Our Lord, J.C.

[InsaneApache]

So Jezza is to be the Leader of Her Majesties' Opposition, what do you guys think?

Me? I can hardly wait! Gets popcorn.

[rory_20_uk]

Risks are too great for my liking - IF he were ever to become PM, he could cause so much damage within 5 years.

The future would be interesting - the other scenario is that Labour get so clobbered that the Tories without an opposition to worry about instantly fracture into 2 or more parties since the only thing that keeps them together is the hatred of Labour.

Labour might of course be wracked by significant internal strife as the whip is withdrawn from people who are not Left wing enough.

Interesting times.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Well, he's described the death of Bin Laden as a tragedy, refused to condemn the IRA during the troubles (but happy to openly condemn the British Army), advocated a closer relationship with Russia and most recently he has asked for the effective removal of the Royal Prerogative and Orders in Council be making them subject to parliamentary veto.

I think that, in reality, he's less likely to get elected than Michael Foot.

This may cause Labour to fracture, it may cause the Tories to fracture as a knock on, if Labour fractures then the more Centrist section may swallow the Lib-Dems - again.

Interesting times, indeed.

Ironically I think that this shows the corruption of the Unions - they supported "electable" candidates during the 90's which pushed Labour from the Left to the Centre, then they got fed up and supported Ed Milliband, and that was a train wreck, now the voting system has changed and they no longer have control - even had they not supported Corbyn I expect the grass roots would have. The point is, this exposes the gulf between the Labour "establishment" and the actual party en masse.

At least Tory politicians are honest about being a social elite.

[Crandar]

The whole hysteria about Corbyn reminds me the panick of the rednecks over the election of a socialist muslim named Husein, back in 2008.
Relax, Corbyn is not a communist and he isn't going to make your railway company public again.
The future of your train wrecks is safe.

He's very lucky that Blair denounced him, that statement will probably grant him the leadership of the party.

[rory_20_uk]

There isn't the money to nationalise the industries and return to the heyday of the 1970's where british manufacturing was an international joke due to the dire quality and productivity. Unless he were to just print more and buy it up that way.

Markets are very temperamental. If he decides he'll print loadsa money to finance projects that the private sector doesn't want to the Bank of England is therefore under Political control. We could have the rating of the pound falling rather quickly. And given the country mainly does services and has little intrinsic true value creation that is a problem.

If he were to spook the financial sector - which love or hate them brings in a large amount of GDP and are pretty easy to move abroad unlike manufacturing - London's looses critical mass to elsewhere and they might decide they'd rather not return back as now there is critical mass elsewhere.

[Montmorency]

Well, where would they move it? China? America? (Actually... )

Regardless of leadership, it is certainly the case that the UK needs to diversify sharply from financial services...

By sharply, I of course mean in the sense of forcefully and coherently, not merely "quickly".

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The whole hysteria about Corbyn reminds me the panick of the rednecks over the election of a socialist muslim named Husein, back in 2008.
Relax, Corbyn is not a communist and he isn't going to make your railway company public again.
The future of your train wrecks is safe.

He's very lucky that Blair denounced him, that statement will probably grant him the leadership of the party.

No, he's definitely a communist and like many communist Labour Party members I suspect he was on Russia's payroll in the 1980's. He's also an atheist and a republican - which makes the idea of him leading Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition a bit of a joke.

All the things I indicated in my last post, he said - including refusing to say "I condemn the IRA", he was happy to say the troubles were terrible and everyone was to blame, and to condemn the British Army for Bloody Sunday but he wouldn't say "and I also condemn the IRA".

[Crandar]

No, he's definitely a communist and like many communist Labour Party members I suspect he was on Russia's payroll in the 1980's. He's also an atheist and a republican - which makes the idea of him leading Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition a bit of a joke.

All the things I indicated in my last post, he said - including refusing to say "I condemn the IRA", he was happy to say the troubles were terrible and everyone was to blame, and to condemn the British Army for Bloody Sunday but he wouldn't say "and I also condemn the IRA".

