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Thread: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

  1. #271
    Uergobretos Senior Member Brennus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Thanks for highlighting this for us kdarak. @abou @Arjos You two are better with Ancient Greek and I, what are your thoughts?



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  2. #272

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Now this is really nitpicking, so I apologize in advance:

    In the province description of "Raition" you talk several times about the oppida on the "Engelhalbinsel of Berne. The "L" is incorrect as it is called "Engehalbinsel". (Engelhalbinsel meaning "Angel penninsula" wheras "Engehalbinsel" is a rather geograhic descrition.)
    This is really the smallest of bugs, but as I'm basically living in this very place I thought I would point it out. ;-)
    Everything else is detailed and great to read as usual!

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  3. #273
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Afaik the Agiadai and Eurypontidai were simply named after two eponymous kings: Agis and Eurypon. So there should not be any etymological significance...

    As for the translations I don't know if the name Agis derives from the verb ago "to lead", but I doubt Eurypon has anything to do with eurus "wide" and pontos "sea", because the name simply has a double stem declension...
    Last edited by Arjos; 09-14-2014 at 10:34.

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  4. #274
    ΤΑΞΙΑΡΧΟΣ Member kdrakak's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Arjos View Post
    Afaik the Agiadai and Eurypontidai were simply named after two eponymous kings: Agis and Eurypon. So there should not be any etymological significance...

