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Thread: Gameroom policy discussion thread

  1. #31
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Thingyman asked me to post this on CFC, figured I might as well post it here too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thingyman
    Invitation to The Mafia Championship Season 3

    Hello everyone, it’s that time of the year again :)

    I am making this post with the hopes that your community would be interested in participating in Season 3 of the Mafia Championship. It will be bigger and more epic than ever before.

    This year we’re expanding once again; 136 communities will be invited to participate, making this not only the biggest Mafia event ever, but also the largest cross-forum event in the history of the Internet. We’ve also moved the venue to Mafia Universe, a new site created largely because of this series.

    Are you interested?

    As always, how you decide your representative is completely up to you. To guarantee your community a spot in Season 3 of the Mafia Championship, I will need to know of your community's interest within the next week (until April 4th). Following this, you will have an additional two weeks to decide your nominee (until April 18th). Additionally, it would be a very good idea to also name an alternate.

    Remember that your representative needs to be prepared to deal with a lot of activity. Expect at least upwards of 500 posts per 24 hours during the early stages of the game. The representative needs to not only be able to read all this, but should also at least be able to manage making 10+ posts per day phase.

    Season 3 Specifics

    • 136 different communities are invited to participate. If some decline the invitation, I may opt to allow larger communities an additional nominee.
    • 8 Qualifying Games will be played with 17 players each.
    • 2 players advance to the Finale Game from each game based on post-game votes.
    • 1 Wildcard Game will be played (Wildcards are decided by a jury consisting of former finalists), determining the 17th and final spot in the Finale. Runner-ups in this game will be first in line to replace any finalists who may have to drop out.

    Season 3 Timeline & Important Dates

    The first Qualifying Game is set to start April 25th. Additional games will take place in the 1-3 months following. I will create a Doodle and find out the best times to start the various games so that preferably everyone gets to play during a time that suits them well.

    In addition to this, it is also a priority to ensure as much as possible that all the players in any given game has no prior history of playing with each other to ensure a level playing field (but I cannot 100% guarantee that this won’t happen).

    Season 3 Game Design & Setup

    For each season, we’ve changed it up. This time, we’re doing something new again!

    The setup is called Matrix12 and is inspired by mafiascum’s popular Matrix6 setup, if any of you are familiar with that. In short, the concept is that there are 12 different possible setups and the host randomizes which one is used. The players know what setups are available, but not which one will be used!

    More on the setup here: http://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/...on-3-Format%29

    Regarding lynch mechanics: There will be a deadline each day phase, and the person with the most votes at the end of the day is lynched, unless a majority has already been reached before then, in which case the day ends prematurely.

    Days will last 36 hours and nights 12 hours, meaning 48 hours (2 days) per game day. With one exception: The weekend (Friday, Saturday and Sunday) will be one game day (so day will be 60 hours and night 12 hours on weekends).
    It'd be cool if someone other than me/visor/atpg was the org rep, since the three of us all played in season 2. Fair warning though: there's a good possibility the activity rate of any game you play in will make Pirate Ship Mafia III look leisurely in comparison. Also, the people you play with likely take mafia much more seriously than we do here, so they will hound you if you lurk or post mostly fluff.

    But, Mafia Universe is a cool site with cool mafia-specific features, and the game will guaranteed be thoroughly exhilarating. You can proudly rep The Org. There are some of you not named Zack/Visorslash/ATPG who I think could do really well if you felt up to the time/energy commitment.

    We need to declare interest by April 4 and a specific nominee/alternate by April 18.

  2. #32
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    This humblebrag just in: apparently ATPG and I are ineligible for Season 3 because we were finalists in season 2.

  3. #33
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    I nominate Warman.

  4. #34
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread


  5. #35
    Rock, Paper, GOAT Member Monster Champion, Spy Hunter Champion, Navy Battles Champion, Turbo Turtle Champion, Bunny Grab Champion, Home Run Rally Champion, Bomb Blast Champion Trug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    seconding GH

  6. #36
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Too bad Sasaki's not active anymore. He would be perfect.

