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Thread: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

  1. #781

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    It's hard to take such a position seriously.

    'Racial differences exist. How do we know? Because we have crude racial typologies in place. Why is that so? Because racial differences exist.'

    So long as you refuse to accept basic facts of reality and continue to indulge in 0-step circular reasoning it will never be possible to have a productive discussion with you on this issue.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


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  2. #782
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades;2053620705; asterisks added by SF
    So there was something about issa... isis... is... issl... whatever, someone seemed worried about that... thing. Seemed important. Enough to make a 10 page thread over almost. What was it?... I seem to have forgotten, having a thread hiijacked by racist bull**** just does that to me sometimes.
    Grammar concern here 'blades. I believe that "racist bull****" is functionally redundant.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

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  3. #783
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    That's quite OK.. I will of course in return whiff you off as someone who hasn't understood that ethnical differences exist.
    Again...all of the differences that matter most to you are more likely cultural in character than ethnic. Ethnicity has only been conclusively linked to a few physical differences -- percentage of twitch muscle fibers, melanin content, etc -- which are not particularly earth-shaking.

    When you have a greater degree of variation (genetically, phenotypically, etc.) WITHIN a given "race" than you do between "races," it becomes harder to consider the category significant in a statistical or scientific fashion.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." -- H. L. Mencken

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  4. #784
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    I already hinted you at the Minnesota transracial adoption study... You couldn't just highlight and google it? There are plenty more examples, let me know if you want to be get informed :)
    No need to do that, when that study was among the ones I linked to in my above post.

    Naturally, it does not support your point.

    Also this.
    Last edited by HoreTore; 10-16-2014 at 08:15.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  5. #785
    Member Member Tuuvi's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    Are. You. On. Drugs.

    You basically claim there are no asian or black people. This is preposterous. Of course people breed across "the lines", but when you start to count people in the number of millions you can easily see ethnical differences.
    Some people are born in Asia and there are people with dark skin and black coiled hair. But due to the gene flow between these different populations there is not much of a genetic distinction separating them from each other. Black skin and epicanthic folds are just that, black skin and epicanthic folds. They don't say very much about the rest of the Black or Asian genome.

    Pretty much all of modern science would disagree with that. You basically say that culture does not impact on the evolutionary scale.
    This is exactly what I was saying. Do you have a modern scientific source that explains how culture impacts human evolution? I have a hard time seeing how something that is in a state of flux could influence the course of evolution in a short amount of time. (tens of thousands of years is not a long time time at all on an evolutionary scale). Show me a credible source (and I mean credible, not some pseudo-scientific bullshit from a non-peer reviewed open-access journal) and I will admit I was wrong and cede the point.

    Well then read the actual report. East Asians did well, black people did not.

    "Confounding factors" is a PC way of saying "let's not touch this".

    As soon as you start to read data, instead of having some filter on how you should read data, the realization will probably be shocking to you.

    You can interpret that black people do worse on modern intelligence tests in any and every way you want. Bottom line will still be that they do worse on intelligence tests.

    You can make any excuses for it that you want, but it really doesn't matter, as they will still show the results they do.
    But WHY. Why do Black people do worse on intelligence tests? Is it primarily because of environment or is their a genetic factor as well? I thought that's what the Minnesota study was trying to find out. I did not deny that the Black children in the study scored worse than the White and Asian children. But if several researchers, including the authors of the study, did not find the results of the study to support the existence of a genetic cause for lower Black IQ's, than the Minnesota study does not support your claim for innate racial differences in intelligence as much as you think. I'm sorry but I trust scientists' ability to interpret data more than I do yours.

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  6. #786

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    If "black" is a credible racial classification by Kad's interpretation, then he will have to explain why "red-headed" or "lactose-intolerant" or "Rh-positive" should not be admitted as well.

    See, this is the stuff that happens when you start with "fuck n*****s" and try to move from there.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


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  7. #787
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post

    I declare you a member of the Fragony race, Kad.
    If you are trying to be insulting, that is really not going to work, I am only insulted if someone who I respect insults me, and you are not one of them. You are way too normal.

  8. #788

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Forget it guys, if my Starcraft analogy did not convince him, I don't know what will.

    Hmmmm, I guess I could ask Kad if he thinks Scandinavians are naturally better CounterStrike players....


  9. #789
    Banned Kadagar_AV's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Heya guys, sorry I've been busy...

    I'd like to answer you all, however, have had little time lately. Anyway, my answer will be in the longer region as there are some sources I'd like to bring up and also explain.