    As for the translations I don't know if the name Agis derives from the verb ago "to lead", but I doubt Eurypon has anything to do with eurus "wide" and pontos "sea", because the name simply has a double stem declension...
    While these are not necessarily the progenitors of the two lines of kings (other kings are mentioned before them), it is perhaps possible that the families were named after them. This makes far more sense than my "theory". I think the text should be edited to correct my assumptions. After all this is EB!!
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  5. #275
    ΤΑΞΙΑΡΧΟΣ Member kdrakak's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Kilikia long overdue.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Province Kilikia
    Traveler’s Log
    So these are the gates… Many crossed, but many failed too. This is the land that the people of the Nile called Kode. Its Hurrian name though is Kizzuwatna! The west is rugged mountain territory and the east is fertile river-land. Indeed, this is a land of contradictions. The mountains can provide shelter in time of need, but the lowlands offer none… and they invite invaders too often. From North and South they come; to hold the gates, to mine valuable ore and to reap the harvest of the fields. Trade too flourishes as natural harbors and emporia make Kilikia a haven for seafarers of all sorts in the eastern Mediterranean, sailing the ancient routes from the Levant, to Kilikia, to Cyprus, to Rhodes and the Ionian coast, to Hellas and the islands, to Crete, to Cyrene and to Egypt. Trade, grain, water, mines, gates, all make for a rich kingdom. Yet, only a handful of local kings ruled this land throughout history…. indeed, this is a land of contradictions.
    Geography
    The Kilikian coastline consists of a well-watered plain to the east and a rough wooded mountainous area to the west. The plain is embraced by mountains to its west and northeast and is accessible through passes that the Greeks called “gates”. The Kilikian country possesses valuable resources, such as mines of silver and iron ore in the Taurus Mountains. The Hittite King Hatussili III, sent a message to his Assyrian counterpart informing him that the iron ore of good quality was not available at that time in Kizzuwatna. They would produce some, soon. As a token of friendship an iron sword was sent to him!
    Along with the metal resources of the mountains beyond Karatepe there was a resource in Kilikia that left no archaeological footprint: horses! In the book of Kings, King Solomon of Jerusalem received horses for his chariots from “Que”, the Kilikian plain. Shipping horses is a practice well attested in Greek history and probably used early on in the area around Kilikia and further down the coast.
    Three rivers come down from the mountains and grant the plain its exceptional fertility. The plains at the lower course of the Ceyhan River provided especially rich cultivated fields. Furthermore, annual winter rains make agriculture possible in the area at a very early date. Dioscurides noted the presence of many medicinal and scented plants. Rosa Phoenicia, an exquisite variety of the white rose, also blooms here, twice a year too! Wild life abounded with even buffaloes making their home in the plain.
    The People, Society and Government
    Several ethnic groups coexisted in Kilikia in the Bronze Age. Luwians, Hittites and Hurrians shared the land and formed its culture. Luwians were probably the first inhabitants at the start of the 2nd millennium BC. Hittites likely came in significant numbers to southeastern Anatolia following the Hittite conquest in the early Old Kingdom period, under Kings Hattusili I and Mursili I, but Hurrians too inhabited this area at least since the beginning of the 2nd millennium BC. After the weakening of the Hittite Old Kingdom in the 15th century BC, Hittites and Luwians contributed to the formation of a short-lived independent kingdom of Kizzuwatna. The toponym Kizzuwatna is possibly a Luwian adaptation of Hittite kezudne meaning “country on this side (of the mountains)”. Hurrian culture became prominent in Kilikia, once it entered the sphere of influence of the Hurrian kingdom of Mitanni, at the peak of the latter’s power. A volatile area, socially, culturally and politically, Kilikia incorporated cultural and linguistic elements from all three distinct ethnic constituents.
    Temple-cities were a noteworthy feature of Kilikia, defining governmental and social organization. Such a city was Kummani, the capital of Kizzuwatna, situated in the highlands. Strabo indicates classical Komana was a temple city from ancient times by his reckoning, relying on the temple for any social structure, where the head priest was also the local political leader. Kummanni, whose Hittite name was Kummiya, was the political, cultural and religious center of the Anatolian kingdom of Kizzuwatna. Its location is uncertain, but is believed to be near the classical settlement of Comana in Cappadocia. Kummanni was the major cult center of the Hurrian chief deity, Tešup. Its Hurrian name Kummeni simply translates as "The Shrine."
    Puduhepa, queen of the Hittite king Hattusili III, came from Kizzuwatna, where she had been a priestess, the daughter of the head-priest. Their pantheon was also integrated into the Hittite one, and the goddess Hebat of Kizzuwatna became very important in Hittite religion towards the end of the 13th century BC. Hurrian goddess Hebat was almost just as important as her husband Tešup, the Weather God. Both were worshipped at Kummani, where it is even possible that she had preeminence. A corpus of religious texts called the Kizzuwatna rituals was discovered at Hattusa. Despite this fact, it seems the King did have to visit Kummani to fulfill religious duties. Queen Puduheba was of Hurrian descent and after her marriage to the Hittite King Hatusili, correspondence from her time identifies Hebat as the Sun Godhess of Arinna, a major cult center near Hattusa in the Hittite heartland. This is another clear piece of evidence of the syncretism that was present in all layers of life in Kilikia from the Bronze Age.
    The city persisted into the Early Iron Age, and appears as Kumme in Assyrian records. It was located on the edge of Assyrian influence, separating Assyria from Urartu and the highlands of southeastern Anatolia. Kumme was still considered a holy city in Assyrian times, both in Assyria and in Urartu. Adadnirari II of Assyria, after re-conquering the city, made sacrifices to "Adad of Kumme" and the three chief deities in the Urartian pantheon were "the god of Ardini, the god of Kumenu, and the god of Tushpa." This testifies to the importance of Kummani and of the culture that flourished in Kilikia fot the wider region.
    History