  7. #37
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Visor do you ever post from a computer?

  8. #38
    Rock, Paper, GOAT Member Monster Champion, Spy Hunter Champion, Navy Battles Champion, Turbo Turtle Champion, Bunny Grab Champion, Home Run Rally Champion, Bomb Blast Champion Trug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Zack View Post
    Visor do you ever post from a computer?
    i actually post with reasonable regularity from a computer

    i used an ipad to play ATPG mafia II years ago, and ever since then it has been posted from a mobile device iirc

    Member thankful for this post:



  9. #39
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Test mobile post

    Why do only you have the "posted via mobile device" and why is that even a forum feature in the first place

  10. #40
    Rock, Paper, GOAT Member Monster Champion, Spy Hunter Champion, Navy Battles Champion, Turbo Turtle Champion, Bunny Grab Champion, Home Run Rally Champion, Bomb Blast Champion Trug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Zack View Post
    Test mobile post

    Why do only you have the "posted via mobile device" and why is that even a forum feature in the first place
    I have no idea. it has crippled my mafia playing ability for years

    its a handicap i have learned to deal with

  11. #41
    still making Bowser jokes Member Roach Kill Champion, Donkey Rocket Champion, Mission Mars Champion Double A's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    I nominate the concept of jokers second warman

  12. #42
    chaos chaos chaos Moderator Pogo Panic Champion, Space Rescue Champion, Graveyard Champion, Invasion 2196 Champion, Rally 2100 Champion, Missle Attack Champion, Ninja Kid Champion, Ninja Turtles 1 Champion, Pop-Up Killer Champion, Ratman Ralph Champion, Mahjong Connect Champion GeneralHankerchief's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Uh, let me look into this when I'm not half-asleep.
    "I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
    "Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
    "I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
    Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006

    Quote Originally Posted by TosaInu
    At times I read back my own posts [...]. It's not always clear at first glance.


  13. #43
    syö minun šortsini Member Space Invaders Champion, Asteroids Champion, Metal Slug Champion, Bubble Trouble Champion, Curveball Champion, Moon Patrol Champion, Duck Tracker Champion, Twelve Swap Champion, Zelda Champion, Minigolf Champion
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    11 hours and 45 minutes later…
    good lord| if you're telling the truth you're setting new records for scumminess as a townie -Renata on IM, 16/09/2011
    Feles deliberatissimae subiugare humanitiati sunt, et res solae quae eas desinunt canes sunt.
    I see I've been sigged yet again -Askthepizzaguy, 02/08/2012
    Hindsight is 20/20 Askthepizzaguy, 10/07/2013

  14. #44
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    when did we get the new sub-forum?

  15. #45
    syö minun šortsini Member Space Invaders Champion, Asteroids Champion, Metal Slug Champion, Bubble Trouble Champion, Curveball Champion, Moon Patrol Champion, Duck Tracker Champion, Twelve Swap Champion, Zelda Champion, Minigolf Champion
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Eh?
    good lord| if you're telling the truth you're setting new records for scumminess as a townie -Renata on IM, 16/09/2011
    Feles deliberatissimae subiugare humanitiati sunt, et res solae quae eas desinunt canes sunt.
    I see I've been sigged yet again -Askthepizzaguy, 02/08/2012
    Hindsight is 20/20 Askthepizzaguy, 10/07/2013

  16. #46
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by El Barto View Post
    Eh?
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  17. #47
    stop tinfoiling me Member Zack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief View Post
    in a perfect world we'd be able to segue nicely from Pirate Ship III to another game (Zack mentioned something about hosting a Futurama mafia afterwards)
    and it only took a year!

