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Thread: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 2.0 testing

  1. #1
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default EB2 Vegetation&lighting 2.0 testing

    The focus of this was to adress some of the issues with the lighting and vegetation from the first release.
    Thus the following areas have undergone changes:
    -fog and lighting
    -grass and ground textures
    -vegetation distribution tweaks

    Comparisons:

    Vanila:




    EB 1.0:




    New:




    More screenshots:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


























    Download link:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/b722b1lerk...on_v2.rar?dl=0

    Install:
    Simply extract it in the EB2 data folder, eg.:
    M2TW\mods\EBII\data

    Any feedback is as always welcome.
    Last edited by Tux; 10-24-2014 at 23:52.

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  2. #2
    Member Member Orphydian's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    so what where the issues with the first release. To be honest I dont see big differences and I might like the vanilla even more. Not sure if its an autosugestion. The best way to compare them is to post exactly the same screenshots.
    Last edited by Orphydian; 10-20-2014 at 15:21.

  3. #3
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Orphydian View Post
    so what where the issues wit the first release. To be honest I dont see big differences and I might like the vanilla even more. Not sure if its an autosugestion. The best way to compare them is to post exactly the same screenshot
    There were no big issues thus no big differences.

    Best way is to check them out yourself and provide useful feedback.

    EDIT:
    I'm experimenting with a different type of grass texture:








    I would like to hear everyone's opinion on this one compared to the previous one.
    Last edited by Tux; 10-20-2014 at 18:09.

  4. #4
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    well im also interested if the sometimes to colorful vegetation in EB2 could be changed.
    but to be honest i find these sample pictures are much to dark to see any details in order to compare.

    and until now i have to say the same as Orphydian: i like the first picture, in vanilla more. ..but this is also the only brighter one in which i can see any details.

  5. #5
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Thanks to everyone for the input, I've updated a new version with further tweaks.
    So check the main post.

    Feedback is as always welcome.

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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    i love those! (although it look a bit too darkish)

  7. #7
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarkiss View Post
    i love those! (although it look a bit too darkish)
    Indeed, I've gone over the top trying to fix the over-saturation I previously did.
    Should be ok now:









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  8. #8
    Member Member Orphydian's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    still I dont know why we dont want uniform grass

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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Orphydian View Post
    still I dont know why we dont want uniform grass
    good point. is it feasible to have both 'bushy grass' and a regular one, subject to different climates perhaps?

  10. #10
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarkiss View Post
    good point. is it feasible to have both 'bushy grass' and a regular one, subject to different climates perhaps?
    It looks fake at certain when zoomed out and from certain angles, that's why.
    I did left the "bushy" ones for certain climates though.

  11. #11
    Member Member Orphydian's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    hmmm , seriously has anyone complained about grass being fake? I dont know about others but for me grass should be uniform and it kinda is by its ...definition? In any circumstances this bushes dont look less fake and they do it from...any angle?

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    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    I have no clue what you mean or what are you talking about.
    The last grass is in this post:
    http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showth...post2053621731

    It's a mix between vanilla and eb2.0 grass.
    Last edited by Tux; 10-30-2014 at 20:50.

  13. #13
    Member Member Orphydian's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    I call those "bushes" because I dont know how to call them. Those clusters orientated in all directions are too visible even from height.
    And now its much more less grass and too much exposed terain.

  14. #14
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    That's what vanilla does to a greater extent, even you said you prefer the vanila grass so I can't see what's the problem.

    EDIT:
    Most i can do tweaking the mipmaps:












































    Last edited by Tux; 10-30-2014 at 23:51.

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  15. #15
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Thank you Tux for you Work - in your last post and the one from 10.28. the Grass terrain looks much more realistic. (at least in the not so dark ones - there are still many very dark pictures where i cannot recognize anything on the ground except the silhouettes against the sky)

    As i cannot use the Graphic Enhancement Mod (works perfect in Battle but Strategy map sadly works unplayable slow ..at least on my engine) i would be very pleased if improvements regarding a more realistic look would be implemented in the next release.

    So playing now without the Enhancement Mod i often think the Vegetation especially the Grass looks unnatural. to much saturated - the green of the Grass and in most of my battles until now to much over-saturated flowers.

    I would love to have my Battles now in Grass Terrain like in your last posts ...especially the ones in your Pictures with the rainy Weather or the ones under the dark clouds.
    The last three in arid area i also find very good!

  16. #16
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleitos View Post

    As i cannot use the Graphic Enhancement Mod (works perfect in Battle but Strategy map sadly works unplayable slow ..at least on my engine) i would be very pleased if improvements regarding a more realistic look would be implemented in the next release.
    You can disable the mod, thus improving performance, while running the game, shift + f12 is the combination to toggle it.