    The first mention of Kilikia in historical record informs us that King Sargon of Akkad reached the Taurus Mountains in the 23rd century BC, during a campaign from Mesopotamia to the Mediterranean, but left no lasting influence. The trade routes from Assyria to the “karum” in the Anatolian highlands went through Kizzuwatna by the early 2nd millennium BC. The kings of Kizzuwatna of the 2nd millennium BC had frequent contact with the Hittites to the north. The earliest Hittite records seem to refer to Kizzuwatna and Arzawa in Western Anatolia collectively as Luwia. Kilikia was conquered by the Hittite Kings of the old kingdom Hattusili I and Mursili I. Fortifications similar to those at the Hittite capital have been found in Kilikia. The Hittite hieroglyphs themselves probably originated in Kilikia, since the oldest example is the seal of Isputachsus, king of Kizzuwatna. Telipinu was the last Hittite king of the old kingdom at the turn of the 15th century BC and probably had to recognize the ruler of Kizzuwatna as a king in his own right, perhaps even as an equal. Isputahsu made a treaty with the Hittite king Telepinu. Later, Kizzuwatna shifted its allegiance, perhaps due to a new ruling dynasty. The Hurrians formed the Mitani state in Syria, but were also dominant over Kizzuwatna in the dark ages of the Hittite Middle Kingdom. The Mittani formulated a policy of containment for the Hittites. Kizzuwatna was an important buffer state and was supported by the Mittani to keep the weakened Hittites in their Anatolian plateau. This close relationship came about when the city state of Alalakh to the south of Kilikia expanded under its new vigorous leader Idrimi, himself a subject of the Mitanni King Barattarna. King Pilliya of Kizzuwatna had to sign a treaty with Idrimi. It was then only natural for Kizzuwatna to become a Mitanni ally. This alliance persisted from the reign of Shunashura I, until the Hittite king Arnuwanda I overran the country and made it a vassal kingdom. Kizuwatna was “liberated” from the Mittani, but was subdued and became a client kingdom to the Hittites. And while the agreement appears to have been a mutual aggressive and defensive alliance, it was the Kizuwatnnan ruler that had to visit Hatousa on a yearly basis to pay homage to the King and was prohibited from having any connection to the king of Hurri. As the New Hittite Kingdom became stronger, Kizzuwatna was incorporated to the empire yet again and the Hittites pushed deeper into Mittani territory. Kizzuwatna rebelled during the reign of Suppiluliuma I, but remained within the Hittite empire for two hundred years. In the famous Battle of Kadesh (c. 1274 BC), Kizzuwadna supplied troops to the Hittite king. This was the status quo until the collapse of the Bronze age near the turn of the 12th century BC, when smaller Neo-Hittite kingdoms such as Tabal, Kammanu and Quwe seem to have emerged in Kilikia and were relatively spared from the devastation that the Sea Peoples wrought in the wider Near East.
    The events that took place in Kizzuwatna are as vague as they are in many other places during this extremely volatile time. Evidence found in Egypt provides us with some information, though, as in other cases, the authors were perhaps more interested in impression than accuracy: “No land could stand before their arms from Hatti, Kode, Kargamish, Yereth, Alashia on.” Kargamish, for example, seems to have suffered no such fate as nearby Ugarit did. Yet Kode (i.e. Kizzuwatna) was probably not spared. The Tursha of the Sea peoples that joined the Libyans against the Egyptian Pharaoh Mernepta were perhaps from Tarsos according to one interpretation of the information available. People from nearby Adana may have been involved in the attack a generation later. But Tarsos had been burned almost to the ground around that time. Archaeology remains inconclusive on the matter.
    Kilikia after the sea peoples was a dark spot in history until the Karatepe inscriptions were found. The author was Azativatas, himself probably not a king or ruler, but a subject of the King of Adana. In the Phoenician version of the inscriptions the king is not of Adana, but of the Dnnym. A connection with the Homeric Danaoi has been attempted, but is somewhat problematic.
    Enter Mopsos! This mythical seer makes a spectacular entry in the stories of post-Trojan adventures. His extraordinary divinatory skill and his achievement are truly remarkable though not all that well known. Mopsos and Calchas, the great Greek seer, had a divining contest after the Trojan War, when Mycenaean veterans went down the Anatolian coast and landed in Claros near Colophon. Mopsus was the local seer. Calchas lost and died of shame on the spot according to one version of the myth. After the contest, he took the group of veterans and went through Pamphylia to Kilikia establishing settlements all along his route. The sites of Mopsion, Mopsou Krene and Mopsou Hestia attest to the trace of truth in the myth. In Perge, inscriptions that include both Calchas and Mopsos as founding fathers have come to light. In 800-700BC, Azitawadda, a local ruler, set a bilingual inscription in Luwian and Phoenician, claiming descent from Mopsos. The name is mentioned in Hittite texts, in Knossos tablets and the Phoenician version as well, retaining the linguistic characteristics of each language (Moxos, Mo-ko-so and Mopsus respectively). The importance of the Mopsos story is that it describes a mix of Greeks (Mycenaean) and Anatolians – possibly the Sea Peoples - from the west into Kilikia and then farther south into Canaan.
    Back to history then: The House of Muksas was based in Adana in Kilikia before the Assyrians conquered the area in 830BC. This is another rare instance of a probably independent kingdom in Kilikia. Texts were inscribed in a hieroglyphic neo-Hittite script to render the Luwian language. Later big bilingual inscriptions were set up including the Phoenician language. It is assumed that Phoenician sea-men reached Kilikia perhaps sailing up the Pyramus River to where the bilingual inscription stood. On the coast of the rough part of Kilikia the one the Assyrians called Hilakku, Greeks from Samos and Rhodes settled in Soloi, Nagidosa and Celenderis. The city of Mallos traced its origin to the hero Amphilochos of Argos, but that might be later attempt at Hellenization of some sort. It was not uncommon for cities to fabricate claims of Hellenic origin during the Hellenistic Era. Still, a text from Assyrian King Sargon’s court (721-705BC) refers to Ionian Greeks from “Que” raiding the Levantine coast as far as Tyre, so there may well be more to the legends than political calculation.
    A rebellion broke out in Kilikia in 696bc. According to Assyrian texts, Kirua, the leader of the rebellion and probably an Assyrian client, gathered troops from his base in Illubru in the mountains to the North. Assyrian troops including chariots, cavalry and infantry were sent against him and defeated him after heavy fighting. Tarsos and Ingira, that the Greeks called Anchiale, were captured during the campaign for assisting the rebellion, as was Kirua himself. He was sent to the capital in Nineveh to be skinned alive, in a typically, for ancient middle-eastern kingdoms, cruel fashion of punishment meant to make an example of the rebel. But from later Greek sources we learn of two battles between Assyrians and Greeks, one on land and one at sea.
    The land battle was against Ionian Greeks that marched against Kilikia. The Assyrians won but “lost many men”. The Assyrian King Sennacherib was not present in the battle yet he set up a statue, an image of himself towering over the battlefield. Alexander the Great was able to see this statue when he crossed into Kilikia and his historians recorded its presence in Ingira, which would otherwise have been lost to us.