    Also, this is an ISIS thread... And as ISIS is an ongoing thing, I'm not sure we should derail this further? The main discussion is valid enough.

    I think I'll just start a new thread when I have time (this weekend). Hope no one minds

  10. #790

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    @HoreTore, just tangentially:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Quote Originally Posted by Smith, Fred H., and James C. Ahern. The Origins of Modern Humans: Biology Reconsidered. pp. 371-372. John Wiley & Sons, 2013.
    A Focus on Processes: Was There a Human Revolution?
    There is a long-standing debate over the causes and significance of the so-called “human
    revolution” in Europe—the “explosion” of expressions of symbolic behavior and complex
    social relationships manifested in the Upper Paleolithic archeological record (Soffer, 1992,
    1994; R. White, 1982, 1989). While some workers see the “human revolution” as cultural
    change within a species (Clark, 2002; Wolpoff et al., 2004), others believe it represents the
    biologically based cognitive superiority of modern humans. The problem is, that as traditionally
    described, anatomical modernity predates behavioral modernity. Some advocates
    of a biological basis for behavioral modernity (e.g., Klein, 2008) attribute it to a neural
    change linked to human language some 50,000 years ago that doesn’t manifest itself anatomically;
    others see it as a latent potential of modern humans.16 However, these innovations
    of the Upper Paleolithic can alternatively be understood as a consequence of demographic
    influence, expanding human populations, without requiring an explanation based on
    biological changes in cognitive capacity. Moreover, there is considerable debate over whether
    a human revolution actually exists at all.
    Various trait lists defining “modernity” have been critically assessed by Henshilwood and
    Marean (2003 and in the Current Anthropology commentary following). Recently, the very
    idea of any single trait list signifying modernity has been undermined by the 2000 publication
    of “The Revolution that Wasn’t: A New Interpretation of the Origin of Modern Human
    Behaviour” by S. McBrearty and S. A. Brooks. While hold-outs reflecting Howell’s position
    remain (for instance, Mellars from [at least] 1973 to Mellars and French, 2011, and many
    others), this shifted much of the discussion to the African continent and emphasized the
    gradual and seemingly independent African appearances of many of the modern behaviors
    later found together in the European Upper Paleolithic. These African appearances differed
    from the European Upper Paleolithic in that they occurred over a much longer period of
    time and were ephemeral, sporadically appearing and disappearing at different times and
    places within the Middle Stone Age. Whatever modernity entailed in the archaeological
    record, it could no longer be considered as a single event.
    If the behaviors of the European Upper Paleolithic are not so distinctly different from
    behaviors of earlier Africans, the other side of the coin is that modern elements have also
    been identified in the archaeological record of European Neandertals (Caron et al., 2011;
    d’Errico et al., 2003; Morin and Laroulandie, 2012; Peresani et al., 2011; Roebroeks et al.,
    2012; Teyssandier, 2008; Zilhão, 2007, 2011; Zilhão et al., 2006) and other archaic Eurasian
    populations (Hovers and Belfer-Cohen, 2006). In the framework promoted by these and
    other workers, it is far from clear whether Neandertal archaeology has always been correctly
    interpreted.17 Primarily European observations of modern behavioral elements associated with Neandertals continue to appear in the literature; some show continuity with later
    Upper Paleolithic industries, others indicate early, unconnected appearances of evidences
    for modern behavior, often at the same time similar modern behavioral elements appeared
    in Africa (as in Roebroeks and colleagues’ [2012] discovery of an early [200–250 kya] use of
    red ochre pigmentation). All of this evidence also helps undercut the contention of a
    “human revolution” accounting for the different behaviors of the Neandertal and Upper
    Paleolithic peoples in Europe (Zilhão, 2011), a tradition of skepticism embodied in the
    writings
    of d’Errico and Zilhão separately (d’Errico, 2003; d’Errico et al., 2001, 2003; Zilhão
    2006b, 2007, 2011) and together (Zilhão et al., 2006). Combined with the African data, this
    indicates that meanings of behavioral modernity are complex and that processes accounting
    for its appearance are unlikely to be biological.
    It is increasingly clear that this is not the modernity of Howells (1969). The attributes
    associated with modern behavior likely do not have a single origin; as cited above, they
    appeared ephemerally both in African Middle Stone Age assemblages and in some
    Neandertal contexts and likely will be found more broadly around the world. Wobst (1976)
    argues that modernity may appear to have dispersed from a single origin, even if it actually
    emerged gradually in many regions. Wobst’s view is that the perception of a single origin and
    subsequent spread of modernity is a creation of the archaeological record. He demonstrates
    that the appearance of punctuation is inevitable in a model predicated on gradualism: if we
    assume modernity appeared gradually, we may expect to find what he calls a “cone of
    modernity” created by viewing the past from the cone’s base in the present. Because of preservation
    bias, more ancient time slices produce smaller and smaller samples of things that
    are modern, until there is an earliest. Such a cone would give the illusion that modernity had
    a single origin in Africa, where there were more people and therefore more evidence of
    modern traits. But the increasing presence of modern artifacts when approaching the present
    does not necessarily mean that modernity spread from a single point of origin (its earliest
    appearance in the record); on the contrary, this would violate the predicating assumption
    of the model that modernity arose gradually.
    Wobst (1977) also discusses social reasons why stylistic changes in (or the attachment of
    style to) classes of artifacts may appear abruptly once those artifacts become vehicles for
    social signaling. Many of the features of behavioral modernity may be linked to information
    exchange within and between groups, conveying broad information to recipients about
    identity,
    ownership, authorship, proscription and prescription, religion, and potentially
    other variables. Intended recipients should be socially distant (so that conversation was not
    common) but not so remote that they wouldn’t be able to decode the messages. Wobst argues
    that style, the attachment of such cultural messages to classes of artifacts, will “appear”
    revolutionary
    largely because of dangers of miscommunication. Once meaning is attached,
    style should quickly pervade that class of material culture, and one should expect relative
    uniformity within a social group; as Wobst argues using examples from mid-twentieth-century
    Yugoslavia, the dangers of being associated with the wrong social group, or inadvertently
    sending the wrong message, force rapid conformity of dress (in this case headdresses)
    within groups. Ultimately, as discussed below, demographic factors, especially population
    expansion, would increase the number of individuals in and relations between these distant
    but not-too-remote social groups, potentially leading to the intentional use of artifacts for
    information exchange and the appearance of a cultural revolution.


