Got EU Milk?

[a completely inoffensive name]

I said it about American foostuffs exemplifying my statement by only two kinds of apples that there are on sale in the supermarkets of the USA. Read the above messages in the thread.

We have more than two kinds of apples...

[Gilrandir]

You were seemingly making the argument that the USA do not offer the same variety of apples and some other products as Ukraine does, where farmers seem to produce everything they can. I showed you that there is indeed variety in the USA as well and now you complain that it's not shoved into peoples' faces.

Perhaps, I should rephrase my initial claim then:
When I was in the USA (Iowa, 1992), I didn't find the variety of certain products as large as I used to see in Ukraine, and locals I communicated to about that seemed unaware that it might be otherwise.

maybe one has to sacrifice on some apple variety to get the GDP per capita of the USA.

Not sure that it will work that way. We are more likely to see the waxlike American apples replacing the natural-tasting Ukrainian ones, but no GDP growth.

[Husar]

Not sure that it will work that way. We are more likely to see the waxlike American apples replacing the natural-tasting Ukrainian ones, but no GDP growth.

Maybe the GDP will grow in the US if they can export more apples to Ukraine.

[Gilrandir]

Maybe the GDP will grow in the US if they can export more apples to Ukraine.

I wouldn't eat those I saw there. We have here Polish apples aplenty - big, spotless, perfect-looking, but insipid.

[Beskar]

Moral of the story: Apples only taste good when mishap, unshapely and still covered in dung for that natural fragrance.

[Gilrandir]

Moral of the story: Apples only taste good when mishap, unshapely and still covered in dung for that natural fragrance.

I prefer not the extremes, but something in the middle.

[Montmorency]

Like this?

[a completely inoffensive name]

What the fuck is so wrong with our apples? I'm looking at the ones in the store right now.

[Husar]

What the fuck is so wrong with our apples? I'm looking at the ones in the store right now.

They are too round, too green/red and there are no worms in them. All the result of selective breeding, genetic manipulation and the addition of chemicals. You may be so young that you only know Frankenapplesbut they are not your friends.
You should be afraid of them, very afraid.

[Gilrandir]

What the fuck is so wrong with our apples? I'm looking at the ones in the store right now.

Are they looking back at you? If no, then they are OK.
Let me put it this way: imagine that you went out and started down the street. All the women you meet are exact replicas of each other and beauty pageant winners at the same time. At first you would probably feel you have died and gone to heaven. Then you want to get to know them closer, but they turn out to be stupid and shallow, kinda dummies. But as soon as they are beautiful, you wouldn't mind at first. But in a week or two you would probably be dissatisfied and even annoyed.
But apples only examplify the whole issue. I can say the same of strawberries, cucumbers, tomatoes and, finally, milk. All fruit and vegetables have their own time of ripening when grown in the open. When they are in season, they taste the best. When the season is over (or before it comes), they are either hothouse produce or brought from far away. These are insipid.
And then the variety - I don't know if people in America are aware of the existence of, say, yellow tomatoes, or egg-shaped small tomatoes (aka plummmies) or large pink tomatoes (aka oxenheart tomatoes) or brown tomatoes. Early strawberries coming at the end of May-beginning of June are very fragrant and good for eating, and later come those that are good for making jam.
At least this is the way in Ukraine.
Perhaps we should start a culinary thread?

[Husar]

And then the variety - I don't know if people in America are aware of the existence of, say, yellow tomatoes, or egg-shaped small tomatoes (aka plummmies) or large pink tomatoes (aka oxenheart tomatoes) or brown tomatoes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_disaster

[Gilrandir]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_disaster

I ate the mentioned tomatoes long before 1986.

[Andres]

I ate the mentioned tomatoes long before 1986.

Glad to see that I'm not the only one who earned a few bucks extra as a student by letting crazy doctors using experimental drugs on me.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Let me put it this way: imagine that you went out and started down the street. All the women you meet are exact replicas of each other and beauty pageant winners at the same time. At first you would probably feel you have died and gone to heaven. Then you want to get to know them closer, but they turn out to be stupid and shallow, kinda dummies. But as soon as they are beautiful, you wouldn't mind at first. But in a week or two you would probably be dissatisfied and even annoyed.

Here's the thing, we grow many apples, strawberries, cucumbers, etc, which are bruised, discolored, misshapen and what have you. These minor flaws are able to be rejected simply because of the volume of the amount of produce the US generates. The odd looking apples are sent to be fed to pigs or made into cider. The odd strawberries are made into jam and preserves. Baby carrots are simply weird looking carrots which have been shaved into a uniform shape to spare them from being thrown away. This is why all of our produce looks "perfect", and there is nothing wrong with this system as it actually minimizes to a good extent the amount of waste. At this point, much of what is being discarded is not being taken up by secondary demands, so now the US is slowly coming back around with introducing "near-perfect" produce at a discount.