    The sea battle was fought separately in a different location and Sennacherib caused another monument to be built at the location, a temple dedicated to the Athenians, according to one translation, raising bronze pillars, a trademark of his building activity in other locations too. Lost in the translation, the actual meaning rendered as Athenians (which is highly unlikely) could perhaps be of Athena. At the mouth of the river Pyramos such a temple was situated near the town of Magarsos, yet it had an eastern air about it and many a characteristic that could be traced to Eastern styles. This serves our understanding of the story quite well. The temple was originally commissioned by Sennacherib in honor of the war goddess Anat (Ishtar) for her help in dealing with (winning?) over the Greek naval invaders of his territory. This however was not the only Greek misunderstanding related to Sennacherib’s monuments. When Alexander passed through this same stretch of land in 333BC and saw the statue of Sennacherib, his advisors misread the inscription on the statue into an exhortation to fornication as the meaning of life! No comment on that…
    Assyrians were not seafarers and their skill in naval combat, even in the relative confines of a river’s mouth, has never been celebrated. Still, even if the claims of “truthful” celebration of his victory mentioned in the inscriptions found at the monuments are more akin to those of the Egyptian Pharaoh after the battle of Qadesh (now considered a near save for him and a far cry from victory), than his other claims of victory during his brilliant campaigning career, the fact remains that Sennacherib himself was not present at the battle. So “truthful” reporting of the facts has already taken a hit. Coupled with the heavy fighting and many losses taken by the Assyrians mentioned in the Assyrian texts there is a real possibility that this was a form of royal propaganda so common both at the time and in previous eras. Yet it really makes little difference. Regardless of the outcome, after the battles the Greeks either left or were chased out of Kilikia and Sennacherib reclaimed it as his own, undisputed. Some claim that after this part of the Mediterranean was made inaccessible to the Greeks they turned to the West and relied more heavily in trade with the West and Graecia Magna. Ironically the Hittites forbidding the Greeks to trade with Assyrians at a time long past may have caused great conflict that spilled all over the eastern Mediterranean. Now the Assyrians were pushing the Greeks out of trade colonies in what was once Hittite territory.
    According to Herodotus after a major battle between the expanding Medes and Lydian kingdom a treaty was agreed upon by the two kingdoms, under the auspices of the kings of Babylonia and Kilikia, which leads us to believe that Kilikia was independent around the 600s BC. Neriglissar of the Neo-Babylonian kingdom annexed Kilikia later on (559-556BC). After Babylon was taken by Cyrus the Great, Kilikia was incorporated to the great Persian Empire of the Achaemenids. It was conquered again by Alexander the Great, after his spectacular victory at the battle of Issos. Following Alexander’s death and until the end of the end of the 4th century BC Kilikia was under Antigonos Monophthalmos’s rule and a treasury was set at Cyinda. After his demise, Kilikia came under the Ptolemies, but for the next decades changed hands a number of times during the Diadochi Wars. It was contested during the First Syrian War (274-271BC), but Ptolemy retained it and added to it other parts of southern Asia Minor. In the Second Syrian War (260-253BC) these conquests were largely unmade and the territory became part of the Seleucid Empire. In the Third Syrian War (246-241BC) the Ptolemies enjoyed great success and retook Kilikia among other more spectacular achievements, such as reaching Babylon and occupying Antiocheia. In the Fourth Syrian War (219-217BC) Antiochos III Megas reclaimed large swathes of land from Ptolemaic control, including most of Kilikia. The rest of it he would bring to the fold toward the end of the Fifth Syrian War (202-195BC) after his undisputed success in solidifying Coele Syria as Seleucid territory, following the battle of Panion. After 187BC, as a result of the Battle of Magnesia, Kilikia became Seleucid borderland with a number of “independent” buffer states, between the Romans and the Seleucids. It remained virtually uncontested, until the death of Antiochos VII Sidetes, after which the Empire began to disintegrate under the pressure of Parthian conquest, Roman intervention and civil war. Kilikia Pedias as it was called became Roman territory in 103 BC after being conquered first by Marcus Antonius Orator in his campaign against pirates. Sulla acted as its first governor and foiled an attempt at invasion by Mithridates the Great of Parthia, denying him pretext and forcing him to execute his diplomat in charge of bilateral negotiations. Kilikia was organized into a province by Pompey in 64 BC which, for a short time included part of Phrygia. This happened only after Pompey Magnus had dealt with what was perhaps the largest pirate enterprise in the history of the Mediterranean, which was mounted from bases in Kilikia. From Kilikia pirates radiated to secondary bases and threatened the grain supply to Rome, among other things. Anything that threatened Rome's grain supply was cause for panic. Still the threat was very real and wide-spread. Ever Julius Caesar was captured at some point and held for ransom. However, the remarkable energy and talent for organization that characterized Rome at the time, found in Pompey the perfect agent for the job. An extensive, well-coordinated land and sea campaign was mounted, that eliminated the secondary bases and forced the pirates back to Kilikia where they were thoroughly destroyed… or so the story went. Some form of treaty or payoff is likely, with Pompey as chief negotiator. This was standard practice, but not as dignified and seldom acknowledged; Rome's generals were supposed to wage and win wars, not buy their enemies off.
    Kilikia was reorganized by Julius Caesar, in 47 BC and in 27 BC became part of the province Syria-Kilikia Phoenice. At first the western district was left independent under native kings or priest-dynasts as it had been since ancient times, and a small kingdom, under Tarcondimotus I, was left in the east. These were finally incorporated to the province by Vespasian in 72 AD.
    Kilikia would eventually conquer Rome… after a fashion; when men from Isauria, an area between Rough Kilikia and Eastern Pisidia (which could be claimed by both regions), sat on the throne of the Eastern Roman Empire in Constantinople, long after Rome had repeatedly been burned and plundered by barbarians, lost its preeminence, its relevance and glamour.
    Strategy
    Kilikia has always been coveted by the powers ascendant in the region, as it grants access to northern Syria and includes a geopolitical drawbridge for the Taurus mountain-fortress in the Kilikian Gates.
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  6. #276
    Lost between books & coins Member DeathFinger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Thanks, it will be added in the ext release

