I'm slowly starting to get back on track with my life and free time so I was thinking to resurrect this game idea. I may even have the basic rules for it (if I look hard). Anyone still interested?
I like the concept of this game, as it allows me to be incompetent without the embarrassment of having my entire faction wiped out (as long as I'm not put in charge of the defence of Rome...). And I tend to be more a coop multiplayer person, rather than competitive, so it's good for that too. In short, if you run this I'd be happy to be in.
Okey, I'll try to find the rules I wrote for this then. Basically it is a Vanilla RTW game (as Scipii?!). There will be some small changes but nothing big and if people don't like them we can cast them aside.
Just to help with this, i once wrote a whole rule set for an EB PBM in here :)
i used to have this uploaded, but i had to dig deep in the forum here to find it again:
Concept rules:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
1. Office Terms
Every elected rank is valid for 12 turns. After each 12 turns there will be a congressional session and new elections for offices.
Only exception is the tribunus Plebis, who will be active for 24 turns.
2. Character Points
To get to the next rank (Rule 2.4) every player must get a certain amount of 'CP's'. Character points are gained from participating in IC events and having your character do something in-game
Battle
"Crushing Defeat" -3 points
"Clear Defeat" -2 point
"Average Defeat" -1 point
"Close Defeat" -1/2 point
"Close Victory" 1 point
"Average Victory" 2 point
"Clear Victory" 3 points
"Heroic Victory" 4 points
Governing
1CP per 2 turns for villages, towns, large towns
2CP per 2 turns for Cities, Large Cities
3CP per 2 turns for Huge Cities
A character which is NOT the main commander of the legion, but does participate in the battle will receive the following points:
1/2 of the normal points if this character is a Legatus. (rounded up)
1/3 if he is a quaestor (rounded down)
To the GM: please note that points will be rounded to 0.25
example:
a quaestor who participated in a close victory: 1 * 1/3 =0.33 (rounds down) == 0.25 CP's
a legatus who participated in the same battle: 1 * 1/2 = 0.50CP
Note: I, as GM, will do a complete review of game history before the next CC and will transfer the new CP points into our current BP points.
3. Pomerium
This included all cities of italy below the padus river.
(Ingame this means: Arretium/ariminum are the northern border of the pomerium. Then it goes al lthe way south to taras/Rhegion.)
This will be the area regarded as homeland. Keep it in mind for it will be mentioned @ ranks.
4.Provinces
A province will be an area in-game, determined by a Charter Amendement, that will or may included several cities in a region and will be governed by a PG (provincial governor)
As the Empire grows bigger, provinces may change in shape/size. ALL NON-POMERIUM CITIES WILL HAVE TO HAVE TYPEII.
Client-ruled cities do not count as a province.
For example: Sicily is a province. It will have 1 governor who will chose his 'capital'. This chosen capital will nto be able to be governed by a quaestor during the term of the governor.
Publius cornelius is now an ex-consul, and chooses as his province Sicily. He then declares Lilybaem his capital, so from there he governs.
His nephew is new in the senate, and Publius Cornelius asks the CoF if his nephew can serve him as a quaestor.
Publius Cornelius can now ask his nephew to govern either one of sicily's other cities.
5. Theatre of War
A theatre of war is a province which is adjacent to a nation of which we are at war with.
For instance: Illyria when we are at war with epeirus.
When a CoL is elected, he may declare his Theatre of War, providing the neighbouring faction is at war with us.
This allows the consul to take control of the province and wager war on the neighbouring faction.
The CoL is the ONLY person who may ventured into enemy territory without approval of the senate. (as longs as the enemy is in a state of war)
6. CASUS BELLI
This concept means the Republic only goes to war with a VALID REASON.
We only attack when we are attacked, or our allies have been attacked, or a nations threatens the status quot in our region.
Provincial Governors are therefore not allowed to take their legion into foreign territory.
Unless the foreigners have intruded our land or attacked us.