But apples only examplify the whole issue. I can say the same of strawberries, cucumbers, tomatoes and, finally, milk. All fruit and vegetables have their own time of ripening when grown in the open. When they are in season, they taste the best. When the season is over (or before it comes), they are either hothouse produce or brought from far away. These are insipid.

But this is the trade off people made when they wished to have the produce year round and when they wished to have all kinds of produce available in their region. There really shouldn't be bananas sold in New York, so in order to make it happen, it gets picked before it matures so that the ripening happens in transit, which causes produce to be less delicious.

And then the variety - I don't know if people in America are aware of the existence of, say, yellow tomatoes, or egg-shaped small tomatoes (aka plummmies) or large pink tomatoes (aka oxenheart tomatoes) or brown tomatoes. Early strawberries coming at the end of May-beginning of June are very fragrant and good for eating, and later come those that are good for making jam.

I will agree that the level of diversity is not on the same level as semi-rural Urkraine, but even here the problem is not as bad as you describe since most areas have local farmers markets which do display a wide variety of produce that you otherwise wouldn't see in a store.

[Montmorency]

ripening happens in transit, which causes produce to be less delicious.

You kidding me? Our bananas are typically dark green when the grocers get them.

I will agree that the level of diversity is not on the same level as semi-rural Urkraine, but even here the problem is not as bad as you describe since most areas have local farmers markets which do display a wide variety of produce that you otherwise wouldn't see in a store.

We have more variety than pretty much anywhere - the problem is that you basically need to be wealthy to access or even know about it.

[Husar]

I would assume the process is the same in most/all of the western/nordic world.

[a completely inoffensive name]

You kidding me? Our bananas are typically dark green when the grocers get them.

I see, I forgot they spray the ethylene gas.

We have more variety than pretty much anywhere - the problem is that you basically need to be wealthy to access or even know about it.

For all intents are purposes, our general population has less variety. I don't think farmers markets are necessarily limited to only rich areas though.

[Gilrandir]

Glad to see that I'm not the only one who earned a few bucks extra as a student by letting crazy doctors using experimental drugs on me.

In Ukraine you may never know if some drug is being tested on you. And you never get paid for it.

I see, I forgot they spray the ethylene gas.

See, no need to seek drugs elsewhere. Just try those vitamin-rich bananas.

Here's the thing, we grow many apples, strawberries, cucumbers, etc, which are bruised, discolored, misshapen and what have you. These minor flaws are able to be rejected simply because of the volume of the amount of produce the US generates. The odd looking apples are sent to be fed to pigs or made into cider. The odd strawberries are made into jam and preserves. Baby carrots are simply weird looking carrots which have been shaved into a uniform shape to spare them from being thrown away.

The same works for beauty pageants. But we don't live our lives at the backstage of the said contest. Instead of the "matrix" one gotta face the real world with its flaws, drawbacks and irregularities. It makes one feel alive.

This is why all of our produce looks "perfect", and there is nothing wrong with this system as it actually minimizes to a good extent the amount of waste. At this point, much of what is being discarded is not being taken up by secondary demands, so now the US is slowly coming back around with introducing "near-perfect" produce at a discount.

This is why I prefer markets where you can pick yourself what to buy and what to discard. But I spoke not only of the appearence/shape/color of the fruit and vegetables. My chief dissatisfaction was with the TASTE, that is with the absence of it.

There really shouldn't be bananas sold in New York, so in order to make it happen, it gets picked before it matures so that the ripening happens in transit, which causes produce to be less delicious.

It is a good excuse for outlandish foods, but, in my view, the locally grown ones must be treated differently. Everything is good in its season. Before and after it you pay for the looks, not for the taste. But do you really have to pay for looking at strawberries?
Moreover, there is an opinion (supported by some doctors) that one should try not to consume too much exotic products, since the digestive system we have inherited from our ancestors is not "tuned" to digesting alien foods.

I will agree that the level of diversity is not on the same level as semi-rural Urkraine, but even here the problem is not as bad as you describe since most areas have local farmers markets which do display a wide variety of produce that you otherwise wouldn't see in a store.

I base my assumtions on my experience, and I never had the one of seeing local farmers markets during my stay in the USA. But again, perhaps they didn't show us around a lot - didn't want the foreigners from the freshly-collapsed USSR to see squashed tomatoes or misshapen strawberries. We could have thought that life in the USA wasn't so perfect if we saw some of those.


