Emma Watson nude...

[Montmorency]

Viking, you missed the point.

Essentially no-one is saying that celebrities are to blame for this because they took nude pictures

Actually, quite a few people are doing this. There's a whole Internet beyond this 100-member backroom.

It would of course be a philosophically absurd position to take.

See my Deflationary Theory of Responsibility...

[Viking]

Viking, you missed the point.

Actually, quite a few people are doing this. There's a whole Internet beyond this 100-member backroom.

Then may I suggest you seek these people out where they are making such statements and argue against their views there, as arguing against them here without specifiers amounts to straw manning. Clarity of communication, and all that.

I also assert that "quite a few", when compared to the population at large, does not disqualify the qualifier 'essentially' - i.e. those are fringe views. Of course, from those who do not take any nude pictures themselves, the conscious choice that taking them is, there is no guarantee for much sympathy - but indeed for other reasons than victim blaming.

[Montmorency]

arguing against them here without specifiers amounts to straw manning.

Laughably incorrect, and so far that is what you have been doing.

i.e. those are fringe views.

What makes you say that? There's certainly a vocal fringe that expresses these views, and certain others of a similar theme, quite vociferously, but

[Kadagar_AV]

I don't get where the discussion went?

Granted, this is a common occurrence in the Backroom, but still.

Have there been any victim blaming going on? Specially since there are no nudes (just a debate on the free internet).

I haven't seen any? People have expressed that one can't be too naive and get away with it... That however doesn't de-criminalize the offenders.


If western girls act like they do in the typical club, at a house party with mainly muslim guys... Well, it would be advised against.

Not because the girls shouldn't have the right to act as they please... But because they can't use "I'm not to blame if I get raped" as some sort of shield to protect them from harm.

[Viking]

Laughably incorrect

Do you have a better term for kicking in open doors? More specifically, the open doors right next to the ones that other people are actually trying to keep closed..

What makes you say that? There's certainly a vocal fringe that expresses these views, and certain others of a similar theme, quite vociferously, but

Well, for starters, I have yet to see anyone express such a view. Not that I've been looking for them.

[a completely inoffensive name]

This discussion here is exactly why I don't get involved in this chat. It's amazing the gymnastics people will do to justify stuff.

I know, what is the point of sharing my view if I am just going to come across who disagree with me.

[HopAlongBunny]

I know, what is the point of sharing my view if I am just going to come across who disagree with me.

How can you say that!!!???

[Viking]

I don't get where the discussion went?

Granted, this is a common occurrence in the Backroom, but still.

Have there been any victim blaming going on? Specially since there are no nudes (just a debate on the free internet).

To introduce som actual victim blaming in this thread: since your thread has such a clickbait title, it deserves to be abused.

[AntiDamascus]

I know, what is the point of sharing my view if I am just going to come across who disagree with me.

Yea that's precisely the reason

[HoreTore]

To introduce som actual victim blaming in this thread: since your thread has such a clickbait title, it deserves to be abused.

That title was walking around showing its bare letters to the world.

Slut.

[a completely inoffensive name]

How can you say that!!!???

Well first, all statements begin as a thought in the brain so lets start there. Electro-chemical synapses activate in response to stimuli......

Yea that's precisely the reason

Well it is. You said so yourself. You don't want to talk to people that do "mental gymnastics" to reach certain conclusions you disagree with. That's fine, but don't pretend that you are doing anything different than my Fox news watching relatives who can't believe the "mental gymnastics" that those dirty liberals perform.

If I decided to walk away every time someone said something nonsensical or absurd here in the Org, I would have abandoned the global warming thread, the vaccine thread, the gay marriage thread, and any political thread where Dawg decided to open his mouth. I just figure they have had experiences I never had, so I don't understand the opinions they base off those experiences.

[AntiDamascus]

Well it is. You said so yourself. You don't want to talk to people that do "mental gymnastics" to reach certain conclusions you disagree with. That's fine, but don't pretend that you are doing anything different than my Fox news watching relatives who can't believe the "mental gymnastics" that those dirty liberals perform.

If I decided to walk away every time someone said something nonsensical or absurd here in the Org, I would have abandoned the global warming thread, the vaccine thread, the gay marriage thread, and any political thread where Dawg decided to open his mouth. I just figure they have had experiences I never had, so I don't understand the opinions they base off those experiences.

I like this line of thinking. It's basically telling me that if I had come to this thread and everyone was shouting "Women are sluts!" and I said the same thing, your answer would also be the same.