This also means that as long as a faction does not attack us/allies placed close to us, governors cannot conquer any new cities.
Only the CoL can venture out to gain new cities.
In case we are attacked, a provincial governor may send word to the senate, who may vote an edict for revenge.
7. Voting system
The congressional system as it is remains, with a few additions:
The Tribunus Plebeis may enfore 2 edicts per term without vote.
A provincial Governor may call of Vote on War: this means that a PG may request the senate to allow him to conquer a foreign settlement of a faction currently not at war with the SPQR.
This includes rebel cities. This may happen when the foreign faction has had troops on our territory or the faction is showing 'bad intentions' to us or our allies.
The governor must provide evidence for a casus belli, after which he may create a poll. No seconding required.
IC voting: several small IC-related things may also require a voting outside the session. This will regard things that do not affect in-game issues (for example giving bean a triumph)
IC voting can be started by anyone. It requires 3 'secondings' after which a voting poll will be isued.
Voting for any of the above will last for 24hrs after creation of the poll. No turn may be ended during this period.
8. Law system
Whenever an edicts contradicts a rule, the edicts will have to be judged by the current elected praetor.
He will have final word on the validness of the edict.
Of course, this means that praetors should take their responsability as not letting things get out of hand against the spirit of the game.
Some issues and changes will need to be taken directly to the GM.
This is to represent the fickleness of ancient roman law.
THIS RULE IS DEBATABLE/OPTIONAL
Career Reforms:
[spoil] Privatus (starting rank)
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
A privatus is a young man, just finishing his education in Rome and ready for the first step of the Cursus Honorum
Requirements: None (Training Stage 1)
Vote weight: 1
Powers:
Penalties:
(1) May not lead any troops nor propose laws.
(2) Cannot Run for Consul
(3) Skulks in Rome to gain ancilliaries until he gets elected as Tribunus Plebis OR appointed Quaestor by a CoF.
Tribunus Militum
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements: None (Training Stage 2)
Vote weight: 1
Powers:
1) May send a request to the CoL to join a legion.
Penalties:
(1) A young man, preferring the education an army can give him above one found in the forum romanum.
(2) May not lead any troops nor propose laws.
(3) Cannot Run for Consul
(4) may not govern a city
Quaestor
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements: Must have been appointed by the consul of Finance (or by request of a provincial governor to the CoF).
Vote weight: 1
Powers:
(1) Can propose one Edict/Charter Amendment per 'Congressional' Session.
(2) Can govern one city (except province capitals)
(3) Must be appointed by Consul of Finance (for a pomerium city) OR requested by a provincial governor (for a provincial city). If requested by a PG, the CoF will still have to approve the assignment.
(4) Can act as second in command to a Legate/Dux/Consul
(5) Can also govern a provincial city in the province of a governor.
Penalties
(1) Cannot command a FULL Legion. (In times of need, they ARE allowed to command the Alae.)
Tribune of the Plebs
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Speaks for the Plebs in the Comita.
Requirements: Must be elected to position.
Vote weight: 2
Powers:
(1) Can propose one edict/charter amendment per congressional council;
(2) Can veto 2 edicts per term
(3)The Tribune of the Plebs term is two Consul Terms long. (24 turns)
(4) Can issue 2 edicts during his term which become valid from point of announcement until next session.
(5) receives 18 CP's after term is completed as this is the first electable office and regarded as the first step of the cursus honorum.
Penalties:
(1) May not lead any troops
(2) Cannot Run for Consul
(3) Cannot govern a city
Praetor
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements:
Must have been Quaestor OR Tribunus plebis. Must have 25 'CP's'. Must be elected.
Vote weight: 4
Powers:
(1) Can lead 1 legion
(2) Can propose 3 Edicts/Charter Amendments per 'Council' Session.
(3) Will get to choose province to govern when term as praetor is over, after both consuls have chosen theirs.
