slow but nice !

[hameleona]

Slow and ugly is my signature from now on... i do not like them. Couldn't add the helmet to the normal infantry for some reason. So i had to work wit a crazy model of the chosen swordsmen. Everything OK, but re-texturing will be a (that B-word) and i have no idea how to add them lorica hamata. Not to mention the helmеt just didn't fit well.

Don't have much time to work today, so i think i will try the basic idea tomorrow. And who knows you may like them with the funny helmet and strange armor.





oh, yeah, and i have no damn idea if they will work in-game. Someone could test them... AFTER Asgaroth says his WOG (word of God ;)) for their future. I'm honest, friend. If you don't like them - say it, and i'll kill them without mercy. :lol:

have a nice night you all :)

PS: I actually forgot to give you a download link.
http://www.2shared.com/file/OLy-zBd2...swordsmen.html

PPS: About the iberian infantry:
I see. Technically they are just iberian light swordsmen. I would love to do them, when we come to them. If i get it right from the research they are armed with falca and javelin, helmet, round shield (caerta) and a round bronze peace on the torso. Interesting unit. I like them. :)

[Asgaroth]

They are awesome !...The look just like I have imagined them to be !...I will just retexture them,to give them Carthaginian colors.You don't need to kill them.

About the iberian infantry:

Did you managed to look at my album at the profile ?...I have all the pictures of the units there.

Yes.They are Iberian light infantry.I like that you like them.

Look take as much time as you need to make the units.I will do the scripting,text editing and 2D art. And Pharoah will do the banners and symbols as you can see.

Iberian roaster as I promised.So some factions will have up to 18 units(but not all of them,just some).Normaly they will have around 14-15.

THIS IS THE WHOLE ROASTER FOR CARTHAGE :

Iberian infantry
Scutarii
Slingers
Moorish slingers(AOR)
Mauretanian archers(AOR)
Archers
Libyan spearmen(AOR)
Numidian javelinmen(AOR)
Peltasts
Poeni phalangites
Sacred Band of Tanit
Celtic swordsmen
Poeni swordsme-heavy infyntry
Heavy cavalry(medium cavalry model-with square shield)
Round shield cavalry-light cavalry
Indian Elephant-will come instead Armored elephants-I alrady have that skin
African Elephants-The second elephants in size that can be recruited in rtw

[Hamata]

Shouldent there be a sacred band of ba'al? hered he had his own sacred band that fought in the style of greek hoplites

[Asgaroth]

We wil reame them to Ball although Tanit also had her Sacred band but Ball is better since he uis the god of War.

[hameleona]

They are awesome !...The look just like I have imagined them to be !...I will just retexture them,to give them Carthaginian colors.You don't need to kill them.

You have no idea how glad i am to read that. I like the model (after my initial frustration of its helmet).

I am sory to say, that i have no idea about what gallery you mentioned (or just the vodka in my head disturbs me), so link? Please? (puppy face)

Like the roster, by simple game-design point of view, the scutarii should be region-based (giving legion-like troops to a faction already having two phalanx units is a uber-combo). Same goes for celtic swordsmen, but i admit it's mostly couse i do not want to see celtic swordsmen recruited for Carthage in Thebes. The faction's units - ok. Foreigners come and import their culture and stile of warfare.

The only recruitment system in historical aspect, that is really different is the roman one. But lately i have come to realize, that Rome never really owned much territory, before the social war. They had allies, protectorates and stuff. So the logic is there - you TAKE a city, you plunder it, and then you import your citizen (or give citizenship to the locals).

But this however is not true for some units. All greeks used thracians, but they practically imported them. Or haired them as mercenaries. Yes, they could have levied Thracian warriors from thrace, but not from italy. I hope all that babel made sense.


So, i need another unit to do. And someone needs to test if the celtic swordsmen are going to appear in-game at all ;)

[Asgaroth]

So, i need another unit to do. And someone needs to test if the celtic swordsmen are going to appear in-game at all ;)

I will test them after I make all symbols and import them.Then I will focus more on the units.There are only three of us on the mod and it is hard to do 20 things at once.Especially if I have to study much.

I am sory to say, that i have no idea about what gallery you mentioned

No problem.I will post you a picture here.

Iberian infyntry

Same goes for celtic swordsmen, but i admit it's mostly couse i do not want to see celtic swordsmen recruited for Carthage in Thebes.

Well I agree with you.We can make them recruitable only in costal regions on Africa.For example-Carthage,Thapsus,Tingi and so on.Because it makes sense.They come on the ships to the cities to join Carthaginian armies.They will be also recruitable in whole : Iberia and Europe,but not in Africa-only the costal cities.How is that ?

you TAKE a city, you plunder it, and then you import your citizen (or give citizenship to the locals).