    EDIT: The upshot is:

    Quote Originally Posted by p. 381
    We believe that expanding population sizes and increasing numbers, driven by great
    improvements in adult survivorship, underlie the archaeological manifestations of behavioral
    modernity.
    Last edited by Montmorency; 10-18-2014 at 05:13.
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


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  11. #791
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Looks like IS found it's Waterloo in Kobani. Go team Kurdistan.

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  12. #792

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Looks like IS found it's Waterloo in Kobani. Go team Kurdistan.
    Waterloo or Stalingrad ?

  13. #793
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Decent_Greek View Post
    Waterloo or Stalingrad ?
    No idea really, I don't understand what's going on. That it is s an absolute nightmare I got.

  14. #794
    Member Member Crandar's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Looks like IS found it's Waterloo in Kobani. Go team Kurdistan.
    Let's not be too optimist. Kurdish propaganda (just a couple of days ago, it was discovered that the pictures of female fighters in Ayn al-Arab are two years old) is a worthy opponent for the ISIS tweets in that Middle-Eastern Goebbels competition.

    Meanwhile, the Syrian and Iraqi Armies lost Saquer Island and Qara Tapa respectively.

  15. #795

    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Light infantry vs light infantry

    So brittle...
    Vitiate Man.

    History repeats the old conceits
    The glib replies, the same defeats


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  16. #796
    Ranting madman of the .org Senior Member Fly Shoot Champion, Helicopter Champion, Pedestrian Killer Champion, Sharpshooter Champion, NFS Underground Champion Rhyfelwyr's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    I wonder if ISIS planned all along for the assault on Kobane to be a diversion. Being on the Turkish border and bringing Turkey's Kurds onto the scene was always going to concentrate international attention on that area. Has this just been giving them freedom to make more strategically important gains elsewhere?

    Maybe a bit like when they stormed into Iraq where everybody was looking at Syria.
    At the end of the day politics is just trash compared to the Gospel.

  17. #797
    Member Member Crandar's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    I doubt that they planned to use the assault at Kobane as a diversion, from the begining, but the losses of Qara Tapa and Saqer Island indicate that they might have changed their strategy, when the western media started to focus solely on the Syrian Kurds.

    The air bombings target almost exclusively the ISIS forces of Kobane, which might allow them to operate elsewhere much more freely.

    Of course, Kobane now has got a huge symbolic value, apart from his strategic/tactical importance, which probably explains how the West chooses her bombing priorities.