(4) Can act as judge in IC disputes
(5) May sponser the formation of Houses/Families
Consul of Finance
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Only Consul of Finance will end the “turn”.
Requirements: Must have been elected to this office. Must have been Praetor OR have 40 CP’s.
Vote weight: 5
Powers:
(1) Can build any building in any settlements he wishes and set the tax rate in any settlement unless they are part of a Provincial Governorship. Cannot recruit military units.
(2) Gains automatically control of the Consular Legio II. This legion will be stationed in a fort outside Capua. It may never enter Latium unless passing through or if there is an enemy near Rome. Legion will be used only to clean up rebels inside the pomerium ONLY.
(3) MUST BE STATIONED IN ROME! The finance consul must always be in Rome to govern. Unless fighting off rebels.
(4) All diplomats (not spies or assassins) are under the command of the Consul of Finance. He can move them and use them as he sees fit.
(5) Once per full 12 turn Consul Term, can force a transfer of one retinue member/item from any Player to themselves or any other Senator.
(6) Can call Emergency Congressional Session.
(7) Will get first pick of his province to govern after term is complete.
(8) Can propose 5 Edicts/Charter Amendments per 'Council' Session.
(9) Can exclude 1 avatar from participating in the congress. the so called: "lictors, remove this man" move Basically only to be used when people are truely annoying in the Curia, or rebellious.
Consul of the Legion’s Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements: Must have been elected to this office. Must have been Praetor OR have 40 CP’s
Vote weight: 5
Powers:
(1) Can build any military unit in any settlements he wishes unless they are part of a Provincial Governorship. Cannot construct buildings.
(2) Assumes control of the Legio I .
(3) May choose his theater of war. If no theatre of war is active, must remain in Rome.
(4) All Assassins/Spy are under command of the Consul of the Legion’s. He can move them and use them in any way he wishes.
(5) Once per full 12 turn Consul Term, can force a transfer of one retinue member/item from any Player to themselves or any other Senator.
(6) Can call Emergency Congressional Session.
(7) Will get second pick of his province to govern after completion of term.
(8) Can propose 5 Edicts/Charter Amendments per 'Council' Session.
Provincial Governor Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements: Must be an outgoing Consul/Praetor OR Must be appointed to this rank through the Senate by an edict.
Vote weight: 3
Powers:
(1) Can govern the Province they have been given. This means: Set the tax level, ask unit recruitment/building construction (Should be mentioned in the SOT).
(2) Can propose 2 Edicts or Amendments per 'Congressional' Session.
(3) Once per full 12 turn Consul Term, can Prioritize one building in any build queue in any settlement in his Province(s).
(4) Once per full 12 turn Consul Term, can destroy one building in any settlement. Buildings in the barracks lines cannot be destroyed with this power.
(5) Commands 1 provincial legion.
(6) Can appoint a Quaestor to govern any city he choses in his province.
Legatus Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Requirements: Must have 15 CP's. Must be appointed by Senate/provincial governor.
Influence: 1
Powers:
(1) Can command 1 legion OR 1 provincial legion.
Dicator
Must be elected by a ¾ majority in the senate OR legion commanders.
Powers
(1)Assumes total control of all supporting legions
(2)Can establish edicts as he sees fit
(3)Can establish charter amendements in negotation with the GM
All avatars/ legions which do not support the dicator will be declared rebels until the dictatorship is over.
All ‘rebels’ will lose their ability to recruit.
The loyalists however, will also not be able to recruit in provinces which are governed by a ‘rebel’
More details on this can be furnished on request
The point of these reforms is:
1)Until you reach praetor, you’re basically a junior senator
2)Once you pass praetor, you get acces to the cool offices.
3)If you manage to get yourself elected, you got much power during your term
4)If your term is over, you get to choose your playground
5)There has to be atleast 1 term between your next election (Term A, you’re consul; Term B; you’re a governor; Turn C; you can get elected again.
6)During your time as a non-elected senator, you’re between the junior senators and the elected senators concerning power.