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  7. #277
    Member Member Eliasmanos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Hi guys :) The region of Corinth could perhaps be named more precisely (especially in comparison with Sparta). The term Peloponnesus is applied to the whole peninsula of S.Greece, not only the north part of the peninsula. It should (perhaps/imo) be called Korinthia (& Elis, since it is supposed to include Olympia). The regions in Peloponnesus are 7; Korinthia, Argolis, Arkadia, Elis, Achaea, Messine(Messinia) and Lakonia (Lakonike).

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  8. #278

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Im working on saurastra is anybody currently doing this?

  9. #279
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Chap View Post
    Im working on saurastra is anybody currently doing this?
    Not that I know of, no...

  10. #280

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    I did this map to see where the gaps are. Its interesting to see where people have chosen to do first, and the large regions of bare history.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	eb2 provence descript.png 
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    If anyone wants to help ask first. I don't know what has been done since first release.
    Last edited by Chap; 03-11-2015 at 13:01. Reason: map update

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  11. #281
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Get in contact with @Mithridates VI Eupator I believe he either has started working on, or has a general idea for Saurashtra and Sindh among other descriptions...

    As for your map, it seems to be missing only Maiotis and Elymais, which were written, but did not make it in the first release :)

  12. #282
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Interesting perspective thanks!



  13. #283

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    I sent him a message ill see what happens

  14. #284

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    And I replied!

    To quickly reiterate what I said to Chap, Sindh and Xiyu are works in process (With Xiyu a bit further along).


    Just in general, as can be seen by the map, any assistance in the Central Steppes, the Balkans and Northern Africa would be greatly appreciated, though. You might want to get in touch with Brennus regarding the status of Gaul.


  15. #285
    iudex thervingiorum Member athanaric's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Chap View Post
    I did this map to see where the gaps are. Its interesting to see where people have chosen to do first, and the large regions of bare history.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	eb2 provence descript.png 
Views:	261 
Size:	69.4 KB 
ID:	14989

    If anyone wants to help ask first. I don't know what has been done since first release.
    I actually did write a description for Dahyu Mazsakata (one of the "grey" provinces on your map), which was received with some degree of appreciation on the Campus Martius subforum (no idea if that one still exists). However, it didn't appear in the game at all, not even in a version improved and expanded upon by someone else (instead, there's still a blank). So yeah.




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  16. #286
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Probably just got temporarily lost somewhere in the myriad random things to do.