  18. #798
    Senior Member Senior Member Brenus's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    "Waterloo" Err...
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. Voltaire.

    "I've been in few famous last stands, lad, and they're butcher shops. That's what Blouse's leading you into, mark my words. What'll you lot do then? We've had a few scuffles, but that's not war. Think you'll be man enough to stand, when the metal meets the meat?"
    "You did, sarge", said Polly." You said you were in few last stands."
    "Yeah, lad. But I was holding the metal"
    Sergeant Major Jackrum 10th Light Foot Infantery Regiment "Inns-and-Out"

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  19. #799
    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Crandar View Post
    when the western media started to focus solely on the Syrian Kurds.
    I think we need to drop this "western media/western opinion"-thing.

    While we do get a kick out of believing the world revolves around us, it's time to realize that it doesn't. While ISIS does send the occasional message our way, the primary targets of their communications are the Iraqi's, Syrians and its surroundings. Just like when Saddam was very ambigious about his supposed WMD's, he wasn't trying to tell us that he had them. He was warning the Iranians.


    Not saying your post is wrong btw, just pointing out one issue....
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

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  20. #800
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Brenus View Post
    "Waterloo" Err...
    Wut, that's the name of the place

  21. #801
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Yeah I dont get it either, waterloo was the end of the war, last I checked ISIS is still kicking.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


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  22. #802
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    Yeah I dont get it either, waterloo was the end of the war, last I checked ISIS is still kicking.
    Hence 'looks like', not 'it is'. By now we know it isn't.

  23. #803
    Member Member Crandar's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    I think we need to drop this "western media/western opinion"-thing.

    While we do get a kick out of believing the world revolves around us, it's time to realize that it doesn't. While ISIS does send the occasional message our way, the primary targets of their communications are the Iraqi's, Syrians and its surroundings. Just like when Saddam was very ambigious about his supposed WMD's, he wasn't trying to tell us that he had them. He was warning the Iranians.


    Not saying your post is wrong btw, just pointing out one issue....
    I mentioned them as a connection with the bombing campaign which basically concerns the western powers, not with the infantry operations.
    There is a possibility that they deliberately target the ISIS forces in Kobane, in order to get a moral victory, considering that the public opinion of their countries, because of the media coverage, is almost excusively interested in the fighting with the Syrian Kurds, ignoring the other frontiers.

  24. #804
    Banned Kadagar_AV's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Swedish media is big on US miss-dropping army materials (guns etc) to ISIS...

    Who cares, they already have Millions worth of stuff from when they shooed away the Irak Army...

  25. #805
    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Was Waterloo the location of the battle or the place the messages about having won the battle sent from?
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
    Pape for global overlord!!
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  26. #806
    Banned Kadagar_AV's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio View Post
    Was Waterloo the location of the battle or the place the messages about having won the battle sent from?
    It's an ABBA song.

    Just google it.

  27. #807
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    People have culture in Australia it seems, non-sunni imam got shot. See there is the difference between immigrants and colonists. Immigrants leave their shit behind, colonists bring it with them.

    Let things burn, and see who is left.

    That would be us, lefties will realise it affects their comfortable highly moral bliss as well once they can't find a decent school or neighbourhood.

    Never more true http://www.brucespeaks.com/myblog/wp...-blind-too.gif
    Last edited by Fragony; 11-03-2014 at 09:32.

  28. #808
    Member Member Crandar's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Any link for the shot imam?
    The only one I found speaks generally about a man shot in front og a shia mosque. Furthermore, only sunni mosques have imams as a leading official, in shia, imams have much more superior roles.

    Finally, how do we know he wasn't shot by an upset christian-fascist, instead of the muslim version?

  29. #809
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    No reliable one sorry, right for now it's a 'seems like', link has been removed so it's probably bull

  30. #810
    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

    Quite a few sources for this

    http://www.9news.com.au/national/201...ey-shooting-pm

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-0...ooting/5864818

    ""Obviously we saw the attack on two policemen in Victoria a month or so back," he said.

    "It seems there is an ISIL death cult influence on this shooting in Sydney in the last 24 hours or so.

    "The important thing is for all of us to absolutely reject this death cult."

    Mr Abbott said the Federal Government was responding to the "new and virulent threat" domestically and abroad.

    "We have a potent military force which is already striking hard against ISIL in Iraq," he said.

    "We've also put money aside to boost our community harmony programs."" - Australian PM
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogbeastegg View Post
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