7)Once everyone gets a high rank, game will evolve around factions as the people who can get their members elected wield more power than those who don’t. This establishes a whole end-game which the current ranks do not have.
Legions:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
8. Legions
All Legions are BOUND to their area. Legions will be composed of 1 roman half, one allied half (Alae)
The allied half will be unit types that are recrutable in the area the Legion is bound to.
Compostion of Standard Legions
Camillan era
1 General
1 Leves or Accensi
1 Hastati
1 principes
1 triari Alae
1 skirmisher type
2 units of allied infantry (two different pairs of Samnite, Lucanian, Bruttium, Ligurian or Gallic infantry or just any local stuff if the real distant cities)
1 unit of pedites extraordinarii
1 unit local cavalry
Polybian Era
1 General
1 unit of Velites/Accensi
1 unit of Hastati
1 unit of Principes
1 unit of Triarii Alae
The two socii alae are composed as follows:
1 unit of allied skirmishers (any mix of javelineers, archers and slingers)
2 units of allied infantry (two different pairs of Samnite, Lucanian, Bruttium, Ligurian, Gallic, or Iberian infantry)
1 unit of pedites extraordinarii
1 unit of allied cavalry (Campanian, Greek, Gallic, Ligurian or anything else available, or possibly equites extraordinarii)
Marian
1 General
1 unit of First Cohort
2 unit of cohors reformata
2 unit of antesignani/evocata
Support
1 unit of Scorpions/arrow throwers Alae
1 unit of allied javelin-men
1 unit of allied slingers or archers
1 unit of allied cavalry
SPECIAL LEGIONS Consular Legion I for the CoL:
A normal legion
Consular Legion II for the CoF:
A normal legion MINUS the Alae
This is great. The one thing I truly disagree is Casus Beli. I know we do it so we don't stomp the AI but the Roman Republic was in a constant state of war since its inception and military triumphs were the main way for one to gain influence and advance in office. A Rome that waits to be attacked to wage war is not at all historically accurate.
The art of war, then, is governed by five constant
factors, to be taken into account in one's deliberations,
when seeking to determine the conditions obtaining in the field.
These are: (1) The Moral Law; (2) Heaven; (3) Earth;
(4) The Commander; (5) Method and discipline. Sun Tzu, "The Art of War" Like totalwar.org on Facebook!
I have thought about this game and the rules for some time and I'll give a short summary of what I thought out. If anyone have some objections then let me know.
1) Ranks/Offices
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
I divided ranks mainly into two parts: civil offices(Cursus Honorum) and military ranks (plus some ranks/offices that do not belong to either of those groups). So, I'll introduce them to you.
Lowest ranks
a) Privatus
All avatars who become of age(become 16 years old) will be considered "Privatus". They can't vote, get elected to offices, propose legislations, lead units etc.
b) Prefect
When avatar turns 18 years old he will receive the rank Prefect. They can lead some units(1/4 stack), run for "Magistrate", vote, propose legislations etc.
Military Ranks
a) Tribune
Legion commanders(or governors) can choose players with Privatus or Prefect ranks to become their second-in-command(if someone have applied to the job) and they will then receive the rank Taribune. They can lead 10 units, attack enemy armies in neighboring neutral provinces. They can ask their units to be retrained but they cannot recruit new units. Cannot hold civil offices as long as he is Tribune.
b) Legate
Commands a Legion(full stack). Can accept another player as his second-in-command(thus promoting him to the rank of Tribune). Can recruit units. Can attack enemy armies in allied provinces. Cannot hold civil offices as long as he is Legate.