  17. #287
    iudex thervingiorum Member athanaric's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by joshmahurin View Post
    Probably just got temporarily lost somewhere in the myriad random things to do.
    Well, I seem to have lost access to the CM and in any case, can't promise to do anything constructive in the next month or two due to real life interference. So I guess someone else needs to re-find it (and maybe amend it in case any release before Easter is planned).




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  18. #288
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    It is linked in the EBH fora, just needs to be worked on by someone, as it follows the older structure and if possible give it a more narrative nature...

    Quote Originally Posted by athanaric
    Dahyu Mazsakata


    Overview:

    (1.215.1) “These Massagetae are like the Scythians in their dress and way of life. They are both cavalry and infantry (having some of each kind), and spearmen and archers; and it is their custom to carry battle-axes. They always use gold and bronze; all their spear-points and arrow-heads and battle-axes are bronze and the adornment of their headgear and belts and girdles is gold.
    [2] They equip their horses similarly, protecting their chests with bronze breastplates and putting gold on reins, bits, and cheekplates. But they never use iron and silver, for there is none at all in their country, but gold and bronze abound.
    (1.216.1) Now for their customs: each man marries a wife, but the wives are common to all. The Greeks say this is a Scythian custom; it is not, but a custom of the Massagetae. There, when a man desires a woman, he hangs his quiver before her wagon, and has intercourse with her without fear.
    [2] Though they fix no certain term to life, yet when a man is very old all his family meet together and kill him, with beasts of the flock besides, then boil the flesh and feast on it.
    [3] This is held to be the happiest death; when a man dies of an illness, they do not eat him, but bury him in the earth, and lament that he did not live to be killed. They never plant seed; their fare is their livestock and the fish which they take in abundance from the Araxes.
    [4] Their drink is milk. The sun is the only god whom they worship; they sacrifice horses to him; the reasoning is that he is the swiftest of the gods, and therefore they give him the swiftest of mortal things.“
    Herodotos: The Histories. Book I, Chapters 215-216.


    Geography:

    The geographer Strabon writes:
    “Statements to the following effect are made concerning the Massagetae: that some of them inhabit mountains, some plains, others marshes which are formed by the rivers, and others the islands in the marshes. But the country is inundated most of all, they say, by the Araxes River, which splits into numerous branches and empties by its other mouths into the other sea on the north, though by one single mouth it reaches the Hyrcanian Gulf. […] Silver is not found in their country, and only a little iron, but brass and gold in abundance. (Strabo: Geographika, XI/8/6)”

    This region encompasses the plains between the Syr Darya, the Aral lake and the Amu Darya. This is a harsh, arid land, with hot summers, cold winters, and a dry climate. It is mostly flat and dominated by steppe vegetation and semi-deserts. The riverbanks and the shores of the great lake allow for fishing and agriculture.
    As for wildlife, there are various sorts of game, especially Saiga antelopes and wild sheep and horses as well as bustards. Even large predators such as the Caspian Tiger would occur in the wetlands. Eagles patrol the skies and, once captured and trained, are cherished hunting companions for the steppe peoples.


    History:

    Of old, these lands were populated by Iranian peoples of nomadic and pastoral tendencies. They are called “Saka” by Eastern sources and “Skythian” by the Greek. Ethnically, these would have been mainly Iranian, possibly with an admixture of Mongoloid population from the eastern parts of Central Asia.
    The eponymous Massagetae tribe rose to some literary prominence among its civilized contemporaries. According to legend, it was the Massagetae queen Tomyris whose army slew the famous King Kyros II “the Great” of Persia, when he tried to conquer her people.
    The Massagetae appear to have been a semi-nomadic people, who, besides cattle herding, also relied on other sources of sustenance. According to our source, “they never plant seed; their fare is their livestock and the fish which they take in abundance from the Araxes. [4] Their drink is milk.” (Herodotos, I.216). Another source is a little more informative:
    “Now those who live in the islands, since they have no grain to sow, use roots and wild fruits as food, and they clothe themselves with the bark of trees (for they have no cattle either), and they drink the juice squeezed out of the fruit of the trees. Those who live in the marshes eat fish, and clothe themselves in the skins of the seals that run up thither from the sea. The mountaineers themselves also live on wild fruits; but they have sheep also, though only a few, and therefore they do not butcher them, sparing them for their wool and milk; and they variegate the color of their clothing by staining it with dyes whose colors do not easily fade. The inhabitants of the plains, although they possess land, do not till it, but in the nomadic or Scythian fashion live on sheep and fish. Indeed, there not only is a certain mode of life common to all such peoples, of which I often speak, but their burials, customs, and their way of living as a whole, are alike, that is, they are self-assertive, uncouth, wild, and warlike, but, in their business dealings, straightforward and not given to deceit.(Strabo XI.8.7)” Strabo also differentiates between Saka and Massagetae.
    Archaeological finds attest to a development of a class society, with prominent burial mounds called Kurgans erected for important leaders. The political organisation of the Massagetae seems to have been monarchy. Slavery was widespread and common but developed somewhat differently from slavery tradition in Mediterranean cultures. Women are said to have held a relatively high position compared to Mediterranean cultures. However, as one source puts it, “it is not clear whether a parallel can be drawn between Saka-Massagetian society and its western neighbour, the matrilineal Sarmatian society.”1 Also, they were reported to share their wives amongst each other and to eat their dead. However, this may be a conflation of actual facts and Greek imagination.
    Like other Skythians, the Massagetae were known for goldwork, usually depicting mythological elements and scenes, especially griffins.
    Of their religion, it is said that “The sun is the only god whom they worship; they sacrifice horses to him; the reasoning is that he is the swiftest of the gods, and therefore they give him the swiftest of mortal things.“ ( Herodotos, I.216)” - which also reflects the increasing importance of the horse in those parts, which was another factor in the transition from a culture of Pastoralist cattle herders to a culture of true nomads.
    Accordingly, cavalry became increasingly important. It has been indicated that the Massagetae were the ones who first developed horse armour, thus instigating the development of the fully armoured cavalry that was the pride of ancient Iranian and Medieval European knighthood. This is hinted at even in Herodot's description of their martial traditions. Similarly, Strabo writes: “They are good horsemen and foot-soldiers; they use bows, short swords, breastplates, and sagares made of brass; and in their battles they wear headbands and belts made of gold.“
    In these parts of Central Asia, there appears to have been some form of coexistence between the nomadic Saka (or, in this particular case, Massagetae), and the sedentary farmers who settled the oases. The Skythians, much like their various successors, were of great importance to trade between East Asia on one side and Europe, the Near East, and India on the other. It was in their own economic interest to keep open extensive trade routes that connected China with Persia, so as to profit from the revenue. Especially Bukhara, the region capital, was to become an important hub of trade and cultural innovation. Even after the Turkic invasions, Sogdian traders played an important role in the Silk Road business.
    It has been said that the Massagetae were the forefathers of the Alans, who in turn not only were the ancestors of the Ossetian people, but also greatly influenced Later Sarmatian culture and left their traces all over Europe during the Migration period, reaching as far as Spain and North Africa. Medieval Persian historian Al-Biruni claims that the Alans originally dwelt at the lower Amu Darya. Also, several place names containing the name “Alan” are known from Central Asia, according to V. Kousnetsov and Y. Lebedynsky, and “It is likely that the Sako-Massagetae tribes played an important role in the ethnogenesis of the new, very mixed Turkic-language peoples in Western Central Asia (…).”



    Strategy:

    Any conqueror of this territory will find themselves faced with stern opposition and an unforgiving continental climate, which, along with the open nature of the land, make it a daunting task to control the region. This province has the typical benefits and drawbacks of a steppe region; it will not offer many resources to sedentary factions. However, powerful and efficient nomadic cavalry troops may be available as auxiliaries. Nomadic factions should focus on developing trade routes and keeping an eye open for unwelcome visitors.

  19. #289

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    I'm looking to do the province of Heruskolandaz, but i'm having a bit of trouble understanding why the tribe of Herminones is supposed to be in this province. So far as i understand it, Heruskolandaz corresponds roughly to the Istvaeonic tribal grouping, which is distinct from the Hermionic/Irminonic group. The territory of the Hermiones seems to corresponds more accurately to Albihoimoz province (Pliny actually names the Suebi as part of the Hermionic group with the Cheruski and the Hermunduri). Wouldn't a tribe like the Chatti, Bructeri, Sugambri, Cannenifates or Batavi be more accurate as residents of this area?

    I suppose this isn't strictly relevant to a geographic description, but it would help me deliniate exactly what area i would have to describe.
    Last edited by Hugin; 03-15-2015 at 15:23.

  20. #290
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Cannot speak for the germanic FC, only @TheTank can clear this up...

    Nevertheless the borders you see in-game are those that should be written about in the description, so as far as Raurikon is concerned: the northern Rheinland should be it :)
    Afterwards I do not know what migrations and archaeological evidences were taken in consideration for the residents as of 272 BCE, still in the history section of the description you can easily cover down to the first decade of the 1st century CE, so you can speak of all those tribes too...

    It is also possible that the tribal migration buildings aren't completed yet and those are just stand-ins...