  18. #48
    syö minun šortsini Member Space Invaders Champion, Asteroids Champion, Metal Slug Champion, Bubble Trouble Champion, Curveball Champion, Moon Patrol Champion, Duck Tracker Champion, Twelve Swap Champion, Zelda Champion, Minigolf Champion
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    That? It's not exactly new.
    good lord| if you're telling the truth you're setting new records for scumminess as a townie -Renata on IM, 16/09/2011
    Feles deliberatissimae subiugare humanitiati sunt, et res solae quae eas desinunt canes sunt.
    I see I've been sigged yet again -Askthepizzaguy, 02/08/2012
    Hindsight is 20/20 Askthepizzaguy, 10/07/2013

  19. #49
    chaos chaos chaos Moderator Pogo Panic Champion, Space Rescue Champion, Graveyard Champion, Invasion 2196 Champion, Rally 2100 Champion, Missle Attack Champion, Ninja Kid Champion, Ninja Turtles 1 Champion, Pop-Up Killer Champion, Ratman Ralph Champion, Mahjong Connect Champion GeneralHankerchief's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    In light of recent events, I need to make one or two things perfectly clear.

    First, everybody - particularly those who attack others for "struggling to read" and/or those who moderate other forums and should thus have a higher inclination to appreciate forum rules - needs to make absolutely sure they familiarize themselves with the Gameroom Rules and Reference (which you'll note is stickied and has a large "READ THIS BEFORE PLAYING" tag in the title).

    The point I want to highlight is in the second post of that thread, under the "Communicating with the moderator" section:

    3. If I make a post in green font, this means that I am speaking officially as Gameroom moderator and should be taken as separate from any in-character posts I make as part of whichever game the post is in. If I make a post in bold green, I am also speaking officially as Gameroom moderator, but it probably means that I am not amused about something and really need to emphasize a particular point.
    When I'm reading a thread, I'm always reading it from the viewpoint of a moderator first and foremost. I'm checking to see if there's any obviously objectionable or NSFW material included that I have to delete or put under spoilers. I'm making sure that the post is in line with the guidelines laid down by the game host in the OP or clarified elsewhere in the thread. I'm debating whether the post crosses the line from a sharp comment to a personal attack. Etc.

    I'm doing all of this before I take off my moderator hat and put on my player hat. With every post. If it doesn't pass muster, then I do what I have to do as mod, probably drop some green text, maybe send a PM, and look to see if there's anything else I have to deal with. If it does, then and only then do I begin to examine it from the standpoint of a player.

    Basically, it comes down to a matter of trust: By playing a game in a subforum that I moderate, there is an implicit agreement on your part that the game is 100% put aside whenever I make an official action and indicate as much by writing in green text. If that trust is not there, then perhaps your forum gaming needs would be better served elsewhere.

    ----------

    Now, for a second, somewhat related issue.

    I can count on one hand the number of times this has happened in the Gameroom in its 10+ year history, but occasionally the situation will arise where the moderator's official actions become the subject of debate in a game thread. Without going into whether the mod was in the wrong or not, there is a time and place to air your grievances, and the game thread is not it. While this has never been an official rule before, many hosts have some sort of stipulation in place about this and I've always operated under this guideline in the past.

    The time has come to officially codify this rule. I am placing it under the "Communicating with the moderator" section in the Rules and Reference thread:

    4. If your issue is with the moderator or the moderation itself, you have three avenues of recourse:
    - PM the moderator (and potentially the game host depending on the circumstance) and work it out privately
    - Post in the Gameroom policy discussion thread
    - If you wish to escalate the issue, post in the Watchtower
    Doing so in a game thread, particularly while the game is ongoing, is not the appropriate place for this and may be met with official action regardless of and separate from the original issue.
    Further discussion of this is welcome here.
    "I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
    "Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
    "I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
    Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006

    Quote Originally Posted by TosaInu
    At times I read back my own posts [...]. It's not always clear at first glance.

    Member thankful for this post:

    Zack 


  20. #50
    Rock, Paper, GOAT Member Monster Champion, Spy Hunter Champion, Navy Battles Champion, Turbo Turtle Champion, Bunny Grab Champion, Home Run Rally Champion, Bomb Blast Champion Trug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    agreed 100%

  21. #51
    Know the Dark Side Senior Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Further discussion of this is welcome here.
    I think most folks here understand that since we have a limited number of people on here, we have to have moderators from within the active player base, otherwise the section will go unmoderated- just something we have to deal with being a low traffic site and a very small player base. Recent and new people may be familiar with the standards of elsewhere, and there's always culture shock going from one site to another. It's also the case that probably very few people ever take a look at the rules and regs in full before being somewhere. I know I don't.