"Sure the line of reasoning is nonsensical, self serving and ultimately hypocritical, but if you don't engage them, you're no better than those rightwing shut-ins that think Obama is the anti-christ."

It's the same reason I don't argue with the guys who think airlines are releasing chemtrails or 9/11 was an inside job. Not every opinion is equal and some should just be ignored.

[a completely inoffensive name]

I like this line of thinking. It's basically telling me that if I had come to this thread and everyone was shouting "Women are sluts!" and I said the same thing, your answer would also be the same.

Not really but ok. I've had outbursts when certain members made blanket accusations about gay people without any justification other than "icky" and I have decided to just ignore that from now on. I don't see anyone in here making such a blanket statement about women, the only person who could be borderline victim blaming is the OP, but even there I think he just wants to make some half hearted argument about internet censorship, not about female privacy.

"Sure the line of reasoning is nonsensical, self serving and ultimately hypocritical, but if you don't engage them, you're no better than those rightwing shut-ins that think Obama is the anti-christ."

It's the same reason I don't argue with the guys who think airlines are releasing chemtrails or 9/11 was an inside job. Not every opinion is equal and some should just be ignored.

Fair enough. But if you are going to ignore the backroom, why bother posting in it to tell us we are all sexist pigs and that you will not engage us?

[AntiDamascus]

Not really but ok. I've had outbursts when certain members made blanket accusations about gay people without any justification other than "icky" and I have decided to just ignore that from now on. I don't see anyone in here making such a blanket statement about women, the only person who could be borderline victim blaming is the OP, but even there I think he just wants to make some half hearted argument about internet censorship, not about female privacy.

That wasn't really my point. My point was it sounded like it almost an obligation to participate. It wasn't "they're right" or "they make good points" it was "if you don't engage them, you don't listen to other opinions you ostrich with your head in the sand!"

The mental gymnastics fall to two real points. The first is "how dare someone use networked storage, don't you know they can be hacked!?" It's such a weird justification. If I'm at the grocery store and someone pushes me over and steals my phone, I should have left it at home in a lock box if I valued it so much? Or if I'm in there and someone steals my car. "Well you know people steal cars all the time. You shouldn't have one if you really didn't want it to get stolen" You could take that line and remove "cars" and add in "naked pictures" and that's the argument we have. Cars are stolen all the time. Homes are broken into all the time. No one says "You shouldn't have had a TV in that house, if you really valued it, you would have kept it in a lock box"

But this whole "how safe is safe" is besides the point. This is all just justification for washing our hands on looking at dem titties. Notice I said "our" I'm not singling any person out. This is just a "well, that's our internet" Which leads to point two.

The other weird thing about this is the "let the internet be free!" cry that has also gone up. Free from what exactly? Roadblocks from naked pictures being taken? That is what we're talking about. This seems like an odd place to shoehorn a net neutrality or copyright law argument in since this didn't involve any of those. The only thing I can pull from that is some people are pro naked picture stealing? Cause if it's about net neutrality, why talk about here?

Fair enough. But if you are going to ignore the backroom, why bother posting in it to tell us we are all sexist pigs and that you will not engage us?

Oh I don't ignore the backroom. I just ignore the threads that go off the rails, which is sadly most of them. I still post in news of the weird and the video one but there are threads just simply not worth wading into. I actually kind of regret posting in this one but I was slightly upset that a thread about someone threatening to release stolen naked pictures boiled down to "serves them right" and "oh no, our internet".

[a completely inoffensive name]

That wasn't really my point. My point was it sounded like it almost an obligation to participate. It wasn't "they're right" or "they make good points" it was "if you don't engage them, you don't listen to other opinions you ostrich with your head in the sand!"

The mental gymnastics fall to two real points. The first is "how dare someone use networked storage, don't you know they can be hacked!?" It's such a weird justification. If I'm at the grocery store and someone pushes me over and steals my phone, I should have left it at home in a lock box if I valued it so much? Or if I'm in there and someone steals my car. "Well you know people steal cars all the time. You shouldn't have one if you really didn't want it to get stolen" You could take that line and remove "cars" and add in "naked pictures" and that's the argument we have. Cars are stolen all the time. Homes are broken into all the time. No one says "You shouldn't have had a TV in that house, if you really valued it, you would have kept it in a lock box"

But this whole "how safe is safe" is besides the point. This is all just justification for washing our hands on looking at dem titties. Notice I said "our" I'm not singling any person out. This is just a "well, that's our internet" Which leads to point two.