    So playing now without the Enhancement Mod i often think the Vegetation especially the Grass looks unnatural. to much saturated - the green of the Grass and in most of my battles until now to much over-saturated flowers.

    I would love to have my Battles now in Grass Terrain like in your last posts ...especially the ones in your Pictures with the rainy Weather or the ones under the dark clouds.
    The last three in arid area i also find very good!
    I have heard that a couple of times and that's why I'm trying to adress.
    I'm aware I cannot please everybody but I won't spend further more time on this, I think it's good enough(see last images).

    Well the funny thing is all are using the same textures(the clear sky and rainy pictures use the same) but the engine's lighting is sometimes too dark(like the first textures).

    However I haven't uploaded the last version.

  17. #17
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    well, we talked about that in the Graphic Enhancement Thread already - disable the mod makes no difference ...its only in campaign map and sooo slow - i mean e.g: when currently viewing Pantikapaion and then clicking on Pergamon it takes almost a full minute until Pergamon is visible! ...and not only this longer distances - every move on Strategy Map. i wonder if no one else experienced that.? ..in Battle everything is perfect.
    ..but sadly - i liked the colors much more with the mod - i cannot use it since its in this way unplayable on Strategy map.

    well yes, i liked your last images very much - thats much more than just good enough.

  18. #18
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleitos View Post
    well, we talked about that in the Graphic Enhancement Thread already - disable the mod makes no difference ...its only in campaign map and sooo slow - i mean e.g: when currently viewing Pantikapaion and then clicking on Pergamon it takes almost a full minute until Pergamon is visible! ...and not only this longer distances - every move on Strategy Map. i wonder if no one else experienced that.? ..in Battle everything is perfect.
    ..but sadly - i liked the colors much more with the mod - i cannot use it since its in this way unplayable on Strategy map.
    Ahh yes, it's really weird since it should stop any post processing, so here some final suggestions:
    Open enbseries.ini and disable everything except bloom:
    [EFFECT]
    EnableBloom=1
    EnableOcclusion=0
    EnableReflection=0
    EnableMotionBlur=0
    EnableWater=0
    EnableShadow=0
    DepthBias0
    EnableDepthOfField=0
    DepthBias=0

    And these:
    [GLOBAL]
    UseEffect=1
    AlternativeDepth=0
    AllowAntialias=0
    BugFixMode=0
    SkipShaderOptimization=0
    QuadVertexBuffer=0

    Also check if this is enabled:
    EnableShaders_3_0=1

    So if that doesn't work I can only suggest to upgrade your graphic card since it seems a compatibility issue.

    well yes, i liked your last images very much - thats much more than just good enough.
    Thanks! Here you go the final version which undergone more tweaks than in the last screenshots:
    http://www.moddb.com/mods/europa-bar...getation-patch
    Last edited by Tux; 11-01-2014 at 11:58.

  19. #19
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    i just tried it again with these settings - but no difference. Seems to be some compatibility issue - well the Graphic Card (from 2009 a GeForceGT240) is updated but if you mean with upgrade to buy a new one - well i cannot afford that now.

    But im curious about your mod regarding the Vegetation - didn't expect that you already uploaded this as a mod - just thought this would be included in a future release.

    I extracted it first outside - 168MB didnt expect that much.. that looks like a lot of Work!

    As there are folders with the same name just as in the EB2.01 version - is it meant to replace all the old files/folders when extracting or copy them into the EB2\data Folder? (guess also recommendable to make a backup of the old ones somewhere outside.?)

    thanks,
    Kleitos

  20. #20
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleitos View Post
    i just tried it again with these settings - but no difference. Seems to be some compatibility issue - well the Graphic Card (from 2009 a GeForceGT240) is updated but if you mean with upgrade to buy a new one - well i cannot afford that now.
    Well too bad, it's a compatiblity issue then.

    But im curious about your mod regarding the Vegetation - didn't expect that you already uploaded this as a mod - just thought this would be included in a future release.
    It will be included in a future release but until then everyone can enjoy it if they don't like the previous one.

    I extracted it first outside - 168MB didnt expect that much.. that looks like a lot of Work!
    Yes it was. :)

    As there are folders with the same name just as in the EB2.01 version - is it meant to replace all the old files/folders when extracting or copy them into the EB2\data Folder? (guess also recommendable to make a backup of the old ones somewhere outside.?)

    thanks,
    Kleitos
    Yes, replaces old ones so just copy over.