Edit: you may soon see some squashed Ukrainian yellow tomatoes in your supermarkets, after all:
https://inagist.com/all/588703155505991681/

[Papewaio]

Here is a fun debunking of the food babe:

The "Food Babe" Blogger Is Full of Shit

This part is priceless:

Hari's rule? "If a third grader can't pronounce it, don't eat it."

My rule? Don't base your diet on the pronunciation skills of an eight-year-old.

[Greyblades]

There's a group on Facebook called " Banned By Food Babe" that boasts nearly 6,000 members. Reasons for being banned include "I asked for her qualifications" and "I pointed out that water was a chemical." Some members of the page were former fans of hers who were banned when they asked questions of clarification. Any dissent couldn't possibly have merit within the ranks of the Food Babe Army.

And when Hari's been questioned about silencing critics by news outlets? She consistently says that she won't be silenced by people who are haters and shills, racist or sexist.

Seems to be a common reaction among leftist shills.

Ah crap, I'm turning into fragony.

If she thinks she's being attacked for being a woman, she's missed that she's not the only "babe" in this discussion.

If her arguments had merit, she could engage in a battle of wits with her detractors instead of making insidious accusations. It's not about Hari, the woman who gets home at the end of the day, maybe gives her dog an (organic) treat and watches some crappy TV show. It's about Food Babe LLC, the business organization that spreads terribly inaccurate science.

I like this writer.

I will have to look inter her other works to make sure she's consistent, but I think I like this writer.

It's about statements like this:

"The enzymes released from kale go in to your liver and trigger cancer fighting chemicals that literally dissolve unhealthy cells throughout your body."

Alas these special chemicals are highly unreliable as they can be neutralized by a hug.

I wonder if anyone will get that one, aside from RVG anyway.

[Husar]

Here is a fun debunking of the food babe:

The "Food Babe" Blogger Is Full of Shit

This part is priceless:

Oh, I already saw that, it has already been debunked, too.

[Fragony]

Oh, I already saw that, it has already been debunked, too.

Is that debunking nowadays, it's called insinuation here. Not to say that I also don't like organic food better even if there are no proven benefits.

At first glance, she is a bitch that doesn't adress the points and tries to make someone suspect because she has no answer.

[Montmorency]

Fragony post of the year.

[Greyblades]

Oh, I already saw that, it has already been debunked, too.

Hold your horses there slick, this aint a debunking, this is merely the opening volleys.

Spending half the article attacking the accuser's credibility instead of her accusations doesnt help my opinion. The continuous assumption of organic=good, chemical=bad (instead of judging by a case by case basis) makes me think she is no more honest than the woman she's responding to.

However I must admit that it is clear ms food babe (assuming it is her who wrote this, recent revelations about a certain other youtube personality has shown the possibility she's merely someone else's a parrot) is more intelligent than I realized. That's not saying much, but a direct response that actually contests some of the opponant's points is still a huge step up over most of her contemporaries these days.

While the idea that such an educated woman could still be making such a dumb video series is depressing, this will still be an interesting fight to watch unfold.

[Sarmatian]

See, no need to seek drugs elsewhere. Just try those vitamin-rich bananas.

Do you think that bananas going to Ukraine get a different treatment? They're sprayed by Love and Spring on the boat?

[Beskar]

Do you think that bananas going to Ukraine get a different treatment? They're sprayed by Love and Spring on the boat?

They don't get banana's.

[Husar]

While the idea that such an educated woman could still be making such a dumb video series is depressing, this will still be an interesting fight to watch unfold.

It's not her fault that the input her brain has received during her life has made it generate this output. Our conscious is merely an observer of the machine that is us. We cannot blame her, it wasn't her decision, it was the way the world shaped her.

[Greyblades]

It's not her fault that the input her brain has received during her life has made it generate this output. Our conscious is merely an observer of the machine that is us. We cannot blame her, it wasn't her decision, it was the way the world shaped her.

Ah the "It's not my fault it was my upbringing" defense, I'll add it to the 'phrases to use to avoids personal responsibility for my actions' list.

It'll fit right under "Greed is good"

[CrossLOPER]

Ah the "It's not my fault it was my upbringing" defense, I'll add it to the 'phrases to use to avoids personal responsibility for my actions' list.

That's the spirit!

[Greyblades]

The ability to notice when our influences would have us do bad is what makes us intelligent.

The ability to disobey our influences to do good is what makes us moral.