The other weird thing about this is the "let the internet be free!" cry that has also gone up. Free from what exactly? Roadblocks from naked pictures being taken? That is what we're talking about. This seems like an odd place to shoehorn a net neutrality or copyright law argument in since this didn't involve any of those. The only thing I can pull from that is some people are pro naked picture stealing? Cause if it's about net neutrality, why talk about here?

Oh I don't ignore the backroom. I just ignore the threads that go off the rails, which is sadly most of them. I still post in news of the weird and the video one but there are threads just simply not worth wading into. I actually kind of regret posting in this one but I was slightly upset that a thread about someone threatening to release stolen naked pictures boiled down to "serves them right" and "oh no, our internet".

You misinterpreted me, because I was not saying you are obligated to do anything. I never said it was your duty to stand here and fight the good fight, I just found it odd to pop in just to say 'you people are wrong, and I have no time for this, good bye' and I guess I did not understand why.

I'm done with this thread. What a joke this whole thing is. I'm not going to respond to the rest of what you said AntiDamascus, nothing I read in this thread I interpreted as "they deserved it" but maybe I am just an idiot that gives people's arguments here too much of the benefit of the doubt. I'm sorry if I offended you.

[Noncommunist]

The other weird thing about this is the "let the internet be free!" cry that has also gone up. Free from what exactly? Roadblocks from naked pictures being taken? That is what we're talking about. This seems like an odd place to shoehorn a net neutrality or copyright law argument in since this didn't involve any of those. The only thing I can pull from that is some people are pro naked picture stealing? Cause if it's about net neutrality, why talk about here?

I suppose if you were to strip the naked aspect from the issue and simply focus on the fact that private pictures were stolen, then it could lead into an internet freedom argument. Obviously, these celebrities are not letting their pictures be free to enrich the world and thus are just as bad as the evil music producer companies that jealously prevent their soul uplifting songs to permeate through the masses without exacting a toll.

I'm not sure how net neutrality plays into it unless the FCC slows down the internet for stolen celebrity pics.

[Kadagar_AV]

Oh I don't ignore the backroom. I just ignore the threads that go off the rails, which is sadly most of them. I still post in news of the weird and the video one but there are threads just simply not worth wading into. I actually kind of regret posting in this one but I was slightly upset that a thread about someone threatening to release stolen naked pictures boiled down to "serves them right" and "oh no, our internet".

I never said "serves them right" or anything like that in the OP. I think you read wayyyy to much into my simple line there.

I don't know how it was in other places, but in Sweden and many of the sites I visit, this sparked a debate on the free internet. The whole thing WAS a hoax about the free internet. I wanted to spread that discussion here, from the perspective offered from this Emma-Watson-Happening...

Thread Title unfortunately might have been a tad to alluring for our more base parts of the brain.


Regardless, what I really wanted to say is that you REALLY miss out on the Backroom if you ignore threads going out of rail, as it's as often as not there you find the most interesting discussions. I think one of the strengths of this forum is that the posters very much themselves decide a direction for a thread, and how it should windle along...

Other forum lacks this "lax" moderation, and thus creativity dies and threads become more... Stale?

[Sp4]

So, sexual crimes against women should be tolerated because, once again, those stupid sluts haven't taken measures to specifically protect themselves?

The thing is, those stupid sluts are at the very best not educated enough to protect themselves. I propose we start WW3 now so we can move past this day and age and start over/move on.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

The thing is, those stupid sluts are at the very best not educated enough to protect themselves. I propose we start WW3 now so we can move past this day and age and start over/move on.

Because our species' track record of significant socio-cultural improvements following major wars is so consistent.....

[Sp4]

Because our species' track record of significant socio-cultural improvements following major wars is so consistent.....

Socio-cultural is the problem though isn't it? A good old world war should get rid of that.

[Hax]

Thread Title unfortunately might have been a tad to alluring for our more base parts of the brain.

wow, so you're not even afraid of admitting that you've just posted this title as clickbait.

it's 2014, and we're still having this discussion. stay classy.

[Kadagar_AV]

wow, so you're not even afraid of admitting that you've just posted this title as clickbait.

it's 2014, and we're still having this discussion. stay classy.

Thread titles is an art of its own... Why do you hate art?

[Hax]

then you're the worst artist I've ever met, if the best thing that you can come up with is "Emma Watson nude..."

truly the mark of a genius.

[Kadagar_AV]

truly the mark of a genius.

I'll just skip past the dumb parts of your post... And thank you

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Thread is tired and needs a nap.