  21. #21
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    I had two Battles since i installed your Vegetation Patch yesterday - so its time for a first feedback.

    it looks really great now!
    ..the over-saturation of the toxic-green Grass and the flowers before was disturbing in my opinion.
    But with your work it looks just natural.
    Also the Lighting in these two Battles was very interesting-exciting-dramatic, just right for this occasion.
    ..first i thought a bit to dark for mediterranean coastside area - but then again: it was Autumn - time for bad wheather.

    im curious about the next Battles - and in other Seasons.

    Thanks for this great Patch!
    Kleitos

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  22. #22
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleitos View Post
    Also the Lighting in these two Battles was very interesting-exciting-dramatic, just right for this occasion.
    ..first i thought a bit to dark for mediterranean coastside area - but then again: it was Autumn - time for bad wheather.
    Yeah, the engine has some weird lighting sometimes. From my tests sometimes it looks too dark and some it's ok, like in the screenshots I previewed.
    Doesn't make sense why the ground is brighter in a rainy weather than clear one...
    Last edited by Tux; 11-03-2014 at 09:11.

  23. #23
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Meanwhile, with already the forth Try as Pergamon, now including V.T.Marvin's Character-Trait-Hotfix and Quintus Javelineers-Cavalry Submod as well i had quite a lot Battles with your Vegetation&Lighting Patch.

    I also must say sorry for overemphasize my concerns about the darkness of your example Pictures.
    ...i just played all the time with to dark settings of my graphic card.
    ..some of your pictures are darker, yes - like dawn - but i can definitely see now details.

    And for the Vegetation now in all those Battles since Installation of your Mod: really well done - absolutely recommended for anyone who will play now EB2.01.
    I wouldnt play without it anymore - as mentioned, it was unrealistic too colorful before and therefore disturbing.

    i also use now the Graphic Enhancement Mod - i just copy in the Files always before a Battle and take them out after it. ..yes some additional ending and starting of the Game necessary but it became a habit - therefore i get the best views possible now.

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  24. #24
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    After many more Battles now i have to write some more here.
    Of course my positive evaluation still stands and the view of the vegetation and lighting is much better then before.

    But i have to add some things which first i thought they are only rare annoying coincidences - but turned out to happen really often:
    First, when a Battle take place with this Patch it is so often at dawn - but not in the morning, instead it turns out after some minutes, its evening. So after i arranged my formation and marched on - it becomes dark. And so dark that it is almost unplayable. I only once played on just to see that this is not fun at all and also not realistic.
    Since then i always have to exit the Battle, load again the Save, start the Battle again and hope for other daytime.
    Well this works - but its time consuming and i wonder why are those evening Battle scenes included anyway? ...dont think this is realistic to start a Battle when it soon becomes pitch dark.

    Second, the weather situation. First i thought ok, it can be coincidence that i have to Battle so often in heavy Rain or the like. But after many Battles now - i find there is too much chance for those bad weather scenes. ..i mean i campaign in the Mediterranean Area and almost only from spring till autumn. And the weather conditions seem to match much more with England or Belgium and not Greece. Also i find this not realistic because of the other reason: why should one so often choose bad weather for a Battle.? ..i mean most of the Battles are the ones you choose to attack - so actually, in Real the Strategos decides, when to attack. ...dont think they would have chosen that often a bad weather for that.

    In a next release it would be great to make some changes here. ...Or meanwhile - how is it possible to change this conditions in this Vegetation/Lighting file?

  25. #25
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Those are present even in the vanilla EB2 and I've didn't found any fixes for them as it's requires a lot of testing.
    1. I hate those to, but I haven't found the files related to fix this. If you ever find a solution let me know.
    2. The weather situation can be fixed but it requires a lot of testing, which I tried to do but managed just to some extent.
    See the weather_db.xml, it has probabilities set for each individual weather type.

    Try a quick test with the vanila weather file, if it fixes both of the issues then we know where to fix it.

  26. #26
    Member Member Kleitos's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    Sorry for late reply - since two weeks i experienced the first major CTD´s and i cant get beyond the year 236BC in my Campaign.. and abandoned it after fruitless attempts.
    Ok, i will try this with the vanila weather file when i solved this CTD problem.

    I tried to find the vanila weather file but couldnt find it?. ..with the search function i only find the weather_db.xml of the EBII data folder.

  27. #27
    Bored Member Tux's Avatar
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    Default Re: EB2 Vegetation&lighting 1.0 testing

    You have to unpack the vanilla files from the pack. See: \M2TW\tools\unpacker

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