  21. #291

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    A felllow TW center user http://www.twcenter.net/forums/membe...rinElminpietra is intereseted in writing the description of Venatia, could someone please contact hi to let him know whether the province is still available?

    Also if someone from EB team could check this http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...RIPTION-THREAD! thread once in a time that would be great:D (@Arjos ?)Maybe there will be some volunteers :D
    My girlfriend plays EB (plus she is hottie). I won the universe.

  22. #292
    Member Member kurush's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Hello guys, I'm interested in helping with regional descriptions in North Africa. With whom should I talk in order to get enough info about the zones still not worked or completed?

  23. #293
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by kurush View Post
    Hello guys, I'm interested in helping with regional descriptions in North Africa. With whom should I talk in order to get enough info about the zones still not worked or completed?
    This is the current situation with Africa:

    Africa

    163. Mauretania Tingitania: Inserted Here (1)
    164. Mauretania: Inserted ("Strategy" section empty) (1)
    165. Mauretania Massaesili: Inserted (1)
    166. Mashiliem: To Do (-)
    167. Numidia: To Do (-)
    168. Gaetulia: Inserted Here (1)
    169. Atiqa: WIP Here (-)
    170. Zeugei: Inserted Here (1)
    171. Byzacena: To Do (-)
    172. Phasania: To Do (-)
    173. Syrthim: To Do (-)
    174. Kyreneia: Inserted Here (1)
    175. Numidia Massylii: To Do (-)
    176. Libye: To Do (-)
    178. Delta Neilou: Inserted Here (1)
    179. Heptanomis: Inserted Here (1)
    180. Thebaïs: Inserted Here (1)
    182. Oasis Megale: Inserted Here (2)
    183. Triakontaschoinos: To Do (-)
    184. Kush: Inserted Here (1)
    185. Erythraia: To Do (-)
    186. Di'amat: To Do (Has a very short "trade resources" description in-game) (-)
    199. Eremos: No building

  24. #294
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliasmanos View Post
    Hi guys :) The region of Corinth could perhaps be named more precisely (especially in comparison with Sparta). The term Peloponnesus is applied to the whole peninsula of S.Greece, not only the north part of the peninsula. It should (perhaps/imo) be called Korinthia (& Elis, since it is supposed to include Olympia). The regions in Peloponnesus are 7; Korinthia, Argolis, Arkadia, Elis, Achaea, Messine(Messinia) and Lakonia (Lakonike).
    @paullus your thoughts?



  25. #295

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    iv finished Saurashtra that history took along time. I'm just doing the travelers log now its going to be a mauryan spy :)

    Member thankful for this post:

    Arjos 


  26. #296

    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Great, looking forward to Reading it.

    Don't make the traveler's log overly actiony or character driven. Whatever province you read about, you should feel that the "traveler" could really be you. At the same time, it should really be like a slightly more immersive summary of the following, more academic, texts about history, geography etc.
    Last edited by Mithridates VI Eupator; 04-08-2015 at 16:13.


  27. #297
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Yes it is supposed to be from the perspective of any generic traveler visiting the region, nothing specific or it won't make sense to everyone's circumstances. But very glad to see another province only done :) Thank you for taking the time and effort!
    Last edited by joshmahurin; 04-08-2015 at 19:18.



  28. #298
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Arjos View Post
    Cannot speak for the germanic FC, only @TheTank can clear this up...

    Nevertheless the borders you see in-game are those that should be written about in the description, so as far as Raurikon is concerned: the northern Rheinland should be it :)
    Afterwards I do not know what migrations and archaeological evidences were taken in consideration for the residents as of 272 BCE, still in the history section of the description you can easily cover down to the first decade of the 1st century CE, so you can speak of all those tribes too...

    It is also possible that the tribal migration buildings aren't completed yet and those are just stand-ins...
    @cmacq



  29. #299
    Minister of Useless Tidbits Member joshmahurin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Quote Originally Posted by Arjos View Post
    It is linked in the EBH fora, just needs to be worked on by someone, as it follows the older structure and if possible give it a more narrative nature...
    @athanaric would you feel like making a Travelers log section for this description and bringing it more in line with our current format? If not @Arjos or @tobymoby would you be capable of at least adding the Travelers log?



  30. #300
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regional Descriptions: Help the EBII Team

    Right now I'm writing Paphlagonia, so don't know...

    Regardless it is also missing "The People, Society and Government", or rather some informations are there, just need to be edited...

    Will see what I can do...

    BTW Chap, for the sake of tallying, you can consider Dahyu Alanna WIP too :)
    Last edited by Arjos; 04-08-2015 at 22:56.

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