Tsipras was also supposed to belong to the far-left, being the idol of many delluded hippies from Spain to Italy, but he made quite a u-turn, when he grabbed the power. I have a feeling that the same is going to happen with his British version, too.

There isn't the money to nationalise the industries

Proper nationalisations don't warrant compensations.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Tsipras was also supposed to belong to the far-left, being the idol of many delluded hippies from Spain to Italy, but he made quite a u-turn, when he grabbed the power. I have a feeling that the same is going to happen with his British version, too.

Proper nationalisations don't warrant compensations.

Except that Corbyn has never been a popular or influential politician, a minister, or even someone who follows the party whip.

"Between 1997 and 2010, during the most recent Labour Government, Corbyn was the most rebellious of all Labour MPs, regularly defying three-line whips. In the 2005–2010 Parliament alone he defied the whip 238 times, approximately 25% of all votes"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Corbyn

[rory_20_uk]

Nationalising in the "take it all" when one still has a large fiscal deficit and mainly has a service industry is suicide for the country.

[Kralizec]

British politics went downhill after Lord Sutch left us.

[InsaneApache]

That's it then. He's been endorsed by Hamas. Should be a shoe-in for P.M.

[Husar]

That's it then. He's been endorsed by Hamas. Should be a shoe-in for P.M.

Context: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...-conflict.html

"According to his statements, I feel that he could be very close to the Palestinians, the Arabs and to the Muslims. He supports all the right things in the world regarding freedom, justice, dignity, the right of people under occupation to get their national rights.

"If he really became the head of the Labour party, he can make a big change to the image of Britain because people here in Palestine feel that Britain has a historical responsibility, in giving Israel the golden chance of establishing their state on the account of the Palestinian people."

[...]

"In order to be careful. I don't want this word to be used against him," he said. "But we expect him to translate what he said before into actions - to move from words to deeds.

"We expect Mr Corbyn and Britain to change the policy and to understand that the struggle of the Palestinian people against the occupation is fair. And that Hamas is not a terrorist organisation.

[InsaneApache]

Context: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...-conflict.html

[Rhyfelwyr]

Hopefully this will cause Labour to split, followed by a major split in the Tories for the reasons that rory says.

Maybe then Britain can get the sort of PR system that will make us feel like we actually have some sort of say in politics.

[Beskar]

There seems to be a drive in British politics for something different, yet at the same time, the establishment wants to maintain a status quo.

Love or hate it, JC as a candidate is better than the cardboard cut-outs he is competing against. Whilst he will most likely lose the next election, him becoming opposition leader will cause a massive shakeup in politics, with either causing a split within the Labour party, and the outcomes of this affecting the other parties. One of them could even be the SNP taking a hard hit as a Corbyn Labour would steal their mandate essentially other than 'independence'.

Also a Corbyn Labour would mean we could realistically see Tim Farron for Prime Minister as he gains the support of the 'Moderates' after those years people laughed at the coalition then think "Oh sh-, they were stopping the Tories from screwing us with these policies".

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I do not like Tim Farron, he seems weasley to me and he may be even more of a homophobe than Rhy and I put together*

Beyond that though, the Lib Dems were virtually wiped out in the election and all the credible politicians like David Laws, Vince Cable, and Danny Alexander are out, so they can't really capitalise on past experience unless they all manage to get elected again.

I think that the Lib Dems were hammered because, as a credible party of govvernment they lost the protest vote. The fact that much of the protest vote went to UKIP suggests that people were more interested in the Lib Dems being "different" than in what they actually stood for.


*All Christians are evil, baby eating, child molesting, racist, homophobic sexual deviants.

[Beskar]

I do not like Tim Farron.

I live near enough to his area, and there is seems to be a good reason they all love him (I admit, the Kendal lot are almost spooky in their love for him), even increasing his electoral share last election. He does a lot of involvement in a lot of community.