    I think, regardless of the rulebook, situation happened because adversarial accusatory guessing game plus what looked like a rulebreak- don't post after night, and don't edit posts. One was intended to fix the other, but if person isn't familiar with how we deal with rulebreak posts, or that we just have you only, pretty much... it can look strange or unfamiliar. And it may become a part of the game. It isn't supposed to, but person was trying to guess motivations for behavior, and didn't know what to make of the situation.

    Very unfortunate situation. Unhappy for everyone involved. I don't think anyone is the bad guy here. We're just people and we're not perfect.

    As for the moderation action, decision, and policies, all are fine with me.
    As for the player in question, I would chalk it up to an honest misunderstanding, based on publicly available data. I don't know what if anything was said in private.

    It's a bummer when something like that happens. I ran into something similar when moderating a clear rulebreak in another game elsewhere- sure, my action was right, but then people started to read into it for alignment. I had to adjust, because it was something I could adjust.

    Here, we're not so flexible, and we have to make do with an imperfect situation- active player is also the only active moderator, tasked with enforcement of rulebreaks.

    These are the random thoughts I'm having as they come at me, speaking as a fellow player in that game.

    I can say that I spoke with neither party about this thing before making this post, this is just me talking and trying to approach it as honestly as possible.

    It is ultimately, not a huge deal, the only problem I really can see here is there may be lingering negative feelings, or a negative impression of the site. That's all unfortunate and I don't know what to do about it other than say it's a minor misunderstanding blown up bigger than it is, due to the setting of it being a mafia game, and an instance of unintentional rulebreaking by someone else which precipitated it. No one went into it intending to harm the game, yet it happened anyway and people got bummed out.

    I support both the moderator in question and the point of view that folks can make an honest mistake, or mistake honest behavior for mafia-insidiousness. That's the main thing that informs me not to get upset when Riedquat accidentally broke a rule. Hell, I've done similar things before. Keeping it in perspective it is just a parlor game, albeit one we get emotionally wrapped up in and take very seriously at times.

    Blah blah blah, that was my 3 bucks and 2 cents.

  22. #52
    Member Member novice's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    It was definitely a culture shock to me to see a player also acting as forum moderator in a game. I did a double take when it happened in the Futurama game as well. If it's the best option available it's obviously fine though, just unexpected for those who haven't seen it before.

    I guess an additional factor is that the threshold for moderation is different here from what I'm used to. Foul language, personal attacks and illegal posts could be censured where I play, but would probably not be edited out or deleted. Basically, forum moderator actions in a mafia game are a bit of a culture shock in themselves. I'm used to more self-moderation and peer moderation, and less intervention and "don't talk about" rules.

  23. #53
    Know the Dark Side Senior Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    If I find myself in a situation where there's an emergency moderating problem I need to solve right away and am the only one around, I may put on my mod hat and take off my player hat on MU, and sub out of the game once my moderating is done. Thing is, we had an incredible amount of sub-ins this game, usually we don't have subs and just have to modkill the slot, impacting the game balance.

    When we have under 20 players at a time, most of them in the game itself, it's kind of a 'we have to make do with what we have' situation.

    Other forums have more options than we do. Plus, since we're such an incredibly close knit community, we all pretty much trust GH or any green hat implicitly to do whatever moderation they need to do and have that come first, not have it be impacted by one's alignment. It's also extremely rare that a mod even needs to intervene in our games. I think the most times it has happened have involved spambots or first timers from other forums who refused to come close to being civil.

    In which case I remember Beskar or Andres, whichever was admin at the time, would come in and nuke the account from orbit, in a manner nearly as glorious as the time I Wogged Neverwonagame.

  24. #54
    Know the Dark Side Senior Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    In other news, I approve of @GeneralHankerchief 's new undertitle.