Cursus Honorum
(Offices can be held from 2 to 10 turns. Players can always resign from the office before their 10 turn term is over. Each office can only be held be one player.)
a) Quaestor
To hold this rank avatar must be at least 20 years old and have been Tribune at least 2 turns. He can set taxes in every settlement(except those that are governed by governors). Cannot lead any units.
b) Aedile
Must be at least 25 years old and must have served as Quaestor. Can create gladiatorial games or races. Cannot lead any units.
c) Praetor
Must be at least 29 years old, served as Aedile and the standing with the Senate must be at least 5. Acts as a judge in IC disputes. Can take command of any garrison and lead them within the borders of their province. Can't however lead more than 10 units. Can propose Edicts between Council sessions.
d) Consul
Must be at least 30 years old, served as Praetor and standing with the Senate must be at least 7. Can lead a Legion(and have a Tribune as his second in command). Will receive the powers of lower offices if they are vacant. Can declare war, recruit units, move captain led armies in any way he wants. Can also propose Edicts between Council sessions.
c) Censor
Must be at least 35 years old, served as Consul. Can ban recruitment in every settlement(but not retraining of units) but not in Capital.
Other offices
a) Pontifex Maximus
A honorary title that can be assumed if player have at least served as Aedile. Can be held for life. Cannot lead any units. Oversees construction and upgrade of temples. Can set god/temple type for a settlement and change it when he wants(but not if there is a large temple in the settlement).
b) Governor(Dux/Propraetor/Proconsul)
Governor can be appointed with an Edict (player will receive the title Dux) or when Praetors(and Consuls) term in the office is over they can choose a province what thay want to govern. Dux can govern 1 province, Propraetor maximum of 2 neighboring provinces and Proconsul up to 3 neighboring provinces. Provinces in Italy can't be choosed. Governors can set taxes, create games/races, build, recruit etc in their provinces. Their term lasts maximum of 20 turns. It's possible to assign additional settlements to the governors with legislations(Dux could then govern more than 1 province for example).
c) Magistrate
All players (except players with Privatus rank) can run for Magistrate. However, Tribune and Legate must resign from their rank if they are elected. Magistrate can set taxes(Quaestor no present), recruit units that legion commanders want, build, do diplomacy etc. Player can always resign from this office when ever he wants. There is no limit to how long someone can hold this office. Magistrate is the one who will end the turn. GM might in special circumstances assume this office to keep the game moving.
d) Faction Leader
If there are no Consuls or Praetors present he will receive their powers. Can lead a full stack.
These are pre civil war ranks and offices. I suggest that if civil war event will happen we merge most of the offices and form a new one - Emperor.
2) Declaration of War and Theater of War
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
War can be declared with an Edict, with a Law(Lex) or by the Consul. In the same time ToW must be declared also. The size of the ToW is connected to the method how DoW was made. Players cannot enter neutral or allied provinces unless it is allowed with their rank.
Edict - ToW can have max 3 neighboring enemy provinces. ToW will be in effect until the next Council session.
Law(Lex) - ToW can have max 3 neighboring enemy(and neutral) provinces. ToW does not expire.
By Consul - ToW can have max 3 neighboring enemy and neutral provinces. Tow will be in effect until the next Council session.
3) Armies
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
All armies must have at least 2/3 of the factional units as infantry. Fleets are under the command of Consul(or FL) unless naval unit is bought by a player with his personal funds. Captain lead armies cannot enter foreign provinces.
Special units
These are Wardogs, Flaming Pigs, Gladiators etc. They are "flavor" units. Players can recruit(and later pay their upkeep) them with their personal funds. There is a limit of how many of these can be recruited. Higher rank/office grants more special units. However, there can be only one unit from each type(one wardog unit and not three for example). Repeating ballistas and Scorpions are also special units for most players. Only FL or Consul can add them into the main army. In Pre-Marian times Praetorian units can only be recruited by the FL and Consul with their personal funds. Mercenary units are also considered special units for most players. Legate, Consul and FL can add them into their main army.
4) Personal Funds
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
All players from the rank Prefect(including them of course as well) upwards will each turn earn some money for personal use. This can be used to recruit some special units or during events. Magistrate will keep track on personal funds.