I am willing to give benefit of the doubt and his views are very palatable. He doesn't fall into the leftist trap of 'lets nationalise everything', nor does he think rampant capitalism is everything.

Also yes, he is a Christian!

[Greyblades]

I dont suppose you know if his area is running a deficit?

[Papewaio]

Well, where would they move it? China? America? (Actually... )

Regardless of leadership, it is certainly the case that the UK needs to diversify sharply from financial services...

By sharply, I of course mean in the sense of forcefully and coherently, not merely "quickly".

The majority of stock brokers work for multinational companies with desks around the world. So London or Zurich or Hong Kong or Tokyo or Singapore, all destinations that they could be relocated as fast as they could get a business class airfare there and a couple of turrets setup.

[Montmorency]

But in that case, they wouldn't haven't really moved anything other than the commercial premises and contribution toward local sales tax from coffee purchases and the like.

What's really at stake is political leverage, and simply moving an exchange or branch from one city to another reduces that leverage in both the first country and the next.

Financiers can't afford to be too flighty, or the political classes will lose all compunctions against extracting from them. So then what, they all end up crammed on a few islands?

[rory_20_uk]

But in that case, they wouldn't haven't really moved anything other than the commercial premises and contribution toward local sales tax from coffee purchases and the like.

What's really at stake is political leverage, and simply moving an exchange or branch from one city to another reduces that leverage in both the first country and the next.

Financiers can't afford to be too flighty, or the political classes will lose all compunctions against extracting from them. So then what, they all end up crammed on a few islands?

They all have houses. Big houses that often need expensive work done to them to please their trophy wives . And their children go to private schools in the main. And private healthcare. Private gym membership. Expensive restaurants...

They might live pampered lives BUT they tend to use little of the NHS, the school system etc so give loads of money and the crimes they commit they'll continue to do elsewhere.

[Montmorency]

What makes it amusing is that one of the driving factors for British focus on its financial sector in the '70s and '80s was that it wanted to benefit from the EEC, but its agricultural and industrial sectors were just too weak...

[Rhyfelwyr]

I would never vote for him because of his baggage but it is true that Britain has to sort its economy out in a much more fundamental way than adjusting spending. We have a fake smoke and mirrors economy, what do we actually make? No wonder we're constantly running a balance of trade deficit. Time to bring back some real industry.

[Greyblades]

We have a fake smoke and mirrors economy

What do you mean fake? It's been workiing for the better part of three decades and it seems to me that a service economy is about as prone to disaster as an industrial one.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

What do you mean fake? It's been workiing for the better part of three decades and it seems to me that a service economy is about as prone to disaster as an industrial one.

We basically launder Europe's money - we don't make anything of value.

[rory_20_uk]

We basically launder Europe's money - we don't make anything of value.

Not just Europe's money - we also help launder Russian, Middle Eastern and Far Eastern money in our Financial sector and housing sector - the house prices in the London are a great place to land large amounts of money that won't be frozen if the USA freezes assets as who owns them is so often unclear.

[Pannonian]

Not just Europe's money - we also help launder Russian, Middle Eastern and Far Eastern money in our Financial sector and housing sector - the house prices in the London are a great place to land large amounts of money that won't be frozen if the USA freezes assets as who owns them is so often unclear.

The English Premier League: the world's biggest money laundering operation.

[Greyblades]

We basically launder Europe's money - we don't make anything of value.

I get the feeling you are over-simplifying, as one look at wikipedia tells me that we do.

Ignoring that, why is this a problem? Finances, services, industry, all these economic sectors are only as valuable as their consumers deem it and when it comes to exports the prosperity they bring are equally vulnerable to outside competetion and uncontrolable forces, so why do you consider industry any more secure?

Or are you arguing that we are over reliant on one sector? That makes much more sense as without diversity we'd be completely gutted should that one dominant sector fail or become obsolete; we'd have nothing subsantial to fall back on and thus collapse.

[Beskar]

JC elected for our sins.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34237564