Can we even make that happen in the mod ?...It sounds very nice.

[hameleona]

Iberian infyntry
1. Treating them as light skirmishers or just as swordsmen?
Well I agree with you.We can make them recruitable only in costal regions on Africa.For example-Carthage,Thapsus,Tingi and so on.Because it makes sense.They come on the ships to the cities to join Carthaginian armies.They will be also recruitable in whole : Iberia and Europe,but not in Africa-only the costal cities.How is that ?
2. I think i get it, and i like it.
Can we even make that happen in the mod ?...It sounds very nice.
3. I do think so. Will be a lot of lines in the EDB. We will probably need 21 different barracks for the different factions... (yeah, i know it sucks, but i'll see what can i do about it) or leave the RTR recruitment CTD in play (when you right-click on a building in the building browser and then left click on the available units in it.) I personally don't use it, so i don't care much, but it's up to you. We can reduce the number of needed buildings to 1 per culture (roman, greek, barbarian, chartage, estern, nomad (if we keep it in play) + 1 free slot for now, witch i say we don't need to touch for now).

anyway its ether a lot of work (many Military Complex buildings (MICs)) or not so pretty (the description lines will be like in RTR). It will add +1/2/3 turns to the recruitment of faction-specific units, but otherwise it won't bug game-play much. But i'm set on one thing - only AOR units from your culture can be recruited if you migrate/give citizenship/absorb/whatever the region.

That is it for now, i think. I have good news - i now have my own PC, that could run RTW and 3ds max. Don't have much time tho, so i'll see how much i can do... maybe i'll import the units.

[hameleona]

OK, i have a lot of images of caetari (or whatever their name is):









With chartage, rebel and spain textures.

Like them?

[Asgaroth]

Like them?

Very nice and imaginative work.They are awesome

I can see that you have gave them a falcata-did you make it again in 3dsmax or ?

Next unit :

[hameleona]

about the falcata - Found it in one of the archive CD's with the spartan model. The rest is history as they say.
About the Scutari - didn't they wore helmets two?
Otherwise there is not much to do with the basic model, except to give it the falcata.

[Asgaroth]

Otherwise there is not much to do with the basic model, except to give it the falcata.

Ok.Give them the falcata

Found it in one of the archive CD's with the spartan model.

Didn't know that.Nice

didn't they wore helmets two?

Yes.They are heavy infantry ?


Make these three units if you can.

mooriah javelinmen


names on the picture.Out of the cavalrymen make round shield cavalry.

[hameleona]

Yes.They are heavy infantry ?

Those on your picture didn't had one, so i've asked.

The other three are easy, but good luck with the skintone of the mootiah javelinmen ;)

PS: Have you thought about the recruitment stuff i posted above?

[Asgaroth]

I am sorry I haven't seen your second post.

Iberian infyntry
1. Treating them as light skirmishers or just as swordsmen?

Swordsmen. Scutarii will have peltasts and swords,like in vanilla.

I think i get it, and i like it.

Ok.Then it is how will it be.

only AOR units from your culture can be recruited if you migrate/give citizenship/absorb/whatever the region.

I leave it up to you to decide what is best to do.

BUT-You must make that non AOR units are recruitable everywhere,I mean the faction's units,for example the iberian infantry.That is all.

You decide what is the best way to recruit units.Make it at your own taste,pleasure.

[hameleona]

Scutarii






I have no idea if i should give them the roman hastati/principi shield in place of the vanilla one. Have to see what shield did i give the HRTW hastati...

Didn't had rebel texture for the shield, so no rebel this time.

PS:
Lost almost a full hour to make the mooriah javelinmen and failed. There isn't even a distantly similar model in RTW, that i can use. And really, i don't get them? They are what? Desert javelinmen? Just didn't worked for me. I'll make something from ether the desert axemen or some other egyptian/libian/numidian unit.

[Hamata]

My ideas for the roman roster
Eqvetes counsalaras[early generals bodyguard]
Leves
Rorarii
Camilian Hastati
Camilian Princepes
Camilian Triarii[fights in hoplite style]
Eqvtes romani
Poblyian roster
Triarii[uses legionary scutum]
Veletes[forgot this one :P]
Ploybian hastati [uses sword instead of spear]
plyobian princepes
roman light calvary
Eqvetes romani[yet again :P]
Marian roster
Praetorian general
Ceasarin legionary cohort
legionary evotticaii[legionary vetrans[
Praetorian infantry cohort
Praetorian calvary
Agustan reforms
Named and numbered imperial legions


sorry for my bad latin.