Prefect - 500 denarii
Tribune, Quaestor, Aedile - 700 denarii
Praetor, Legate, Governor - 1000 denarii
Censor, Pontifex Maximus -12000 denarii
Consul, Faction Leader - 1500 denarii
(Propraetor will receive +100 and Proconsul +200 denarii to their governor salary)
5) Edicts, Laws, Council session a.k.a Politics
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Just like in KotN there are two type of legislations: Edicts that last until the next Council Session and Laws(Lex) that will be permanent. Consul and Praetor can also propose Edicts(Consul can propose 2 and Praetor 1 Edict) between Council sessions. Those Edicts need only 2 secondings to pass.
Council sessions will take place every 10 turns. They last 2 days and are follwed by 2 days for voting.
Emergency council sessions can be called by Consul or Faction Leader.
All offices and legion commanders can be removed from their position at any time(office holder must have served at least 2 turns before he can be removed) if 2/3 of the players support it.
6) Modification of the files
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
a) There will be some small changes to the descr_strat file.
b) All Gladiator units will be made recruitable.
c) All special units will receive * mark to their unit name for easy refrence.
d) All roman temples will be made available for the players (?)
Fog of War can only be turned off by the GM. He can take the save and help the AI when needed.
So, this is what I have been doing for the past (almost) 2 weeks. If you like these rules then I will present them in a much better format.
EDIT: How do you become a legion commander? That is not yet in the rules (or did I overlook it?)
I think I just forgot to add it. Council can make someone Legate with an Edict or if there is a Consul then he can do it as well.
This means that if Legate wants to keep his position then he has to be at least somewhat active in the game. In previous games there were times when someone was given command over army but then that player became not active. So, hopefully this way we can prevent this happen. Also, they will be much easier to removed from their post.
I really would like this to get running. Perhaps in March already?
As Scipii there are 4 starting generals and 2 more will become of age in first 10 turns. However, if wI can get more than 4 players sign up then I could modify the strat file so that all would start with an avatar from the Scipii family.
At the moment, it's impossible for me to say when I'll have enough time to take part in this game. Depending on RL circumstances, it'll be either somewhere around March 15th or somewhere in May/June.
Andres is our Lord and Master and could strike us down with thunderbolts or beer cans at any time. ~Askthepizzaguy Ja mata, TosaInu
The rules look good to me - I don't have any prior experience with games like this, so I'm happy to run with what everybody else deems appropriate. I'm fine with whenever you choose to start it, provided it's not in the next week or so.
Sorry, I think your rules look quite nice Ibn-Khaldun. The one question I have is whether ranks that would normally not be allowed to train troops are able to do so with their private funds.
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Sorry, I think your rules look quite nice Ibn-Khaldun. The one question I have is whether ranks that would normally not be allowed to train troops are able to do so with their private funds.
They can recruit these special units (flaming pigs, wardogs etc) and mercenaries but not other factional units.
All ranks and offices can recruit a small number of special units(wardogs etc and mercenaries) with their private funds. The higher the rank the more they can recruit them. However, factional units can only be recruited by the ranks who have the power to recruit units.
I like these rules, I just don't think that the Faction Leader should get so much power and money - rather, we should just have one player step in as the first Consul and hold elections as soon as we get our feet wet.
Let's get started!
The art of war, then, is governed by five constant
factors, to be taken into account in one's deliberations,
when seeking to determine the conditions obtaining in the field.
These are: (1) The Moral Law; (2) Heaven; (3) Earth;
(4) The Commander; (5) Method and discipline. Sun Tzu, "The Art of War" Like totalwar.org on Facebook!
Re: "RTW Nostalgy" RPG game
Originally Posted by The King
I'm slowly starting to get back on track with my life and free time so I was thinking to resurrect this game idea. I may even have the basic rules for it (if I look hard). Anyone still interested?). And I tend to be more a coop multiplayer person, rather than competitive, so it's good for that too. In short, if you run this I'd be happy to be in.
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