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Thread: concerning the pope...

  1. #1

    Default concerning the pope...

    So far it is 1215 and the second crusade has just finished. I have tried to take part in it and its predecessor (as England) but when I try to get an army there most of them desert before I get to the straits of Gibraltar. In the First Crusade I kept sailing until I had 1 unit left. In the Second one, once I'd lost half of my men I turned my ships around. But as soon as I dropped the cross, all the rest of them (except the knights) decided to go on without me! (Maybe they then deserted themselves?)

    This whole thing leads to even more trouble for me though. You see, in the First Crusade the French got an army (made up of peasents, just like mine) to Jerusalem and took it. That got them in the Pope's good books and now, a Pope later, there are 3 French Cardinals in the Church and no English ones. France declared war and the Pope kept sending me orders not to attack the French. The French, however, still freely attacked me. Looks like the Holy Roman Empire were told the same; but they attacked France I think and were thrown out of the Church. Just this year the French asked for peace and I accepted, but I want to even this up a bit, so how do I? And if it is necessary, can I/how do I, er, remove the Frech Cardinals?

  2. #2
    Member Member demfl's Avatar
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    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    Once on the ships going to Jerusalem make sure you highlight all the ships "ctrl A" and sail them just short of the furthest the green allows, sometimes u will able to repeat , all the way to Africa. Honestly don't worry about desertion because once near Jerusalem u can recruit a boatload of unhorse knights and top of the line spearmen. I had the same problem as England but remember even if your General is the only one left you can recruit a full 19 stacks of superior troops like unhorse knight, crusade knight etc once on land directly in front of Jerusalem.


    I have never listened to the pope warnings. At the very start of the game you should've allied with the pope. After, you can moniter your relationship with him and gift him before and after attacking catholic factions, even with the warnings, i have never been excom with this message, only lose influence that is quickly gained back with a meagre 1000 florin. Learn the game mechanics.
    Last edited by demfl; 04-15-2012 at 05:25.

  3. #3

    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    By alliance with the Pope, do you mean with the Papal states? And what do you mean by gifts? (Money?) However my current problem is the French Cardinals, cause when one dies the other 2 will get another Frenchman elected, and even though my standing with the Pope is much higher than France's (I didn't realise the full extent of the uses building Churches) I was victorious in my last war with France and if I can cut off their support from the Pope they can remain a vassal state of my Allies (the Danish) without being any threat. So, is there a way I can deal with this situation? Hopefully because of the good standing with the Pope of myself and my allies we can seize a lot of power if I can rid myself of the French Cardinals

  4. #4
    Member Member demfl's Avatar
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    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    Yes, always form an alliance with the pope asap, he will always accept early if you aren't at war with anyone, even if you play as a Muslim faction. Yes you can gift the pope in increments of 100 florin, this will allow you to stay very high on the pope meter. The french pope won't matter if you keep your relations perfect with the new pope. Just make sure you have more crosses than the French.

  5. #5

    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    Problem is, the Pope currently thinks the light shines out of France's butcrack (they have full crosses) and he doesn't like me as much as the old one did (who also didn't like France and liked my allies as well) My diplomat is going to Italy now, hopefully I can even this out. Thanks for all the help man

  6. #6
    Strategist and Storyteller Moderator Myth's Avatar
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    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    On Crusades in vanilla:

    1. Always make sure to call the crusade yourself. You do that by bribing the pope with 3-4 thousand florins and giving him an alliance. As England I recommend crusading for Cordoba, as it's closer. Just prior to taking the target city you can have your generals back at home and their armies join. They will still get the traits and the armies will get the chevrons.
    2. Only you suffer desertion, the AI does not. To avoid it, make sure you have always moved as close as possible towards the crusade target city. You do not suffer desertion for keeping a prolonged siege on the target city, or if you lay siege to another city for a turn or two. It's common practice to take several cities on the way to the crusading target.
    3. You get good Papal standing for allying with Catholic kingdoms and for fighting Muslims, as well as doing papal missions, winning/participating in crusades and of course, bribing the Pope. If you need to fight Scotland or France (which you do), do what you must and then make good with his Holiness by filling his pockets. Works every time.
    4. Assassins will kill enemy Cardinals. If you want to have your own, make all your priests (I usually get 12-15) and dump them in the Moorish controlled Spain to convert Cordoba and it's surrounding settlements to Catholic. They grow very fast in piety and turn into a group of super-Cardinals. After that is done, send them to Jerusalem and the other cities in the Holy Lands. You will always have an English pope after that, especially if you take out Scotland and France.
    Last edited by Myth; 04-17-2012 at 09:36.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    I didn't know I could have a Pope from my faction! Thanks for all the advice man! Between me posting this and your advice I found out that you needed preists to get Cardinals, and there is now a new Pope. I have made an alliance with him, and launched my own Crusade against his enemy, Milan. I took Rome and (don't kill me for this) gave it back to the Pope. I then continued with the war and took Naples (both cities were poorly defended; in the seige of Rome I lost about 10 men) I recruited some preists and now I have a single Cardinal. So now my standing with the Pope is full and France's (for whatever reason) has gone down. Also, this gives me a launching point for Crusades. Looks like there'll be a big one up ahead, since the Mongols are by far the most powerful faction and hold Jerusalem and Antioch.

  8. #8
    Throne Room Caliph Senior Member phonicsmonkey's Avatar
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    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    Quote Originally Posted by Myth View Post
    make all your priests (I usually get 12-15) and dump them in the Moorish controlled Spain to convert Cordoba and it's surrounding settlements to Catholic. They grow very fast in piety and turn into a group of super-Cardinals. After that is done, send them to Jerusalem and the other cities in the Holy Lands. You will always have an English pope after that, especially if you take out Scotland and France.
    This - I always make a God Squad of priests and move them in a herd throughout Muslim and Orthodox territory. You can get control of the Papacy and the whole college of cardinals this way. Makes things a lot easier.

    Also, you can bribe the Pope repeatedly in a single turn, in increments of 100fl. Just keep offering him gifts until he refuses and then start again next turn.

    It's so easy it's basically an exploit.

    Alternatively, and more difficult - recruit a bunch of assassins and level them up against rebel captains. Then kill off all the cardinals in the world and kill the pope. I have heard that if you clear out the remaining cardinals and pope in a single turn it's possible to eliminate the Papal states altogether.
    Last edited by phonicsmonkey; 04-24-2012 at 00:49.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    lol, sounds like the former strategy is easier. Since it's so easy to win the Pope over (as I have done) that I think enemy kings and Princes would be more suitable assasination targets

  10. #10
    Member Member Sp4's Avatar
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    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    Hehe.. I have a campaign somewhere where I pretty much control the church (as England).

    I sent a whole navy full of monks to rank up in Northern Africa, then sent a bunch of assassins to rank up on army captains and such and now, I have 3 assassins parked next to Rome, so every time, the pope excommunicates me, I kill him, get one of my bishops elected (the entire college of cardinals belongs to me, save for one or two others), who then likes me so much, he will wait a turn or two before telling me to stop making war with Christian factions aaaand oops.. another pope just mysteriously ended his career after a year oO

  11. #11

    Default Re: concerning the pope...

    lol, we're going through Popes quick here...

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