Roman: Brutii

[McArthurBR]

do you guys have any tips about the falxmen?
i mean, some good ways to kill them

[Craterus]

Pin them and charge into their rearwith cav? Works with most barb infantry.

[McArthurBR]

Pin them and charge into their rearwith cav? Works with most barb infantry.

i'm trying that
but many times they just turn and hit the cav, killing many of them
i'll try to put stronger inf to pin them.. they MUST pay attetion on my inf hehe
at the moment i'm using velite gladiators to pin them, but these glad are too
disorganized (or unorganized? dont know =p) and cant keep a good pin

[katank]

Falxmen are best killed from range. Use ample archers. Also, have velites behind your lines and set them to hold ground and fire at will. Do the same for your hastati.

The mix of arrows and then concentrated pila will typically destroy 3 units of falxmen right away. Feign with cav to keep em dancing in front of your lines to eat pila and arrows.

[MackBolan]

I agree, but you'd definately need at least 3 units of archers. Im talkin going against 6-8 units of Falxmen, charging under cover of skirmishers and archers. i agree w/katank as well about keeping the velites behind the lines. BUT DO NOT USE HASTATI, they run like dogs. Principes or higher.....post marius Im sure the Earlys can handle it but dont use Hastati. Anything w/out armor or shields is gonna be SUPER vulnerable to missle attacks. If the enemy stack in question has no cav then either simply let their infantry absorb that missle fire and chase down their missle troops w/your cav. by that time the Falxmen should be close to your line. engage them w/your troops and your cav should be behind em in perfect positon to charge into the rear. can anyone say instant rout?

[pezhetairoi]

If you know what you're up against in the beginning, draw up your army concentrated close to (but not AT) one corner of the deployment area, and hit one flank first with your cavalry on the extreme flank to outflank the rear's archers and cavalry. Most of the time the enemy responds by setting up his line as per normal, so outflanking is easy as long as you charge your infantry at a run while your cavalry go round wide. Your infantry should hit first, so they take notice of them. Meanwhile your cavalry should advance in line with them. It is essential you do not pass the Dacian line because then they will respond and turn to face your cavalry upon which it will be harder to outflank their archers, and they will not 'notice' your infantry as well as you would like them to. Try and break their flank before the other end of the Dacian line is able to close up, and keep some cohorts in reserve to hold off those new arrivals from your flank-crushing force's flanks.

[DensterNY]

If there weren't enough benefits to using the Brutti for your campaign here is another boon that I've discovered in my games. As many people on this thread suggested I built up shrines and temples to Juno in my newly conquered territories to counteract culture penalties. However, I began to notice that my family members have been reproducing quite well while governing these cities. In fact, many of my family members have four children and nobody has less than two. Part of this reason is because Juno temples allow you to retain Physicians which increase the chances for childbirth. (or perhaps its just the water )

I sent a childless and quite mad governor aged 36 from a Mars dedicated city to a Juno city and within a few turns he had 2 children. I guess they're the ancient versions of The Mayo fertility clinic.

~ Long live the Brutti

[Garvanko]

For some reason Im innately defensive when I play Brutii.

[pezhetairoi]

...Interesting. Perhaps it's the effect of the hoplites?

[DensterNY]

Wow, I wish I paid more attention to the last few posts before I marched on to Thrace. There I was totally victorious from my campaigns against The Greeks and The Macedonians. My Eastern armies were making steady headway into the Seleucidian empire so I figure, hey I have some nice neighbors to the Northeast with some decent sized towns and cities.

So I'm making war with the Thracians and take my textbook, kick-butt approach, Principies deep on guard, fire at will, velites right behind on guard, no skirmish, archers behind them. Seems to work great against everyone else. The Thracians charge with 8 groups of 40 falxmen and cut into my infantry like a hot knife through butter. All of my men rout and run behind the gates like frightened children. I did eventually win that fight because they chased my men to within arrows reach of my wooden walls and I waited there on fast-forward and let my archers kill them off volley after volley.