  25. #55
    Senior Member Senior Member Othello Champion Montmorency's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    In which case I remember Beskar or Andres, whichever was admin at the time, would come in and nuke the account from orbit, in a manner nearly as glorious as the time I Wogged Neverwonagame.
    Isn't that the Askvaard game where Zack subbed in as Mafia godfather and killed my mason partner, I couldn't admit his scumminess and begged him to be town role, he reacted along the lines of 'Huh? Whatever", killed me, then got lynched?
    Vitiate Man.

  26. #56
    Member Member novice's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy View Post
    It's also extremely rare that a mod even needs to intervene in our games. I think the most times it has happened have involved spambots or first timers from other forums who refused to come close to being civil.
    I would agree that it's rarely needed, but it did happen in the Futurama game and in the latest game, and also in the IKEA game I just read. In that game the moderator action was also used for solving purposes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raith Kemmler View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief View Post
    Enough with the pretzels.
    GH and Zack are very unlikely to be Mafia together.

  27. #57
    Senior Member Senior Member Othello Champion Montmorency's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by novice View Post
    I would agree that it's rarely needed, but it did happen in the Futurama game and in the latest game, and also in the IKEA game I just read. In that game the moderator action was also used for solving purposes.
    How much of the Gameroom history are you reading? If all of it, would you mind giving a summary of my play 2011-2014? I only remember the highlights.

    Also, if possible compile a dossier on everyone who has played here and forward it for my eyes only.
    Vitiate Man.

  28. #58
    syö minun šortsini Member Space Invaders Champion, Asteroids Champion, Metal Slug Champion, Bubble Trouble Champion, Curveball Champion, Moon Patrol Champion, Duck Tracker Champion, Twelve Swap Champion, Zelda Champion, Minigolf Champion
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Oh, come on, if he reads your latest games he'll realise that you are always mafia and always with atpg.

    Regarding the other, more serious business, yes, moderators don't act as players and nothing should be read into their actions. I was genuinely pissed last game.
    good lord| if you're telling the truth you're setting new records for scumminess as a townie -Renata on IM, 16/09/2011
    Feles deliberatissimae subiugare humanitiati sunt, et res solae quae eas desinunt canes sunt.
    I see I've been sigged yet again -Askthepizzaguy, 02/08/2012
    Hindsight is 20/20 Askthepizzaguy, 10/07/2013

  29. #59
    chaos chaos chaos Moderator Pogo Panic Champion, Space Rescue Champion, Graveyard Champion, Invasion 2196 Champion, Rally 2100 Champion, Missle Attack Champion, Ninja Kid Champion, Ninja Turtles 1 Champion, Pop-Up Killer Champion, Ratman Ralph Champion, Mahjong Connect Champion GeneralHankerchief's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by novice View Post
    I would agree that it's rarely needed, but it did happen in the Futurama game and in the latest game, and also in the IKEA game I just read. In that game the moderator action was also used for solving purposes.
    I'm glad you brought this up. That post you quoted annoyed me at the time - though not nearly to the extent as the more recent incident - and was in my mind (along with the events from the most recent game) when I made my above post/rule change.

    (also you'll note that I've moderated the game thread as both mafia and town, so stop trying to read into things that way)

    Basically, the main thing I want people to get out of this is that when I post something in green text, or make an action as moderator, the game is 100% out of the equation, and now it's officially codified as such. If folks understand this much, then we've done well here.
    "I'm going to die anyway, and therefore have nothing more to do except deliberately annoy Lemur." -Orb, in the chat
    "Lemur. Even if he's innocent, he's a pain; so kill him." -Ignoramus
    "I'm going to need to collect all of the rants about the guilty lemur, and put them in a pretty box with ponies and pink bows. Then I'm going to sprinkle sparkly magic dust on the box, and kiss it." -Lemur
    Mafia: Promoting peace and love since June 2006

    Quote Originally Posted by TosaInu
    At times I read back my own posts [...]. It's not always clear at first glance.


  30. #60
    Member Member Dp101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gameroom policy discussion thread

    I see no issues with this policy, if you can't trust someone to separate their in-game motivations from their moderation then how can you trust them as a moderator? Seems pretty clear-cut to me.

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