Man, it doesn't matter how big or advanced your cities are, how far your empire reaches, how deep your treasury is or how deep your army marches, a bunch of crazy barbarians with 3 foot long scythe blades can still kick your butt.

:)

[katank]

Hi Denster,
I see you are from NY too. welcome.

It's true that falxmen are one of the best level 2 infantry units around. Missile fire is the least expensive way to kill em off. Ballista work well too. I ideally use 6+ archers complete with ballista parked on a hill when facing those guys.

Principes are actually decent against them. Make sure you turn on fire at will and let them use all their pila. Same for hastati and turn velites off skirmish. The blanket fire of pila combined with archer power is often sufficient to crush them at near point blank range.

[pezhetairoi]

Hoplites one-on-one against falxmen are also extremely efficacious when they are 4 ranks deep or greater.

[Garvanko]

...Interesting. Perhaps it's the effect of the hoplites?

Possibly, but I think its probably got something to do with doubtful courage.

Nevertheless, fresh from conquest with Egypt, I have began the Brutii campaign once more in earnest. So far, I control all of Greece, Macedon is destroyed, most of Sicily captured, ditto Carthage and Thapsus (dunno why everyone wanted to avoid the last three, because theyve we're pretty easy to get, and i've pretty much stopped any kind of expansion by Scipii in the process - the end game should be a cakewalk).. Going to spend the next fifty years capturing a few more wonders, and work my way northwards and west against Thrace and eventually Germania.

Easy.

[Maximus_Praetorian]

All very interesting. Here is a question for most of the advanced players. What is the purpose of the seante missions? Can you ignore them and pursue victory on your own grounds. or will that just piss them off and declare civil war more rapidly. I always run into this problem. I accumulate vast wealth, only to have the senate ask me to attack a neutral faction, thus requiring me to abandon my current wars, redeploying my armies and thinning them out abroad, or create new units to defend my settlements and attack new factions. either way, it almost always bankrupts me.

[Craterus]

Welcome to the org

You don't have to do Senate missions but it is advised. When playing the Romans, I complete acceptable missions but I will not declare war on a neutral faction just because they want me to. Once, I was campaigning in Africa (as Scipii) at which point they ask me to take Larissa. IN MACEDON? No thanks. I wouldn't have even got there in the 10 turn limit.

Do the ones you want to do, but ignore the outrageous ones, that's my advice.

Although, if they offer you a major exotic unit, go for it! This can be eles or Legionary First Cohort.

[Maximus_Praetorian]

Thanks for the welcome. You'll see me around for a while. I am an avid gamer and rome: total war is probably one of the best i've played. thanks for the advise

[pezhetairoi]

see you around then... Don't complete the outrageous missions, btw. If you manage to complete them yout standing with the plebs will increase but your standing with the senate will decrease greatly making faction leader suicide demands that much quicker.

[Craterus]

I never got those demands, I only played short campaign with Romans...

[katank]

I personally find it very efficacious to complete Senate missions at the beginning of the game. It is usually quite reasonable and something you would do anyhow. The first mission is usually 5000 denarii which really helps your economy.

Afterwards, only major exotic unit missions are really great. As mentioned, first cohorts and merc eles are both excellent rewards. Both are hard to get otherwise. Besides, you can later have the irony of killing the Senate with what they gave you. I certainly had fun routing their big stack with my 2 merc eles both given to me by them crushing a flank together with some cav.

[DensterNY]

Hey Katank, howyoudoin - yup fellow New Yorker here.

I'm finishing up my first campaign thoroughly crushing any enemies foolish enough to bare swords with my armies and am looking forward to starting a new game. I've played my first one after reading through Frogbeastegg's invaluable guide and picking up some great tips from this forum.

The thing is though that once I caught my momentum the game lost a great degree of its challenge for me. I learned how to efficiently and effectively manage my cities to produce more than enough money and troops to feed my insatiable bloodlust and thirst for expansion. In combat I formulated a nearly undefeatible strategy and formation - winning over 112 battles by raining pilas and arrows onto my enemies and only losing one battle - to egyptian chariots who rolled over my tight formations of principes and velities standing there on guard mode. Even this I quickly ammended by learning to keep loose formations and a wide crescent and broken line whenever a good number of chariots were involved.

I was wondering how much smarter is the AI on Very-Hard mode or should I perhaps look into some of the mod packs like RTR or perhaps looking into moding myself to make it more challenging? For instance, in anticipation of a civil war I masses up armies upon armies all with Onagers either just on my adjacent borders or off the coast of my Roman allies so that when it came I took over about 70% of the other roman faction's settlements in just one turn. I had tons of troops just sitting there, whereas any human player would feel rightfully threatened way before the fact.

Just my two cents, would appreciate some personal experiences of difference, etc...

[katank]

AI isn't much smarter. The money tightness of the VH campaign makes the beginning a bit more challenging and makes naval combat insanely hard.

However, it's still the same in mid-end game. VH battle is bugged in 1.2 as you get attack bonuses too, making battles over faster but no AI advantage.

You should check out mods for more challenge. I personally like SPQR and Vlad mod.

[MackBolan]

Hey Denster.

Brutii campaign has a ridiculous advantage over the other factions. You get SOOOOO much money that you literally can bribe away battles. Ive bribed full stacks for a little over 100k but when you're making 25k++++ a turn then its no biggie. Try some of the Barb factions, they are pretty tough. You money management needs to be really good. You also dont get more than Roads as Barbs so that hurts a lot. Also no siege weaponry. The Romans got it made sometimes....

[pezhetairoi]

Yeap. Try Dacia. Now *that*'s a challenge. Of course, Germania would be nice too, but it's too easy to win battles as Germania with your phalanxes.

[katank]

Dacia, Spain, and Numidia are economic toughies. Spain even stinks on the military front initially so is probly the hardest.

[pezhetairoi]

I always had the impression Numidian javelinmen were even worse than Iberian Infantry...

[Craterus]

My joint-campaign with Spain isn't going too badly. I have the economic power to march on Rome immediately. Unfortunately, Bull Warriors take 2 turns to build and their military units aren't that great as it happens anyway.

[katank]

Numidians can get Desert Spearmen which are reasonably good infantry the same time as Iberian inf. Besides, archers at the large town level makes Numidia a blitzing powerhouse. Their jav cav is also a tactician's dream.

Spain should definitely take Tingi quickly. This coupled with Cordoba brought me into prosperity. Palma should also be a priority.

Very early expansion into Gaul is financial suicide.

[DensterNY]

Thanks guys for the advice... I love this game and hate to nitpick but once you figure out a few things it becomes clockwork butt-kicking and empire expanding.

I think however to truly experience this time period you need to play against true guile, cunning, deceit and betrayal - meaning playing multiplayer with your buddies, hehehe.. stuff like making alliances with Carthage to kill Senate missions for Scipii or with Gaul to hurt the Julii.

Just for curiosity sake how would you guys handle differently than the AI if faced with an army of Principies standing 4 deep across the entire line, evidently on guard and fire at will, backed by Velites and archers ? The AI would send in his cavalry to be butchered then march in like a dummy under a hail of pila. I've never played against another human being or found myself in a similar situation so what would you do tactically?

Denster

[katank]

First of all, it depends upon your army composition.

If you are a horse archer faction, you can simply mass fire and rip those Principes to bits while staying out of range of the enemy archers.

If you are a barbarian faction, then war cry and charge from just out of pila range. If you are traditional faction, either missile duel or move up your infantry. Note to turn off phalanx formation and charge up to them and then turn phalanx on.

Always try to flank with cav. 4-deep principes cannot stretch across the map unless corner camping. If they seem strong on refusing flanks, try smashing in their center.

Be flexible and look for opportunities.

[MackBolan]

Id dump on them w/my Onagers until that stupid line looks like swiss cheese. Then I would send 3 seperate lines of phalanxes to begin enveloping their degenerating line; under cover of archers of course. Then Id use my cav to attack between the 2 openings between my phalanxes, w/2 other cav units going around. Thats a fun one.